I have survivors guilt. [Story]
Posted by This-Ticket-6348@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 45 comments
It’s not what you think. I didn’t get into some crash and I was the only one who survived. It’s a bit different.
I’m an ATP at a regional airline. I see what hiring is like right now and it is horrible. Airlines have their doors shut to qualified pilots and my friends and colleagues are either stuck as a CFI racking up thousands of hours, submitted hundreds of applications and networked so much and have either been ghosted or rejected so much that they have lost motivation or have quit aviation altogether and it makes me feel guilty for “making it in”.
You see, I went to a 141. Did my time there and managed to get in the airlines through an airline program through the school. This was around a year ago. Shortly after, that program pulled out of the university and it has been virtually impossible to get into that particular airline nowadays. I’ve seen many pilots, thousands of hours, zero failures, maybe a couple failures, gold seal, CFI, CFII, MEI, turbine time, TPIC, tons of extracurricular aviation based activity, you name it, and they aren’t getting in. A lot of my friends are unhappy and a lot of aviators are unhappy. Not just here, just throughout everywhere with hiring. I try to stay humble and I try to stay positive. I love flying, and I love aviation. I want to share pictures of what I love online (outside of cockpit, not breaking FARS and SOP) and even talk about it but it’s getting to the point where I don’t want to talk about what I do because I don’t want to make people upset. look at myself and I feel bad/guilty that I’m in the position that I’m in and my friends/colleagues are in the position that they’re in. Is anyone else dealing with this?
Disclaimer: I am okay, I operate safely, I love my job and aviation runs in my blood + am healthy Just feeling “survivors guilt”.
JustAnotherDude1990@reddit
I was wondering how long this post would make it before the lovely members of this sub attacked you enough to make you not want to share anything ever again.
powerflexx@reddit
Do you want us to feel bad for you? Lol shut up
flying-ModTeam@reddit
/r/flying is intended to be a friendly and accepting place; check your ego at the door and take your snark and attitude elsewhere.
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
Nope.
powerflexx@reddit
Why post then
Hot-Category-5740@reddit
Got hired by F9 at 22 years old, went to UA at 24 years old. 0 survivors guilt, survival of the fittest.
FodneyRangerfield@reddit
My hope is this is just a troll, but either way you need to seriously reevaluate your attitude.
There are thousands of military pilots, many close friends of mine, who have thousands of hours flying on dark, stormy, shitty nights over open ocean where their only divert is a bit of steel moving through the water at 20kts. They missed the hiring window because they were doing their countries bidding, not meowing on guard like I’m sure you were.
You are not “the fittest”. You did the work and got lucky the window opened when it did.
I’m sure captains love you.
Hot-Category-5740@reddit
Life’s ruff, get a collar
flying-ModTeam@reddit
/r/flying is intended to be a friendly and accepting place; check your ego at the door and take your snark and attitude elsewhere.
fingermydickhole@reddit
Survival of the fittest…What a dumbass thing to say
flying-ModTeam@reddit
/r/flying is intended to be a friendly and accepting place; check your ego at the door and take your snark and attitude elsewhere.
Odd-Explanation-9614@reddit
Survival of the fittest? So guys who were flying turboprops at the regionals after 2001 or 911 are not as "fit" as you because you got the luckiest path in aviation history? Hope you lose your medical
f9pilot@reddit
As someone who got stuck in regionals for over a decade before getting hired at F9, what’s it like to be such an elite pilot?
SATSewerTube@reddit
What’s your influencer channel??????!!! /s
Special_Seesaw3378@reddit
“Luckiest timing”
LegalRecord3431@reddit
This is a dumb post.
KJ3040@reddit
It’s better to be lucky than good
Sharp_Experience_104@reddit
It’s better to be lucky and good.
Odd-Explanation-9614@reddit
It's better to be blessed than lucky or good
Sharp_Experience_104@reddit
True that!
DonWop1@reddit
This post is so irritating. You don’t have survivors guilt… I lost a buddy during a training evolution in the military and struggled with survivors guilt as I watched his family grieve years ago… Why don’t you tell HR how depressed you are over not being able to share pictures so I can take your spot.
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
Didn’t mean to offend you/have it come off as insensitive. I can’t even imagine the amount of grief you experienced personally and through watching your friend’s family. I appreciate your comment. Thank you for addressing your concern
Iknewitseason11@reddit
I agree you sound like a damn baby whining that you got an airline job like wtf is this post bro
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
I’m “whining” because I want people like you to get into the airlines, bro. I don’t know your history. But seeing your flair that you’re a CFII and the people who left the initial comment is also a CFII shows that there is dedication and work to the craft.
I don’t need pity. Why would I go on Reddit of all places to do that? That’s not what I’m looking for. Simply venting and seeing if anyone else has felt some sort of that experience in their career.
Wonder_Momoa@reddit
I get what you’re trying to say but It comes off more as a humble brag lol
Iknewitseason11@reddit
Exactly
mattdm311@reddit
Same
ltcterry@reddit
There are about 20,000 out of 30,000 or so recently new CFIs who will likely not find flying jobs. All while the system turns out more.
Much of life is random rather than equitable. Sort 1000 applicants and take the top 50. Number 51 doesn’t get hired next month because 60 more people applied…
And that’s not your responsibility. I have zero athletic or musical ability. But enjoy others’ success in those areas.
I saw good advice: “be concerned about things you can change; don’t worry about those you can’t.”
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
I’ll remember that quote, thank you.
RepresentativeOfnone@reddit
Tell them “Whomp whomp” and now you can officially switch up on your day ones /s
Superb-Photograph529@reddit
Fair enough, but you could just as easily be on the other side of it. It's just the churn.
Hanae_Mori@reddit
Wrong term. What you describe is better called Success Guilt. I don't get the sense that you meant anything by it, but using 'survivor's guilt' in this context is a bit tone-deaf, especially in a community where it is highly likely to bump into someone who has actually lost a friend or collegue in aviation. To that person, there is no comparision with that and what you're experiencing, and it can come off wrong.
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
I really should’ve thought about that prior to making this post. That’s my fault — thank you.
Bowzy228@reddit
There’s nothing you can do to help you friends other than maybe a LOR but those don’t do much these days anyway. I would rather make it and feel bad VS not making it. Considering yourself lucky and enjoy your career.
Maybe one day it’ll open for the rest of us but many will quit all together. Some will come back when things get better, others will get comfortable with a different career. That’s just what it is.
This-Ticket-6348@reddit (OP)
Thank you so much for taking the time to go out of your way and write this. I really hope that it open up for everyone again. I just hate how it goes up and down in waves
Bowzy228@reddit
I know man. It sucks. I became a CFI a year ago and still can’t find a job as an instructor or any flying job for that matter. Many CFIs at my old flight school are way beyond 2000 hours and they’re still instructing. Even your friends should consider themselves lucky since they’re no longer paying for flight time. Believe it or not I still rent to keep my currency.
This bottleneck might take a few years who knows? I ended up moving on with my backup career but still have one foot in aviation.
PM_ME_YOUR_FOQA@reddit
It’s different to understand that you got in the nick of time and to feel guilt. Don’t feel guilt. It’s what it is. Make good use of every opportunity you have.
Jacrifice@reddit
I’ve been through a lot of aviation jobs over the years. Took the dive into being a pilot about a year and a half ago.
Yeah it sucks right now, but I wouldn’t change a thing.
BootComprehensive321@reddit
Real friends would be happy for you for making it. It’s not your fault the market is what it is. (I’m speaking as a private pilot only so my aviation advice may be very limited but life experience isn’t so much haha)
Keep your chin up buddy. I’m happy for you. No need to feel guilty. Happy flying!
RealP4@reddit
My friend you have a good soul. But count your graces you gotta take care of you first. There are way worse things that people are dealing with than not getting a job from the current aviation hiring cycle. You can drive yourself mad thinking of everything. Keep grinding you deserve to be where you are at :)
slipstall@reddit
You sound… depressed…. I’m calling the FAA! /s I totally feel the same way sometimes.
I think one of the things to take away from this is that you (and I) are at our chosen airline…. right now. This industry is cyclical.
There may come a day where you are furloughed, downsized, spun off into a shitty company, whatever. Just because your friends haven’t made it yet doesn’t mean they never will. It is just going to take longer. They may end up in a better position than you by the time you hit 65. You don’t really know if you made the right call until you hit that point. That’s my take at least.
whataborgor@reddit
I remember for the longest time this subreddit was dead against being a part of any cadet program, calling them worthless, waste of time and when hiring went crazy who were the airlines hiring? All of those damn cadets. Like someone else said, this career is about timing and who you know. Don't feel bad you made it in early and your buddies are on the outside looking in. Outside of just flying you must do your due diligence, study the hiring trends, volunteer, build yourself up and you'll be in a position to be hireable but it still doesn't matter. It'll happen when it happens.
WorkingOnPPL@reddit
I wouldn’t feel guilty. You are humble enough to realize that luck and timing played some role in your success. I think that is all that is required on your part.
redditburner_5000@reddit
It's timing. That's it.
Are you guilty enough to quit and give your spot to someone else? No? Oh...okay.
Don't worry about it. The timing worked out for you! Embrace it and understand that you're a lucky one! Might not be so lucky next time.
It's always better to be lucky than good!
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
It’s not what you think. I didn’t get into some crash and I was the only one who survived. It’s a bit different.
I’m an ATP at a regional airline. I see what hiring is like right now and it is horrible. Airlines have their doors shut to qualified pilots and my friends and colleagues are either stuck as a CFI racking up thousands of hours, submitted hundreds of applications and networked so much and have either been ghosted or rejected so much that they have lost motivation or have quit aviation altogether and it makes me feel guilty for “making it in”.
You see, I went to a 141. Did my time there and managed to get in the airlines through an airline program through the school. This was around a year ago. Shortly after, that program pulled out of the university and it has been virtually impossible to get into that particular airline nowadays. I’ve seen many pilots, thousands of hours, zero failures, maybe a couple failures, gold seal, CFI, CFII, MEI, turbine time, TPIC, tons of extracurricular aviation based activity, you name it, and they aren’t getting in. A lot of my friends are unhappy and a lot of aviators are unhappy. Not just here, just throughout everywhere with hiring. I try to stay humble and I try to stay positive. I love flying, and I love aviation. I want to share pictures of what I love online (outside of cockpit, not breaking FARS and SOP) and even talk about it but it’s getting to the point where I don’t want to talk about what I do because I don’t want to make people upset. look at myself and I feel bad/guilty that I’m in the position that I’m in and my friends/colleagues are in the position that they’re in. Is anyone else dealing with this?
Disclaimer: I am okay, I operate safely, I love my job and aviation runs in my blood + am healthy Just feeling “survivors guilt”.
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