Are Hyundai/Kia still crap these days?
Posted by phtphongg@reddit | askcarguys | View on Reddit | 203 comments
I keep seeing mixed opinions about Hyundai and Kia, especially when it comes to their sedans like the Elantra, Sonata, Forte/K4, etc.
A lot of people still say they’re unreliable or “crap,” mostly because of past issues (like engine problems), but it seems like the newer models have improved quite a bit.
At the same time, I’ve also seen plenty of people say that these cars can last a long time if you keep up with proper maintenance, just like any other brand.
So now I’m wondering if the bad reputation is still accurate today, or if it’s mostly based on older problems that people still remember.
Curious what real owners think about newer Hyundai/Kia sedans in terms of long-term reliability.
lowkeyproducer@reddit
It's a good car to have if you want it to get stolen.
babikospokes@reddit
no, and i dont understand the hate on reddit
JCC114@reddit
We don’t know. People thought the Theta II engines were great for 5+ years before was even a hint at the widespread disaster. The new stuff has not been on road long enough for us to know. What we do know, prior engine disasters, Kia/Hyundi Boyz, recalls for cars bursting into flames, and many other issues. They are at best average and at worst? They are the absolute bottom of the barrel crap that will be worth nothing while you still owe 10k+ putting people in a world of hurt. To me? Pay the extra up front for something you know is not junk, and then you don’t even have to ask this.
averynicehat@reddit
Do they have new engines though? Aren't what they put into their cars basically tweaks on stuff that's been around a while and hopefully the kinks worked out? For the ICE engines at least. Not sure about their hybrid stuff.
Critical-Magician421@reddit
No
Ambitious-Intern-928@reddit
With a 100k mile powertrain warranty, the vehicle should be paid off before then. People overpaying for used cars is a completely different issue, and one that affects Honda and Toyota more than any other brands since they hold a ridiculous amount of value even at high mileages where the best made vehicles are prone to failures.
The reality of today and the past 5+ years market is that aside from EV's and some luxury brands, buying used makes absolutely no sense and ultimately costs more over the long term, especially if you're financing at a higher rate.
FordF150ChicagoFan@reddit
This is an absurd take. I'm nearly 50 and I've only owned 3 vehicles. My latest one, an F150, I bought slightly used with like 4k on the odometer and a Ford cpo warranty that actually gave me a longer warranty period than a new F150 would have. I also saved a ton of money buying it used. I will never buy new. Let someone else pay the depreciation costs.
JCC114@reddit
That is a ridiculous take. First, it does not matter if a vehicle is paid off. It should not have a major mechanical failure before 200k+ with standard maintenance. This idea that it is paid off time to buy a new one is a debt cycle that keeps people poor.
2nd, buying used from a dealer at like 1 year old and 95% of new price makes no sense. Buying a 50k dollar suv for $15,000 at 6-7 years old and 100k miles makes perfect sense assuming it’s not a Hyundai/Kia. It will last another 100k with minimal cost, things like $400-1,500 repairs for things like a failed alternator or leaking valve gaskets should be extent of it. And unlike the first person that lost 35k in value your 15k will still return 5-6k at 200k assuming you took care of it. So in both cases you had 100k miles of use. In first your interest plus 35k, but probably no repairs. In the second your out 10k, and maybe 2-3k in repairs, plus interest. Remind me? What is more 35-40k depending on interest rates or less than 15k with repairs and interest?
f700es@reddit
My 12 Optima 2.4l went 127k trouble free miles before I traded it in Jan. 2020.
super80@reddit
2.4 MPI engine can do 220k, I’ve seen them in sorentos with regular maintenance.
JCC114@reddit
And my 2011 Durango went 220k. With only water pump and alternator outside of basics like brakes/fluid changes and was running great for next person. Does not change Chrysler is not a great buy for quality now days. Besides that 127k has not been lot of miles since the 90s.
Herroo-There@reddit
we also know they're stingy with replacement engines, and the replacement engines arent free of underlying issues.
the national managers are also a pain to work with unless you bought the car new with a 10/100 warranty. even CPO owners sometimes get screwed with coverage.
not to mention the headache of waiting on a dead car that was towed to a shop.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
That’s a completely fair take and the Theta II point is a good one, nobody really knew how bad it was until it was already widespread. The “we just don’t know yet” argument is probably the most honest answer anyone can give about their newer stuff. That said I’d push back a little on the depreciation angle. The newer Hyundai/Kia models have actually been holding their value pretty well lately, so the “upside down on your loan” scenario is less of a sure thing than it used to be. But your overall point stands, if you can comfortably afford something with a longer track record, it’s hard to argue against that peace of mind.
Prize_Guide1982@reddit
Man I can forgive their engine stuff. Their lack of immobilizer use for years? Just to cheap out on a few bucks? Fuck them.
v6underpressure@reddit
The important thing to note here is that when the Theta engines failed, Hyundai was fighting tooth and nail to not honor the warranty even with proof of proper maintenance. That track record alone should be reason enough to avoid them as a company regardless if their current and future engines end up being reliable.
SumyungNam@reddit
As long as they push the 10k miles oil change intervals with thin oil the engines will die lol
Vb_33@reddit
Toyota and Honda don't have these issues despite the jiffy lube 10m mile thin oil changes.
LaStochasticFleur@reddit
The hybrids with the 1.6 i heard are pretty dang reliable. Our hyandai ioniq hybrid went 165k miles strong before totaled. No maintenance outside of the basic basics. Someone has 240k on theirs
Elantra hybrids and Kia niro share the same engines
Puzzled_Ant_2892@reddit
Hyundai kia are cheap for a reason. They're subpar to Japanese cars in every way. they're not the worst but they're ok if youre on a budget.
Diligent-Body-5062@reddit
I had a 2014 Kia soul, supposedly bad engine model, gdi 2.0. I changed the oil every 4000 miles, made sure the oil as never low, sold after eleven years 131,000 miles. Maybe I was lucky. I didn't get another Kia.
Kiwi_Jaded@reddit
I’m a car maintenance guy. I’m working on transitioning to all Toyota/Lexus for my family’s cars. I still have one older Subaru in our small fleet (2012 Forester). I probably over maintain cars - oil changes at 5k every time, regular tranny/diff/transf case drain & fills, radiator drain & fill every other years, early spark plugs, etc.
The worst car I ever owned was a Sonata with a Theta II. It got treated very well from a maintenance perspective and the motor still started burning oil like crazy at 110k miles. Will never buy another Hyundai/Kia again.
T
boostedbacon22@reddit
My hot take
Honda and Toyota are more reliable because…………….. they have better owners. The original owners bought a product they intended on keeping and treated it as such
Korean or American buyers are buying the best deal possible to get them by, which means less concern about longterm
breakerofh0rses@reddit
Except that there are actual engineering philosophy differences. Japanese purposefully design their products to fail more gracefully even when neglected. This isn't just an example of selection bias or placebo effect.
FordF150ChicagoFan@reddit
Another angle is the driving style of a driver that goes for a Toyota in the first place. A Corolla or Camry driver is typically timid, never accelerates hard, doesn't stress the vehicle and comes nowhere near testing it's limits. I had a Corolla rental before. They actively fight acceleration. Compare that to say a Nissan or BMW driver who floors it every other stoplight.
I had nothing but American vehicles and all three have been reliable. My 4th Gen Camaro gave me no headaches and I drove that like an idiot. My Suburban was bulletproof for 250k before I sold it and got my F150. Granted I've bought what Detroit does well: trucks, RWD, V8s, etc but from what you read on reddit you'd think they're just money pits.
Federal-Membership-1@reddit
Nissan Altima owners, whole nother level.🤣
Own-Secret-6523@reddit
I definitely agree that "anything maintained seems to last". I had an employees a few years back make a comment about her vehicle so I asked her when did she last change the oil. She looked at me like a deer in headlights. I went out and checked and she had almost no oil in her vehicle. Luckily I carry and extra quart and put it in and told her to go and get her oil changed. This by the way, was a very smart hard working employee. Some people just seem to think vehicles don't need maintenance, they just automatically operate.
Duukt@reddit
This isn't entirely true. I bought a 2000 Toyota Solara new and was very sloppy with maintenance, oil changes were usually dragged out to 8-9k miles with a lot of short distance driving. Later I gave it to my brother who was slightly better with oil changes but didn't need to do any repairs.
When he finally traded it in for a new car, it was still running with 286K miles.
FaithlessnessThick29@reddit
I did the same with a 2015 sonata which is still being driven regularly. Did VT to FL twice last year and only issue was pulling a crazy code after plugging in a gas station phone charger in the rear usb.
MACception@reddit
My Toyota Prius C went 250k miles in 10 years and I had 0 issues. I've had my Chevy Bolt EV for 40k and 2 years and it's been in the shop 7 times.
Holmesnight@reddit
Preach! Most vehicles will last if maintained. Now there are some problem children that not matter the upkeep will shit the bed and the Theta 2 was one of those.
ZeroedInNomad@reddit
That’s true but Toyota and Honda seem to handle the abuse of a bad owner better than say Kia/hyundai. I had a friend in high school that beat a civic like a red headed stepchild. I don’t think he did any maintenance at all. Drove it for years before it finally gave up.
cmbtmstr@reddit
It’s the same thing in the motorcycle community with Honda sport bikes. They’re usually the slowest in their class but also the most reliable. The owners buying them to own and take care of them for a long time know that.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
That’s actually not as crazy as it sounds as a hot take. Selection bias is real, the type of person who buys a Camry or Accord with the intention of driving it for 15 years is probably also the type to never miss an oil change. Meanwhile someone stretching their budget to get into a car is maybe less likely to stay on top of maintenance. Though I’d say Hyundai/Kia have been pulling in a different kind of buyer lately with the Genesis overlap and their higher end trims, so it’ll be interesting to see if that shifts the long term reliability data over time.
freetotebag@reddit
Fwiw I absolutely love my 2020 Elantra GT N-Line. I get oil done every 3k miles, just hit 70,000. All I’ve done to it so far is tires once and I’m gonna get my brakes done soon. Never had an issue. Of course I’m entering the next phase of this car. But so far I’ve had 6 smooth years. The thing I love about this hatchback— it’s shockingly useful- it can carry a lot. Packing for vacation has been a breeze. It’s not the fastest car by any means but 201hp isn’t bad either. It’s a fun car to drive. I wish they’d bring back the hatchback. Hyundai’s interiors on top trims like this one are really nice. I’ve always felt like I got a lot of bang for my buck, I got mine brand new for $23k.
pabloconllama@reddit
I have a 2013 sonata for 11 years now. Engine blew up around 60k miles and was replaced for free at Hyundai since they had a recall on them. Even gave me a rental car. Using it till now. Love that car soo much. Currently at 176,000 miles and going strong. Had the catalytic converter replaced recently.
wannakno37@reddit
I've got a 2013 ELANTRA. Runs great, just wear and tear stuff and their tail/ brake lights seem to burn out more frequently than my 09 Civic and 2015 Mazda 3. Interior quality of materials don't stack up to the Japanese manufacturers. But the 6 speed auto and 1.8 engine have done well.
Ralph_O_nator@reddit
They are fine. I had a 2013 Elantra I just sold for $4000. I bought it for $13,000 new and put around 90k miles on it. I serviced it at Hyundai and the only major thing I had was it needed a new catalytic converter which Hyundai covered. The fit and finish is not up to a Honda/Toyota level but it still worked. I did the brakes at 60k along with the fluids and other consumables. Would it last another 100k miles???? I don’t know. I currently have a 2012 prius with 108k miles and it feels like a much better screwed car.
notjohn61@reddit
I've run a few kia vengas as school cars and they've been faultless. Driven very badly by people hell bent on killing me and the cars just took everything without ever missing a beat. I also had a Hyundai i20 on holiday for a week and it put me to sleep. I also had a Kia Picanto on a holiday where we did the Stelvio pass. Excellent cars.
ohog9og0790@reddit
I bought a new Rio for 14k 12 years ago and it served me well. the only thing that broke was a switch for the indoor lighting. Just sold it.
No-Exchange8035@reddit
Do u replace your vehicles regularly? You're probably fine.
Do u keep your vehicles for 20 years? It's probably not a great purchase.
Competitive_Guava_33@reddit
This comment could be said about any car. How many fords from 2006 are being driven around or chevys. Or anything from bmw, ve, Subaru, Nissan, etc etc
FordF150ChicagoFan@reddit
I see a lot of big GM SUVs from 2006 and older on the road all the time.
TheLastGenXer@reddit
depends upon the model.
plenty of 20-30 year crown vics, rangers, e series, and f150s on the road.
DickWhittingtonsCat@reddit
Where are all these mystery crown Vics? I haven’t seen one in 5 years- other than a couple Granny Marquis with like 50k miles out in the country.
People say this, and I see F150s and Rangers, but the indestructible Crown Vic is like an urban myth at this point.
TheLastGenXer@reddit
they are if driven by a normal person.
but they are not magical.
they got all bought out by “gypsy cab”/unlicensed taxi/ towncar drivers who drove them into the ground.
BigPaPaRu85@reddit
90s and early 00s Ford was pretty reliable. I got 200k+ miles on a lot of their vehicles.
wickedcold@reddit
Focus and Taurus on the other hand…
Wrong_Supermarket007@reddit
the ford focus transmission should be classified as a class 4 explosive
darksoft125@reddit
Irony is the Focus and Fiesta engines are pretty bulletproof and would go for 300K miles+ if they weren't mated with the worse transmission ever built.
Manyfaces367@reddit
I've got an 06 Taurus, rusty as can be but it's still going strong.
HemiWarrior@reddit
My daily is a 1991 Land Rover 90. 300Tdi with the R380.
CartierWlayvo@reddit
Got an 06 expedition with 350k miles still starting ev everytime😭
NaitiveTexan1270@reddit
Previously had a 2002 Ranger, and it was bulletproof.
Satins_Cock@reddit
I think half of it is the brand reputation. If the owner thinks their Kia Sedona won't make it to 200,000 and the engine craps out at 150,000, they're not going to invest more into the van.
Same exact scenario, but the Toyota owner replaces the engine, and it makes it past 200,000.
Not saying their equally reliable, but the reputation is hard to shake and is a bit self fulfilling.
Hansdawgg@reddit
Honestly I ve beat on my little 31 year old Toyota and it still just keeps going. Original engine and transmission too.
espressocycle@reddit
The resale value also influences that. Since Toyota retains more value at higher miles, repair costs don't exceed the value as early.
Hansdawgg@reddit
You say that but I still jump in and drive my 31 yr old Toyota every once in a while lol
Hansdawgg@reddit
You say that but I still jump in and drive my 31 yr old Toyota every once in a while lol
No-Exchange8035@reddit
Chances are you're going to see a 20yr old Toyota/honda over a 20 yr old Kia/Hyundai.
SubstantialKick2452@reddit
I have a 2009 Chevy Malibu that is going strong. Only repairs that it's needed in the five years that I've had it were some suspension work and new VVT solenoids. The latter of was my fault because I was an idiot and went too long without an oil change.
Whowhat91@reddit
Tbf of all the car brands with old cars pre 2010 on the road bmw is definitely the most common one i see and people love their old bmw's being used as a daily commute car.
fishscaleSF5@reddit
I feel the Subaru community is pretty good at keeping their golden era vehicles running against all odds. Subaru could probably stay afloat strictly by manufacturing EJs for the vapelords that blow them up every 6 months.
HyperionsDad@reddit
Vapelords - I love it. I will need to use this.
cranky-donkey@reddit
25 year VW here. Regular maintenance does wonders.
mydb100@reddit
Gonna chime in here.....The people of Saskatoon, SK. Seem to love their GD Saturn's. As a tow truck driver I love them, but for Pete's sakes give them up. They yearn for the junkyard
K_Linkmaster@reddit
I'm also from the north and remember several with gaping holes in the side. Fold and plastic don't mix
Cynyr36@reddit
Hey, not from Saskatoon ( central MN isn't that far away) my daily is a 1999 Saturn sw2 (the wagon), and i recently picked up a 2006 ion.
TraderVics-8675309@reddit
As a former SaskatoonIan, it’s a good car for a lack of rust, however that engine blah
K_Linkmaster@reddit
Mustangs of all kinds are everywhere and the people won't let them die. F150s are the same, even the 5.4 3 valves are still kicking.
threephasemachinery@reddit
Ford 2.3 Ranger and 5.4 Triton F150s are everywhere still also you see more early 2000s Subarus more than any other Japanese car and that's only because all the Altimas/Maximas crashed in police chases.
killian1113@reddit
You are joking?
edwardniekirk@reddit
My 93 chevy, 03 chevy and 09 ford are still running strong. Both Chevys bought new and the ford I bought from a neighbors kids after they passed.
QueenAlpaca@reddit
Shit, my boss is about to look at a Dodge Neon this with less than 100k miles weekend lmao. I’m in Subie country so I regularly see 90’s (and sometimes 80’s) Subarus driving around. There’s also a guy who drives his original Jeep Wagoneer around, just saw him the other day. If rust isn’t an issue and parts are available (and cheap), you’ll probably see more driving around.
Hell, the last time I was in Michigan I saw an absolutely obscene amount of 2000’s era Monte Carlos.
Now there is someone I work with who has an older Hyundai that he’s shoved something like five motors into. None have lasted longer than 50k miles but he’s got a warranty going with LKQ or some shit where he keeps getting them replaced for free minus doing the labor himself, but I think the transmission shit the bed this time so the car’s not currently drivable.
SatisfactionLow508@reddit
I have an 06 Yaris. Still my daily driver.
Clay_Dawg99@reddit
Isn’t that a Toyota?
SatisfactionLow508@reddit
Yes sir.
ber808@reddit
2000 accord and 2001 cavalier still going =/ take care of your shit
Uncaring_Dispatcher@reddit
I just replaced my 2003 Honda Accord.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
Honestly fair point. Most modern cars are pretty solid within the first 10 years or so, it’s usually when you push past that where brand/model reliability gaps start to really show. Hyundai/Kia have improved a lot but the jury’s still kind of out on how their newer stuff holds up at the 15-20 year mark.
red18wrx@reddit
Parts start getting discontinued around the 5 year mark.
TomTom199004@reddit
I wouldnt actually agree they are crap. They can be considered crap if you look at them from premium car brands like BMW, Lexus, Mercedes.
Many of those korean cars still going in my country even if they are more then 20 years old, so generally any NA Hyundai/KIA would surviva longer then any turbo from other brand
f700es@reddit
We’ve had a ‘12 Kia Soul for 14 years
Say_what_u_say@reddit
I had a the same car! - but it got stolen. I did a lot of Soul searching..
f700es@reddit
Lol
Unique_Watch4072@reddit
Even new Toyota which are pretty reliable cars are not going to last 20 years. I have a 38 year Toyota that will outlast me.
Ejmct@reddit
Can they really be worse than any Stelanis vehicle?
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
No
NetherIndy@reddit
Know what the first couple characters of the VIN mean... country of assembly and plant. Some of the Korean built models have way outlasted their price with decent maintenance. All Souls, Seltoses, Konas and Niros in the US have been Korean built only. Not sure how tariffs are affecting prices on them these days. The US built are mid. The Mexican built are... cheap?
CairnsRock1@reddit
The Genesis owners love their cars. Me being one of them. G70
LXLuther08@reddit
If you drive very little, pamper the heck out of your cars and don't drive like a NASCAR race car driver, perform regular maintenance, and purchase a new car every couple years, then these can be good cars. Otherwise, no.
Softcorew@reddit
I bought a 2018 Kia optima Lx in 2019 with 27k miles. I still have the car today, driven daily 50 ish miles. Over that time , I have replaced the tires twice, battery once, brakes thrice, and have kept up with oil changes. I now am closing in on 100k miles and the check engine light has never came on and still drives great. I would really like to get this car to atleast 200k before I upgrade. I have enjoyed my Kia so far.
Active_Elk_4831@reddit
Many of them are okay to buy with 20,000 miles on it to save depreciation and then sell at 90,000 miles.
Lonelycat9@reddit
They're wonderful if you buy warranty and switch cars more often than not.
bclovn@reddit
Bought a new Santa Cruz 2.5 3 years ago. It seemed very solid and overall I was pleased. Without the warranty I would not touch a Hyundai. The depreciation sucks. I just traded it while I could get decent money but still lost 33% value. I purposely stayed away from the turbo and DCT transmission. Now back to Toyota again.
Nerothehero58@reddit
I have a 2019 Forte with 110k miles. Kept up with the maintenance and it’s been rock solid. Still rides like new.
Dick_Burger@reddit
My 2022 Rio rolled over 115k miles and I’ve done front brakes, more oil changes than I can count of care to keep track of, a few cvt fluid drain and fills, air filters, cabin filters, and I probably should service the cooling system soon.
I’m not a fan of how they designed the plastic oil filter housing and the plastic thermal management module, but the thing has been solid. The PFI 1.6 they put in from 2020-2023 seem to hold up ok, but N=1 here, so take it with some salt.
fakemedicines@reddit
I still drive a 2012 Hyundai Accent. 150k miles. The car is starting rust so the run will probably be over in a year but it held up longer than I ever imagined.
OldDude1960@reddit
We have a 2019 Kia Soul base model, MT, with about 72k miles. Have only had to replace the idler pulley and water pump. I replaced the spark plugs at 60k just because I wanted to. Have had no other issues with it. Car has been regularly undercoated and gets regular maintenance.
Resident_Skroob@reddit
The "I've only had to replace" thing makes me scratch my head. Both my cars are over 150k and have had nothing but maintenance. Hell, my last bike made it to 99k with only a clutch at 67k (which is about when they need replacing). I guess one's impression of reliability is based upon last experience? I won't buy a car that regularly requires repair before 100k.
Having to replace a water pump after 70k is wild to me, and would put me off that brand forever. I'm not calling you out, just making an observation that "reliability" seems to often be people simply judging it against past experience.
OldDude1960@reddit
Granted, you've been lucky. I suspect the water pump was my fault, because I made the belt too tight after replacing the idler pulley. Nothing had failed yet, I just noticed things getting slightly noisy.
I don't consider replacing easily changed parts that cost less than $50, a huge issue. I doubt there is any vehicle made today that will reach 150k with just basic maintenance, especially in northern New England where I am. There are too many components that can fail now, and too much complexity. The simpler the vehicle is, the more reliable it becomes.
I've owned many brands of vehicles. None reached 150k before salt induced corrosion made keeping them untenable. None made it to 100k without replacing something. The best one was a 2011 Corolla S that made it to 115k before we traded it in. I had replaced the front wheel bearings and a camshaft position sensor. Brakes and rotors never last here, no matter what the vehicle is.
I think if people stick to the brands that are known for reliability, they have the best odds.
Prize-Lychee7973@reddit
Do you like having a reliable engine and transmission?
go literally anywhere else.
Hour-General-9908@reddit
I sell them used and you couldn't pay me to buy one. I'm only Toyota and Honda at this point of my life
jeffeb3@reddit
Newer hyundai/kia don't have engines. Their EVs are awesome.
pon_d@reddit
Wouldn't hesitate on one of their EVs.
My buddy's wife had her Sorento's second engine fail today
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
That’s kind of the paradox with them right now isn’t it. Their EV stuff has been genuinely well received and doesn’t carry the same baggage, but then you hear something like your buddy’s wife being on her SECOND engine and it’s like… yeah. Hard to fully shake that reputation when stuff like that is still happening.
pon_d@reddit
...yeah. It's hard, he's looking to replace it soon, just last week he was telling me that the 10-year warranty was a big selling point for him. I pointed out that I'd rather have a 3-year warranty I didn't need to use. It's tough; even Toyota's struggling with issues these days on the TTV6 engines - it seems like we might be running up against the limits of what an ICE engine can do in terms of the compromises between emissions, regulatory compliance, efficiency, reliability, and tolerance for imperfect owners. The days of the reliability of things like the Jeep 4.0 straight six seem to be behind us.
hazSolar@reddit
What year Sorento? Is it old enough it has a Theta engine?
pon_d@reddit
I think it's a 2017 but I haven't like, looked at the VIN
Tomas2891@reddit
Aren’t Hyundai and Kia EVs getting plagued by ICCU problems right now?
hazmatt24@reddit
The true failure rate of the iccu is minimal, but the people that have had it happen are loud. We already put 70k on our 2023 Ioniq 5, and other than it being a magnet for rocks to hit the windshield, we've had no issues. I'd love to get an EV6 GT Line for myself but my ICE is paid off and you can't beat that monthly payment. Plus I WFH so my 12 year old car only has 80k on it. But if anything happened to it I'd look at an EV6. Gas prices are still making me consider getting another EV just because.
Past-Judgment-9700@reddit
The failure rate is minimal but if it goes you don’t have a car for months… it’s totally turned me off of the EVx or Ionicx cars. I would take a Hyundai/Kia ICE (or 400V EV) any day.
Satins_Cock@reddit
Same with Chevrolet, lot of happy Bolt customers, meanwhile their turbo crossovers... Trash.
Say_what_u_say@reddit
** TLDR: buddy's wife never changed her oil **
ID_Poobaru@reddit
My grandpa has a gen 1 Sorento with the 3.8 engine and it’s been an absolute unit. 280k miles of towing boat all over the west
I’d imagine when they went unibody they got bad
N_ModeVN@reddit
YouTubers savage geese said it best a year or so ago. Most of the time they’re great. But all too often people get a bomb.
And the dealers are horrible.
I had a 2022 Veloster N and loved it. Was awesome for 3 years.
Traded into a 2025 Elantra N last year. Huge mistake. Car was broken from day 1. Squeaked when ever it hit bumps.
Dealer replaced exhaust. Nothing Dealer replaced front left shock / insulator. Nothing.
Dealer said some cars just squeak.
Called corporate. Dealer became my worst enemy, wouldn’t touch the car.
Went to new dealer, they held the car for 10 days. Drove it .2 miles, said I was hearing chirping birds.
5 months and 1700 miles later tried to sell it to caravans, who rejected it because it squeaked.
Sold it to carmax shortly after.
Will never buy one again.
billybobthehomie@reddit
I have a 2024 Elantra SEL with 25000 miles. Haven’t had a single problem yet. Very nice interior for the price. Physical buttons instead of this Haptic Touch stuff. Infotainment system is nice but not too big and is redundant rather than the only way to do some things.
Couldn’t be happier with my purchase.
Time will tell but I’ve loved it so far.
Own-Secret-6523@reddit
I am not an owner of a Kia or Hyundai but my last job I traveled 3-4 weeks a month and rented cars from National. National typically has various makes and models. Almost always these were the very basic models but occasionally you would get upgraded models from some manufacturers.
I drove some Kias, both sedans and SUVs. I just didn't like how they drove at all compared to other vehicles I rented. Hyundai was a little better, but I still was not impressed with the drivability. Both of these brands though were always very basic models, never any upgrades in them. I do like the look of Kia vehicles though.
Generally cars that I personally did like driving were: Toyota Camry, Nissan Altima, Ford Fusion, Chevrolet Impala, and the the Chevrolet Malibu. I don't ever recall having a Honda even available to drive. Stellantis brands I just avoided due to not being impressed in the past with their vehicles. SUVs I thought drove nice were the Chevrolet Blazer, Chevrolet Trailblazer, Ford Edge, Ford Escape, and Nissan Rogue (if loaded with options).
I am not a big GM brand guy, but I can tell you honestly, that every Chevrolet vehicle I rented, I thought drove very nice for their price points and being more basic model vehicles. My go to rental though if I could find one, was either the Toyota Camry or the Nissan Altima. Many times you could find these with upgraded options on them.
theindomitablefred@reddit
People are very opinionated about Hyundai/Kia for some reason. In my experience they’ve been pretty reliable, but but with big brands like that there are just so many of their cars in the market that a lot of people will have various experiences.
j-christopher@reddit
Some of the models are ridiculously cheap to lease, which also limits your durability concerns to 24-36 months while they're still under warranty.
Live_Magician_9209@reddit
Junk cars. Add genesis too. People only buy them because they’re cheap (comparably) and look ok.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
Lumping Genesis in there is a bit of a stretch tbh. That brand has gotten genuinely strong reviews across the board and has been climbing reliability rankings pretty steadily. It’s not just “looks ok for the price” territory anymore. The “people only buy them because they’re cheap” argument could honestly be applied to half the brands on the market. Value for money is a legitimate reason to buy a car.
jakebg19@reddit
I owned a 3.3 TT G80 Sport for awhile. My time in the forums etc shows thats its quite hard to judge reliability, especially on the newer gens. Most people that buy them new (in the groups at least) barely drive them. 5-6yr old cars with 20k on them. I loved mine for what it was, but it was NOT a reliable car at all. Hell the day I went to trade it in the backing of the seats fell off, I had to do a jimmy-rig zip-tie job to pass the trade in inspection lol. I got mine for 60% less than new with 40k on it, I would have hated it had I paid for it new.
There was one or two guys that were the outliers and had 180 to 190,000 mi with minor issues, but thats one or two out of 20k+ people.
JCC114@reddit
They are the same manufacturer. 100% group them together. Same manufacturer that fights against every warranty claim. Those reviews are meaningless. All pay to play. They are being reviewed by the same people they pay for advertising space. Biggest marketing budgets equal best placement on those top whatever list. Confirm this by looking at early Theta 2 vehicles. Reviewed incredibly well. Hyundai/Kia/Genesis all have had very large marketing budgets for several years as they try to dig out of past years of bad cars so “reviewers” want as big of piece of that as possible talk highly of them. Basically, reviews lie.
Wilder_Oats@reddit
My experience with a 2023 Hyundai Sonata hybrid has been awful. I’ll never buy a Hyundai again.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
What happened with it? Always curious whether it’s mechanical, dealer experience, customer service, or something else because that stuff matters a lot for the full picture.
Wilder_Oats@reddit
If the car isn’t driven at least weekly, the battery dies. Took it to the dealership twice for troubleshooting, they claim nothing is wrong with car and won’t do anything about it. Side note, a colleague bought a brand new Hyundai G80. Air conditioning died at 400 miles.
xxBrun0xx@reddit
Look up ICCU issues on the Ioniq 5 side. To give some context, it's an issue that leaves you stranded on the side of the road and appears to impact between 7-10% of all Ioniq 5/EV6/Ioniq 6 vehicles per year. The issue persists after half a dozen recalls, part revs, and software updates from Hyundai. They have been trying unsuccessfully to fix the issue since 2022. The 12V batteries also typically don't even make it 1 year before needing replacement.
That being said, they are incredibly well built, software works well, range is good, very comfortable, and they drive way better than other cars it competes with. So owners are in this weird space where they love their cars despite them breaking frequently.
Yes, Hyundai are still crap. But honestly so are all other 1st gen EVs. Early Model S, Lucids, and Porsche EVs all have serious reliability issues. I expect whatever platform eventually replaces the current one will be indestructible similar to Tesla Model 3/Y (2nd gen EV platform).
Just thought I'd give a different perspective. Full disclosure: I love my Ioniq 5N. If it has the ICCU die causing me to get in a hideous accident, I'll buy another one.
u3b3rg33k@reddit
funny thing: the ICCU are hyundai's gen2. the earlier 400V systems don't have that problem.
i'm curious just how fun the 5N is, if it weren't for the dice-roll ICCU I'd be considering one as a next vehicle.
xxBrun0xx@reddit
It is extremely fun to drive. If you're local, happy to let you test drive mine!
Thin-Amphibian6888@reddit
depends where you are from i guess. Kia ceed is probably the most common car on eu roads and is considered somewhat reliable
Ok-Hour-8665@reddit
We still have an 07? santa fe that refuses to die. Engine was well taken care of, just shy of 200k.
Unique_Night1895@reddit
They’re not Toyota-level bulletproof yet, but they’re also not the “cheap unreliable cars” people remember.
Over_Pizza_2578@reddit
US? Still mostly true, they don't rank very high on reliability charts
Europe? Top 10 most reliable brands
ExcellentWinner7542@reddit
Yes, still crap.
IntrepidRobot@reddit
Got 2023 Kia Sportage with over 50k KMs, no issues except one faulty spark plug replaced under warranty. The prior issues you're reading about are probably related to the THETA 2 engines in previous generations. The QC was awful and it resulted in massive recalls. Then there was the USB fiasco, used to steal cars.
However, new generation seems to run well and it's push to start eliminating the USB 'hack'.
macman7500@reddit
I'm not a fan of them used because owners tend to not care and not keep up on maintenance. Also the whole Kia boys theft problems doesn't help
elmatt71@reddit
If you buy it brand new, can get it at least 5k cheaper than a comparable Toyota or Honda, take care of it and don’t plan on keeping it past 90k miles it can be a good buy. The 5k will make up for the crummy resale value of Hyundai/Kia and if you’re the original owner and follow the owners manual for service, the factory warranty is very good.
Equal-Fee770@reddit
Hyundai has been better since 2015. And I would say are quality now. You could NOT pay me to own a Kia. Garbage cars
avoidhugeships@reddit
They are the same cars with different design and marketing.
Equal-Fee770@reddit
And yet the statistics don’t lie
mregression@reddit
Long story short: no.
ChiraqOG@reddit
There not necessarily crap there just way overpriced nowadays for what you get.
bygoneOne@reddit
2008 Hyundai Azera 3.8L with just over 100k. Just regular maintenance and one alternator. Very reliable - not one of their econo-boxes though.
supremekingherpderp@reddit
I’ve bought my 2018 Elantra new in 2017 so going on 9 years. Put 61k miles on it. I’ve had zero mechanical issues and done nothing special with it besides oil changes and tire rotations. I did have the shit white paint that they’re currently working on for free from the recall.
I think Hyundai/Kia get a bad wrap because they’re cheaper than Honda or Toyota. I’m assuming the customer base is less likely to actually maintenance them.
Regular-Bother-832@reddit
They're better than what they used to be
DallasGrave@reddit
Our sales guys all have 2020+ Forte GTs and now are getting K4s. 4 of the GTs have over 200k and have never had anything but oil, filters, brakes and tires. 11 cars over the last 5 years. Worst we've had are AC pumps and alternators.
Is that an indication of quality? Maybe. But it's a better sample size than anyone else here has presented.
terran1212@reddit
Having owned some, they’re excellent.
Brooklyn_918@reddit
I own a Lexus and I recently drove Palisade top model for a long trip and I was genuinely impressed by the comfort and ease of driving it.
I loved how it keeps you secure once you touch 80mph, you feel a gentle hug around your waist.
After driving 12hrs a day I was only a little tired and No soreness the next day and drove for another 7 hours.
The one con that I could notice it was way louder than my Lexus RX350
00death@reddit
I’ve got a ‘22 Elantra N-Line and I absolutely love it. Only complaints I have are minimal things in just being nitpicky about, I’ve had zero issues with the car so far
Impressive-Crab2251@reddit
Go on https://m.carcomplaints.com/ and research the brand, car, years etc and make your own decision. I am biased Korean and Chinese cars are not something o would buy.
Say_what_u_say@reddit
You bought / owned two CDJR products, and your takeaway from that was: "don't buy Korean"?? 👀
TopShoe121@reddit
Ran mileage over 200K on both my 06 and 16 Sorento before selling. Good cars, never skip an oil change. 2020 Soul died before 80k, it was junk.
One-Sea2951@reddit
Yes
Few_Improvement7329@reddit
last time i was in a Hyundai was my ex gf's 2010 santa fe sometime around 2020. it was easy to work on, nothing super out of the ordinary if you've done any mechanic work, but:
i'm not a big gal (120lb/~55kg), but i leaned over onto the center console to adjust my seating position and it cracked under my elbow. like almost caved in. also, the plastic panel under the trunk area cracked entirely in half when my black lab jumped up into it. the seats were already starting to tear in some places, and i had replaced multiple interior parts from the lil retaining tabs breaking off of them. on a ten year old car kept in northern alabama.
never again. even if the reliability is okay (meh), i'd never trust the quality of materials or manufacturing. even if she just had a dud, then that lack of quality control would be highly concerning.
get a Civic or a Corola. your grandkids will drive it.
NaitiveTexan1270@reddit
2012 Kia Optima owner. they outsourced their engines originally, and had oiling issues. They replaced my engine at 95K miles under warranty. Currently at 120k miles, and I drive the crap out of it. I love this car.
Jazzlike_Welcome5513@reddit
I’ve have a kia optima bought new in 2014. 190,000 miles and only have had to change oil, brakes, and tires. Still going strong.
Fit-Ad-7430@reddit
I have a cousin that works as a tech for Hyundai and he says that theyre all junk. Says the most common problem are blown engines lol
jimmyredcup@reddit
Own a 2017 Sonata I bought new with the Theta II engine. Have had two warranty visits for the engine, not engine failure. Never even a moment of hesitation from the service center about it being a warranty repair and costing me nothing. 10 year, 100,000 mile warranty is true. The engine now has a lifetime replacement warranty as well after the class action settlement.
Other than that not one bit of an issue with it other than burning about 1.5 quarts of oil between oil changes. Runs fantastic, mid-30s gas mileage with highway driving, and all the tech still works like new. Oil and filter change every 5,000 miles and any additional service in the manual based on mileage.
We like it so much we bought another Hyundai so now we have two.
illyria817@reddit
My 2002 Hyundai Sonata with \~240k miles still going strong. We got a 2024 Tucson Hybrid, really liking it so far, will see how it works out down the line.
muzaklover75@reddit
I drive my parents 23 Santa Fe some when I cart my parents around if I don’t want to drive my car. It drives really well and the quality and features are good for the price.
lucatitoq@reddit
Here’s a story with Kia: My grandfather sold BMWs for years. Around 15 years ago he retired, and his bmw had gotten a bit old so he got a Kia Niro. Despite his age (90 years old) he wants to learn how things work, and I’ve spent lots of time with him learning the infotainment system, CarPlay, etc, of his car. He’s a big fan of it, and really likes that it’s hybrid and he enjoys doing long drives and maintaining a really good fuel economy. Recently his warranty expired, and literally in the same month or the month later, the car was having some issues and when he brought it to the dealership it was a €6k repair… My grandpa took such good care of it, always having maintenance done on time, stored in a garage every night, never driven aggressively… and this is what he gets. So yeah, screw Kia.
MidAgeDadAtl@reddit
Kia’s are shit. Hyundai and Genesis are great.
When the Asian financial crisis happened Hyundai bailed out Kia and room majority ownership. They now are minority partners. A lot of the components are the same (the Kia ev6 is the same basic battery and car as the my Genesis gv70e but one is shitty and one is nice)
I made a mistake and bought a Kia and sold it a month later for a Genesis. Same basic software same battery but one was well done and one was a Kia. (I also loved my gas genesis when I had one)
epper_@reddit
since i’ve owned cars i’ve had
Honda civic VW golf Ford Fiesta Kia Optima Kia Niro (current) Kia K4 (current)
The three Kia’s have been by far the most reliable of the bunch.
RepresentativeExit63@reddit
They might have improved their quality but if you ever have a problem, they fight you on it. They're just not built with as good of materials and they wear out faster. You could argue that all brands' quality is going down, which is true. I would rather gamble with a Mazda/Honda/Toyota than with a Kia/Hyundai. You could roll the dice and get a rock solid Hyundai or roll the dice and get a lemon Toyota but the odds of both of those are lower than the opposite.
Superb-Meal-4473@reddit
If you’re buying a new 2023–2025 Elantra, K4, or Sonata, the reputation for being “crap” is largely outdated. These are genuinely competitive, well-equipped cars. The 10-year/100,000-mile powertrain warranty also offers meaningful long-term protection — which itself tells you something about where Hyundai/Kia’s confidence in their newer engines stands. The caveat is that Toyota-level long-term durability data for the newest generation simply doesn’t exist yet, and maintenance discipline matters more with these cars than with some Japanese competitors.
BiggusDickkussss@reddit
These 2 brands have been much better for almost 10 years.
They’re not crap.
ratdogdave@reddit
I have a 2009 Kia Rio, 137,000 miles. No major problems so far. I keep up with all the maintenance. So hopefully I can get to 200,000 miles.
Channel_Huge@reddit
Yes. Especially Hyundai.
AppropriateRound1@reddit
Bought an Elantra N a year ago brand new, no issues at all and such a blast to drive. Never thought I'd own a hyundai but they blew it out of the water with the N.
SloppySmack756@reddit
As long as you get rid of them before the powertrain warranty is up, they are fine.
Sasquatch559@reddit
I have a 2020 Sonata Limited with the 1.6 Turbo engine that I bought new. It has 123456 miles as of today and I have done nothing other than tires and regular maintenance (myself). Brakes are still at about 80%, haven't had any suspension components wear out. I'm still impressed by the comfort and features compared to other cars, especially at the price point.
I'm curious if a lot of reliability concerns stem from people that don't keep up with maintenance and drive irresponsibly.
Sagethim@reddit
My last KIA i had for 18 years, and sold it to my nephew, and he's driven it for the last year. Basic oil changes, tires when you need them, all you need to make most cars last.
Stingraysreefs@reddit
Have had multiple mechanics recommended the Kia Sportage
SpeedyHAM79@reddit
They are still crap IMO. My brother has an EV6 that is 1 year old and has a horrible clunk from the rear suspension that the dealership doesn't seem to be able to fix. It doesn't look look good for long term reliability.
Sorry_Visual@reddit
My 2011 Kia Rio5 has 170k miles and it's only ever been in the shop 3 times, once to rebuild the front end from an accident, a radiator I punched a hole in trying to hit the hood latch after my kid broke it, and once for the timing belt replacement. Everything else I've done myself and it's been across the country multiple times no issues. I'll never buy another one because of Hyundai/Kia immobilizer bullshit but I'm going to drive mine until I'm Flintstoning it down the road.
Ordinary-Map-7306@reddit
KIA EV9 still has some quality issues.
yopto@reddit
For reference, 2021 is the year they switched to the reliable smartstream engines with multiport injection.
deerhuntingdude@reddit
I've always hated them, but thought they may be better recently. My friend bought a new Hyundai and yeah less than a year in it's having trouble starting and they don't know why.
Altruistic-Panda-697@reddit
Nicer crap. Interiors are much improved. Not so much under the hood.
Crap_Sally@reddit
I’ve owned 3 Hyundais. 2001 sonata I sold with 292,000 miles. It’s probably still going. 2008 sonata blew a head gasket at 192,000. Now I’ve got a hybrid Tucson. Rides real smooth and I’m getting 37 mpg. I’ve always just done basic maintenance. I did get the extra warranty on electronics this time. Can’t trust that the electronics won’t break. Shit looks expensive. Anyway, it runs well for me. It works well for my utilization too.
Background-Job-3629@reddit
The company that builds them doesn’t support their dealerships and if you ever have to get service from one of them you will catch on quickly.
luiscor2537@reddit
If they had problems in the recent past, with basic engines, then how can you trust the newer more complicated ones?
PollutionOld9327@reddit
Yes, they are crap
Odd_Activity_8380@reddit
If you just change the oil regularly you are fine. Change the oil 3k instead of 5k. Trans service every 15k. Its a drain and fill, so you only change about 3-4 quarts of a 8-9 quart system.. they are cheap cars and people often are cheap on the maintenance which leads to failure. If you skimp on the maintenance and want to keep it 20 years then pass on it... however I recommend any Toyota or Honda without a turbo. Turbos are expensive maintenance items.
Turbulent_Deal_3145@reddit
There's certainly worse. But no they're not great. 12 years is a decent lifespan for one of those
SurlyJohn009@reddit
Since you guys have talked about the Theta II POS. I Owned a Theta II engined Sonata. At 72K it failed and caught on fire while in our garage.
Burned half the garage down and melted the car. This was a direct result of Hyundai and it's manufacturing failures.
My father was a maintenance freak, had all scheduled maintenance done. Hyundai denied our $12,000 claim through a loophole in the warranty.
I did just get news I get $2,351 from the SECOND class action suit against Hyundai. So I'm only out $9,649 now for a crap mobile.
I will never do business with a company that advertised a 10 year warranty and then actively fought every single claim. Fuck Hyundai.
TheLastGenXer@reddit
ive heard hyundai is kinda split.
the ev kona is supposed to be crap. but the ev ioniq 5 and 6 are supposed to be top notch.
WordWithinTheWord@reddit
Every brand is its own flavor of crap these days
BlueMonday2082@reddit
People who just bought a Kia/Hyundai think they are great. When it blows an engine at 60,000 miles they say they suck.
Tony-cums@reddit
Yes. They’re still garbage quality wise.
ferraricare@reddit
It is absolutely not true: go drive one. Then compare the prices and the warranty. Five in our family and everyone is happy.
Pinkys_Revenge@reddit
Their current cars are fine. They are middle of the road for reliability. Their previous generations had major problems with engine failures and were impressively easy to steal.
LingonberryOdd768@reddit
Thefts also affected insurance rates
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
Yeah that’s kind of what I’ve been seeing too. The older generations definitely hurt their reputation, especially with the engine issues and theft problems. But it seems like the newer models are more just average/solid, not amazing but not terrible either. Probably just comes down to maintenance and taking care of the car.
kyledukes@reddit
Just get rid of it before the warranty's up and you have nothing to worry about.
tombeaux1950@reddit
My 2023 Ioniq 6 (EV) might be the nicest ride I’ve owned. I’ve had it two years. It’s been back to the dealer twice for software updates. That’s it for repairs.
bobqzzi@reddit
We have an Ioniq 6 and love it
Sideburn_Cookie_Man@reddit
Nope. They've been excellent for ages.
Also worth remembering that each market is different.
Here in Aus, Korean cars are some of the highest regarded around - when considering new vehicles.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
The market difference point is underrated and doesn’t get brought up enough in these conversations. A lot of the horror stories you see online are pretty North America heavy, whether that’s due to different manufacturing batches, climate, how they’re driven, or just which issues get the most visibility on English speaking forums. Good to hear they’ve been solid in Aus though, that tracks with what a lot of people outside the US tend to say about them.
Sideburn_Cookie_Man@reddit
You hit the nail on the head there.
They seem to get the worst models, with the lowest specs available - it's not surprising they hate Kia.
lItsAutomaticl@reddit
Hyundai interiors and infotainment are pretty nice, at least the Tucson I rented. I own an objectively nicer car in every way but I would be really happy if I could put in the screen setup from a Tucson.
avoidhugeships@reddit
They are nice new but do not hold up well.
smthngeneric@reddit
I've heard this same question asked since they started selling these cars in America. And the answer is always "no they're fine now, those were just the old ones that had problems" and it just keeps going. Like someone else said if you replace your car regularly you'll probably be fine but I wouldn't hang onto it for too long.