What are the views on crossdressing in the Balkans?
Posted by tb_sasha@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 80 comments
Hi! Two friends and I are considering visiting ex-Yugoslavia + Albania next summer. I'm a plain cis guy who happens to like wearing skirts and other stuff, but I often try not to look too feminine as I mostly wear black and white without any makeup, although I like to wear colored outfits (also, i'm not trans).
I'm from Western Europe and I dress like that in public. Although I do get a few stares here and there, I actually never really got negative remarks. I even sometimes get mistaken as a woman lol. Now of course I know the Balkans have much more conservative societies, so I'm being realistic and I'm assuming my experience would be -at least- not as comfortable if I travel there dressed like that.
So now considering the fact I'm traveling in a group, will I be safe if I behave correctly, without showing off and just being... idk, a normal person?
Thank you all!
FordFreeState@reddit
Wouldn’t recommend it, you will feel awkward but will probably not be confronted. You’re more likely to be beaten up in Sweden or Paris.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
As a French person, I really don't think so though
Full-Rice-9287@reddit
The “you’ll get beaten up” comments are unhinged. Albanians may stare and comment with one and other, but it’s highly, highly, unlikely someone will cross the boundary and be confrontational with you directly.
RegionSignificant977@reddit
I'm afraid that people like that exist. Even if it is extremely rare. It's better to be safe than sorry.
Kitsooos@reddit
How are they unhinged ? What happens if he dresses as a woman and randomly happens upon a crowd of football / basketball ultras ? Look me in the eye and tell me they won't beat the shit out of him.
What happens if he walks around and radomly finds himself in a poor / "bad" neighborhood ?
It's not the most likely scenario that he gets beaten up, but why take such an unnecessary risk ?
Better safe than sorry.
Full-Rice-9287@reddit
I only speak for Albania, and yes, I can tell you straight in the eye, that chances of anything like that happening, are close to zero. People don’t feel so strongly as to beat someone, about anything, and even if they do, chances of anyone crossing the mental barrier from annoyance to straight up violence with a stranger, are extremely low. Such treatment is mostly reserved to people of higher proximity, when there is some form of interaction, but no culture of random acts of violence simply for ideology.
They wouldn’t be more exposed to such risk in Albania, then they would in Sweden let’s say. I would even argue that it’s probably more extremists in Sweden than here.
That being said, OP should exercise reasonable levels of caution depending on situation. If he feels some uncomfortable energy somewhere, can adapt and act accordingly.
cevapi-rakija-repeat@reddit
Yeah I’d say very unlikely but non-zero. Albanians prioritize hospitality and being a foreigner makes physical violence generally unlikely unless you’re being dickhead.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
They're scary but at least they have good intentions (i think? besides that one comment). Thank you for your comment btw!!
Arktinus@reddit
It might be ok in Ljubljana, but probably not such a good idea outside the capital where there are greater chances of bumping into guys who are just eager to beat someone up because, yeah, jerks like that also exist.
On a lighter note, we did send three guys dressed as women (Sestre) to Eurovision in 2002. :)
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
OH YEAH I love their song!! :D
Good to know, thank you for your advice!
chunek@reddit
You would probably be ok, can't say for sure since I am not a crossdresser or know anyone that is.. People generally don't bother other people here, especially not strangers, you might get a look but not staring, not from the locals, staring is considered rude.
I live in the countryside, we have a trans person working at the supermarket, a very obvious one, noone cares. But you never know I guess.. if you stick out, you might attract attention that you otherwise wouldn't, positive or negative.
That being said, you also just might look like someone who has lost a bet.. men dressing as women can be funny, even among the rural folk, example.
Arktinus@reddit
You can still hear it on radio sometimes. :D
Also, I know it's not crossdressing, but a trans person – Salome, she had a show (Iznenada) last year (I think?) in several cities across the country and it was mostly if not entirely sold out, so the reception was great.
VitaNueva@reddit
Kitsooos@reddit
Slightly off topic, but god I really love this meme.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
I like the meme too ngl
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
I'm straight btw
User20242024@reddit
Better travel as a man. Your lifestyle is a thing in the West, but Balkans is a conservative society and "testing" of local social norms is not recomended. I saw here on reddit picture from Serbian gay club and even local gays do not look feminine at all, but they look like ordinary Balkan men.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Thanks for your advice!
caesarj12@reddit
You will 100% get beaten up by my fellow countrymen at some point if your stay is long enough.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Huh.
Diligent_Original_53@reddit
There's a Moldovan guy (I assumed he was romanian at first) who has similar style (wears long skirts, makeup, keeps his hair long) and documents his life on Instagram, I forgot the name of the account. It's obviously technically not the balkans, as from what I remember he lives in Chisinau, but he usually either gets compliments from more open minded strangers, or random insults or questions "why do you dress like this?" and people that bother him. I feel like if you also look up on social media similar accounts of Balkaners who have similar style documenting stranger interactions or reactions, you'd get a better feeling of what you might experience. For Bucharest, for instance, I believe you'd be mostly fine, in particular in the tourist/central areas. I can think of a few people more famous in social media that dress out of social norms, so it's not like it would be a big shock for the locals. You might get a judgmental look or two tho especially from older people - keep in mind they did have a whole group of Christians throwing holy water etc after a pride parade event. So perhaps stay in more tourist areas, if you feel unsafe just tone down the look, and maybe travel with a friend group.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Thank you so much!!! ✨
AnaBaros@reddit
people got beaten for less in some situations... a lot of people live in a toxic masculinity world in their heads, so i would not risk it.
also be aware that just because something was passable in, for example, ljubljana, it doesn't mean the locals would tolerate it in continental montenegro (and vice versa). the region is diverse and populated areas have a mixed crowd where you cannot really know where they stand on things like gender.
i hope you will enjoy your trip even if you have to dress less creatively.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Fair I'm sure I will, thank you ☺️
cevapi-rakija-repeat@reddit
I would not recommend it. Even otherwise “progressive” people in the Balkans have a dim view on trans-related stuff, and I know crossdressing doesn’t make someone trans, but many people you meet will likely not make the distinction.
It’s a bad idea. As others said at minimum you will absolutely be stared at and people will be making comments amongst themselves for sure, but also possibly to your face. I think it’s less likely you’d get beaten up since you’re a foreigner, but definitely still a non-zero chance.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Good point you made about people not making the distinction between trans and cis people who just express themselves in a feminine way. even where I'm from, among my friends, some of them thought I was trans when they first saw me :') Thank you for your insight and advice!
cevapi-rakija-repeat@reddit
No problem. The Balkans is otherwise very welcoming to visitors and hospitality is very important in the culture. Have a good time!
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Thank you!! 😊
Super_Sherbet_268@reddit
if u are going to another country, wear some pants and shirts and dress appropriately that's the obvious thing to do. Well, some people on reddit might say its okay we are cool with but that doesn't necessarily reflect the sentiment on the ground. Balkan is obviously not as liberal as Western Europe
respect local customs
ComplicatedSunshine@reddit
When people say "respect local customs", that refers to the countries with strict (usually religious) rules. There is no "custom" that men must wear trousers in Serbia specifically, nor is there in other European countries. It's just something men tend to do. So no, it's not "the obvious thing to do", and the fact that the Balkans is not as liberal still doesn't make it a custom
User20242024@reddit
In Serbia even women wear trousers.
SentenceSad2188@reddit
Do you know who is Azis
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
The Bulgarian singer?
Willing_Corner2661@reddit
There's people like you in the Balkans too, it's not extremely common but it exists
SentenceSad2188@reddit
Looks like Ptin and Oban were right
Willing_Corner2661@reddit
In what way?
SentenceSad2188@reddit
The agenda is spreading east bro. We must stop it.
Im a gay but a man gay. We need to stop the spread of fembois
Willing_Corner2661@reddit
I think this guy isn't gay tho? Or maybe I misunderstood lol but what I meant was there are people who are born male and identify as men but dress like women, I don't think it's necessarily about being gay or straight
SentenceSad2188@reddit
Bro he acts and dresses like a woman that's gay
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Can confirm, I'm a straight guy lmao, the stereotype is getting boring
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
there's no agenda. i'm just being myself
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Good to know, although the chances of meeting them is slim I imagine. Thanks!
Willing_Corner2661@reddit
Depends where you're at tbh
Madiomiaiuta@reddit
Please dont
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
gotcha
Madiomiaiuta@reddit
Not to be judgmental. But for your own safety avoid certain behavoir , even if it is something that defines YOU ,in some places it is a risk so be mindufull
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Yeah I get it don't worry, thank you btw! :)
First-Egg-713@reddit
Ya youll definitely get some stares and laughs/comments wearing a skirt as a man. Honestly i think a lot of people would think its a comedy skit or something like that.
I really really doubt youll get any actual threats or acts of violence in albania though. Albanians are generally non confrontational unless they perceive some sort of ‘provocation’ like you stare at them for too long for example.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Thank you for your advice, I appreciate it😊
Fit-Duty-6810@reddit
No brother, bad idea
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
gotcha
MarucaMCA@reddit
I'm Swiss adopted from India. The only Balkan people I know who wear unisex/avant-garde clothing, are artists.
I think to a concert or exhibition it would be fine. But walking around on the streets, I don't know... There's always the possibility of a hate crime, but if you stick to large cities and artistic places/neighbourhoods, I think you could dare it, especially if it's not too feminine.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Got it! thank you!!
responsible_car_golf@reddit
Only for traditional purposes
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
i love the energy
SentenceSad2188@reddit
Do you have to come to Balkan. Sweden nice.
If all else we send him Dagestan one two years and forget
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
okay mate
CoronaryStenosis@reddit
nobody would care but you might get some occasional muttering and dirty looks here and there. Especially if you are in bigger cities you're irrelevant cuz people just wanna live their lives
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Gotcha, thank you 😊
ShestoChuloff@reddit
In Macedonia, you'll get only the stares, nothing else. Feel free to visit us, buddy!
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Gotcha, thank you 😊
ConfusedAdmin53@reddit
Thing is the definition of "normal person" is quite different than it is in the West. For instance, a male "normal person" does not walk around in public dressed in women's clothes here.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Yeah I know that, but wanted to ask just in case. Thanks!
Current_Fee_7874@reddit
Bro dont be ashamed because of your cistic fibrosis, we are not monsters
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
LMAOOOO
MichaelLachanodrakon@reddit
I know, right? I'm a plain scol guy (scoliosis), but I won't tolerate any hick makin fun of my back
Kitsooos@reddit
You will get stares 100%.
It is likely you will get some comments as well.
It is generally unlikely, but not completely impossible, that you will get physically aggravated.
I would stick to the known tourist areas if I were you.
If you want to venture beyond those, just wear a pair of fucking pants.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
got it!
SnooEpiphanies6807@reddit
to put it simply, wouldn’t recommend it bc you’ll get made fun of at best and beaten up at worst. especially in albania.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
got it, thanks
ConsciousPoet254@reddit
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
😭 is okay
xesnoteleks@reddit
the best case scenario: you'll get annoyed and angry stars, some laughs
mid-tier scenario: you get insulted or shouted at
worst case scenario: you're beaten up
The third one is likely to happen in certain places where people are really not welcoming towards it, or if you stumble upon that sort of a crowd.
I'd generally advise against it.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
I see...thank you for the advice!
greekgirl002@reddit
its a baaad idea to go to a country you havent been to before as a crossddresser. I wouldnt risk the chance in your place, you never know what person will be around you in public
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
yeahh that's why when I went to Latvia last year I didn't risk it, but now that I'm more comfortable I was curious. thanks!
Valuable-Layer-7798@reddit
Well, really depends where you go. If you are in the central part of the capital or major city, nobody cares since everyone got used to meeting all sorts of people, but if you to rural areas, i would advice to tone down your taste to pants and shirt.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
got it! makes sense, thanks!
Stealthfighter21@reddit
They'll stare and laugh at you.
tb_sasha@reddit (OP)
Got it.