Did Callisto deserve to go Hell?

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EasyEntrepreneur666@reddit

Better question, did Xena really deserve heaven?

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summer_james2@reddit

Well Callisto wasn’t sorry for her wrongful acts.., Xena was … not saying that she is worthy or not… just throwing that fact out there

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SnoopVee@reddit

Mentally ill??? Please explain... lol

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“What did I feel-- when Xena confessed her crimes? Well the problem is, Gabrielle-- I never feel anything. I mean, bits and pieces, here and there, but nothing solid. Think back to when you were a little girl-- and all you knew-- was your mother-- and your sister. And all of your faith revolved them. Now, kill them.”

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EasyEntrepreneur666@reddit

From how she behaved, I don't even believe that she would be that angelic person they showed her. More like she was a psychopath from the beginning but the death of her family made it worse.

Plus, Callisto frequently moaned about what Xena did to her but she was doing the same while dodging any responsibility and just blaming Xena for it.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

or she was just traumatized after losing her family as a child. she didn’t seem like a psychopath when we saw her younger self.

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EvaHalliwell@reddit

She seemed like a psychopath an hour later when Iolas rescued her. "It's okay to cry" (implying she hasn't cried yet) "I will never cry..." blank stare

Besides didn't they all cover this in S2 Intimate stranger? Watch the last scene where Callistos mother haunts her in Tartarus, then you'll know why Callisto deserves to be in Hell. She had every right to kill Xena, but not the hundreds of men she actually did kill.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

She was crying here.

But yeah, she was obviously traumatized at that point with Iolas.

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stopstatic27@reddit

I don't think she was a psychopath. And I think she knew exactly what she was doing. She even says that the murders she will commit are on both her and Xena's hands. The only mitigation she would want for the choices she made was to partly blame Xena. the ghost of her parents call her out on her crap and she feels guilty for a bit but she still goes on doing the same stuff.

I think it also begs the question, many people who commit mass murder are actually in their right mind? Should their childhood trauma be used mitigate responsibility? Plenty of people have extreme childhood trauma and don't go on to murder women and children. Plenty of people live not in their right minds without harming others.

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EasyEntrepreneur666@reddit

We saw practically nothing about her when she was a child. All I can say is that if a trauma turns someone into the worst human being possible then they weren't that good to begin with.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

Her already being bad just defeats the whole purpose of her character and relationship with Xena.

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EasyEntrepreneur666@reddit

Not really. Not being a sweet person doesn't mean one is a murderous psycho.

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summer_james2@reddit

Exactly there was no accountability. Xena had her brother, her gf, and other people taken from her , and she did go crazy but ultimately took accountability for her actions. Callisto kept killing. She knew it was wrong but did it anyway. Callisto may be crazy but she had all her faculties about her to know right from wrong

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

Xena wasn’t a child when it happened.

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summer_james2@reddit

She was a teenager when it happened … still a child.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

Not as young as Callisto was. Also her mother and older brother were still alive.

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summer_james2@reddit

It doesn’t matter. If you have your mother who is your entire world telling you she doesn’t love you and she blames you for the death of her brother … she might as well have been dead to her. Same with Taurus they hated Xena. They finally reconciled but only after a decade has passed and Xena reformed. If Callisto would have made the decision to reform and do good she could have found love and married or had children… or lived a good life. She chose not to do that. She chose not to accept accountability.. just because your family is killed doesn’t mean you get to go on a rampage and destroy everything and think you don’t have to own up to it and change your life around

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

It does matter. Xena went through a lot of trauma but it’s not the same as seeing your entire family burn to death when you were a child.

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summer_james2@reddit

Again she didn’t care that she killed children so sorry gotta go to hell.

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summer_james2@reddit

And as she says her brother was the only one who ever understood her…. her mother abandoned her after her brother died and her older brother ran away and left home … she had no one left

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stopstatic27@reddit

I never bought this quote to be honest. She definitely feels things. She's clearly very very angry. She talks about having rage in her heart. I'm not sure people who don't feel anything can scream like she does

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ObnoxiousConsistent@reddit

so, she was a psychopath… or whatever im not an expert

that does not absolve her of her crimes. by this measure, most serial killers should also not be punished, bc most of them have some type of mental illness probably

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

Depends on the person. For example I think Aileen Wuornos probably deserved to go to a psychiatric hospital instead of death row.

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summer_james2@reddit

So was Xena. Depression and suicidal ideation.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

but she wasn’t cackling “I don’t feel anything” crazy.

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summer_james2@reddit

Ya girl gladly accepted death over and over again. Xena only felt happiness with her family(gabs solan Cyrene) but even then Xena would gladly die. She put her life on the line as a hero yes but she never cared if she died… that’s screams mentally ill. Xena only didn’t kill herself in the pilot episode bc those villagers needed help and she was there. If Gabrielle didn’t ultimately stay with her Xena would had offed herself … and just because someone isn’t obviously mentally ill doesn’t mean they don’t have a mental illness. Xena was chronically depressed and has many suicidal thoughts

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

I’m not saying Xena didn’t have her own problems, just that I don’t think the “Xena changed but Callisto didn‘t“ argument is fair when Callisto was a lot more unstable.

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SakuraTacos@reddit

Callisto was younger and at a different point in her life than Xena. There was a point in Xena’s life where she was also wildly unstable, committing mass murder and totally void of empathy for other humans. Xena saw a lot of her younger self in Callisto, which is why she was so conflicted about killing her and even wanted to let her go and give her a chance to reform when she had her tied up on horseback (I forget which episode this was)

Callisto maybe could have changed with the right help, I didn’t see her any worse than Evil Xena in her Destroyer of Nations era until Solan was born.

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summer_james2@reddit

Callisto was given opportunities and never wanted it. Thats the difference. Xena had the opportunities and didn’t want them and then finally accepted the help to change.

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stopstatic27@reddit

Yeah the moment when her parents confront her on her actions and try to hold her accountable after her body is switched back from Xena's could have been a turning point. But she just goes on killing women and children after that. I love her character. Hudson is so great at playing her. she's hot and charismatic in the role. but I don't think her mental health excuses this degree of chosen violence

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SakuraTacos@reddit

Yeah, you’re right. I was gonna write a whole paragraph to expand on what I meant by “the right help.” Not Xena’s or Gabrielle’s help, to be more specific lol

Someone or something that maybe could’ve gotten through to Callisto. Cuz we saw in Armageddon Now when she had to relive her village burning down that she didn’t totally lose her humanity, she still very much felt love and sorrow.

It took a lot for Xena to reform, it probably would’ve taken Callisto even more. But we’ll never know because Xena kept dropping rocks on her! (kidding, don’t @ me, Summer! 😂)

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Ok-Jackfruit-6873@reddit

Callisto does seem to feel something at the end of the body-switching episode when her victims come back (& her mom) ... which is more remorse than we probably see from her any other time

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summer_james2@reddit

She isn’t remorseful she is just scared bc her past is staring at her in the face and crowding her and the soul of her mother is telling her how disappointed she is in her. She feels a slight bit if guilt just enough for Xena to use it to escape but not enough to truly change her and it also didn’t matter bc she was already dead. But she could have vowed then to actually care about all the wrongdoings and the pain she caused and she never did.

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Ok-Jackfruit-6873@reddit

yeah clearly whatever she's feeling in that moment, it wears off ... 😂

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Popular-One-7051@reddit

How she never caught on to not being around. rocks and collapsing buildings got to be pretty funny

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summer_james2@reddit

Well Callisto got the Hercules package 😒🙄 (change your ways) and that didn’t work … seriously I hate that he gets credit for changing Xena. Salmoneus was already working on her and changing her. But herc gets the credit.. whatever …

Hey Callisto deserves all the rocks!!! Hahah

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Ok-Jackfruit-6873@reddit

I do wonder if Xena turned down more opportunities than Callisto got. We saw people who wanted to help Xena back in her Destroyer days.

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summer_james2@reddit

Callisto got herc, Xena, and Gabrielle. We don’t see more bc well Xena killed her.. and then once she was immortal it didn’t matter.

Xena got more opportunities bc she lived longer.

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summer_james2@reddit

She wasn’t truly unstable as a human she still knew right from wrong and continued to blame Xena for all her wrongdoings. She also wasn’t truly unstable as a God. As an immortal before she turned god she was wild and insane. When she turned into a goddess she had more clarity and has less insane moments.she was very calculated and even more calm as a god vs when she was immortal

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

she was pretty gleeful causing the fires in sacrifice, or the way she laughed after Gabrielle fell into the pit.

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summer_james2@reddit

Bc she loved to be evil. She didn’t want to be good. Thats when you know she deserved her place in hell. Bc she was truly evil there was no reconciling that. She had her opportunities to change. She was still calculated in those moments. Xena also cackled killing people too. Also gabby got a smile on her face a few times when she was in the heat of battle. However, Callisto was more tame as a god then she was as an immortal.

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

Well, she also had gone through different stuff. After Solan’s death didn’t make her feel any better, and she was unable to save her family after going back in time, she just became depressed and wanted to end her existence. So maybe she wouldn’t be as wild as when she was trying to ruin xena’s life or whatnot.

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summer_james2@reddit

She killed innocent children and knew it was wrong. And didn’t care. Hell is deserved. I love Callisto but you don’t feel sorry for it you gotta go to the place with the fire

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SnoopVee@reddit

If you've changed your life, saved lives, regretted your bad choices and made the conceous decision not to repeat the same mistakes....I cant say she "deserved it" but I'd say she certainly earned it when her time finally came.

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TheCalamityBrain@reddit

She should have stayed there

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Emica12@reddit

For the innocent people she has killed? Totally. 100%.

Because she hates Xena? No.

But what her hate for Xena made her do all the monsterous acts?

Totally. 100%.

I wanted her to get redemption her own and also I wanted her to have a very realistic dream or vision that she actually suceeded in her mission of killing Xena only to be haunted by her ghost and go a rampage killing Gabrielle, Joxer, Argo, take ambrosia that isn't enough revenge! Let's take out Solan, all of Xena's exes, Hercules, Autolycus (who SHOULD have been also demi god my inner child is still mad about it!) Cyrene, ect.. just EVERYONE that ever meant anything to Xena ever.....and still feel empty inside. She wakes up in sweat but from here she realizes no amount of revenge is ever going to cure what she has going on inside of her. So she now has new purpose- Help Xena. Weaponize Kindness. Be there smiling sweetly at every corner. Make her life hell in a brand new way. Which eventually turns to genuine kindness.

...As one may see I give her a lot of thought.

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DoctorEnn@reddit

I mean, she did do a lot of bad shit. The fact that she has a sad backstory doesn't mean she didn't do a lot of bad shit. It's pretty much a "cool motive, still murder" thing.

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DuchessSwan@reddit

sadly yes, Xena murdered countless people, but didnt create many "Callisto"s, sadly Callisto fell into the abyss and it over took her. A poor comparison is like when Callisto murdered Perdicus, Gabrielle spiraled but she managed to pull herself out of it. Sadly Callisto did choose to go down a dark path of hatred and revenge.

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Ok_Kangaroo_2160@reddit

Callisto, unfortunately, didn't have anyone to pull her towards the light. She allowed the darkness to consume her whole, and while there might have been times when the little girl that she once was came out, she didn't express remorse for killing innocent people.

Xena had Gabrielle, as well as others, who saw more in her than a murderous warlord. Callisto wasn't handed the same opportunities.

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Jahon_Dony@reddit

Definitely, so does Xena. But Callisto made it our.

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Hour_Dog_4781@reddit

Callisto didn't deserve hell. She deserved Tartarus. It sucked so bad how they started mixing up ancient Greek myths with Christian nonsense. It's one of the reasons I dislike the later seasons.

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Wayne47@reddit

Nope. I'm a Calisto apologists.

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Competitive-Put1047@reddit

Yes. Without a doubt. Regardless of her mental instability, she was genuinely a monster. She absolutely deserved to be in hell

At the same time.... as much as I love Xena, and I love her dearly, she didn't really deserve to be in paradise either. No matter how much she did change, her atrocities are second to none. And she herself knows that better than anyone. It brings me to her line to Gabrielle in AFIN. "I had to learn from you. Enough to know the final, the good, the RIGHT thing to do". Because in the end, it was the right thing to do for her

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ObnoxiousConsistent@reddit

Xena rescuing Callisto from hell was more about Xena, her guilt and her feeling like she didnt deserve heaven/redemption, than it was about Callisto.

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SakuraTacos@reddit

It was more about Xena’s guilt, for sure, but also I remember Michael saying something about how being an angel leaves you purified and full of compassion so you might be even more affected than usual by someone suffering in Hell. So it was also that Xena was compelled, more than usual, to save her.

“Michael: But, now you're an angel-- purified and full of compassion. The suffering you see in Hell will break your heart."

He warned her it would tempt her to want to sacrifice herself to free Gabrielle but instead Xena did it for Callisto

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Ok-Jackfruit-6873@reddit

yeah which is my personal headcanon for why her rebirth as Eve doesn't karmically "take" and she once again goes down a dark path

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Selverd2@reddit (OP)

I think it was less Xena thinking she herself didn’t deserve heaven and more guilt about being responsible for Callisto.

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Acceptable-Fig-8984@reddit

When Callisto becomes an angel Xena was angry and didn’t think Callisto deserved forgiveness but someone told her (maybe eli I can’t remember exactly) that was how Callisto would have been if Xena never burned her family / village down

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Overall_Sandwich_671@reddit

Callisto was sent to Hell because she was deemed too evil for Tartarus.

It's likely the Olympians condemned her to that fate, not just because she snuffed out countless human lives, but even murdered a god (Strife) and conspired with Hope and Dahak, who were a major threat to all gods. And I think Hades had enough of her escaping from his kingdom every time she died.

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RotaVitae@reddit

I think this line says it all: "Xena cooks my family, destroys my life, and I wind up in Hell while she gets another shot! Yeah, that's fair."

So, the fact that she regrets nothing she did over the last three years, including killing children, just to antagonize Xena? 100% deserving.

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IseQween@reddit

I can't speak to "deserve" -- Cally in Hell or Xena in Paradise. I believe it wasn't about that, so much as a set up to achieve a personal resolution between the two.

Xena appears to go to the Olympian gods' Tartarus when she semi-dies in S2 DESTINY. By the end of S4, she's somehow good enough to accompany Gabs to Eli's gods' spiritual heaven. There, she's "cleansed," presumably enough for redemption. She gives up her chance at eternal peace by gifting her "light" to demon Cally, who's somehow in the same spiritual realm, but evidently hasn't done anything to earn better death conditions except for Xena's compassion.

I'm not a fan of the gods arc or hurt my brain too much trying to make sense of the various deities/religions. Still, it produced my favorite, saving-grace moments of S5. Even with the time jump, we had rare continuity in the closure between Xena and Cally. I found poignancy and humanity amidst the otherworldly stuff -- especially the scene above and when "restored" light/dark Xena absorbs (and absolves?) Cally's spirit in SEEDS OF FAITH.

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