So I know they probably don't let Joe Schmoe just go a "Junk'n" around in there, but do they have some kinda store where someone could buy like an old steam gage or similar?
Just saying they are missing an odd market of auctioning off weird plane bits and greebles that are not classified and can not be repurposed to DIY and Etsy folks to make stuff aviation nerds would buy. But the logistics of ensuring nothing of military value went to a forgien adversary to be repurposed or studied for some weakness, ensuring it was safe and free of some sort of weird contamination, and even setting up such a system would probably be onerous and not even approach being anywhere worth it. Would still be kinda cool for collectors. I visited someone's house that had their work desk made out of an old P-51 part of a wing. But that is such a specific market.
It's in a military facility so you can't get access to it. At one point if you knew someone who worked at Davis you could essentially get private tours or sign up for tours on a bus. DMAFB then changed security protocols and you can no longer visit it at all.
Yep! Pima Air & Space Museum is located just south of the base and is open to the public. The museum used to do bus tours of the Boneyard, but those stopped during COVID and I don't think they ever resumed.
Dang it! We were going to do the tour and then covid hit. I remember they needed to do a background check on you first. I just checked their website and they no longer offer them.
Usedtobe that you could get a drive-through tour via the Pima Air and Space Museum, but you weren't allowed to get off the bus. Still a neat tour, though.
Back a few decades ago, we landed at DM in a 135 with a broken engine (CSD shot). Got a spare from a 707 in boneyard. Had to go through OK city to approve it.
My understanding is the parts aircraft are stored but they do have a projected life in storage when they are considered no longer viable IIRC it's around 25years +- . A lot of the easily removable stuff is already gone like gauges and avionics, the larger assemblies tend to remain until there is a demand.
I took a tour through the boneyard some years back, and it’s an amazing place.
There are three basic sections to the place:
one is a boneyard where aircraft are being dismantled,
another where aircraft are stored out in the open,
and another where aircraft are essentially ‘shrink wrapped’ to maximize preservation for potential future use.
The Pima Air & Space Museum used to have bus tour “safaris” of the boneyard but they have been suspended. I took it once about 20 years ago and really enjoyed it.
I wonder how much money it would take if I was a billionaire and wanted to get a tomcat flying again for airshows. Would the USAF sell me one of those preserved airframes if I asked nicely with a briefcase full of money? Haha.
It likely would be cheaper to new build one, highly complicated high stressed air frame that spent a significant part of it's life tied to a ships deck been sprayed with salt water. Completely fucked would be the ones in the best condition.
I've still always wondered what it would take. Even if you had to custom make parts and hire retired mechanics. I wouldn't think it would cost more than 30 million to get an F-14 flying if the government just handed you a husk.
one off machining and reverse engineering military aviation grade electronics and systems is VERYY expensive. iirc when Myra got destroyed and there were talks of putting the second unfinished airframe into service it was estimated the costs to get it airworthy would be in the billions for that single plane, and it didnt even have any complex swing wing gear boxes to reengineer
If I need a civilian F-14 to operate. I wouldn't need to 1 to 1 military avionics and get things like radar or rwr to work. If its just going to be a plane to do some passes at airshows with wings folded and such. You could probably make a whole new prototype system that wouldn't need to perfectly emulate a military F-14 electronics or hydraulic system.
Honestly I susspect it would be easier to build a replica from scratch without a swing wing at all with off the shelf avionics than to try and refit a 40 year old airframe and make it flight worthy
That's the thing though, some of the tomcats at the boneyard didn't get their wingboxes destroyed. The clipped F-14's were one's that were given to museums.
probably not. iirc they have destroyed parts of the airframe in a way that they can never fly again to ensure nothing usable can ever make it to iran, or something like that
You'd have better luck going to the Iranians and seeking their expertise on that. The U.S. government paid special attention to the F-14 with regard to what happened to the airframes and useful spare parts because they didn't want bits and pieces finding their way into Iranian hands.
They’re unfortunately not preserved past potential display or movie prop capability. They look alright, but have important structural and operational components functionally destroyed and don’t have engines. They’d disintegrate under flight load.
I mostly said air force because DMAFB and the 309th AMARG who stores the plane in the first place is all air force. Ah man, I would need two briefcases full of money. One for air force, one for navy.
They could get a bunch of those planes back in the air, there are some that are just for parts. and some that are too far gone for anything but are still out there.
Lived right there for quite a while. I had an opportunity to take a tour in base once it was an awesome experience they have so many planes there. As a part of the denuclearization treaty with the Soviet Union they had to cut up a bunch of b52s (seen with the weirdly folded wings) they literally have a giant guillotine on a crane they used to cut them up and it was still there when I visited. They’re positioned in that way so the lower resolution Soviet at the time satellites could see they were decommissioned from orbit
Let’s say I showed up here with tools, jet fuel, any other consumable oils or lubricants, and unlimited mechanical expertise - how many working planes could I assemble out of these?
I stayed there because mom really wanted us to go out and do a lot of hiking then my mind registered and I tricked her into heading to the museum. 10/10 would do it again
Tucson AZ. No, you cannot visit it. The museum next door used to do tours (during the tours you couldn't even step off of the bus!) but they stopped in 2020 after the new base commander at Davis Monthan said it was a security risk. Not even active duty personnel are allowed in.
wish I had taken the bus tour before some covid/national security BS reason had them cancelled. They also did a 5k a year or two, should have gone just for a walk.
I wonder what it would take to get a c5 operational again… that’d be a hell of a personal aircraft. “Welcome to my airplane house motor home warehouse garage! Make yourself comfy.”
I thought you were telling me to start explaining that fact, sat here puzzled for a solid minute before I realized that was probably the treaty in question.
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It was at one point. But old planes aren't really worth much other than for scap, and these will get scrapped. Who would you sell an old C-141 to? It's 60 years old, parts haven't been made for 30 years, it's loud, inefficient, and dangerous by modern standards.
It looks like maybe they're finally getting rid of the chopped up B-52s? There seem to be less of them than I remember last time I took a serious look via GE. They've been sitting out there for more than 40 years.
Bear in mind those chopped-up B-52s were on display as part of an arms limitation treaty - to prove the aircraft had been dismantled and remained dismantled. Since neither the US or Russian governments are showing much interest in keeping to such treaties these days, the US Government may have decided to cease displaying the pieces.
I heard they stopped, but I know 15 years ago, at the Army base I was at, we were warned that we were having Russian overflights as part of Open Skies I believe it was called. I'm not aware of any effort on anyone's part to hide anything. We did consider putting a message out, but didn't get far enough to actually try and do so.
Different airframes. The chopped up ones were done so as part of START(nuclear weapons treaty) and were mostly B-52Gs. But a number of H models have cycled in and out over the years.
I drove past the site for a week while on a business trip years ago. Took my son to Tucson last year only to see walls from the road. I've heard they give tours, which would be awesome, just need to book something in advance next time.
I know a lot of it is in pretty sorry state (like the tail-less B52s at the bottom of Pic 1) but i'm curious how much of the boneyard could be brought up to "readiness" if the Air force really needed it ala the Russians draining their tank depots to fight Ukraine?
Just as a WAG , probably about 75% if time and cost weren't an issue. Some of those airframes are probably pretty bent up, but if you started consolidating parts onto the best airframes, you'd get most of them together. You'd never get 100%, but certainly a majority.
The real question is if it would make any sense financially or strategically.
I've actually worked on (civilian) aircraft that were being pulled out of a similar graveyard in California. The real issue is getting the aircraft inspections done (particularly for corrosion) and the paperwork up to date. This can take months and be very expensive even by aviation standards. It's a lot more than just kicking the tires and lighting the fires. I'm sure the guys there work hard, but it just takes time to catch up.
From the operations side, the issues can be simple or complex - mostly involving the training of the pilots or requirements for new equipment that didn't exist when the aircraft went into storage. Different submodels of aircraft can have wild differences in cockpit setup, and pilots used to flying the "modern" aircraft don't know what to do with a bunch of old "steam gauges" and no GPS. Not the pilots' fault, they just would need retraining (which costs time and $). Other operational issues can crop up too - the servicing equipment might be different, for example.
And then in the end when you do all this stuff, you've still got a xx year old aircraft with old aircraft problems. You've also possibly got something that is easily militarily outmatched by newer versions. I love the F-14, but I wouldn't want to put one up against a F-35 or equivalent.
So could you? Yeah, possibly. It just probably wouldn't make sense in most cases.
China is currently taking their old frames and turning them into drones.
Some of those old F18 and F16s could do a lot of damage if they were given some drop tanks, 1K dumb bombs and pointed at a hostile target.
Planes are brought out all the time. Some times aircraft are sold to foreign governments and go through refurbishments and modifications as FMS aircraft. Very common.
Primary purpose is parts but in the event of a major conflict its faster to fix an airworthy plane from the mothball fleet than build one from scratch.
Casual reminder the Cold War (That the US escalated at every opportunity) costed around 24 trillion adjusted for inflation. We also never really got back down to reasonable defense spending even after it was over.
For context you could have bought every building/car/hamburger/dump truck...literally everything but the land for the amount we spent on the cold war.
Are the planes stored here to be utilised for parts? Or are they stored here in case they need to be brought back into service - and if so - would that take a lot of time and effort to do so?
The Marine Corps purchased more AH-1Z and UH-1Y than they have room for in squadrons, so they put a number of them in the boneyard. The intent is to swap them out in a few years in order to allow for longevity, provide a parts resource, and replacements in case of attrition.
Well, in fairness ... the Irish military as a whole is 22 times smaller than the US Marine Corps.
I think the last numbers I saw, and someone else can find the actual numbers, but the Marine Corps (on it's own) is still the 10th largest Air Force in the world.
15 E-8C JSTARS plus one dismantled and another at Robins museum of aviation. Current fleet status in one sentence. One of my golf balls is out there amidst the rusting airframes too.
I delivered a C-130 there in 2015. It was in my flying sq for more than the 15 years i was in it. It was like abandoning an old friend. Not a good feeling.
GuhdNahtBahd@reddit
Where is this?!? I annoy believe there are Tomcats there. Amazing.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
This is the military boneyard in Tucson, AZ.
Haldron-44@reddit
So I know they probably don't let Joe Schmoe just go a "Junk'n" around in there, but do they have some kinda store where someone could buy like an old steam gage or similar?
Hije5@reddit
The military often auctions off things. No idea about aviation equipment though.
Haldron-44@reddit
Just saying they are missing an odd market of auctioning off weird plane bits and greebles that are not classified and can not be repurposed to DIY and Etsy folks to make stuff aviation nerds would buy. But the logistics of ensuring nothing of military value went to a forgien adversary to be repurposed or studied for some weakness, ensuring it was safe and free of some sort of weird contamination, and even setting up such a system would probably be onerous and not even approach being anywhere worth it. Would still be kinda cool for collectors. I visited someone's house that had their work desk made out of an old P-51 part of a wing. But that is such a specific market.
imbasicallycoffee@reddit
It's in a military facility so you can't get access to it. At one point if you knew someone who worked at Davis you could essentially get private tours or sign up for tours on a bus. DMAFB then changed security protocols and you can no longer visit it at all.
https://www.airplaneboneyards.com/davis-monthan-afb-amarg-airplane-boneyard.htm
apuckeredanus@reddit
The pima air and space museum used to do bus tours through it.
Took one through the boneyard around 2012, it was awesome
Haldron-44@reddit
Makes sense.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
I don’t believe they have a gift shop.
what_the_fuckin_fuck@reddit
Isn't there a small aviation museum nearby?
Vikkunen@reddit
Yep! Pima Air & Space Museum is located just south of the base and is open to the public. The museum used to do bus tours of the Boneyard, but those stopped during COVID and I don't think they ever resumed.
DiscoverySTS1@reddit
Yeah they don't anymore sadly, they stopped for security reasons because AMARC may have been getting some more advanced jets.
FuzzyManPeach@reddit
Dang it! We were going to do the tour and then covid hit. I remember they needed to do a background check on you first. I just checked their website and they no longer offer them.
Isernogwattesnacken@reddit
Did that and it was excellent and very special. They never resumed those for "security reasons ".
Vikkunen@reddit
Which, I mean, I get. It is an active military base, after all.
imbasicallycoffee@reddit
Pima Air & Space is huge, right near here. And it's awesome.
https://pimaair.org/
Dear-Regret-9476@reddit
I went there and saw a Beechcraft starship 10/10
shityplumber@reddit
Someone flys one in and out of the local airport here I just saw it a few weeks ago
throwawayshirt2@reddit
I grew up near Wichita KS, used to see those things flying around all the time.
ArkansasCigarette@reddit
Say less
GottaHaveThatSkunk@reddit
It’s pretty dope. Been a few times
chillinwithmoes@reddit
That place is so cool.
condition5@reddit
Pima Air Museum.
Not small at all! Awesome collection adjacent to boneyard
fredly594632@reddit
Usedtobe that you could get a drive-through tour via the Pima Air and Space Museum, but you weren't allowed to get off the bus. Still a neat tour, though.
Haldron-44@reddit
Bummer :\
icebucket22@reddit
Nearby is the Air and Space Museum. Also a boneyard for all types of planes. One of my favorite places.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Old aircraft parts often pop up on ebay and etsy. Boeing 747 pilots' seats go for about $3k.
Haldron-44@reddit
*Fighting off the intrusive impulse to buy one and convert to my new sim chair* 😅
aarrtee@reddit
i dunno about 2026 but back in 2000, i drove on roads directly adjacent to this facility. I was blown away by the sheer numbers of planes.
aarrtee@reddit
google maps
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Pima+Air+%26+Space+Museum/@32.1629827,-110.8358431,3a,75y,196.37h,84.14t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1soYFr8W_0XPaNQHh6dh0j2g!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D5.8601421885103235%26panoid%3DoYFr8W_0XPaNQHh6dh0j2g%26yaw%3D196.36791719244968!7i13312!8i6656!4m6!3m5!1s0x86d664ee093b37e7:0x8e49b10f9b327453!8m2!3d32.1399593!4d-110.8649696!16zL20vMDNkODdt?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI2MDQwNy4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
aarrtee@reddit
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Pima+Air+%26+Space+Museum/@32.1686933,-110.8408197,3a,90y,286.13h,84.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sh_sb6Jk1q9ckOHKyMsVmaA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D5.369304145405621%26panoid%3Dh_sb6Jk1q9ckOHKyMsVmaA%26yaw%3D286.13488442484277!7i16384!8i8192!4m6!3m5!1s0x86d664ee093b37e7:0x8e49b10f9b327453!8m2!3d32.1399593!4d-110.8649696!16zL20vMDNkODdt?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI2MDQwNy4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
bigfoot_done_hiding@reddit
Nice try, foreign adversary! You'll have to continue to source parts using the pricy underground channels.
Haldron-44@reddit
Ah man! Any idea how hard finding F-14 parts is these days 🤣
China_bot42069@reddit
The used to. But since Covid those tours got shut down
wunderkit@reddit
Back a few decades ago, we landed at DM in a 135 with a broken engine (CSD shot). Got a spare from a 707 in boneyard. Had to go through OK city to approve it.
fortysixand2thirds@reddit
You can find steam gauges on eBay or other online used airplane parts stores
TacticalSpackle@reddit
Dry for sure but these poor birds must be getting slowly sandblasted.
Specialist_Reality96@reddit
My understanding is the parts aircraft are stored but they do have a projected life in storage when they are considered no longer viable IIRC it's around 25years +- . A lot of the easily removable stuff is already gone like gauges and avionics, the larger assemblies tend to remain until there is a demand.
Neat_Promotion_1866@reddit
Is it open to visitors?
PsychicSweat@reddit
Used to be. I think it’s on hiatus now?
pilotboy99@reddit
I took a tour through the boneyard some years back, and it’s an amazing place.
There are three basic sections to the place: one is a boneyard where aircraft are being dismantled, another where aircraft are stored out in the open, and another where aircraft are essentially ‘shrink wrapped’ to maximize preservation for potential future use.
HermionesWetPanties@reddit
There is also an Sierra Army Depot in California where nerds can count mothballed tanks, trucks, and howitzers.
Turns out deserts are better places for storing surplus/obsolete equipment than the tundras of Siberia.
markydsade@reddit
The Pima Air & Space Museum used to have bus tour “safaris” of the boneyard but they have been suspended. I took it once about 20 years ago and really enjoyed it.
Big_Animal7655@reddit
I’m so old the vibes are “Can’t Buy Me Love” 😫
DancesWithHoofs@reddit
No wonder they can’t find Nancy Guthrie. So many places to look.
imadave@reddit
What a weird f'ing comment.
Cruel2BEkind12@reddit
I wonder how much money it would take if I was a billionaire and wanted to get a tomcat flying again for airshows. Would the USAF sell me one of those preserved airframes if I asked nicely with a briefcase full of money? Haha.
Specialist_Reality96@reddit
It likely would be cheaper to new build one, highly complicated high stressed air frame that spent a significant part of it's life tied to a ships deck been sprayed with salt water. Completely fucked would be the ones in the best condition.
fhorst79@reddit
Tomcat were Navy only. And all wingboxes were destroyed, you basically need to build a new airframe.
Apexnanoman@reddit
Which would for sure make it a billionaire project but given a budget of 30-40 Billion l bet you could make it happen.
That being said nobody with that kind of money is nearly that interesting.
Cruel2BEkind12@reddit
I've still always wondered what it would take. Even if you had to custom make parts and hire retired mechanics. I wouldn't think it would cost more than 30 million to get an F-14 flying if the government just handed you a husk.
memeboiandy@reddit
one off machining and reverse engineering military aviation grade electronics and systems is VERYY expensive. iirc when Myra got destroyed and there were talks of putting the second unfinished airframe into service it was estimated the costs to get it airworthy would be in the billions for that single plane, and it didnt even have any complex swing wing gear boxes to reengineer
Cruel2BEkind12@reddit
If I need a civilian F-14 to operate. I wouldn't need to 1 to 1 military avionics and get things like radar or rwr to work. If its just going to be a plane to do some passes at airshows with wings folded and such. You could probably make a whole new prototype system that wouldn't need to perfectly emulate a military F-14 electronics or hydraulic system.
memeboiandy@reddit
Honestly I susspect it would be easier to build a replica from scratch without a swing wing at all with off the shelf avionics than to try and refit a 40 year old airframe and make it flight worthy
Cuck_Yeager@reddit
I dunno, Paul Allen owned and flew a MiG-29UB, that’s pretty interesting
Cruel2BEkind12@reddit
That's the thing though, some of the tomcats at the boneyard didn't get their wingboxes destroyed. The clipped F-14's were one's that were given to museums.
memeboiandy@reddit
probably not. iirc they have destroyed parts of the airframe in a way that they can never fly again to ensure nothing usable can ever make it to iran, or something like that
Strong_Coffee_9999@reddit
You'd have better luck going to the Iranians and seeking their expertise on that. The U.S. government paid special attention to the F-14 with regard to what happened to the airframes and useful spare parts because they didn't want bits and pieces finding their way into Iranian hands.
jjamesr539@reddit
They’re unfortunately not preserved past potential display or movie prop capability. They look alright, but have important structural and operational components functionally destroyed and don’t have engines. They’d disintegrate under flight load.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
Navy. But they might now that Iran doesnt have a use for the parts
Cruel2BEkind12@reddit
I mostly said air force because DMAFB and the 309th AMARG who stores the plane in the first place is all air force. Ah man, I would need two briefcases full of money. One for air force, one for navy.
Whiteyak5@reddit
They're not going to waste. They're supplying parts to the rest of the fleet so they can continue the mission/ life.
Rhino676971@reddit
They supply parts or they entire airframe can be bought back to life two KC-135s were just bought back to life out of the boneyard
Sprintzer@reddit
I was gonna say, I wonder if we had like a world war 3, how many of these bad boys could be brought back to service within 6 months?
chefdeit@reddit
I had the same question. Maybe 10%, 15% if taking chances (as in, one-way missions etc)?
Rhino676971@reddit
They could get a bunch of those planes back in the air, there are some that are just for parts. and some that are too far gone for anything but are still out there.
FunktasticLucky@reddit
That's also where we got our new WC-135Rs. Low hour KC-135R tankers are converted into them.
Deer-in-Motion@reddit
Aircraft necromancy.
marenicolor@reddit
Aviomancy
Vikkunen@reddit
They dug out a B-52 a year or so ago as well.
Storm_Chaser06@reddit
I might be blind, where are the F14s?
GuhdNahtBahd@reddit
Picture 3, 5:29 on the clock
HornetGaming110@reddit
Davis Monthan AFB
Lokitusaborg@reddit
I read that initially as Dave Matthew’s AFB
Eastern_Labrat@reddit
Davis-Monthan AFB, Tucson, AZ
rickyh7@reddit
Lived right there for quite a while. I had an opportunity to take a tour in base once it was an awesome experience they have so many planes there. As a part of the denuclearization treaty with the Soviet Union they had to cut up a bunch of b52s (seen with the weirdly folded wings) they literally have a giant guillotine on a crane they used to cut them up and it was still there when I visited. They’re positioned in that way so the lower resolution Soviet at the time satellites could see they were decommissioned from orbit
rigsby_nillydum@reddit
The Lancers make sense. It is a BONEyard after all
175_Pilot@reddit
Exactly what I locked onto first as well. There are F-14’s and I need to touch one now.
GuhdNahtBahd@reddit
FYI the Naval Air Museum in Wildwood NJ has a real beauty on display. We go every year.
amooz@reddit
Why do they keep aircraft that aren’t flying still in the boneyard? Those F4’s are mighty long in the tooth
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
There are still U.S. allies flying the F-4. The ones in AMARG are used as parts planes for them.
And, some of these are QF-4s that don’t get expended.
N-cadherin@reddit
Let’s say I showed up here with tools, jet fuel, any other consumable oils or lubricants, and unlimited mechanical expertise - how many working planes could I assemble out of these?
N-cadherin@reddit
Great photo
Right_Sugar_4007@reddit
Where is it? Can you visit it?
Old-Sentence-1956@reddit
Not too far away is the Pima Aircraft museum, open to public and well worth going. They just acquired one of the last two Martin MARS flying boats.
aflyingsquanch@reddit
Tucson is worth visiting just for Pima Air and Space.
Its also just an awesome city all around for a lot of other reasons that also make it worth a visit.
And the Titan Missile Museum a half hour south is also pretty cool and worth the drive.
Dear-Regret-9476@reddit
I stayed there because mom really wanted us to go out and do a lot of hiking then my mind registered and I tricked her into heading to the museum. 10/10 would do it again
J4CKFRU17@reddit
Tucson AZ. No, you cannot visit it. The museum next door used to do tours (during the tours you couldn't even step off of the bus!) but they stopped in 2020 after the new base commander at Davis Monthan said it was a security risk. Not even active duty personnel are allowed in.
critical_patch@reddit
Davis-Monthan AFB outside Tucson, and no not anymore.
Right_Sugar_4007@reddit
Pity!
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
This is in Tucson, AZ. Portions of it used to be open to the public but I’m not sure if they still offer that.
JamesLahey08@reddit
What percent of those can be used again?
Blueanddirt@reddit
Over my way they call this hoarding
Battle_Intense@reddit
wish I had taken the bus tour before some covid/national security BS reason had them cancelled. They also did a 5k a year or two, should have gone just for a walk.
Union_Jack_1@reddit
Your tax dollars at work.
AbleRelationship5287@reddit
I wonder what it would take to get a c5 operational again… that’d be a hell of a personal aircraft. “Welcome to my airplane house motor home warehouse garage! Make yourself comfy.”
keybord-hero@reddit
Is see opportunities😈👻☠️💀 i see kamakazi drones/airplaynes. Fill them up with explosives and drop them on the enemy👻☠️💀👻
spillerrrrr@reddit
Maverick could get that up in the air, no problemo
Venom1656@reddit
Davis-Monthan AFB, AZ.
Who-Dey-Troy@reddit
I drive past this almost everyday. It blows my mind how big the boneyard is
mpg111@reddit
are they still doing tours there? I did one like 10 years ago and it was amazing
BeachHut9@reddit
That’s where the cumulative defence spending went to?
FlippantResponse@reddit
Why do the B52s have the tails removed and set to the side?
SpezIsALittleBitch@reddit
They were visibly disassembled and displayed as part of an arms treaty (some of the 52s in the boneyard, not sure which ones)
East-Plankton-3877@reddit
START
SpezIsALittleBitch@reddit
I thought you were telling me to start explaining that fact, sat here puzzled for a solid minute before I realized that was probably the treaty in question.
Ypocras@reddit
I think the ones with their tails removed and set to the side.
53V3N@reddit
Specifically the New-START (Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty) with Russia, where we were limited in how many nuke-capable bombers we could field.
We chopped them up and the Russians verified by satellite.
https://www.warhistoryonline.com/war-articles/b-52-bombers-cut-arizona-compliance-russian-treaty.html
runlola@reddit
Why do we mothball planes that have been retired? I see a couple of F14s in the picture.
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
Those are on museum hold
ptear@reddit
Good, they belong in a museum.
NoDoze-@reddit
This gets posted too often, yet newbies are still surprised to hear about it and see it, which really surprises me. LOL
CaptainRAVE2@reddit
Impressive
ProperWayToEataFig@reddit
Tucson AZ at Davis Monthan Air Base. You can see these planes on Interstate 10.
WardogBlaze14@reddit
Wish I could take a tour of that place!
Least_Candidate3470@reddit
Lobbyist graveyard
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redSovietBoombox@reddit
Nice poopmerican wasteland filled with hillbilly trash
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AdDesigner5025@reddit
Davis-Monthan in Tucson, AZ
HortonFLK@reddit
Why do so many of the B-52s (?) in the lower center of the frame have their tails separated from the rest of the plane?
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
They’re cut up and posed per a US/Russia weapons reduction treaty. The idea is that Russian satellites can see and verify the destruction.
HortonFLK@reddit
Thank you.
onethousandmonkey@reddit
Do I spy Bones in the boneyard?
ancillarycheese@reddit
It’s crazy how many B-1s they have there. But good because that means more parts to keep the flying force operational.
Bradders59@reddit
Looks like they might have removed a couple of KC 135s…
Long_Doughnut798@reddit
Do any of these planes get reactivated? Water bombers or something?
irowiki@reddit
Any E3 Sentries in there for a quick reactivation?
TokoloshNr1@reddit
That’s a LOT of money just rusting away there.
SodaAnt@reddit
It was at one point. But old planes aren't really worth much other than for scap, and these will get scrapped. Who would you sell an old C-141 to? It's 60 years old, parts haven't been made for 30 years, it's loud, inefficient, and dangerous by modern standards.
nehocbelac@reddit
Arizona, it won’t rust
TokoloshNr1@reddit
Thanks, now I know.
OcotilloWells@reddit
One of the reasons they are in Tucson, less rust. Just lots of UV and heat. :-)
TokoloshNr1@reddit
Thanks, now I know..
pollyauntie@reddit
Of 'Can't Buy Me Love' fame.
dscottj@reddit
It looks like maybe they're finally getting rid of the chopped up B-52s? There seem to be less of them than I remember last time I took a serious look via GE. They've been sitting out there for more than 40 years.
FelisCantabrigiensis@reddit
Bear in mind those chopped-up B-52s were on display as part of an arms limitation treaty - to prove the aircraft had been dismantled and remained dismantled. Since neither the US or Russian governments are showing much interest in keeping to such treaties these days, the US Government may have decided to cease displaying the pieces.
OcotilloWells@reddit
I heard they stopped, but I know 15 years ago, at the Army base I was at, we were warned that we were having Russian overflights as part of Open Skies I believe it was called. I'm not aware of any effort on anyone's part to hide anything. We did consider putting a message out, but didn't get far enough to actually try and do so.
SodaAnt@reddit
The US withdrew from the open skies treaty in 2020 and Russia withdrew in 2021.
Key-University9881@reddit
A few of them have been returned to service
Messyfingers@reddit
Different airframes. The chopped up ones were done so as part of START(nuclear weapons treaty) and were mostly B-52Gs. But a number of H models have cycled in and out over the years.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
The boneyard is very expansive, these picture definitely do not capture all of it. There are likely some “parked” in another area.
PapaGeorgieo@reddit
I see 4xF-14s!
Tagous@reddit
I drove past the site for a week while on a business trip years ago. Took my son to Tucson last year only to see walls from the road. I've heard they give tours, which would be awesome, just need to book something in advance next time.
tmt04@reddit
They used to do tours, unfortunately that stopped a few years back
AlexFinns85@reddit
Tomcats?!
China_bot42069@reddit
Can you just fly over this? No restrictions on air space?
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
No, it’s on a military base so not just anyone can fly over at these altitudes. I was doing touch and gos in a KC-135.
China_bot42069@reddit
Ahh I figured. Sorry about your brothers/sisters
maneyaf@reddit
Aircraft Maintenance and Regeneration Center. Davis Monthan AFB, Tucson AZ.
AlcoholPrepPad@reddit
*group. AMARC changed to AMARG about 20 years ago.
maneyaf@reddit
Fair, thats about when I left.
Wardog_Razgriz30@reddit
I know a lot of it is in pretty sorry state (like the tail-less B52s at the bottom of Pic 1) but i'm curious how much of the boneyard could be brought up to "readiness" if the Air force really needed it ala the Russians draining their tank depots to fight Ukraine?
84Cressida@reddit
Bring back the KC-10
Sprintzer@reddit
I often wonder how many of these bad boys they could bring back into service in ~6 months time, if they needed to.
Say WW3 kicks off and we need every possible asset we can get
84Cressida@reddit
Many. Several are kept in storage for that purpose and aren’t retired. Either by congressional mandate or operational needs.
penelopiecruise@reddit
Wonder how many could be returned to service if push came to shove?
fredly594632@reddit
Just as a WAG , probably about 75% if time and cost weren't an issue. Some of those airframes are probably pretty bent up, but if you started consolidating parts onto the best airframes, you'd get most of them together. You'd never get 100%, but certainly a majority.
The real question is if it would make any sense financially or strategically.
I've actually worked on (civilian) aircraft that were being pulled out of a similar graveyard in California. The real issue is getting the aircraft inspections done (particularly for corrosion) and the paperwork up to date. This can take months and be very expensive even by aviation standards. It's a lot more than just kicking the tires and lighting the fires. I'm sure the guys there work hard, but it just takes time to catch up.
From the operations side, the issues can be simple or complex - mostly involving the training of the pilots or requirements for new equipment that didn't exist when the aircraft went into storage. Different submodels of aircraft can have wild differences in cockpit setup, and pilots used to flying the "modern" aircraft don't know what to do with a bunch of old "steam gauges" and no GPS. Not the pilots' fault, they just would need retraining (which costs time and $). Other operational issues can crop up too - the servicing equipment might be different, for example.
And then in the end when you do all this stuff, you've still got a xx year old aircraft with old aircraft problems. You've also possibly got something that is easily militarily outmatched by newer versions. I love the F-14, but I wouldn't want to put one up against a F-35 or equivalent.
So could you? Yeah, possibly. It just probably wouldn't make sense in most cases.
HawkAlt1@reddit
China is currently taking their old frames and turning them into drones. Some of those old F18 and F16s could do a lot of damage if they were given some drop tanks, 1K dumb bombs and pointed at a hostile target.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Some of those weren’t flying that long ago, KC-10 fo example.
MrBobSacamano@reddit
How many rattlesnakes are in these pictures?
sakura_apple@reddit
Very cool. I wonder if some of those E-3s will be dusted off soon now that at least one (maybe 2) have been damaged by Iran
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
I suppose that is possible though I can’t say I’ve heard of any planes being brought out of the boneyard, just parts.
84Cressida@reddit
We take planes out of there all the time.
mookdog11@reddit
Planes are brought out all the time. Some times aircraft are sold to foreign governments and go through refurbishments and modifications as FMS aircraft. Very common.
SpezIsALittleBitch@reddit
Yeah two tankers and a Lancer relatively recently - I saw one of the KCs on its "first" cross country after.
The_Bard@reddit
Primary purpose is parts but in the event of a major conflict its faster to fix an airworthy plane from the mothball fleet than build one from scratch.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
Lots of planes come out of the boneyard. Most recent notable one was a B-1b getting put back in service to replace a crashed one.
PorkChoppen@reddit
What a great Google maps search to keep in mind
DelphiTsar@reddit
This is a lot of healthcare.
Casual reminder the Cold War (That the US escalated at every opportunity) costed around 24 trillion adjusted for inflation. We also never really got back down to reasonable defense spending even after it was over.
For context you could have bought every building/car/hamburger/dump truck...literally everything but the land for the amount we spent on the cold war.
19finmac66@reddit
I want my money back
CardinalOfNYC@reddit
It's the 'farm upstate' for america's military aricraft
Emily_Postal@reddit
I’ve driven by it a few times. It’s huge.
runlola@reddit
No clue what these are. B57?
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
Parts birds for the NASA WB-57s
dr1ftwood@reddit
The bring it back yard!
boggleys2359@reddit
Are the planes stored here to be utilised for parts? Or are they stored here in case they need to be brought back into service - and if so - would that take a lot of time and effort to do so?
MeadyOker@reddit
The Marine Corps purchased more AH-1Z and UH-1Y than they have room for in squadrons, so they put a number of them in the boneyard. The intent is to swap them out in a few years in order to allow for longevity, provide a parts resource, and replacements in case of attrition.
boggleys2359@reddit
Wow. Living in Ireland where we have 8 pilatus pc9 propeller aircraft, essentially comprising our 'Air Force', couldn't be a bigger contrast!
MeadyOker@reddit
Well, in fairness ... the Irish military as a whole is 22 times smaller than the US Marine Corps.
I think the last numbers I saw, and someone else can find the actual numbers, but the Marine Corps (on it's own) is still the 10th largest Air Force in the world.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
Both. Most for parts. But many times an airframe is brought back to replace one that's been crashed or damaged beyond repair
boggleys2359@reddit
Thanks for the reply.
runlola@reddit
F-104? Something else?
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
T-38
runlola@reddit
Okay, I can see that now
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
I think T-38
Spiderkeegan@reddit
Love Tucson, and love the boneyard. Pima ASM across the street is also amazing, undoubtedly a top 5 aviation museum in the country.
PartyLegal3843@reddit
Would love to walk around there
ScottOld@reddit
So much in there, they won't miss a few
runlola@reddit
Not sure what these are. A6 Intruder?
Mysterious_Basil2818@reddit
A-4 Skyhawks
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Not sure. Definitely Navy, they have drogues.
torklugnutz@reddit
Skystrikers spotted. Yo Joe!
killertrout1@reddit
15 E-8C JSTARS plus one dismantled and another at Robins museum of aviation. Current fleet status in one sentence. One of my golf balls is out there amidst the rusting airframes too.
runlola@reddit
Storage bunkers at the boneyard?
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Probably but it’s located at Davis Monthan AFB so that’s not surprising.
Stahi@reddit
If memory serves, the legacy-Hornet Blue Angels are there as well.
Carlito_2112@reddit
At least some of those are in museums.
QueBestia19@reddit
I drove by here a few times over the past few days. It’s kind-blowing.
SinisterSoren@reddit
Sounds like some of the KC-135s are being resurrected from the boneyard after the losses they suffered in the middle east recently
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Doesn’t surprise me, the KC-135 fleet was already spread a little thin.
Artful_Dodger_1832@reddit
This doesn’t look like your moms house at all.
PotterOneHalf@reddit
I wonder how hard it is to get in there and take photos from the ground.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
It’s on Davis Monthan AFB so virtually impossible unless you know someone who works at the base.
PotterOneHalf@reddit
Dang, I thought it was in the middle of a residential area because I thought that thing to the top right of the first photo was a trailer park.
Physical-Cut-2334@reddit
Me screaming "I see tomacats"
onethousandmonkey@reddit
Always sad to see Warthogs there.
nixonbeach@reddit
Do they give tours?!
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Not anymore unfortunately.
Admirable-Security91@reddit
All I can think about is the millions and billions of dollars just sitting there.
tdgarui@reddit
I’d say trillions.
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
I don’t think millions would touch it. I know one KC-10 was valued around $65 million.
gardendong@reddit
I delivered a C-130 there in 2015. It was in my flying sq for more than the 15 years i was in it. It was like abandoning an old friend. Not a good feeling.
dstan1856@reddit
Our tax dollars at work
RoverTiger@reddit
A guy I know was able to get me into Davis-Monthan a few years ago to take a drive around the boneyard. Really cool to see.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
Are these recent pics?
Aviator-Intelligence@reddit (OP)
Yes, about a month old.
skyelord69420@reddit
A security dog is very disappointed
Still-Union-2528@reddit
Awww come on they could afford to give me a fighter for my backyard!
Pasutiyan@reddit
The military equivalent to that basket of old wires and other crap you just can't bring yourself to throw away in case you may need it one day.
nine57th@reddit
Awesome picture.
FaithlessnessOld5785@reddit
Scale of this place never fails to blow my mind tbh. literally billions of dollars in taxpayers' money just chilling in the desert sun dude.