Long-Haul Pilot Fatigue
Posted by NeitherAd5619@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 54 comments
Hello everyone! I know I post quite a lot on this forum, but I’m very curious and your answers help me a lot.
I’ve been wondering about fatigue related to long-haul flying for pilots. How tired are you, both during rotations and in everyday life? Given that these flights almost always involve shifting or “sacrificing” a night of sleep (relative to your home base time), how do you manage this, especially as you get older?
On your days off, are you mostly recovering, or do you have enough energy to live a normal life? Over time, do you feel any long-term effects of long-haul flying on your overall health? Do you feel like you age faster compared to people of the same age with a more regular lifestyle?
Finally, for those who have moved from short/medium-haul to long-haul, would you make the same choice again today, or do you have any regrets?
Thank you very much for your answers and feedback!
wasnizam@reddit
Long haul fatigue management is genuinely one of the more underappreciated skills in the job. The circadian disruption compounds fast — it's not just about hours of sleep, it's about when you slept relative to your body clock. A lot of crews focus only on the duty time numbers and miss the physiological piece entirely.
What's worked best for me across talking to folks who do this: treating pre-flight sleep as a strategic asset, not just 'getting rest'. Anchoring your sleep window to destination time a day or two out where possible, staying disciplined about light exposure post-landing, and being honest with yourself about where you are on the alertness curve before each segment.
The crews who struggle most are usually the ones who try to 'push through' on discipline alone without any real awareness of their fatigue state. It catches up.
tacomasgrande@reddit
I sleep like a baby in crew rest. It’s a little jarring when you’re new to long haul and you look over and see the old captain fast asleep. But hey, you’re the captain now!
AutothrustBlue@reddit
What’s your secret? I feel I have struggled so much when trying to get meaningful rest in the bunk.
tacomasgrande@reddit
Sorry I don’t know! I think the secret is being very tired. 😂
ThatLooksRight@reddit
A sleepy version of the Hulk.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
How many hours of real sleep do you get on a say 8h flight or a 12, 14 hour flight ?
RaiseTheDed@reddit
Depends on the time of my rest. An 8 hour flight will usually have 3 crew, and we are able to get up from the flight deck seats at top of climb (20 ish minutes into the flight) and usually sit back down an hour from landing. So, 8 hours is usually 6:40 divided between three for rest. 12 or more hours will have 4 crew, so 10:40 divided by two. If my rest is during the time I want to sleep, I can sleep most of the rest period.
Some like to split 4 crew flights into quarters, but if we do that I like to have one short rest and one longer rest.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Wow! So on a 12h flight you may be able to sleep 5h ?
Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit
you get the rest opportunity, now whether you can make your body sleep on demand during your 5 hrs downtime... that's a different story. hence being prepared to either sleep first (show up tired at the beginning of the duty period) versus being rested at the start of the flight duty period which is how everyone has been operating before they get to long haul.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Are you able to sleep well in the bunk ? Real rest?
RaiseTheDed@reddit
I can. Some aren't able to. Some prefer the business style seats that are available.
tacomasgrande@reddit
I fly business jets part 91 so there aren’t any rules. But on a 12 hour flight I’ll be in the bunk for four hours and sleep most of that.
RaiseTheDed@reddit
Yes. Mostly the same for passenger flying.
Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit
you sleep when you’re tired you eat when you’re hungry.
either it works for you or it doesn’t.
you get to sleep at work in flight. hopefully you have a good captain that organizes the crew before the flight. so you know whether to be rested and fly first or tired so that you can sleep first then fly later.
it takes a day or two back home to get back to normal.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Do you feel like your aging faster than everyone else ?
Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit
I dont think so, but who knows. you're going to die sooner or later.
i dont regret switching from short to long haul. i do it again. it is a change of layovers, instead of manhattan, orlando, las vegas or long beach layovers, i get tokyo. incheon, hong hong layovers instead.
Horror-Quality-578@reddit
did u switch for better pay or more interesting destinations
Historical-Pin1069@reddit
And once you get back to normal the cycle repeats.. The joy of being a pilot :D
HumanServices@reddit
And then off you go again for another trip
entertheinterloper@reddit
ACMI is the most fatiguing flying I have ever done. I didn’t even know what Part 121 Supplemental was when I got hired. I had never had headaches from sleep deprivation before until I started working here. The key is to sleep when you’re tired, eat when you are hungry. If you try to maintain a rhythm, you’re doomed. The schedule simply will not allow it.
It’s become more manageable over time, but there are some trips where it just doesn’t work out and others where it works out very well and I’m well rested the majority of the trip. It’s all luck of the draw as the company provides zero consideration for our rest and sleep cycles outside of regulatory and contractual rest requirements, which are severely lacking when it comes to protecting a pilot’s health and the body’s circadian rhythm. Their answer to poor scheduling is to call in fatigued which results in going unpaid for that trip, so it’s rarely utilized.
I fly 17 on and 13 off. My sleep schedule is completely obliterated by day 2. The hard part is managing overnights. I am often scheduled for 24 hour layovers and they are the bane of my existence.
A normal day at my ACMI is waking up an hour before van time. Go to work 18-20 hours. Two legs, usually about 8-10 time zone changes. I get in. Sleep 8 hours. I’m up for 12-16 hours. I try to sleep again before my next 18-20 hour duty day. My body refuses to sleep. I show up for work as my body’s circadian rhythm begins to request sleep. If I’m pilot flying, I’ll have caffeine. Usually just tea because coffee disrupts my sleep too much. I’ll sleep 3 hours on the first leg. Try to sleep on the ground while the plane is being loaded. Usually unsuccessful. Second leg I get anywhere between zero and one hour of sleep. I get to my hotel. Sleep for 8-10 hours. Hope that it’s a min rest day (11 hour layover) so that I will at least be well rested for the next day. Melatonin and caffeine are kind of a necessity to combat the time zone changes and sleeping during the day/being awake at night, but it’s kind of an art.
After about ten days of this, my sleep becomes completely disjointed and I sleep in 4 hour increments unless I’m so tired that I sleep for 12 hours when I have the time for it.
It takes me about 3 days at home to stop waking up every 3-4 hours and begin sleeping normally for 8 hours on my home time zone. After that I’m cured and can go about being a normal human.
Sleep and fatigue mitigation is the hardest part of my job. I wish my company cared more about adjusting schedules to accommodate circadian rhythm, but regulations and contractual protections are archaic and ineffective. But at least we are profitable…
It can be very frustrating. And I’m not sure what the best solution is. 117 rules won’t really work for us since we do so much night flying and the nature of some of our flights would not allow for it - namely hostile area flying. I’ve heard some people smarter than me propose 18 hour work and rest cycles and protecting that. Basically 18 hours of available duty followed by 18 hours of rest.
By the way, for anyone reading this, this is VERY different to how passenger operations are run. I fly freight and not human beings. Pilots that fly passengers long haul are not scheduled this way at all. They have many more protections, better rest rules, and bonafide fatigue management programs to prevent this type of scheduling. Most passenger airlines recognize that this is an unsafe practice. So please rest assured that your pilots are not subjected to this type of scheduling.
Rev-777@reddit
Only 30 years to go!
entertheinterloper@reddit
Don’t think I have it in me.
Rev-777@reddit
You’ll adjust. How long have you been doing it for
KITTYONFYRE@reddit
no, the human body is not capable of simply “adjusting” for fucked sleep schedules. at best, you trick yourself into believing so because you’re chronically deprived of good quality sleep. humans never had a reason to need to be sleep deprived, so they never evolved a system to deal with it (vs eg food - we’re pretty damn good at tucking away extra calories for later)
Rev-777@reddit
Sounds like you don’t know what you’re talking about. Agree to disagree.
NonVideBunt@reddit
You don’t adjust to circadian flips constantly… if you do cargo / ACMI or long haul flying in general, it’s going to take its toll.
Rev-777@reddit
I’m aware, the guy who replied doesn’t.
KITTYONFYRE@reddit
“i’m aware you don’t adjust to circadian flips constantly but also the guy who said you don’t adjust to circidan flips constantly doesn’t”
ok big man
Rev-777@reddit
I’m saying they’ll get use to it and figure out what works for them. If they’re brand new to it then it seems like you’ll never figure it out.
Good grief, not everything is an argument.
DFWmovingwalkway@reddit
Sounds like you need a new job man.
NonVideBunt@reddit
Makes me glad I’m long haul for a Legacy. That sounds terrible.. I just do three days trips 3x a month and that’s it.
Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit
I agree 24 hour layovers are the worst... id rather have a 16-18 hour layover or a 30-32 hour layover, but 24 hour layovers suck.
Legitimate-Run132@reddit
long haul fatigue is brutal. the circadian disruption compounds over time so you gotta be proactive. melatonin timing helps some guys, others swear by strict sleep hygeine on layovers.
hydration and avoiding heavy meals mid-flight makes a diffrence too. some pilots i know take Energy Bits since its easy on an empty stomach and keeps energy steady without calories.
bergler82@reddit
I hated it. Loathed it. Can’t tell you how happy I am that I haven’t had to fly LR for the last 10 years. The constant exhaustion, the nights spent over some ocean. I hated it.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
So now you went narrow body
bergler82@reddit
I've been on the A320 ever since. Love it. 95% daytrips, home at night, no frills. 2-4 legs a day. Absolute joy. No horrible new hotels because the room is 3 bucks cheaper than the last. No either stupid expensive or shitty food. I love me my short- and medium haul daytrips.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Happy for you! Maybe you could answer a question I have: with enough seniority can you bid always layover trips with nice locations (Caribbean) and get them 90% of the time ? I heard that almost all destinations in South America have a 24h layover, sometimes in all inclusive. Curious if it would be possible to always get them with seniority. (I asked earlier but the person didn’t answer)
Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit
Caribbean isnt long haul.. at most it’s a 6 hour flight from the west coast / 2 hour flight from Florida / 3 hours from New York, Caribbean would be flown by domestic crews. I bid avoid Caribbean layovers
South America goes fairly senior usually those guys bidding those flights do it to go visit their second wife and family in South America that the family in the US doesnt know about.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Ahaha I see, why do you avoid them? Aren’t they nice, 24h layover in all inclusive ?!
bergler82@reddit
I am sorry to say but I have no clue. I am base on the other side of the atlantic. We had some north/south LR to Africa but most was east/west to the US & Caribbean as well as Asia. So a vast majority of our flight were one day flight towards the west and one night flight towards the east, crossing a minimum of 6 and a maximum of 9-12 time zones. And that got me. As well as the sheer time away from home with very limited communication due to time zones.
ccarn245@reddit
A big factor in my experience is the efficiency of the flying you get. West coast into China/HK/Oceana/SE Asia produces 2.5-3 trips a month with the ability to recoup on longer stretches at home between pairings. Europe flying typically pays 4-5 pairings a month, which is a significantly higher toll on the mind and body (again for me in my experience). Once you find a sleep routine that works for whichever direction you’re flying, it’s very tolerable and the recovery is quick (so long as you’re able to sleep in the bunk). However, if you get hit with a month where you’re going both directions, ie a ICN, DUB, HK, I find those are killer and you just have to hang on for dear life.. East coast pilots doing Europe turns is the worst I’ve experienced, I had months with 5.5 Europe pairings, and that was unbearable..
PILOT9000@reddit
That’s why I don’t do it anymore. Domestic or just the Americas is much easier on me after 40. In my 20s and early 30s it was ok for the most part.
NeitherAd5619@reddit (OP)
Yes I see. But curious, with enough seniority can you bid always layover trips with nice locations (Caribbean) and get them 90% of the time ? I heard that almost all destinations in South America have a 24h layover, sometimes in all inclusive. Curious if it would be possible to always get them with seniority.
Which_Material_3100@reddit
I’m doing better than I expected after switching to long haul (787). I think the combination of the aircraft’s lower cabin altitude and humidification system, along with finally figuring out sleeping in the bunk enroute, has helped me feel better than when I was doing “all-nighters” and multi-leg narrowbody flying. I find flying to Europe then back to the US I feel pretty good when I get home. Doing Pacific flying is a bit more challenging for my body clock.
FightingIlliteracy@reddit
Sometimes it’s easy to snap back into your home time zone, sometimes it takes a week to re-acclimate. Most layovers (long-haul ACMI) are multiple days so getting enough rest before the next flight is rarely an issue, and most flights have 3 or 4 crewmembers, helping mitigate fatigue even further.
I haven’t done enough long haul flying to feel any long-term health issues, but the pilots I know who seem most affected are specifically night sort cargo drivers.
I would make the same choice every time because I got into aviation for the travel and to drive heavies, and every layover in an exotic city reinforces my confidence in my decision to fly long haul. I would much rather see the sights and enjoy the culture/cuisine of somewhere new than to min rest in suburban America, close out Applebee’s, and crash at the La Quinta.
funnynoises@reddit
lol that's a tad hyperbolic of domestic flying.
Nyaos@reddit
Everyone does it differently. I don’t know if my body is just different but I don’t find the actual flying to be that fatiguing. I don’t really sleep on the plane too well. The bunks are very hard and I’m a side sleeper so I find I have to rotate every half an hour to stop my shoulders from hurting.
My technique that works for me always involves managing my rest so I get a big 8 hours of sleep before any flight. Very often i stay up all night in Asia or Europe to sleep in the day if my next report time is at night. The times where it’s hard is finishing a long haul flight and then forcing myself to stay up another 8 hours or more to plan ahead my rest. Even if I’m dead tired at that point I take a melatonin and then pass out when I need to, it keeps me from waking up randomly.
Some people adapt to the local zone. Some people stay on their home time zone. Some people do what I do and just don’t pay attention to the time too much and work around their schedule.
I don’t feel myself getting much older. I frequently see legacy pilots in the terminal that are in worse shape than some of our oldest pilots. We don’t fly a lot of block hours though and we had a lot of layover time to work out. Eating healthy is probably harder than the fatigue.
nbd9000@reddit
i spent almost 4 years flipping my body clock every 36 hours to fly a "rigorous" longhaul schedule. i gained 120lbs. i was constantly exhausted. my family life suffered. and coworkers were dropping dead regularly. i made a tough decision to give up the job and the pension. turned out to be the right one. doctor said i was well on my way to a heart attack. now im getting my health back and feeling way better over all.
i should add: i flew longhaul acmi for YEARS before this with no issues. the days were long but i got a few days of rest in between flights- lots of recovery time. it was the fixed schedule that soured the whole thing. 12 hr flight, 8hrs sleep, 16 awake, and right as you are ready to pass out its time to go another 12 hours. thats the stuff that kills you.
TellmSteveDave@reddit
Pretty sure I was more fatigued flying short haul.
Typically I bid for late night departures as the bunkie (to avoid traffic). I show up for work, and e tak off, I got to sleep. Yeah I’m awake later than I normally am, sleep quality varies and I get to sleep less, but on the layover I sleep HARD. Usually 10+ hours. Same on the return leg.
RaiseTheDed@reddit
As an ACMI long haul cargo, I'm not actually too fatigued most of the time. We usually fly at night, and night time in Asia is my day time, so works fairly well. And our overnights are rarely short. Sure I will get flights that go through my home sleep period, but because there's 3-4 crew, I'm able to sleep on the airplane quite well. Some can't sleep in the airplane well at all.
I got more fatigued doing regional min rest (10 hours) 4 day trips actually.
SurpriseGeneral8618@reddit
I have a friend who flies the 747 now. He is managing it well by trying to keep the body clock as stable as possible. But even after that, when you have to wake up at 2 AM (your home time zone) in a different part of the world where it is evening, and then fly back to home where it evening when you land, life can get tiring.
IllPlatform4801@reddit
I never need a recovery day. Living in base helps immensely so I’m never really home late. I just go to bed early and I’m fine the next day.
MyPilotInterview@reddit
I don’t think fatigue on days off is a big deal. I hear more long haul pilots complaining about being 2 pilots, landing at JFK at 3am their time, for the second time in 18 months, with bad weather, and short tempered controllers who expect everyone know all the non-published information that comes with flying in there weekly for the past 10 years.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Hello everyone! I know I post quite a lot on this forum, but I’m very curious and your answers help me a lot.
I’ve been wondering about fatigue related to long-haul flying for pilots. How tired are you, both during rotations and in everyday life? Given that these flights almost always involve shifting or “sacrificing” a night of sleep (relative to your home base time), how do you manage this, especially as you get older?
On your days off, are you mostly recovering, or do you have enough energy to live a normal life? Over time, do you feel any long-term effects of long-haul flying on your overall health? Do you feel like you age faster compared to people of the same age with a more regular lifestyle?
Finally, for those who have moved from short/medium-haul to long-haul, would you make the same choice again today, or do you have any regrets?
Thank you very much for your answers and feedback!
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