All of us who are watching from a safe distance
Posted by Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit | Libertarian | View on Reddit | 144 comments
Posted by Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit | Libertarian | View on Reddit | 144 comments
AkimboBears@reddit
Please don't fight him! Just let it happen so they cant make excuses!
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
We all know they'll blame Capitalism anyways
Brave_Gas3145@reddit
Noooo, it couldnt ever be Capitalism....
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
It's always capitalism fault when their "perpetuum mobile" of economics doesn't work.
PreviousMenu99@reddit
It's always capitalism's fault when you talk about a capitalist economy. Crazy, right?
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
First, we were talking on a different scenario. They blame capitalism when their newly created experimental closed planned economies fail (cuba, ussr, venezuela, north korea, mao's china and etc.). And they don't realize that command economies are doomed by design, because marxists are flat-earthers of economics. (Marx didn't have economic education lol).
Second, the term capitalism is a misnomer for economic individualism. It's wild blaming individuals that produce goods and services, while entities like central banks basically print double digit inflation.
And In fact we don't even have a capitalist economy. We live in a mixed economy where the good free market part is mixed with ineffectiveness and harm of government shit regulations. So it's capitalism mixed with shit socialism.
PreviousMenu99@reddit
Sure buddy, whatever you say. Capitalism is a neutral term for market economy where capital is held in private hands and used for profit. Look up the OG definition of Lois Blanc. Capitalism is absolutely what we have today. We don't live under libertarianism, of course, but you Americans had something close with the gilded age, and it didn't work well.
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
another clown without economic education who was also an indoctrinated by socialist ideology. Ok lol.
try to read actual science books before engaging in conversations on economics.
you mean it didn't end well when the creation of federal reserve (1913) led to the great depression (1929-1939). Oh look, another government entity fucked with the economy and lost. Like in 2008. A government failure is not a market failure, my dude.
PreviousMenu99@reddit
Louis Blanc is the guy who coined the term Capitalism. His definition is the true one.
The Gilded Age era of America was shit because of the poor workers' rights and the economy was already going to shit because gold standard works like shit when it comes to economies whose growth outpases the supply of gold. Fist currency is here to stay forever and it is ultimately for the better.
Government actually does things done. It is just that each government is different. FDR actually used the government interventions to bring the US econom back from the Great Depression. Singapore has for-profit state owned companies which earn billions for the state. Norway also has their own for-profit state companies and great welfare policies. Finland reduced their homelessness rates to basically nothing thanks to their Housing First policy.
Government actually does things better than capitalists when the government works for the benefit of its citizens and not the capitalists. Capitalists actually seek to fuck you over big time. That's why their companies charge exorbitant prices, built products with short guarantees, hike up rent and cut down wages.
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
he didn't know what he was talking about. We don't use definitions of alchemists in chemistry. His definition is irrelevant. The term capitalism was a political buzz word at the time. It's even said in wikipedia lol.
50-80% of which goes to taxes and regulations. lol
you also don't understand how the supply/demand regulates prices. (read a book)
don't blame high prices when your government extracts half of your shit for free.
you're literally a dept slave because of the government. You can't afford a big house because the government has the monopoly on the land and won't let you build a house on unused land. The monopoly also is another factor that drives housing prices up. Cost of living crisis is created by the state and completely artificial like your indoctrinated hate towards people that produce goods and services.
PreviousMenu99@reddit
Lmao, okay dude, keep living in your delusions and worshipping landlords. People in places like Vienna would continue to "suffer" from stuff like municipally-owned apartments and other sorts of government intervention like Italian SSN
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
Don't call it delusions though. My position is science backed by Nobel prize level economists and actual economic education. The difference is that you choose to be compliant to the current system because it requires no effort. It's easier to conform. You trade actual freedom and wealth with an illusion of safety.
a loser's dream.
1.3 fertility rate. Spain is 1.1. Your cute EU socialist rat utopias are not sustainable.
PreviousMenu99@reddit
I don't care about fertility rates. You know the places where they're the highest? Shit home MENA countries. Why even have children when you can have more free time for yourself? Religious or traditionalist reasons haven't been convincing to people of Europe who each have whole lives ahead.
You Americans will keep dying because your healthcare insurance got declined unless you actually do something about it. YOU are the actual slave to the system. I pay taxes willingly, because ei love it that my taxes allow poor people get treatment for their diseases and even get tumor removal surgeries.
You also keep clinging to the idea that you're the rational one here. I never claimed to deny the Neoclassical Economic Theory and Theory of Marginal Utility. You, on the other hand, keep believing in myths about capitalism.
vaiplantarbatata@reddit
They’re going to blame Trump, even if Trump does nothing directly or indirectly.
Lothar_Ecklord@reddit
When his twin, de Blasio, ran for re-election, he had a campaign ad talking about how Trump criticized "New York values" while Trump, unlike de Blasio, is a native New Yorker and it was Ted Cruz who said that. Then, when Trump lost re-election the first time, there were the allegations that laws signed in by Biden were Trump's fault. I'm not a fan, but can the accusations at least be based on actual things he's done?
Hawna-Banana@reddit
I’ve been telling my liberal friends and family: just because I disagree with his policy, doesn’t mean I’m hoping he crashes and burns. I’d love to be wrong and for Mamdani to invent utopia and for everyone to be happy. I’m just extremely certain that it’s not going to work out like that.
Lothar_Ecklord@reddit
de Blasio before him made almost identical promises and had a very similar background. I am not hopeful at all. I think John Lindsay was roughly similar.
TrifeDiesel-@reddit
I totally agree. It’s also unfortunate the powers that be will set every trap they can so he fails. And not in the name of the greater good. But so they retain their power and influence
Hoppingbird@reddit
Safe money is he will not get 40 billion if things go south
No-Win1091@reddit
I just had the same convo. I actually really like the guy, hes magnetic, witty, charming… but his political beliefs are bad.
vNerdNeck@reddit
I get some of that, he just comes off phony as hell to me.
Especially once you hear some of his pod cast interviews from earlier in life before he decided to adopt his current accent.
No-Win1091@reddit
Oh he’s phony… but certainly entertaining. He’s witty as hell and quick with an answer and has become a rather polished politician somehow. His policy? Yeah… utter disaster. But he is talented enough to make someone who actually knows what theyre talking about look foolish if they arent on their game.
For as awful as he is, i guess i get excited any time someone makes these career politicians look like complete idiots.
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
communism is the same totalitarian shit as nazism. "that nazi is a great guy" ...ok buddy
No-Win1091@reddit
What is compelling you to take what im saying that far out of context?
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
Because he said that their final goal is to "seize the means of production" which means that he's a marxist. Marxist ideology is known for political violence and totalitarianism. Which means he's as evil as it gets behing his performative smile.
No-Win1091@reddit
Yes, to which i agree with you. Which is why i stated i like everything about him but his political beliefs. I hated Obama, but it can still be said that he was also magnetic, witty, charming…
Dont be one of those people who cant fathom that two things can be true at the same time.
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
The person should lose all appeal the moment they mention that they're into murders.
No-Win1091@reddit
Right… you sure you fit into this sub? You seem to be into the art of hearing what you want to hear.
Crazy_Diamond_4515@reddit
I don't get how you can genuinely like the guy knowing that he's an open marxist lunatic.
No-Win1091@reddit
I genuinely like him in a way where if he were speaking about Libertarian principles we would be the most this party has been energized since Ron Paul. Hes a phenomenally talented politician with all the wrong beliefs. There is absolutely no way you didnt understand what I meant by what i said.
unjustdude4@reddit
He is obviously not going to create utopia and no one expects him to.
dodo91@reddit
I am a leftie but I actually look forward to do something different in Argentina for a change
Ralphy_1997@reddit
Well he’s the mayor of New York so idk why effects he’ll have on Argentina
dodo91@reddit
That was a milei reference I forgot to mention
Ralphy_1997@reddit
Ohh okay lol, I was confused by that haha
TouristAggressive113@reddit
He was stating something different for Argentina since previously it was pretty heavily left.
_WrongKarWai@reddit
Any history / economics book will lead to that conclusion.
Rush_Is_Right@reddit
I get what you are saying, but I hope he does fail because his version of utopia is not my version. Making everyone poor so they're all "equal" is not a good thing.
stilt0n@reddit
Unfortunately it never seems to work out like that, when they inevitably crash and burn, there’s always some excuse. If we could just raise taxes a bit more, if we could just roll back some of these constitutional protections so people can’t spread misinformation, or capitalism is just too entrenched if we could just re-educate people. We just need to communism a bit harder and it will work this time guys
Hawna-Banana@reddit
I agree, it’s a tale as old as time. But I do think that there is a small, quiet group of people that will learn and move on. It’s just that the dumbest people also tend to be really loud.
definately_not_gay@reddit
Unfortunately, by the time that happens more people enter the voting age and replace them. Socialism is the outcome of public education
The-Avant-Gardeners@reddit
The revolution never ends
Rustymetal14@reddit
Just one more against the wall!
SkyGuy1985@reddit
The dude is a useful idiot whose job is to be a demolition expert of a soon-to-be formerly great world city.
AIter_Real1ty@reddit
Is this from starwars?
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
It's from Lord of the Star Trek
Then_Big_9524@reddit
I find it incredibly funny to have Palpatine representing Libertarians here, considering his role in Star Wars
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
I know, I know, I just liked the quote
Then_Big_9524@reddit
No no it does work really well, I just think it’s funny
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
How would someone that wants to control the galaxy represent an ideology of "live and let live" lmfao
Dollar_Bills@reddit
You shouldn't have to pay for your last ride on public transportation
scaryjobob@reddit
The same way we're waiting for all the crazy GOPs to crash and burn... right guys?
... right?
The hell is this crap? Conservative brigade?
FamousLastName@reddit
I’ve been a registered libertarian since 2013, I don’t know if as I’ve gotten older I’ve just changed but nothing he said in his speech last night sounded that crazy to me. So he wants to tax billionaires more and use those funds to help the people…not that crazy. He seems to be a true working class representative, regardless of what he calls himself I think that’s something we could all agree on and should all strive for. Working class solidarity.
I think the word socialism has been corrupted by conservative pundits and talking heads since the Cold War. Communism is bad. We know. It doesn’t work. But hell, late stage capitalism is pretty crony and sucks too.
We will see what happens in New York, maybe it’ll work out. Hoping it fails because “he’s a commie” is stupid and defeatist.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
His ideology is inherently immoral and unethical, no libertarian would ever support this. He represents the greatest threat to free people and free markets to the USA. Also “late stage capitalism” isn’t a real thing, it’s a left wing talking point to trick the uneducated about economics just like the whole blackrock talking point that’s 100% not true. The problems a lot of people are referring too has to do with the use of government regulations that favor certain industries and companies that are inherently anticompetitive. He’s literally for everything that we should be against, idc about his ethnicity or religious background, his ideology is evil.
FamousLastName@reddit
Free busses and free childcare aren’t evil lol
Ralphy_1997@reddit
There is no such thing as free buses and childcare.
FamousLastName@reddit
Of course, but taxing billionaires isn’t evil in my opinion. They’re corporations, not people.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
lol billionaires are people like Elon musk is a billionaire and a person. He doesn’t actually have billions of dollars in cash though, it’s all tied up in shares of corporations if that’s what you were meaning to say. A lot of time people don’t realize that a lot of these peoples wealth isn’t even real because they own larger stakes of a company they founded and like Elon owns 10% or telsa right now. If he tried to actually sell that much stock at one time then he would take huge losses as the stock would crash hard not to mention all the fees and then taxes he would pay for liquidating all of that. He’d probably be lucky to end up with half.
FamousLastName@reddit
Obviously lol
Regardless, even half that wealth is still more than enough to fund such things. Will it work? We’ll find out.
I’m just going to wait and see.
Happy to be wrong, happy to be right.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
Okay but he also had to take tons of risk to grow his wealth to that level, that’s the whole point of why capitalism leads to so much innovation. It rewards those that are willing to take the extra risk and use their life savings to fund R&D on a new product that helps millions vs doing the same thing and putting it all in bonds. Now you’re saying that we need to punish those people even though we use their products everyday because they have made are life better. It’s a terrible way to look at things, and not only that we are going to give that money to government bureaucrats and rent seekers who will spend that money as inefficiently as possible and more than likely cause more harm than ever before.
FamousLastName@reddit
I’m sorry, but I just cannot understand why anyone would ever Simp for a billionaires/corporations
It’s so weird to me. They haven’t really made your life better. They’ve made a product. They’re selling things that we don’t really need.
I guess they provide jobs, which is good but companies like Amazon and Walmart pay their employees shit.
I don’t care about Elon Musk’s “ risks “
He comes from a wealthy family who own a fucking mine , so I want to get into the exploitation of those people we could talk about that. Again, I just don’t understand why anyone would sit for these people they wouldn’t piss on you if you were on fire.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
I don’t stand up for billionaires, I stand up for what’s right. I’m not going to advocate to change to a worse system that will hurt a lot more people than it will ever help. That’s what’s wrong with people with your line of thinking. They would rather everyone be starving in the street than for someone to be doing better than them. That’s what’s wrong with democracy because people will do a lot of damage for a short term gain for long term pain.
FamousLastName@reddit
That’s not what I want at all, and I think you grossly mistaken, my own beliefs. I simply believe that we need to have social safety nets so people don’t slip through the cracks not everyone’s going to make it. I understand that but we should want people to at bare minimum be able to get by without struggling. Our current system does not really allow for that, with AI growing it’s going to put more and more people out of work. I mean, I’m sure you’ve seen the job market for this month. It’s abysmal.
Things are going to get worse and when things get worse, society acts out - when people‘s needs are not met, Crime follows.
That does not mean I support a welfare state , I just think people’s basic needs should be met and if local governments can solve that, fuck yeah! That helps keep fed government small.
This is coming from someone who makes $240,000 a year- I’m by no means the target audience of this- I’m just a blue-collar dude who wants better than what our current systems are doing.
westphac@reddit
They are when the process of implementing them leads to no busses and no childcare for anyone.
FamousLastName@reddit
You’re going to have to explain your position because I’m not seeing the correlation
westphac@reddit
Imagine there are city busses that run for $5 a ride. Some people can’t afford bus rides, so Mamdani makes them free, and pays for the costs with billionaire tax money. Government doesn’t care about profit, so their costs are constantly rising. Now the costs are continuing to go up, and there’s no revenue at all except for billionaire tax money. Eventually, that billionaire tax money runs out. Either they become taxed to the point they are no longer billionaires or more likely have just left. So now you have free busses, but nobody to pay for their costs. At that point you have two options: move onto taxing the millionaires or just stop providing busses. Taxing the millionaires leads to the same two options, and that continues all the way down until you’re taxing homeless people to provide “free” busses. When even they are taxed to oblivion, the government costs still increase, which leads to a complete inability to even provide the service.
FamousLastName@reddit
It’s just such a “what if” that in my opinion, needs to be proven- and don’t will be. I don’t foresee billionaire money running out unless billionaires leave which again I really don’t see happening.
Time will tell. I don’t think we need to be doomists about something that hasn’t happened yet. It’s fair to be concerned and it’s fair to be cautious.
westphac@reddit
Except it has happened time and again wherever it’s implemented. There is not shortage of such historical events.
FamousLastName@reddit
Also, for what it’s worth there’s plenty of democratic socialist countries that are doing just fine.
Yes, there’s no doubt that Europe has some major issues with their Muslim populations, that has nothing to do with their social welfare programs, though. That’s what happens when you take in refugees from war torn countries and then don’t bother to try to assimilate them in fear of being labeled “anti-woke” for lack of a better term.
FamousLastName@reddit
Well, I guess we’ll find out then eh?
No stopping this one.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
That’s why government worker unions are unethical too. There is not two parties with competing interests that have to negotiate a fair deal to both parties, but an employer who doesn’t have any reason to fight back and an incentive to give in. It’s not like management positions in government roles lose anything and they can just stick all that extra cost onto the taxpayers. It’s not like it comes out of their pocket anyway lol.
Charimia@reddit
Wow. “He’s inherently immoral, unethical, and evil” is certainly a take…
Ralphy_1997@reddit
He’s a socialist psychopathic parasite, he should be in prison not running for mayor. If we’re going to lock people up for drugs, prostitution, and stuff that only effects themselves than we should 100% be locking up socialist which are no better than a serial killer,rapist, or armed robber. I mean almost the exact same as an armed robber, using force to take from others what they could never achieve, except him using the threat of government oppression and violence. Idk how any that claims in anyway to be libertarian could ever have any but disgust for him. If you were a maga populist then it would make sense because it would show you just follow whatever propaganda is popular now but no one who is a free thinker should fall for that.
Charimia@reddit
Jesus, dude.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
Sorry if that’s radical but literal death is better than living under goverment oppression with socialism.
TheVeryVerity@reddit
I just can’t believe you think a socialist is as bad as someone who killed somebody. If someone murders your mom you still are going to claim a socialist is just as bad? Absolutely wild.
Ralphy_1997@reddit
lol there is a difference between personal and societal harm. If someone kills a direct family member than that will obviously harm me more directly, socialist cause more harm to society as a whole though then one person killing one person.
TheVeryVerity@reddit
A socialist existing doesn’t harm anyone more than someone killing somebody else. A socialist government takes way more effort than talking by random college kids or anyone else. You thinking thought crime is as bad as murder is one of the wildest things I’ve seen on the internet lol
Ralphy_1997@reddit
Okay by your logic then I guess all nazis aren’t bad people either?
TheVeryVerity@reddit
Lmao wow you just get crazier. Have a good day/night man, I’m out 😂
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
I think you're failing to make a distinction here. An ideology that is: "inherently immoral, unethical, and evil," is absolutely possible from a person or a group that has zero unethical, or evil intent.
So, people like you get huffy when you see someone that: "Obviously means well." is being excoriated in such a manner.
The problem here, is, at the risk of Godwinning the sub-thread, and I hope it's obvious I'm engaging in some hyperbole to make the point, but Hitler, Stalin, and Mao all "meant well" too. At least from the standpoint of how they viewed things.
They arguably did not wake up every morning chortling with glee at all the death and misery they'd cause that day. At most, they believed they were "hard men" that were able to make the utilitarian choices that needed to happen to make society or their nation "better" as they saw it.
Now, is the Mayor of NYC even close to the level of power those men have? No. Obviously not. However, intentions rarely matter. Outcomes always matter.
If Mamdani raises taxes and regulations on a NYC business owner, that forces them to close doors, driving them into unprofitability, to fund/subsidize people that didn't work or earn the rent, public transport, or whatever else they consume... is this "evil?"
A Libertarian would definitely say: "Yes, this is evil." Even if Mamdani's intentions was to "help" the people he believed could not pay for or provide these things for himself.
Now... Ralphy_1997 up there might not be making this distinction with his condemnation of Mamdani, but that doesn't make what you're implying correct either.
Charimia@reddit
I think it’s crazy to say the ideology is inherently immoral, unethical and evil. That’s what I am taking issue with. It’s demonizing and degrades the actual arguments that can be made against Mamdani’s ideas.
westphac@reddit
It’s not that they are evil because they aren’t our views. That’s what few carpenter was saying about intentions rarely mattering while outcomes always do. Socialists out there may be good, kind people who are simply doing what they view will best help the world or themselves. Socialists aren’t inherently evil. Socialism the idea, however, is inherently evil. Socialism has been proven theoretically and practically every time to only bring suffering and death when it is implemented. The more socialist policies that Mamdani enacts, the worse NYC will be in just a few years time. He may be a charismatic young politician who genuinely believes that he is doing the right thing, but the results of his policies will still be evil.
Charimia@reddit
I feel like you’re talking past me. I am not saying they said “socialists are evil” and I already corrected my semantic mistake of addressing “he’s evil” vs “his ideology is evil.” I think it still stands that the ideology itself is not evil, and to say it is causes us to miss the opportunity to actually talk about how things go right and how they go wrong both in ideology and implementation.
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
Oh dear... I'm not saying or implying Leftism is "evil" because of how I feel about it. Or that I merely disagree with it.
I'm saying Leftism is evil because it is.
For the sake of argument, I'll dispense with my assertions that Leftism is ideological cancer, because Leftism is a deeply hateful anti-human/misanthropic ideology built on a foundation of envy, and then worse, it cloaks itself in a paper-thin veneer of "social and economic justice" to disguise itself.
So, to help you understand better, I'll just toss all of that right out the window because it's easy enough to get lost in the weeds and you can claim that all those assertions I'd make are subjective ones based on how I feel.
So, fine. I concede this. Just write all that off as "subjective opinion" on my part.
I will instead assert that Leftism is objectively and factually evil, because it holds the world record for human body-count/deaths by orders of magnitude over any other ethos or ideology you care to name. These are all unnatural non-combat deaths of human beings through political violence, oppression, or famine/mismanagement. And the Left has a tally, from 1900 onwards... in excess of 100 million people.
I certainly understand that one might wish to engage a little moral relativism for the sake of polite cocktail conversation, but does your moral relativism extend so far as to excuse the murder of over 100 million human beings?
And no, this is not hyperbole, just history.
And this is what I'm alluding to when I state that intentions rarely matter, but outcomes always do.
Now... is this an excuse to let the Right off the hook? Of course not. They're a pack of deeply hypocritical top-tier asshats. If the Right actually acted on it's stated ideology of zero coercion free-markets, minarchy, and maximum individual liberty, they'd be almost de-facto Libertarians. And right now, the "Right" isn't even arguably "the Right" anymore. Under Trump and MAGA it's delved into Postliberal bullshit that is arguably almost Peronism.
But, that said, in my critique of the Right, it's somewhat inherent that I will confidently assert, the Left is even worse, and always has been.
And having said this, you can either accept this, and try to deal with it. Or, you can just get indignant and come up with whatever rationalizations, compartmentalizations, and cognitive dissonance you need. I mean, you're in good company, I just described 90% of Reddit.
LegalSC@reddit
His ideology, he said. Where's the lie?
jobutabaki@reddit
Yes, I don’t think he understands what either of those words mean.
Professional_Golf393@reddit
You’re not a libertarian
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
This is the fundamental problem with Libertarianism in a nutshell. So many people aren't, but they like to use the word. Both for good-faith but mistaken reasons, and bad-faith wedge issue ones.
The "Libertarian Left" wants the "sex, drugs, & rock-n-roll" social freedoms, but still wants coercive Statist force to engage in collectivist wealth redistribution and subsidies.
The "Libertarian Right" wants laissez-faire capitalism and other freedoms, (Guns/RKBA etc.) but wants coercive Statist force against groups, people, cultures, and social behaviors they dislike.
Neither of these people, and there's a fuckton of them are actually Libertarians.
Just accepting some billionaire can keep their billions and do whatever they want with them, as long as it doesn't involve coercion and force, and accepting some queer pony-gender pot farmers that dress their son as a drag queen, & parading him around, can do what they want, as long as they're not forcing him to do it...
Either side of this, that's the hardest goddamn position on the planet to actually maintain. We have a TON of base-level monkey-troop instincts to try and exert force & control over other members of the tribe when it comes to resources and behaviors.
bteam3r@reddit
I guess this sub doesn't allow awards, which is a shame because this is the first time I've felt compelled to voluntarily part with some money just to tell some guy on the internet he's doing a great job
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
Thanks...
It's nothing that other deep minds haven't already said already, just paraphrased.
But I'm glad it resonates.
FamousLastName@reddit
I certainly have libertarian ideologies but as I’ve gotten older there are some things I’m flexible on. I think have social safety nets just makes sense.
MakinBaconOnTheBeach@reddit
But the way he achieves his goals of helping the working class goes against libertarian principles. "Free" buses, "free" child care, city run grocery stores, even more rent control than NYC already has. Just more government control and central planning.
FamousLastName@reddit
I don’t have a problem with free busses or childcare, especially if it helps working class people. Local government is the most important government there is in my opinion. If there is a way to help people locally, I see no issue. I’m for smaller Fed and state government all day, but I don’t have a problem with those ideas. I don’t see how those are bad.
MakinBaconOnTheBeach@reddit
I'm sorry, but that's just not a libertarian perspective. Free markets and liberty, right? Instead of the market competing for better and cheaper buses and childcare, the city is just going to forcibly take it from its citizens and (most likely) provide an inferior product than the market can.
Just to wrap it up, he tweeted "Taxation isn't theft, capitalism is." That short statement goes entirely against basic libertarian principles.
VicisSubsisto@reddit
War isn't war, peace is.
Slavery isn't slavery, freedom is.
Strength isn't strength, ignorance is.
ThreetoedJack@reddit
Nobody has a problem with "free" busses. However, anyone who's not economically illiterate will have a problem with how they are funded.
A couple things to keep in mind: tragedy of the commons and violent delights have violent ends.
restinb1tch@reddit
Right.....
I dont even like Trump but I'm not hoping he crashes and burn cause wtf.... like that would literally impact me if he failed us as a nation.
The people wishing for failure are sooo odd and weird.
Kathubodua@reddit
The obsession with and demonizing of Mamdani is bizarre. So he actually wants to carry out what Demicrats have used as empty talking points for years, big deal. It is not that radical
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
I can fundamentally agree with this. It's a good point to raise.
Or, another take on his policies is that they're arguably mostly just "European" in outlook, and not all that "hard Left." And they only really seem so from the American standpoint. And that's probably aided by some "flyover country" antipathy for NYC itself, no matter what it's doing. Be it the 1970's "Death Wish" dystopia of brick fields and burning cars, Guliani's peak "stop & frisk" of the "post 9/11 rebound," or now whatever Mamdani will attempt.
However, at the same time I can confidently state this is not exactly an endorsement of the Democrats either. In terms of their actual duplicity for pursuing Corporatism draped in Leftist social trappings, nor their actual "aspirational" platform goals they claim to support.
Neither are any good.
Of course, the GOP absolutely sucks too, for different reasons, but ones that play out in a very similar pathology overall.
Kathubodua@reddit
Its manufactured rage and exhausting. I ignored this sub for a long time because of the MAGA bias here, long before I moved into left-libertarian and beyond. I've seen hope lately, but these posts, falling into the GOP propaganda machine's efforts to demonize him, is just sad.
It's fine to disagree and talk about his policies. But calling him a communist and talking about how he is going to destroy NYC is just laughable.
And don't get me wrong, I am not a fan of Democrats. I think they have betrayed this country in their own way, by and large. They mostly say one thing and do another and line their pockets just like the GOP. But we have to do better than this.
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zoltqn@reddit
This is why I don't affiliate with the party anymore. Yall are just a bunch of pussies.
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
Wtf is this, libertarianism is not tied to any religion dude. You're free to worship any religion as long as you leave other people tf alone
Tater_Sauce1@reddit
Not safe enough, in in the fallout zone, and been fucked by the NYC population enough
SelectCattle@reddit
I think his rent control idea is fascinating. Why has this never been tried before in the history of man?
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
What's the idea ?
I sense sarcasm but we had lefties on the sub so I am suspicious this could be genuine
SelectCattle@reddit
The idea is that rent control has been tried on six continents over 15,000 years and has consistently resulted in increased housing prices.
But maybe this time will be different! Fingers crossed!
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
Oh it was sarcasm, good, got concerned someone would think Rent Control is a good idea lmao
Every time it gets tried, it never fails to make things worse for the people.
Eric862@reddit
People are really losing their shit over this guy. Sure, I think some of his economic proposals aren't realistic, but they probably won't get implemented anyways. And otherwise he's a decent man cares about individual rights and is prepared to stand up to an authoritarian federal government.
Electrical_Bunch7555@reddit
100%
Electrical_Bunch7555@reddit
I fundamentally disagree with his means for taking action on his policies. I do not disagree with any of the problems that he is calling attention to. I’m tired of the two parties politicizing, the poor, hungry, and poverty with absolutely zero fucking action for change. I’m entirely skeptical of Mom Donnie, however like OP, I’m watching from afar and truly rooting for him. Rooting for the people of NYC, rather That said Massie 2028 👏🏽
nnamdrep@reddit
I’m not a fan of his socialism ideas, but I am a fan of his pissing Trump off ideas.
Silky_Mango@reddit
Maybe Libertarian politicians can take notes on his campaign and get elected to a notable office too
Dry_Winter5652@reddit
I'm confused. This guy does not represent libertarian views at all.
librarian1001@reddit
The joke is that we’re waiting for him to crash and burn
ThreetoedJack@reddit
It's more than waiting. It's expecting. It's knowing what's going to happen. We've all seen this movie, we've all read this book, we know how this ends.
It's like when your cousin decides to bring the grill inside the house. You tell him that it's a bad idea. In fact, it's a really bad idea that will end in suffering. You show him charts and graphs and physics textbooks and building codes and common sense proving that bringing a charcoal grill inside the living room will probably catch the house on fire, increase CO2 levels to dangerous concentrations, and the house will smell like smoke for a decade.
He responds that you obviously don't want kids to eat and you hate hamburgers.
Then two minutes into grilling and nothing is on fire he claims victory and that you are an evil person and probably racist.
But of course none of the consequences will ever be his fault. And you'll be the asshole for not "helping out" when his kids pass out from CO2 poisoning or not letting him and his family "crash on your couch" cousin Eddy style because his house burned down -because of shitty drywall installation and not the fucking charcoal grill in the fucking living room.
Dry_Winter5652@reddit
OK I gotcha. I was confused because I think there was a guy on here who made a post a little while back asking something along the lines of "if Republicans don't like Zohran and Democrats dont like Zohran does that mean hes just what our country needs to disrupt the system?" Pretty sure he wasn't kidding.
staticattacks@reddit
Dude was nuts
Weaksoul@reddit
I dunno, the sith are all about freedom and doing what the individual feels is right for them. The jedi are intrinsic to the government and represent galactic order and uniformity
kkdawg22@reddit
Are we talking about the original trilogy here? Where the rebels are fighting the empire? And the jedi are on which side?
Weaksoul@reddit
This is a scene from the prequels where the incumbent are the Republic that are wrapped up with the jedi.
"Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me".
Weaksoul@reddit
Aka: don't tread on me
500mHeadShot@reddit
epp1K@reddit
In fact I think he's considered the bad guy.
PossibleWestern3280@reddit
I’m pretty sure libertarians don’t represent themselves. I’ve found that they’re just conservatives with an itch for weed. I’m down for a minarchy but yall will bitch at a leftist economics but jork to republicans destroying the free market.
Civil-Song7416@reddit
I am personally glad he was elected. Along with the other democrats that won, it has the administration concerned. Maybe they will do better. Maybe they will take a more America First position like they campaigned on. Maybe they will quit acting like clowns.
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
They won't
They'll just start blaming Mamdani and Mamdani will start Blaming the Trump administration
They will just be each other's scape goats
zanpher717@reddit
So you're the emperor in this case?
TheSheepSaysBaa@reddit
I know what he is trying to convey, but having Libertarians be the emperor is a bad move.
blaimjos@reddit
Like atmospheric nuclear testing, I find the "safe distance" concept worrisome. There are complications.
SerenityNow31@reddit
No one is safe. That stuff spreads.
Exciting_Vast7739@reddit
They say the best way to convert a liberal into a conservative is to give them a job.
Now he's got a job.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjzqO6UOPFQ
Exciting_Vast7739@reddit
This is the most accurate take, and should be pinned for the month of November.
Few_Carpenter_9185@reddit
They'll just blame "greed" and Capitalism. Or, things like population decline, and the WFH commercial property spiral gutting urban downtowns like NYC/Manhattan. Or for whatever other reasons, and it'll be memory-holed like every other far-Left disaster in history.
You have to remember these are people who gush over the "Scandinavian Socialist Model" while the actual Scandinavians are standing over there getting pissed pointing out that they're not actually Socialists, just high-tax Capitalists.
Whatever he plans, it's already going to fail out of the gate, because he will not have the tax-base to draw on to implement anything. Even in that "honeymoon phase" before capital flees NYC.
Besides just the inherent dynamics of: "Leftist failure," he's doomed.
- The fundamental weakness in the economy right now, masked by the AI bubble.
- Trump/MAGA tariff damage to trade and prices.
- The post-Covid WFH revolution/gutting of commercial real estate is still ongoing. (WFH will "win" over RTO, because WFH is CHEAPER...)
- The slowing of population growth alone is hitting the economy. It hasn't even shrunk YET. Plus ICE, deportations, and subsequent self-deportation reducing population and net-demand for... everything too. Less kids, even Christmas and Black Friday's will be smaller for decades to come.
Just look at the attached image of the current US commercial real-estate mortgage delinquency rates. I mean... getting rid of the NYPD will save him some money to spend on "fair this and that..." but I don't think it'll be enough...
We don't even need the "usual" stuff that will kill this big Leftist/Socialist push he intends. Where dependents and non-productive people flock to new sources of subsidy, high taxes/regulation drives away business and capital, or crime and lower street-level quality of life disincentivizes people and businesses from staying in NYC.
This failed before it started.
RigobertaMenchu@reddit
He’s just a mayor. A politician. Yall acting like he can do anything.
sadiqsamani@reddit
The enemy is both strong and weak.
He will ruin everything and also accomplish nothing.
john35093509@reddit
He can definitely screw things up. That's what politicians do best.
Mixedthought@reddit
Ummmm probably find a better image
Low_Abrocoma_1514@reddit (OP)
I know it is Palpatine, however the quote is very fitting
Few_Industry_2712@reddit
It still does not fit.
-BigBoo-@reddit
No we will not watch his career. I could care less who New York chooses to drive themselves into the ground.
movieguy2004@reddit
vaiplantarbatata@reddit
“From a safe distance”, indeed!