Trying to create a PC able to run games at 4k without an NVIDIA GPU
Posted by toemeister0@reddit | buildapc | View on Reddit | 99 comments
I'm trying to stay within $2000 - $2750 and get the best possible without buying and NVIDIA GPU. Please leave any suggestions or comments on what I could improve upon.
Specs:
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 9800X3D 4.7 GHz 8-Core Processor
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler
Motherboard: Asus TUF GAMING B650E-PLUS WIFI ATX AM5 Motherboard
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory
Storage: Western Digital WD_Black SN850X w/Heatsink 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive & Crucial P310 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive
GPU: Gigabyte GAMING OC Radeon RX 9070 XT 16 GB Video Card
Case: Fractal Design Pop XL Air ATX Full Tower Case
PSU: Corsair RM850 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply
dexteritycomponents@reddit
Brand loyalty is dumb. Only buy it if it’s the best you can afford.
toemeister0@reddit (OP)
That was kinda the point of the post. I know that the 5090 is the best card period. But, the prices on all NVIDIA GPUs are just completely outrageous. So I have to go with the 9070XT. I was more posting for the rest of the parts.
greggm2000@reddit
You also won’t get DLSS with an AMD GPU, and next gen, you’ll have access to next-gen DLSS, but the 9070XT won’t get FSR 5. Nvidia does cost more but you are getting something for that money.
Honestly, it’s a terrible time to build, so if you can wait for next-gen and the AI bubble to pop, do. This time next year will hopefully be way better, you’ll get way more performance for your money, and you might even be able to afford a Nvidia GPU. Regardless, even if you go with Zen 6 + RDNA5, you’ll have a system on par or better than the next-gen consoles that’ll cone out next year that will use that same tech.
TheTommyMann@reddit
What if I told you I think games look worse with dlss. Things just look almost camouflaged.
Ill_Difference_4039@reddit
"what if i lied to you" lmao, camouflaged bruh ?
TheTommyMann@reddit
Yeah, it's like adding noise and then running an unsharp mask. I thought Space Marine 2 looked better on performance rather than quality when standing still. I first noticed it when playing the first death stranding and the "smoke" rising from the chimerium(?) on the ground looked less beautiful with dlss on.
I switched to a 9070 this year and have not once been like, I miss dlss.
greggm2000@reddit
You might be using relatively low settings. DLSS (4) Quality gives results that are at least on par with Native, but fps is higher. Sometimes you might choose to run, say, DLSS Performance for a bit worse visuals, but where it bumps up the fps enough to make the game playable. And ofc you have the option to not use upscaling at all, in most games. And also, nothing stops you from running DLSS at full 100% (ie: no upscaling) as a better alternative to TAA, for anti-aliasing.
More to the point, with Nvidia cards, you can use DLSS or FSR. With AMD cards, you only have access to the gen of FSR that's allowed with that card. So, definite advantage to Nvidia cards there for gaming (and that's even ignoring the use of DLSS FG for frame smoothing, which is another potential benefit)
dexteritycomponents@reddit
Please stop spreading unverified information. We as a society need to get way better at not taking every single X post to heart.
greggm2000@reddit
AMD refuses to provide FSR 4 support to older gen cards, when the leak of AMD code demonstrated that FSR 4 works just fine on those older generations, and so therefore AMD's insistence on not releasing it at this point is obviously "artificial market segmentation". So while I agree with you that what I said is unverified, it is also just following the pattern that AMD clearly have shown. Still, what you say is a fair comment, so I'll edit my own comment above. Thanks!
dexteritycomponents@reddit
I think that’s a fair judgement, but it’s also worth mentioning that the FSR 4 version that runs on older GPUs isn’t the same.
It’s marginally worse performance/visually, so IMO it should have been released as an update to FSR 3.
greggm2000@reddit
It's the same, but not as performant. Then again, the same can be said of DLSS 4 on 2000-series and 3000-series Nvidia GPUs. One way I've heard (and I agree with) is to offer the feature but have it bring up a disclaimer when you try and toggle it on.. perhaps labelling it as a beta feature as well. That way, people will see and understand the tradeoffs.
Anyway, I hope the Radeon group at AMD make a different/better choice when RDNA5 arrives.
Ill_Difference_4039@reddit
it's called learning from the past, you don't need an X post or a rumor to think that AMD will give the middle finger to RDNA4 once next gen drops, it's what they do
dexteritycomponents@reddit
Prices on AMD GPUs are outrageous too. It’s a 600$ GPU.
PrettyQuick@reddit
They are better than Nvidia over here. Cheapest 9070 xt is €680, the cheapest 5070 ti is €1000.
Swolm@reddit
9070xt will need some setting turned to medium to get good 4k performance in some games
Ill_Difference_4039@reddit
nothing wrong with this, capable of 4K in most games in native, but in more demanding games fsr 4 quality will also be good enough, you won't get a 100+ fps but that's not really necessary in single player games, check out benchmark videos and see for yourself, also highly capable of raytracing
Swoleus@reddit
I have the same CPU and GPU, and run it daily on 4K 240HZ. Only some of the crazier demanding UE5 games really push it.
I generally use FSR for most of my games, for example lately RE9, PoE2, RE4R, BG3, Crimson Desert, Warframe, and achieve a 120fps lock in all of them upscaling from 1080p or 1440p to 4K.
Be prepared to use Optiscaler to inject FSR4 into pretty much any game, it's 100% worth it and no more difficult than installing a mod.
ExpeditionItchyKnee@reddit
Upscaling from 1080p isn't 4k though is it. It's not even close to 4k. And running that far under native rez is like dlss on performance mode. Blur and artifacts are plentiful.
If we are upscaling from 1080p then my $300 b580 is suddenly a 4k card.
Swoleus@reddit
Used to think this way when I had a 24" 1440p monitor with a 5070ti on Windows, until I upgraded to a 32" 4K OLED and swapped for a 9070 XT for Linux a month ago. Both FSR4 and DLSS4/4.5 performance on 4K is vastly better than quality and native on 1440p (my own experience, and a friend who made the same monitor upgrade).
I can always lock these AAA games to 60fps native in 4K anyway which is how I did the first run of RE9 lol. If you have a 120/240/360HZ monitor, you're also getting perfect frame pacing that way.
Lewdeology@reddit
4k is a premium so unless you’re willing to turn down some settings, Nvidia is usually the recommended option.
roundtwentythree@reddit
6900XT is unbelievably cheap and 4k capable.
Not my listing but just the first result: https://www.ebay.com/itm/236737021098
For $400, you'll find nothing more capable for the money.
beirch@reddit
I wouldn't get RDNA 2 for 4K, personally. You will need to use upscaling for newer AAA games, and FSR 3 is pretty bad. You can get FSR 4 to work with RDNA 2, but not without fairly complicated workarounds, and even then it does not run particularly well.
FSR 4 on RDNA 3 however, works without much of a performance hit, and is much easier to set up.
roundtwentythree@reddit
I have a 6900XT, and it's fine for 4k with reasonable expectations. It's a competent card and for $400 nothing comes remotely close. Obviously if you have the budget you can go 7900xtx, but the 6900XT is a phenomenal value these days.
f1rstx@reddit
3080 is simply much better card
roundtwentythree@reddit
Maybe you didn't read the post where OP explicitly stated they were unwilling to buy any Nvidia GPU.
f1rstx@reddit
Maybe you should reread, be is talking about new.
roundtwentythree@reddit
Brother, nowhere does he specify "new, latest generation only".
f1rstx@reddit
https://old.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/1scv0qc/trying_to_create_a_pc_able_to_run_games_at_4k/oedy1f4/
roundtwentythree@reddit
Nothing in the linked comment says new only either.. not sure what the point of this link even was?
f1rstx@reddit
Lmao
roundtwentythree@reddit
Are you having a stroke? Do you need medical assistance?
f1rstx@reddit
If you cant deduce that OP talking about new gpus since he is considering 9070xt - that’s not my problem, it doesn’t change however how absurdly wrong you’re about “nothing comes close to 6900xt at 400$” lol.
beirch@reddit
Well I got my 7900 XT for $400, but that's definitely an outlier.
roundtwentythree@reddit
Once in a lifetime unicorn deals aren't really the same thing as widely available everyday pricing.
beirch@reddit
Which is why I said it's an outlier.
GuaranteeRoutine7183@reddit
I reccomend getting cheaper ram(6000mts is often overpriced due to shortage compared to better faster kits) on 4k you dont need an 9800x3d a 7800x3d wont have a noticable impact, dont go with 7900xtx or 9070xt neither are a 4k card and 7900xtx cannot use an upscaler(fsr3.1 does not count its dogshit and no, native 4k gaming just does not exist anymore) you could go for a 5070 ti if im correct on price estimation
Independent_Cod_2776@reddit
Looks Solid. If it was me i would go for a 7800x3d instead of the 9800x3d. The latter might be a bit overkill for a 9070XT. It doesnt hurt to have it but there in General, there shouldnt be enough Performance gain overall to legitmiate the extra cost.
lucasduenas@reddit
I would even get the R5 9600x instead and use the extra cash in something else
Independent_Cod_2776@reddit
Not much else he could get though
Sonkinha@reddit
Cocaine and hookers bro.
Responsible_Win9149@reddit
I have one with a 5080. Other than things like msfs, you won't be cpu limited. Or at least I haven't found anything in 4k.
Independent_Cod_2776@reddit
You could get away with even weaker CPUs, especially at 4k. but having a x3d is always nice.
Responsible_Win9149@reddit
I meant a 7800x3d with a 5080 card.
ExpeditionItchyKnee@reddit
If you want to game for 5+ years with high settings and 60 fps+ then you need to commit to 1440p, and that card should be fine for 95% of games.
4k your going to be using upscaling and you kinda need to go Nvidia as much as you don't wanna hear that. Fsr just kinda sucks.
And frame gen can work magic to get you to your monitors refresh rate, 160, 240hz etc , But frame gen just to get to 60fps presents many timing and artifact issues.
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Without nvidia, the 9070xt 16gb is the best for 4k at least until intel releases something similar in performance. Its still technically a mid ranged card so some titles at 4k may need adjusted settings.
Due to the many 9800x3d deaths(effects all 9000 series and some reports on 7000 series chips)on all asrock and asus model motherboards, it's recommended to go msi or gigabyte since they have much lower reported cpu deaths as a precaution. Everything else is solid.
Moon_Devonshire@reddit
9800x3ds have been dying a lot?
OkStrategy685@reddit
Shocking /s
TetePepeF@reddit
if i’m remembering correctly, it’s a problem with power controllers on the boards not doing their jobs very well, leading to dead cpu’s and dead motherboards, but if you already have one and it hasn’t died, i don’t see why it would out of nowhere, so don’t freak out if you do
AntMiserable6610@reddit
There's been many reports of all 9000 series chips(and some 7000) dying but especially 9800x3d and mostly on asrock and asus boards. Still happening on gigabyte and msi boards but at like a 3rd or so less reported than asrock and asus.
Celcius_87@reddit
On Asrock, not ASUS
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Asus is second most reported deaths closely behind asrock. Asrock used to be apart of asus and still use similar board architecture despite separating into different companies. They are both an issue
Moon_Devonshire@reddit
Damn. I have a 9800x3d and a gigabyte board. I'd be devastated if mine died
AntMiserable6610@reddit
At least you have a gigabyte. If the cpu does die, feels more unlucky than from a killer board. Just don't overclock outside of expo just in case and have pbo off.
Moon_Devonshire@reddit
I have a GIGABYTE B650 AORUS Elite AX. Is pbo something that's usually off by default? Because I've definitely not turned anything on in bios before other than ram related stuff and secure boot
encidius@reddit
I have the same mobo running since late 2023 with a 7800x3d. No issues ever. However you can turn on PBO with a negative -10 to -20 curve and get a little extra performance. It effectively undervolts the CPU which results in lower temps and allows it to stay in a boosted clock speed for longer amounts of time. PM me if you want some more info.
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Usually not. Its usually an overclock thing but some boards can (asus and asrock love their overclocking which doesn't help them right now) Gigabyte and msi usually stay simple out of box. If all you've turned on is expo, you should be ok. Can't say 100% since even good chips can die but its less likely it'll die from the board
Moon_Devonshire@reddit
Well it's been running without any issues for about a year so here's hoping
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Once it hits the 1.5-2 year mark, its far more unlikley to die by the board than by general unluckiness unless it dies suddenly after a bios update. If your pc is stable and you dont need to update bios, best not to as future advice. I hope that cpu serves you well for years
ZequineZ@reddit
Supposedly certain motherboards have been shorting them out more frequently
Moon_Devonshire@reddit
Am I ok if I've had mine for months with zero issues?
ZequineZ@reddit
Honestly dunno I’m in the same boat, except mines only been running for a week or two, I only heard about it recently after I got it all built
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Most cpus have reported dying after 6 months, especially around 1 year. Some older ones have even suddenly died after the recent bios update. Asrock and asus boards have the highest reported deaths with gigabyte and msi having far lower reports. Just dont overclock except for expo and keep pbo off as a precaution.
ZequineZ@reddit
Didn’t plan on overclocking anyways thankfully, I’m happy with the base speeds it’s still a huge upgrade form my old build, hopefully no issues going forward, I have as ASRock mobo
AntMiserable6610@reddit
Hopefully you encounter no issues. There are lots of people who have no issues on these boards just the mass reports from those who do is always concerning. Don't leave it idle for too long either. A lot of reports were from people who left their pc idle, it would stutter and/or suddenly shut down when they returned then the dreaded cpu and vram leds would stay on meaning dead cpu.
Kein_Plan16@reddit
Just use a Nvidia, whats wrong with it?
wsteelerfan7@reddit
The issue is that in that price range, he can step down by like $50 to a 5070 that needs upscaling to even match the raw performance of a 9070XT or he can spend $400 more for a 5070 Ti. He didn't mention it in the post, but he said in a comment that he didn't want to blow past his budget on a GPU.
The_Machine80@reddit
Cause we need to stick to context or there is no point people making "Specific" questions. If op wants a specific answer aka no nivida or dont answer. Since OP made it specific, pretty much 7900xtx and 9070xt is there only answer.
SpagettiStains@reddit
*their
The_Machine80@reddit
Blocked. Who gives a shit. There there there there there there
TylerDurdenisreal@reddit
lmao "free thinker" and blocking people on reddit of all places
Hrmerder@reddit
Any pc can depending on what you are playing
alex88nguyen@reddit
9070xt is the only real option, but it’s not going to play everything at 4k without lowering some settings. It’s comparable to a 5070ti.
Pretty_Bar_1206@reddit
I love my 9070XT. I don’t care what it is “compared to.” It is a 4k card and I use it everyday.
IllGene2373@reddit
Ok
TheSasosam@reddit
ok
GodRaaz@reddit
ok
ElectronicRip1630@reddit
ok
FriezaLikesAnal@reddit
It's not the only real option, even the 7900xt is a perfectly fine 4k card and it's still afforable
XtraSqueaky@reddit
Set aside 12-20 years an untold amount of money or scholarships to the top schools, study every facet of computer architecture, electrical engineering, semiconductor physics, low level programming and lastly learn Mandarin then maybe you can work at a company that may produce something that's capable of what you're asking for.
Raunien@reddit
I have a 7800XT and that does 4K just fine. A 9070XT will be more than up to the task. Or, if you're willing to stretch your budget, the 7900XTX is still the fastest AMD GPU on the market.
Wabv_@reddit
7900xtx/9070xt which ever you can find cheaper
BZJGTO@reddit
I'll second this. I do it with a 7900XT, and generally don't have any issues, but a slightly more powerful card like those two would be nice for the more demanding games.
Wabv_@reddit
Yeah, I have a 7900XTX on 4K. Plus, I use it for vr mostly, and no complaints. No need to upgrade to anything else until next gen. And I’m no fanboy. I’ll go to whatever color makes sense price-to-performance-wise.
rickydark@reddit
I gave up on mine for 4K it just didnt quite cut it. Got lucky on availability and pricing with a 5090 when working in the US recently. (UK prices are a joke)
I have no regrets.
Wabv_@reddit
I mean no one would regret going to the best card on the market 😂
CommandShot1398@reddit
There is no such thing, unfortunately.
StrifeTribal@reddit
OP I don't personally game in 4k, but I do believe the 9070 XT would be your best bet.
You might have to sacrifice some Ultra settings for high if you want ray tracing and using FSR to keep it at 60FPS. I think if you do Ultra settings and no ray tracing at 4k, the 9070 XT will blow that away.
dorting@reddit
9070 xt
Mixabuben@reddit
As others said 7900xtx or 9070xt.. i have 7900xtx for 3 years now and playing everything in 4k wothout RT (wouldn’t turn it on even if I had Nvidia gpu) and I love this GPU, bought it for $900. If you want better rt and easier (without optiscaler) access to FSR 4 go for 9080xt
scmitr@reddit
Sure live by your principles if you can enjoy playing at 40fps medium settings without dlss.
biotech997@reddit
7800x3d is cheaper if you want to save some more money, and it’s not that much worse than the 9800x3d. 9070XT has been great at 4K for me, it can max every game with or without upscaling.
ZequineZ@reddit
My 5 year old 8gb 5700xt asus gpu can run ok on my smaller 4k tv, and still runs (albiet with a lot of graphical bs in game but it’s fine for streaming etc.) on my 65 inch 4k tv, same brand.
I have a brand new ASRock 9070XT 16gb that I haven’t tested on the tvs yet as I’ve only had it going for a few sessions but I figure it can handle them a lot better than the old one at the very least, and I assume a 4k monitor would be piece of cake in comparison as it’s smaller.
I personally use the isle as a bit of a point of reference since it runs kinda shit graphically sometimes and it’s what I play a lot of. At 1080p (my monitor) old one struggled with 60fps and kept overheating and dropping to 20 or even less sometimes before I toned down settings and eventually replaced its internal thermal pads and repasted, new one hits 200fps at the same resolution.
unimportantinfodump@reddit
Well without a Nvidia GPU there are 2 options
9070xt and 7900xtx.
9070xt is the newer one. CPU doesn't matter. You could have a ryzen 5600
unimportantinfodump@reddit
You have also chosen the worst 9070xt brand.
Get a power color red devil it's actually a decent fps difference
Winkel00@reddit
9800x3d is overkill for 4k and a 9070xt. Its a great cpu and offers upgrade ability for a future GPU upgrade but if you want to save money you can easily get away with a cheaper card like 7600x.
Regardless this will play 4k but not max settings on high FPS.
HankHippoppopalous@reddit
You problem is that nVidia is the only one making a top-teir 4K card until AMD launches a 9080 (and theres no indication of that - AMD appears to have killed it)
9070TI is your only choice.
AnubianWolf@reddit
At your budget, consider a trusted, used, 7900 XTX
jhenryscott@reddit
My R5 9600x/9070 runs 4k just fine
HotwheelsMiata@reddit
If you're buying new I'd suggest a B850 motherboard instead of a B650. The B650 were made for the Ryzen 7000-series. They can work with 9000-series CPUs, but might need a BIOS update. B850 will always work with 9000-series out of the box, and includes other small upgrades over the older B650.