why are greece and turkey referred to as enemies?

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Roufianos255@reddit

The Turkish government absolutely is an enemy of Greece, we're not even a few years removed from Erdogan threatening to invade in the night and talking of missiles which can hit Athens. I'd like to think most Turks don't agree with this rhetoric but also threads like this make me think they're tone-deaf to what's going on.

Let's also not pretend that these threats don't have real world consequences, namely the ridiculous money Greece pours into its army and the hesitancy to extract resources from the Aegean.

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EnoughPersonality859@reddit

In the last 150 years, Turkey hasn't attacked Greece a single time, but you definitely can't say the same for the other way around. Let’s be real: Greece isn't actually a major driver of Turkish politics. Even though politicians try to play the "Greece card" every now and then to stir the pot, it never really lands with the public because the average Turk doesn't give Greece much thought. The only time Turks actually talk about Greece is when they’re complaining about the economy. It’s usually someone wondering how a country using the Euro is somehow cheaper than us. For the average person in Turkey, the "Greek issue" begins and ends with the fact that you can get twice as much calamari for 20 Euros over there than you can here. That’s literally it.

But for Greece, it’s a totally different story. Turkey is a talking point in every single election. hell, they probably bring it up when electing a primary school class president because it’s such a guaranteed crowd pleaser.

Long story short: all that talk about "we have to spend billions on defense because of the Turks" is just a bunch of political nonsense.

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Radiant_Put_3609@reddit

This feels like a pretty onesided take tbh. Conflating government rhetoric with the views of an entire population is exactly the kind of thinking that keeps tensions high.

Yes, politicians on both sides have used aggressive language at times, but that’s hardly unique or new in the context of long standing regional disputes. It doesnt automatically translate into genuine intent for conflict, nor does it reflect what “most turks” think.

Also, framing it as if only greece is reacting defensively ignores the fact that disputes in the aegean (airspace, maritime zones, militarization of islands, etc.) are mutual and have been ongoing for decades. Both sides interpret international law in ways that favor their own positions. As for military spending, greece’s decisions are sovereign choices influenced by multiple factors, including alliances, regional security dynamics, and internal politics, not just turkish rhetoric.

Reducing this to turkey = aggressor, greece = reacting oversimplifies a complex geopolitical situation and doesn’t really help anyone understand what’s actually going on.

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samvarr@reddit

Adding to this the last “aggressor” that led to a conflict between both nations was the Greek military junta that led an illegal military coup to annex Cyprus to Greece. Breaking the treaty of guarantee signed by Greece, Turkey, and the United Kingdom.

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BlackberryHoliday734@reddit

That was a military junta supported by the United States.

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Roufianos255@reddit

Show me one example of a Greek politician ever expressing aggressive intent towards Turkey in recent times? It's not a 'both sides' thing.

Also I don't know what your first para is about when I explicitly separated the Turkish government from the people. That's not what keeps tensions high by the way, it's Turkish politicians explicitly threatening to invade Greece and even those affiliated with Erdogan posing with maps showing Greek lands to be part of Turkey.

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bruhmanbruuh@reddit

No , our cultures are not almost the same. I have nothing in common with a Turk from Diyarbakir.There are better neighbors than Turkey, Bulgaria for example.

>yeah, stuff happened in the past, but it’s called the past for a reason.

Are you really that naive or is this ragebait?

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EnoughPersonality859@reddit

are you rage baiting Kurds?

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KhanofSeljuks@reddit

Turks in Diyarbakır?!

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PotentialBass3073@reddit

If you want to skip the part of history where the ottomans raped and conquered everyone in their empire (including genocides on the Greek population - not that far ago), you can talk about active conflicts like the Turkish occupation of Cyprus, discrimination of Greek minorities in contested territories etc. If you genuinely think history doesn't impact the world today then you've been living a very privileged life, or you're too young to feel it's consequences.

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samvarr@reddit

As if the Greeks and Roman Empire you claim didn’t conquer land and objectively were absolutely way more brutal…

And on Cyprus issue you’re leaving out how it started. In 1974 a Greek backed coup by the military junta (using EOKA B) overthrew President Makarios to annex Cyprus for Greece. That directly violated the constitutional order and the Treaty of Guarantee. Turkey then FIRST pleaded the United Kingdom to intervene as a guarantor and when they refused Turkey intervened.

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PotentialBass3073@reddit

Never claimed that Greeks or Romans didn't conquer land. Also, I'm definitely sure the Romans and Greeks weren't as brutal as the Turks were - you can literally talk all day about the millions of Assyrians, Greeks, Armenians, Kurds dead at the hands of their oppressors (some genocides happened in the last century!!). The romans were also harsh, but absolutely not at this level (they're also a much older civilization, morals changed a lot since they fell). Greeks were part of the ottoman empire for a long time lol so they couldn't have conquered or subjugated others, at least not at the scale of their neighbors.

Regarding Cyprus, after the coup and the invasion, there were legal elections that reinstated a legitimate government there. Why didn't the Turks leave?

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samvarr@reddit

You’re positive they weren’t more brutal?

Europe absolutely had its own record of coercion and violence tied to religion forced conversions, expulsions, massacres, and persecution of those who didn’t conform. That’s not really debatable.

In contrast, the Ottoman system operated differently. Under the millet system, religious communities like Orthodox Christians, Jews, and others were allowed to practice their faith, maintain their institutions, and govern aspects of their own affairs. It wasn’t perfect or “modern equality,” but it was way more just than Europe at the time.

It’s also widely recognized that, relative to much of Europe at the time, the Ottomans were more religiously tolerant. A clear example is Sultan Bayezid II welcoming Jews expelled from Spain, and more broadly the preservation and continuity of the Eastern Orthodox Church under Ottoman rule.

As for the “genocides” you mentioned I’m not going to unpack all of that in a Reddit thread, but those claims are heavily debated and I’d be able to refute your “genocide” label.

History here isn’t one sided and your nations don’t have a monopoly on conquest. Nor do you have a morally superior higher ground to stand on and lecture us.

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BlackberryHoliday734@reddit

Ottoman times sucked for Greece. Then Turkey genocided a bunch of people. So yeah.

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Radiant_Put_3609@reddit

You’re selectively framing history to fit a narrative. If we’re going to bring up atrocities, then be consistent about it. What happened to Turks in Greece during population exchanges and earlier conflicts? What about massacres on both sides during collapsing empires? History in this region isn’t one-sided, it’s cycles of violence, retaliation, and power struggles.

Also, invoking rape as if it’s unique to one group is just ahistorical. Unfortunately, in pretty much every war ever, from ancient times to modern conflicts, civilians, especially women, have suffered horrific abuse. That’s not an “Ottoman only” thing, that’s a human warfare problem.

As for Cyprus, even that isn’t a simple “one side evil, one side innocent” situation. There was intercommunal violence long before 1974. Ignoring that context doesn’t make your argument stronger, it just makes it incomplete.

History absolutely matters, but cherry-picking only the parts that support your stance while ignoring everything else isn’t “acknowledging history”. It’s weaponizing it.

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BlackberryHoliday734@reddit

Greeks didn't genocide. That was the Turks. Who were the oppressors. And who yes also faced violence. Duh. You had to GTFO.

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PotentialBass3073@reddit

Did you seriously just prompt chatgpt to make you this response? 😂😂

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Tadimizkacti@reddit

Turks conquered Greece and settled in there. They ruled for hundreds of years without investing a substantial amount into Greece.

Then the Greeks rose up and ethnically cleansed Greece from Turks. They weren't satisfied with what they had so they invaded anatolia too. Greeks then got their ass kicked by Turks and ran away in defeat.

After that whole thing there was the "legal" and mutual ethnic cleansing on both sides called the population exchange. People had to leave their homes and lands and those were occupied by foreigners.

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

right.

y is ur post history in Turkish, if ur Greek?

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Impossible_Web_4332@reddit

He is literally a Turk. Only a Turk claim that "Oh,we're so similar we eat the same food and we look similar" , I haven't heard the same statement from any Greek.

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Substratas@reddit

Only a Turk claim that "Oh,we're so similar we eat the same food and we look similar", I haven't heard the same statement from any Greek.

I’ve heard it from Greeks too, but about Italy. The ”Go West” mentality is big in the Balkans.

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Roufianos255@reddit

South Italians do have a significant amount of Greek DNA, dunno what kind of hyperbole you may have read beyond that though.

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Substratas@reddit

South Italians do have a significant amount of Greek DNA

So do Western Turks, but you’ll never hear the ”una faccia, una razza” when they are the subject of the conversation.

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Roufianos255@reddit

Do they? My understanding is that South Greeks and islanders are closest to South Italians and northerns and central are closest to Albanians and other Balkan groups. I've never seen a study which links Turks and Greeks as particularly close genetically (culture obviously yes).

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Substratas@reddit

Do they? My understanding is that South Greeks and islanders are closest to South Italians and northerns and central are closest to Albanians and other Balkan groups.

Alright, have u ever heard the term ”una facia, una razza” when Albanians and other Balkan groups are the subject of the conversation? My point still stands that many people in the Balkan countries love being compared to the West.

Albanians too, like, they love being compared to Italians but downplay the similarities between the Albanian & Serbian cultures.

I've never seen a study which links Turks and Greeks as particularly close genetically (culture obviously yes).

I just checked on ID and u are right - Idk why I believed the two were so close.

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Yarrrak31@reddit

Greek right wingers on twitter think we are Greek race traitors cosplaying as Mongol invaders

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Kindly_Scientist@reddit

and mongols/old turkic people claims we are anatolian/greek. cycle continues 😂

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

my mother 🇹🇷 my father 🇬🇷 i mean, my family says this a lot, so i got it from them. but i was actually born in greece.

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

my greek posts are private and my mother is turkish

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WickedLordSP@reddit

Animosity between two nation is a boomer and genx tradition. I haven't come anyone of y or z to have any hatred among them

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Happy-Hour88@reddit

Shared history. The man who created Modern Turkey was born in a Greek city which is triggering some ultra nationalist Turks. Also most artifacts found in Turkiye are from Ancient Greece. On the other hand Thessaloniki old stuff is mostly Ottoman.

Modern Greek food is actually mostly Ottoman sourced. Very few dishes from Ancient Greece survived. Laiko and modern Greek pop sound very Oriental and with obvious to outsiders stylistic links to the Ottoman era. Ofc Greeks will claim it's not true but it is. Ancient Greeks didn't sang or made music like that.

Also, having different religions and population exchanges didn't help.

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strongestwill@reddit

One of my longest friends is Greek, other than radioactive nationalists no one hates eachother

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PupperRobot@reddit

Nobody besides a handful of ultra-nationalist actually think they're enemies.

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Twofingers_@reddit

This, and i will also add that it benefits some people by being labeled as “enemy” because.. cough cough you spend money to buy military equipment due to that label.

And i would also like to add that a balkan alliance could be a force to reckon with (in a different world most prob as its unlikely to ever happen on this one..).

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windozeFanboi@reddit

Idk , Russians and Ukrainians were brothers ...

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PupperRobot@reddit

Not sure if it's a good comparison. Also just because two nations are warring it doesn't mean the people are enemies.

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Bauljamic_Arlijam@reddit

Yea bruh, they gonna hate each other more than us and Croats..

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izii_@reddit

How were they brothers?

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raceregos@reddit

I’ve always had the feeling that Western media push this narrative, as if we’re supposed to be at each other’s throats.

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immacomment-here-now@reddit

Well it does. I thought you were sworn enemies. Like proper. Always wondered how it works to be sworn enemies and at the same time in the same defense alliance though.

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raceregos@reddit

You'd be surprised how Turkey sees the world and where it puts Greece. "Sworn enemies" sounds like an amateur way of describing Turkey's views. There's no such thing.

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immacomment-here-now@reddit

Only reason is because I’ve been fed said false information about y’all bro ✌️ Love to stand corrected in this case ofc. Or learn something new, like.

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Roufianos255@reddit

Western narrative made Erdogan openly talk of striking Athens?

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raceregos@reddit

That was an unfortunate statement but still lacks the context which is crucial. It never justifies Western media, anyway.

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zara_anwar@reddit

Enemies at day, gay lovers by night

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

I'll leave a fan art here too then <3

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K-Hunter-@reddit

The greatest love story of all time

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Significant_Judge008@reddit

As a Turk myself, I don’t have any enmity towards anyone that’s seen as being ‘historically hostile’. Doesn’t matter if they’re Greek, Armenian, Kurdish, Assyrian or Arab

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InternetIsntMyFrend4@reddit

Christian and Muslim religious bastards of both parties pumping up the hostility rhetoric

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asterothe1905@reddit

People are alike and friends sometimes politicians act to influence feeble minded people for their agenda.

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FantasticQuartet@reddit

I am too broke to care, and seeing the recent Artemis II mission by NASA got me into a rabbit hole about how vast the universe is and how insignificant country disputes are in the grand scheme of things.

Maybe I just need to put down the phone and go to sleep.

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Gazdanadam@reddit

The animosity between Greece and Turkey isn't because of the past, but rather the past keeps getting brought up because of the current animosity.

Greco-Turkish relations were doing incredibly well after 1922 until it started to deteriorate in the 50's and 60's because of the Cyprus issue. Then the territorial waters and EEZ entered the picture, and we have been squabbling ever since.

I'd absolutely love to live with the Greeks in not just peaceful coexistence but close cooperation.

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Creative_Gain3000@reddit

They fighting about Baklava. Undecided if better with walnuts or pistachios

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sayinmer@reddit

enemies is too strong, more like siblings… we fight a lot about the stupidest shits sometimes but if ever one of us was in real trouble, the other would rush to help

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nobody1568@reddit

so why should we be enemies with turkey?

Are you asking why Turkey should be enemies with Turkey?

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

🫪

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Brilliant_Success346@reddit

Νοbody calls us enemies

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Kalepox@reddit

there is no war at all it’s just nationalism earns votes in both sides

also countries like US and France profit from selling weapons to both sides

we like greeks here and no one has a problem with you guys

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bongiovist@reddit

If we were enemies, why did we run towards each others help at the worst days when a natural disaster happened? We enjoyed seeing each other devastated? I do not think so! Realising how miserable each of us when there is no show left, we faced with the harsh reality. Stay merciful and stay as a friend Komşu!

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

exactly… at the end of the day we’re just neighbors who show up for each other when it matters. Να προσέχεις, γείτονα!🩵

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erdoganbestforturkiy@reddit

Greece is absolutely the enemy. They are ruining the Balkans.

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kolecik@reddit (OP)

calling greece a destabilizing force in the balkans while we’re literally one of the biggest investors in the region is bullshit ☠️

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CockamouseGoesWee@reddit

You gotta buy me dinner first before saying something so heated

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Repulsive_Work_226@reddit

We are not enemies. Rivals on some aspects. We also share something very important: food

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Embarrassed-Shoe-848@reddit

Aegean

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Checky_3rd@reddit

Because of territorial disputes and sometimes generational grudge, due to Ottoman-Greco drama and subsequently Roman-Turkish Drama.

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AFKE0@reddit

I don't have a personal problem with Greeks either, but the collective consciousness of a nation has a big inertia. Even if most of the nations are fine with each other (and I believe we are mostly fine with each other), this bleeding into policies and cultural expressions will take time.

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Worried-Owl-9198@reddit

Only politics the rest is nonsense.