I feel like there’s a certain stigma around not wanting to be (or no longer wanting to be) an expat

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BlushHeat@reddit

Absolutely, it's wild how people act like you owe it to them to stay miserable in a place that doesn't vibe with you; living your best life should always trump a passport stamp.

[-]

You're going to have haters anywhere about anything. Before moving abroad I moved from Dallas to Baltimore, and Dallas people were like "ew why Baltimore?" And then I did the reverse and Baltimore people said the same about Texas.

Even when I moved to London and San Diego, generally quite popular and desirable places to live, some ppl's first response was "good luck with the cost of living" - haters gonna hate

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kicia-kocia@reddit

I mean, to a lot of people around the globe the decision to move back to the US right now if you have an option to stay in Canada will seem foolish.

The US is not a desirable place to live at present and Canadians will be acutely aware of this, having suffered from unhinged decisions and threats of your president.

I honestly wonder how are you surprised at these reactions having lived in Canada for a while now?

I bet peoples' reactions would be very different if you were moving back to another country.

In other words - I don't think it's about an immigrant deciding to move back to their home country. It's about an American who thinks life in the US will be better than life in Canada right now.

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sum-9@reddit

I mean people are trying to warn you that you’re moving back to a place where rights are being taken away from women and minorities, democracy is broken, and they are currently starting a war. So no, they are not really bizarre attitudes IMHO. But hey, you do you.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I don’t care for your tone at all. I completely respect your opinion, but I don’t feel like I should feel obligated to live somewhere that actively makes me depressed.

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lasmesitasratonas@reddit

Ask your fellow American friends how they are feeling right now. If they’re feeling absolutely amazing, they’re (and you’re) probably on the wrong side of history.

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chiree@reddit

Everyone I know in the US is just living life, same as everywhere else.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

They said they’re going to “work around” the shit happening in America. Must be nice to be able to just “work around” the loss of rights, violence, dwindling social services, and skyrocketing prices for everything.

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Fancy_Violinist_5056@reddit

The sanctimonious virtue signaling is next level. Most rational people can differentiate between the government of a country and its citizens. Americans are just individual people with literally zero control over policy trying to live their lives the best they can just like everyone else in this fucked up world. 7 billion pawns who are too stupid to direct their anger in the appropriate places. Quit laying the weight of the nation's problems on OP's shoulders. It's absolutely ridiculous.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

He wants non-judgmental positive regard when he tells the people of the country who have played host to him that he’d rather live in the country whose elected leader has directly threatened them and is destabilizing the world. He hopped on Reddit to complain that he hasn’t received well-wishes.

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Fancy_Violinist_5056@reddit

Again viewing everything through the lens of politics and treating individual people like an extension of their corrupt government is the surest sign of an idiot. There are many reasons why a person might miss the country they grew up in, that's not a personal slight to Canadians in any way. Get off your high horse and hug an animal or something, you seem like you need it.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

It seems like you’re struggling with this.

Nobody is blaming him for the acts of the US govt. They just aren’t hyping him up to move back bc to them it seems like a bad idea for myriad reasons, including geopolitical. And he’s SAD and MAD he didn’t get a handshake and a pat on the back.

He’s a white man with the ability and resources to easily move to another country and back again, according to his whims. And that’s not enough for him. He also wants validation from “coworkers and others” (jfc) and now randos on the internet.

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Fancy_Violinist_5056@reddit

Ummm your comment that I originally responded to sounds a lot more like blame than a simple lack of enthusiasm for his choices "OP said they’re just going to “work around” the shit happening in America. Must be nice to be able to just work around the loss of rights, violence, dwindling social services, and skyrocketing prices for everything." As if his moving back or not moving back is going to have any impact whatsoever on any of those things. He talked about missing his family. Not feeling like a part of the culture in Canada. Those are real things. You're the one making it all about politics and now race apparently. Just yuck. Plenty of people from all ethnic backgrounds move from one country to another and sometimes it's not a fit, it's really as simple as that.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

You can’t be a real person.

That wasn’t blame for those things. That was pointing out that he’s either incredibly naive or incredibly privileged to just be able to work around shit that negatively and significantly impacts large swathes of folks.

I’m done with this. Your reading comprehension is tenuous, at best.

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Fancy_Violinist_5056@reddit

I can't be a real person huh? Because it's unfathomable that someone disagrees with you? The funny thing is that your "opinions" are just the NPC tropes that every other brain rotted political zealot on Reddit bleats out mindlessly. 2 minute hate style. Get a grip.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Your comments are ridiculous. Canadians have every right to be mad. However, I also have every right to go back home and be close to my family. It’s spending that I need to do. There’s no other way of stating it. I didn’t really fit it, I didn’t enjoy it, and now I’m going to have to pack up and try something else out. If someone has a problem with that they can shove it.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

What alternative do you have to offer me? I reason to bet that you don’t have an alternative other than some platitudes about how Canada is the most wonderful place on earth where nobody could ever be homesick.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

You never asked for an alternative. You just popped on to complain that Canadians (and now randos on Reddit) think moving back to a place where the leader directly threatened their country while destabilizing his own (and the world) is a shit idea. If it’s not working out then just quietly go home, no need to tell your host countrymen how miserable you’ve been and how you’d rather live in the country inflicting so much misery worldwide.

Naive, oblivious, entitled.

Nobody owes you well wishes.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

This is what I deal with every single day living in Canada. You want to do something as simple as going visit your aging mom and dad in the states? Prepare to get a lecture about why you shouldn’t do that. And if you do it anyway prepare to be criticized.

I wanted to like it. I wanted to fit in. I couldn’t, I didn’t, and now the only answer is to leave. Nothing more to it than that.

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SpeedyPrius@reddit

Nobody decides on a whim to make a move home. The states are not falling apart, and people aren’t waiting on every corner to shoot you. Nobody knows your experience but you - come on home if you will be happier!

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thank you for giving me some much needed positivity!

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SpeedyPrius@reddit

I’m a grandma- it comes with the territory!

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Strict-Joke236@reddit

I would imagine that after the President's slamming of Canada and upending our once wonderful relationship with our northern neighbors for no good reason that the Canadians could never have a positive view of the US. Can you blame them?

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Not at all. But I am an individual person. I’m more than happy to let them win that argument and just see myself out and move, though. Obviously I’m not welcome, and the attitude I’ve received in the last year alone is enough for me to pack up and leave.

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Unhappy_Performer538@reddit

Have you been getting a lot of hostility in Canada?

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

It’s constant. The only acceptable thing I can do to appease those I work with (and those I talk to) is to basically reject everything American. But deep down I’m not able to do that. I still love where I come from and I would never change it, even if I could. They want me to reject America, give up my citizenship, and never go there again (and that’s the only thing they will accept as proof that I’m not “one of the bad ones”).

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Unhappy_Performer538@reddit

Let’s be honest it probably still wouldn’t be enough. I visited Canada for a few months and even with minimal contact with them, was still berated angrily a few times- as I was there in solidarity to support Canada. It’s horrible what’s happened to our relations and I really hate it and hope we can repair down the road. I understand they’re angry and obviously I get why. But with all this happening, there’s just nothing you can do to really integrate & if I were you I’d leave too.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thanks for this reply. You truly helped me feel seen by sharing your experience. I’m glad I’m not alone in feeling like this.

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chiree@reddit

I made the decision to stay where I'm at, and it's by having family and local connections. But I miss the lifestyle and culture of some places, and I left behind a lot of good friends. I'll always be a foreigner. I get it.

You do you. People who inject politics into everything are fucking annoying.

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Gunzhard22@reddit

Ha this is so not true. We're starting to see home foreclosures spiking and massive unemployment, as well as people just struggling to buy groceries. Sure some folks are privileged but it eventually affects everyone. Not to mention the threat to personal freedoms.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

What are you even going on about? Just because she lives in America like 300 plus million people does not mean that she Green Lights the current administration. Your accounts are nothing but rage bots.

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sum-9@reddit

Nailed it.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I’m not letting you assign any political preferences of affiliations to me based on wanting to go back and live in the place that I grew up and where I was born. If that’s your feeling, you can fuck off.

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Healthy_Camp_3760@reddit

Respectfully, their tone seems quite reasonable, and I don’t think they’re suggesting that you should feel obligated to do anything.

If I may, out of kindness, offer a concern: I worry that you might be responding to the people around you in a way that makes it difficult to form community. You mentioned that you found Vancouver isolating. I believe you, and I’d suggest you reflect on how your responses might contribute to that. I worry that if you move elsewhere, you might find the experience even more isolating regardless of where you go.

Of course, I may be entirely mistaken. I’m just a stranger observing your post and a single comment. I simply found your reply quite striking.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I have never struggled with metal health issues until I moved here. I always had lots of friends and lived a very happy life. For whatever reason, I was never able to recapture that here. Vancouver is a very cold city filled with people who are not interested in being your friend, not interested in knowing you, and don’t really want anything to do with you. I tried, but I’m tired of trying and just want out.

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ElijahSavos@reddit

Metro Van is 3 mln of completely different people. I’m sure there are some that may be your good friends.

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sum-9@reddit

Sounds more like a you problem. I’ve made loads of great friends since moving to Canada. Canadians are generally very friendly and helpful.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Well I’m very happy for them (genuinely). That has not been my experience at all, but I can acknowledge that some people will have different experiences than others.

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Gunzhard22@reddit

That's a perfectly good reason to leave there, more than reasonable. But the warnings you've got about the are worth knowing regardless, even if you decide to come back.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I’m willing to take a step back and maybe think about trying a new location, but I know deep down this particular location will never work for me. At least I can try to be reasonable and acknowledge that.

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Gunzhard22@reddit

Yeah that's fair

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sum-9@reddit

I couldn’t give a shit. Go back to the burning husk that is now the U.S. then, we won’t miss you at all.

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ponpiriri@reddit

Of course you don't give a shot. Only your opinion matters, right?

That's why no one should listen to you and folks like you when it comes to making life decisions.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

You need serious help if this is how you reply to people. Let me guess, you’re one of the “kind” Canadians I’ve met along the way? I’ve been treated terribly by a lot of people in Canada and I’m done with it. If I get turned into Swiss cheese when I get back, so be it. It’s a better way to go out than being around people with this kind of attitude every day.

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sum-9@reddit

😂

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Luckily it’s my life and my decisions (and not yours). End of conversation.

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Conscious-Tutor3861@reddit

u/RadioDude1995 : I wholeheartedly agree with your original post about giving a place a try and moving on if it's not working for you. Even places that are "the best" on paper might not be the right fit for you, and that's OK.

However, I want to give you some feedback regarding the other, antagonistic replies you've made in this thread. The chatter you're getting from other people about violence in America, about not wanting to ever set foot in America, about America being a shithole country... those are very, very common attitudes that Americans hold about much of the rest of the world. Americans have spent much of the last 20-30 years shitting on other countries and other people, and they've effectively gotten a free pass on such comments because there were still a lot of good things on in America.

Now that the shoe is on the other foot and America is steaming pile, it sucks for people to paint your people with a broad brush and not consider you as an individual and the redeeming qualities of your country, right? You as an individual aren't responsible for everything that goes on in your country and you don't want everyone treating you like an ambassador for your country, right? You want people to understand that your country can have both good and bad qualities, but on the whole it's more good than bad, right?

I urge you to be introspective and take a lesson from what you're experiencing. And the next time an American makes a "joke" about Canadians just being Americans-lite, or the French surrendering, or Mexicans being criminals, or whatever the negative stereotype is, have some courage and tell that person to stop. Explain to them that, not only is there more to the world than America, but that lots of other countries are doing things better than America and that Americans would benefit from having some humility and learning how they can be a better people and a better country.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Oh please. I give it a rest. Most Americans are not thinking about other countries. guys are on such a weird bender of America bad. Yeah the country has its issues and it can really suck. But the campaigns that Americans should just take being slander 24/7 is getting out of control to the point it's actually happening in real life. I've had to put a lot of people together when travelling who were confused that people aren't gonna respond as if it's a Reddit comment section in fear of being down voted.

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FlyFishingRealtor@reddit

You mean besides the actual president? It’s been said so many times it was brought up in questions to the Canadian prime minister and the leader of their opposition party for a response.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I fully agree with you. I think Americans need to do better with how they view other countries. I totally understand that perspective. I just personally feel like at this stage in my life, I belong in the country I was born and raised and nowhere else. I totally understand that people in other countries have a right to hate me for my nationality. I just think everyone else should be understanding when I decide that I’m going to go back. I have nothing against anyone and no animosity, but I don’t desire to continue on this pathway any further. I will commit to being the change I want to see in the world, but I’ll do it from home.

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ElijahSavos@reddit

Well what’s the question? Why did you even post this? Good luck going back home and enjoying your life.

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

Personally I like these posts, as someone who is still chugging away at trying to build a life abroad but can often feel like I might be happier back home. It's "popular" right now to disparage anyone who wants to stay in or move back to the US, to the point you can second guess your own feelings. If every single person in your life online or in person is saying the same thing, I don't care how firm your sense of self is, you're going to struggle with believing anything otherwise. People always look to find others with similar views, or they give up on their identity in pursuit of acceptance.

These kinds of posts help remind me and others we might not be alone if we make this kind of decision in the future.

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Conscious-Tutor3861@reddit

In OP's case, however, there is a specific explanation for the animosity: Trump has spent the last year attacking, belittling, and trying to domineer Canada. There's been a huge cultural shift in the last year from viewing Americans as our friends and brothers to completely shunning everything to do with America. Canadians straight up do not like Americans right now, and it's not a sentiment that's magically going to disappear with a different President.

PS: I'm an American who emigrated to Canada so I've experienced both sides of this shift in attitudes.

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

That's a very blanket statement mate. I'm as much of a self hating American expat as anyone else but America is now like many other countries. Stop trying to paint us as particularly worse than another nation. Hope you have these kinds of words about NZ (new right wing government dismantling everything Arden did), UK, Germany with their right wing party resurgence, Japan with their new right wing leader, etc etc.

Every country has good and bad sides.

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UnknownPleasures3@reddit

The US is in a different power position than most of its allies. You have been acting like world police for decades. This has had massive repercussions for the rest of the world, including its allies.

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sum-9@reddit

Good and bad sides LOL. Name another country that has elected a rapist pedophile? And where the rest of the party still supports them?

Go on…?

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ponpiriri@reddit

Easy. South Africa and the Philippines.

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

I mean just ignore how the other countries also have Epstein perpetrators in their governments/sovereignties? Prince Andrew anyone? Oh right "not my monarchy." How about some other crimes to be aware of, like Australia's abuse and murder if immigrants who dared to come to us by boat? Hmmm?

Dig into any country's history or current admins and you will see corruption is global and ebbs and flows in and out of focus.

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Conscious-Tutor3861@reddit

Prince Andrew was arrested, though, right?

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TikiBikini1984@reddit

Andrew had no role in government. And my monarchy so I'm glad to speak of it. Mandelson is out via a forced resigning. Lang in Paris resigned from his position in the same forced way. There are consequences in other countries, and further consequences we hope in the future. Your whataboutism has no function other than to distract.

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ErnestBatchelder@reddit

Silvio Berlusconi, media mogul and Prime Minister of Italy from 94-95, 2001-2006, 2008-2011, PM of the party 3 times. Sex parties, abuse of office, underage sex crimes, bribery, and corruption.

He's actually fairly comparable to trump. The issue is Italy doesn't have the same geopolitical power to have a global ripple effect.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

I'm a minority and I luve a much better life in America to what a lot of minorities live in different countries. I can say that with complete confidence. And I'm a woman. Yes, America sucks on a lot of fronts, but it's still has a lot of privileges that the rest of the world cannot give.

This isn't about whether or not you like America. it's whether or not she feels comfortable in a new spot and making it home goes out we know that disliking America is basically the virtue signaling that everyone loves on reddit. But that's how you feel, that's not how she has to feel

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Chuhaimaster@reddit

When your country is an active threat to its own allies and the stability of the rest of the world, people tend to have opinions about it.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

And that's completely fair, but what's not fair is how you try to you guys don't guilt the UK, Canada Mexico, South America, India, Asian countries etc about the atrocities that it has within its government. And it definitely has them. The online activism on here is out of control. And it doesn't help anything. You bitching and moaning on reddit does not stop what's going on.

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Kingsley-Zissou@reddit

No one, even in Texas is even making jokes like that. Just because you saw it on x which is filled with bots, or Reddit which is filled with bots, does not make it true.

Are you suggesting that molester-in-chief or his administration are bots? Because it’s them talking about making Canada the 51st state. It’s the Trump admin talking about annexing allied territory. They went so far as to make a Greenland shaped cake decorated with the American flag that foreign diplomats were cutting into. Random twitter bots are one thing, but we’re talking about the literal government of the United States.

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Lillemor_hei@reddit

Can I ask what privileges America has that the rest of the world doesn’t have?

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Absolutely, one of the biggest is that I can at least discuss race. I've been to so many European countries where I instantly get shut down and told that racism doesn't exist there when it clearly does. the excuses I get would make you think that I'm back in Jim Crowe South, and I'm from the deep South in America.

My employment opportunities are better. My race is at least more integrated within America compared to other countries. I've been called the n-word more times in Europe than I ever have in America. Which is wild because of the origins of the word

Other parts of the world aren't perfect just because they aren't America.

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Top-Half7224@reddit

I would argue that what you are describing is *opportunity* not privileges. Quality of life in the US is very good if you can afford it, but the safety nets in Europe give more security for those that can't. I agree with you on the racism though, its pretty normalized. As is sexism, especially in southern europe.

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livsjollyranchers@reddit

White people have the best time moving off to the EU based on racial preferences there. No way that's coming into play, eh. These factors you mention would just be completely overlooked.

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Rasputin171@reddit

Thank you for this post. To be honest I’m surprised you’re not getting downvoted. Your actual experience is less meaningful than someone’s opinion of your experience. Common sense/self awareness/nuance not really of any value here. Reddit really has become more insufferable by the day. Appreciate you. Best!

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Lol I might not be getting downvoted because I'm actually a minority voice and not the loads of white privileged people on here that keep wanting to speak for minorities and women.

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Rasputin171@reddit

Oh okay. I’m white and okay in my skin and view of the world and don’t feel the need to speak on anyone’s behalf. I enjoyed your comment thought it was great and yet met with another generalization - the kind that you spoke against. Cheers.

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slack3d@reddit

Ah here we go.. the shortsighted people that don't really understand what the US is, and what it stands for.

As if our rights in Canada are not being taken away by Bill C-9? Or the illegal use of the Emergencies Act on a group of protesters? Or Bill C-11 and the aftermath of less information available?

Give me a break..

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

You likely don’t have a passport.

Shut up.

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sum-9@reddit

Here we go, the anti vax brigade.

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nah-nah-nanaha@reddit

Right? I would've said that people were overreacting and stereotyping a few years ago but not now. Nothing could get me to move back to the US right now.

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AccountForDoingWORK@reddit

People definitely told me I was overreacting when we moved away 6 years ago specifically because we knew stuff like this was going to happen.

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sum-9@reddit

💯

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orange_salamander20@reddit

What rights are being taken away?

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Far-Tourist-3233@reddit

I’ve been in Canada for 5 years and have made the decision to move back to the UK. I feel it lacks community and have also felt really isolated. Whilst Canadians are lovely and it’s a beautiful country , it is just not for me .

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Binar1101@reddit

Only if you care what other people think. 🤔

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Conscious-Tutor3861@reddit

This kind of attitude is why we've raised a generation of entitled assholes in America.

We should care what other people think and re-evaluate our behaviors when other people criticize us.

And that doesn't mean we always agree with other people's criticisms; it does mean we should be open to feedback and introspection when challenged by others, though.

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Binar1101@reddit

Oh please. Get real. Feel free to allow other people to control who you are and what you do and think. Especially now when the assholes are right wingers. Go gaslight someone else. 🙄

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

So. Entitled.

Looks like we didn’t send our best.

Just move back already. Ugh.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

The level of which I care is rapidly decreasing by the day.

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Binar1101@reddit

When you reach 70, you have no more effs to give. Trust me. 😝

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Chemical-Cricket9225@reddit

I like being isolated and outdoors in Canada, but country and people are pretty lame and shallow. Most workplaces are toxic while opportunities to grow or get a raise are fewer. Country is generally in a downward spiral. Cost of everything going up like but services and products you are getting are just getting worse and it's becoming pretty annoying.

I think it has a good balance of safety and if you make a decent income(upward of 130k single or combined) is an alright place(if you are not in Vancouver or Toronto), if you don't have enough money and you are not from 3rd world country I don't see much of a benefit being here honestly. Too many wildfires, lot of smoke, expensive food, lots of silent corruption and monopoly, polarized society etc

Canada is bunch of individuals in one place, there is no real sense of community. Yeah, they might argue there is but even among Canadians conversations and relationships are pretty lame, generally people are very nice, but pretty dishonest and scared for some reason, I guess isolation.

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Capable_Fly_4692@reddit

One of my childhood friends was gunned down in broad daylight. A school 2 miles from me had an incident with an armed guy trying to enter an elementary school about a month ago. It's everywhere, but you know how to maneuver the US. Just don't honk at anyone in traffic when you come back.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

You might be surprised to hear that I’ve never had any issue with road rage despite living in America for almost all of my life. And no, I wasn’t going out and honking at anyone either (as I can accept that honking at people is a stupid idea). On the flip side, the road rage I’ve seen in Vancouver would probably shock you.

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Mean__MrMustard@reddit

Only Americans complain about traffic or road rage. As an European, traffic and the ignoring of 95% of the rules is usually way worse in most European states, even the boring ones.

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Lillemor_hei@reddit

You obviously haven’t been to Scandinavia.

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Mean__MrMustard@reddit

I said most and not all. And the few Scandinavian countries are probably the only ones which are more relaxed than the US. Although you can easily have some road rage in Stockholm or Helsinki (not Scandinavia, I know) as well.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Here is another bot. They're pretty easy to spot after a while. They'll try and corner people into these emotional stories which of course are terrible, but most Americans are not actual victims of gun violence. That is an incredibly rare situation

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missjoy91@reddit

Experiencing gun violence is incredibly emotional and traumatizing. Of course people who have been through it are going to feel strongly about others who dismiss it as just “rare “ and hand waive it away.

It’s most Americans won’t experience gun violence. But the rate of Americans that do, relative to other developed countries, is exceptionally high. This is a negative thing for most people. Being in America statistically increases your likelihood of experiencing gun violence. It’s a fact.

If you like America that’s fine but pretending people are bots for acknowledging this and being sensitive about a very horrific and emotional experience just makes you look cruel and obstinate

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

After living in Los Angeles and the SF Bay Area for 20 years I never once experienced road rage despite being a frequent driver. In fact it wasn't until I moved to Australia that I experienced two very aggressive road rage incidents from methheads in Sydney.

So, this is why generalizations are pointless. Everyone is living a different life.

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Capable_Fly_4692@reddit

Is there a separate score board for witnessed incidents?

Anyhow, I should've specified. HOUSTON is awful with road rage.

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

Yep and LA and SF are right behind it. My point stands.

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FlyFishingRealtor@reddit

I think no matter where you go, it’s about connecting with people. If you play pickleball, join a league, if you like to fish, find a fly tying group etc. I want to move to Vancouver from Utah but have made so many good friend here, it will be a challenge to start over and I’ll miss them.

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ScatterTheReeds@reddit

coworkers at work was telling me about how I’m a fool to leave because I’m surely going to get shot and killed if I move back home to the states.

You’ve been in Canada for 5 years. You must watch Canadian news stations. There’s lots of violence in Canada, too.

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Conscious-Tutor3861@reddit

The homicide rate in the United States is 300% higher than it is in Canada:

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/75-006-x/2025001/article/00011-eng.htm

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ScatterTheReeds@reddit

That’s racist of you to point out the demographic.

It’s not my point, anyway. My point is that there’s crime in Canada. There’s zero crime in my America town.

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/violent-crime-hate-crimes-and-thefts-remain-high-in-canada-finds-think-tanks-justice-report-card

https://www.reddit.com/r/canada/comments/1ow8sko/the_numbers_dont_lie_violent_crime_has_surged/

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Bomboclaat_Babylon@reddit

I don't think this has anything to do with expats. This has everything to do with the world hating America. If you were in Germany or the UK or Singapore or Thailand, you would get the same comments. People really don't like America right now. No one says stuff like that when an American that was living in Belgium says they want to try something new and move to Spain. It's about moving back to America.

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CuriosTiger@reddit

Here's the thing: No matter how you live your life, there will be people who disapprove. You can't please everyone, and it's insane to try.

Your coworker's a dick. Even if he/she were right about that statement as a matter of fact, it's a dickish thing to say. Don't take their attitude problem and make it yours.

You sound like you've given this a lot of thought and come to the conclusion that moving back is the right decision for you. So do that. Or perhaps trying your luck somewhere else. Then do that. The people who disapprove will disappear out of your life soon enough, and here's the thing: It's not everybody. There's no united world council that has decreed that thou shalt live in Canada.

Do what's right for you. Absolutely, take friends and family into account. People who have earned your respect. People who are willing to listen, debate pros and cons with you like an adult, and, ultimately, respect your decision. Because it's your life, and the decision on how to live it ultimately belongs to you and you alone.

Life is too short to worry about what the jerks think.

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ponpiriri@reddit

I moved back to the US a couple of weeks ago from France. I've mostly come across attitudes like this on reddit and FB expat groups. The majority of the people I knew irl were happy for me and some wish they hadn't married (divorced) with kids because they're stuck.

Log off and switch up the people you deal with. I met some people like your coworker when I initially moved to France and cut them off quickly. Doom and gloomers will try to hold you back from moving forward because they're afraid of potentially being wrong. Leave them where they're at.

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mp85747@reddit

I live pretty much like a hermit at this point, but whenever I deal with people, I face a different level of insanity. There are 2 groups here:

1) hasn't ever visited, has absolutely no clue about the US and hates it
2) hasn't ever visited, has absolutely no clue about the US and loves it.

For context, I'm talking about my "home"country and I've spent 25 years of my life in the US - 1995-2020.

They all know life in the US better than I do and explain it to me! Both sides' totally unrealistic BS drives me up the wall! Arguing with them is useless and not worth it. I don't start any conversations about the US and if somebody else does, I give some brief, non-committal answer and change the topic.

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isthisreallife080@reddit

Can we just clarify that political differences in the US are not about a simple difference in opinion?

I live in Europe now and can cordially disagree with people on where my tax dollars go and how the government should respond to various domestic and global challenges. Extremists exist, but most people are not extremists.

The US is different, and much of what it does has a global impact. One side advocates for basic human rights. The other follows a war mongering demagogue who actively seeks to destabilize the global economy, decimate entire populations, roll back progress on climate change, and erode domestic human rights. People see a desire to return to the US as an endorsement of the latter, and I can understand where the hostility comes from.

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ponpiriri@reddit

We can clarify that this is your opinion.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

That’s really constructive advice, and I appreciate you sharing your (very real) experience. Some people just are unpleasant to be around, and there’s no remedy for that other than cutting them off.

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ponpiriri@reddit

I actually don't like cutting people off because variety is the spice of life, but some people can't keep their anger and misery to themselves. So you kinda have to move on, unfortunately.

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Bytowner1@reddit

Canadians (justifiably) don't feel very charitable towards the US right now, and low level anti-Americanism that's always present (no different than what you'll find in any smaller country next to a larger neighbour) is in hyper drive. The desire to leave Canada for perceived greener pastures in the Great Satan will be seen as a personal slight by self-conscious Canadians who are routinely insulted and belittled by their erstwhile partners and friends. Has nothing to do with how people feel about expats.

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UnknownPleasures3@reddit

It's not just Canada.

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Top-Half7224@reddit

Maybe its not Canada, maybe its just Vancouver? Moving to a bigger city or just to a different state within the US can give you the same feeling. Many years ago when I moved from NYC to Oregon, people said sort of the same thing. I literally had a guy say "You're throwing your life away". Spoiler; I wasn't, allthough it wasn't for me long term I learned a great deal about myself and life in the time I lived there and dont regret the experience.

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Charming-Vehicle-304@reddit

I feel like there is more stigma towards America and Americans in general rather than towards expats in general wanting to move back to their home countries.

The USA is loud and the drama is very visible to the rest of the world so people are likely to be more opinionated than if you were talking about returning to some other country.

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Early_Switch1222@reddit

honestly the people giving you grief about this are projecting their own stuff onto your decision. ive been an expat for years now (greek, living in the netherlands) and ive had moments where i seriously considered going back to greece. and every time i even mentioned it to other expats they acted like i was betraying the whole concept of living abroad.

the thing nobody talks about in expat communities is that sometimes a place just doesnt fit and thats not a failure. you gave it 5 years. thats not "giving up," thats giving it a genuine shot and making an informed decision based on actual lived experience. people who have never lived abroad for more than a vacation dont get to have opinions on this tbh.

i think the stigma comes from this weird identity thing where being an expat becomes your whole personality and then if someone leaves its like they're threatening that identity. but your life isnt a statement. you dont owe anyone a justification for where you choose to live.

for what its worth, alot of the happiest expats ive met are the ones who tried multiple countries before finding the right one. not everyone gets it right on the first attempt and thats completely fine.

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missmadime@reddit

I LOVED living in Vancouver. I lived over by Granville/Davie St and worked in the DTES area and had such an amazing tight knit community and a huge social circle there, in a way that I didn't even have when home in the US. Even though I haven't been there since 2019, Vancouver and Hastings St will always have a part of my heart.

That being said, I think that sense of "open community" is somewhat unique to the DTES area? I very much struggled in making non-DTES friends/contacts. Beyond that downtrodden underbelly, Vancouver seemed to be a very isolating place and full of...idk, very busy "young professional" judgemental yuppie types? Very briefly I had a job elsewhere downtown and didn't fit in at all with my coworkers/culture and felt that same loneliness you probably do, so I quickly went back to working near Hastings.

Overall though, unless you are MISERABLE, I think the loneliness felt in Canada is still preferable over the economic/political/cultural/etc uncertainty America is dealing with right now.

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DonnPT@reddit

Wow, surprised at the hostility. I'm in Portugal, and I'm used to some hostile reddit - from the other direction, wanting expats to go away - but not this bad. Maybe some people should be thinking about what's really eating them.

People are different, from each other maybe different from their earlier selves too. I haven't been back to the US and don't have any particular plan to go, but I know I will always be more at home there in many ways. So I'm just doing without that, but I sure wouldn't expect everyone to. It probably makes a difference that I'm here because I wanted to be here, not because I was running away from the US. Refugees have it worse in this respect.

I'm from the Pacific NW, and the social climate you describe sounds like something you might find there too.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thanks for sharing this! I appreciate you understanding where I’m coming from and sharing your story. I’m glad I’m not alone.

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DonnPT@reddit

Not at all. I don't have statistics, but it's my impression that people who leave for various European countries, commonly return in no more than 2 or 3 years, I would guess often at considerable financial cost. Of course language plays a big part in that, and people often have unrealistic ideas about learning the language, but it isn't just that alone.

Not to minimize the precarious situation the country is in right now, but I'm optimistic, if that's the right word, that there will be some correction rather than real collapse, and life will go on for the vast majority. The things we read about in the news, are not generally the things that really impact us so much. Probably if you want to reckon the direct impact on you, the Canada-US comparisons to look at would be statistics on things like obesity.

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PoemNo2510@reddit

So first if you plan to immigrate to another country stop calling yourself an expat. Westerners want to be fancier but I can assure you that calling yourself an expat after marrying, a house, etc it is called immigration.

On the hostility towards American immigrants it is growing due to the action of your own government. Your government is anti immigration, why do you expect special treatment?

And no, “he is not my president”’is not cutting it TWICE. The whole country has to be left accountable with the amount of destruction it is bringing to the world.

People dislike you for a reason, ask yourself why,

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Yet-Another-Persona@reddit

Oh get off it.

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PoemNo2510@reddit

you are right. I will leave this then. You guys have created your own language in your bubble. Enjoy.

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lm913@reddit

Expat myself in Europe. Honestly I don't care if someone expresses this kind of thing, I get it. At the end of the day I'm doing me so who cares?

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GingerBuffalo@reddit

The things you've said you haven't liked about living in Vancouver, can be found in many parts of the US. I spent a year in New Mexico, before leaving for the UK. New Mexico is stunningly beautiful. The people are generally very friendly and have a unique perspective, the food was amazing, but I found myself feeling pretty soon there's no way I could spend the rest of my life there largely because of how isolating it felt. It's a massive state with a pretty small population, the biggest city is Albuquerque, which is tiny by most standards.

Where I've moved to in the UK is far enough outside of London that I can find nature and as much isolation as I want, yet I can get into London on under an hour if I want to connect back in again. I've got friends here. I'm comfortable with the balance of weather. This is my sweet spot.

I think relocating is about finding your ideal sweet spot. It's a mix of culture, weather conditions, exposure to people, solitude when you need it, every person has their own sweet spot of these things. I don't think it has to be about which side of a border you find that in.

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fat-wombat@reddit

There’s no stigma around not wanting to be an expat. It’s about the US.

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gandolfthe@reddit

As a Canadian, gtfo Yankee

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

And it's hostility like this online that people think is acceptable in real life that's going to get them fucked up real bad

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

And here we have a clear example of the reason why I am packing it in (if anyone wondered why I would think this).

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Ashamed-Childhood-46@reddit

Jeez. I thought Canadians were equally as committed to “being nice” as they are “thankfully not American.”

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thin_wild_duke@reddit

Hon, you may not have noticed from the Orange Turd side of the divide, but the two countries are at war.

It's a cold war, but it's war.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Hey, smart Guy. The orange turd is an all-americans. Literally half the country didn't vote for him.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

And when there’s a war, I go back to my side.

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Strict-Joke236@reddit

I live in a nice neighborhood in a US city. There have been two shootings within .1 miles of my place since Sunday. YMMV once you return.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

I lived in Chicago for almost a decade I never even saw gun violence. I lived in Texas where they love guns, and never saw gun violence. Of course it happens but most people will never be an actual victim of it like Reddit activists want you to think.

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pjeffer1797@reddit

Ok but that’s obviously an exception. I live in a middle class neighborhood and there hasn’t been a shooting in decades.

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FreddyNoodles@reddit

Like most of the entire country.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I’ll take the risk. Sure, I could stay put where I am, but what kind of life is that if you aren’t even really happy?

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fuzzyrach@reddit

Be sure. Because moving out of the US again isn't guaranteed. When I left Switzerland in 2007 (I had never planned to stay, it was more of a fun adventure) I wanted to come back to the US and start my own business. I did and so many other things.

But I've been wanting to move abroad again and I can't find any path to do so at this point in my life. :/ it breaks my heart but I don't know I would have chosen to do things differently.

At this point I'm not in my adventurous, take risks stage of life. Things need to be a bit more certain. Is there any way to get citizenship before you leave, if you change your mind later? It's always good to have options.

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Duke_Newcombe@reddit

May I ask, aside from moving away, what things have you done to help yourself with your depression? Any counseling? Visit the doctor to see if there's a chemical or physical reason for the way you're feeling? How convinced are you that moving back to the states will cure your depression? Are you sure it hasn't been there always?

Important questions for you to ask, otherwise, you're merely running to another place hoping for resolution to your depression.

"There" is no better than "here". When your "there" becomes a "here", the risk is you'll merely find yet another place over "there" that once again appears to be better than "here".

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I don’t know, this feels a little bit like blaming if you ask me. I’m not chemically depressed, nor do I really need any other type of “help.” I do go to a therapist weekly, so I think that my bases are covered.

I can’t fix the fact that people where I live are not receptive to wanting to make friends. It’s a very common thing you can read about on the internet. There are a lot of people in my shoes who have had a hard time (so I know I’m not alone). I just don’t feel compelled to keep living like this forever when I know it’s not that bad at home. And for the record, I do travel back pretty often and my interactions at home are always a lot better. For that reason, I just feel like it’s the right move for me at this time.

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ledger_man@reddit

5 years is a good chunk of time to give it a go - though I’m curious how often you’ve gone home during that time? I’m an American living abroad and have found the changes to be quite shocking. I’ve also been changed enough by this experience that while I’ll never really be a native where I am now, I’ll also never really feel like I belong back home again either.

All that said, most people without a powerful personal, economic, or safety motivation to stay abroad do end up back home, especially if they are close to their family of origin. It’s a very personal decision and while macro conditions play a role, they’re not always and shouldn’t always be the most important thing.

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

Leave then.

Bye.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I’m already in the application process to find a new job. Wish me luck!

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

Nah.

Just leave.

Cya.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

So you wont even wish me luck on my job search so I can get out of your hair?

Let me guess, you’re Canadian? I can tell almost instantly!

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

I don’t live in Canada. I live in the US. But I am Canadian and proud of it.

Unlike you, I’ve succeeded in my new country. To be fair, I hate it here in the US (despite making millions of dollars and retiring in my 30’s)

You’re a whiny bitch.

I don’t give a fuck if you do well or don’t at your new job.

Bless your heart.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I meet tons of people just like you. This is exactly the reason why I’m leaving. See you in California though!

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

No you won’t.

You won’t be hanging out in Manhattan Beach.

You failed in a country that is super welcoming and open to new people, Canada.

I succeeded in a backwards and bigoted country, the US.

We aren’t the same. You and I won’t ever cross paths.

Nice pipe dream, though.

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Big-Basis3246@reddit

Cool it with the self aggrandizing

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

lol okay then. All this post does is prove my exact point. Something wasn’t working out for you, so you decided to change it, and it paid off. That’s exactly what I intend to do. Have a nice life!

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

Nope.

Things work great for me. I did great in Canada. Have done great in the US.

I do great in Europe where I also am a citizen.

I do great everywhere. You’re the problem.

Bye/Au Revoir.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

This is one of the funniest things I’ve read all day. Top tier trolling so I tip my hat to you.

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Rasputin171@reddit

You leaving is good news. Make it speedy.

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Californian-Cdn@reddit

I succeeded in your country to a level you never will.

You couldn’t hack it in mine.

You’re a failure. You don’t matter.

Nobody cares about you.

Cya pez.

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anewleaf1234@reddit

I am an America living in Canada.

When I go back to America things seem harsh. People are a lot closer to the edge.

If you want to go back. Go for it.

I wouldn't.

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Sufficient-Job7098@reddit

Immigration is not for everyone. No matter how bad situation is in home country ( poverty, war, dictatorship) most people will choose stay put instead of becoming immigrants.

When I was deciding to move abroad I could understand skepticism of my family and friends who could not imagine that the benefits of immigration will be enough to justify negatives of living as an immigrant. They were correct to be skeptical. Their skepticism helped me not to move abroad with overly rosy expectations.

I have been living abroad for over two decades but I knew that there was possibility of me having to return So far I have no plans to return home but when any immigrant wannabe plans immigration I automatically assume that almost no one can say for sure: “I will never return”. Yet when I suggest them to have contingency plans they may are sure they are uniquely well informed so they will not be changing minds and returning.

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EhDeeHD@reddit

Being an immigrant is tough. No matter where you leave and where you go. If it's not for you it's not for you.

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lelileea@reddit

I feel it's perfectly understandable to want to return to somewhere familiar

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ElijahSavos@reddit

Why you even posted this then?

You made your mind. Go live your life whatever you feel like. You don’t need positive affirmations by some strangers.

Having said that, Canada is not monolith but just a bunch of individuals. I’m an immigrant from Russia to Vancouver. I was able to make tons of good friends including locally born. You should always find your flock. Heck there are thousands of Americans living in Metro Van if you want to stick specifically to them.

Anyways, good luck!

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Positive_Hall_3207@reddit

I think living as an expat is not for everyone. It is not as easy as people portray it at times. It takes years sometimes to get accustomed to a life abroad and I know people who left and some whom stayed because of their children, partner or couldn’t afford to move for example. It is not talked about in a frank manner , it is downplayed as a way to protect from the responses of other people, positive or not . This is not my life , not my decision , I don’t judge . I also don’t expect others to understand or validate my personal decision . Emotions can get in a way of making decisions and vice versa . I hope you find solace in returning to the US and I hope you find what you are looking for that fits. I have been an expat for half my life and this feeling of quite not fitting still exists at times. I embrace it. Both Europeans and Americans think I am an hybrid. Life can be so complicated and difficult at times as an expat/ immigrant I don’t add more emotional pressure on myself. So take care of yourself emotionally and mentally. Be well.

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Party_Nothing_7605@reddit

If you know deep down in your bones that this move is right for you, no need to listen to people who try to steer you away from that path because they don’t know you and your circumstances as well as you do. It can be good to question ourselves but gut feeling and intuition is also valuable. You know this is the right step. I hope things improve for you back home!

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oshunbleu87@reddit

I lived out of the country for 6 years and it was time to come home to Colorado. Everyone said “Are you crazy?!?” “Everything is so bad in the states!!” Well I’m here and everyone is super friendly and I’m in a safe area. I mean some things are very expensive like beef. I drive an EV so gas isn’t an issue. I’m glad to be home. 🏡. I wish you the best 💙

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Redfive88888@reddit

It took many years and a lot of hard works for me to immigrate to US. Achieving the American dream for many immigrants is so under discussed. I have never imaged the wonderful life and career that I have experienced in this new home country. Considering the only support from my family was $1000 plus an one-way flight ticket when I came to US alone, this country has given me so much since. I have received the first class education on the scholarship, found a loving husband, developed a professional career and enjoyed community activities in a picturesque town. Now, I see my kids starting to launch their dreams. This is like a wild dream I don't want to wake up. If you have a drive, follow your heart.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thank you! This post was never meant to be hateful or bitter. I just want to do what you described and follow my heart and passion.

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bsg_80@reddit

Someone on this thread said you’re a woman. So, I would ask myself 1) what will I do if my right to cote gets repealed 2) what will I do if I need an abortion but there’s a federal ban 3) how will I protect myself once #1 & #2 happen and violence against women increases exponentially because all of those who barely hid their hate are now feeling like they can do anything to women because, who cares??! The government doesn’t.

That said, being homesick is real. But tbh, those things I mentioned are just the tip of the iceberg. Real structural demolition is occurring. Not sure when was the last time you went back for a visit, but I’d definitely scope it out before making your decision. It may still be to go back, but I’d mae that decision with my eyes wide open.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Well I’m a man, so that example doesn’t apply completely. I understand that women do not have it easy and I’m fortunate enough not to worry about those issues.

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bsg_80@reddit

Welp, you’re also white I’m guessing? If so, you’re right to assume not too much is going to affect you. And this whole thread makes a lot more sense now.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I feel like this is meant as a personal insult about me being a straight white man. Sure, I have privilege. If I want to live in the place where I grew up, I should be allowed to do so without judgement. This is what this entire thread is about.

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

Get a therapist if you want a non-judgmental space and unconditional positive regard.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Never said I wanted that. I just want people who desire to go home to feel like they can do so. The replies I’ve gotten here illustrate my entire point. Say you desire something else and you get attacked.

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bsg_80@reddit

It was an observation of fact. But again, based on your response it tells me you started this thread so you could argue with people. Thats what this entire thread is about. Yes, your privilege is showing. Doesn’t mean it’s not a fact. Go back. Have fun. No one cares.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Alright I intend to do exactly that!

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iminthemoodforlug@reddit

Ding ding ding.

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AmbivalentSamaritan@reddit

Good luck. No sarcasm, I’m absolutely sincere. I love Vancouver, but there are places where I don’t fit and don’t want to live, so I get it. I hope you find your place.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thanks for putting a positive spin on your comment. I appreciate that Vancouver is a nice city. It’s just not my thing and I’m going to have to try something else out. To each their own in this life and I can totally respect that other people feel differently!

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TakKobe79@reddit

Do what makes you happy.

That said, moving from the USA to Vancouver CA isn’t much of a jump….if you want a vibe like that but want more guns and less healthcare must move to the PNW.

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Unhappy_Performer538@reddit

I think it’s more about how America’s an aggressor right now and Canada is not rather than judgment for not wanting to be an expat anymore

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Well politics aside, I can’t listen to this stuff anymore. If their goal was to try and make me leave, congratulations, it worked extremely well.

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Most Americans have never experienced gun violence. However it's very hard to tell people who watch the media and on reddit that. I'm glad you aren't listening to the extreme opinions that are frankly misinformed about life in America. However, I need to be careful because I know especially on this website you're not allowed to say anything positive about America.

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

I totally acknowledge that America has issues, but I feel like I’d rather try to work around those issues and at least live where I’m happier and closer to my family. I’m not saying it’s the “wise” decision, but it’s the right decision for me.

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Gunzhard22@reddit

I plan to leave, but I will certainly miss the New England charm, cities, towns and nature.

But especially if you don't have kids go for it.

I don't think the warnings are wrong. The current dismantling of education and social support systems won't necessarily affect the more privileged folks initially, but historically, both nationally and globally, reducing those things only increases crime and disimfranchisement, which makes the place more dangerous for everyone. But you gotta follow your heart if not your head.

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nah-nah-nanaha@reddit

In that case, I say go for it. I don't love my current location either but I was home not too long ago and the violent vibe just isn't for me. I'll stay here for now. Life is short. Do what's good for you and ignore our opinions. Good luck!

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RadioDude1995@reddit (OP)

Thanks for the positivity! I totally agree. Life is short and I’m not going to live somewhere that I don’t like just because it makes sense on paper.

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Gunzhard22@reddit

Well to put into perspective, there are more DAILY cases of gun violence in the US, than there has been voter fraud cases over the last 25 years, and guess which one our government is focused on?

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Beneficial-Koala-670@reddit

Ok, so I'm right?

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Gunzhard22@reddit

Nobody can help getting home sick. I think in case of the US, so much has changed so fast, and all for the worst. The things you remembered and cherished might be very different now. If you have a lot of money and/or you are white, a lot of the issues here may not affect you right away anyway.