Tehran rejects 48-hour ceasefire proposal from Pentagon
Posted by ObjectiveObserver420@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 108 comments
Posted by ObjectiveObserver420@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 108 comments
rbhmmx@reddit
The Iran trap
Its amazing to see all the predictions made about two years ago. Even before trump won the election, the story was written already.
Aggravating-Fee1934@reddit
That guy is a fraud, and a Holocaust denier.
NearABE@reddit
Is he denying that Iran was involved in the Holocaust.
Aggravating-Fee1934@reddit
The Holocaust denial isn't a point about Iran, rather that he's a crank that doesn't accept observable reality, and it's impossible to make accurate predictions from inaccurate data. He just shotguns so much bullshit out there that sometimes he is right.
PurpleMclaren@reddit
Of course an American doesnt agree with his analysis that America is falling apart
Aggravating-Fee1934@reddit
Oh, no, the U.S. is certainly falling apart, but "professor" Jiang doesn't have any special insight into it. Whether it will fall apart completely is yet unclear.
PurpleMclaren@reddit
I guess time will tell, no one said his insight is special, he just brings up valid points that are meant to invoke questions.
NearABE@reddit
Need to correct you on that. Freaking out about “the country falling apart” is epidemic in USA. I have observed it said in all of my decades. I believe complaining about the coming doom goes back all the way to before the founding constitution. Prior to that the first British colony (Jamestown) nearly starved to death. Prior to that Roanoke actually disappeared, no one really knows what happened. The Spanish colonies were overrun by gringoes. All of the other nations were overrun by invading Europeans and subjugated.
PurpleMclaren@reddit
That has nothing to do with what we are talking about, the reality of the situation is the debt has gotten so high that realistically there is no way to pay it, especially if people stop buying bonds/american debt.
If countries need to sell off bonds/stock to pay for electricity or food then america is absolutely fucked.
You guys have relied on the petroldollar for so long and were able to just print money when oil was low but now oil is not low and everything is expensive, ai bubble, war, its all piling on and it will burst soon.
Civil war 2 is coming.
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
Isn't labelling him a "Holocaust denier" a bit extreme.
If I remember correctly his argument was the Holocaust was a genocide but there was never any written order from the Nazi government saying they should exterminate the people in the camps. I'm not sure if I agree with that, but again it's not the same as Holocaust denial
Cachar@reddit
No. That is the classic denier opening gambit.
It's also substantially misleading to the point of basically being a falsehood. Yes, there is no singular 'holocaust law', but there is a whole host of evidence that makes any claim that the genocide was not wanted and planned by the Nazi government absolutely ludicrously indefensible.
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
Well yes, I agree.
It's the same with Gaza, many Israeli politicians made outright genocidal statements, but there was no official "do genocide" directive. But we would agree that a genocide still occurred, even if there was no official directive.
Cachar@reddit
Please be aware that the way you're arguing is problematic. You are immediately pivoting from the Nazi Holocaust to current crimes of Israel (which I am not defending in any way, but drawing cheap parallels is way too simplistic) after soft-defending a holocaust denier. If that's not the impression you want to give, you should rethink what you post.
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
How is it pivoting? I am just using another genocide as an example. Again no direct "do genocide" order, but the genocide still occurred
Cachar@reddit
Nope, not getting dragged into that argument. You're using the talking points of Neo-Nazis. That's where I leave the conversation.
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
I'm a neo nazi because I call out all genocides...?
Fascinating
Cachar@reddit
Nope. You're using neo-nazi talking points and 'debate' tactics. Like not making distinctions like that to paint others as unreasonable.
I have no idea what your actual beliefs are. And honestly, I'm not interested.
PathfinderZ1@reddit
One might argue that not having genocide be enforced by law is even more damning (for both Nazi Germany and Israel), as it points to a real systemic issue within the people, not just the system.
He is not defending Nazism, I am also not sure why you're unable to respond beyond repeating he's a neo nazi, the man is basically agreeing with you..
Unlike you though, we acknowledge both past and active genocides.. do you acknowledge that what's happening in Gaza is genocide, or are you a neo nazi? :)
Cachar@reddit
Lol, that's a really poor attempt at a gotcha. Do better.
And before you get the wrong idea: I do think Israel is in the process of comitting genocide in Gaza. You just ENTIRELY missed the point I was making.
PathfinderZ1@reddit
As expected, no meaningful response..
Glad we agree!
You don't have to project your national guilt onto us all. Genocide exceptionalism is as bad as holocaust denial.
Cachar@reddit
I don't feel obligated to make a meaningful response, if you don't make the effort to understand what I've already written and make the same mistake I called the other person out for already.
Nice attempt to change the topic once more, still not biting.
PathfinderZ1@reddit
You seem to be under the impression that not agreeing with is equal to not understanding you, which is incredibly asinine. We understand you just fine. :)
No need, my reply is more or less for the benefit of others reading this thread, not you. I already know what kind of person you are.
Cachar@reddit
Glad you've figured me out! You are so smart, I admire you.
loggy_sci@reddit
That is holocaust denialism. The holocaust wasn’t just a thing that ended up happening, the Nazis built an entire industry around systematically eradicating millions of people. It was intentional.
ChillAhriman@reddit
You don't build mass installations to systematically kill millions of people to a point where you need lots of industry both to build them and to sustain them, if there isn't very clear intent to actual kill millions of people.
I guess you could make a skit about bureaucrats redacting and signing papers without thinking about what they mean and suddenly comes a day when they say: "Gee! Looks like we've built a nuclear plant. Wonder how things came together all of a sudden!", and maybe it'd work well in a comedy TV show, but no one's going to buy they didn't know what they were doing.
Aggravating-Fee1934@reddit
"we don’t actually have any concrete evidence for the Holocaust." - "Professor" Jiang
So yeah, he's a Holocaust denier. That's the thing that you are if you deny the Holocaust
Maybe_this_time_fr@reddit
LMAO what a reach.
Aggravating-Fee1934@reddit
Damn, I reached all the way from a dude denying the Holocaust to him being a Holocaust denier
Bartimeo666@reddit
That guy is nuts, but that is uncanny indeed
PurpleMclaren@reddit
How is he nuts?
Bartimeo666@reddit
You can watch the last episode of the series. He implies the Putin could be some kind of telepath as a way to explain his suposed mastermind makin a direct reference to the Foundation series for the telepath thing).
Besides riding Putin's dick hard (and Stalin"s for that matter) is some kind of Covid denier and applies Game Theory in the same way a kid that has learn a nee word would.
And that is only in that series, AskHistorians have an even worse opinion on him, wich is something.
PurpleMclaren@reddit
Ah, saying russia is winning in Ukraine is riding putins dick, got it.
Bartimeo666@reddit
No, saying that he is some kind of genius who wanted to create some kind of forever war to liberate spiritually russians through fighting a common enemy is.
Dis you see the videos?
ChillAhriman@reddit
A lot of his positions are logical for someone with a slightly-beyond-surface level knowledge, but... Then there's another lot, and he starts saying that the US is going to collapse specifically because half of 20yo white women have OnlyFans accounts (false premise and faulty reasoning), or he rambles about conspiracies of secret sectarian groups that rule the world from the shadows (hey yo, sociology and class analysis are knocking on the door and they science-based, no need for conspiracy theories).
EnglishMobster@reddit
He also gets into COVID denialism etc.
It was interesting to watch at first but the more I watched of him, the more I realized he was coo-coo
PurpleMclaren@reddit
"American" values is certainely a valid point, and its clearly been eroding society.
You just feel extremely uncomfortable about the valid points he brings up.
GianfrancoZoey@reddit
Haven't seen too much of his videos but I get the sense that he just repackages analysis from the likes of Wallerstein/Mearsheimer etc and then adds his own kooky beliefs about Sabbatean blood cults, energy harvesting via ritual sacrifice, and the Antichrist kicking off the War of Gog and Magog.
He seems to do this instead of delving into the capital powers that actually drive these events.
montyman185@reddit
It's not uncannywhen someone says obvious shit that everyone with a hint of knowledge of things
Bartimeo666@reddit
Trump being idiot enough to attack Iran wasn't so obvious. He didn't the first time
SludgeFilter@reddit
Honestly if China has any brains they will start another frontier somewhere else by the end of end of year. Pretty sure the paper tiger can't actually fight a 3 way conventional war
NymusRaed@reddit
They would cook the war too hot with that and they know it. The wisest thing China can do, assuming their aim is taking back Taiwan, is waiting for the US to lose enough influence/softpower like waiting for a piece of meat to simmer long enough until it's nice and tender.
Stubbs94@reddit
China isn't war hawkish.
GianfrancoZoey@reddit
People's perception of China is so skewed, they don't want war. The West has claimed that they do over and over so people believe it but it's just projection
ChillAhriman@reddit
About a year ago, I was relatively certain that they may try to invade Taiwan before the end of Trump's current term. Now? If I was Xi, my position would completely change to: "We just keep doing nothing and they keep shooting themselves in the dick. Wait another decade and we won't have to fight at all."
Provodniik@reddit
They don’t wanna go for Taiwan with boots on the ground, rather take it by “softer” power.
SludgeFilter@reddit
Ok but what other shit can they start a war with maybe north south Korea Venezuela anywhere else where us has strategic interests. Us is getting fucked right now and short of using nukes they will likely have to pull back to their sphere of influence which might be just around north America
Lezzles@reddit
I mean the US can't "win" this war really and it's a complete quagmire, but the US isn't really getting "fucked" by this war in that sense that we're losing anything meaningful. It's just not winnable.
Tsofuable@reddit
Money isn't meaningful?
Manndeufel@reddit
China won't start a war. That would destroy their entire narrative. Apart from that, war is quite the worst for China's strategy because they are currently winning economically against the United States, if anyone here is not tolerating rivals, it is the United States.This clearly shows the history and empires like the USA never last forever, the problem is rather that the USA is so cooked that I would not rule out if the decay was imminent, that they will burn everything.
IOnlyFearOFGod@reddit
They shouldn't take any ceasefire, thats basically letting your enemies catch a breath, and who the hell would even trust a ceasefire from a nation that broke the previous deal brokered by Obama, they broke it and bombed Iran.
beefprime@reddit
You cease fire, the US and Israel keep shooting (specifically at your negotiating team, it seems)
tubawhatever@reddit
You cease, we fire!
Elurdin@reddit
Israel would send rockets at the time of the ceasefire like countless times with Palestine. That unholy alliance never gave anyone any trust in ceasefires. Its like Russia asking for a ceasefire, you know they are gonna break it.
Turgius_Lupus@reddit
What ceasefire in the current conflict has Russia broken?
SpinningHead@reddit
"What, me lie?" - Putin probably
Turgius_Lupus@reddit
Can you be more specific.
SpinningHead@reddit
Oh please. https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-breaks-donald-trump-brokered-ukraine-energy-ceasefire/
Biscotti-Own@reddit
Pretty sure they just killed the guy that was negotiating. Again.
elkaki123@reddit
Israel, the US or Iran?
Biscotti-Own@reddit
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/4/2/irans-ex-foreign-minister-kharazi-gravely-wounded-in-attack-on-his-home
Moikanyoloko@reddit
Source that he was the one negotiating? Because the last time he was the Iranian foreign minister was in 2005.
The current foreign minister is Araghci.
NymusRaed@reddit
The url itself says "ex-"
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
He was the key figure in the whole JD Vance Pakistan mediated negotiations. I didn't put any faith in it but it was the strongest chance at any sort of negotiations. So it's no surprise they would bomb his house
Biscotti-Own@reddit
Did you even attempt to read the article? I'll admit it's further down the page, but I believe in you
eagleal@reddit
It’s kind of a meme nowadays that Israel/US just killed the next guy that was supposed to discuss ceasefire with them, daily.
This week it was 2 of them IIRC.
stonkmarxist@reddit
They didn't kill him. They seriously wounded him and killed his wife by bombing his family home.
Biscotti-Own@reddit
My mistake, that's totally fine
Robdul@reddit
That’s like accepting a cake from someone who’s best friends with the person famous for poisoning cakes
Michael_Gibb@reddit
That's like accepting a cake from someone ~~who's best friends with the person~~ famous for poisoning cakes.
Fixed that for you.
Robdul@reddit
You’re right they just have better PR
Mediocre-Frosting-77@reddit
Depending on the kind of cake I could see myself falling for that
TellThemISaidHi@reddit
As a kid, I watched the Smurf's. Jokey Smurf's "gifts" are always a bomb. At a certain point you gotta stop accepting them.
historicusXIII@reddit
Even if they trust the US, a ceasefire with Washington doesn't mean that Israel stops bombing.
dezastrologu@reddit
And let’s not forget about Israel who lives to violate ceasefires
fre-ddo@reddit
Some sources say they are already fighting in southern Iran, so a 48 hr ceasefire is the Israel method of buying time to penetrate further..
moodychair@reddit
I'm pretty sure Iran said they didn't want a cease fire - they wanted a complete end to all hostility. So to say the first part without the second part is misleading. I saw the foreign minister say it. - I ain't searching for the clip.
Rindan@reddit
Iran is not looking for an end to hostilities. If Iran had that on offer, Trump would have already taken it. Iran needs to extract a price so that the Trump can't just do this again. If Iran lets the US declare peace and walk away, it means that anytime the US is displeased with negotiations, they can just start bombing Iran again, safe in the knowledge that they can turn the gulf back on before things get desperate. That's obviously a losing position for Iran.
I don't think Iran's going to end this until they have extracted a price that deters Donald Trump from ever considering messing with them again. If Trump walks away, I think Iran will just keep the gulf closed, and only allow friendly ships and those that pay a big enough bribe through.
loggy_sci@reddit
Nobody is going to let Iran control all traffic in the Hormuz, this is Iranian fan fiction.
Dic3dCarrots@reddit
Oh yea? What are you going to do about it?
loggy_sci@reddit
Me personally?
Dic3dCarrots@reddit
You said no one, you volunteering to take the coast line,bud?
loggy_sci@reddit
I’m not in the military, so no.
Do you understand that it is possible to have an opinion about how the war will go, without supporting it myself. You sound like you’re taking things very personally.
Dic3dCarrots@reddit
Oh so more, "someone will be stupid enounge to try to hold 200 miles of coastline adjacent to rough mountainous terraine" with out any idea of who will be stupid enough to grind their military into dust for no reason.
loggy_sci@reddit
Sanction their economy and bomb their country until they change their position
Dic3dCarrots@reddit
How exactly will sanctioning them more and bombing them more open the strait?
Taviii@reddit
You keep sounding ‘less intelligent’ the further down i read.
Iran has already been under severe sanctions for decades and has been bombed continuously for over a month. The United States, the world’s mightiest armed force, has failed to reopen the strait and was forced to resort to begging the global community for help, without success, since no one is willing to send their children on such a deadly and fruitless endeavor. Every extra day the strait remains closed is catastrophic for the world economy. If nothing else, this war has taught Iran that if the West decides to sanction them, they can simply sanction us back, and there is little we can do about it.
loggy_sci@reddit
I personally believe the U.S. has kicked a hornets nest and should never have bombed Iran.
There is not little the U.S. could do. They continue to attack at a greater intensity and blockade all Iranian oil exports coming out of kharg island (~90% of all Iranian exports). The Iranian position could change under more pressure and the U.S. absolutely has a huge arsenal. The Iranians are not unmovable simply because they are difficult to invade and able to withstand sanctions. The U.S. hasn’t been defeated because it got a black eye.
Rindan@reddit
Iran literally controls all traffic in the straight right now. Other than a couple of ships that snuck out, all traffic in the straight has had to get Iranian permission and pay for the pleasure. It's pretty goofy to call something verifiably happening right now "fan fiction".
And to be clear, I am no fan of Iran. It's a monstrous and violent government that has committed great evils both to their own peaceful citizens, and to people outside of Iran. Not liking Iran doesn't change the fact that it has taken control of the straight and no one is able to stop them. The best they can do is deny them the straight as well. Your belief that "someone" is going to put a stop to this is thoughts and prayers.
Describe who will stop this and how.
invisiblelemur88@reddit
This comment is functionally worthless without a source to back it up.
moodychair@reddit
https://youtube.com/shorts/h28MUzLzsf0
Dic3dCarrots@reddit
The iran-iraq war lasted 8 years and Iran was pummeled yet refused every cease fire. This is not a regime that will submit and murdering all of the civilians. will just leave rugged unclaimed territory where anyone with enough money to ship some drones that direction could use to extort the strait. An end now would leave Iran in a fundamentally stronger position than a month ago with demonstrated leverage on global trade. The options here all suck
ThevaramAcolytus@reddit
I've been a longtime opponent and critic of much of U.S. foreign policy, including toward Iran and on the whole MENA region, and have had a lot of choice words for the U.S. government's past policies and actions - So many things that could be said about them. Yet never in my lifetime did I expect it to be saying that it looks absolutely ridiculously.
Imagine little over a month into the illegal undeclared war you started with assassination attacks, flash forward a few days and weeks the world's most advanced air defense systems are being blown to confetti, the most advanced radars and AWACS planes destroyed on the ground, your foremost stealth jet fielded blasted in the sky, can't protect or prevent any of your regional allies from having hellfire rained down on them and having their industry leveled and economic means of life wrecked, all your bases in the theatre rendered uninhabitable and troops evacuated and sent to hide and hunker down in civilian hotels, the route through which a fifth of global oil exports transit cutoff, the vaunted world's strongest navy of a maritime power loitering a distance away unable to be ordered in to try and reverse the situation for fear of just being blown up too, and now being the one begging the attacked party - a decades long-sanctioned developing country, for a ceasefire.
Did I miss anything? It's just unreal.
Lezzles@reddit
Alright I know we wanna be dramatic and I overall agree that we're being both evil and stupid, but the US military has like 14,000 planes. You're going to lose a few.
FederalSandwich1854@reddit
How many operational KC-135s and E-3s does the US have?
loggy_sci@reddit
Hundreds of KC-135s and about 20 E-3s
ThevaramAcolytus@reddit
It's not that they're going to be even close to running out of planes anytime soon or at all as a result of this conflict. It's that throwing more planes at the problem isn't getting the job done in accomplishing the political goals of this conflict and won't get the job done. Because it's not a war that can be won by air power in the first place in terms of regime change or preventing anything Iran is doing domestically in the long-term.
And a land invasion would make Afghanistan and Iraq combined look like summer ice cream socials and result in a Vietnam-style bloodbath quagmire whose outcome would still be uncertain and would induce generational social upheaval and unrest on the homefront.
ffpeanut15@reddit
There are much fewer AWACs though, which is why it is a big deal
heckin_miraculous@reddit
Iran was not kidding when they said "We've been preparing for this for years."
Gilamath@reddit
Iran today is a combination of a civilization that has lasted thousands of years by weathering empire after empire and attack after attack without allowing itself to be disassembled, and a religious tradition characterized by perpetually overcoming persecution and dispossession.
whater39@reddit
Iran said figure out the long term peace/security agreement first. Then ceasefire after.
They won't do vauge terms, as they have seen vauge terms from Israel before with Oslo Accords. Where Palestinians never got that state. Everything needs to be precise details instead.
Firecracker048@reddit
In case anyone was thinking this was in response to two downed jets today
beefprime@reddit
Have also heard a blackhawk was downed in Iraq
Firecracker048@reddit
Uscentcom said both returned to base. Both took fire but made it back
Vast_Particular_@reddit
Is the A-10 confirmed?
Phenergan_boy@reddit
Damn, them Iranians have hands
Firecracker048@reddit
US centcom confirmed it per NYT
BatmanForever93@reddit
Good. Why should they accept a ceasefire agreement with country that attacked them unprovoked while they were in the middle of negotiations? They have every right to make this as painful and drawn out as possible for the US.
fcukou@reddit
Iran doesn't want a ceasefire with two nations who have shown time and again they don't honor ceasefires. Color me shocked. Maybe the US should have reigned Israel in for its ceasefire violations and shouldn't constantly bomb every Iranian diplomat sent to negotiate.