Why are expats often so hard on other expats?

Posted by Lost-Raccoon-7450@reddit | expats | View on Reddit | 12 comments

I'm an American 30 year old woman who has been living in France since 2016, with a couple six month - 1 year breaks where my French husband and I lived in the US (where I'm from).

Over the years, I've had a really hard time making friends with other expat women in France and in other European countries (both Americans and/or other foreigners like me in Europe). Before I became a mom/turned 30, I used to go on coffee dates / happy hour dates with other female expats hoping to make a connection.

But every time it always felt like a massive d*&% measuring contest where we're competing to see who speaks the local language better, who has more "local friends", and who is better integrated.

For example, I've been laughed at one too many times for sharing that I really needed my French husbands' help with putting my CV in French, finding a job in France, setting up our rentals, utilities, bank accounts, and later a mortgage. My husband loves paperwork (where I hate paperwork) so I'm very lucky and grateful that he's always been eager to help, so I never presented needing him as a bad thing,....nonetheless, every time I've made myself vulnerable to others and acknowledged that I felt like I needed my spouse more here in France, in comparison to living in the US, I would get some kind of hurtful "I don't need my man to do all that" response. I've even had other women tell me that my spouse must not really be French or that most European men prefer more independent women so it must be because my French husband is fat that he does all that for me...

Frankly, I've felt bullied in these expat groups for not being feminist enough and for getting my visa through my marriage and son and not via a work visa.

Has anyone else ever had this feeling amongst other expats? What is the psychology behind these fellow expat women who make me feel so bad for not being a feminist American in Europe?

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MediumExercise4540@reddit

Easy solution: just cut them off from your life. Don't try figure them out.

JustinScott47@reddit

Because people are naturally socially competitive. When I was in Peace Corps, there was always one-upmanship among volunteers along the lines you describe: who spoke the language better, had more local friends, knew more about the culture, etc.

I'm a nerd cut from the "can't we all just get along?" cloth and never feel comfortable competing socially to put other people down, but it's the same in all non-expat parts of life. "Where is your house? Oh, we live in a nicer, safer neighborhood. Where do your kids go to school? Oh, you poor thing, our kids go to a private school..." It never ends.

Nausved@reddit

It's so weird to brag about making friends and fitting in, when said bragging makes people dislike you. (Are you actually making friends and fitting in, or are you just surrounded by acquaintances and colleagues who have to tolerate you?)

It's also weird to go to a meetup for expats/volunteers and then brag about how much you don't rely on other expats/volunteers for social activity. Why are you attending then?

Fanfarerere@reddit

Ego stroking. Nothing more.

mnunn44@reddit

To be honest some expats make being an expat their entire identity. And it’s a very American perspective in my experience. Some real pick-me bullshit. I’ve never had this from others.

You are not special for emigrating, you are not special for learning a new language or getting a work visa. Can it be an incredible feat to accomplish? Sure. But it’s not an entire identity and really all that nonsense is a way to feel superior to others. And this is why I avoid American expat groups. Part of the reason I left the US is that intense and competitive individualism. We need supportive communities to thrive not toxic competition barely disguised as friendship.

That said, on the occasion I’ve met another American by chance - they’re often kind and nice and want to connect on how difficult it can be to leave behind family or get set up in a new country (yes things like your first CVs or the mountains of paperwork involved!) or the funny mishaps that naturally happen to everyone who starts over in a new country.

Hopefully you can soon find a good group a friends (maybe they won’t be American haha) who support you!

TeamAccomplished6734@reddit

Interesting. The worst in Korea are by far the Brits. Some of the Canadians, too...but definitely the Brits.

Admirable-Willow-267@reddit

Resonated with this. The amount of gaslighting from others and failure to achknowledge their struggles/be supportive is astounding.

There's a lot of jealousy too, who has residency, who found a local partner, who is fluent in the language. There's so much judgement and don't feel any kind of warmth at all.

Ok_Nefariousness3226@reddit

The problem is primarily white privilege ... when living abroad "as an immigrant" Americans didn't want to be treated the way we treat immigrants, so expats were born... There are no expats in America only immigrants. But Americans aren't expats , you're an immigrant and call yourself such and you'll be much more respected. Or just stick to expats and have no friends or culture.

Giannandco@reddit

I haven’t encountered this living in the UK. I moved 6 years ago from the US, whenever I’ve run into another American expat it’s always as if we’re long lost friends. I’ve never come up against it with other expats from other countries either. I’m sorry you’ve had this experience, how sad. It’s tough learning to get along in a new country/culture, support from others going through the same thing is so helpful.