The Iran War Could Collapse the United States in the Next Six Months
Posted by Opposite-Mountain255@reddit | collapse | View on Reddit | 415 comments
Posted by Opposite-Mountain255@reddit | collapse | View on Reddit | 415 comments
dontrackonme@reddit
with a stroke of the auto pen trump can declare that ethanol for gasoline dilution is “woke” and there would be a large volume of corn available to feed livestock and make our favorite flavor of high fructose corn syrup. Our twinkie and candy diets will be maintained
brainmydamage@reddit
The Epstein class doesn't care. When will you people get it?
sns_2017@reddit
And they rule the world! That knowledge should be enough for a revolution everywhere.
Funktownajin@reddit
I don’t really get why the author quotes a Nobel prize winning economist who is saying that it is the poorest countries that are going to be hit hardest with food shortages and then pivots to saying actually it is America is going to collapse. Then he uses the example of the Arab spring and food prices when those were all much, much poorer countries.
America produces a lot of food, and it has domestic sources of fertilizer of all types, including urea. Africa on the other hand is in huge trouble, most of their urea comes from the gulf states and many countries there are already food insecure. Food insecure people in America arent food insecure in the same way someone in Sudan is. I’ve lived in both places and that’s just absurd.
The article just isnt very well thought out. If food rises as much as he says in the next six months, 20% (very unlikely), America won’t collapse. People will still eat. Food banks will still exist. Rice and beans will still be affordable to practically anyone. The only thing I can see really collapsing America would be a civil war, sudden climate catastrophe or the grid plunging into darkness from cyber attacks or emp.
MoonlitInstrumental@reddit
the breadbasket of the west coast is out of water. you probably read all the articles posted here about it this past week
Funktownajin@reddit
A large amount of the stuff posted here is hyperbolic and substitutes for actual research and factual evidence, and I’ve been reading articles here since like 2010.
SemperMementoMori@reddit
Oh grow up, even Fox News is talking about the almost non-existent snowpack and here you are being a denialist, goofball stuff https://www.cnn.com/2026/03/25/weather/west-snowpack-melt-heat-wave-climate
Funktownajin@reddit
What am I denying?
Theres no water = textbook hyperbole. It’s literal hyperbole, do you know what that means?
California is well above average precipitation for 2026。look it up I’ve linked it below. I’ve lived here for 15 years. This isn’t a drought year at all compared to what I’ve seen. It’s way too hot and the lack of snowpack could lead to a bad fire season, but crops will have water to grow.
Nobody is starving this year because California has no water, stop spewing garbage. You can insult me personally but like I said most of the stuff here is hyperbole and comments like hours show how lacking people are in actual scientific knowedge and just read the media without understanding what’s actually at threat.
https://ggweather.com/seasonal_rain.htm
SemperMementoMori@reddit
Take it easy, bud, it's only the end of the world.
Funktownajin@reddit
Sorry, I just get bothered by the stupid things people say.
Popular_Dirt_1154@reddit
Proved them wrong then they moved the goalposts, happens a lot here, among doom prophets hoping to predict the future. They always look like fools, making hundreds of predications waiting for the day that one is right.
VCETJ@reddit
Honestly Reddit in a nutshell
ItsEntirelyPosssible@reddit
Pretty funny.
Have a look at the Colorado snow monitor. That's where southern California's water comes from. Yeah all hyperbole. Yet you apparently know jack shit about how California grows food and how the water it uses comes from the upper basin states which have been in drought since 2001 and are now in megadrought. The Colorado River system feeds so many million people and yet its past the brink of collapsing.
Yup nothing bad is happening.
StrawsAreGay@reddit
What about the fertilizer shortage?
Alzakex@reddit
That one is not going to be a problem for the US. At least not until the huge refugee crisis it causes. South/Central America isn't as dependent on Middle Eastern urea as Africa and Asia, but they rely on it enough that we are going to be seeing a lot more attempts by starving people to enter the US in the next few years.
But in the US, we make plenty of our own fertilizer. The only potential issue we could run into would be if prices overseas rose to a point where it would be significantly more profitable for domestic fertilizer producers to sell to the east than keep their products in the west. I can't imagine the producers being quite that short-sighted, though.
Oh, wait. I forgot how capitalism works for a second there. Yeah, we're cooked.
AstarteOfCaelius@reddit
Part of what gets to me about this tendency towards hyperbole is…well, if you look, they are also discussing Yarvin and the Technocrats: but apparently not reading the part of things where people losing their shit and crime are a fairly common tool.
I mean I do realize that hyperbole is the common vernacular and has been for a while, but it’s been a quietly corrosive practice just as long. Of course, that doesn’t mean anyone else is to blame when (typically younger adults) lose it and commit acts of violence because they don’t think anything matters, but it’s happening in enough increasing frequency that people could take some freaking responsibility for the way they express themselves and knock it off.
Beyond that, if it’s just not factual, it’s not factual- but if you’ve ever had to have a really tough conversation with a kid who has been seeing this stuff, you realize that how we discuss things matters a great deal. I’m definitely not glossing any of the bad things over- but my god, it would be great if people stopped passively contributing to this one.
Pootle001@reddit
Don't come round here waving your facts around while we're enjoying ourselves.
artisanrox@reddit
Whelp.
This is exactly why the US will collapse. Thanks for posting Exhibit A.
ItsEntirelyPosssible@reddit
Buddy. There aint no fucking water. We are in the worst drought of record in the high Rockies. Thats where southern California gets its water from. That's where a huge portion or American food comes from.
Funktownajin@reddit
I don’t think you know what hyperbole is. It’s exaggeration.
There is no water - hyperbole
There is xxxx gallons of water, xx% of normal - not hyperbole.
ItsEntirelyPosssible@reddit
Lol ok. Sure there is 1% of the water that typically comes down the river but everything is fine disphit.
collapse-ModTeam@reddit
Rule 1: In addition to enforcing Reddit's content policy, we will also remove comments and content that is abusive or predatory in nature. You may attack each other's ideas, not each other.
Funktownajin@reddit
There is 1%.
Another hyperbolic, totally made up number because you don’t know what you’re talking about.
ItsEntirelyPosssible@reddit
Well thats two of us.
J-A-S-08@reddit
It's possible they're not talking about California? Oregon, Washington and Idaho's wheat growing regions are very dry or in drought conditions now.
Funktownajin@reddit
I don’t think so, I think they just read more into headlines than they should.
unknownpoltroon@reddit
Remindme! 8 months
OkayMeowSnozzberries@reddit
What I don't understand is, according to a nyt article, the US uses a minor percentage of the petroleum that comes from the middle east. Sure, it's a global economy, but the US is far less vulnerable than a large number of other countries. I can only imagine things escalating and the us will not suffer nearly as badly as others will. Which is what will drag this into a much wider conflict and a probably a global recession. Buckle up.
loralailoralai@reddit
Yeah you’re less vulnerable which is lovely- your idiot in chief is trashing everyone else’s economy more than yours. So thanks for that.
If you think the rest of the world going down the toilet will not drag you with it tho? You aren’t very smart
MyCuntSmellsLikeHam@reddit
OPEC is what makes the US dollar the global reserve currency. That’s the “petro-dollar. We make every country in the world trade in dollars with a gun to their head, and it controls the price oil globally. If that goes away so does our easy life and all of the US’s leverage for sanctions. We can’t just make it cheaper without ruining everything.
Reluctant_Firestorm@reddit
US national debt per person is $114,000, and rising dramatically under Republican leadership. That system of debt-financing in the US cannot continue without the petro-dollar.
Japan, which as a similar per-capital debt burden, is very close to a debt crisis, where the country can no longer service its debt without severe austerity measures. The only reason we don't see these pressures yet in the US is the petro dollar and the global trade in US dollars.
theycallmecliff@reddit
Petrodollar creates international demand for USD.
US consumer spending on manufactured imports creates the supply.
However, I think it's a mistake to underestimate that China and even the EU are dependent on export in a way that would make it difficult for them to step into the role currently occupied by the US.
Even if the petrodollar went away, these places would be looking for export markets for their goods.
They could encourage consumer debt the same way the US has for its citizens but then they would be no better off than the US as a buyer.
I would argue they would probably be worse off due to the cultural habituation unique to American consumer culture.
The ideological primacy of capitalism and individualism in the US populace are firmly rooted.
EU nations have a primarily ethnic basis for their identity. They're fairly capitalist but not to the extent that they view this as more a part of their national character than the historic, ethnic basis.
China has an ideological basis that is fairly incompatible with the required public attitude. This doesn't preclude their ability to get to a place where they can mobilize that attitude through propaganda, it just makes the job much harder than the culture the US has at its disposal.
And China would have a harder time dealing with the household debt. Belt and road structure could potentially create the framework. But unbearable levels of household debt are less easily absorbed by a one-party state because there is no internal other to point the finger at.
I think the Petrodollar is incredibly important and is certainly a huge factor in US actions right now. But I don't think the US is completely out of the game without it.
stasi_a@reddit
How much does this administration pay you?
theycallmecliff@reddit
I doubt either major party in the US would want to employ me in any role that's politically relevant.
Do you have specific problems with my analysis? I'm open to learning if you think what I'm saying is biased in some way.
kokirikorok@reddit
So it’s a house of cards…
theycallmecliff@reddit
That's been shifting anyway; more and more global oil trade has been happening in alternative currencies.
I think the Trump admin is hoping to hurt others more than they hurt the US. If the US remains comparably strong because most places take a plunge but the US still has food security and consumer markets, then that gives them leverage to establish a new balance of trade.
But it's obviously a very risky strategy.
StrawsAreGay@reddit
With what fertilizer?
theycallmecliff@reddit
To my knowledge, production is primarily domestic.
Largest international sources look to be Canada and Russia.
https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/fertilizers/reporter/usa
Freud-Network@reddit
One of the reasons Iran is being attacked is that they dared to do business in the petroyuan.
Singnedupforthis@reddit
We force them to pay in PD in exchange for security. How is that deal working out?
RollinThundaga@reddit
The US produces enough oil to feed itself, hypithetically.
The reason so much is imported is because the US has the best refining infrastructure, and can process the trickier grades of oil that are produced abroad. Meanwhile it produces grades which are easier to process, and exports those grades to countries with less capable refining infrastructure, making use of comparative advantage.
So even if the situation became Fortress America, it would just take the retooling of the refineries for the US to be oil independent.
OkayMeowSnozzberries@reddit
And this is what I don't understand about these narratives that the US is going to collapse, clearly we are at an advantage to most other countries. I certainly don't support this war, but I'm confused by the narratives around it.
Imusthavebeendrunk@reddit
It gets clicks
Singnedupforthis@reddit
The US imports from Canada. If the price of oil goes up elsewhere, Canada can ship their oil there. The US is not self contained. The US is worse off than mosy countries because the per capita oil consumption is 4 times the global average. The US has built itself around absurd amounts of motor vehicle dependency and it is why the US can be bullied by Iran.
Singnedupforthis@reddit
This is a lie. The US is dependent on millions of gallons of imported crude per day to meet it's gasoline demand.
RollinThundaga@reddit
We were at a net surplus as of last year
Singnedupforthis@reddit
Nope https://www.reddit.com/r/oil/comments/1rqh6og/does_the_us_produce_more_crude_oil_than_it/
RollinThundaga@reddit
You're citing your own post as your source and the comments there are raking you over for being wrong.
Singnedupforthis@reddit
No, they are saying the same as you are, and they are clearly wrong. The US does not produce the 20+mbpd that you are saying they do. The US produces 13.5mbpd of crude oil, yes or no?
RollinThundaga@reddit
It's not me saying 20+mbpd, its the Energy Information Administration saying as much.
Singnedupforthis@reddit
An average of 13.4 million barrels per day (b/d) of crude oil was produced in the United States during August 2024, a new record according to data from our Petroleum Supply Monthly. More crude oil was produced in the United States during August 2024 than during December 2023, when the previous monthly record of 13.3 million b/d was set. nope
youcantexterminateme@reddit
means that american oil can be sold at higher prices. they know they have a limited time to do it before its obsolete so if they can stop production in other oil countries for 5 years or so they got a big advantage
loralailoralai@reddit
Well no American would bother reading it if it said Africans are going to starve. Or for that matter anyone but Americans.
Because that’s all Americans care about
Worried-Barnacle-306@reddit
I actually laughed when I read the title. Like, yeah, America will collapse, but what about other countries that aren't involved in this war? Countries with much LESS resources than the U.S.?
Gas and food prices have fucking soared where I live. Bus fares are insane. Our oil reserves are only good for a month or so. What will happen to us after that?
I know Americans didn't ask for this war. But neither did we.
artisanrox@reddit
Because an enormous percentage of the US population doesn't think anything is real but will get out every long gun in thier closet if they have to wear a medical mask or can't go eat at TGIFriday's.
Spolied, stupid, and completely unready to deal with what they've put in motion in 2024.
BassoeG@reddit
America produces food, using oil-based fertilizers and oil-fueled equipment, and transports it to American cities hundreds of miles from the farms using oil-fueled trucks. An oil shortage is de facto a food shortage.
Joe_Exotics_Jacket@reddit
Agreed. They even point out:
“…The International Monetary Fund found no significant effects on democratic institutions in wealthy nations when food prices spiked.¹⁸ That finding has been cited as reassurance. It shouldn’t be. It described a pattern of government behavior, not a geographical fact.”
So no rich democratic countries have fallen apart due to food prices in recent history, and the U.S. with its vast wealth and agricultural land will be first due to reasons?
Thick-Ad5738@reddit
Dear sweet child. The US is no longer a democratic country. Even fucking Peru has a more functional democracy
UnluckyWriting@reddit
Do you read what came next in the article? It attributes the lack of collapse in those countries to a government that provides food assistance. The US just cut food assistance and no longer even tracks food insecurity. The point of the piece is that food prices will go up and the US government doesn’t give a fuck if it’s people are suffering. Idk if it means full scale collapse but it’s certainly fair to say that can cause widespread instability.
Middle and low income Americans have been making do with fewer and fewer circuses. What’s going to happen when we have to make do with 20% less bread too?
Thick-Ad5738@reddit
The US working class is barely surviving. You have a government that thinks helping people not dying of hunger is "communism". You will have food, and gas, but millions of you will not be able to afford it.
You do not need to reach the levels of Sudan to have the unraveling of a functional society.
Haveyounodecorum@reddit
Agreed. All valid points in this article were undermined by a rush to sensationalism.
Agreeable_Ocelot@reddit
It’s a classic upvote just for the title Reddit piece.
nickiter@reddit
There's a reason the New York Times cooking section is obsessed with beans. Just gonna get even more obsessed.
EastTyne1191@reddit
One issue of note is the lack of supportive infrastructure that is supposed to mitigate food and housing issues for people who are struggling. I work the public and see firsthand how much people are struggling. A family whose car doesn't work, with no ability to rent a car or walk because they live in a rural area. Had a kid who had only eaten a few crackers in the past two days. Another kid who routinely gives his sister his lunch and asks if I have any fruit or granola bars. Parents who are stressed and unable to make ends meet.
I've had to call shelters and food banks and they are even more underfunded and stretched thin.
And it's hard to get a read on the situation as a whole when the agencies responsible for gathering data and reporting it are gutted.
dingalinglans@reddit
Isn't that what the Epstein class want? It was pretty much admitted to in the files.
Collapse everything, buy it all, establish technobro loservilles everywhere.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
IMO, the working class should throw a wrench into their plans, rise up, and eat them first. Go after the source of the problems: the billionaires and hundred-millionaires who are pulling the strings. But that would require a lot of courage, organization, and bold action that so far, there doesn't seem to be widespread support for. Maybe full-on collapse and widespread suffering will open enough people's minds to some out-of-the-box thinking.
springcypripedium@reddit
We saw signs of the working class rising up yesterday, with millions taking to the streets and planning the next level of action which is necessary for change.
Most of the protests that I saw were human centered. Some protests had a tiny nod to the environment (and I watched many, participated in one)---- but not enough.
We can't exist without healthy, diverse ecosystems. Tragically, environmental issues usually take a back seat when they should always be at the forefront of everything we do. And yes, I know, the billionaires couldn't care less about healthy ecosystems. They have ratcheted up raping and pillaging of the earth to levels that are mind blowing. Orange, demented, narcissist declared environmentalists as terrorists.
"Maybe full-on collapse and widespread suffering will open enough people's minds to some out-of-the-box thinking."
I might, just might believe that is possible IF we did not have 8.3 billion people on a planet whose biodiversity is collapsing and if we were not so damn anthropocentric.
Co2 levels were at 431.95 ppm yesterday (Mauna Loa Observatory, Hawaii (NOAA), up from 426.9 ppm last year.
A blue ocean event is imminent. It is a matter of when, not if. Some feel it is likely this summer/fall. A super El Niño is possible this year along with the potential of WW3 and the fact that Earth’s energy imbalance, the gap between heat absorbed and heat released, is the highest on record and the jet stream is broken.
These are monumental, existential crises and if they occur simultaneously could lead to survival instincts kicking in superseding time/energy for out of the box thinking (imo). If these things occur all at once and lead to full-on collapse I just don't see a way to recover. That time has passed---it passed a long, long time ago.
I hope I'm wrong.
I just want to add one more thing. I am not convinced (far from it!) that a critical mass of people are capable of thinking/behaving that is not anthropocentric. Anthropocentrism, I believe, is one of the key causes of the extinction event we are now immersed in----extinctions caused by humans. In the box thinking continues to be based on human exceptionalism. Can we get out of that box?
Humans are not immune to extinction. We need biodiversity to survive. How many people understand this?? How many people even know what biodiversity means? Or the importance of healthy ecosystems? Or even know where their water comes from or where their waste goes?
Good article on anthropocentrism and its consequences:
https://shunwaste.com/article/how-does-anthropocentrism-affect-the-environment
For those who don't know about a blue ocean event:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/the-blue-ocean-event-the-1-climate-tipping-point-no-one-is-prepared-for/ar-AA1SFlHF
For those who missed the recent report on earth's energy imbalance:
https://insideclimatenews.org/news/23032026/wmo-report-highlights-global-emergency/
Scientists are still debating if we are in the sixth extinction. It may be a matter of semantics----it sure seems like we are. https://www.sciencenewstoday.org/the-6th-mass-extinction-are-we-currently-living-through-it
LoCal2477@reddit
Thank you AI
simulation07@reddit
Thanks. I agree with this theory.
freesoloc2c@reddit
The Democratic party is way better environmentaly, obviously. Unfortunately that message is being lost on a super minority who make noise about fringe, far left issues. The rampant fraud and completely ineffective and corrupt blue states are creating an exodus because of how bad it is. Without serious change from the left they may be very much a minority for the foreseeable future. You on the left please make noise about this. If the left put forward honest politicians that really were of, for and by the people who pay taxes then they'd never lose again.
Konradleijon@reddit
Yes we need Les people
DarylInDurham@reddit
That's why Luigi's alleged killing of that Epstein class scumbag scared the shit out of them. That's the only thing they fear; all these "No Kings" protests are nothing more than a minor distraction.
LoCal2477@reddit
That murderer is from a multimillionaire family from Maryland that makes their money from healthcare. So it’s an Epstein class kid killing someone from the same class not someone to worship or praise
Ferovore@reddit
material conditions need to be a lot worse before people will organise first.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Those conditions are on their way. 2026 is shaping up to be a perfect storm of shit hitting the fan. If you thought that inflation was bad during COVID, or in the years since, just wait until this summer.
Wise-Childhood-145@reddit
I hope you're right.
Wise-Childhood-145@reddit
Exactly. People have gotten comfortable not owning anything and putting everything on credit cards while being distracted with their daily tiktok and netflix.
emmc47@reddit
Yep.
upstatestruggler@reddit
Everyone thinks “well I can still buy food so I’m clearly doing something right and this will NEVER affect MEEEEE”
dingalinglans@reddit
These next few weeks are crucial, and personally I don't see any common sense or reason on the horizon from any of the protagonists. Worse times are ahead, that's for sure.
Wise-Childhood-145@reddit
Won't happen. The working class in America is too distracted and content with their tiktok and netflix while living on McDonald's and Taco Bell.
dingalinglans@reddit
I agree, I think one of the first things that people need to fully agree on is disengaging from the Social Media that they promote. They live for Ad revenue and killing that might make that area take notice at least. It's clear appealing to their humanity is not working, and that only their wallets are sensitive.
BetterEveryLeapYear@reddit
Their wallets are not sensitive. They have clearly shown that they're willing to sink billions into metaverse and AI with no gain in sight to control the future.
Here's where they are sensitive - we always knew it. Sorry for the NYP article but it gets the point.
https://nypost.com/2026/03/29/us-news/five-guys-ceo-paid-1-5m-staff-bonus-so-he-wouldnt-get-shot-like-brian-thompson/
Ragnarok314159@reddit
If everyone left META right now and stopped needed trinkets delivered via Amazon we would see a huge shift in a month.
Meta going bankrupt would cure so much of the world. It doesn’t bring any net positive.
exmuslimnfree@reddit
Hopium
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Can I add "copium" to your Hopium?
Unfadable1@reddit
You can. We call the concoction dopium, named for its double meaning.
filmguy36@reddit
Can I add opium? So we know what to take when things go south?
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
I don't know where to get it - nor do I know how to grow poppies, but whatever will get us through. :)
corporate-citizen@reddit
The entire edifice needs to go bankrupt.
valkyrie360@reddit
Are they too rich, already? Would it even have any profound effect?
Ragnarok314159@reddit
Line goes down, watch the rats abandon ship. It doesn’t take much.
Minimumtyp@reddit
Amazon makes most of their money from AWS now, the trinkets are a side hustle. It's basically impossible to boycott Amazon without boycotting the internet (but fuck it, maybe that's a good idea?)
PetuniaPicklePepper@reddit
How is it impossible? I deleted my accounts with them. Just don't buy from them or use affiliated companies.
Bormgans@reddit
Convincing a significant amount of their user base to do so, on a fairly short timeframe, is by all means impossible.
unseemly_turbidity@reddit
There's a decent chance that if you work, the company you work for uses AWS cloud computing services.
Minimumtyp@reddit
Depending on the source, somewhere between 30-40% of the internet uses AWS. You're on a website that uses AWS for storage right now.
PetuniaPicklePepper@reddit
Oh brother.
Ragnarok314159@reddit
It will still affect their bottom line, and with the “line must always go up”, people seem to forget how effective this would be.
gc3@reddit
Funny reading that on social media
ReyTeclado@reddit
I just said to a family member “I cant believe any parents let their kids use social media AT ALL!” they are doing absolutely nothing but hurting society. It is imperative that we all disconnect 100% from their services. Just turn it off! They are professional predators.
pvdfan@reddit
We are at this weird point where kids have to be monitored 24/7 "to be safe" (thanks 24/7 news) but at the same time, parents want the ability to ignore their kids 22 hours a day. So many kids, as soon as they can sit up, have a tablet put in front of them with zero monitoring besides what the sites themselves have.
jose_ole@reddit
Do you mean, seize the means of production?
democritusparadise@reddit
Lenin understood what needed to be done; you can't convince rot to just...not be rot.
Specialist_Ant116@reddit
Lenin who? Vladimir Lenin? If that's the case, can't even take you seriously if you consider communism the answer to anything, you are not taking a pill to cure you, you are taking pills just to prolong your inevitable death.
The result stays the same, one way or another, you die. Can't help but wonder why people can't come up with something original, gotta rely on ideas or concepts from 100 years ago. It's like religion at this point, we all know in today's age is not relevant or updated in any way, yet here we are 😂 This thread is full of delusional people for some reason, it's like you are stuck with the same narrative, you are either X or Y, never crossed your mind to be something different?
democritusparadise@reddit
Naw the other Lenin.
Also, ahem, I was specifically referring to what he realised he needed to do to an entrenched, die-hard establishment who would literally fight civil war and invite foreign armies in, in order to stop being oppressed.
Not necessarily to the economic system that came later, and certainly not to the totalitarian nightmare than Stalin instituted. I actually reject Marxism-Leninism as a governing philosophy, even in a best-case scenario.
See now, isn't it better to consider more carefully the words and context actually spoken rather than just make assumptions based on wild extrapolation in a misdirection?
Specialist_Ant116@reddit
Hmmm, fair enough. See, that's a healthy mentality, taking the good aspects. I'm sure many controversial people/leaders had more than one positive impacts between the hundreds that weren't.
_Laughing_Man@reddit
He even wrote a book on it!
mongooser@reddit
What production? What do we produce? All we do is buy and sell.
jose_ole@reddit
Medicine, energy. Profits.
Makeshift5@reddit
We rent and we serve. In other words, we exist for the benefits of the wealthy ruling class.
BerryLanky@reddit
Half of them voted for this administration. They won’t rise up.
WorkCentre5335@reddit
they might when theyre homeless & starving
Ragnarok314159@reddit
Nah, MAGA will blame cities, educated people, or two trans girls playing softball before rising up against their masters.
Specialist_Ant116@reddit
See, MAGA is not "the masters", not even the government is, which is where you fail to understand that nothing is changing without Trump. You honestly think he's the one in power? 😂
Let me ask you this, buddy, when there's a war or when they are in trouble and need more money, who do they call? Who's the one making you poor? Who is The Creature from Jekyll Island? How big is it? How many heads are there? Who made generational debt? Who's thriving in a controlled crisis? Who's creating inflation? Who's financing political campaigns? Those same campaigns that promise the average Joe a change for the better without raising taxes? How do they achieve that?
The Creature already extended worldwide, you have access to info, but it's still invisible to you, because it distracts you constantly with so many thing.
Follow the money trail, take 1 dollar bill and see who owns it really, it's written there, big and clear. The world has been built with those bills already, how you gonna take them down without taking the world down? Their signature is everywhere
Ragnarok314159@reddit
What’s incredible to me is you typed all this out. If I had similar thoughts it would require enhanced interrogation techniques for me to ever say this in public or even type it all out. If I was as completely braindead and void of intelligence as you, there is almost nothing other people could do to extract what you just wrote out of me. I would be so ashamed of how dysfunctional my brain operated, would hide it at all costs.
Yet you proudly type it all out, even add emojis to what you typed to further insult yourself. How did you get here?
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
They may be too physically ill to do anything, except sit and watch it burn.
simulation07@reddit
Son of a bitch - I’m in
Specialist_Ant116@reddit
You think you can just do that, don't you? I don't think you understand that the system is so heavily tied, that your reaction will probably send society to the stone age.
How do you plan to stop the Federal Reserve financing wars? Asking the same for the european equivalent, because if the Fed goes down, everything goes down, right?
How you pull them all out of the system without causing a total collapse? Because total collapse is sure to guarantee to remove them from power, because there won't be "power" anymore, just the wild west.
See, I don't think you guys really comprehend how economy works or who's pulling the strings. War never changes, if it's not Trump, it's Obama, if it's not that guy, gonna be somebody else lmao.
To understand where to strike your Jekyll Island creature, you need to first figure out how many heads there are, cut them all and try not to fk the world up while doing so, as far as I'm concerned, you are aiming for the tail 🤣
And how are you gonna explain to the average Joe how complex is this system if you don't understand it yourself? Short answer is you don't, you will never get enough people to agree, people can't even agree whether they are a man or a woman, hell.
ArrrrKnee@reddit
The thing is, people currently dont have the time to dedicate to such an organization. When you're barely making ends meet, every day is spent getting those ends to meet and recovering on your days off. Getting involved is a luxury of time.
But when prices go up and it becomes such that no matter the effort you still come up short, you're gonna see a lot of organization real quick.
Seriously_Unoriginal@reddit
100% this. AND
The privileged in our society don't get that "this time it's different" for more reasons than (but not to exclude) social media, corrupt media and AI. One gigantic thing that a lot of men don't realize is that the way revolutions were won in the past had to do with the fact that men had to work outside the home and women did not. So, because women are generally badass and will literally die for a better future for their kids, they could shift priorities behind the scenes and help the cause. Well, we couldn't have that, and especially not if men were expected to buy the cow when they could clearly get the milk for free. So about 50-60 years ago, a bunch of guys said "Quiet Piggies, you can work too! You won, you've come a long way, baby!" And they slowly stuffed their pockets, consolidated wealth, paid people half as much and hid it with inflation, until the 1% became the .0000000001%, the middle class disappeared and there are, like, 80 people on the planet controlling the other 8 billion.
I got no answers, but I'm stockpiling essentials because I think the shits going to hit the fan this summer when the suppliers quit eating the costs of tariffs, transport costs increase 300%, they can't get the goods to transport, people are unemployed and desperate, mid fiscal year pricing contracts are renegotiated, and people have gone six months without health insurance...there's probably a new virus going around that doctors can't diagnose. Well, it's going to make Friday the 13th, 2020 look like the good ole days.
Love, your friend, Cassandra
PS, hook up your land line again, withdraw some actual cash, buy extra jug water, dry goods and toilet paper... you'll never regret it!
jack_the_snek@reddit
I pray for it, that enough people wake up in time, but i'm not super hopeful and afraid, that most people will fall for their narratives and dog whistles and keep on blaming ANYone but the top %ers. That's literally why they invest so heavily in all those technologies that shape our opinions. I hope i'll be proven wrong!
madcoins@reddit
Unfortunately, usually the thing that sparks and sustains true and lasting revolution comes out of widespread suffering.
FlobiusHole@reddit
You’re underestimating the amount of people who actually want to be serfs.
whereisskywalker@reddit
Saint Luigi needs to call in reinforcements for real. It's the only way we get out of this.
stasi_a@reddit
LOL who betrayed him?
mac3687@reddit
I'm on your side but can you articulate this into tangible things that us "normal" people can do? Rising up and eating them means what exactly?
ArmedWithBars@reddit
It's very easy to preach this, but I don't think you grasp the ramifications. Rise up and kill the ruling class: Supply chains collapses (food, medicine, fuel), critical infrastructure goes down, economy collapses entirely, crime beyond skyrockets as police/military are overwhelmed, ect.
You need a medication to not die? Good luck, pharmacy ain't going to be around to fill it, they were looted a week ago. Live in a city/metropolitan area? Find a nice comfy place to starve to death at. Food is gone within a week at most and those shelves aren't being restocked, credit card processing went down and cash is basically worthless.
OH no let me get info on my favorite subreddit....oh wait the internet has been locked down and the rest of telecom is collapsing. Let's take bets on how long the lights stay on at this point.
We are talking 10s of millions of deaths, if not more in a modern day revolt. It's the total collapse of the United States. Do you know what happens in a power vacuum? The most violent and brutal make their way to the top and odds are of anything even makes it out the other side it will be a level of fascism you've never even dreamed of. Have you even actually studied the details of the French Revolution? The absolute terror and horrors that happened during it?
An American working class revolution is akin to glorified suicide.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
You've really built this up in your mind to be an unsolvable problem, huh?
No human on this planet is irreplaceable, especially not terrible, inhumane leaders who's defining traits are their bottomless greed and insatiable lust for power. Making the class war go hot, en masse, around the planet, is one of the smartest things that billions of the working class could do. Such a move would have its challenges and growing pains, but on the other side of it is a world where billions of people can prosper, not just a few thousand lecherous parasites at the very top.
But it doesn't matter what your or my opinion on this is. The wealthy have already cultivated conditions on this planet that will ensure more and more regular people come to hate them, and turn on them. It's only a matter of time, at this point.
ArmedWithBars@reddit
I'm sorry but I think our definitions of "challenges and growing pains" are completely different.
Might be because I work in supply chain management and I get to see how fragile the system is behind the curtain.
It's a pretty basic concept. Modern American society relies on fragile Just In Time supply chains to keep society afloat, owned and operated by the "billionaires/multi millionaires" that people want to eat. Without these intricate supply chains you wouldn't have massive cities and metropolitan areas.
Enjoy your road to utopian revolution in a complete technological blackout where you see your friends and family starve to death. If you are lucky you'll pass on before you have to live through the real horrors.
It's not the 1700s anymore, throwing a country into a revolution has far more ramifications in modern day. You are far too short sighted and can't see past "billionaires need to go". You aren't eating the rich, your are eating the foundation of modern society.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
LMAO the billionaires are "the foundations of modern society" like any other parasite is "integral to the health of the organism it feeds off of".
You seem to think that when the rich are disposed of, humanity will just lose all leadership, and no one will assume the role they provide. We will. Humans are very adaptable, and we'll always find leaders among us. What we need now, are a far better class of leaders.
There will always be an upper class in human civilization. But the particular types of people that currently occupy that role are monsters. They go too far. They are unrestrained, and all they want is endless wealth and power, and no checks or balances on them. The view other wealthy people as the only real people, and the remaining 99% of humanity is nothing but chattel to be used by them. What we need is to replace those people and the role they fill with more temperate folk, who understand the phrase, "We have enough."
We need greater checks and balances on the upper class, and limits on personal wealth. Transgressors need to brutally punished, to dissuade this problem from becoming as widespread as it is today. We need to get rid of the obscenely wealthy, amoral parasites currently making up the upper class, and replace them with leaders who invest in and are stewards of the actual backbone of civilization: the working class.
This vision for humanity is unlikely, but any country that comes close to achieving it will have the strongest economic, social, and political foundation that humans can attain. The closest we currently have is the social democracy as practiced in the Nordic model of Scandinavia. And it's no coincidence that those countries are the happiest, most prosperous nations for regular people, year-after-year.
The upper class cannot be trusted to police themselves, and make all the rules. When they are allowed to do so, they always trend towards corruption, criminality, and abuse of power at the expense of the majority. Always. This is the lesson that our modern world has to teach us.
ArmedWithBars@reddit
"They are leading us all to ruin".
Yes, so let's just cut out the middleman and throw us into a near instantaneous socioeconomical ruin.
So you even understand how a modern economy works? Do you grasp supply chains? Do you grasp the entire modern world is built upon the systems that the wealthy directly control?
What you think the local Chase bank is going to let you inside their branch to withdraw money after their top execs got dragged into the street and guillotined?
Oh yea I'm sure AWS is going to continue providing uninterrupted internet backbone services once their upper management got dragged out to line up and face a wall.
The realistic scenerio? A smaller percentage of the wealthy will get caught by the mob and killed. I'm sure that mob will be reasonable and orderly, making sure they only target specific individuals and don't start widespread chaos. After that comes a techno-dystopian fascist police state crashing in like you couldn't imagine. From their it will either be stomped out or the civil fabric of society will tear and take everything with it.
Your are a delusional idealist who hasn't read history further than a Wikipedia page. I implore you to read actual accounts of the French Revolution for a small glimpse into the future you want to conjure up.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Sounds like you can't even conceive of the world without Capitalism. The thing is, many of us long for it. We just want a system that works for everyone, not a fractional minority of ultra-rich sociopaths, at the top. This system has a fatal flaw that breeds inequality, poverty, and war. It's completely unsustainable.
Every problem you're describing, like the fragile supply chains, that's all by design as part of a system that prioritizes maximum profit above all else. Holding onto this dying system, no matter what, will end up destroying everything. Our species needs to find the courage to move on, if we expect to have any hope of long-term survival.
YerTime@reddit
Well, once a person has nothing to lose……..
SentientCrisis@reddit
I used to hear how men were protectors— but they sure don’t seem to be doing much of anything to defend our freedoms.
03263@reddit
Organization is the part that doesn't work. The federal government became experts at infiltrating and undermining all kinds of organizations during the cold war.
Alzakex@reddit
The Cold War ended 34 years ago. The federal government is going to be too busy trying to rig the midterm elections and deport/keep out all the climate refugees that are coming to infiltrate much of anything. Besides, hundreds of FBI and other federal agents have been fired or forced to resign in the past year. They have mostly been replaced by ICE goons and other inexperienced loyalists -- not what I would call experts at infiltration.
RandomBoomer@reddit
The expert parts of the Federal Government have all been fired or dismantled. So there's that silver lining.
2748seiceps@reddit
Organization is fine, the main problem is you end up with these massive protests and such but there is no uniform message and nobody can tell you what they want to see change. It's what killed Occupy and the same will happen with No Kings. It makes people feel good to participate but changes nothing.
Early-Coyote-9171@reddit
Agree the oligarchs have their marching orders that started with powell memo and continued with project 2025. Went to protest yesterday and thought we the people need a plan…3rd party workers party.
Postmeat2@reddit
They (the three letter agencies and the federal gov) couldn't stop a Russian asset being placed in the WH, how much stock do you really place in their competence these days?
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Good point. If it isn't the United States federal government monitoring us, I thought it was the technology class who is monitoring us.
fd1Jeff@reddit
I was gonna post something like this. We have all them profiled. We are being monitored constantly. The government another have all sorts of ways of infiltrating, misdirecting, you name it, to any sort of organization.
That doesn’t mean it don’t try, just that you can’t be naïve. And don’t forget, Epstein and so many others are dead.
najapi@reddit
That’s what they want you to think, organisation has worked to drive every revolution that’s ever happened.
TobiasWidower@reddit
I would argue the problem with the modern world pulling a French revolution is the fact of how decentralized everything is. If the citizens of California en masse go "fuck silicon Valley, fuck Zuckerberg and bezos eat the rich!" Then how fast do you wanna bet that east coast finance bros are gonna run to their uncles Hampton estates. Politicians you can go after one nation at a time, but the elite would just play "platinum refugee experience"
Go after individuals, and the power just gets divided and squabbled over by the remaining sharks. We need to think bigger. To quote Mr Torgue "Blow up the ocean" and dry up the system these elites rely on.
killtrevor@reddit
Then what
roywill2@reddit
Itsca lot easier to start a revolution than build the afterworld. Its always like in Animal Farm.
winston_obrien@reddit
Truly, the scary part is what happens after.
pm_social_cues@reddit
Haha! I look at the billionaire bootlickers (who are no billionaires themselves you can guarantee that) in my state acting like an income tax on people making over 500,000 a year is the worst violation of the (state) constitution of all time. They’ll defend the rich more than they defend themselves.
Rootsinsky@reddit
The guillotine was invented for a reason
exmuslimnfree@reddit
It's done... No need for hopium plz
upstatestruggler@reddit
We should but we never fucking will
ElephantContent8835@reddit
Once people start to get hungry they will rise up. History shows us that there is a point, but it’s still a ways off.
Uhh_JustADude@reddit
The fun times will come right as the rule of law is collapsing, but before starvation and despair set in.
here-i-am-now@reddit
Why do you think they’re investing so heavily into AI + robotics?
Masta0nion@reddit
The golden path?
mom_with_an_attitude@reddit
I can't explicitly say what I want to say on Reddit.
Let's just say that we could tip the balance of power away from the oligarchs and towards the people if second amendment rights were enacted in a strategic manner against elites in government and wealthy oligarchs. If we made a list with names and started picking key players off one by one, I'll bet things would start changing fast.
The US government no longer reflects the will of the people. Our government needs significant course correction. The oligarchs are not going to suddenly yield power gracefully. They are going to have to be persuaded in a forceful manner. They will not change course in response to peaceful protest.
Otherwise, the general enshittification continues. Wages remain stagnant while the cost of healthcare, housing and education increase. This has been going on for decades. They skim the profit off the top while we struggle on the bottom. This trend is ultimately unsustainable. There is going to be a tipping point.
Note to FBI: It won't be me. I don't even own a gun and I have no plans to acquire one.
Merfstick@reddit
I love how we've all dropped "Elites" from our vocab and replaced it with "Epstein Class". I always hated that phrase, and the shift is not only conceptually better, but that "E" rings just close enough phonetically to be a reminder of who and what they are and aren't.
Ghost_Of_Kyiv@reddit
All I read is "dropping elites" and I came.
dingalinglans@reddit
Spot on my friend, there is nothing elite about them.
stasi_a@reddit
Elite parasites for sure
BitchfulThinking@reddit
Excrement class is also fitting. They're toxins that need to be removed.
bi0hazard6@reddit
It reminds me of E-Corp, or Evil Corp in Mr Robot.
SvetlinaToYou@reddit
Yes!
winston_obrien@reddit
Or Doofenschmirtz Evil Incorporated
Minimumtyp@reddit
I agree. Elites sounds almost like a compliment.
ShortyRedux@reddit
Curious where this is said or alluded to in the Epstein files.
DonBoy30@reddit
I wouldn’t be surprised in the least if the this bizarre push for data centers all across the United States and this potential economic collapse due to the Iran war arent related. Collapse the economy, depress real estate, build data centers, and create some AI utopia for the wealthy and a dystopia for everyone else.
madcoins@reddit
I believe the government name is “techno feudal fiefdoms” but I like your term way better, I have to say
professor_jeffjeff@reddit
I'd better get my motorcycle all fixed up then. If we're heading towards Cyberpunk 2027 then I need to have a cool looking motorcycle.
sunflower_spirit@reddit
I fElon admitted this in a tweet in 2024
SentientCrisis@reddit
Collapsing everything basically turns everything into an economic opportunity. I hate it here.
pmxller@reddit
Just created a website for it with some animations you can all share with your families: https://us-iran-2026.lovable.app/
emmc47@reddit
Yeah. They havent exactly been inconspicuous about it to those with a shred of political knowledge.
miklayn@reddit
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
curiouscreeture@reddit
Omg I love hamilton
miklayn@reddit
You have to be joking. Please tell me you're joking.
curiouscreeture@reddit
I thought it was obvious lol
miklayn@reddit
I can never be sure anymore.
NGL I fucking hate Hamilton. It's maximally performative liberalism.
curiouscreeture@reddit
That’s so fair. And as for Hamilton - I honestly couldn’t even finish it. I don’t get the hype at all
MerryRain@reddit
Brother that document was written by a group of wealthy men who openly believed poor men's votes should never matter. They thought only rich folk could care about or understand the needs of the nation, so they rigged the system to ensure the "majority"'s vote had no meaningful power.
miklayn@reddit
Yep. And they were wrong. They failed to understand the principles they laid out.
They are also dead, long gone, and I couldn't care less about what they intended in their time.
We are here and now, and we can and should re-state those principles along with our own, for our purposes.
ClassicT4@reddit
There’s also the added benefit for them to use the war to justify canceling all future presidential elections.
DisastrousExchange90@reddit
👌Oh okay 😂 Just like it was reported that he would do in 2020 during Covid?? And look….He didn’t, never even suggested it and won’t again. But keep peddling this kind of stupidity 🤭
ClassicT4@reddit
The same reports that said he changed his mind last minute because he was told so many people would quit if he tried that it would make him look bad? He doesn’t have the same guardrails in place anymore.
Ttthhasdf@reddit
When you throw in the lack of snowpack in the US West and the coming water crisis, shit.
Pisces93@reddit
What if, we the people, decided their crypto and their dollars were no good? The dollar has value because we say it does.
Purplealegria@reddit
Exactly..but why is anyone the least bit surprised?….this has always been the plan.
That Dark Gothic Maga video on youtube, and the Yarvin butterfly revolution writings and his redpilled substack gave the game away years ago.
rebellion_ap@reddit
Fall off USSR 2.0. We even have our own Boris and they're actively saying they want to own everything
breinbanaan@reddit
Not sure if its Epstein or Russia. Probably same same but different
miklayn@reddit
Petrogarchs and schizofascists have no country.
rcm1201@reddit
lol it won’t collapse the United States in 6 months
Moist-Topic-370@reddit
No
Ok-Maybe-1247@reddit
Yeah but the Epstein distraction war is working know, just like fearless leader hoped it would. If American can afford to feed itself there’s less collective will to take down wealthy elite pedos like Trump and his ilk. So go team..,?
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
From a non-American perspective, fingers crossed that it does. I understand how uncaring and cruel that can seem, but Trump's America is a fascist threat to the entire world. German fascism plunged the world into chaos for six years, and Germany wasn't nearly as strong, militarily and economically, as modern-day America is.
So, for as long as America is marching to Trump's drum, ignoring international law and throwing their weight around to destabilize other countries, they are an existential threat to world peace. Fascist governments never get better, they only get worse, the longer they are in power. So, the least destructive path out of this mess, for every country that isn't America, is for the United States to collapse in on itself before it can hurt and kill millions of more people. It's best for the world that the majority of suffering to come remains within America's borders.
Hate to say it Yanks, but you made this bed, and now it looks like it's time to lay in it. Voting matters. And not making narcissistic pedo conmen who care about nothing but themselves, is really fucking important. Y'all weren't smart enough to get that memo, so now you're going to get a trial run of just how bad reality can get for you, when you make the wrong choice. Following fascists will destroy your country. I would have thought that lesson was clear after WW2, but it seems most Americans didn't learn that.
Fartknocker500@reddit
I would say most Americans didn’t choose this. Doesn’t really matter at this point, but we didn’t.
didureaditv2@reddit
It was the responsibility of most Americans to not allow it get to this point and failed.
A very basic democratic responsibility to me informed and vote.
A quite simple responsibility that is about 2000 years old.
This lack of responsibility should not be pushed to the side as not a serious one.
Most Americans are in fact responsible.
Fartknocker500@reddit
Ok, look. There are a lot of dumb people in this country, that’s plain enough to see. What isn’t so easy to see is that we’ve been going down this road for like the last 40 years….slowly but steadily.
Neoliberalism has been killing this country for decades, and other countries, too. It’s just easier to see our mess because it’s HUGE.
A lot of us have tried for a long time to push for change. Like, going to DC and talking to our elected representatives kind of pushing (just got off the plane from a week in DC doing just that on behalf of federal workers). It’s a mess, and it needs to stop. You’re right that it shouldn’t have gone this far and it’s likely going to get a lot worse before it gets better.
HommeMusical@reddit
So why don't Americans ever complain to "your" party, the Democrats?
The Democrats are even more neoliberal than the out-and-out Fascist Republicans and have managed to screw the pooch in election after election.
I suggested to people I knew that we occupy the DNC after the catastrophe 2016 election, demanding answers. The abuse I got was huge. "This is exactly the wrong moment." But there was never going to be a right moment.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/learned-helplessness
Fartknocker500@reddit
People like myself have complained about the Dems for well, a couple of decades now. Tried everything, but they are beholden to corporate greed/AIPAC, too. I also have the extra-added bonus of getting the crap beat out of me because I supported Bernie.
HommeMusical@reddit
Agree very much. I was in your shoes for a long time, most of 32 years, but eventually, rather than become a US citizen, I returned to Europe - my UK passport was becoming dodgy because of Brexit.
Now I'm a Dutch citizen living in a little town in France. Luckily we made a soft landing here just as writing computer programs stopped being a viable career, particularly from an old guy.
I still feel guilt in leaving. None of my friends in the US feel that way about me, but I do. But I tell myself that 32 years is too long to be in an abusive relationship.
(Oh, and Bernie was the only US politician I actually loved. My affection for Obama didn't last more than a few weeks after Obama's election.)
We don't live too far from Paris - if you're ever in France, drop in to Rouen and we'll wine and dine you! (Or beer you, or whatever you favorite is.)
Very best wishes
Fartknocker500@reddit
Don’t feel guilty, just happy you’ve escaped! We would do the same if it wasn’t for big responsibilities here, older parents who need us and would not do well picking up and leaving being the biggest one.
We have a daughter who married a Brit and is living in the UK and I am relieved that she is there. The UK has their own issues, but they don’t have an Orange Turd killing everything he touches (from human beings to our democracy) so I know she’s safe. The rest of us are here for whatever comes, and more and more it looks as if we’re in for a hell of a ride.
We have fought for decades and we’ll continue to fight against fascism and for basic human rights for all Americans, but especially for those who are marginalized. It’s a frightening time, but I decided a long time ago that talking the talk was one thing, walking the walk is another. We have to stand up for what’s right and decent. This country has a lot of work to do to be the place we can be proud of, and tbh I feel that now is the time to truly push for change. Not the fake “change” that politicians always run for office touting, but a grassroots movement of the people for the people. They’re tearing everything down, we will build it back only better than before.
Thank you for the kind invitation, maybe someday we’ll take you up on your offer. Who knows, maybe I’ll even have some stories to tell after this shitshow is over.
HommeMusical@reddit
Thank you for the kind words. It's nice to wake up to another concerned person.
My parents sadly both died when I was quite young. My father joked that at least we wouldn't have to take care them in their old age (I continue to appreciate that he kept his sense of humor, at least sometimes). But it left me free.
I keep wanting to call them up in the afterlife. I particularly want to tell my Dad, "Hey, all that French you spent so much time teaching me? I still have it, and moving to France saved my ass!!!"
We are so rooting for you here. The French people have always had a great deal of warmth and respect for America, and even though that is very tarnished, they know that there are a lot of decent people hurting really badly.
(And on a practical note, if the US dollar collapses, then I won't get social security and I'm pretty fucked! :-o But I am confident that France won't let us starve.)
pvdfan@reddit
We have been trying for over 30 years. Since Regan the Dems and Republicans have both moved widely right in unison at a fast rate. Clinton should have been a warning and Obama/Biden a red flag, but nope. All that matters to many voters is that their team wins and what the actual actions taken are ignored.
HommeMusical@reddit
How often do you contact the DNC or your representative, demanding radical change, or even just change?
pvdfan@reddit
Before COVID, weekly I would write at least one member of congress, state level office, or local level. In 15-ish years, exactly 4 gave a response that wasn't a glorified form letter written by the PR team. Some states have politicians that engage with the public more but not the ones I have had. It becomes a legitimate issue that in deep blue states, they know they can't lose once in office and in deep red states, they can't really do anything without the party votes. In turn, a lot (in all parties too) simply don't care once the campaign is over and until it's election time again in 2-6 years.
What happened in the 2016 Dems primary with the complete media blitz, on a local and national level, that Hillary had won months before the actual primaries took place due to Superdelegates pledging in mass to only voter for her turned off a lot of left voters. Hell, CNN was showing Hillary being up by over 600 delegates in the fall before the primaries and saying Bernie couldn't catch up due to "early losses" before vote one was cast. The message was clear that the DNC would never allow someone that wasn't a neoliberal to sniff the nomination and being okay with some basic civil rights was about the only bone they would throw us. 2020 and 2024 showed it wasn't a fluke either as neither Biden or Harris (don't even get me started on the 2024 disaster) would do anything to disrupt the free market system.
Obama gets praised as this leftist president and his "public benefit" monetary policies have been a complete disaster since day one. Obamacare was mandate to get PRIVATE insurance or having to pay a fucking tax penalty because you couldn't afford health care. After his term he defended it on Marc Maron's podcast as "we simply couldn't afford to lose the private industry jobs" when they should have became government jobs under single payer plan. His policy to completely nuke the affordable used car industry by destroying millions of working cars in the Cash for Clunkers bailout of the auto industry had zero plans to help low income Americans afford a car down the road. Locally cars with over 150,000 miles are routinely selling for 10k plus when in the past you could get them for 1000 or less. The bank bailouts did fuck all to help the average American and we are headed to the same housing crisis we had in 2008. Subprime loans started to become common again right before COVID (I remember getting an offer for one at 1.5%) and those same loans are now at over 7%. Florida was a key indicator of the collapse happening then and it's already starting now as Orlando is having a massive spike in mortgage defaults.
I can only speak for myself here, but all I want is a simple life where I can afford the basics while having a small vacation once or twice a year. I'm not asking for a 3000 foot McMansion in a $750 a month HOA, use DoorDash daily, or a 90k tricked out truck. It's completely out of reach with medical cost hitting me for over 18k a year after premiums and deducible (and that still doesn't cover everything) and car/living place insurance/taxes hitting 5k a year.
It's not a helplessness issue, the common American has been completely abandoned. Trump won the rural white vote because what he said was right, rural Americans were told to go fuck themselves by both political parties since the 80s (thanks NAFTA and deregulation). He didn't do a fucking thing to help either, in fact he made it much worse in term one, but he was the first candidate to really make that his rallying call. The DNC has made it very clear they will not help either and frankly don't care about the non-urban vote. Places that used to be nearly 80% Dems are now MAGA strongholds. I should know, I live in one where the every elected office was a Dem in the 90s and now it is straight republican.
Sorry for the long rant or if I came across in any way upset at your question. I've just watched entire parts of the country go from nice blue collar areas with almost zero homeless around to full welfare towns in a matter of 30 years. The jobs aren't coming back and AI is taking what few white collar jobs were left away. I don't have the solution but what we are doing right now is going to kill a lot of people if prices in general go much higher.
HommeMusical@reddit
Aw, man, my heart fscking breaks, and now I feel really bad for being mean.
If even 10% of Americans were like you, the world would be a very very different place.
My hat is off to you.
Sorry for the delay there, I wanted to read it in detail, and yes, I agree with every word. Clinton's embrace of neoliberalism lead not only to NAFTA but also the "reform" of the social safety net, and the metastasis of the incarceration state with the Three Strikes You're Out laws. The D's hit from the "left" - really the center right - and then the Rs slam you from the far right.
Bang on. I used to say that HRC's decision to ignore the midwestern states that lost her the election to repeatedly canvass California in order to win the utterly meaningless popular vote (which she did win), together with the "basket of deplorables" quip was the greatest unforced error in US political history. Used to, until 2024.
This is just heartbreaking.
And this is you and so many other people.
People just want A Life, nothing fancy. All most people want is to do regular, not very expensive things and stop worrying about money.
There was a very prosperous period in America starting with FDR and continuing until Reagan ended it where a lot of people could have these things, and people with non-heteronormative sexuality or non-European backgrounds made great strides, and the country started dealing with environment issues.
Dust in the wind.
To think that I could have removed one of these causes with a little planning with a window of a decade or more, when I lived in New York City in the 80s and 90s, and security was non-existent! Conceivably I'd have gotten away with it. But I would never have done it, even had I "known", because how can you know?
I hope things somehow improve. If you ever have some big cause, hit me up, or if you are ever in France, we're not far from Paris, we'll wine and dine you. (How we got here is a story in itself.)
pvdfan@reddit
Thank you for the kind words. This subreddit really has a civil and thoughtful population that weirdly gives me hope for humanity.
You mentioned the Midwest specifically and you are dead on. I had forgotten about the deplorables line and it really did serious damage in rural areas. Among people I knew growing up, 2016 lead to a large shift from voting for who they thought was the best to Republican only until they die. Biden's large investment to fix the nations crumbling infrastructure was a great first step in repairing the damage but it wasn't nearly enough to stop Trump in 2024. The damage could be repaired with 8-12 years of the Dems making large scale investments in rural areas but I'm not sure I see a pathway to having control that long.
HommeMusical@reddit
Well, there are still around two years, nine months and three weeks to go. Look how bad he has fucked things up in just a year. The scales might fall from people's eyes...
didureaditv2@reddit
I share your frustrations. We are tied to the boat of humanity and are tied to its fate.
We share in the apathy, foolishness or stupidity of the general public's decisions just as we share in its glory.
Fartknocker500@reddit
I’ve been screaming into the void for the past couple of decades. I saw this shit coming, but nobody would listen. It’s way beyond frustrating.
But you’re absolutely correct. We’re all on it.
ContessaChaos@reddit
We're all Cassandra.
dingalinglans@reddit
Hopefully it means that political education is improved then. That's my hope in all of this, that this is enough of a shock to every single tax paying individual, no matter where you are in the world, to stop voting against your fellow mans interests.
We're here because of greed and spite. And it's high time we all changed xxx
AngusScrimm---------@reddit
Greed came out to play in a very big way with the election of Reagan.
Ronald Reagan: The Father of Shithole America
RegionSilent9204@reddit
Last election a third of the country failed to vote against a fascist. A majority chose this willingly or by way of apathy.
Freud-Network@reddit
Most of the people in Jonestown didn't go there with the intent of mass suicide. You're along for the ride, at gunpoint.
HP7000@reddit
Do you know how democracy and voting works?
Yes, every American who could vote is responsible.
Fartknocker500@reddit
I’m not going to argue with someone who automatically starts with an insult.
Have a great night.
dingalinglans@reddit
There's no insult tho?
Minister_Garbitsch@reddit
As an American, or as I like to say a Californian, I 100% agree with every word.
If I could move outside the country I would. Currently working on Canadian birthright citizenship, my mother was from Quebec. Trying to get copies of her birth certificate, etc. Sadly, my parents were terrible with keeping records.
Living-Excuse1370@reddit
I agree. I also want the International Community especially Europe to actually publicly condemn the USA and Israel and impose sanctions. If any other fucking country was doing what they're doing the outcry would be huge.
HommeMusical@reddit
I fled the United States almost ten years ago because it seemed like the US wasn't doing anything to help itself. And it still isn't.
Now you want us to fix your messes. You want us to be the punching bag for your psychopathic dictator.
It isn't going to happen. Our leaders are wisely refusing direct conflict with the US while they set up an alternative system.
To be blunt, even Democrats were pretty contemptuous of the European system. Note how, for example, Obama refused to allow any consideration of how Europe did healthcare in the run-up to the limp and useless ACA.
And you passed a law, voted for by members of both parties, and never challenged, that allows you to invade Europe if we ever try to hold you accountable: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members%27_Protection_Act
Oh, and the UN is in serious financial difficulty, because "some of" their members are behind on their dues, most notably the USA.
So it isn't happening. Fix your own messes.
Purplealegria@reddit
We didn't choose this and we do not deserve this…They stole the elections…both 2016 and 2024.
The truth will come out one day.
HommeMusical@reddit
It depends on what you mean by "stolen".
Republicans have obsessively been using voter suppression for over three decades. Even though this has been brought to the Democrats' attention for over three decades, by people like Greg Palast (https://www.gregpalast.com/trump-lost-vote-suppression-won/).
Scholars who study voter suppression claim that without it, no Republican would have won in decades: https://cmarmitage.substack.com/p/the-long-coup-how-23-states-are-killing
For some reason the DNC has refused to act on this.
That said, in 2016, there's little if any evidence at all that votes were stolen or switched. HRC was the second least popular Presidential candidate since poll started; the most unpopular was Trump.
I used to think the 2016 election was the greatest unforced error in political history. But then came 2024.
The DNC covered up Biden's incapacity until it was far too late. But they had nominated a VP, not based on their electability or popularity, but based on their demographic. They even announced ahead of time that they were only considering women of color for the VP ticket, which as a far-left person enraged me, because it meant there was no possible way for me to claim that this VP candidate was chosen primarily on their own merits.
Harris had never won an election when she was pushed into the campaign. And she ran a mediocre campaign, as usual trying to appeal to the imaginary moderate Republican voter.
The fact that she came close to winning, and (I believe) there were a lot of stolen votes too, is no tribute to the DNC or Harris, but to how detested Donald Trump was.
With friends like the DNC, we don't need enemies. Until they are either completely reformed from within, or thrown away, America will continue to vacillate between center-right and far-far-right, and continue to collapse.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
I agree with your post.
orpheusoedipus@reddit
The bullshit your country has done to the world for a century was more than enough, you think this started with trump? He’s just the opening for the final act.
RegionSilent9204@reddit
They only stole it because the result was close enough that they could. Take the last election, how many didn't even bother to show up and vote against Trump? A third of the country. I'm afraid you very much do deserve it.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
All the western democracies should definitely impose sanctions on both America and Israel. The fallout from this war will be more destabilizing for the world than anything since WW2.
hippydipster@reddit
Sanctioning the US with like tariffs and such would move things further along in bad directions. It's astonishing how people keep reaching for solutions that fail, have proven to be failures over and over. Of course they do that because it makes themselves feel better.
Freud-Network@reddit
There is a huge amount of decoupling that has to happen to make it real. The G10 has to become the G9.
phaederus@reddit
Yeah, Germany who is a massive exporter of weapons to the US and Israel are toootally going to sanction them.
Don't be fooled, this isn't about the US and Israel. This is a total paradigm shift in the way diplomacy and international relations are going to be working the next 50 years or so.
The post war era of stable alliances, east vs west, and joint prosperity (at the cost of developing countries mind you) is over.
stasi_a@reddit
Democrats are exactly the same
HollywoodAndTerds@reddit
I get that, and I’m strapped into this infernal machine, but I really don’t think the average American is on board the same way the average German was for that whole reich. Yes, a significant portion is racist and hateful as fuck, but even amongst that group they are more invested in the day to day extravagances of having more than one paper towel to dry their hands than the glory of state expansion. The mood of our current wars is not the same beefcake ra ra as the early days of the “Global War on Terror”. Back then I literally saw people dressed head to toe in American Flags with matching head bandanas in the mall. We as a people didn’t have the stomach for protracted guerrilla wars against us since like, maybe the Philippine occupation?
Don’t get me wrong, I also hope for the collapse of our government, but like, I don’t really think that there’s much support or even propaganda in support of the recent “adventures” as it may seem. This is not a freedom fries mood.
The only people I’ve personally seen supporting the war are either homeless or hardcore Zionists, and I see a lot of people in my day to day. That said, I also hope it all falls apart. I’m at least in the pacific rim, and fully and with my whole heart, fuck the Midwest.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Oh, you're absolutely right. There isn't nearly as much buy-in for Trump's agenda as there was within Germany, for Hitler. And that's largely because Hitler was at least smart enough to understand that if you want to become a dictator and turn your country into a fascist empire, you have to take your time and spend some years delivering some wins for your people, before you start ruining their lives. Trump jumped right to the "ruining people's lives" part, pretty much from day one. As such, his support has been declining ever since he started his second term.
That's good news, because it means that the blowback to Trump's regime will be more extreme, and that's the best chance that Americans have at limiting the incoming pain. Now that you have a fascist government, it must fall. The sooner it does, and the more definitive you are with rooting out and destroying all the fascist elements, the quicker your country can recover, put the pieces back together, and start building a future worth living in.
So, if the collapse comes, I encourage the pro-democracy forces within America to show the fascists no mercy, and prosecute them to complete destruction. Anything less, and you'll just be encouraging copycats to try again, in the future. And the scariest part of that is, a future fascist president might actually be smart.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Personally, I would go beyond "showing the Fascists no mercy and prosecute them to complete destruction." I believe in scorched earth. Read "scorched earth" as you will.
I agree with HollywoodAndTerds "and fully with my whole heart, fuck the Midwest." And add that it's not just the Midwest, it's the south AND pockets of MAGA in my own state of NY who voted for this.
AngusScrimm---------@reddit
It's the old goddamn Confederacy. A large swath of the Midwest is the state of Illinois from 50 miles south of Chicago, through another 350 miles to Cairo Illinois. The Chicago area vote overwhelms the red neck portion of the state every single election. There are plenty of politicians down there who call for southern Illinois to become its own state--free of the Chicago area. If that ever happens, they'll be admitted to the Union as a slave state.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Is Illinois as divided as NY Is? NY is divided by the Upstate/Downstate jargon. I am not surprised though.
I really think there are several "blue states" who have MAGA pockets. My county in NYS has many MAGA pockets and I am roughly 75 miles NW of Manhattan. My town is firmly Republican, but I can't vouch about how MAGA those Republican Crony, Crony & Nepo residents are.
winston_obrien@reddit
This is absurd. As if “The Midwest” voted as a bloc for this. I can assure you there are many there who absolutely didn’t want this and I am certain there are many from near you who absolutely did want it. You are allowing yourself to fall to their divide and conquer strategy, and likely patting yourself on the back for being a ‘superior’ coastal elite.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Far from it. I am not a coastal elite - does that even exist? There are many who live near me who did not vote for this - and far more who did not vote at all. This is a USA all over problem.
winston_obrien@reddit
Well, as long as you think “Fuck the Midwest”, I will question your input, regardless of your place or position.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Okay.
Wulfkat@reddit
If we do manage to get to the other side, I want our prosecutors to slap both the RNC and the DNC with RICO violations and strip them of their property, freedom, and ability to run for office.
If we have to do it the other way, there are a lot of walls and blindfolds.
96-62@reddit
I'm not sure he has as much support from the people, but he has both houses of congress, the presidency, the supreme court and a majority of governorships. That's a lot of power still.
purple_sun_@reddit
Speaking as a European (not German) I don’t think the “average German” was fully supporting the reich movement. Most were trying to get along without being shot and managed to do that by ignoring what was going on. Sound familiar?
Hitler succeeded by scapegoating others while simultaneously praising so called innate German characteristics. It’s a heady mix, isn’t it and it takes insight and reflection to spot it. And bravery to stand up to it
Sarcastic-Potato@reddit
As an Austrian whose grandfather & his brothers were in the nazi military, while it's true that the majority of the country weren't hardcore nazi supporters, saying "most were trying not to get shot" is also misleading.
Hitler did have the support of a lot of people, however partially because not everyone knew of everything that was going on. A good comparison would be - right now, a lot of Americans would probably agree with the statement that criminal foreigners and illegal migrants should be deported, but they wouldn't support them getting killed in mass in a concentration camp. Hitler took advantage of a similar mentality regarding Jews, foreigners, minorities.. Etc. Most people at that time were in favor of policies against those groups because they thought it would help the internal security & economy - but most probably wouldn't have supported the full on concentration camps.
purple_sun_@reddit
Thank you for your input. The way Nazis ended up with extermination camps is tough to understand. I suspect it is a combination of people who come up with instructions being many times removed from the people who actually do it. Also the regime discovering it’s very expensive to keep people indefinitely in camps, especially while at war.
I’m sure you are correct that most people would never support mass murder, and in the 1940’s information was spread through word of mouth, newspapers and limited media. I still think that more people knew what was going on, or at least that communities were disappearing.
Shleepy1@reddit
This got me thinking about the movie ‘Zone of Interest’, which is very well done in depicting the cognitive dissonance and moral suppression of perpetrators living next to a camp.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
Fantastic film. Watch it with the documentary "The Commandant's Shadow."
Sarcastic-Potato@reddit
You also have to realize how powerful propaganda is. Watch an interview with Israeli settlers on how they talk about Palestinians, they don't even see them as human. Same with the Rohingya genocide in Myanmar. And it was similar back in nazi Germany. The people simply cared less what happened to Jews, Roma,.. Etc because they saw them as lesser, because that's what they have been taught.
And then some people were hardcore nazis, and those were the ones responsible for the death camps, they enjoyed doing that shit. Hell there was that one wife of an SS officer who made lamp shades out of the skin of inmates
purple_sun_@reddit
My god. I despair at the worst of humanity. I truly hope the brave outweigh the cruel
Few_Ad6516@reddit
The great depression was Hitler's greatest ally, plus the way German society was structure obstructed the vast majority of men from higher education and well paying jobs. In the absence of work, millions of young men were disenfranchised and happily signed up to the SA, know for well that it was an organization of thugs that promoted violence against political opponents and minorities.
hitthelow@reddit
The other thing was - the final solution plan, camps, & SS etc aside - Hitler made Germany a much more pleasant place to live for the average resident compared to what happened under Weimar in the 20’s with hyperinflation (which ironically Hitler was still part of as #2 to Hindenburg) - the economy and production became stronger which was really just for the war effort - but people were able to own things again, even including cars for the more wealthy - Hitler had a lot of public support even through the initial period of WW2 (I did this period as a chosen subject in HS)
jonathanfv@reddit
It's not only about the war tho. It's everything that have been preceding it for decades. Your country's rich have been cannibalizing it for ever. Some of your states have (or had, the numbers are probably dated now) an average IQ of like 89. That's shameful for the richest country of Earth to not have made sure everyone had everything they needed in order to access and benefit from a proper education. Even the fact that the war in Iraq still had a high approval rating says a lot on how dumb the American public is. And I know it's not their fault. It's a mix of indoctrination, and conditions created on purpose to create domestic consent for the Anerican empire. Most of you guys never figured out why some people in other countries dislike or even hate the US. How many of you questioned basic things, like why you're asked to recite the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools? When Trump ran for a 2nd time and people everywhere were worried about Project 2025, how many of you even knew about it? How many of you knew how close to fascism your country already was way before Trump? You had constant red scares, capitalist propaganda, ugly ass suburbs designed to exclude those who can't drive or imprison them inside, which by the way were started with the racist intentions to keep "inner city people out". You supported most of the world's dictatorships, you sided with fascists over and over again. All over the place, you had police forces that racially profiled people and occasionally shot them in the back. Your Republicans were clearly a lot more evil than the Democrats, but when it came down to it, the Democratic establishment sided with genociders.
So now you have a fully fascist regime - finally. The speed at which they're messing everything up is astounding, even for me, but it makes sense: they have no choice but to speedrun the fascism before they lose power. It's the only way they can maintain their power. Except that they won't, because fascists are insane, and these specific fascists are both insane and imbeciles, so they're speedrun the shit but self-destruct in the process. Of course most Americans aren't on board with that. But most of them didn't see it coming. The biggest crime of America wasn't that most people were pro-fascism (that's about 30% of people, and by the way, you might have wanted to do something about it a long time ago), it was that most people were uneducated and stupid. I almost wrote lazy as well, but I don't think that's the case, because they're being exploited and living from paycheck to paycheck, so I understand that they don't have time to do much better. But still! You're exploited, living from paycheck to paycheck, yet you tie yourself down more and more in that system of exploitation and don't try to figure out a way out of it? As a population, that makes you either idiots or cowards. Rest of the world is probably not much better, and a lot of us probably just got off easy because our governments still let us have time for ourselves. But not all of us. Personally, when I saw the boring, servile future I would have if I stayed where I was and did what I was expected to, I decided to bounce and test my chance. At least by myself some time before I get swallowed by the system. So I took a backpack, ditched everything, and became homeless until I found my way towards a future I found more interesting. And I'm down to do it again. I stole food when I needed. I survived sleeping outside at -20 without any winter gear. It was worth it. I know not everyone is able to do that, but it pisses me off to see an entire population of pushovers getting destroyed by the fascism they pushed abroad for decades, saying that they don't want the fascism now that it impacts them negatively, after having benefitted from a world order that was fascistic and ecologically devastating for so long. I know I probably sound pissed. I am pissed. And I'm also pissed at my own country. I don't even hate Americans. But I'm down with the cuddling, it's stupid. Lots of you guys don't deserve what's coming your way, but you also should've known better and for a long time.
starman-jack-43@reddit
I think the problem is less that the majority of Americans support Trump and more that its a split who see Trump less as a president and more as a Messiah, and a whole bunch of other people who seem to think that everything's still somewhat normal and that they're just got to hold on for another couple of years before the political norms reassert themselves.
Problem is, things ain't going back to normal. Trump's presidency has been an apocalypse in its literal sense - an unveiling of what's going on behind the scenes. A country can't ignore its own laws and expect those laws yo hold any weight in the future. A country can't make noises about invading allies and then expect to be trusted. If you go around bombing schools and hospitals, that's at least two generations of relatives who hate your guts with a passion.
Trump can say or do whatever he wants without any real consequences, apparently. Problem is, there are a lot of other people who, while they may believe that consequences are coming, they also think the blowback will be limited to Trump and his supporters. But remember all that talk of the end of history? Well, history doesn't end, the status quo doesn't last forever, and sometimes events bite us all in the ass really really hard.
Schwifftee@reddit
Most Americans aren't racist. Just dumb and self-centered.
Funneduck102@reddit
Yeah my fault for being born here I guess, sorry
superAK907@reddit
As an American, I hate to say it but you’re right. We deserve whatever we have coming. I truly, achingly hope we can reverse course this fall, or at least apply the brakes. Very very embarrassingly late, but better than not at all. If the midterms get stolen, it will then become time for measures I can’t talk about here.
HP7000@reddit
What brakes? Trump was democratically elected. This is what you wanted. Why would you stop what you voted for?
superAK907@reddit
You understand that even in healthy, fully functioning democracy, things will happen that many millions of people didn’t vote for.
This is pretty elementary
Damagedyouthhh@reddit
Stop acting as tho millions of people didnt also vote the other way. The US has an extremely vocal left upset about this & everyone pretends like they dont exist
lifelovers@reddit
Eh. Country states are over. It’s now the global billionaire class against the rest of us. They’re taking over the US very publicly right now. A war serves their purpose to destabilize common folk, cause more chaos and death, and increase anxiety and uncertainty so they can amass more stolen wealth while preparing their climate bunkers and building their close circle of loyal workers.
emmc47@reddit
Well said.
Fatboyneverchange@reddit
We spent almost a century in the U.S. public school system focusing almost exclusively on WW2. The problem is it was all propaganda, we didn't learn anything.
Cum_Quat@reddit
Most Americans don't support Trump. I know a lot of people didn't vote, and far too many did vote for the disgusting child rapist con man, but I know what you are saying and yeah, the current US needs to collapse. It's scary being here rn. I never thought in my life we would see this but here we go
JeffreeNommer@reddit
Do people outside not know about the election fraud? They claimed it first, yeah. It's been investigated. Musk and Elon aren't facing any penalties. The billionaires are running this entire continent. Well, and Israel, apparently. Didn't see that coming.
This is absolute bull shit. We are all holding out hope that the elections make a difference. Less violence is met with violence here. We don't want to give them a reason to cancel the elections. Trump is trying.
HommeMusical@reddit
Yes, we've known about it for over thirty years now. Neither of your parties has been at all interested in fixing it.
We thought you just liked it that way.
https://www.gregpalast.com/
calico134@reddit
Both political parties are bought and owned by the billionaires. They benefit from things being this way.
urlach3r@reddit
This is exactly the problem. We need a revolution, but the Traitor in Chief has his people everywhere. The moment things turn violent is the excuse he needs to declare martial law and cancel the elections. And so far, Congress & the Supreme Court are sitting back, letting him do whatever he wants. Fuckers even took a two week vacation.
Schapsouille@reddit
Well maybe it's time to resist and not wait for every excuse to do fuck all. Did you really think elections could get you out of fascism? Are you all really that dumb or is it cowardice to take action?
No matter. With the Houthis about to close the Bab al-Mandab strait, say bye bye to your fertilizers.
You thought you had it bad? Meet starvation. Should have risen up when you still had the opportunity.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
I don't think there was fraud, but at this point, even if there was, it doesn't matter. Trump and his regime aren't leaving without a fight, even if clearcut evidence of fraud was uncovered.
Whether America got to this point through apathy, poor judgment, or fraud, all that matters now is that it's in a deep fucking mess. Gotta get rid of Trump and his fascist regime, by any means necessary. The longer they are in power, the more America and the world will suffer.
I truly hope your country is able to course-correct after the midterms, but I highly doubt the system will save you; it's proven wholly unable to keep Trump in check, up until now. He's lawless, and he doesn't care about legal checks and balances. If Dems win the midterms in enough numbers to impeach and remove him, I foresee him just ignoring those efforts. You certainly have an uphill climb ahead, and unfortunately, I think the only way out will be either revolution or civil war. But I hope I'm wrong.
StrawsAreGay@reddit
Someone marry me bc I had nothing to do with this shit
Animal40160@reddit
I hate that you are right.
Spacecommander5@reddit
There is no force in the planet that could stop China and Russia if the US is collapsed. Not remotely. Not in soendng, manpower, etc. China gets Taiwan semiconductors and the whole world stops producing chips except China. They before the leading tech super power.
Don’t hope for what you just hoped for
Agreeable-Affect3800@reddit
It is to distract from the Epstein files. Seems the plan is to get back towards the stone age. At that point they will quit worrying about the diabolical scandals in the files.
So far the plan is working and Iran are having the last laugh
sailsaucy@reddit
The problem is, like a drowning person, we will grab hold of everyone we possibly can and drown them in an effort to save ourselves.
In a true dystopian, 'them or us world', the US would simply take whatever it wants from other countries. Just out of convenience, it would start with Canada and Mexico and then any other country that had something we needed would be on the table except China and Russia which would likely be doing the same thing around their countries. What country is going to fight back when its two or three largest cities are effectively... 'de-populated' through the use of chemical or biological weapons we certainly don't have? I mean... yeah... they may have lost like 5 million people but depending on the country, they could have 10's to 100's of millions more who they may not want to lose.
I'm already worried Donald is going to use the war with Iran to some how declare martial law and suspend the elections in November. This is damn near political suicide for the Republican party so he has to find some way to prevent "the blue wave" or whatever they like to call it in November.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Why do you think all the Western democracies are currently arming up? It's not to placate Trump. It's in preparation for the fight we see on the horizon.
tennezzee88@reddit
bringing up germany, lmaoooooo
981992@reddit
I didn't have anything to do with this but yeah I'm fucked lmao
Alarmed-Soup-5591@reddit
As a Yank, I agree.
Azteza@reddit
Just curious, what do you think the other powers that be will do if this does happen?
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Oh, the 21st century will firmly belong to China, now. Trump and his MAGA cronies have ensured that. Russia is too weak to make any major moves for the next decade, or more. They have exhausted their military strength in Ukraine, and their economy is on fumes. The US looks to be making the exact same mistake in Iran, destroying itself in an inconsequential, unnecessary war.
That will leave one superpower standing, that still has its military and economy intact. So, time to start learning mandarin and cantonese.
EnterTheShoggoth@reddit
Just Mandarin. The authoritarians in Beijing have been on a mission to eradicate the other dialects, especially Cantonese.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Thanks for the tip, that will save me some time.
No_Foundation16@reddit
Agree, it's going to happen.
reborndead@reddit
nothing. they see the US as evil and needs to eat itself. other powers like china will survive because of their philosophy to force sustainability
Schwifftee@reddit
I'm sure it made you feel great to type that.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Not at all. This is a fucking tragic situation. But America chose it. The world didn't. So when it comes to which people should suffer the lion's share of consequences, the answer is obvious.
Ezer_Pavle@reddit
Americans do not realize even how shared this sentiment is across the EU, for instance. Everybody might as well hate the clerofascit iranian regime, but you are truly the great Satan today. Not putin, not China, but you
tezmo666@reddit
Yeah for me it's long past the point that millions of Americans should have been marching to remove Trump for any one of his countless offences. At this point they're complicit, same with the democrats. For a country that loves to harp on about revolutions in their history, they won't take to the streets when it really matters.
Longjumping-Fig-2948@reddit
iran is holding a lot of cards. Is it possible that they could demand the unredacted Epstein files in exchange for opening the straight of Hormuz? Surely Trump would give them over to end the war.
futuriztic@reddit
Inshallah
heppyheppykat@reddit
Inshallah 🙏
Bluebird-National@reddit
We are in Satans Little Season of deception, Revelation 20:7. Yahuah is the true name to be saved by. All Re-Legions are pagan and put into place to deceive us. Call on the name Yahuah to be saved because time is short. The plan has always been to destroy the USA. No matter what happens, put your faith in Yahuah! He is separating the wheat from the chaff. Discernment comes from the spirit and the only way to have the spirit is through reading His word and relationship with Yahuah. Do not fear! The evil ones feed on our fear. Do not give them power. Isaiah 43:11 John 5:43. Yahusha is messiahs true name but saving comes from Yahuah alone.
icorrectotherpeople@reddit
Why does our food supply depend on the fucking Strait of Hormuz? What genius thought of that?
AgitatorsAnonymous@reddit
International trade. The economy built off of the Chicago School model necessitates a global economy. It's the reason the rest of the past administration's treated with Iran in a fairly reasonable manner. We can't produce enough of what we need to feed our people on our country, so we need to outsource for fertilizer. The entire lie of an entirely independent nation is dead and has been dead for a while. There are no significantly sized populations left that are fully self-sufficient. The closest is North Korea, and without their trade with China, they would fail too.
chefwindu@reddit
I greatly fear troops get deployed and get devastated and then as act of attempting to save face Trump will use two nukes. At fist he will say it was the Iranians. Then the story will be, "We'll we did it to Japan, look how that turned out". The Russia gets involved and drop two tactical nukes on Ukraine and then we are done as a species.
getridofwires@reddit
I hate to say it but I kind of think Trump would use a nuke to avoid losing power, and probably declare martial law at home.
Jcolebrand@reddit
He has repeatedly said he wants to do both of those things. I think the only thing preventing it is Marco Rubio
TheIrishWanderer@reddit
Don't threaten me with hopium.
Cptawesome23@reddit
It took Rome 1000 years to fall… and wouldn’t you know it, it’s STILL around today!
I think this subreddit fundamentally has no idea what collapse is.
Collapse takes a long time to end nations. It won’t be over night. It will be after many decades. It will be after parts of the country secede, millions of people will NOT die over night. It will be more like neighborhoods will just eventually board up, and the everyone will move closer to the coast. Just like what happened in the Wild West.
Frog_and_Toad@reddit
The British empire only took 50 years. As technology gets more advanced and interlinked, it happens much more quickly. America has now been collapsing since before 2000, when it lost its industrial base and started running on debt.
Cptawesome23@reddit
Man that is nonsense. When you say the British empire fell, are you talking about how the territories were returned to indigenous people? That’s not really economic or societal collapse, and some would argue it was an improvement.
Quercus408@reddit
Tell that to the Aztecs. Or the Olemecs, the Maya
Cptawesome23@reddit
Actually, I just took an ancient civilizations course and recently learned that the Mayan civilization did not disappear overnight as well. It’s more like, as the larger capital cities fell to either disease or lack of food, the people eventually just joined smaller populations in the outskirts, they didn’t all die, they just downgraded to huts from temples.
pegaunisusicorn@reddit
This isn't a monologue. This is a race to the bottom.
artearth@reddit
To add a small amount of nuance regarding the use of the word “grain” in that article: 99% of corn grown in the U.S. is not suitable for human consumption. The vast majority is used for ethanol and similar derivatives, as feed for confined animal operations (mostly cattle), and for sweeteners and other indirect food ingredients.
I’m just saying this because corn in a notoriously heavy feeder on nitrogen but the article conflates it somewhat with wheat, which requires about half the nitrogen, can still set seed (what we eat) with limited nitrogen (though yield and protein content would be greatly reduced), and which is almost entirely used for human consumption. We currently export 50% or more of our annual wheat crop, so the downstream effects would likely include a reduced crop plus a higher domestic market, meaning more starvation around the world.
And of course, all of the above messes up the economy in big ways, which is a massive problem. The U.S. can likely transition to be pretty self-sufficient in terms of basic calories though.
SignificantWear1310@reddit
Yes this!
trickortreat89@reddit
So be it. I know it sounds hard, but whatever it takes which can also cancel all plans to become the dominant oil producer of the world is good for us all in the long run.
Maybe we need to suffer now to be able to take the green transition more serious.
If we can finally get rid of fossil fuels once and for all we can stop the number one threat to human civilization - global warming. If we can stop all being dependent on global trade for our basic infrastructure and foo supplies, it can start looking hopeful for once.
If we can then keep production of virgin resources within the planetary limits it can even start looking GOOD for once.
It should be so clear. The road is right there.
lost_horizons@reddit
And for the topic at hand, regenerative farming. It is the superior method in that it is t built on chemical inputs from far away. You build soil which builds healthy crops. Stop the soil erosion, increase food nutrition, may even increase yields or at least buffer losses in major ways.
SignificantWear1310@reddit
Exactly. People are freaking out about fertilizer prices going up, and I’m over here feeding my worms…
krichuvisz@reddit
The road is right there since the limit of growth in 1972.
trickortreat89@reddit
Yeah it’s awful, I even think it’s awful that the rich people don’t realize they could even keep their wealth if they followed this path rather than the current.
Intelligent_Swan8284@reddit
"If you work in advertising - kill yourself! Youre waiting for a joke, a punchline...there is no punchline...if you are in advertising kill yourself now, you are the destroyer of all things good!".
Billy should have been offered thr job of supreme leader, even now i would trust him above corperate nonces
NiPaMo@reddit
Just in time for the midterms
dgmitch11@reddit
Nope! USA will be just fine, better than ever and the 46-year scourge of another islamist fascist terrorist regime will be no more. And by year-end there will be dancing in the streets of Havana.
Crazy_Beaver@reddit
I listen to financial news because they only care about money and don't do much politics. They are almost univesally happy with higher oil prices.
dgmitch11@reddit
No, yesterday you saw some paid “protesters” organized with $47 million from Alex Soros and friends, promoted by a corrupt media to herd all the gullible, uninformed sheep into the latest groupthink. And We the People are just thanking God that Trump is our President.
ElectronHick@reddit
Could we be so fortunate?
killonger@reddit
Wake me up when September ends.
HousesRoadsAvenues@reddit
March is almost over, so you have some more sleeping to do. :)
formallyhuman@reddit
🤞
Ill-Year-9506@reddit
I have been in the prepper space for 25 years. If I had a dollor for everytime someone said that the sky is falling and nothing happens.... I would be loaded. We got through Covid. Stop stressing yourself out.
Creepyfaction@reddit
The worst thing America did by showing it's hand (war) is that it exposes the limits of its own power. If Trump did not commit to another war, the American Empire probably could keep up the illusion of strength for another decade or two.
Girl_gamer__@reddit
Exactly, all of America's weaknesses are now on full display, and the other major powers are taking notice, and will work to exploit those in the future.
Unsual_Wash563@reddit
Arguably sooner rather than later too, why wouldn't they realise their goals while the Americans are preoccupied and low on ammo
Girl_gamer__@reddit
There is no indication that americas stocks won't get lower still. They are likely waiting it out until America is at its absolute weakest.
Unsual_Wash563@reddit
?? That's what I'm saying?
stasi_a@reddit
His idol Vlad taught him well
SavageThinker@reddit
Right, the power was a pure illusion. In reality, America was only able to decapitate the entire leadership of a country in a matter of hours, and then sink their entire navy in one day, and then establish complete air superiority the same day, and then when they tried to establish new leadership, America killed them too. And whether you're an Iranian billionaire or completely broke is now irrelevant because the currency is worth less than the paper it is printed on. But they still have enough fishing boats with bombs to harass ships and make gasoline 75¢ more expensive, so America is totally losing.
How weak do you think the American people are? Like they will plunge into collapse if prices inflate a little, yet the strong Iranian people (who already hated the irgc before the war) are going to rise up and win when they have faced an actual, honest to god, collapse.
Opposite-Mountain255@reddit (OP)
"Every single one of those numbers gets worse when grocery bills go up 15 percent. The family that was barely making rent stops making rent. The person carrying medical debt on a credit card to buy groceries now has less credit and higher prices. The underemployed worker who needed full-time work faces a labor market contracting under inflationary pressure. The crises don’t sit beside each other. They feed each other, all at once, with the same shock driving all of them simultaneously."
Konradleijon@reddit
The polycrisis
Opalescent_Moon@reddit
The best phrase I heard to describe this came from the TV show The Expanse: cascading failures. I hadn't heard that phrase explained before the episode describing how the Ganymede station failed. Each time something fails and falls onto a backup or redundant system, the higher the strain until that system collapses, too. We're going to see this with the climate crisis. And the climate crisis and economic crisis are going to amplify each other and speed up our collapse.
cecilmeyer@reddit
The Expanse is a libertarian dream come true.
SethQuantix@reddit
it does end with mostly nothing left so there's that.
Tearakan@reddit
Yep. Systemic collapse. More elaborate systems tend to be more resilient than simpler systems. However these very same more stable systems will fail far more catastrophically than simpler systems will.
Basically the more complex systems can cover up or reduce the impact of serious disruptions when compared to simpler systems.
But those simpler systems can bounce back much more rapidly when disruptions occur.
More complex systems will take much longer to collapse but once it does it collapses much harder than expected.
FantasticOutside7@reddit
The bigger they are the harder they fall…
Mastrovator@reddit
Welcome to the Churn.
Sharktopotopus_Prime@reddit
Goddamn that show is so good.
system_error_02@reddit
The books are even better
Mastrovator@reddit
Fully agree. That epilogue 😗👌
mooky1977@reddit
Float to the top or sink to the bottom.
Total_Oil_3719@reddit
Tantrum Spiral. One little mistake, conflict, gradually leads to a magnificently complex system becoming unfurled, because it no longer has the resources to maintain itself and all of the actors are eventually either crazy or left wit genuinely valid reasons to hate one another.
There's also "Catabolic Collapse", where a complex system can't maintain the energy requirements to sustain itself, and it begins the process of self cannibalism.
pippopozzato@reddit
Welcome to r/collapse .
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pinkfloyd078@reddit
The link to the merch shop and bumper sticker website in the “what to do about it” section killed me lol. Instagram infographic merch site influencer apocalypse
bloominggoldenrod@reddit
Here’s a revolutionary process that is being used in Vermont to create nitrogen rich fertilizer for local farms. This should be in every state.
https://richearthinstitute.org/
TurkeySammich42@reddit
Says the obvious shill account with his history hidden. Pass. Get new hobbies.
21plankton@reddit
So in the fall when the crops come in there will be less crops. More inflation. No telling when the market crashes how many folks will have been laid off by then. I doubt Donny and Pete went to war to lose it but I suspect they will, based on their performance so far.
The sub-stack article only focuses on food for the poor. I attended a couple of meetings at Second Harvest. As a result of the reduction of SNAP benefits the demand for charitable food has increased by 40% and donations have also increased as a result of a new CA law requiring recycling of good extra and waste food and from other sources that previously would have gone to landfills.
Who knows if the US will really protest about the current administration’s policies or what will precipitate unrest here and abroad from food shortages?
Even though the US and Israel started this war the impacts just of the disruption of oil and chemical byproducts and the closure of straits is an international crisis bound to affect regions of the world differently but profoundly.
Dave37@reddit
I can't wait that long! Hurry up! I've got shit to build in from the ashes of civilization!
TheArcticFox444@reddit
Civilizations collapse. Why should ours be any different?
unluckid21@reddit
Usually they collapse from a mixture of internal rot and external pressures. In this case, it's pure internal rot driving the collapse at breakneck speed. Quite fascinating from a historian's standpoint, terrifying if You're in it, and frankly confusing from the outside.
TheArcticFox444@reddit
I fear we won't be " outside" for long.
Alzakex@reddit
The external pressures are there, and as strong as ever, but more subtle. A significant portion of the internal rot is being influenced by external pressures. We wouldn't have attacked Iran without external pressures. We wouldn't be contemplating the end of American Democracy if it weren't for external pressures.
trolololster@reddit
i mean.... don't threaten me with a good time?!
recycledairplane1@reddit
Why just the US? Surely almost every other country will also be put into significant struggle with rising oil, shipping, farming, etc costs. feeling like we don't have a lifeboat here.
mike-deadmonton@reddit
Time to load up on beans and rice
Vegetaman916@reddit
Not just the United States. When the world reserve currency crashes, so does the world economy. And when it is also the petrodollar... And we were already about to collapse economically anyway.
Again, it is all part of our walk into the inevitable world war, and the inevitable ending of that war in nuclear spasm by one side or the other.
And Iran? Also still part of the original prediction that just keeps getting validated more and more the older it gets.
At what point will people stop saying it is wrong? I think it is about 80% fulfilled now, and still the naysayers are at it, talking about how world war is impossible...
Ah, well. Everyone enjoy their collapse as they choose, I guess. Smoke 'em if you got 'em.
AdLegitimate7318@reddit
Woo!
wageslave2022@reddit
How does that parable about the scorpion and the frog go again?
morganational@reddit
How are they going to accomplish that?
burritodoctor@reddit
Who needs nitrogen our air is full of it /s
HollywoodAndTerds@reddit
That’d be sick
Malcolm_Morin@reddit
If the United States collapses, that puts the entire world in danger. On top of potentially millions of Americans who would be more at risk of death, that would likely lead to rogue states, possibly balkanized, that own nuclear weapons.
BlasterPhase@reddit
empires have collapsed in the past
Malcolm_Morin@reddit
They didn't have nukes.
BlasterPhase@reddit
Pakistan and India have nukes, and they're not superpowers
Malcolm_Morin@reddit
They're also not on the verge of collapse.
ihavenoideia@reddit
I beg to differ. What does put the world in danger is the actions that the US is undertaking or has been undertaking. Whatever else the rest of the world can do, the us is doing far worse right now.
Noobatronistic@reddit
Agreed. The idea that the US is the glue that holds the world together is now antiquated and clearly disproven by facts, and not only recent events, even though they play a big part of it.
If anything, the US has been showed to be a bully that has always taken advantage of their position while doing everything to maintain the status quo.
I'd gi as far as to say we migh see a better world, in some aspects at least, without the US shadow hegemony.
urlach3r@reddit
We were the glue that held the world together, but that era is dead & gone. The idea of America coming to the rescue is absolutely laughable now, a relic, a phantom. We weren't prepared for the big one, and we lost: WWIII was fought in cyberspace & on social media, through traitors & billionaire sycophants, with Brexit & MAGA. Putin & his internet troll farms took us down without firing a single shot. We may not have actually collapsed as a nation, but our standing in the international community has been irrevocably destroyed. We are not what we once were, and will never be again. It will be decades, if ever, before the rest of the world trusts us again.
TengenToppa@reddit
He's but it's less dangerous than the current state
The broken down stares would be less powerful individually too
Malcolm_Morin@reddit
Less???
If you think it's bad NOW...
TengenToppa@reddit
I'd think the rogue states would fight each other first, it's a divided country after all.
And yes they would be less powerful individually ( less people to form an army, less nukes, inferior logistics abroad and so on)
HP7000@reddit
If the US continues on its current path and goes full fascism (even more so then today) and goes full ww3 that will be even worse and possibly global civilization ending.
pmxller@reddit
Just created a website for it with some animations you can all share with your families: https://us-iran-2026.lovable.app/
Mouthshitter@reddit
Dune ass type shit moment
Signal_Run_68@reddit
No, it's clickbait. Iraq, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Panama, Grenada didn't collapse us.
Substantial-Art2015@reddit
That is the intended goal of the head of the current regime. Not just this country, but all of them.
Awhispersecho1@reddit
That is the goal
manymasters@reddit
honestly, we collectively have it coming
jigsaw153@reddit
Be careful what you wish for.
A broken America still has an enormous military that can be turned on nations to blockade, starve and plunder.
tropical58@reddit
No military works for no pay. You clearly are not getting it. The US is broke. Like unbelievably stupendously broke.
Cum_Quat@reddit
I'm terrified the orange child rapist will drop nukes on Iran to "win" the war
outofshell@reddit
Sweating up here in Canada watching our militaristic neighbour losing its mind 😬
Omar_DmX@reddit
There we go America. A humiliating defeat and total collapse or a technobro fascist oligarchy. Your choice. You voted for this.
LeninsMommy@reddit
Please 🙏
It's over, let it be done now
SethGrey@reddit
Oh cool, so right about when I’d have my down payment for a modest home.
bpeck451@reddit
Pull on your boot straps harder.
cecilmeyer@reddit
It is almost by design the oligarchs have created a system that any disruption to causes chaos.
yaosio@reddit
I don't like articles with this kind of utopian thinking. The world would be a better place if the US collapsed and that's why it won't happen.
Beardygrandma@reddit
And then military service becomes the only way to fund your family. Russiamerica
thechilecowboy@reddit
!remindme 6 months
Ghost_of_Nellie_Fox@reddit
Don’t tease me with a good time!!!
stripesonfire@reddit
The all saw ready player one and thought that looks awesome, let’s do that kind of dystopia
Hinin@reddit
Donnie is going to load his airplane with his bullions and go back to russia once it's done
Ragfell@reddit
Remindme! 7 months
KombuchaWarfare@reddit
So something good might actually come from this shit show?
CaptZ@reddit
Saving for later.
Purplealegria@reddit
Yeah….and This is exactly why he is doing it.
socialsciencenerd@reddit
Looking forward to this!
MonoNoAware71@reddit
🍿
mushykindofbrick@reddit
Okay yeah, sure, collapse the entire US, I'm very curious as to how that prediction will hold up !remindme 6 months
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FireBug77@reddit
Everything DJT touches turns to shit so why not keep the record then?
ClearSnakewood@reddit
🙏 hurry up please!
drellynz@reddit
Other countries (dominos) will fall before the USA. Fuel prices hikes are far worse elsewhere.
StatisticianThin288@reddit
its about time
miles197@reddit
🤞🤞
Ok_Main3273@reddit
millanstar@reddit
Far_Out_6and_2@reddit
It’s possible in arm chair postulates
MiaWallacetx@reddit
🤷♀️🤷♀️🥹
Ezer_Pavle@reddit
Good. Iran is doing EU's dirty job
SJSquishmeister@reddit
That's literally the goal.
StatementBot@reddit
The following submission statement was provided by /u/Opposite-Mountain255:
"Every single one of those numbers gets worse when grocery bills go up 15 percent. The family that was barely making rent stops making rent. The person carrying medical debt on a credit card to buy groceries now has less credit and higher prices. The underemployed worker who needed full-time work faces a labor market contracting under inflationary pressure. The crises don’t sit beside each other. They feed each other, all at once, with the same shock driving all of them simultaneously."
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1s6nv6o/the_iran_war_could_collapse_the_united_states_in/od39k7e/