Battleborn LiFePo4 battery dangerous design flaw
Posted by Joyous0@reddit | overlanding | View on Reddit | 41 comments
There is a design flaw in popular Battleborn LiFePo4 batteries (12V, 100Ah and reportedly 50Ah) that causes the positive terminal to overheat above 250°F (120°C) under load or charging. The reason: there is plastic between the positive terminal and the busbar, only a screw is conducting the full load. The negative terminal is not affected due to different wiring. The heat melts the plastic, the screw becomes loose, worsening the situation over time. The BMS intermittently cuts out, this can be the warning symptom.
The issue is unfixable due to the sealed case. Many warranty claims and the issue itself were denied. If you have a Battleborn battery checking the temperature of the positive terminal under load would be a good idea from time to time. I don't see other safe solution than a recall and redesign of the positive terminal. This was a major oversight.
Video link in first comment.
Joyous0@reddit (OP)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP2yPY57Wjc
https://www.reddit.com/r/batteries/comments/1pj2o1z/battleborn_battery_issues/
Unkindly-bread@reddit
I’ve not watched the video yet, but am surprised. By my experience, Battle Born are way ahead of their competitors in all aspects of their battery design. 2013 to 2019 I worked for a third party test house, and we tore down and tested a lot of different lithium batteries, and BB’s were always at the top of the pack for design and safety, and they’re on my shortlist to buy in the spring.
redditRon1969@reddit
Have you seen all the videos/discussions of the failures of them lately? A $200 a Chinese battery is a better choice than a battle born imho.
Unkindly-bread@reddit
I have now. It’s disappointing, as they were light years ahead of the competition a few years ago.
211logos@reddit
I had good experiences with them too...back then. They were pioneers in US assembly of lithiums at that time. But competition is fierce now, and new ownership.
Worried-Peanut2722@reddit
Be sure to watch the video
Unkindly-bread@reddit
Yep, that’s a problem.
ok_if_you_say_so@reddit
They used to be. These days they are a joke compared to the alternatives. Overpriced junk. Will Prowse has several videos about the subject
SurfPine@reddit
That's a very informative youtube channel!
Sufficient_Math9095@reddit
Looks like the negative bar may have an even worse issue… new video from Will. Glad I didn’t buy any of these!
https://youtu.be/2m7DSCKO-Bo?si=zPklX7RMqAaV8e8Y
Reasonable-Teach7155@reddit
The name of the company alone was enough to make me avoid. I'm not surprised at all lol
Goomba543221@reddit
Nevada is the Battle Born State, The Batteries are made in Nevada. Just like California is the Bear state and Bear State Construction is based in California. Its not hard to figure out where the name comes from.
Hugh_Jascock2@reddit
Correction: Batteries are designed and assembled in NV with Chinese parts 😉
Goomba543221@reddit
This is true, they currently use Chinese Cells for the batteries they build in Nevada. Though they are on the verge of scaling their Dry Electrode process to start producing their own cells domestically. If they accomplish that, then it changes everything for the company.
Hugh_Jascock2@reddit
DO you really think the company will last that long??
Their stock went from a high of $150 last year to .40 this week and is now at $4 only after a 10:1 reverse split.
Not it is coming to light that there is a design flaw in their base 100A battery that could sink the company..... but hey that's just me!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fD3yaRvp3o
Goomba543221@reddit
Should have scaling done in months. This Design flaw coming to light has actually been pointed out several times over the last 7 years and Will Prowse even acknowledged it 3 years ago. But maybe its still coming to light to sink the company? If the company was to go bankrupt sell off all their assets and pay debt, it would leave them with around 45 million when its all said and done. So Bankruptcy and fire sale would put the current price around 3.80, so not surprising the price bounced from the 3.5-4 level, its basically zero risk at this price.
Large Block buys on Tuesday after the r/S. Those Large buys have yet to have corresponding sells. A huge reason for the r/S is because many Institutions have bylaws preventing them from buying stocks listed under 3 bucks. 60 Million shares sold in October between 1.25 and 1.35 a share in their offerings sold in a couple days, these were not retail buying these up. All the extra shares offered to the under writers were also all bought. People with money are betting its going to do just fine, they have already proven the ability to scale their own Cells and now they have over 30 Million Cash on hand to fund the scaling.
Maybe you are right, or maybe the people spending millions to buy up the shares of this company the past couple months are right. Then there is the DOD making it so after next year they cannot buy any batteries with Chinese parts. Guess who Stryten sells to? I think the people with the money buying these shares, are going to be right over you, but hey thats just me.
elehman839@reddit
Thank you for the analysis.
Hugh_Jascock2@reddit
Whatever helps you sleep at night😂
Goomba543221@reddit
Well I was buying it between 3.40 and 3 bucks and just sold at 4.25. Im sleeping fucking great!
Reasonable-Teach7155@reddit
Nothing is hard to figure out I have the sum total of human knowledge in my hand. I just don't care. And it still sounds stupid.
Goomba543221@reddit
Fair Enough.
notCrash15@reddit
They're based out of Nevada. "Battle Born" is our state motto
bob_lala@reddit
no, it isn't. the motto is "All for our Country"
notCrash15@reddit
I can't believe I managed that
bob_lala@reddit
'battle born' is on the flag, so I can see why. state motto's are pretty obscure!
Reasonable-Teach7155@reddit
Still sounds like batteries w punisher skulls
bob_lala@reddit
the name appeals to a certain mentality
Shmokesshweed@reddit
Right? 100% sounds like shitty batteries for insane prices. And turns out, that's true.
Maleficent_Ant_3392@reddit
This is very concerning to me as we have a 270 Ah Battle Born battery sitting under our inverter which is located under the bed in our RV. Our inverter, which is a Victron, died on us after just 3 months of use which I found to be very strange as Victron makes good products. Now I wondering if the heat from the Battle Born battery fried something on the inverter since the battery is right under the inverter. 🤔
DEADB33F@reddit
Has the company responded?
Are they still denying there's an issue?
Joyous0@reddit (OP)
BattleBorn Batteries responded: melting is a safety feature, not a design flaw
Thin-Telephone2240@reddit
Yes. Will Prowse just read the company's response. All spin, obfuscation and denial.
DEADB33F@reddit
Heh, I'm watching that video right now. Utterly crazy response by BB.
...for anyone else following this
clauderbaugh@reddit
This good to know, thanks.
clauderbaugh@reddit
Follow up response from BB: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fD3yaRvp3o
211logos@reddit
I'm no mechanical engineer, but looking at the video and how the terminal is secured—with a nut and jam nut on the bolt—seems less than ideal. And obviously it worked loose. I know that it's maybe too easy to apply incorrect torque on the first nut when tightening or adjusting the second, so assembling that could be prone to misfires.
What would be the standard for securing that? I would think not using a bolt there would be far better, but again, what do I know?
magniankh@reddit
This is why I am skeptical of lithium ion battery banks for any larger application. A quick Google is all you need to educate yourself on how frequent of a problem house fires are due to them. My BIL is a firefighter in Florida (hot state), and says he will never buy an EV as long as they use li-ion batts.
For my overlanding build in using marine AGM batteries. Better than lead acid, plenty of amp hours.
legos_on_the_brain@reddit
Lfp is safe. It's not the same as lithium ion.
magniankh@reddit
Oh dang, I haven't even researched this battery type yet. Thanks for the correction! I thought that was their model number. Will be learning about this today now.
NowFreeToMaim@reddit
Why would you even spend that much money to even find out?
Tonkatte@reddit
Thank you for bringing this to our attention!