Americans that moved to Spain, do you regret it?
Posted by unsuretest212@reddit | expats | View on Reddit | 181 comments
For context: I have the opportunity to move to Spain through work and am considering it since I am Mexican American and could qualify for citizenship in two years. My Spanish isn’t great and I’ve been to Spain and really liked it but everything’s good on vacation.
I want to know if Americans like it long term or regret moving and if you feel like your life changed for the better.
You know how they say if you move you just bring your problems there? My fear is that that’s true but another part of me feels like the US environment is damaging my mental health and I will feel relief and more in touch with people/life in Spain.
doonilbibi@reddit
Moved to Spain almost two years ago, looking to leave as soon as possible.
It’s a nice place to live if you can find a good job, can speak Spanish, and are extroverted/ social. Something you don’t realize until experiencing it over the long term are the subtle differences of personal boundaries and other social norms. It can be exhausting
Ok-Limit7212@reddit
what's the exhausting part? can you please elaborate?
doonilbibi@reddit
Well I can, but I will probably be downvoted, whatever. This is just my experience as a foreign person in the country, but still you should try and experience it for yourself.
people love the food here, but I haven’t been impressed really. I went to two different Michelin starred restaurants, and try a new one every week if I can, of local and non local food. The Spanish palate is, in my opinion, very bland and kind of boring. They hate any type of spice and if you go to a different type of cuisine, for example sushi, they cater it to the Spanish palate, adding in cream cheese and removing anything remotely spicy unless you ask for it specifically. One thing that does seem to be popular, however, are bocadillos with only one ingredient. For example, fried calamari on bread. Or just like salted chicken on bread. I dunno, just boring. The wine and olive oil are both very good though.
Spanish people themselves are nice but in a shallow type of way. In my experience, Spanish people can be very racist, fatphobic, and aggressive in general. Spanish people tend to stick to themselves and not reallly socialize with anyone outside of their group. The majority of friends I have made here are other immigrants. Spanish people love cutting in lines, pushing you if you are in their way, or just being in your personal space without permission. They will be nice at first but you will see how shallow it can get very quickly if something is mildly inconvenient.
It seems like Spanish people like to take credit for the good and exciting parts of Latin American culture, yet look down on the people from there. They have this smugness about them and definitely love to brag.
There is a lot of good though, but since like 3 people asked what I don’t like, well there you go. See for yourself if you like it!
Frank1009@reddit
Sounds similar to Italy in a way
Alone-Strain@reddit
Or America
runningtravel@reddit
curious - have you lived outside of the united states prior to living in spain?
doonilbibi@reddit
I was born in an Eastern European country, moved to the US very young. Didn’t live in other countries but I have often traveled to Europe for vacations, visiting family. I moved to Spain without ever having been there before though. I guess you can’t always trust what everyone says online, you have to try it for yourself
runningtravel@reddit
thank you for your honest reply. i was born in US but live in Northern Europe for 32 years. Visit Spain often and studied spanish when i was younger so i do understand a bit. i am hoping to move to spain in a few years. i’m curious how others have experienced the move there.
doonilbibi@reddit
It depends on the person. Some love it, others don’t. I am one of the non-lovers.
One-Acanthisitta-210@reddit
As a northern European who wants to move to Spain, what were the things you didn’t like? I have travelled to Spain often, but I realise that living somewhere is quite different.
On a side note, I lived in the US for several years, and while I liked it initially, in the end I decided to move back to Europe. So I do understand how subtle differences can start to grate and be annoying after a while.
Brijyoda@reddit
Hello , I am an American who came to live in spain as a English teacher , now doing contract work & was considering staying here as I’ve been here a little over a year now. Can you explain some of the things u don’t like about it?
DorotheaArcher@reddit
Can you elaborate on this? We’re on the search for a place to live in the future and Spain was on the list.
doonilbibi@reddit
Yeah, replied to someone else
Puzzleheaded-Sun7418@reddit
I am Spanish that migrated to Northern Europe so I can relate with your last sentence. Different cultures and adapting to those, especially when you don’t really know all the social norms and such (because you grew up somewhere else) is very exhausting.
But I guess that’s everywhere where there is a very different culture than yours. Expectations, social dynamics, boundaries are all different and confusing. And they not always align with you and your values.
I hope you go to a place that aligns better!
Blanche_Deverheauxxx@reddit
Do you mind answering what you noticed about social boundaries? And how would being extroverted be more helpful? Are people generally less likely to engage with others unless being spoken to? Or are they also extroverted?
doonilbibi@reddit
Thanks, I hope the same for you if that also applies
Puzzleheaded-Sun7418@reddit
Thank you :) I came back to Spain and I’m fine here. I just don’t resonate with Germanic/anglo cultures as we are pretty different here in the south.
Solid-Platypus-2162@reddit
Hey!
I’ve been going through this process myself recently and honestly, it’s more complicated than people think at the beginning 😅
Things like paperwork, getting your NIE, finding a place to live, and understanding the real cost of living can slow you down a lot if you don’t plan it properly.
I ended up putting everything together in a simple step-by-step guide based on real expat experience (not generic info):
👉 https://www.moodpalmdigital.com/moving-to-spain-guide
Might help you get a clearer picture before making the move 🙌
prezidentbump@reddit
I lived in Barcelona for five years. I don’t regret it at all, but I’m happy I moved back to California.
n8larson@reddit
How would you compare the cost of living between those two places?
prezidentbump@reddit
California is about double the price, maybe a little more. I make the same salary. I work remotely. I wasn’t living like a king in Barcelona or here simply because I live a modest lifestyle. California makes me happy. I live in O side. Surfing the Pacific, year round high UV index, friendly people, SPICY food, less complaining, less drinking, less bureaucracy, less Catalans.
Artistic_Amoeba_7778@reddit
I’m sure Catalans were happy you left too.
prezidentbump@reddit
Was married to a Catalan. Surrounded by Catalans. They are the most xenophobic, racist humans I have ever met. The disdain for South Americans, North Africans, “Gypsies,” tourists, other Spanish… any “outsiders,” their national identity is pure tribalism. I had never experienced that level of us vs. them mentality in my life and it’s PERVASIVE.
prezidentbump@reddit
I don’t think Catalans are happy about anything
Artistic_Amoeba_7778@reddit
and you must be a POS living somewhere you hated with people you despised. Go back to maga land so you can be a happy a-hole.
Artistic_Amoeba_7778@reddit
happy to take a xenophobic racist back to the USA. You will find lots of people like you, even in SoCal, there are maga idiots.
MigJorn@reddit
Less Catalans? Outside Catalonia? Lol! Good riddance!
buscoamigos@reddit
You should also ask about salary between the two.
n8larson@reddit
I actually don’t need to ask about the salary because I have enough to live on without working. However, an answer that includes that info too will be more useful to some other readers. 🙂
prezidentbump@reddit
I’m self employed, making the same salary. It’s been stagnant but I live a modest life with no dependents. Not a home owner but happy enough. I don’t see a huge difference between my lifestyle in Barcelona compared to SoCal except rent and health insurance is higher here.
javadesigner@reddit
Why were you happy to move back ?
Uncle_Richard98@reddit
Because California specially the southern part is the best place to live in the world despite being expensive asf. Best weather in the world, 1000 different things to do, friendly people, high salaries, amazing food etc.
TheBurningQuill@reddit
The politics in Spain may surprise you. PP + Vox likely to win in 2027 and the things you're running away from find you, but this time you're actually an immigrant.
meguskus@reddit
Yup, you can't run away from politics. They can change at any time and most countries in Europe actually have a substantial far right movement.
ZookeepergameNo2431@reddit
The far right is ascendant everywhere, unfortunately. But the question is, in terms of living in U.S. vs. Spain vs. elsewhere: what do you want your baseline life to look like? Me, I want fewer guns, more accessible health care, less stressful work-life balance, walkable neighborhoods, public transit and education, better food, etc.
n8larson@reddit
I saw it written elsewhere that much of Europe’s far-right/new-fascist corruption and racism movement is “very similar to the US, just 10-15 years behind”. Can you comment on how accurate that might be?
meguskus@reddit
I've never lived in the US so I can't compare from experience. I don't think it's behind or ahead, it's never been gone. If anything I think the US just developed into it very rapidly, while Europe has been brewing for many years.
ACapra@reddit
We moved from San Diego to Valencia a year an a half ago. We have bought a home and we plan on staying here forever. Also a dual citizenship home (Mexico - US) so we are already starting to work with our immigration lawyer to gather the needed paperwork for our Spanish citizenship.
All of my problems in the US mostly delt with work (On a NLV so problem solved), fear of future extreme healthcare cost, and the political state of the US. We don't have any of those problems here. And we have had some honest conversations about if we ever want to go back to the US again, which is looking like we will only be returning for funerals of very close family members.
Our biggest fear was that we would be lonely before we moved here because we didn't know anyone and didn't have any family here. We have made so many friends that we kind of joke that we have more friends here than we did in the US.
No regrets - 10/10 would recommend.
jibrie8@reddit
Valencia is great! Do you have more expat friends or locals?
ACapra@reddit
At first, mostly expats (we prefer to think of ourselves as immigrants )from various countries but we are starting to make Spanish friends. Our goal is to join a Casal (Fallas House) which is a unique thing in Valencia. We hope will allow us to meet more of our neighbors and form relationships with them.
ZookeepergameNo2431@reddit
that's brilliant to join a fallas society -- you don't get more local than that in Valencia.
MediumMoney9970@reddit
This is amazing! im moving my family of 4 to either Valencia/Alicante, we are coming on a NLV as well but are super nervous to go through this process. Did you use an immigration lawyer or other services to help you in your move?
NattiCatt@reddit
I’m looking to do this but seriously struggling with how to navigate the whole visa thing. My current company won’t sponsor and won’t allow the DNV either. I’ve heard finding a company that will allow it is a nightmare and that even with companies that will sponsor, they usually want you to have been a long term employee first. Did you find a job in Spain? Were you already fluent in Spanish? If you found a job offer in Spain, how did you go about that? Any other advice?
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
Thanks so much for your reply and recommending Valencia. I am concerned however about taxation on “world-wide income” as my wife and I will have about 60K/yr coming in (we’re not rich) via Social Security and an my wife’s annuity. Any thoughts or reservations about taxation in Spain? This could be a deal-breaker unfortunately as Valencia or Malaga was where I was headed. Thanks!
livin_the_life@reddit
Social Security is taxed by American brackets and not taxed in Spain by Article 20 of the US-Spain Taxation treaty.
It would still count as reportable income, so it may cause any non-Social Security income to fall into a higher bracket, but the Social Security itself would be taxed by America, not Spain.
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
Thanks for the reply. I need to get a professional tax advisor involved in this situation.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
Join the Americans in Spain Facebook group. There's a wealth of knowledge, expertise and experience in the group. Its great for asking questions and getting recommendations for professional support.
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
Thanks so much! A great idea. Will do
Fit-Avocado-6002@reddit
I also agree with the part about friends. My social life has basically sky rocketed in Spain and I barely do anything different. It’s just a more social culture and on top of the weather and the way cities/ towns are designed it’s much easier to find social opportunities.
Comprehensive_Ant984@reddit
This is what I’m looking for. Where in Spain did you land?
Independent_Drink714@reddit
It's been my experience, too.
Frank1009@reddit
Did you learn Spanish or made friends with mostly English speaking people?
ACapra@reddit
We have friends who speak both languages.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
Aww, that's awesome! Valencia is such a brilliant place to live.
unsuretest212@reddit (OP)
Thank you for sharing this is so helpful! Also so happy you are loving it!
Blanche_Deverheauxxx@reddit
Did you always have dual citizenship? If not, how difficult was it to secure?
ACapra@reddit
That's a tricky question. The reality is we always had it but getting all of the paperwork in order to prove it did take some time and some lawyers. I think we have spent about $800 on the whole process but we finally have the passports which makes everything easier from here on out.
Blanche_Deverheauxxx@reddit
Thank you! I'm in a position where I qualify for dual citizenship if I apply for it but wasn't sure how costly the process would be or if it'd be particularly difficult.
Downtown-Storm4704@reddit
perhaps through a partner which is quite common in Europe.
Ok-Limit7212@reddit
what about money? if you do remote then this won't apply to a lot of people.
jazzyjeffla@reddit
What do you do for work?
ACapra@reddit
We are on the NLV so we are not allowed to work as a condition of our Visas. We will once we get our citizenship but I will never go back to a high stress job like we had in the US.
jazzyjeffla@reddit
I assume that means you’ve got some passive income from retirement, disability?, military, online business, or just savings from when you did work in the US. Be grateful because the reality of the situation in Spain is very different. It’s hard for us to pay bills, and save money to buy homes, cars, holidays, health procedures that aren’t covered by the public healthcare. Wishing you all the best in your next chapter!
runnymountain@reddit
You moved there to retire? What’s the age and profession and net worth?
For people that still have to work it may not be as rosey.
ACapra@reddit
The job market here is pretty tough. We are on the NLV but we have several friends who work for US companies still on the DN visa here. We are in our 40s.
Rough-Neighborhood18@reddit
What about the illegal immigrants and refugees taking over
kittycatparade@reddit
I live here and I have no regrets, but I also don’t plan on staying forever. That said, with 2 years until you can get citizenship, you would be crazy not to move.
mouldy-baps@reddit
Are you going to renounce your US citizenship? I thought Spain does not allow dual citizenship?
Artistic_Amoeba_7778@reddit
it does. I’m a Spaniard with dual USA citizenship. Had to go to the Spanish consulate in nyc to tell them I got the usa one but intended to keep the Spanish one. So I’m dual. work for the USA gov and they know it too.
Downtown-Storm4704@reddit
they don't but plenty still wait it out 10 years (those who are not eligible before) just to get their hands on a shiny burgundy EU passport, then they can move anywhere in the EU. You just got to be careful the authorities don't catch you using both citizenships in the EU.
kittycatparade@reddit
I’m nowhere near getting citizenship to be honest haha. But even though Spain doesn’t allow dual citizenship in theory (unless you’re from an ibero-American country), you can get it in practice. They don’t make you renounce your other citizenship, so most Americans just quietly hold onto both.
You just have to keep it quiet and be careful with how you use your passport.
Prior-Actuator-8110@reddit
honestly experience gonna vary like a lot depending your background and previous quality of life.
Main issues its the job market which is terrible and you'll need to speak spanish. And extrovert personality its very advisable if you wanna make friends in a new country.
whitelikerice1@reddit
Moved to Valencia from Minnesota, I personally think it’s super over rated, most of the neighborhoods are pretty shit other than the touristy or rich places, but like, it’s fine I guess. If I wasn’t here to be with my partner I’d move back home in an instant.
billyathens@reddit
That’s just, like, your opinion, man
snowconez@reddit
"Wherever you go, there you are". Moving to Spain won't magically make things better, but it could potentially help certain factors. Personally, I couldn't get behind the siesta culture. Which sounds crazy but its just like social norms like that that wore on me after awhile. I did end up moving abroad elsewhere!
billyathens@reddit
The dude abides
Top-Half7224@reddit
I don't regret moving to Spain, I don't regret leaving either. Lots of lovely people, lots of awful ones too. But what it came down to is the general insensitivity of the culture (compared to my baseline, completely normal for people who were raised in it). I had accumulated stress on a daily basis, the lack of personal space, noisy environments, high carb foods, late hours, poor personal boundaries, cruelty to animals. Alot of things my spanish friends would also complain about, but long term it was exhausting. At the time, my employment opportunities were limited to teaching English, which was also a low paying high stress job (for me).
You can't escape politics though. Yes, less guns, but also less autonomy for you as a foreigner. Unless you have the kind of money that you can live in a bubble, but then who will you turn to if things get bad?
Lucyiscute945@reddit
I’m glad to read your comments, this explains what I was confused about my experience in Spain. I studied Spanish in Sevilla for six months few years ago, I was shocked by the architecture and the views, everything seemed attractive to me, I loved there very much but in the meantime I felt very uncomfortable dealing with the locals. I thought maybe because I was an Asian in this small city and they didn’t get used to see foreign faces. I even asked my teacher, based on her telling about Spanish culture, personality , and the situation that women were in I kinda understood what kinda people they really were under that happy no worries face , especially Spanish males.
bretl002@reddit
Is anyone able to comment, from experience, about the racism differences between the US and València? Specifically the African American experience.
ibrahimsow1@reddit
Plus one
Movetospainfromus@reddit
I've been here for 20 years now. Absolutely not. Has it always been easy? No. But I am thankful everyday that I'm here and not in the US.
catherineuvarova@reddit
Yeah
kwrightSpain@reddit
Been here over 3 years now, only regrets I've had are for traveling back to see my parents who are getting up there in age. Otherwise, the weather (well the past few months haven't been great), the food, the cost of living, the water (I live in Malaga), the mountains, the rest of Europe being close (took my wife to Venice for 4 days for our anniversary)...
Very happy, very glad I came here. I do wish my Spanish were better, but no regrets.
n8larson@reddit
I’m in a few other groups here about leaving the US (haven’t yet) and your comment is quite helpful. I have a LinkedIn connection who moved to Malaga and my close-in-age only sibling has lived in Bavaria for about 25 years. I’d love to ask you some more detailed questions about your experience and the Malaga area before I make my first recon visit. If you’d be open to a brief dm exchange (no personal info) I wouldn’t need to clutter this space, but up here is okay too.
kwrightSpain@reddit
Sent you a DM
Ok-Force-6966@reddit
In short, yes. We are in Asturias in a rural area, been here over a year. Finding the social situation tense, with locals very unsure and not very happy with the rapid changes including skyrocketing housing prices (of course, some people are benefiting mightily, but the older locals and people who don't own their own property are justifiably freaked out), and this is transferring into some amount of hostility. Just found out that there's an unexhumed mass grave from the civil war about a KM from here, there's lots of intergenerational trauma that nobody talks about. While Asturianos are super courteous and it is generally safe, with neighbors (all of ours are in their 80s and 90s) outside of this every relationship with Spainish people has started to feel largely transactional. Thinking about moving to another EU country, as I'm an EU citizen.
cootercomplex@reddit
I moved to Spain 7 years ago and have no desire to go back to the US. My first year in Spain was complicated ngl. I was learning the language and building new friendship, getting used to a new job, etc. But I loved the chaos anyway because I knew it was such a unique experience. After two years it started to really feel like home, I made meaningful connections, really grasped the language, and had more understanding of the culture. Now 8 years living here, I literally couldn't ever imagine going back to the states or what my life would have been like if I'd stayed. I say you should go for it!!
sab98xx@reddit
Did you speak fluent Spanish when you moved?
cootercomplex@reddit
No not at all, just what I had retained from the high school Spanish class. But I moved into a shared flat with Spanish speakers to force myself into an immersion. I also went to a lot of intercambios my first year and on a lot of tinder dates with Spanish speakers haha
CountDeMone@reddit
After 3 month of diligent work collecting documents, apostilles, translated documents, letter from a CPA, bank statements, and more, I unfortunately had to abandon our goal to relocate to Spain. Here is why.......
The taxation systems appears to offer friendly expat treatment, but that is not really true. Since I am a business owner, with US based employees, I myself am not considered an employee nor a "freelancer". This disqualifies me from the Digital Nomad Visa and the Beckham Rule. I was planned to essentially manage my US-based business and employees from abroad in a semi-retired sort of way. As I was having an attorney review the documents before submitting to the Spanish consulate, I learned that as a business owner, Spain is going to consider my US based company as essentially Spanish-based income since, I as the owner, am in Spain even if I am semi-retired and return to the US for Board meetings. Since the business is a partnership, this would have exposed the business to a 47% tax rate. Also, Spain would levy a wealth tax of up to 3% annually of my personal wealth AND the value of the business I am an owner in.
This would have resulted in an additional several hundreds of thousands of dollars per year in taxes to Spain above what is paid the to US. I have no issue paying taxes, but it is not a Spanish-based business with any Spanish employees or presence. Plus, we would not be entitled to any Spanish benefits, like health care, social security, public schools, local tuition rates, etc. For me, the Beckham rule didn't apply, nor would the 24% tax treatments for foreign sourced dividends. My business is also an illiquid assets with low margins. Having to pay a wealth tax on it would essentially devour any positive cash flow from the business.
We so wanted to move to Spain, to provide our kids with an immersive international experience, Excessive tax rates on income, combined with a significant tax on essentially illiquid assets (business, long-term investments), etc, is oppressive.
I share this because I believe the internet and influences post about the DNV and benefits or relocating to Spain. In certain employment situation it works. But, once you have an employee you jump from Freelancer to Owner and are exposed to Spain's Permanent Establishment treatment. The wealth tax is a levy on already being successful, but includes taxation on illiquid and fixed assets.
After much consideration, we will have to pivot to other countries. We really wanted our second home to be in Spain, but their taxation treatment makes it financially irresponsible.
Positive_Bar8695@reddit
Not an American or long term expat but wanted to share my experiences.
I have been to Spain many times with my family and I often stayed for extended stays.
To sum up, it is a great country to visit for a vacation, great cities and regions, but would I live there? i really don’t know. I didn’t grow up in a big city and found Madrid and Barcelona to be too busy and chaotic.
There are lots of nice coastal areas outside of the popular areas such as Andalucía’s Atlantic coast in Huelva and Cadiz, but much of these towns are seasonal and very quiet outside of the summer season.
Granada was a nice place, I loved visiting the North African tearooms.
I think for people with physical disabilities, sadly much of Spain is not accessible for people who are visually impaired. I am fully blind for example, and a lot of places that look tourist friendly on paper are really difficult for visually impaired people to manage.
Other comments have pointed out that even if you do speak good Spanish, it can still be hard to make friends. I speak c1 Spanish for example, but even with that, especially in places like Granada I found it hard to meet new people there beyond bar based intercambios or university programs. The unemployment situaiton as many have pointed out is also a major issue.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
Just so you know, Spanish citizenship applications are currently taking between 18 months to 2 years to be approved and that time frame is expected to increase quite substantially due to the overstayer amnesty that will result in 100s of 1000s of additional applications in 2028 and 2029. Visa conditions must be maintained during the whole process or until the applicant has been approved for permanent residency (which may happen before citizenship is approved). Having said that, Spanish citizenship gives you access to employers and residency across the whole EU. Which is the Golden Ticket in today's world.
smallreadinglight@reddit
That's still pretty fast. IDK why everyone acts like 2 years is the end of the world.
YaBastaaa@reddit
Should be one year with today technology.
smallreadinglight@reddit
That's never going to happen. Unless you're willing to invest in a citizenship (i.e.: Malta), then your timeline base is 2 years. The Malta citizenships by investment is only slightly faster at 1-1.5 years. IDK why you think it should take shorter given the layers and layers and layers and layers of bureaucracy you have to go through. Not to mention, most of these countries don't really WANT to give these citizenships out but they have to.
YaBastaaa@reddit
Busting everyone Chops , why is that Redditors are sooo Serious . Today we have the technology to go to the Moon back-and-forth. And verify track a soul - has become a complicated Einstein scientific formula- that it takes two years to verify and confirm. Find individual that pays taxes and it’s a good law abiding citizen. It should be a walk in the park to say I’m done living here. Can I come over to the other side and add value?
Independent_Drink714@reddit
It's a supply and demand situation. Extremely high demand and no more hours in the day here. Nothing, absolutely nothing, around residency or citizenship happens quickly. It's the same in many countries around the world. It's a serious business and positive outcomes aren't guaranteed. You're, at best, inexperienced, possibly naive, to think otherwise.
YaBastaaa@reddit
VERY NAIVE!!! Duhhh!!! I am dome , uneducated. I am a hillbilly from the south 🤣 🤠🐄
Independent_Drink714@reddit
I will take your word for it.
smallreadinglight@reddit
Yeah but what qualifies one to be a citizen of somewhere? That's what they are verifying. You've clearly never done this process and are unaware of all the steps involved. Keep living in la la land.
YaBastaaa@reddit
Never done and hope I never will. Being an immigrant on another country is definitely not pleasant at first. That is why I give lots a credit for all those who do it . I have the upmost respect for them.
smallreadinglight@reddit
it's very tedious, that's why I said 2 years was fast. I'm preparing to apply for a Certificate of Ancestry by Descent which will allow me to apply for Permanent Residency via Descent in Lithuania. The paperwork gathering process has been almost a year to the date I started and I'm only now at the point where I'm close to being able to apply.
it's very long, very involved, very tedious.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
It's not about technology. It's about sovereignty.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
Nobody acts like that. Everyone here understands that it's the regulated process.
RidetheSchlange@reddit
The overstayer amnesty isn't going to affect that. That was right-wing and nazi propaganda that they will be fast-tracked to citizenship when the plan is very obviously to get documentation underway and likely to facilitate deportation and deciding on who stays and get people to contribute to taxes.
Independent_Drink714@reddit
It will affect it. Because the majority of that 500k to 1.million are those here from former Spanish colonies. The timing of the amnesty is not coincidence.
Away_Letterhead_4220@reddit
Most americans I know, including mexicans as well as mexican americans tend to either love it or sit out their two years and move to the Netherlands.
nvyetka@reddit
Why the Netherlands ?
Away_Letterhead_4220@reddit
I wouldn't know to be honest
Medium-Issue-377@reddit
If you move through work, one thing worth looking into is the Beckham Law.
It’s a special tax regime for people relocating to Spain. For up to 6 years, employment income is taxed at a flat 24% (up to €600k), and you’re generally not taxed in Spain on foreign-source income.
For many Americans, that makes the financial transition much easier in the first years, especially if you have investments outside Spain.
It obviously doesn’t answer the lifestyle side of the decision, but financially, it can make a big difference if you qualify.
If you end up exploring the move and want to understand how (or if) you’d qualify, happy to help clarify the regime in more detail.
TheTravelingTwink@reddit
Following this as I’m planning to move there via NLV 🫡
Gloomy-doomy-happy@reddit
New Yorker here in Valencia 6+ years. Before here it was Italy & Perú….no regrets except for that paycheck, the trade-offs are worth however both for the kids, and our lifestyle and safety! If anyone wants to meet up for a beer sometime feel free to send me a message!
christylg197@reddit
I lived in Spain for one year and just came back to the US. There were aspects that I loved, but the job situation was not great. It was going to take a minimum of 2 years to homologate my husbands degree so he could work in the same field. And even then pay would be only about 1/3-1/4 of what he could make in the US. It doesn't make sense financially. Nor would it be possible to work in my field. Additionally, the bureaucracy and inefficiency is just incredible. It was so frustrating trying to get any paperwork done or tasks accomplished.
Downtown-Storm4704@reddit
No regrets, but it’s been hard. It really depends on how deeply you put down roots — job, home, friendships, maybe even marrying a local. If you truly integrate into the culture and community, you start to feel like you belong instead of just being a resident. That’s not easy though; many Spaniards have tight childhood circles, so breaking in can be tough. Dating a local helped build a bridge, but it wasn’t perfect.
If you don’t reach that level of integration, you never fully experience the reality of living there. It can end up feeling like a permanent vacation, slightly detached from real life — at least until something serious happens and you actually need the system and a real support network. When you need to navigate bureaucracy, rely on public services, build support, or get through a difficult period, that’s when you realize whether you’re truly part of the system and have a strong local network to depend on.
Like anywhere it really depends on how deeply you put down roots. If you live there long enough, integrate into the culture, build your life within the local economy and community and participate in society and life in Spanish, you start to feel like you belong — the closer you get to living like a citizen rather than an immigrant, the better it will become.
Fluffy_Claim6985@reddit
Mexican-American currently 3 years into living in Spain with weak Spanish. The best thing you could do for yourself is taking the chance. Life comes with different problems in Spain but you could always return.
I personally feel like the system takes care of my mental health beyond belief here. Medication, on-going check-ins and work laws that make it better for workers here in Spain. If you have the opportunity, do it
Additional-Ebb-2050@reddit
I don’t regret it. The biggest challenge you will face is employment and salary (very low).
You mentioned the need of improving your mental health. I think you will get a huge relief as soon as you move here —maybe after a week?
Good luck with your plan. I am an American citizen but I also hold a passport from a South American country. I am counting the days to hit the 2 year mark for applying to ES citizenship.
Tardislass@reddit
Being an immigrant is not easy and finding work and housing isn’t relaxing. I wish people would stop this myth about how immigration will relax you. It’s stressful. After you get it sorted out yes but the first few months will be intense.
Downtown-Storm4704@reddit
Yeah the job search in Spain is stressful as there's suprise suprise very few jobs and way too many overeducated applicants. Even if you do move here with flying colors and immigration success, you need stable work to sustain life if you plan to survive off the local economy. If you have a stable remote job, you'll do just fine
Additional-Ebb-2050@reddit
That’s a good point. I am not denying it. I just got blindsided as I have move continents 3 times now. You make a very valid especially for people who move and don’t work for a Spanish company.
YaBastaaa@reddit
Crazy !! US administration shames Puerto Rico and anyone who speaks Spanish. Have not figured out why no uproar.!!!!
YaBastaaa@reddit
US administration has insulted anyone with Spanish heritage and worst is that anyone who speaks Spanish in public are super conscious.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
5 months now. 0 regrets. After 3 days - including jet lag recovery - it felt like a huge burden was lifted from my shoulders. When you are in the US, you don't realize how much life there just messes you up. Trumpism, the media, the prices, the pace...
Around 3 days as well, I stopped carrying my passport. I realized the police are never going to randomly stop me. I don't have to worry about some paramilitary force grabbing me off the street because I'm an immigrant.
I have realized there is an innate inherent cruelty in the people of the US. I'm never going back.
Fine-Spite4940@reddit
don't know why you're being downvoted. it's true. everything that you said.
n8larson@reddit
My guess is the downvotes might be for calling the “innate cruelty” out without qualifying it as pretty limited to the M0|esters Always Get Amnesty voters who get the most press, and to the chosen very few who have now taken over the US government. At the local level there is a lot of kindness, patience, and charity. But I still voted it up.
Knowthyselves@reddit
In my town in Oregon the "local level" is being infiltrated by conservatives. It's like watching someone you live die a slow inevitable death. I had to leave. Heart broken still.
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
This is happening all over and I have it in my workplace as well here in NYC. It seems to have its roots in some kind of yearning for the 1960’s when life moved slower, you only needed a HS Diploma to get a decent job, many more whites and a not such a large Spanish population.
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
I agree about kindness, patience and charity at the local level opinion. However it seems to me that’s probably true of small-town USA and not anywhere where 75% of people actually live. I spoke as a generalization however the comment about mania about gun ownership and lack of education are 100% fact based. Want to make America great again? Make education a priority among parents and the general culture. Leaning teaches a work ethic (it takes effort to learn Algebra!) and an ability to analyze the pro’s and con’s of different arguments and ideas. I see an overall laziness and an addiction to entertainment (sports and TV and music) rather than addiction to learning and making oneself better. Education doesn’t solve every societal ill but if you notice? All the really advanced countries (Europe and Asia) people have great educational systems and people want to raise their kids there. That’s not really true here.
Maleficent_Return_76@reddit
I agree. America has become a mean-spirited culture and hyper-competitive (instead of community-based). The abundance of guns (in the millions) here vs Spain (with likely very few) tells you everything you need to know about the USA vs. Europe
Downtown-Storm4704@reddit
I absolutely agree. Every year more and more Americans are finally coming to their senses and leaving the hellscape that is the U.S.
JohnLothropMotley@reddit
Europe ends up with lots of guns too occasionally.
Nedgamell@reddit
Couldn’t agree more with your comments about the state of US these days. I always feel so much more relaxed when I’m out of the country - which is several times a year these days.
Dry_Personality8792@reddit
Amen! This is 💯 spot on.
I moved overseas and opened my eyes to the rest of the world. It’s a big beautiful planet. The U.S. is no longer the place to be , and sadly , it prob will never be again . ~ 70 million people + plus one orange blob took it there.
Top-Half7224@reddit
You are still in the honeymoon phase. How is your Spanish? The Spanish can be extremely cruel, especially to animals.
Rocky_Bukkake@reddit
yeah five months ain’t much time. could be everything you want and need, but views change quite drastically over the years.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
Yeah, I know I'm in the honeymoon phase. According to a lot of people, you are not allowed to have an opinion until you've been somewhere three years. Oh well. I have mine.
My Spanish sucks but I am working on it with a teacher.
People in the US can be extremely cruel, especially to animals.
smallreadinglight@reddit
Thank you for sharing this. We are on our way out to Eastern Europe in a few months. We visited 2 years ago and I didn't realize how much the US was weighing on me. I am praying to stop feeling like I do. This place is getting worse daily.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
Like I said, the feeling will go away almost immediately. You will be physically removed and the news won't be around you non-stop.
And, of course, do what you can now. Take social media and news apps off your phone. If you can't get rid of Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, etc., severely curtain your use of them. Unsubscribe or block YouTube channels. Keep focusing on the path forward and block out the noise.
Sufficient-Job7098@reddit
Immigrants have to keep up with news, they have to participate in social media. How an immigrant plans to get to know locals, their country, issues locals care about if immigrant removes themselves from news and social media?
News and social media is great way to improve and practice listening, reading and writing.
Mater of fact any person who is playing to immigrate and assimilate should start using media and news of their future host country before actually moving.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
I was referring to future immigrants still in the United States. They can start detoxing from the US while still there. That is why I advised OP to "do what you can do now." I was not giving her advice of what to do once she arrives in her new home.
Sufficient-Job7098@reddit
I was talking about them too. The person you are talking about is about to go to Eastern Europe. I am from Eastern Europe.
There we have events, problems, cultural things that are talked about on news. We use social media to talk about important or unimportant things that matters to us.
An immigrant will not be able to successfully integrate in Eastern Europe if they do not follow newer and refuse to get to know their country and local people.
smallreadinglight@reddit
Eh, a little bit of column A, a little bit of column B.
You still have to manage every day life. I'm also a parent and work for myself. It's enough to keep my head above water. I think the original commenter meant that I should start to divest from US news a bit to prepare mentally for a move to Eastern Europe.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
Yes, I was speaking with regard to US media. Sufficient Job seems to be a huge proponent of mainstream media and social media unwilling to accept any nuance.
HVP2019@reddit
In my opinion remove apps from your phone, remove yourself from news around yourself … is not nuanced.
I think minimize news and social media from your old country and focus on getting to know everything you have to know about people and events in you destination country, while having an opportunity to practice local language is way more nuanced take.
English isn’t my native, so maybe I am missing something…
Anyway Americans believe that Europeans know more about the world. But they also believe that paying attention to what is happening in the world is wrong.
An average Pole can easily name 3-5 events in US right now, can name US leader without googling.
Can an average American say anything about what is happening in Poland?
Sufficient-Job7098@reddit
Yes and management of life will be even harder for an immigrant abroad. They have to constantly absorb a lot of new information. They have to switch to using different language.
People move abroad to foreign country and then they complain: “no one told me how mentally exhausting it will be” .
No, we tried our best to warn about this.
smallreadinglight@reddit
I feel I can't at this point because ICE is getting closer and closer by the day. Reddit and Facebook is the only way I hear about where they are. I'm also a mom so I'm already severely isolated due to the way society is structured. That said, I try my best to curate my algorithm and keep my actual news consumption to only trusted sources.
The biggest weight I felt lifted was the constant underlying fear of gun violence. I didn't realize how much that affected me and how much better I felt when it was gone. August cannot come soon enough.
Slappy_san@reddit
The regime is not the people...
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
Enough people voted for the regime. Enough people who consider themselves to be good and morale are supporting the regime. We are each entitled to our own opinions.
Slappy_san@reddit
This isn't an opinion. A regime is not it's people.
David_R_Martin_II@reddit
Whatevs. My problem is also with a lot of the people. It's okay if you don't agree with that. You don't need to change how I feel.
Slappy_san@reddit
I'm not trying to. You have a problem with facts and what an opinion is. That's a shame and I'll just move on. Bye.
a_library_socialist@reddit
American Sadism - Chris Hedges
elise_michele@reddit
This!! The weight lifted off my shoulders by realizing I didn’t have to worry about random shootings or needing to spend thousands if I had to go to the hospital was amazing. It’s still stressful to try and settle in a new place, but it’s a much less scary type of stress than feeling like I have to constantly be vigilant of violence.
Also - the food tastes better!! And I feel better after eating it.
supragalactic@reddit
Nailed it
Affectionate-Ear3214@reddit
Moved from San Diego to Madrid 11mo so far. The challenge has been the paperwork every month I spend 30hrs on something else so far got the DNI, Health Card, passed the driving test after failing a couple of times but still no DL, have SS, transport card. Cost of living is not much lower than California, I was expecting half, somethings are much cheaper transportation being maybe 4-5x cheaper, rent and food is the same cost, found out the Dia brand supermarkets are much cheaper than other supermarkets. Getting good meat is challenging. Cell phone is 2x cheaper, Insurance is 120$/mo for the whole family (private PPO with no copays) thats 6x cheaper. The Spanish are very open, but will rarely invite you to their homes, its very difficult to play sports or join sports clubs, but the big advantage is for 45$ you can fly to Paris and grab breakfast and come back, like living in many other European countries you can travel everywhere cheapely, which is fantastic. I was expecting a much lower COL and much faster integration, but for now will stay, I just can't thing of going back to the US ans all the hate.
peterinjapan@reddit
An American friend of mine tried living in Spain, they had fun for a couple years, but we’re really frustrated by the bureaucracy, they literally couldn’t renew their visa in time because of the stupid bureaucrats refused to get off their stool and do their job, continually asking for more information when more information was needed, so one day they packed up and went home. Now they live in Hawaii.
jazzyjeffla@reddit
Been in Spain for about 7-8 years. Love it just the job situation makes me feel very uncertain about my future. Came here when I was young and comparing myself to my friends back in the US. I’ve got not stable career, living at my mom’s house(cause the COL in the big cities are too much on the salary), can’t put a down payment on a home. Very “far” behind the rest of my peers back home. This place is fantastic if you’ve got your own income from aboard or a good paying job here. Other than that is extremely challenging. I’ve hit that financial ceiling here and it’s hard to break past that
454k30@reddit
I want to move to Spain permanently. I lived there for three years and loved it. I’ve heard the real estate market is difficult though and that concerns me.
ith228@reddit
I don’t regret it, I actually loved it beyond words but I had to leave after 3 years to actually make a livable salary in the NL.
Pearl_is_gone@reddit
This doesn’t make any sense. Loved it beyond words, left.
An honest statement would be “many great parts, but overall an unfavourable package”
mp85747@reddit
It's pretty clear... It's wonderful, as long as you don't need to make a living there! ;-) In short, it's one of those places that are great for a vacation.
ith228@reddit
I didn’t contradict myself. I won’t qualify what I said to people who refuse to read.
vixenlion@reddit
I lived in Spain for 6 years and I moved back to America.
I didn’t regret it but wouldn’t move back either.
I didn’t like the paperwork and how the Spanish deal with it.
Move if you can.
javadesigner@reddit
Why would you not move back ? (asking because I'm thinking of eventually retiring in spain and am always curious why people move back out of spain)...
vixenlion@reddit
I was there for the extreme lockdown with Covid.
I could leave my apartment more than 3 times in a week.
The local government had car go around with a loud speaker saying not to leave your apartment.
I was self employed and all I got was a one time payment of 200 euros. I had my own business and paid a lot in taxes.
I lost a lot of money opening up a business there.
I didn’t like that the hacienda or another government agency could just take money out of my bank account.
That happened twice both times amounts being over 300€ never got it back.
If you are good with Spanish and had your own income it may be for you.
Don’t buy property there. Unless you have a German lawyer. Best advice I got was that from a Swiss lady.
I couldn’t in good faith buy a property there.
Cornfedmidwestbitch@reddit
Moved to Madrid from the Midwest and I love it here. Going on 6 years. Take the leap, if you find it’s not for you, you can always go back. Life is short! And fuck Trump!
thamiam@reddit
Lived here 6.5 years. Zero regrets. As others mentioned, it's like a weight of worry just gets lifted off your mind. There are difficulties, but they are more personal and it feels much less likely you will get swept up in someone else's politically or racially driven actions.
billdietrich1@reddit
It's all good except after 11 years here, I still haven't been able to learn to speak/hear Spanish.
obscure3rage@reddit
So you have absolutely no interaction with spaniards? 11 years is too long to not give AF about the country's language lol.
billdietrich1@reddit
I give AF, I'm just failing to learn it.
I married into a Spanish-speaking family, and I have primitive conversations with neighbors and storekeepers. But my skills are very low.
nonula@reddit
My life improved exponentially. I can’t quite remember what I was like before I moved to Spain. The friends I’ve made and the times I’ve had are irreplaceable. But, the transition from North American to Spanish culture is not the easiest thing ever. Otherwise, what I can advise, is be well prepared by connecting with people who have moved and learning as much as you can about different areas so you “know” the city you move to before you make the move; and maintain connections to folks back home, preferably by video. I have video calls with family about once a month, and stay in touch with friends often. Worse comes to worse, you can always return to the US, Spanish citizenship in hand, and re-establish yourself there. Buena suerte.
a_library_socialist@reddit
Absolutely no regrets. Especially looking at the US, it's worse than even I thought it would be.
Pecncorn1@reddit
I have been an immigrant for almost 3 decades now, in 6 different countries. I was born and raised on Guam and lived on the mainland for about 20 years. I understand the mental health part in these trying times but I am still in so many ways culturally American and no matter where I live the events there still weigh very heavy on me. I can't not care, probably even more so now that I am nearing the end of my run. IMO these things will follow you no matter where you go.
I lived 15 years in Central and South America and am a fluent Spanish speaker. I went to visit a friend in Madrid a few years ago and in three weeks there it reminded me of Colombia without the cocaine and openly friendly people. Because my Spanish is from Latin America, I can understand even the most challenging accents there, I found it difficult at times to understand some Spaniards. I would have to ask my friend, WTF did he say?
I had to return to the US at the beginning of last year because I didn't have a US driving license, the only thing Social Security, credit card companies will accept as I.D. They wouldn't accept my passport or military I.D. as proof, go figure. Anyway though after so long abroad I have to say I was surprised how friendly people were. I never talked to anyone about politics or religion though.
Anyway, go for it you can always go back. I doubt you will be able to take your eye off of the ball though. Sorry for the rambling comment.
Tardislass@reddit
Because people are friendly and quite frankly the US going through what Spain went through in the 20th century for 60 years. So pretty similar and there still a lot of fascism in Spain under the surface.
That said, do you have a job lined up? Unless you are coming to retire it’s incredibly difficult to find work. That’s why many young people still leave. The expats who stay are usually retired Americans or those who have a Spanish spouse and can do remote work or influencer. Staying for a few years is an option just save a lot of money before you come.
Pecncorn1@reddit
I think you misunderstood my comment. I'm an older boomer and have been retired for years now.
I suppose there is a parallel however slight to between the US and Spanish history. I think that's a bit of a stretch though. Not sure where you are getting 60 years from, Franco was only in power from 39 until he died in 75. I can't tar all Spaniards with the same brush but have met many outside of Spain that I had no interest in, they would have all been Falangists I'm sure. The friend I went to visit has a family that is divided along these lines today, one half can't talk to the other half.
I'm happily retired in Asia. I didn't mean to imply I went back to the US to stay, I just needed to get a current DL from there. I was struck by how friendly people were when I was there. A contrast to all the crazy shit I get from the news. The main point I meant to make was leaving will not be any less mentally exhausting for OP. The shit still creeps in.
DorianGraysPassport@reddit
I lived in Madrid for 7 years and it got increasingly loud, crowded, and costly. I still loved it and reflect fondly on my early years there shooting the shit with my crew in Lavapies without a care in the world. I don’t think I’d live there again, though
TheBlueFence@reddit
I don’t regret it so far, but im 2.5 years in now. My visa renewal will be up soon and I’m quite anxious I’m paying all this money in taxes and social security just to get kicked out.
greasemonk3@reddit
11 years here and nah I don’t at all
estrea36@reddit
Why is everyone in this thread essentially saying, "i dont regret moving to Spain, but i left spain"?
I get it in a philosophical sense of enjoying the time you spent there meaning you dont regret it, but it would be more helpful to OP if you explained what motivated you to leave.
ith228@reddit
Surprise!! It’s money/jobs, ósea lack thereof.
Jacob_Soda@reddit
I like Spain and I lived there for 5 months. Best moments of my life. Also some of the hardest too. I think unemployment is bad. Banks aren't open from 9-5 and only open to 9am-1pm then only one day a week it's open until 5pm. Weird stuff.
Low_Midnight1523@reddit
one of my uncles moved to Spain 10 year ago. and every time i talk to him i don't think he regrets it he is the guys that makes a room lightup where ever he go