HELP! Buying a carry gun today
Posted by Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit | Firearms | View on Reddit | 17 comments
Hi everyone, i’m stuck between buying a 43X and a CSX E-Series. I really enjoy the ergo and shoot better w the csx however i’ve heard its riskier to carry it w the manual safety off given its a sao hammer fired gun?
How is it any different than the glocks internal/trigger safeties with its striker fired operation? I’ve never owned a SAO hammer fired gun so I don’t see how rocking one w no manual safety engaged is any different?
906Dude@reddit
That's an interesting question. There are many striker fire guns that are fully-cocked -- the Shield X, Bodyguard 2.0, and the Echelon series come to mind -- and commonly sold without safety switches. I am going to guess that it's down to how light the trigger pull is and how likely it is that a user might touch off a round if handling the pistol outside the holster and the user's finger wanders into the trigger guard. FWIW, I would make sure the safety was engaged if I were carrying an SAO pistol.
_SCHULTZY_@reddit
Why wouldn't you use the thumb safety as it's intended?
Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit (OP)
Thats the first gun i’ve ever shot that supposedly should have a safety engaged and i’ve not practiced enough to feel confident in reliably hitting the safety off. Plus i’m one of those guys who see it as an extra step or failure point where I wouldn’t want one.
Averagecrabenjoyer69@reddit
Dude, special forces guys still run 1911s. It's nit the hindrance you think it is.
_SCHULTZY_@reddit
I mean the design is over 100 years old and throughout the decades and in two world wars, troops have managed to flick off the safety.
Your thumb basically goes there on the draw and as you establish your grip and drive your thumbs forward the pressure flips it off anyway. Like pressing down on a gas pedal.
You really shouldn't have to think about it. But absolutely not I would never carry SAO cocked with the thumb safety off. I would however happily carry with the grip safety pinned because they suck ass.
mcgunner1966@reddit
This just my opinion so keep it at that. I bought into glock for three reasons:
Ease of operation - you pull the trigger and it goes bang
Consistency of operation - It will eat about anything
Ease of cleaning and maintenance - Only 4 parts to strip
In a stress situation, a safety is "one more thing" to activate. The purpose of an external safety (in my opinion) is to give you a "last chance" to disengage. If I've pointed my pistol at something, I don't need a last chance. I'm past that. I've seen a lot of false fires (people pull the trigger and find that the safety is on). They don't drop the safety by muscle memory; they always look at the pistol as if it did something wrong. That's because in their mind, it malfunctioned when it actually did exactly what it was supposed to do. The only external safety you need is a holster that covers the trigger. Aside from that it's all about proper handling. Just my opinion.
werewolf013@reddit
What type of holster will you be using? The only concern is if something can get in the trigger. Otherwise it has enough safeties in place to be fine.
Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit (OP)
I guess thats the other part of it. Theres not many available for the csx it seems. I’ve seen 2 gun stores that have them, one leather, one kydex. I just assumed that w a holster its pretty much the same principal for both guns.
WindstormMD@reddit
Holsters are generally a semi-custom order game. The biggest question is if you plan to use a compact light on your CCW or not, as that dictates your options.
Personally, I find hybrid holsters that use the two materials intelligently the best. Falco has some great options in that regard
werewolf013@reddit
When it comes to holsters, stores suck. They have no stock and usually cheap options. The online options seem decent for the csx. I'd do a strong search of drop safety tests, and make sure your holster is a strong leather or kydex to avoid any flex in the trigger area of the holster. Those can give you that extra peace of mind that it won't go off
Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit (OP)
Gotcha. So you wouldn’t think there is any more risk involved in carrying a sao hammer gun rather than the glock if neither have an external safety? I just don’t get why ppl were saying its a bad thing?
No-Average6364@reddit
I would carry the one that you shoot better and fit your hand better and just carry it as safely as possible.If you have any fears about it.
Anonymusk@reddit
In terms of the safety and forgetting to turn it off, I feel like there's a ton of bad advice in guntube world and just around gun counters that can get into your head with advice like "safeties will get you killed because you'll forget under pressure." This is really bad for two reasons:
1) training to go from "scanning for a threat, finger off the trigger, weapon in a ready position," to "weapon on target, sights aligned, finger pressing the trigger, taking an aimed shot without excessive imput on the gun during the trigger press process" (especially under stress in adverse conditions) is WAAAAY more challenging than "click the safety on/off" as a single training step which falls into that process, and that overall process must be trained anyway regardless of a manual safety.
2) The videos don't explicitely remind people of the fact that single action triggers with safeties are NOT designed to be carried safely WITHOUT the safety on, so new shooters may get the impression that "cocked and unlocked" is just as safe as a striker fried or double action trigger with no safety--the trigger press is MUCH easier in single action mode because there are fewer mechanical barriers to completing it.
I used to cc a 1911 in cocked and locked with a leather holster, then I switched to striker fired with no manual safety in a kydex holster, but I still train with and occasionally carry the 1911, and the only times I ever had issues not clicking the safety were like 2 or 3 times out of several thousand presentation drills early in the process (before I even started changing between platforms) when still needed to learn the proper grip for a manual safety gun. Never had an issue in presentation drills or live fire with timer since.
All that said (to get to your actual question) based on my 1911 roots, I was very excited about the CSX when it first came out, but then I dry fired one in a store and the reset was absolutely awful. Maybe they've fixed it, or maybe my brain/muscle connection is making a mountain out of a mole hill (never bothered to even rent one to try), but it was an instant no as soon as I felt the weird reset.
Ok_Crab_3522@reddit
If you buy the sao you carry it hammer back safety ON. Carrying safety off is a good way to streak a bullet down your leg or into your privates.
The alternative is to carry empty chamber, but just be aware that doing so makes you significantly (incurably) slower and carries the issue of flubbing a load, which is significantly more common (even counting training) than forgetting to sweep a safety (which really isn’t a thing if you train. Like… it never happens)
Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit (OP)
Thanks a lot for your comment. Maybe i’m just overthinking the safety thing. I guess it’d just take a lot of training on my part to feel confident with sweeping that safety in a stressful situation or if I had to draw at a weird angle or grip like maybe inside a car or something. Just weirds me out, maybe I should go against the csx after all.
Riker557118@reddit
Because the striker on the glock (and most striker fired pistols) isn't fully cocked, it's like 2/3^rds cocked where as a SAO firearm is fully cocked (and usually has a significantly shorter trigger travel).
Embarrassed-Part-692@reddit (OP)
Thank you good sir