As someone from "the other side" - I don't actually mind this aircraft. It's not pretty (their F-16s and J-10s are better looking!) but it's a good workhorse for the PAF. Something like the Mirage F-1 was for the French or the Jaguar for the IAF. Sometimes you don't need the latest and greatest (even though it's getting upgrades), you just need a missile truck that you can deploy for cheap. The Jeff does that well enough.
It's designed to be in service for 25 years, but is already outdated. It was designed to be cheap, not effective.
The fact that even China won't use it is telling. The engine problems are well known ( even after the "upgrades") and the avionics are a decade behind what is acceptable. The lack of durability of the materials, has led to costly maintenance schedules. Of course the the lack of stealth, means it's survivability against current weapons systems is very low. Range and payload are a limiting factor.
The upgrades are sticking plasters, solving problems that shouldn't have been there in it's initial design stage.
There's more, but you get the idea.
There is absolutely NO independent evidence for this claim.
Even the supposed 6:2 kill ratio by Pakistani JF-17s against Qatari Rafales in 2021 was with under very specific and unrealistic scenarios. Although, the exact exercise conditions aren't known, independent sources suggest the situations simulated were extremely weighted towards the JF-17s.
\> There is absolutely NO independent evidence for this claim.
For which claim exactly. It's true that the Rafale was shot down by a J-10, but the MiG-29 was shot down by the JF-17, as far as I know.
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\^the only people who believe that a jf-17 managed to shoot down a rafale are brainwashed paxtanis.
Most likely it was a J-10C with the help of the SAAB Erieye.
\> The fact that even China won't use it is telling.
China doesn't use it, because it has no use for a light budget fighter. The JF-17, especially block 3 is still a pretty decent fighter, especially for it's cost and size.
\> The engine problems are well known ( even after the "upgrades")
No, they aren't. It uses the same engine as the MiG-29, it's not the best one but still serviceable.
\> and the avionics are a decade behind what is acceptable.
That's just not true. JF-17 block 3s are rather modern.
\> The lack of durability of the materials, has led to costly maintenance schedules.
That's again nonsense.
\> Of course the the lack of stealth, means it's survivability against current weapons systems is very low.
Which is literally the case for most Jets. Also, Pakistans enemy is India, which itself does't use any stealth jet.
\> Range and payload are a limiting factor.
Well, yeah, that's a factor for every light jet.
>It was designed to be cheap, not effective.
Which is a perfectly viable strategy. Pakistan isn't rich, having 50 decent planes is better for them than having 5 great ones.
>Of course the the lack of stealth, means it's survivability against current weapons systems is very low.
Pakistan's main geopolitical adversary, India, doesn't have stealth planes either. And is unlikely to have them in the next 10-20 years. In fact because of Indian procurement troubles, the Indian Air Force still has almost a hundred MiG-29 and Mirage 2000s, which depending on how much have been updated, can certainly rival the JF-17 in terms of capabilities/obsoleteness.
It's a bit lost in translation due to dialect, it refers to two completely different sets of Chinese characters that sound identical in spoken Mandarin (I'm not an expert in mandarin, so you can fact check me). The Chinese designation is FC-1 Xiaolong (meaning Fighter China 1, “Fierce dragon”).
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I'm not sure about others, but the bald guy in a blue uniform is Usman Yousaf, and he was a squadron leader in the PAF.
[https://www.dawn.com/news/1912122](https://www.dawn.com/news/1912122)
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All fighter jets are missile carriers in 2025 that’s how it works
I’m just memeing though, pakistan just had better systems than india did, not much to do with the individual plane
All I can do is just appreciate that they have successfully got the plane into service unlike the Indian homegrown tinyjet which has to undergo a million tests to enter service and 3 decades of development just for the iaf to order an upgraded version of it with another decade of development 🥱
None of the other companies a part of the selection process (Tata, L&T, and Bharat Forge) has ever made a flying aircraft. Asking them to build an advanced 5th-generation fighter is absurd and will cause tons of delay leading to government backtracks and a lack of confidence shown by the IAF. This whole situation will lead to another “Tejas 2.0” scenario and will add on decades worth of delays.
The j17 always leaves me conflicted as a Canadian.
Building a homegrown fighter is insanely difficult from an economic standpoint.
If Pakistan can do it, canada should be able to as well.
I know their economies are potatoes vs tomatoes.
Now I'm just rambling.
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