Major FO career advice
Posted by G_Platypus@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 73 comments
Hello everyone,
I'm an FO at a major airline with no TPIC. I managed to get in during the covid wave and I've collected a few type ratings since. Upgrade times are near 10 years and I'd like to eventually move on to a legacy. I like my current company but it's future is less certain than any of the big four.
As far as I see I have two options: stay, make myself comfortable and eventually move to a legacy in a long, long time - or go back to a regional, upgrade, and then go to a legacy.
I'm obviously not excited about giving up the pay and QOL to go fly under a regional contract, but long term that might be the best option.
Ideas?
Tailwheel1991@reddit
Literally half of each AA class right now is Spirit and JetBlue, the other half are military and wholly owned regional flow throughs. AA is taking record numbers of pilots through training right now.
CAM0916@reddit
That’s just factually incorrect.
Joe_Littles@reddit
How long will the continue?
Tailwheel1991@reddit
I have no way of knowing that but they are taking everyone they can get. I just moved up another 247 in system seniority. Classes of 62-68 starting every Wednesday through January at this point
Joe_Littles@reddit
They are publicly saying 1500 hires in 2026. So that’s good.
Tailwheel1991@reddit
I believe AA is receiving more three more 737-MAX8’s ahead of schedule by end of year and they are gearing up for the new A321 XLR’s. The very first XLR in the U.S. was delivered to DFW just 7 days ago on October 22nd and 50 were ordered, making it aircraft number 1,001 on property! 737 Max10’s are expected on property in late 2027 or 2028, so significant fleet expansion incoming.
Big-Technology7161@reddit
Fastest way to majors is become an FO at JSX. UA loves them and AA is targeting them. You'll be right seat mainline within 30 months. Skip the regionals - Envoy to AA is 5+ years, JSX is the fastest way.
MyPilotInterview@reddit
I have been career coaching pilots exclusively for 25 years.
I see your situation completely differently than where you are.
The variations in what hours and type of hours change so rapidly. Recently we have seen UAL not require TPIC, and albeit there seems to be special focus on NK and F9 they are picking from other airlines too. With the hiring projects into 2026, I think no TPIC will be the norm.
So my recommendation to you, update your hours every 2 weeks. The more you do it the better the results. Plan to go to some job fairs, yes it’s pay to play but it works. Reach out to everyone you’ve flown with that is at the legacies and strengthen that network. The Chief Pilot breakfast at UAL, appears to be very effective in having your app pulled.
I will admit we never know exactly what is going to happen - 2 years ago your assessment would have been more accurate, but today things are changing for the better for you.
Joe_Littles@reddit
Do you suspect average times of new hires will go down in 2026?
MyPilotInterview@reddit
That is what I’m anticipating. Hiring forecast is promising and if AA and DL still require 500 - 1,000 TPIC UA will have their pick of every candidate and AA and DL will have what’s left over.
SubarcticFarmer@reddit
DL doesn't require TPIC
Status_Job2266@reddit
You think UA is more preferred airline than DL these days? I know the routes and bases are better, but delta is proven to be top for a long time prior.
I’m asking as a regional pilot who only knows from here say.
EdBasqueMaster@reddit
Delta has run the most successful internal and external PR campaign in history convincing people that they are exceedingly better than their competition in any meaningful metric.
SubarcticFarmer@reddit
This is the first time I think I've ever heard someone claim American is providing the same service as UA or Delta. Which is hilarious because even American's CEO has said they need to start trying to provide service more like United and Delta.
brongchong@reddit
There is a secret sauce. It’s called $5-$6B profit. Consistently outside of COVID. UAL is catching up. AMR will lose money this year and has $40B debt.
DAL is #1 and UAL is catching up and is a very close #2. Either is a GREAT job for anyone seeking a major career.
SWA, ALK, JBLU aren’t even close and will likely lose money this year as well. SWA doesn’t know who they are anymore.
EdBasqueMaster@reddit
Please carefully but gently remove Ed Bastian’s cock from your mouth.
Most of what you just said is factually incorrect. AMR projects a profit this year. They are less than 40b in debt. SWA is making money. ALK will make money. JBU is the only one of yours referenced in a weird purgatory right now.
I actually am not sure if I want to feel bad for the way you view the world or to laugh at you.
Sacknuts93@reddit
Preface: I am not a DL guy.
But - they are more FINANCIALLY successful than anyone right now. They are making 60% of the industry-wide profit. There is something to be said for that, and the profit-sharing checks will reflect that accordingly.
But yes, they all do the same job we all do. Their marketing is just better.
EdBasqueMaster@reddit
I definitely agree. Their finances are incredible and they do run a great product — I’m not denying that by any means.
But the way that a random person I will interact with is convinced Delta is some superior airline and that flying them comes with clout (???) always blows my mind.
They really did a master class on brand imaging.
Sacknuts93@reddit
Agree on all points.
UAL new "next" interior on NBs I think is better than DAL. Starlink, huge screens that have bluetooth headset enabled, Apple TV+, spotify, ton of movies, etc.
It's a fantastic product. I hope they market it appropriately to demonstrate how far they've come.
I know personally that Starlink is a total game changer...you are getting 300 mb/s from gate to gate. It enables business people to listen in on conferences real time, playing online video gaming, streaming, you name it. It's such a huge deal for passenger convenience and entertainment.
Otherwise-Pen70@reddit
I flew for United for 32 years - never got furloughed. Both Airlines are a fairly safe bet but if you want to live on the west coast - go with United; they have the best domiciles in my opinion including on the east coast
DefundTheHOA_@reddit
Delta thinks they are better than everyone.
Doesn’t always mean it’s true.
MyPilotInterview@reddit
No. They’re getting more talk because they’re hiring more. Typically everyone applies to DL, AA, UA and whoever gives you a class first is your airline.
PICisking@reddit
I think it's mainly because United is growing more than Delta at the moment, thus creating more job openings and more opportunities for seniority progression.
Joe_Littles@reddit
FWIW I got a friend who is an AA recruiter. They have two buckets: 2500 TT & 500 TPIC, and 3000 TT with 1500 TSIC
Dunno about delta but have seen folks get interviews with 1000-1200 turbine SIC
f9pilot@reddit
“I’ve been career coaching pilots exclusively for 25 years…Recently… United has stopped requiring TPIC, and while Spirit…seem to be their preference”
Did you retire?
justcallme3nder@reddit
How much does having a sibling currently working as a pilot at a legacy help getting hired at that legacy?
Otherwise-Pen70@reddit
not much. But they might be able to walk in your application or application update
MyPilotInterview@reddit
Depends on what capacity? If they’re the CEO, you’re golden. As a pilot, they will be able to get you to a meet and greet which is beneficial. As an entry level worker, probably very little.
justcallme3nder@reddit
Thx. They've been a pilot there for 9 years
MyPilotInterview@reddit
That’s a good referral. Make sure if there is a section on the application to disclose family members who work at the organization you fill it out correctly.
G_Platypus@reddit (OP)
Yeah I'm seeing all the legacies starting to hire again, some more than others, and I'm trying to get ahead of whatever hiring wave might be on its way
Sacknuts93@reddit
Apply to everyone, silly.
You can't afford the luxury of having all your eggs in one basket. Have your apps in with the big 3 and SWA. To do otherwise is foolish...you never know who will call.
MyPilotInterview@reddit
It is difficult because it can become a game of whack-a-mole, and you find yourself one step behind every move.
Historical_One3960@reddit
Is the Chief pilot breakfast different than a chief pilot meet and greet?
Oregon-Pilot@reddit
Yes, at the breakfast you have the opportunity to spill sausage links and syrup on your trousers.
Twarrior913@reddit
“Sorry my pants are sticky I was just excited to meet you”
MyPilotInterview@reddit
No, different airlines call them different things and have changed them over the years.
sawdustking@reddit
Hopefully someone will just buy the Blue Airplane company. But I'd hang out there man, it'll get better. You're in a good position believe it or not. My .02.
SRM_Thornfoot@reddit
If I were interviewing you, I would assume you went back to a 135 operation because you were given the option to resign or get fired.
SecretSensitive8098@reddit
Horrible idea!
It sounds like you’re at you’re at Bluejet. I was a former bluejet pylot now at a legacy. I left for the same reason over a year ago. As many have said DO NOT go back to a regional. You will be giving up so much not only in 401K contributions ,but qol and earning potentials just at where you are. However, the real detriment will be your resume. Leaving a major for a regional is a major step backwards professionally and completely changes you chance on getting called for the worse. If you go to a regional you’ll have to qualify as an FO and then successfully pass upgrade and then time build that PIC. If something happens during training you’re going to be at a loss and not to mention that you’re no longer in a pile of major pilots but in a pile of regional pilots all waiting for the same call. As we all know legacies at times meters regional hires rather than hiring from Direct competitors.
Remember, pilots recruit pilots, if a recruiter ever saw you take a step backwards from major carrier to chase the left seat they would really question your judgement. While it is admirable that you’re willing to do this for a legacy job, there are other methods to boost your resume community volunteer, duty pilot, union etc.
As others have said -
Update regularly Go to job fairs Get involved some how Have your apps and resume professionally reviewed Be Patient!
NonVideBunt@reddit
I wouldn’t leave a Major FO job to go to a Regional for the hopes of a quick CA upgrade. That is a backwards step in your career imo and this industry is weird.. you never know what’s going to happen and there are no guarantees.
For example, I’ll bet the pilots at America West never thought they would end up being WB CAs at AA. I’d stay where you are, keep your apps updated, attend all the job fairs and get face time with recruiters. That’s going to break you out more.
PM_ME_YOUR_FOQA@reddit
Do not go back to a regional. Think about how many went under since 2020. Compass, Xpress, TSA and Whiskey. Hang on to your major job where what it says on your paycheck matches what it says on the side of your jet.
changgerz@reddit
is whiskey fully done now?
PM_ME_YOUR_FOQA@reddit
They’re flying limited charters. Majority of the fleet is parked. But I included them as the vast majority of their pilots are below the line with small hope of coming back.
Otherwise-Pen70@reddit
You are very lucky to get hired by a 2nd tier 121 Airline. My climb started at Ameriflight where I spent 8 years before moving on to a Legacy Airline. My advice to you is to stay put and start/keep applying to all the majors. Keep your overhead low, no new car or toys. Be ready to jump when the opportunity presents itself.
Ilikehashbrowns89@reddit
At one of the conferences couple months ago they basically came out and said something along the lines of “if you can’t upgrade in xyz years at your current airline/operator we will still consider you.”
changgerz@reddit
go back to a regional? bro you need to call out sick for your next trip because you are smoking crack
aviatortrevor@reddit
STAY. Keep applying. Study the airline interview gouge out there.
Frosty_Piece7098@reddit
I’d stay where I’m at and apply where you want. I think going from a major to a regional would be extremely foolish… where would you rather be stuck? The only way I would even consider it is it you already live in base and they have an extremely fast upgrade, but personally I wouldn’t either then.
Make a spreadsheet and see how long it’s going to take you to make back the money at a best case scenario, and in a worst case one, like we have a recession you get stuck at a regional for 10 years.
I think it’s a horrible idea, but you do you.
MyPilotInterview@reddit
That’s a good referral. Make sure if there is a section on the application to disclose family members who work at the organization you fill it out correctly.
Joe_Littles@reddit
Going back to a regional is the worst thing you could do. Pilot interview guy is right. You’re probably more competitive than you think. Have you applied? Plenty are getting called without TPIC. Know a friend with 980 turbine who got an interview with ua with a 121 fail on record. Yes, they’re spirit, but that just goes to show they’re essentially scraping the bottom of the NK pool so it should be open doors for many others soon.
F9 guy with 2600 TT and 1200 sic turbine got the CJO a week ago. YMMV
Historical_One3960@reddit
I’m WN, prior mil, current volunteer experience, clean record, can’t get a call.
PICisking@reddit
Why are you trying to leave Southwest if you don't mind me asking? If it's none of my business, then it's none of my business.
Historical_One3960@reddit
Great contract but I’m done with a transcontinental commute (2 years now with no end in sight).
AY4L@reddit
Yeah that sucks and justifies a job change. Good luck to you
PICisking@reddit
Ohhhh, yeah I did hear about all the base displacements happening over there. I didn't think it had been going on for two whole years though, that's really rough.
Historical_One3960@reddit
I never got my west coast base that I live in when I started and every month it gets further and further away as they shrink the west coast. All the legacies have a base there.
PICisking@reddit
Ah. That's a little disconcerting, I didn't know they were shrinking their west coast presence. It'd be nice if Southwest could come out strong on the other side of this makeover. Time will tell.
Historical_One3960@reddit
Yeah! I hope they come out strong as well. Lots of changes that hopefully will help their bottom line. But I’m not gonna wait around if UAL or DL calls.
PICisking@reddit
Oh for sure. Yeah at the end of the day you can't exactly wait around for WN to get their shit together. Do what you gotta do and all that.
RaidenMonster@reddit
If you’re senior to me, good luck!
swakid8@reddit
Naw, I think you need to stay put.
redwoodbus@reddit
I say stay unless you're looking at job trouble i.e. Spirit. Make the job moves up, not down or lateral. If you have a clean record then you're a known, experienced, and trainable pilot as far as the legacy goes and hiring you hurts their competitor. Be patient but persistent.
DepressedFoool@reddit
Forgot all these clowns who say stay where you are.
If you REALLY want a legacy, nothing beats TPIC.
Gojet is hiring DEC now.
You with 1000 TPIC is much more likely to get a call than staying where you are like all these clowns are suggesting.
Joe_Littles@reddit
DEC is a horrible idea. High failure rate, terrible absolutely terrible QoL, and if UA is his goal, he’d just be kicking that can further down the road.
Username checks out.
DepressedFoool@reddit
Not really. Only at shitty regionals who don't have their shit together like PSA. Or if you can't fly for shit.
Gojet training is actually really good.
It gets better just like anything else. A small price to pay for valuable TPIC.
Joe_Littles@reddit
It gets better….. after the ~1.5-2 years worth of FOs ahead of you have upgraded lol
DEC sucks, and most people would wonder why the hell anyone at B6 would EVER voluntarily leave to chase a regional job, DEC or not.
DepressedFoool@reddit
TPIC is king. Anyone who says heavy time is more valuable or sic in an Airbus at frontier or some shit is more valuable, is crazy.
If you really want a legacy, go become a DEC somewhere. Gojet is hiring DEC right now.
NOTHING beats TPIC.
1000 TPIC could give you a big shot at a legacy.
Handag@reddit
I'm going to guess that you're at Jetblue. If so, stay where you're at. Do not go to a regional. If you're coming close to or past 1000 121 time, you'll get a call from one of the big 4 in short order. They have a lot of NK guys/gals they're working through right now.
PICisking@reddit
Ehhh...you're going to get some varying opinions on this, but I personally don't know how beneficial going to a regional is for you. You can definitely look into it, but if I were you I would also be leaning hard into networking, volunteering, regularly updating your applications, things like that. I also think it depends on what regional you're trying to go to as well. Not all regionals are created equal.
Yes, I'm aware of how ironic this comment is, given my username lol
hawker1172@reddit
Degree? Volunteering? Training history? Does depend a little bit on how badly your app needs TPIC.
G_Platypus@reddit (OP)
Four year, none yet but I'm starting to look, spotless training record. I have two delta internal recs but none anywhere else.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Hello everyone,
I'm an FO at a major airline with no TPIC. I managed to get in during the covid wave and I've collected a few type ratings since. Upgrade times are near 10 years and I'd like to eventually move on to a legacy. I like my current company but it's future is less certain than any of the big four.
As far as I see I have two options: stay, make myself comfortable and eventually move to a legacy in a long, long time - or go back to a regional, upgrade, and then go to a legacy.
I'm obviously not excited about giving up the pay and QOL to go fly under a regional contract, but long term that might be the best option.
Ideas?
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