Why are people's opinions so divided on buying organic food?

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Mr-Incy@reddit

For most people who don't/won't buy organic it is typically because it is more expensive,.

For those who only buy organic chose to do so because they believe it is healthier, which it is for a lot of things.

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OddlyDown@reddit

It’s not just because it’s healthier - it’s also much better for the environment.

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Most off the time organic food has a lot lower yield, so more land is needed to grow enough to make it more affordable.
With that, it means the process to get the food out of the ground, for example, can increase greenhouse gasses per kg of food.
It can also lead to am increase on how often the soil is disturbed to get rid of weeds, or a greater area of disturbed soil, which leads to more stored carbon from the soil being released into the air and soil erosion.
Some natural pesticides can be more harmful.

Then you start including organically reared animals, typically more land needed, more feed per animal and less yield from the animals.

Also, organic produce still uses traditional methods to ship it to where it needs to go.

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Lopsided_Snower@reddit

are the chemicals related to non-organic veg growing not much worse for the environment than anything you mention here?

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Mr-Incy@reddit

It would depend on where the food is grown, every country has its own regulations.

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National-Raspberry32@reddit

But generally biodiversity and soil health is improved with organic farming. And as technology improves, carbon emissions from the processing will reduce.

In the US huge numbers of bees get shipped around the country to pollinate fruit because insect numbers have been so wiped out.

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DameKumquat@reddit

It isn't healthier, assuming you're comparing with other UK/EU produce where there's strict limits on pesticide residues. That's a huge change since the start of the organic movement - there's now only about 1% the amount of residues on say strawberries that there were in the 1970s.

Essentially pressure from the organic movement has talked themselves out of business. Which is a good thing! Pesticide run-off now has way stricter regs, chemicals are applied much more precisely for short times, etc. And mainstream farming has stopped using some chemicals that organic still permits as exceptions - copper sulphate for example.

The organic standards do set stricter animal welfare standards and tend to choose slower-growing breeds, so meat will be tastier and generally more nutrients per gram for that reason, but repeated studies show no difference in nutrients between comparable organic and non-organic produce or other products.

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Tim-Sanchez@reddit

Not necessarily, organic food generally takes more land and produces more emissions.

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PurpleOctopus6789@reddit

not even healthier, it actually tastes better. The gap between how organic vs non-organic taste seems to only be growing

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Mr-Incy@reddit

Usually because it is slower to grow, vegetables and fruit aren't grown in controlled environments to speed up the process and animals aren't fed certain feeds that can contain growth hormones to speed things up.
Obviously there is a bit more to it than that, but I am not typing everything out when people can easily use google to find out the answers.

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Difficult_Bad1064@reddit

The marketing mechanism of organic food is to suggest that there is something wrong with the food that everyone else eats.

I won't reward pseudoscience.

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RevenantSith@reddit

The price.

There is currently a cost of living crisis.

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Rexel450@reddit

The price and downright snobbery

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Fragrant-Attorney-73@reddit

I work in crop production and sometimes get asked about organic - my usual reply is “nice idea, won’t feed the world though”.

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Nirnroot_Enjoyer@reddit

Am I correct in thinking organic crops are more susceptible to failed seasons? Ie it can be quite more risky for the farmer, if conditions aren't ideal?

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Fragrant-Attorney-73@reddit

Yes - failed seasons, much lower yields, lower quality (in terms of uniformity and cosmetics).

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Nirnroot_Enjoyer@reddit

Admittedly most of my knowledge of farming has come from Clarksons Farm.. But I've noticed over the past few years how my local farms would rotate the types of crops, presumably to improve soil health etc. as well as the seemingly worsening weather conditions we're having year after year...it's interesting stuff.

The economics student in me however, feels like the best we can do is focus efforts towards whatever's most reliabe.. and export as much as possible, in an attempt to offset our inevitable imported produce?

I'm sure it's not that simple

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himit@reddit

MIL grew up on a farm and she says you can't really guarantee anything's 100% organic because of the residue/run-off from the farm next door, so she views it as an expensive scam

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N-F-F-C@reddit

Are her family involved in non organic produce by any chance?

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himit@reddit

It's a rice farm in Taiwan - I've never asked about the organic side but given her attitude, I imagine it's non-organic 😂

there's a few farms in the area that are organic but it's all small-scale family-run farms afaik

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Nirnroot_Enjoyer@reddit

Mostly due to cost.

I'm not entirely convinced organic Is better in every scenario, but I'll prioritise meat/animal products, where I can.

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ZBD1949@reddit

I'll believe in organic carrots when someone can show me an inorganic carrot

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Mr_Coastliner@reddit

Organic can often be more expensive and in some cases, a lot more expensive than it needs to be. Lots of non-organic food in the UK is perfectly fine to eat as we have quite strict regulations anyway. Something like a carrot would be such a minimal difference.

You do also get a lot of small producers (not as much at a supermarket), whereby their produce is actually organic, but they haven't paid to get it certified.

When it comes to meat is where it can get tricky. Things like 'grass fed', 'free range', 'pasture raised'. Can't take any at face value so if you're going to pay more on those, you have to look in to the specific brand and their definition of it.

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PurpleOctopus6789@reddit

there's a lot of difference in taste though. Organic vs non-organic carrot tastes a lot different. Getting carrots from your local farmers market is best as those are full of flavours. But non-organic carrots are significantly worse than organic ones.

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National-Raspberry32@reddit

Homegrown are the best, so much more flavour it’s actually crazy.

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Mr_Coastliner@reddit

Think it just depends on preference. I've eaten non-organic vs non-organic carrots from different brands and one was significantly better. BBC did a little test on this once (non-scientific) and found the majority of people preferred the non-organic carrot taste wise. Either way, if you prefer the organic one, then there's no need to change :)

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PurpleOctopus6789@reddit

a lot of people have preferences based on what they are used to. Once they change it for something different or not eat it for a while, they are more objective when it comes to taste.

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becooldocrime@reddit

Once I started getting bunched organic carrots, there was no going back for me. I would also rather have no cucumber than non-organic cucumber.

Onions seem to take a consistent hit in quality with the organic version. I mix up my food shop between Sainsbury’s, Waitrose, M&S and Tesco and have been consistently disappointed.

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Not_Wrong_Tho@reddit

Some people refuse to buy 'non-organic' because they think 'organic' means 'better'.

Some people refuse to pay the premium associated with 'organic' produce.

Pretty simple really, isn't it?

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Atompunk78@reddit

Because it’s a nuanced topic

Organic food tends to be higher quality, but:

It’s not necessarily higher quality

It’s often worse for the environment

It’s generally like double the price

This nuance causes a divide in opinion, especially for some who don’t appreciate the other side of the nuance

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RagingFuckNuggets@reddit

The price, I've started sneaking organic broccoli into my shop recently. Used to order 1/2 a week and would waste quite a bit, but now I order 1 organic. It lasts longer and it does taste so much better.

I steamed some the other night and my husband asked what I did differently with the broccoli. Literally nothing, always just steam veg. You can taste the difference in the organic as opposed to the non-organic.

I'm going to try make subtle changes like that when budget allows.

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becooldocrime@reddit

Carrots, celery, tomatoes, and cucumbers are the ones which have the biggest flavour boost when going organic, for me. I rarely have broccoli but I do like it, I’ll pop it on my list for this week’s shop!

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Jimmy90081@reddit

For most of human history, all we had was organic. The average lifespan was like, what, 35? Then we developed ultra processed foods and can now like until 100. People, organic is bad for you /s

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ceffyl_gwyn@reddit

Organic is pricier and more carbon-intensive.

There's basically no evidence with fruit and veg that it's any better for you.

I wouldn't cut off my nose to spite my face, but for the most part with organic your paying for some placebo effect so I avoid it usually.

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ClarifyingMe@reddit

"Organic" is mostly a marketing ploy.

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Great_Cucumber2924@reddit

Studies have consistently found lower pesticide residue levels on organic food compared to non-organic.

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ceffyl_gwyn@reddit

Well yes, that's obviously the case given the limited use of pesticides on organic food itself (though the same farm may still be using on neighbouring fields).

What there's basically no evidence for is that that has any impact at all on human health.

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YetAnotherMia@reddit

You need non hybrid seeds and lots of chicken poop then you can grow the most delicious vegetables at home.

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Level_Confection_926@reddit

Well, as someone who buys organic produce, I’m not dogmatic and will buy conventional produce as well, especially if it is grown more locally and looks fresher.

There is a lack of research as to the impact of consuming low levels of certain artificial pesticides over a period of years or decades. It is in one sense an experiment on human beings. It is known that some pesticides, herbicides and fungicides can be carcinogenic, which is why some of the most toxic have been largely phased out. There is a lack of research for instance on the impact of low level pesticides, consumed frequently over many years, on the oral and gut microbiomes. We all know about the current litigation regarding Roundup.

The safest option is to favour systems of agriculture that, though not perfect, reduce levels of pesticide residues on food and are better for biodiversity and soil health and biomes. That should be the basis of sustainable, healthy agriculture.

Yes, people can become very dogmatic and purist about organic food and lose perspective on the bigger picture that involves our microbiomes, soil health and biodiversity.

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boycott_all_rats@reddit

For everyone stuck with good intentions if possible grow something yourself this year.

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PurpleOctopus6789@reddit

even if you live in a flat, you can still grow some stuff. I love spring onion but the little butt ends we get in shops can hardly be considered spring onion. But it's enough only to buy one or two and if you add some water, you are likely to have infinite supply of spring onion as it just keeps on growing back.

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PurpleOctopus6789@reddit

Frankly, from what i found, what's labelled as organic these days are fruits and veg that should be the average quality. The issue is that organic means you get actual taste and flavour and if you go for the non-organic stuff, you will often have lower quality produce that tastes of nothing. Just try cucumbers or bananas. The difference is huge. But 2-3 years ago the difference wasn't as noticeable. Sometime in the last year, non-organic bananas started to taste really bad.

Many people will not want to overpay assuming it's all the same or not being able to afford but, from what I've notice, the generic stuff keeps on getting worse while all the produce with actual taste gets labels as organic and have higher price.

I pretty much buy organic only because of the flavour benefit and try to avoid non-organic simply because it often taste of nothing and is a waste of money. But I am also more likely to go to greengrocers and buy stuff that's not packed in plastic.

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Creative-Solution@reddit

I've heard that it's more expensive, not any healthier, and still bad for the planet due to the pest control stuff they use (even if it's not as much or different types compared to non organic food)

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BeaksFalcone@reddit

I didn't understand the difference until last week,organic is grown in animal manure byproducts,normal stuff comes from human waste byproducts...unsure which is best really

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Banes_Addiction@reddit

There's some health bullshit about organic food. It's also significantly more expensive. Some people have a visceral reaction to the implicit or explicit suggestion that by not buying organic food you're endangering your family or whatever, when you're not.

Personally, organic means nothing to me directly, but I sometimes just buy organic products because with that extra price buffer (and increased checking of sourcing), you can wind up with a higher quality product.

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FornyHucker22@reddit

I guess it’s like bio and non bio. I don’t know the difference between those either

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OddlyDown@reddit

Bio has enzymes. It will destroy silk and wool. It also won’t work if your wash goes hotter than about 45 degrees.

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FornyHucker22@reddit

ahh cool, dont think it matters for me then 😄

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mining-ting@reddit

One makes me skin itch

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evb666@reddit

I was never fussed about buying organic for myself but now I have a one year old, everything is organic for him. The difference may be minimal but I would rather err on the side of caution. I know I am incredibly privileged to be able to have this option in the first place, I think for a lot of people it comes down to price

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Personal-Listen-4941@reddit

It’s like “natural flavouring” what counts as natural/organic compared to chemical is often really pedantic and sometimes less healthy/chemically anyway.

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boycott_all_rats@reddit

Price vs quality. I think the best I can muster is cage free eggs.

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GetCapeFly@reddit

There has been research stating there are “no benefits to organic food” however these are typically referring to micro- and macro-nutrients I.e the Vitamin C in broccoli is the same whether it’s organic or not. This has become a common impression that organic is no better for you. However, what people seem to forget is although nutritionally it’s the same, the pesticide exposure is not.

Some people, those who are more financially secure or more health conscious, will therefore choose organic produce over non-organic.

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StoneColdSedSo@reddit

Organic alternatives weren't a thing when some of us were kids and when they did start first appearing they were expensive and shit. I've had 0 experience with organic alternatives since that initial impression in my childhood so I guess to me they'll always be expensive and shit and I'm just not bothered if that isn't the case

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