Albania and Serbia - Does it look right? come with your opinions.
Posted by Personal_Garden6538@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 384 comments
Posted by Personal_Garden6538@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 384 comments
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
I think that all countries except Serbia, Albania and their child don't give a damn about Serbia and Albania.
Iapetus404@reddit
based
TheGuy839@reddit
Seriously. Most of EU countries think that we are all in EU and dont even think about Balkan as a whole. Basically same mentality as towards children who play outside in park and occasionally scream too loud
Luukosaurus@reddit
So many people in western europe don't even know Serbia is not a part of the EU
Senior-Profession711@reddit
It would be nice, but it isn’t true. In Western European countries, being from Estonia or Slovakia is viewed more positively than being from Serbia, even though all three countries are small. I’m speaking from my own experience.
Dependent_Rip2887@reddit
As it should. Being from serbia should be a red flag.
Specialist_Elk140@reddit
They think it's cold out there
ERShqip@reddit
They think the balkans is a country probably
itsalonghotsummer@reddit
> Basically same mentality as towards children who play outside in park and occasionally scream too loud
That is excellent
ERShqip@reddit
Vucic and Rama dont give a sht about serbia and albania while they steal funds used to build up our countries instead they buy yachts and mansions and sip tea with one another while laughing in our faces
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Very much true.
VerkoProd@reddit
“their child”😭
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
Glad you said it. I could have been banned for saying same thing in a similar manner.
adyrip1@reddit
I don't think Romania has any issues with Albania, but historically we do have a good relationship with Serbia.
Now Kosovo is a different matter, as Romania doesn't recognize it, but has little to do with the relationship with Albania.
Shtapiq@reddit
Our national anthem was written by a Romanian so… can’t have anything bad with you guys I guess.
Heydavid17@reddit
Oh boy… if just more Albanians had the same way of thinking as you, then things would be much nicer.
Additional-Gur7915@reddit
No Albanian thinks negatively of Romanians. If anything, we see them as closer due to being native Balkan. (Kosovo Albanian here).
Tomorr3@reddit
Most of Albanians (90%) don't care about romania. So I don't get your comment
Heydavid17@reddit
I'm certain it's just a VERY LOUD and annoying minority, but I just find it insane how social media (twitter, facebook, etc.) keeps "recommending" me, all kinds of racist junk.
Especially when it comes to sports, I just can't watch football game with a peaceful mind, without seeing some crazy stuff that has happened behind the scenes. Like recently, when Bosnia and Romania played, out of nowhere, I got "recommended" all these crazy racist posts from Bosnians, Romanians, Serbians, Albanians. Kinda the same stuff the past two years, when Romania played "Kosovo" - I honestly hope that match won't be played in March either - where all 4 matches were just trouble.
All in all, I just generally hate how these no life insane people(minority) cause so much trouble for normal people. Plus, I think it's nice to see that an Albanian at least recognize that the national anthem was composed by a Romanian, just to recognize some sort of friendly relation between nationalities.
Elegant_Wash6321@reddit
Twitter is a special kind of shithole. Internet trolls all around with way too much time on their hands.
Tomorr3@reddit
All this hooligan stuff was started by romanians actually. We never really cared about romania beforehand.
Most of the educated Albanians know that. It still doesn't make us feel any closer to romania tbf.
Heydavid17@reddit
The hooligan violence with Bosnia, yes, I'll absolutely agree with that, that some disgusting Romanian traitors caused that. Some other incidents, - related to other games - I believe can be debated further.
Also very much fair, no expectations either that you should feel closer to Romania because of the national anthem, all cool bro.
Tomorr3@reddit
Why, what did Kosova Albanians do to you first?
Heydavid17@reddit
I haven't been to these games, but just from what I personally understand, so there could be some missing info and I'm just sticking to the main points, so lots of details missing.
First game in Pristina, June 2023 - "Kosovo" fans boo the Romanian anthem and show unacceptable behavior towards the Romanian players, and Romanian fans were barred from attending the game.
Second game in Bucharest, September 2023 - Romanian fans retaliated and ultras eventually showed the nationalistic banner "Basarabia e România" & "Kosovo je Srbija", which made the players of the away team leave the field for nearly an hour before the match was resumed.
Third game in Pristina, September 2024 - "Kosovo" fans repeat their actions from the first game, with trash now also being thrown on Romanian players.
Fourth game in Bucharest, November 2024 - Romanian fans were warned ahead of the game by the football association to behave, which they did, until the very last minutes were Rrahmani caused problems with Alibec. After this pointed, players from "Kosovo" were seen making the eagle symbol as a provokation, which led to Romanian fans chanting "Serbia" in response. The players left the field once again, and trashed the dressing room. Romania was eventually awarded the victory.
I see it as, a small fire became like a erupting volcano, with provocation from both sides, which caused bigger and bigger trouble. Now that both teams are in the same path for the World Cup, let's be honest, this can only get ugly IF both teams can surprise and eliminate their first opponents first, but if they both are eliminated, they will be forced to play a friendly anyways.
Romanians, from what I've seen, have expressed more and more that they just wish to avoid "Kosovo" completely in any further football games, despite we have 3 wins and a draw.
Probably the shortest way I could put details on, but there's far more to it. Plus, we also have intense moments with other teams as well, like Hungary, but that is for historical reasons.
Personally, I also see a kind of rivalry with teams like Greece(eliminated us from 2014 World Cup play-off), Montenegro(multiple recent matches), Albania(eliminated from EURO 2016) & Turkey(Upcoming World Cup play-off). None of them in any hostile way, just as some fun Balkan mini-feuds which end with wishing the better team best of luck in the end.
Tomorr3@reddit
Well, you are wrong. It was your ultras who started it:
https://www.koha.net/en/sport/vazhdojne-provokimet-e-renda-te-tifozeve-rumune
It seems like they have a fetish for unbased hatred
fk_censors@reddit
Why would you see a population of 25 million people or so in a different light based on the trolling of a few individuals? That makes you appear way worse (with low IQ tribal thinking) than Romanians as a whole, who generally seem to understand individual accountability better than you.
I bet that if you did a random survey of Romanians - even of general soccer fans who are not part of that specific hooligan group - most would probably say nice things about Albanian and Kosovo. Trolls only do their thing because people like you get triggered - and this silly reaction probably amuses them.
Tomorr3@reddit
Oh yeah, trolling with war criminals should just be ignored. Take a hike!
You just confirmed me my bias.
fk_censors@reddit
Trolling with words, and only words, is not that serious. People in higher IQ societies (like the US) don't take that stuff seriously.
Tomorr3@reddit
When does it become serious? When you actually start genociding them or sth? 😑
fk_censors@reddit
Yes. Physical actions are serious. Words are just sounds made in the air, they don't hurt anyone. A loud engine with a high decibel count is far more harmful physically than some stupid words. (I don't even support those words by the way). But that's not my argument - instead, my argument is that soccer hooligans have the role of demoralizing the other team, and they should only use words - not physical actions. And any professional athlete should be immune to words, if they are trained correctly. The New Zealanders use the Haka for the same purpose, a really aggressive yell and dance, for example.
Tomorr3@reddit
Words literally hurt more than weapons. You are on to nothing.
fk_censors@reddit
Weapons literally hurt more than words. Literally.
Heydavid17@reddit
Ah, so there were a few in the very first game, just to provoke.
That's the thing, from the media I've seen, it was portrayed as there weren't any - which to be fair, are people that no one wants.
Good to learn, cheers bro.
fk_censors@reddit
In the last game, the Kosovo players started it because they needed to win and it was the 90th minute and they had no chance of scoring. So they tried the "racism" card, first by provoking a fight with Denis Alibec, but he was too soft (Romanians are not as violent as Albanians) and that ploy didn't work. Then they went to provoke the ultras who responded, ironically "Serbia Serbia". They were clearly laughing in the images. The Kosovars pretended to take it seriously in order to get the automatic 3-0 win but it didn't work. It was their only gamble to win the group, lacking the ability to score, and I understand why they did it...
Tomorr3@reddit
We are talking here about the very first match, not the most recent one
fk_censors@reddit
In the first match, the Romanian ultras provoked, it's true. But only mildly so and mostly in jest. Plus, they are not representative of the Romanian people and attitudes, they are not the brightest spokespersons for the Romanian nation.
Tomorr3@reddit
You sure about that? https://www.koha.net/en/sport/vazhdojne-provokimet-e-renda-te-tifozeve-rumune/
No hate, but I couldn't care less about romanians. I just don't understand how you are lucky enough to have no animosity with any balkan country and your hooligans still managed to embarrass themselves. It seems like you are trying to hard to fit in.
fk_censors@reddit
It was mild. Yelling some bullshit like "Serbia" or "Kosovo is Serbia" is mild - launching torches, ripping seats, or throwing stuff at players is serious provocation worthy of jail time. But just yelling some stupid, provocative words to get a reaction out of the opposing players is very mild - and professional players should not react to some sounds. By the way, you are right about the hooligans, I don't like or condone their behavior, I would never chant something hurtful (even to troll some thin skinned low IQ soccer players) and I'm pretty sure most Romanians are like me, and not like the hooligans.
Tomorr3@reddit
Yeah, because that usually happens all the time 🙄🤨
What kind of standards you have there in romania, dude? 😅
fk_censors@reddit
Mostly normal people. Probably similar to Albanians - and Balkan people can definitely take a joke.
Tomorr3@reddit
I am starting to doubt it, especially judging from your weird comments.
fk_censors@reddit
Not sure how I am so weird. I've never hurt an Albanian in my entire life and I got along great with the few I've met, including one from Kosovo. They were calling me "madjup" and I was calling them "bebelush" (it means little baby in Romanian) and we were joking around and nobody was offended. Just Balkan people being Balkan...
Tomorr3@reddit
Great for you!
fk_censors@reddit
I'm not sure I understand your comment - you don't think those actions, that actually directly lead to the destruction of property, or to people getting hurt, are more serious provocations than any chant?
Tomorr3@reddit
Whatever, dude. Byebye
Toni78@reddit
You mean they don’t care in thr sense that they do not have negative feelings?
adaequalis@reddit
i can tell you that 95% of romanians do not have negative feelings towards albania. they have no feelings towards albania at all actually. it’s just seen as a random balkan country. probably most don’t even know that albania is not in the EU or that albania is majority muslim
Tomorr3@reddit
We generally don't have any feelings about romanians, be it positive or negative. Same as we don't care about somalia.
The ones we usualle hate are serbs
Whispperr@reddit
I think too many people believe what the football fans/ultras groups are saying/doing, when in reality those ultras groups are just hooligans looking for anything to be mean.
Normal people(football fans included that are not part of those ultras groups!) will not any have any issues with the otber country and be largely neutral.
nefewel@reddit
Albanians are generally decent people. They just have louder morons.
ERShqip@reddit
Most Albanians like Romanians even ultra nationalists who thinl in historical terms think we are related (illyrianxdacians) but its once again POLITICS that shows its ugly head since you know keep them divided and fighting so they dont see us steal billions in funds and aid that was meant to help the people 😊
First-Egg-713@reddit
I have never heard any genuine negative opinion of romania or romanians from albanians, at least not ones from albania.
If anything opinion is neutral.
Diaspora here in canada and usa usually get along well. Ironically albanians and greeks get along very well here in canada lol.
canyoubelieveitt@reddit
No. Bulgaria is very russophilic, Serbian ties to Russia are not a negative thing here. Serbian historical backstabbing is the reason we dont care if Serbs lost Kosovo etc. But I wouldn't call it favoring Albania either, we dont care about Albania there are no Albanians here.
drminjak@reddit
Macedonia would prob be more towards serbia because of albanian invasion in 2003
Aggravating_Key2725@reddit
As opposed to the eight decades Macedonia spent occupied, colonised and oppressed by Serbs?
drminjak@reddit
Lol, they were so occupied, colonised and oppressed they didn't want to leave yugoslavia
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
Hahahaahhahahaha
Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit
What is so funny, was there a war? Did the macedonians start it?
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
No the Macedonians just banned the use of albanian language and flag even though there was a very large minority of albanians there.
drminjak@reddit
Lots of misinformation, neither Albanian or Albanian flag were banned in general, they were banned from public institutions (foreign language and a foreign flag, why should they be allowed in public institutions in macedonia).
The soldiers that invaded them entered Macedonia illegally from Yugoslavia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_insurgency_in_Macedonia
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
Because the albanian minority was and is a big part of North Macedonia hence the 2018 recognition of the language officially.
Once again the Albanian state had no part in this, so there was no “albanian invasion” mr.Serb.
drminjak@reddit
So what if it's a big MINORITY? why should flags of foreign countries be hoisted over public buildings and languages of foreign countries be used in public insitution? Also, there was a albanian invasion, albanians entered illegally through kosovo and invaded macedonia.
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
How can it be an invasion you moron when the Albanian state is not affiliated with it and albanians itself are the biggest minority? Go brush up your english and learn what invasion is.
Well as of 2018, Albanian is an official language so you are crying over nothing.
I think I am talking to a wall. Bye bye.
drminjak@reddit
It's an invasion done by albanians, an albanian invasion. Albanians within macedonia didnt rebel, macedonia was invaded by a foreign force that entered from kosovo that comprised of albanians.
You seem to be an average 83 iqer, forgetting our original topic and instead talking about events in 2018, while also ignoring the definition of an invasion because it doesnt fit your agenda. Bye bye.
ERShqip@reddit
My brother in christ invasion means one nation declares war officially on another nation albania never did that in fact albania steered clear of it its albanians that had protests in macedonia as duel citizens its theyre right to protest jesus dude your turning into trump "i ended a war between albania and azerbajan" 🤦
InterestingStation82@reddit
Not sure what trump has to do with anything, but anyways an invasion is simply a foreign army taking land by force. An army of albanians invaded macedonia from kosovo. An invasion. If that hurts your feelings i cant help you.
SnooSuggestions4926@reddit
dude you got so butthurt you pulled the 83 iq fake study which is ironic since the study puts you guys in the 80s too😂
Dunedan8@reddit
As a bulgar (hope the Flair is up) I sympathise more to Serbia. Culturally similar to. On the way to Europe. We have similar issues. Albania seems wild, foreign, weird.
determine96@reddit
This is true, and I also think they are closer to us, but I'm pretty sure most of them don't think like this.
They see in us only the negative from my experience and we are like their nightmare.
Not it historical, state relations stuff like they are afraid that we gonna attack them or something, but they see us as a worse version of them, as an abomination of a Serb.
Glittery_Marshmallow@reddit
I think I always see you saying this. You really have to start meeting real people and not just angsty internet overlords. People don't have you, you are bratche bugarche.
determine96@reddit
I don't need to meet "real" people to have such an opinion.
And as I said, I don't think or I'm not positive that you hate us.
And this isn't based only by reddit.
Like I have seen a Bulgarian woman on FB saying that she is married to a Serb, but that Serbs don't like us, and I have seen her profile not a bot with a picture with her husband and pictures from Serbia.
And I know even this is subjective, and this isn't true for everyone in Serbia, but it is present in the culture.
Like with us and Romanis or Macedonians, even tho with Macedonians is only historical, it's more similar to Bulgaro-Romani one by my opinion.
We say for almost every outrageous, untestfull thing a "Gypsy" one and what to think when I see Serbs using "Bulgarian" for the same stuff..
I'm also not saying that there isn't base for it, but it is what it is, that's why I said that Serbs don't think they are close to us.
If we look it at every aspect it's like this.
You are closer to Croats and the other "Yugos" in many aspects, but because of the wars in the 90's you still have some resentment left you pretend sometimes you aren't.
Glittery_Marshmallow@reddit
No, it is used "gipsy". You are just really into this, like you enjoy it and want to feel a certain way. Internet echo chamber is your basis.
Bilbolbu@reddit
What the fuck, Bulgaria and Bulgarians are very rarely, if ever, mentioned in every day discourse here.
determine96@reddit
I haven't said you constantly think about us, I'm saying from my experience what common opinions from Serbs I have seen when Bulgaria and Bulgarians are mentioned.
Sowa96@reddit
As a Serb from Bosnia, I see no general negative opinion about Bulgaria, except if mentioned in the WW1 context.
We also got fairly along Bulgarians during a work and travel program in the USA. Also Romanians.
Probably parts of Serbia might have more negative sentiment due to being closer, but I'm not aware of that much.
harvestt77@reddit
Have you ever been to Albania?
ERShqip@reddit
Considering nearly 20k golobordas (albanian-bulgarians) live in albania and have for 100s of years i doubt it i have to many bulgar friends in newyork have been to bulgaria with said friends and got a lot of love especially since as i said we have a LARGE bulgar community in Albania who have intergrated for a long time one of my closes friends is a golobordas as well as a girl ive been seeing is golobordas so its 50/50 🤷♂️
Not to mention a lot of bulgars mention that 1000s of albanians fought with bulgars against serbs in bulgaria in the second balkan war
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Okay. Thanks for your opinions. We may be slightly more backward. but we are improving:)
Dunedan8@reddit
I've never been to and Albanians I've met fit the Turkish meme stereotypes you see online 😂. But I'd love to explore you're beaches and mountains.
deathgang12@reddit
Turkey leans heavily on Alb
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
They don't care. I could bet they prefer Russians to us.
_MekkeliMusrik@reddit
Only delusionals likes Russia, there are men who worship russian women but generally speaking average turk likes Albanians more (also the opinion on serbia is kinda bad because of the sympathy for bosniaks.)
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
That is exactly what i had in mind.
_MekkeliMusrik@reddit
well half of the russians are male so Albanians are more loved in terms of rate lol
Diligent-Owl1321@reddit
We like Albanians. When I first started usng Reddit, I was actually suprised to see Albanians hating on Turks, lol.
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
*Ottomans. In real life we love Turks.
OverallPhrase4623@reddit
lol
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
No they don’t.
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
NOT TRUE
Extension-Garlic-822@reddit
Same with Bosnians
Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit
If u ask Slovenians (not politicians), i think we are much more pro serbian
Stverghame@reddit
I sincerely doubt that.
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
Yeah, nobody in Slovenia likes Albanians these days. Alsp, if a Kosovo recognition would be put on a referendum it would lose.
East-Raccoon135@reddit
Please report these comments to the sub.
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
Why, just facts. Dont cry about it, rather educate and improve.
East-Raccoon135@reddit
Improve how??
Tomorr3@reddit
Cry some more racist 😎
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
🫡🤡
Tomorr3@reddit
You can't clown me when you actually think, that your country is relevant, dude.
Now go do sth productive with your life
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
Its Ok🫡🤡
Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit
You can, but as a slovene i am 100% sure of it
Stverghame@reddit
I mean, you probably know better, but I haven't really seen many pro-Serbian Slovenes, it seems like quite a rare sight.
DekadentniTehnolog@reddit
Its not about being pro-serbian but around 30% of kranj are albanians from Kosovo and macedonia so maybe they have bad expirience with them
Stverghame@reddit
Then a different phrasing would be more fitting. They are likely "more anti-Albanian than anti-Serbian", rather than being pro-Serbian.
Tomorr3@reddit
Whatever dude, we have our prime ministers who love & have sex with each other, why would we care about slovenians 🤷🏻♂️
Stverghame@reddit
Why would we care about anyone?
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
I don’t know, I’ve always had excellent relations with them (I worked for a Slovenian company), and there are plenty of them in Belgrade. Whenever I heard about any issues involving Serbs, it was usually because of the diaspora being unbearable and rude (which is true, they are obnoxious) — nothing more than that.
Stverghame@reddit
Being good with you doesn't mean the nation in general is pro-Serbian though. Idk how you always mix that up.
Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit
Its not 30% my friend, im born and lived in Kranj, there are plenty, but 30% is gross exaggeration
DekadentniTehnolog@reddit
Ok then. It stuck in my head because I spoke with some locals
Arktinus@reddit
Yeah, locals tend to overestimate the number of foreigners. If you ask a Slovene from any city, they'll probably say half of the people are Albanians/Serbs/Bosnians etc.
I often read/hear people saying how it's rare or impossible to hear people speak Slovenian on the streets, but then when I'm in the city, I mostly hear Slovenian.
Any disdain towards the Albanians, Serbs or Bosnians does come from them not even trying to learn Slovenian, though, abd expecting us to speak their language. Not all of them, but a lot of them.
DekadentniTehnolog@reddit
I have to say I'm quite often in Slovenia. Mostly in Brezice and Krsko. However sometimes I go to the western part and I also hear only slovenian. Maybe because I mostly visit smaller cities? Somehow I always end up in a small bar with angry slovenians
Likaboy@reddit
Not lately..
NihilisticMynx@reddit
I agree.
New_CremeSAA5332@reddit
what makes you think Algeria is more leaned towards Serbia? (if you are talking about having good terms with Yugoslavia back in the day then that’s a different story)
Ill_Click_8365@reddit
Agreed with Russia, but my personal opinion:
Don't waste your words
on the brotherhood of Slavs.
The Brotherhood of workers
, and no others. (Mayakovskiy)
mikey_tr3@reddit
Although trade and businesswise Turkey can be deemed neutral, Turkey is a lot more pro-Albanian. The reason is most Albanians are Muslims and Turkey supports Muslims in the former Ottoman lands. Albanian diaspora in Turkey is more populous than Albanians in Albania. Still, Christian and atheist Albanians hate Turkey, you can see them cursing at Turks at every opportunity
Stukkoshomlokzat@reddit
My anectode is that I, as a Hungarian don't know anyone who prefers Serbia over Albania (given that the person knows what Albania is, because a lot of them don't even know that). Don't mix the bromance of Hungarian and Serbian overlords and corruption partners with the feelings of the actual people.
Hungarian nationalists tend to feel empathy towards Albania, becasue they see Albanians in Kosovo as an analogy for minority Hungarians living outside Hungary.
Hungarian liberals tend to feel empathy towards Albania, because they see Serbia as a bully and enemy of the West.
I like Albania because I think their language sounds cool. I don't hate Serbians either, I am neutral towards them.
More_Donut337@reddit
Oh I thought your nationalists didn’t like us because we are friendly with Romania.
Stukkoshomlokzat@reddit
Hungarian nationalists know very little about most things. I don't think they know that either.
Ill_Click_8365@reddit
Not just Hungarian, that's relevant to nationalists all over the world.
HumanMan00@reddit
This map isnt accurate - light blue doesnt cover the boarders of Serbia.
erionei@reddit
Kosovo is a de facto independent country with its own international relations. It would be inaccurate not to include it whether you recognize it or not.
HumanMan00@reddit
We agree to disagree. I still think if we work at it we can figure something out. Call me a romantic 😁
Aggravating_Key2725@reddit
The abuser refusing to let his victim go is not romance.
HumanMan00@reddit
I am not Milosevic and they r not UCK.
I refuse to take guilt for how previous generations handled shit as i didnt ask for it nor did i support it.
Miss me with that generational guilt BS as we r stuck in an abusive loop (Balkan as a whole) because of that.
No_Row_8284@reddit
Happy independence day of Albania!
ERShqip@reddit
Ayyy thanks bro where are you from
No_Row_8284@reddit
Romania, I visited Albania this year and I really liked:D
ERShqip@reddit
Visited bucharest really beautiful 👍also did you know we also have a large community of Albanian/Romanians in Albania called qopan?
No_Row_8284@reddit
Oh I didn't know about it but I did some research now and I found it.
I was looking for the word "Qopan", in Romanian it should be "Cioban"(Çoban) which makes sense, we use this word when referring to shepherds. Is it the same for you?🤔
ERShqip@reddit
Yup exactly the same i used qopan from the south of Albania the north used Coban which means shepard theres acually 100s of words Albanians and Romanians use that are exactly the same 😁👍
It is said the Cobje in Albania came to Albania 100s of years ago from Romania because of Ottomans and became one of the family
No_Row_8284@reddit
I learned something new, I can be happy for the rest of the day lol😆. My brother has an Albanian girlfriend by the way
ERShqip@reddit
My cousins father is a Coban btw
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Thanks :)
MLukaCro@reddit
Interestingly enough, Croats from Kosovo (Janjevci) are actually more fond of Kosovar Serbs than Kosovar Albanians. But, Croats from Croatia and Bosnia do overwhelmingly support Albania.
Tomorr3@reddit
There were croats from Kosova?!
MLukaCro@reddit
Yes, mostly settlers from Dubrovnik during 13th and 14th centuries. Most of them lived in Janjevo and Letnica, with the population number of just under 10k in 1991 They massivley fled in the 90s as a result of combined pressure from Milosevic regime, but from local Albanian population as well.
gixm0@reddit
Any source on the Albanian thing? Seems like Serbian propaganda that just got repeated by some journalists. I'm not aware of the KLA targeting any of the civilian population there. The 200 or so Croats there tend to vote for Albanian political parties
MLukaCro@reddit
https://hrcak.srce.hr/file/467182
Page 10:
Tomorr3@reddit
Excuse me, but the article says that both serbs and Albanians were trying to destroy everything croatian. So, why hate us more?
MLukaCro@reddit
I have never said that Kosovar Croats hate Albanians.
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
I listened to an interview by an Albanian catholic priest telling about situation in the past. Allegedly Croats had settled since Ottoman period and then were joined by other Albanians who could not afford to live in cities, unless they converted and so on. Small communities get the short end of stick during such situations, unfortunately. It was such in Ottoman period, i could figure it was no different during Yugoslavian period either. I did not pay much attention much to what the priest said about Croats because i was paying attention to muslim by day and christian by night explanation.
gixm0@reddit
I'll take it with a grain of salt, keep in mind after 89 Albanians were kicked out of all state institutions. And Josip is Zef in Albanian no idea where "Jasap" comes from. Also traditionally people married based on religion. Janjevci would often marry Catholic Albanians from Busi a village 7km away. They were quite integrated with their surroundings.
Tomorr3@reddit
Well if they were more fond of serbs than Albanians, then no wonder 😆
MLukaCro@reddit
Nor really an excuse to throw people out of their homes. They were more fond of Serbs due to similar language and religion.
Their tale is a tragic one, Milosevic (Serb) regime wanted them gone and Albanians wanted them gone. Doomed, whoever they could have picked to side with.
Tomorr3@reddit
Then they were done a favor by bringing them closer to yugoslavs. I really mean no hate here.
Well, Albanians probably wanted them gone because they probably hated Albanians too. They were unwise in their decisions. We don't have a historical hatred for croats.
MLukaCro@reddit
What decisions? They didnt take up any arms. They were living peacfully, until a war started between two much larger side who both wanted them gone. Idk how you can blage them for their own expulsion when they have drawn no swords and shot no bullets.
Tomorr3@reddit
In their decisions to not fight with the ethnic majority of population in Kosova. There were literally Kosovo Albanians who fought alongside croatia.
MLukaCro@reddit
So you are actually saying that because they didnt actuvely fight together with the Albanians, they deserved their expulsion? Sheeesh.
What does Kosovar Albanians fightning alongside Croatia have to do with the Kosovar Croats? These are two separate things. We in Croatia are grateful for all who defended Croatia in the 90s including Albania. And Croatia today is one of the biggest (if not the biggest after Albania) supporter of Kosovo. But actions of Croatia and Kosovar Albanians in Croatia dont put any obligation on Kosovar Croats.
Tomorr3@reddit
Yes, that's PRECISELY what I am saying 🤦🏻♂️
Come on, dude. Read through the lines.
I didn't say they were obliged to. Again read through the lines.
Bilbolbu@reddit
Because unlike Croats from Croatia they actually had to live among them.
Tomorr3@reddit
And Croats from Croatia actually had to live among you.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Based Croats. They even celebrate Slava.
ilijadwa@reddit
Some Croats in Dalmatian hinterland and Hercegovina also celebrate Slava.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Nice
New_Accident_4909@reddit
Because they got the same treatment after independence. Kosovo Albanians despite what they write on the internet are not found of minorities.
Ok_Candidate_2338@reddit
Just ask Roma.
There was a split beetwen Roma who supported Serbs who were in majority and minority who supported the Albanians.
New_Accident_4909@reddit
Punishing a minority for choosing a side is equally bad. If they haven't actively participated in any crimes they should not be oppressed in any form.
gixm0@reddit
Would transporting dead bodies of ethnic cleansing victims be considered active participation to you?
New_Accident_4909@reddit
So every Roma did that or Janjevac or any other non Albanian?
gixm0@reddit
Don't put words in my mouth. Just answer the question.
New_Accident_4909@reddit
The question is in bad faith and ment to imply that only ones that ran or were on Serbian side helped facilitate the crimes.
So no, i will not answer a bad faith question.
gixm0@reddit
No bad faith there. Some Roma did help facilitate crimes that's why the Roma / Ashkali split happened the ones not involved did not want anything to do with the pro Serbian ones. We still have no justice for the crimes committed by the serbian forces, everyone has the right to return but some don't due to fear of prosecution. IMO we should not concede to any serbian demands until all criminals be them Serb, Roma, Gorani or whatever be extradited for trial in Kosovo
New_Accident_4909@reddit
You do realize how many Roma from Kosovo fled, they're all over Belgrade. There is no way all of them did that because they participated in crimes. Roma are historicaly oppressed by everyone.
I am not a fan of their behavior but saying they fled because they are somehow responsible is not very probable given how many of them fled.
gixm0@reddit
They can legally return to live in Kosovo why they don't I can't say. It might be economic reasons. Sure people have prejudices towards them but no one will go out of their way to harm them. You seem to think we go minority hunting every 28th of November.
New_Accident_4909@reddit
I don't, I just think that your attitude towards minorities (Serbs excluded) is not that great.
gixm0@reddit
Which ones? The muslim slavic speakers in Prizren for example I feel are a lot better integrated then say 10 years ago, they're a lot more fluent in Albanian and mixed marriages are not rare. Besides dumb jokes I don't really see any discrimination.
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
He said "used to" which implies that after indipendence there is no such case.
New_Accident_4909@reddit
No, his implication is that once they moved to Croatia they developed anti Serb sentiment.
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
Ok, i just checked his later comment. Maybe he needs to clarify more. Last year i was in Kosovo. Political conversations are usually about Kurti, Serbia and Serbs, E.Hoxha and Tito. In that order.
New_Accident_4909@reddit
Everyone cold do better with less political talk I'd say.
That being said hating on Vučić gets a free pass.
xd_out@reddit
Albanians don’t like minorities and that’s it. Serbs don’t like minorities and start 4 wars in 6 years including the first genocide in Europe in 50 years. Thats the difference.
HumanMan00@reddit
Proving once again that it's all fuckin politics.
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
Not just politics. I would like to expand the topic. Empires and big authoritarian states like Yugoslavia or Soviet Union have such effect on different communities. A quick check on map would prove me right.
HumanMan00@reddit
Look, if politics dont activate the stupidest and most opportunistic among us it is easily provable that we r very close nations inseperably tied by culture history and blood.
Mich money effort and manpower was invested into making us hate each other.
Imagine if we did the opposit.
First-Hospital3993@reddit
Because they do not have to live with assholes. Same as Serbs in Germany or Austria who support Vucic. Go and live under Vucic and vote for him then
ERShqip@reddit
They do vote for him then go back to austria and germany same with albanians for rama 😊 voting rights should include a 1 year prior stay in said country prior to being able to vote
MLukaCro@reddit
Well, there was a paper that showed that Janjevci living in Kistanje (who have lived with Albanians in Kosovo before and now live with Serbs in Kistanje) prefer Kosovar Albanians to Kistanje Serbs.
First-Hospital3993@reddit
Good for them in that case
Comfortable_Reach248@reddit
I don't agree with you. Most people I know (I am from Zagreb) tend more to Serbia than Albania. I only know 1 guy, but he is nationalist and hates Serbia.
gixm0@reddit
What kind of masochist do you hang around? They were kicked out by Seselj in 91 when Croatia declared independence from YU. The few remaining ones had no water in Janjevo because the water supply went through one of the Serbian communities that was actively blocking downstream water to the village, only getting resolved recently with Kurti in power.
gafsagirl@reddit
It's not really masochist to get along better with a neighbour that speaks your language rather than someone you can't understand at all
gixm0@reddit
After Croatia declared independence there was pressure and outright violence by the Serbian regime toward Croats living in territories controlled by Serbia. The Janjevci didn't move to Zagreb for fun
MLukaCro@reddit
Well, I said "used to" as I was talking about pre-90s situation. I dont know what is the current opinion of the handeful that was able to stay in Kosovo.
gixm0@reddit
Not many people left now but they tend to get along. The Albanians there tend to speak highly of the Janjevci. As for the "used to" I really doubt it over the centuries the community absorbed lots of Catholic Albanians you can tell the Albanian influence in the names they use Kolja, Pashko, Zefo. Like the Arbanas in Zadar who absorbed lots of locals into their community. Balkan cultures are usually exogamous
UseAlternative777@reddit
Kosovo Serbs didn't kill them and purged.
vattghern___@reddit
Didnt ate enough children*
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Bosniaks in Kosovo had better relations with serbs in kosovo before 99. Today it's neutral or slightly towards Albanians.
MLukaCro@reddit
I am not sure, but I think the little amount of Croats that did remain in Janjevo and Kosovo do acutally still like Serbs more.
Although, most of them left for Zagreb (Dubrava) and Kistanje in the 90s. And those tend to support Albanians nowdays.
Open_Adhesiveness607@reddit
The fact is that if not for Greece, Albanians wouldn’t have a country and possibly they would be less than a million today. The amount of humanitarian help their people received from Greeks and the way they were welcomed in our society is beyond your imagination. Yea there was some cases were refuges were took advantage, but generally Greeks helped a lot.
Smrekovasmola@reddit
Slovenia is way more pro serbia than pro albania
No_Search7380@reddit
Really? Wasn’t the Slovene goverment one of the first to recognize Kosovo? Likewise, don’t Slovenians remember the 10-day war? Like, surely at least in 90s and early 00s Slovenes were more pro-Kosovo than pro-Serbian.
Smrekovasmola@reddit
Times change. Politics is one thing, i am talking about people. If our goverment today unrecognizes kosovo most people would support it.
Maybe in 1990/1991 people were more pro albanian bit that is it probably.
No_Search7380@reddit
Right, but the recognition came in like 2008. Both the ruling party and opposition (bar the Slovenian national party) passed it. By some logic, wouldn’t there be more political parties opposed to it?
Smrekovasmola@reddit
I am pretty sure most of politicians did this so we could have good relations with west and usa. Not beacuse they feel any love for kosovo.
If you take out our membership.in eu and nato out of it. I am pretty sure some more would be against it.
East-Raccoon135@reddit
And what did Kosovo and Albanians ever do to Slovenia exactly?
Smrekovasmola@reddit
Nothing special. I am more pro albanian than proserbia, but most people arent.
First reason is that in Slovenia Serbs are the biggest minority and they have a lot of social power because they have some high positions. Just recently director of our biggest national theatre became Serb. So you can imagine there wont be many albanian plays in that theathre.
Best spprts players are Serbs, mayors of big cities are Serbs...we are becoming Serbia 2.0.
And all.of serbs are anti albanian and that then shows in society.
Second Albanians are probabaly one ethnic group that is least integrating in slovene society, so people fell distant to them.
And also some of albanians do crime and drugs in Slovenia so people dont like that.
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
Washington was pressuring Slovenia and a number of smaller states into that. US diplomatic cables leak had plenty of evidence for that.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
They were... but they Slovenians don't like Kosovo-Albanian migrants... maybe that why.
ERShqip@reddit
I doubt theres that man albanian immigrants in slovenia maybe less than 1000
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
From Albania very few. From kosovo quite a size
ERShqip@reddit
Really im gonna search that up out of curiosity
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
At least 10x, mostly from Kosovo/Macedonia, if not 20x or more. And not the brightest but low skilled. Usually parasiting on at least some form of welfare/subsidies.
ERShqip@reddit
Ughh 10X and 20X isent 10k its 20k and 40k so 5X more 🤨 not that many
Smrekovasmola@reddit
Največ Kosovcev in Albancev je v zadnjih letih prišlo v Kranj. Kranjska upravna enota je v petih letih (2018–2022) izdala oz. podaljšala 8668 enotnih dovoljenj za prebivanje in delo Kosovcem in 102 Albancema.
This is from an article. So just Kranj municipality gave 8668 work permita to albanians from kosovo and 102 to albanians from albania. In 4 years.
Truth is nobody knows how many foreigners are in Slovenia because goverment does not wanna share ethnic information with the people.
But Serbs are the biggest minority, and Albanians are the fastest rising minority.
Albanians as always are more stigmatized because they dont even know how to speak language and they dont really socialize with Slovenes.
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
The last official census was done in 2002 and 6.186 declared as Albanians (almost 2x increase from a decade earlier). That was before the surge of arrivals since then, especially since 2007. Even if there was only a 2x per decade increase then we are now at about 25k. Sure, a lot also left but easily way more than 10x from your estimate (1k). Kranj isnt even mentioned so you know your source is not good.
Tomorr3@reddit
Imagine being bothered from 10k people in your country. Life in slovenia must be pretty boring for the natives ig
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
Well, people dont like problems with integration, crime, welfare parasiting.. and Albanians seem to be just under the top of the pyramid. The cherry goes to gypsies.
No_Search7380@reddit
True as that might be, didn’t notice them having a stellar opinion on Serbs either, as far as i know both are considered “čefurji”
DisastrousWasabi@reddit
And that, like most other countries, was done because of diplomatic pressure from abroad. This was proven with the leaked US diplomatic cables. If Kosovo recognition would be put on a referendum it would lose.
Smrekovasmola@reddit
This.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Okay. Thank you
brotherfromorangeboi@reddit
nothing like fresh human organs and good heroin from albania.... rich countries like it cuz for 15k you can get brand new kidney.
Sabeneben@reddit
It's totally wrong
vegancorr@reddit
I was shocked to see photos of Erdogan in North Macedonia. Sometimes I had the feeling it was Little Turkey, but with bigger flags. But then I remembered the statues of big boobed ladies and big everything men, fake greek buildings & stuff. They have big daddy issues 😂 EU should provide psychological asistance.
However, no Erdogan photos or much Turkey ties were visibile in Albania / Kosovo (7 years ago).
Candid-Argument-6615@reddit
Italy and Macedonia are allies of Albania, especially since they are liberal capitalist states and fear the spread of Slavic nationalism, which they believe will negatively impact Western Europe. They fear that the Serbs want to annex all of South Slavia and unite it with Russia. Therefore, Western liberals see Albania and other countries as a bulwark against the project of a Serbian world, particularly given that Italy and NATO have stood with the peoples of yoguslavia against serbia and milosisveitch
Russia supports Serbia because they both hate liberalism and are working to eradicate it, and they want to unite the Slavic world under their banner. The European Union and NATO stand firmly with Albania.
Downtown_Log_7380@reddit
Countries that have recognised Kosovo leans towards Albania and countries that did not leans towards Serbia. As simple as that.
asspounder16@reddit
Bosnians and Albanians are more friendly through a common hate of Serbia
gehirn4455809@reddit
The dynamics between Albania and Serbia are complex and shaped by historical events, but many in the region focus more on everyday life than past conflicts.
Kaloyanicus@reddit
Bulgaria is towards Albania, but not because of Russia but because of our history with Serbia.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Albanians think that North Macedonia should be split between Albania and Bulgaria.
rintzscar@reddit
Bulgaria would never agree to that. Bulgaria's goal is an independent North Macedonia that's friendly with Bulgaria and is decoupled from Serbia. Splitting it is a net loss. Instead, Bulgaria wants the entire North Macedonia in the EU as a trusted close friend, like Germany and Austria are currently. That goes through stopping the Yugoslav propaganda and hate speech, which is extremely problematic.
Bilbolbu@reddit
Why do Bulgarians think they have the right to dictate what other countries should and shouldn't do lmao?
Dude basically said ''we only accept North Macedonia as our puppet'', the things I'll read here...
rintzscar@reddit
Bulgaria is not dictating anything to anyone.
Anything else you wrote or you though is your own delusion and we have nothing to do with it.
Grow up.
Bilbolbu@reddit
You are literally dictating what NM has to do in order for you to consider it a ''close and trusted friend'' i.e. they need to conduct politics how it suits Bulgaria, not NM.
Talk about growing up lol.
rintzscar@reddit
Again, nothing you've said is true. Lying like a child will achieve nothing. Grow up.
determine96@reddit
You aren't familiar in depth with our problems that's why you say that.
ThickCaterpillar9867@reddit
He did not say they have the right to but that is what their politicians want to achieve
Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit
Yugoslav propaganda? 35 years man…
rintzscar@reddit
Modern Macedonian historiography is indistinguishable from Yugoslav historiography. It's effectively entirely propaganda.
abieslatin@reddit
I believe they mean exactly the propaganda that happened during Yugoslav times, the consequences of which are still felt today..
There is literally no reason for modern day Balkan countries to hate each other, yet here we are.
"taught hatred" we're all guilty of, unfortunately
ERShqip@reddit
My brother in Christ thats the ultra nationalist 99% of albanians dont want that
First-Egg-713@reddit
No thats not true in general. I would say on average opinion albanians dont want any part of Macedonia to be absorbed into albania but just want the rights of albanian from macedonia to continue to be respected.
rintzscar@reddit
Correct, relations with Albania are at an all-time high, especially after they recognized the Bulgarian minority there.
akaHastaSiempre@reddit
They had to, it’s a requirement of the EU Charter in order to join in. North Macedonia should think twice about their refusal to recognize a Bulgarian minority (unless by this they want to admit that they and we descended from 2 proto Bulgarian khans which were sons of Kubrat and brothers - Kuber & Asparuh, at the same time and mixed with the same local population 🤷Simply Khan Asparuh founded a state which exists since while Khan Kuber couldn’t and Byzantine took over.
rintzscar@reddit
It's not a requirement for Albania at all. And they did it years before that deal was made with North Macedonia.
Also, the requirement for North Macedonia is not recognition, it's establishment in the Constitution, which is far harder.
akaHastaSiempre@reddit
It is a requirement for every single candidate to have it in their Constitution and there’s no exception for Albania. It’s more interesting to me why they decided after centuries of recognition to drop it at some point and try to piss us off. Guess it was some political shenanigan🤷
rintzscar@reddit
This is complete nonsense. Literally every word in this comment is wrong. You have no clue what you're talking about.
akaHastaSiempre@reddit
Yo, the Talking Head, don’t eat sh**, adherence to the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights is a criteria when weighing on a new application for entry although not stated as a requirement As long as ALL members are supposed to adhere to it it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out what’s not explicitly stated but I guess it’s too hard for you to get it🤷😆
rintzscar@reddit
Adherence to the EU charter has nothing to do with what the recognition Albania enacted for the Bulgarians or with what North Macedonia is required to do.
Again - you have ZERO clue what you're talking about. You don't even understand the terms you're using. You can't even comprehend how uneducated on the topic you are.
akaHastaSiempre@reddit
But I can see as far as what laughable 🤡you are🤣🤣🤣and how ppl are supposed to take your BS statements at face value just because you say so. Take a hike with your nonsense logorrhoea & just go to WiKi and check Bulgarians in Albania WHERE it explicitly says it was the EU Commission that requested it🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️Damn talking heads (not the band ofc) Here just for you,
rintzscar@reddit
I went through 5 years of Law School just so I wouldn't have to deal with imbeciles like you who can't even comprehend what the AI slop they're reading says.
Go troll somewhere else.
ERShqip@reddit
Ughh yea because we were raised with gollobordas (bulgarian/albanians) one of chillest people in albania many of my friends are gollobordas my ex girlfriend was one so 🤷♂️ hard working good for a drink and have your back so i dont see why not
ERShqip@reddit
I never got macedonias refusal? Do they think by recognizing the minority bulgaria is gonna take macedonias land or somthing 🤨
akaHastaSiempre@reddit
Me neither and keeping in mind that it came from VMRO, a party which for quite a long time in the past was considered pro-Bulgarian🤷🤷🤷
ERShqip@reddit
The gollobordaz and why wouldnt we? Theyre good people one of my best friends in albania is gollobordaz my ex girl was gollobordaz chill people plus theyre half and half its like theyre the peace between the countrys 👍
ERShqip@reddit
And golobordas bro cmon theres more than 20k albanian/bulgarian peoplein Albania
UseAlternative777@reddit
I wonder what issue Bulgarians can have with Serbia if we don't count Macedonia?
Kaloyanicus@reddit
Too many... They hate us more though. Mostly about Kosovo and etc.
stankomar@reddit
as a Serbian: what?!
i don't think I've ever met anyone that expressed strong feelings towards Bulgaria one way or the other.. idk maybe in south, southeast, near the border with Bulgaria there are people like that, but otherwise nothing more than memes about backstabbing, but they are just that: memes, without any serious feelings attached
rintzscar@reddit
You can't not count the main problem, mate.
UseAlternative777@reddit
I really don't know. In my mind we should be the ones who hold grudges for the first and second world war. Which we don't. So I want to hear the other side
Stverghame@reddit
Hmmm.. Not sure about this.
Turkey is certainly pro-Albania and not neutral. In fact, quite a lot of "neutral" ones in here prefer Albania as their russophobia affects their opinion on Serbs as well.
Still, I don't care much outside of the internet. Here I'll argue with absolutely every serbophobic crap, regardless of their ethnicity and reasons for serbophobia. The same way I'll be cool with anyone who is serbophilic, regardless of their ethnicity.
west_ham_vb@reddit
Hate for Russian is usually why Americans don’t like Serbia.
Even though I’m not a fan of Russia, I still like Serbia and Serbians. Some of the best people I’ve ever met.
exZ1@reddit
I swear to God, I'm gonna start reporting every Serbia vs Kosovo vs Albania post or map I see as it feels like bot raids specifically created to rage bait and divide people here. Whether it's Russian, US, or Israeli bots just stop engaging with this unproductive shit.
East-Raccoon135@reddit
Thank you please report these posts and comments
ERShqip@reddit
As an Albanian ill join you this crap is annoying and its probably all of the above i was raised in the US and these mtherfckers love to divide and counqer same goes for putlers stooges and the balding isreali troll in office
crextiv@reddit
Everyday new shit about Serbia and Albania
East-Raccoon135@reddit
GET RID OF THESE MODS!!! so sick of this anti Albanian bullshit
kimmielicious82@reddit
as long as it's friendly I'm all for it! it's healing
ERShqip@reddit
Yea give us interesting crap and acual discussions we can have not this bs
Guess what everyone were both poor countries where our politicians push this nationalistic bs to steal outragous amounts of funds buy yachts and mansions all over the world while our people leave theyre respecttive countries and go work as workers in other countries like slaves but hey why fix the big problems and make lives better in the balkans when we can post bs content on reddit and hate eachother while vucic and rama sip tea in switzerland while laughing at us 🤷♂️
Classic-Exit4189@reddit
Half the posts in this subreddit are just cheap bait
neuralek@reddit
All the while us Zerbs are vacationing in Albania, and Albanians partying in Belgrade 😎
i_getitin@reddit
I can respect the idea of nationalism over religion
OkciotS_Photography@reddit
Non political ppl don’t care about nationalities only personalities!
Durim187@reddit
Germany is much more affectionate toward Serbia than it deserves. Being German i like to believe they think they are neutral but they are really not
Bilbolbu@reddit
Serbs should be much more hostile towards Germany then they currently are.
Durim187@reddit
ant shoud be hostile to the elephant?
Bilbolbu@reddit
We've seen that elephant's back plenty times in our history.
m0mchilo@reddit
how are oran, iraq and north african countries on the serbian lmao never let bro cook again
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
They don't recognise kosovo
Iran cyberattack on Albania
Refugee_InThisWorld@reddit
Cyberattack happened because Albania shelters a faction of Iranian opposition exponents. As for Kosovo, it has nothing to do with "separatist" movements in Iran. They simply act to counter American actions. If America dropped support for Israel in favour of Palestinians, you can bet Iran would back Israel in turn.
m0mchilo@reddit
they don't recognize kosovo because they have their own separatists
never heard about the cyberattack, sounds like a civ VI event, gonna need some sauce
rlesath@reddit
Switzerland towards Serbia 😅 😂
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
No neutral. They may be more towards Serbia because og Xherdan Shaqiri
rlesath@reddit
But he is Albanian
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Why did he choose to play for Switzerland then??? We should stop celebrating Albanians that play for other nations. we are the only people thats does that. He means noting to me.
ERShqip@reddit
What! Wait?! What!?!? Only nations huh since when how many africans play and are born in europe? Zlatan ibrahimovic who is croat plays for sweden? Etc bro what
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Zlatan did not have Bosnian or Croatian flag on his boots flag only Swedish . Xherdan is a hypocrite
ERShqip@reddit
Well zlatan is Croat/Bosnian/Albanian yes Albanian from his mothers side look at his auto biography so he would need a lot of flags on the shoes Xherdan has Albania on one side and Switzerland on the other nothing wrong with that a lot of players are proud duel nationals
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
That why Albania was the last nation to become independent after the fall of the ottomans. Because albanians did not fight for a common course. But did fight against its own interests
ERShqip@reddit
You do have a point there and this is why from enver hoxha to present day we have had pos as leaders who sell off the people history and wealth for cheap we have no one good leader this has been going on for thousands of years though i mean skenderbegs own nephew betrayed him for wealth
ERShqip@reddit
In a foriegn country vandalizing a $100k piece of filming equiptment in marker writing "kosovo is serbia" but Xherdan waering the Alb flag on his personal shoes is unacceptable
johndelopoulos@reddit
If you mean the people, realistically no, majority in most of the countries would vote for Serbia, for obvious reasons. If you mean states and governments, no again but closer
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
What are these supposedly “obvious reasons”?
i_getitin@reddit
Probably the fact that Albanian migrants have a bad reputation throughout Europe as “thugs/gangsters”. Also many Europeans would consider Albanians as “Muslims” so that would contribute their dislike towards the nation. Of course these are generalizations.
ERShqip@reddit
Wells its dumb us albanian catholics and orthodox exists and were nearly 26% but hey hate is easier right
i_getitin@reddit
Hence why I said that they are generalizations. But Europeans will emphasize that it’s 74 percent Muslim and it leaves a bad taste in their mouth with the growing Islamophobia growing in the west
ERShqip@reddit
True its less than 45% and shrinking but i get where your coming from. most of these Albanian muslims the women wear mini skirts and drink and smoke while the guys chug rakija like its a contest 🤣
I remember this one show where this imam came from saudi arabia to tirana and was shocked and "disgusted" that no women wore a hijab women wore skinny jeans with crop tops and guys drank like sailors and smoked hashish 🤣 he nearly fainted and called us fake muslims i was watching with my moms side of the family that are muslims and my female cousins said "he can fck right off back to his sand kindom in the middle of nowhere"
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
As opposed to the very quiet and calm Serb immigrants /s
Just go look up which fans were the only ones causing scenes at the Euros in Germany
i_getitin@reddit
Lmao you’re obviously living in denial. Let’s compare prison statistics in UK and other western nations.
You trying to compare a single tournament lmao
johndelopoulos@reddit
Exactly
baxulax@reddit
He Albanians themselves
Tomorr3@reddit
Come on, dude. You're a greek. 💀
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
Whar are these obvious reasons?
johndelopoulos@reddit
Major religion, crime statistics within immigrant communities etc
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
Major religion? Albanians are much less religious than greeks, you can’t even divide state from fairytales.
Boohoo, put them in prison if they make a crime just like any other nationality.
Saying obvious reasons just makes you discriminatory but what to expect from best buds greek-serbs.
johndelopoulos@reddit
If that makes you happy then whatever. Point remains that islam has not the best reputation in European countries (regardless from religiosity) and that works here as well
ERShqip@reddit
Yea but more tham 26% of us are Christians and growing while islam shrinks
And criminals i habe to agree we have to fix that but why is it when 1000s of russians sell cocain,prostitutes,arms everyone looks away but when an albanian does it its bells and alarms and generalizations
Ghost_Protocol147@reddit
Aside from being a discriminative prick, you are also ignorant if you think the Muslim Albanians are the same as radical muslims. Bye.
Additional-Peace-809@reddit
Why do you think that ordinary people outside the Balkans even care about Albania Vs Serbia? And if we're talking politically Albania has been on a cruise lately with the EU and Serbia has not been aligned with the EU.
johndelopoulos@reddit
I dont think that Balkan people care either, I am sure even Serbs hardly care in fact
Additional-Peace-809@reddit
???
johndelopoulos@reddit
My answer was literally an agreement to your own, so if my own is a "nothing" answer then so is yours i guess
Tomorr3@reddit
WE hates eastern europe equally
Usta_Llari@reddit
who gives a shit?
pussyseal@reddit
I don't think Ukrainians care about either Albania or Serbia. I travelled to the Balkans and learned loads of history, and Serbia was obviously a bad guy at some point. Personally, I prefer Albania due to its stance against Russia; however, Serbian people are really fun, and I wish to visit it at some point.
Lowe164@reddit
Wales loves albania 🇦🇱 🏴❤️❤️
perseusveil@reddit
As someone living ukraine, I would say ukraine does not just "slightly" prefer albania.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
What so?
EfficiencySmall4951@reddit
Doesn't look quite right to me. I will say this whenever I get the chance though, Albania's national flag is amazing, amazing look
ERShqip@reddit
Thank you i like romanias one as well its fcked up that chad copied it now americans think romania is in africa 😅 but americans dont even know where america is so
Zekieb@reddit
A bitch to draw though.
I wonder how an Albanian tricolour would have looked like...
redikan@reddit
Zekieb@reddit
Looks a bit like an evil Austria or Lithuania lol
EfficiencySmall4951@reddit
I'd imagine it's a pain to draw yeah lol
HumanMan00@reddit
Amaying geopolitical stance u should be proud.
CockolinoBear@reddit
Hungary hates both, but for different reasons. We consider most Serbs savages (you know the kind I'm referring to), but Albanians ain't better because they run their maffia mostly through their bakeries and launder a shitload of blood money. In that sense, I actually think we hate Albanians less, sheerly based on the fact, that they are further away lol
Comfortable_Reach248@reddit
To be fair, most of the right wing people in Croatia dislike/hate Serbia, but most if the left/center people tend more to Serbia. Croatia and Serbia are more connected than Croata and Albania.
caesarj12@reddit
I think Croatia and Hungary are neutral. Spain dgaf about any of us. The others are more or less correct
Diligent_Tomato_147@reddit
Spain is just worried about Catalonia, France on the other hand is heavily pro-Serbian on the political level.
Stverghame@reddit
That's absolutely not true.
ThickCaterpillar9867@reddit
You are right ,France used to be on the Serbian side but now leaning more towards Albania.
ItalicAlpaca45_4@reddit
Kosovo is albanian (gets downvoted into oblivion) Kosovo is independent (gets downvoted into oblivion) Kosovo is serbian (gets downvoted into oblivion)
Eastern_cold999@reddit
Nobody gives a sh1t about Albania and Serbia, that's the reality buddy
Any-Subject-9875@reddit
What is this map even
prajeala@reddit
The Serbs should remember themselves each time in what good light they're being seen by the romanian nations. As a general tendency. I look up to them for your determinism, stoic-like attitude towards life and bald, brave looks. And also due to rakija. Every individual has a different set of motives, some don't see you in a better light just yet to some ties with Russia, not being a member of the EU, or a form of brutalism or aggressiveness as a stereotype for your people.
racunZaBaciti@reddit
Catholic Albanians migrated to the nearest catholic country, which is Croatia, and muslim Albanians went to Kosovo, Macedonia, Serbia and that's all there is to it, really.
Albanians in Croatia are well known for big families and trades, so until rather recently they were synonymous with bakeries, jewlery shops, etc. They're mostly good people, and in comparison, we had a war with Serbia, so of course people in Croatia will have a better opinion of Albanians.
That being said, in recent few years, Albania made huge progress in tourism and had positive PR in the EU, so... Yeah. Wonders of religion and marketing.
HuckleberryUpbeat518@reddit
Who is forcing you to choose between the two?
dannysilverghost@reddit
I'm not sure Türkiye is pro Albania but we are definitely not pro Serbia, Srebnica genocie is enough for us to Serbs for another generation.
Stverghame@reddit
Luckily, I know to write "Greek genocide, "Armenian genocide", "Assyrian genocide" and "Kurdish genocide". I get bonus points for knowing those words unlike "Srebnica", so I guess we get the pass for Turkey hate for many generations to come. 🙏🏼
buteljak@reddit
I dont think anyone supports one over the other. Romania, greece and russia has good relationship historically with serbia but that's about it.
hwyl1066@reddit
Well, Serbia is not seen as a friendly country in Finland but I don't think we have a very strong connection with Albania either, just that Serbia often seems to be Russia lite and that settles it for us.
Ordinary_Leave_1343@reddit
dont know about others, but people of bulgaria will always be with people of serbia. its a big big love (dating back to the time od yugoslavia, maybe even before), but unfortunately love that is not given back 😢 (schools in serbia teach kids that people of bulgaria are enemies and that they betrayed us each time throughout history)
Martha_Fockers@reddit
I think this map is dumb becuase I can assure you if you go to most of these countries and ask them what they think of Albania or Serbia they’ll say who and what lmao.
Here in America a solid 80% of the people I know think Albania is next to Armenia
User20242024@reddit
What is point of this? Albania and Serbia are two countries with friendly relations, and they formed an union known as Open Balkans.
--_Omen_--@reddit
99% wrong
starxidiamou@reddit
What is it about Algeria??
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Friend of Russia therefore > Good relation with Serbia
Algeria does not recognise Kosovo
VastAd3561@reddit
101st map made with AI to farm karma
TatarAmerican@reddit
AI absolutely sucks at making maps right now. Here's a map of Connecticut's Western reserve chatgpt made for me last week
kimi_no_na-wa@reddit
Bro this is like super basic, I genuinely think AI would take much longer to do this especially to have it come out this clean.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
No. I did make by myself using MapChart.net .... :)
Zekieb@reddit
Is this based on the actual policy of these countries or just "vibes"?
Ok_Candidate_2338@reddit
Majority of European countries just take the policy of the larger organisation that they belong to.
Most of them don't care about a war 25-30 years ago, especially now that there are other more pressing things such as War in Ukraine or Economic Troubles.
Albaaneesi@reddit
This is based on AI or his personal opinion, karmafarming post
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
I don't care about karma. just my opinion and views.
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
People and policy.
Zekieb@reddit
But each of the countries have millions of people. I don't think it is possible to distill a general opinion without basing it on assumptions only.
casastorta@reddit
Well as a Croat, I personally absolutely love our Shqiptare brothers. I can’t talk about all the Croats though.
ComfortableGlad6766@reddit
poland having a cultural grip on anything lmao what does that even mean
No_Designer_8203@reddit
This is very wrong. All NATO members and all countries that recognized Kosovo should be on Albania's side by default. They're allies after all. On Serbia's side, there's no one. The regime is selling weapons to UA, so RU is not an ally, and also introduced sanctions to Belarus, so not an ally. The sentiment of the local populations, that's another story.
RestlessCricket@reddit
Shouldn't Poland be yellow for the same reasons as the Baltic countries?
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
Poland doesn’t really like Muslim-majority nations. I wouldn’t say that they dislike us, rather they don’t like us anymore than they like the Serbs.
adaequalis@reddit
95% of romanians don’t care about albania, bosnia, serbia or kosovo.
however, our far-right football ultras simp for serbia for some reason. for the average romanian, hungary, bulgaria and greece are far more relevant in the cultural zeitgeist
erionei@reddit
Why Greece?
adaequalis@reddit
people go there on holiday a lot and enjoy it
they’re also mentioned frequently in terms of what can go wrong economically, i’ve seen people worry about us being the “next greece” due to our unsustainable deficit spending
ZonzoDue@reddit
TBH, no one really ever think about these two countries here.
And if we do, it is unfortunately often for bad reasons (Serbians are crazy nationalists and a Russian trojan, Albanians are crazy nationalists and thieves).
I would say the dominant stance is we don't give a damn (and it is a shame).
Albaaneesi@reddit
Turkey + Bosnia heavily toward Albania/Kosovo due to past history with Serbia.
And I would argue that Greece does not lean toward Serbia since Albania + Greece are close NATO allies.
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
Turkey Has Had More War Issues with Albania then Serbia what you talking about ?
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
That war has ended 113 years ago
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
And when did the Turkey Serbia war ended ? And Why did Erdogan Visited Albania 20 min and afterwards spend a Weekend in Serbia ?
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
Because Erdogan tries to appease all parties so that he can benefit from all of them. That is the exact same thing Vucic does: he shows off Russian weapons as a “sign of Orthodox brotherhood” and yet has received loads of funds from the EU and the US.
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
Naaah , 20 min in One Country and a Whole Weekend in another Country is clearly a message for those who have Brain 😉
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
So now you are resorting to personal insults because you ran out of arguments huh? He could spend a year in Serbia for all I care, his actions prove where his heart stands. And he has literally built mosques and hospitals in Albania with Turkish taxpayer funds. For “someone that has a brain” you seem to rarely use it.
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
Today is 28 November , Albanian National Independence Day , From Turks , 🤡
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
Damn, thanks for telling me, I wouldn’t have known so otherwise /s
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
Spinless 😅 , Imagine if Everybody Celebrated Occupiers
GoodZealousideal5922@reddit
You seriously lack reading comprehension. When did I ever celebrate our occupiers? However people move on, Germany has invaded France far more recently and now both countries have friendly relations. Do you expect people to just hold grudges forever like a bunch of toddlers?
Haunting_Bicycle_253@reddit
Germany and France are both on the Same Level , Big Influence Countries which is not the case with Albania and Turkey . Albania can never be the same level with Turkey , Albania is 27 thousand km2 and Turkey 800 thousand km2 , it can only be a Puppet to Same Occupiers who have Forbidden Albanian History with Law for Centuries . Go Get a Spine ok ?
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
Bosnian federation > Prefer Albania
Republika Srbska > Prefer Serbia
Therefor > Neutral
Albaaneesi@reddit
Bosnian Federation as you call it has more than twice the population, how can you call it neutral? You think more Serbs live in Bosnia?
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
They did not recognise Kosovo because of that...
johndelopoulos@reddit
He/she has to make clear first if means public opinion or governments
SE_prof@reddit
Turkey should be Turkey
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
And Albania should remain Albania
SE_prof@reddit
It is already. I'm talking about the map
PlatinumState@reddit
Can anyone explain Italys love for Albania?
Personal_Garden6538@reddit (OP)
600 years ago asylum to Albanians that fled from the ottomans. Preserved culture and language.
PlatinumState@reddit
Thanks
Er1on004@reddit
Yes, i think its true for the most part, as Serbia, and particularly Belgrade is a massive hub for the balkans, they invest more.
dardan06@reddit
So you made all the Serbia leaning blue and the Albania leaning neutral?
Inevitable-Theory901@reddit
For Bulgaria I'd say it's right