This is funhangs response when asked to see there ul certification on the bikes needless to say I will not be purchasing from them and suggests no one else does either trying to save will cost more in the short and long term
Posted by Ok-Professional-4978@reddit | ebikes | View on Reddit | 55 comments
EmergencyScientist@reddit
Way late to the thread and haven't read all the comments, but for future visitors you can look up "funhang" under "trade name" here and you will see that all of their batteries for all their models (EB-M1, EB-C1/2, EB-S1) are all certified. What I find most interesting is that they list EB-M2, but I've never seen that model for sale. The M1 is their regular mountain ebike that is $350-400 shipped on Amazon. I wonder if this means a new model of that bike is coming.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Thanks
8abyNeji@reddit
why would you need this certification what does it show about the bike ?
OldFargoan@reddit
Why downvote just because they asked a question? I wanted to know also.
8abyNeji@reddit
redditors are 99% virgins i have no idea about the certificate and was just curious
FrabbaSA@reddit
That your battery is less likely to be a cheap piece of future unplanned explosives.
Remarkable-Host405@reddit
X for doubt. I doubt my EV is ul certified
FrabbaSA@reddit
Guess again, UL2580.
FreedomX01@reddit
To make sure that it's certified and has been tested!!!!
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
That they are not just claiming the bike is or at least the battery is ul listed .is there a better way ?
rewt127@reddit
Lol fucking huh?
I can go into Home Depot and grab a electrical backbox off the shelf and read the UL number off the box itself and then Google it and get all the info.
Hell I can go to Schnieder' website and get the UL data on a 52c load center in just a few minutes. Just need to find which data sheet has the UL number. Its definitely not on the one I usually look at, but simultaneously. idgaf lol, I know it is listed.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
They have a picture of the alleged certificate on the Amazon post for the bike but it can’t be expanded and can’t make out anything on it you would think they would be jumping to show off that information
rewt127@reddit
Aight so just to clarify for the sake of it. I might talk to you like like you are an idiot but its for anyone else who comes along.
That bike will not be UL listed. The bike is an assembled product. Not a part. So the battery, and the housing. Those will definitely be UL listed. If the brakes are hydraulic the master cyl should be UL listed too. But the bike itself wont be. So I wonder if they give this answer to just push away the folk who hear "cHeCk FoR a Ul LiStInG!!!".
But it is simultaneously kinda odd they wont provide it.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
No your good I’m a noob when it comes to these bikes and the ratings I’m trying to get best bang for buck
rewt127@reddit
Turns out im the idiot actually.
I had to edit after the fact. Apparently they do a full bike UL listing which is weird. Usually its part based. Like the back box is listed, and the receptacle is listed. But they dont UL list the installation. But then again I guess since they at a factory install the Battery, housing, and bike. They can UL list it.
The reason im surprised is because batteries are something that an end consumer can replace without any technical knowledge and not grenade the assembly. So it surprises me that they can UL list the whole assembly. I have expected that because the Battery is a consumer product, and would reasonably be changed out, UL wouldn't list the bike. Like im pretty sure they dont UL list my whole ass motorcycle. Because who the fuck knows what Battery, brake pads. Tires, headlights, bars, mirrors, grips, fender eliminator, and random ass other shit im gonna slap on my motorcycle.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Yeah I’m not sure the recipe I just see some claiming battery and some battery and whole bike I assumed maybe the wires idk like I said e-bikes have only been on my radar for few weeks now as means of cheap transportation to and from work
rewt127@reddit
Yeah UL is a like... a whole thing. So its part of why im so surprised they would have full listing..
Alright so after doing a little digging. There might be a language barrier. I wonder if they are thinking you want the UL requirements and acceptance data. Most companies wont even give you that.
What they will do is provide the UL number. Which says "it meets this UL certification". And then UL will say "yep we said it passes". But to get the actual data costs money.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Maybe but they post this on Amazon
But you can’t click on it to expand and it’s too blurry to read anything off it
rewt127@reddit
The photo is fucked lol. But yeah that is a legit cert as far as I can tell.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
But almost seems used deceptively considering for all we know it could be for a toaster right ?
Kind_Instance_8205@reddit
Here is the website to search for UL listed products and items: https://productiq.ulprospector.com/en/search?term=funghang
If you want to see what it looks like for companies that have UL listings, you can search for Rad Power Bikes.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
From what I’ve gathered if sgs or another reputable company recognized by ul does it it won’t show on there is that wrong ?
Kind_Instance_8205@reddit
As far as I know, if the organization that is entrusted by UL to certify the product completes the certification, it should show on the UL site. If it isn't UL certified but is certified by SGS legitimately, it's usually just as good but not technically UL certified and so won't be on the UL search. If they say it is UL certified, it should be in that search. No matter the organization that did the testing.
rewt127@reddit
No, I can read enough of it and the UL number is for Ebikes.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Well shit maybe I’m wrong and wrongfully putting them on blast
rewt127@reddit
Maybe, maybe not. Im 75% sure thst is a legit UL very. But frankly I could build a fake UL cert in Photoshop in 10 minutes.
If you really want to be certain ask this
Hi the the certification number on your UL certificate is illegible. Could you provide me with a transcription of the number posted on your Amazon listing
Thank you, Your Name.
Should get you a response. Be formal. Be professional. This is how we industry folk ask for this stuff.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
I’ll try
sincerely_brie@reddit
Technically it is not ul at all, that’s an sgs certificate from one of their labs. This type of certificate is very common unlike actual ul certificates. They claim to test to “ul standards” but ul is a whole thing and it is tested by ul more then the random other companies do and ul rating is extremely expensive. They create confusion using ul when they arnt ul and there’s actually lawsuits right now for amazon vs a company without ul saying they are ul. On the ul site you can search a company name, I guarantee you this bike is not there.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
My understanding is if sgs or tuv does it’s it is still ul just not under ul and won’t show on ul website
sincerely_brie@reddit
Oh no they are very different, sgs is technically an international testing laboratory but if it is not done by ul it is not a ul certification at all. A way to think about it is sgs “tests” but ul “certifies”. If a company says the word UL on things without it being ul certified it is technically a crime, they tend to write in small print “ul tested” because they cannot say ul certified. It’s kind of a fake loophole to attempt to get around standards by changing the verbiage. I’ve done a silly amount of research on it after the Amazon lawsuit but I didn’t think it would ever come up lol
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
In the case of these funhangs in the title of all the bikes they say ul certified
sincerely_brie@reddit
Ohhh that is interesting! That is very much not aloud if they are saying certified without being certified they can get sued by ul.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Yeah I’ve heard they take it very seriously as they should tho
sincerely_brie@reddit
This is a copy from Google but it is the Amazon lawsuit in a nutshell “Amazon and safety certification company UL Solutions are actively suing Chinese companies for using fake UL marks on e-bikes. These lawsuits, filed in Washington federal court, aim to curb counterfeit goods that pose safety risks.”
AdBoring4472@reddit
yeah, you dont know what you are talking about, sorry. There is UL Listing and UL Recognition. UL Listing applies to a product as sold to an end user, where UL recognition is for individual components which go into an assembly and require additional safety evaluation in the end product.
On an ebike, the whole electrical system can be Listed to UL 2849. This could mean the Listing identifies the ebike model, or it could just identify the electrical system (when used on numerous models). UL 2849 only evaluated the electrical system safety, not any of the mechanical parts, brakes, or drivetrain.
Additionally, the battery and charger can be listed to UL 2271 and UL 62368-1, respectively, since these are fully tested to their own end-product standards. Of course, parts of the electric system could also be Recognized, being only partially tested to the standards. Also, this certification can be done by labs other than UL, in which case they probably wont use the terms Listed or Recognized, since those are UL specific terms.
Long story short, the manufacturer should have no problems providing the certifications (Listing or Recognition) for the electrical system, battery, or charger. There is nothing secret on these certifications, and a failure to do so should be seen as a high liklihood that they dont have them.
Just-Smart-Enough@reddit
UL2849, to be specific. To be fair, you're only mostly wrong, though. That UL spec only applies to the E-system, not the whole bike. They could hang a UL approved system on an utter dogshit frame and you'd still be in great danger.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
I’m mostly concerned with the battery as I feel it’s less of a fire risk if ul certified
AdBoring4472@reddit
100%. They should be able to provide the certificate (like the SGS one posted here) to UL 2271 for the battery and it absolutely points to the battery being more safe. It should also be readable. If they give you just the certificate number, you should be able to look it up on the certification agencies database.
If you have the cert number for SGS, you can look here for more details and to ensure the cert is valid: https://www.sgs.com/en/certified-clients-and-products/sgs-certified-components-and-products
To check UL, you need to create a free account to UL Prospector, here: https://productiq.ulprospector.com/en
.... and so on with other labs like Intertek, TUV, etc., just google the labs name plus "certification database".
Anyways, you are 100% valid asking for the certification, and you are 100% correct to walk away if they wont provide it in a readable and verifiable form.
Mindless-Concept8010@reddit
Great job.
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
I’ve also reached out to sgs in belief they are lying about certifications word is they take that very seriously
AdBoring4472@reddit
If you have the cert number for SGS, you can look here for more details and to ensure the cert is valid: https://www.sgs.com/en/certified-clients-and-products/sgs-certified-components-and-products
RichTrifle1785@reddit
You can also just look up their trade name. Funhang is on there, but only for a UL2271 (battery only) cert which isn’t common.
Really odd that they asked you for your order number to confirm their certification since that’s all public information. Maybe they were expecting you to ask for the lab testing document?
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
The battery is my main concern.sgs is basically no help because I don’t have the certification number
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
The alleged certificate is unreadable
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
I’m in the process of email exchanges with the sgs all I have is a pic of alleged certs from Amazon page but they can’t be expanded and too blurry to make out
Difficult_Coast2848@reddit
Funhangs has the recipe on BS spicy extra Krispy crapp, if you purchase their product they still won't give you the information guaranteed 😎
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Probably 🤣
Relative-Display-676@reddit
this is true of majority of chinese drop shippers, they're scammers.
the only ones with true UL certification are: velotric, aventon, kingbull(what a surprise!), rad(is dead), denago, tenways, rambo, addmotor, velopower, ninebot, radio flyer, aima, volcon, bisek, dirwin, himiway, taochen, golden wheel, roadsan, qidian, ristar cycle(not ridstar), gobao, wallke, emmo, happyrun, and probably many others. but nowhere close to all the brands that claim to be certified. feel free to look them up, its free and easy.
RichTrifle1785@reddit
Cybervelo/Euybike is also UL-listed for most of their models but to the UL2849 standard only. I didn’t know there were so many budget brands that did get a UL listing though.
TheFlightlessDragon@reddit
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
Update they can no longer be purchased on Amazon
havpac2@reddit
If you have legitimate ul rating you don’t make people jump through hoops to see the cert.
I Don’t trust any company that’s not willing to produce safety information upon request. Most just publish it .
Ok-Professional-4978@reddit (OP)
I agree
Worried_Document8668@reddit
just another one of those "cheap pem company does shady things" moments.
just stop buying all those landfill-level bikes