How do you handle management that thinks 8GB RAM is enough? /s
Posted by Ayy4K@reddit | sysadmin | View on Reddit | 621 comments
Hi guys - I’ve been working at this company for a while and management is having us use these sluggish systems with 8GB of RAM. Clearly it isn’t enough and I have these devices replaced because I value my users.
They don’t seem to be happy with me optimising the workplace. /s
This is a satirical post after seeing another user complaining about a technician who is replacing devices with 8GB RAM.
A technician that cares about the state of devices within your environment is a good fucking technician (at least in their heart). 8GB RAM is barely enough to surf the web in 2025.
What really grinds my gears is when you are just not equipped to do the job you’re employed to do. I have worked in a few establishments now, and I’m not just a level 1 or level 2 technician anymore. But when I was, the bane of my working life was trying to deliver support on a machine hanging on for dear life.
Please place an importance on IT. As technology advances, so do minimum requirements.
DangerousVP@reddit
Frankly, I cant even believe systems are sold with 8GB of RAM anymore. Between an OS and Chrome thats pretty much it. God forbid they also have Acrobat installed.
Gopher246@reddit
They still sell systems with 4gb.....
hbdgas@reddit
I wish Dell would let me buy theirs with 0GB. The Dell RAM (and storage) tax is insane.
dloseke@reddit
I just dropped 512GB of customer supplied A-Trend RAM in 2 new R470's (each) for said customer because it was requested I order with a little RAM as possible because Dell RAM is so expensive. Felt crazy ordering decently powerful hosts and 90TB hybrid array with only 16GB in each server but it was a lot more cost effective.
Fuzzmiester@reddit
I wish laptops still had the little doors on the bottom for changing the ram and the disks.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
They do! You just undo a bunch of screws and the whole bottom is the door that you hope doesn't crack when you pop it off! And then they put TWO screws on the hard drive that looks like a stick of gum and if you're lucky you'll only loose one of those and just hope it fell in your coffee and isn't in the computer.
I LOVE working on laptops! /s
EhRanders@reddit
Lots of RAM is soldered these days, or these past 4000 days if you’re an MacBook user
RykerFuchs@reddit
HP Elitebooks are not. Been using HP business laptops since the 8xxx and 9xxx models. Served us very well, and cost competitive with just a bit of work.
pdp10@reddit
Yes, though to be fair, Intel "Lunar Lake" also puts the main memory on the CPU package like apple Silicon, and also isn't upgradeable.
AMD Strix Halo doesn't have memory on-package, but AMD and Framework working together couldn't engineer reliable slotted memory within tolerances, either. Here's hoping CAMM2 starts shipping very soon.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
My favorite is the soldered hard drives... how the hell am I supposed to dispose of that? I can't even get it off the board so I can't donate the still useable laptop.
SnooPaintings139@reddit
Stop disposing perfectly good drives. Just wipe them with a good quality and certified software. I've passed all my audits for years with this.
Sunshine_onmy_window@reddit
This depends on your risk appetite.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
The legal beagles say "no" to that.
It's not a fight I'm willing to have with them. Someone told them a story about a company that can restore data from wiped drives (you know, 20 years ago when you could maybe do that if you spend a shitload of cash) and now we have to destroy the drives.
Despite the fact that besides personnel and financial data nothing we do is proprietary, secret or worth the effort anyway.
zomiaen@reddit
Depends on how they're wiped.
I just recovered thousands of photos from a formatted drive because it wasn't written to 0s for almost free, the disk wasn't encrypted and hadn't been used so very little data was overwritten. Just have to rebuild the indexes.
Technically I think you could recover more from the actual disc platters with shitloads of cash even if 0'd out, but that's why the CIA-level secure erase requirement was 7+ passes of 0s written.
dreadcain@reddit
To the best of my knowledge no one has ever publicly successfully recovered any meaningful amount of data after a single pass of writing anything. There's been some published research on how you could do it theoretically, which is what the design of the "DoD wipe" was based on. In practice it seems like there's just too much variance and noise in the bit values to be able to remotely accurately determine prior states of the bit.
w0lrah@reddit
The official version of the famous "DOD Wipe" many of us are aware of from the '90s is three passes. Some sources say pass 1 is all zeroes, pass 2 is all ones, and pass 3 is random. Other sources say pass one is random, pass 2 is the binary complement of the original pass (whatever was ones the first time is now zeroes and vice versa), and pass 3 is random. I can't find official sources to confirm one way or another, either way everyone agrees that every bit on the disk gets set to both states and then randomized.
This was extended in 2001 to a seven-pass system where the original three passes are run followed by another random pass and then the original three again.
In 2006 those standards were retired because they were deemed unnecessarily complicated and time consuming for hard drives and ineffective for other forms of storage media.
Many disk wiping utilities took it upon themselves to invent a bunch of other systems for adding more passes to the mix using various methods either random or iterating through a sequence but there's never been any evidence that it actually does anything other than multiply the amount of time the wipe takes.
These days a lot of nicer drives can self-encrypt with no performance impact so they can pull a neat trick where they just encrypt everything by default and just automatically load the key if the user hasn't requested explicit security. Then if a secure wipe command is issued all the drive has to do is forget the key and the disk may as well be full of random bits.
Pure-Recover70@reddit
You should be aware you can also recover data from screens, because it can burn in ;-)
Rivereye@reddit
There are also attacks for recovering data from RAM even after the device is powered off.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
You shut your filthy mouth! If my legal weenies heard that I'd be torn up and down about potentially giving people access to our publicly available information that they could just download from the web!
madicetea@reddit
Bitlocker key lost: Downloading more RAM.
Djaaf@reddit
And hopefully everything is also encrypted.
dustojnikhummer@reddit
Fortunately our legals said that throwing away Bitlocker key is good enough.
PC509@reddit
Hopefully, it's not like my local bank that has a single sheet print out in large font with "BITLOCKER KEY -- XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX". Not that someone would break into the bank and steal the computer and get away with it, it's just a big WTF.
dustojnikhummer@reddit
Keys are in AD. If you have a fully Bitlocker encrypted drive a clean install will nuke every data below it, you can't recover it. We of course also delete the computer object and recovery key when the machine is decommissioned. I'm glad we don't need to destroy those SSDs.
AmusingVegetable@reddit
You should clone your legals, because I can absolutely see a market for them.
null640@reddit
Pliers
PsyOmega@reddit
dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/nvme0n1 bs=10M;sync
run that 5 times if you want a DOD wipe.
Damascus_ari@reddit
I will admit that I have cracked those little clips holding the bottom upon opening multiple times... also whoever decided to hide screws- multiple screws- under rubber feet and stickers deserves to be scrubbing old thermal paste off for the next century.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
With their tongue!
changee_of_ways@reddit
to be fair, taking apart a laptop today is about 1000 times better than taking apart one 20 years ago when they were like "what we need is some more motherfucking screws, and you know what else, lets make them all a bunch of different lengths"
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
And 3 different types of heads. But they're all M3 screws. Except for the 2 that are M2.5
Also they're all black except 3 that are silver. Are the silver ones important? Special? Different? Who knows!
How do we use so many screws? Well, see first we screw the keyboard to the frame. Then we screw the frame to the chassis. Then we screw the motherboard to the keyboard. Then we screw the touch pad to the frame and part of the mother board and also this other tab here that we won't document anywhere. Boy I hope you got all the cables clipped in because they are exactly too short to clip in before you get things screwed down but then you can't get to them. It's like a puzzle!
Ok, got that? Cool. Now we have to screw the heat sink to the fan and that screws through the motherboard to the keyboard and also to the motherboard. Then there's the battery... don't fuck that up! Then you can put in the hard drive and the RAM. Oh, shit, we forgot, the RAM goes on the backside of the motherboard so you have to take that out to get it in there.
There's no wonder so many laptops accidentally ran into bullets out in the desert.
rainformpurple@reddit
I had the misfortune of having to replace the keyboard on a Dell E7250 a number of years ago. I had to undo 78 screws to get it out, I think. Many different sizes, colours and heads. Some were Philips, some were Torx. All were a pain in the ass.
dodgy__penguin@reddit
My favourites are the doors hidden behind the keyboards
maximumdownvote@reddit
You lose it. After you carelessly loosen it. You don't loose it.
Kodiak01@reddit
I have an ancient Inspiron 14R here from 2013 that I still use for occasional light writing. It could not be easier to work on; when I have to replace the keyboard (I've written so much with it, I'm on my 3rd one), you can pop the old one out with a flat head screwdriver, disconnect the ribbon, then snap in the new one. Literally takes 90 seconds. The access cover for the drive and memory compartments is literally ONE screw.
Several years ago, I agreed to help a coworker by doing the upgrades on his kid's Latitude. To get at everything was a total of 43 screws and you had to crack open the clamshell. It took several hours to figure out how everything came apart and went back together.
I own one other laptop, a Latitude about 3 years old. The battery went out on it earlier this year; this was the first time I ever had to pop open the shell just to replace one!
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
Yeah, those old machines were so much nicer. But also bigger and heavier.
We gave up ease of access to get slimmer, lighter machines.
Kodiak01@reddit
I keep using the Inspiron because I like the keyboard so much more than my newer one. The newer laptop was actually used on my desktop for a year or so after previous computer died, last weekend was the first time in a while I actually typed on the keyboard itself... and was reminded why I didn't care for it.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
Keyboards is a huge issue. I have end users that will not let me swap out their nasty dirty keyboard because they hade the new ones and I can't find a replacement for what they have that isn't stupid expensive and/or mechanical and loud.
It's one of the few times they can be nitpicky and I don't mind. Like that's the thing you gotta use all day to do your job, it should be one that doesn't piss you off.
Kodiak01@reddit
When I need to replace my desktop keyboard at work, I just pick one out on Amazon, send the link to my boss, and it shows up in a day or two. I've been beating on this simple Logitech K120 for so long now, I've worn the letters off of several keys. My mouse? Also simple, a Microsoft Basic Mouse v2.0.
Comfortable and functional without the extra crap. I'm a simple man. Some day, however, I will get a Das Keyboard 4 Ultimate. Some day. Maybe.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
I'm kind of like you. Just a simple keyboard and a mouse with a back button and I'm happy.
We have a list of "pre-approved" peripherals people have to pick from. It's a little bit stupid because the offerings change all the time so the list is always out of date.
I'm more of the "don't ask for something stupid and we can order it. Stupid means ridiculously expensive, loud, or ugly. No fucking pink or purple or neon keyboards."
But I also hate it when people change their email fonts to be cutesy and colored. Becky! Fuck off with that. Black and White and the default Outlook font is FINE. Quit making your shit hard to read with your pink background with red hearts and then a blue comic sans font. You're not 13...
Kodiak01@reddit
The trick here is to respond to their emails in non-HTML mode which strips it all out... and the users typically don't know how to bring it back.
Toyletduck@reddit
Also the screws are made of play dough so they strip if you turn them even slightly too hard
RangerNS@reddit
I don't think the upscale HPE or Dell, or any Lenovos is quite two screws, but they aren't 10. Of course, the good ones that you can service are north of $1k.
$500 laptops you just throw out if there is an issue.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
I just checked, the Dell 16 Pro plus is 8 (so not quite 10)
Then there's the 2 screws they've got holding the damn NVME drive in when one at the end would do... but they put a shield over it that is screwed down at the side of the connector too. (That one drives me NUTS)
antidragon@reddit
Framework laptops have these (and you can replace pretty much every component yourself).
anaemic@reddit
Yes but they also do the same upgrade your ram, only $200 (for a $50 part) crap. Oh you want an ethernet port? $20. USB? $5 each...
Their upsell game is infuriating
morosis1982@reddit
I don't think it's that bad. On the AU site 32GB ram is $260, same thing on Amazon is $225. More like not discounted rather than marked up.
And given their emphasis on quality I don't think their ports are unreasonable. Just the cost of doing quality low volume parts. Offset by the fact that if the lan port dies you.... unplug it and plug in a new one.
PsyOmega@reddit
I can get 2x64 ddr5 SODIMM for 260. (USD, dunno what that is in upside down monopoly money)
morosis1982@reddit
Current exchange rate puts that at around $400 aud, can get on Amazon for $415 so pretty much the same.
Oflameo@reddit
They still do, in rugged models.
NextSouceIT@reddit
We are a Dell shop, so I can't speak for other brands, but opening them is so easy with one of those Fanttik electric precision screwdrivers. Get one if you don't have one. Takes literally 30 seconds.
iB83gbRo@reddit
The new Pro Plus Premium models are an absolute pain in the ass to open... The tolerances on the bottom cover are extremely small. Not even enough room for iFixit's little blue pry tools.
Kodiak01@reddit
If they're going to screw you like that, do they at least have the common courtesy to give a reacharound?
NextSouceIT@reddit
Yeah you gotta spring for the Dell Pro Plus Premier Premium Max Advanced for easy maintenance.
WolfOfAsgaard@reddit
I wish I was a little bit taller. I wish I was a baller.
radicldreamer@reddit
I wish I had software who looked good i’d install’er
gregsting@reddit
What’s next, replaceable battery! Inconceivable !
Ur-Best-Friend@reddit
When it comes to gaming laptops and the like, most do. Basically "enthusiast" devices. Office laptops don't have these, but they never did for the most part.
Justsomedudeonthenet@reddit
I have, on more than one occasion, ripped a bottom laptop panel almost in half while removing it.
I wish I could say I had some incredible super human strength. But sadly it's ~~just to force you to buy their crazy marked up RAM and storage~~ to make the laptop 1% lighter and thinner, which is all we really ever cared about anyways.
GeneralUnlikely1622@reddit
Problem I've found is that the new Dell laptops are very picky on RAM.
I have a fleet of Latitute 5550's and ordered Kingston KF556S40IBK2 and the laptop will not take the memory at all. No POST after installation. So you wind up having to to hunt for specific memory that works with the laptop. I wound up ordering 3 different kits until the last one finally worked. Or you can get a single 8GB stick of Dell memory for what a 32GB kit costs from any other manufacturer. They are very proud of their memory I guess.
MBILC@reddit
I take the serial number from the installed ram to look up the specs and the chip makers and usually try to match as close to that as possible.
We are an HP shop mainly, so not had issues, I just stick with Kingston ram.
GeneralUnlikely1622@reddit
It's a problem that I assumed no longer existed. Having to hunt hardware compatibility beyond it being within the maximum memory limit for the motherboard, being the right version of DDR, with the right number of pins.
Needing to go beyond that is asinine.
URPissingMeOff@reddit
There are still several issues involving compatibility with the memory controller and the rest of the mobo chipset - ECC vs non-ECC, wait-states, chip speed, CAS latency, and voltage. Some mismatches will slow down memory access, some with flatline the whole system.
MBILC@reddit
For sure, considering the ram modules comes from basically 3 companies...Hynix,Samsung and micron (i think)
So then just makes you think Dell is intentionally doing this to force people to buy their ram, much like how they did with hard drives for their servers and checking firmware and such with the claim "stability and compatibility" even though they are just relabelled drives anyways from the big makers....
soulseaker@reddit
Is it a voltage problem or something?
MathmoKiwi@reddit
64KB is all you'll ever need!
hurkwurk@reddit
how i miss the days of barebones chassis
cszolee79@reddit
We switched to Lenovos recently. Same crap as Dell but way cheaper. Essentially, you get a much better system for the same price.
Dell stopped being good years ago, now it's just expensive.
psiphre@reddit
the chinese-owned lenovo?
Freon424@reddit
This. We actively get the smallest amount of RAM possible on our desktops and laptops that have normal DIMM/SODIMM slots and purchase RAM kits for them. Saves the cost of a full PC for every 6 we order.
AdhesiveTeflon1@reddit
That's what I used to do when I ordered from HP directly. Now I'm allowed to order from anywhere, like Newegg, Amazon, or Micro Center thankfully and save us a bunch of money.
Ron-Swanson-Mustache@reddit
I hate when they use soldered on ram and storage. Every manufacturer does it. Apple's the first as I don't think they sell anything that doesn't use integrated storage.
MBILC@reddit
or Lenovo who will solder in 1 stick so you only have 1 slot to upgrade...
762mm_Labradors@reddit
Dell is the new Apple. Their replacement line for their XPS’s have increased price so much that they almost identical prices compared to Apple’s MacBook Pros.
AmusingVegetable@reddit
Don’t MBPs last longer?
762mm_Labradors@reddit
Not necessarily, and I say that as somebody who has used Apple products for a long time. Their battery technology has probably gotten better then competitors since their battery is non removable
jortony@reddit
With modern nvme and good memory management the difference cannot be perceived by knowledge workers with good executive functioning.
itanpiuco2020@reddit
I have seen laptop with 3 gb 1 slot is 2gb and 2nd slot is 1 gb. They even installed 64 bit Win 7
No-Wonder-6956@reddit
There are some school districts that provide students with Windows devices with 4gb of soldered ram. This is absolutely ridiculous but it is very widespread due to the deceptive marketing of companies like Dell that a low end Windows device is equivalent to a Chromebook.
Durfael@reddit
small arch linux with a few systems installed and a really small browser that allows ram limitations lmao
Gopher246@reddit
We sent mofos to the moon on 4kb of RAM, fucking chrome requires a warehouse lol
yukeake@reddit
It's wild when you think about how far we've come. Even a Raspberry Pi is massively more powerful than the computers that got us to the moon.
Back then, the technology was primitive in comparison to what we have today, and they accomplished these Herculean feats. Now with something several orders of magnitude more powerful, I...filter ads out of web pages.
PC509@reddit
And it still runs like shit and get's overwhelmed with a few tabs open. Websites these days are just insane with how much BS they have. And don't click that option you want just yet, there's still something loading that's going to make sure that option moves at the last second as a final fuck you.
I don't get it. Even some small web pages load like shit and take up WAY more resources than what you'd expect. It's insane. Can load up the same website in Firefox, IE, Chrome in XP and it's perfect, fast, killer, low resources. Do it in Win11 with a brand new browser of the same name? Easily triple the resources being used for the exact same website, bare browser install. There's just too much bloat in the browsers these days. We used to complain about OS bloat, now it's browsers.
Really makes me question Windows XP with 128MB RAM on a K6-2/233 back in the day. Ran just fine with Netscape. Now, 8GB is considered low even for basic web browsing (with the browser being the biggest offender of resources!).
psiphre@reddit
ads, tracking scripts, popovers for cookie settings
Pure-Recover70@reddit
Paradoxically orbital mechanics aren't actually particularly complex...
It's really just calculating (ie. digitally integrating) a few simple equations...
You don't even need a particularly precise answer, because you don't have particularly precise data (location + mass + velocity) to begin with, nor particularly precise control of your engines...
pdp10@reddit
Adblock and resource block extensions really help there.
geusebio@reddit
Its all web-browser!
NightFire45@reddit
I have an old laptop that was grinding with Win10 and install Linux Mint and it runs great. Windows is just shyt. You could get 64GB of RAM and Win11 will find a way to make it slow.
j2thebees@reddit
I usually tell people manufacturers should be indicted for selling machines with 4GB.
To OP, any client I work for will tell you my answer to everything is RAM. I’m currently purchasing standard office desktops with 32GB (up from my former standard of 15). I get no pushback, as high-ranking people have seen the benefits. When their machine is choking and 15min later it’s humming, they know you were right. My basic premise to mention to managers is, “I don’t know about you, but I don’t like paying people to wait.”
This is a simple matter of efficiency. If you’re users are doing ANYTHING productive, 16-32GB RAM will pay for itself in a month. After that, it’s all profit, and whether paid salary or hourly, that profit belongs to the company.
forceofslugyuk@reddit
On smaller dedicated devices maybe... on anything that needs me to open a graphical web browser? Ney ney.
psiphre@reddit
literally
JustKeepRedditn010@reddit
What the 32bit hell
a60v@reddit
They do that for the people who will immediately throw away the included RAM and upgrade it to something usable, thus avoiding the manufacturer's RAM tax.
Gopher246@reddit
These heaps of junk are still sold to consumers who don't know any better and couldn't swap RAM to save their life. True, there are less now but the fact that any consumer laptop can come with 4gb is a joke.
DangerousVP@reddit
That should be an actual crime.
NoSellDataPlz@reddit
🤢🤮💀
KiNgPiN8T3@reddit
My current company gave me a 8gb laptop when I started. It was pure shit… they kept promising a new one but it never arrived. So I ended up hammering RDD and doing everything from there. Then they said I was using up too much RDS resource?! Haha! I then managed to get a 16gb laptop and the difference was night and day. Most recently, around 2 weeks ago, I went to 32gb and I now have zero issues. I couldn’t imagine trying to use 8gb again.
DangerousVP@reddit
I start people at 32, but we do a lot of CAD stuff, so its pretty much a requirement if I want them to be able to do their job and be able to look things up at the same time.
No_Dog9530@reddit
Well I setup workstations for users having Bloomberg terminal and multiple files and analytics Softwares and I start them at 32GB. Can’t think of anything lower than this.
noother10@reddit
We start everyone at 32GB for most of this year now because even 16GB is not quite enough for normal sort of usage now. MS Office apps, web browsers, communications apps, they all chew through memory.
Holiday-Honeydew-384@reddit
During Covid when I used Teams it took almost 11 GB of RAM.
SAugsburger@reddit
Chrome alone just consumes a ton of RAM. I can't imagine someone that regularly is using a bunch of other applications not noticing lag with 8GB.
MBILC@reddit
Last MSP I worked at they gave me a laptop that had 8GB....pure crap-TASTIC unusable for the work I did (Project resource, lots of Visio, remote sessions et cetera)
I requested more ram, denied... ask for a new laptop.. since mine was 4 years old and the 4 core i5 was not cutting it..denied..(even after i did my own resource monitoring to capture my usage)
So I just took some extra ram I had at home and put it in...
This same company was still giving out 24" 1080p monitors up until I left.and you were only allowed 2 because "thats the standard".....& because 1440p / 27" were too expensive and if they gave me some, then everyone else would want them.. (they were $50 more)
Meanwhile I was being billed out often times at $200+ an hour....
Kodiak01@reddit
But 640k should be enough for anybody!
eazolan@reddit
My PHONE has 16GB of ram.
I got a good deal, 300$ plus 18$ a month for the next two years.
DesertDogggg@reddit
Acrobat with a security suite and Chrome with over a dozen tabs open. Sounds like a good time.
countsachot@reddit
Acrobat is still required for some financial reports... Good forbud they format a document properly
armaghetto@reddit
I used an 8gb m1 MacBook Pro up until a few weeks ago. I’m in IT so I “eat the dog food” generally and give the good stuff to the staff.
It doesn’t hurt that I mainly manage stuff from a browser and remote into servers primarily, but god help me if I had a PowerPoint and an excel file up at the same time.
webguynd@reddit
Not really a fair comparison. Apple Silicon machines are increadibly fast at swapping and are really good with memory compression, along with having the fastest SSDs available in any consumer machine and a bunch of other optimizations both in hardware and in the kernel, and macOS uses swap as a feature rather than a consequence of running OOM.
I had an M1 Air for several years, base 8GB model and would regularly hit 10GB+ of swap and it didn't break sweat.
Windows isn't as good, nor is the hardware as optimized and will shit the bed much more readily when OOM.
I love these machines
PsyOmega@reddit
That didn't end well for a lot of soldered-SSD M1 laptops. swapgate kills the NAND and you can't replace it.
I agree with your other points, the compression is nice.
mga1@reddit
So you are saying we should be getting 5400 spinning disks. Thanks, putting in the new marching orders to my peeps. /s
but spinning disks is what our head IT was giving people up until 2017-ish. I never did ask him how many times he actually took platters out to put into a new drive body to recover data… but I bet it’s less than 1.
PsyOmega@reddit
You have bad reading comprehension, as I never mentioned spinning disks.
The solution is more ram, and that should have been obvious to you, but it's clear you are behaving in bad faith by putting words in my mouth. I am autistic and will never employ subtext or hidden meanings, ever.
TheStorytellerTX@reddit
I always attribute that to Apple designing the OS for the hardware they control, and Microsoft designed an OS for general purpose use on a variety of machines.
timbotheny26@reddit
That's been my go-to answer to the "Why does Mac run so much better on "worse" hardware then?" question. Like you said, it's because macOS has been optimized out the ass for Apple's hardware, and they are both meant to work together as synergistically as possible. Windows meanwhile, is designed to work on almost anything, which means having to optimize it to work as well with a myriad of different hardware brands and configurations.
mybloodismaplesyrup@reddit
God forbid anyone forks cash to adobe anymore unless you have no other choice.
mangeek@reddit
I had to special order a laptop that could run multiple VMs and had 32GB RAM. Now Windows 11 eats 14GB just booting up and loading the default set of tabs for various work tools in Chrome.
Meanwhile, my five year old Ubuntu laptop uses 4GB to do the same. Boots up in just a couple of seconds, applies updates in about ten seconds a week, and opens apps like lightning.
Windows had a nice 'thin' period between 8.1 and the 10 up until the 2020-era builds or so. Now it's a slow, beastly hog.
Limp-Beach-394@reddit
... Coincidentally opened my task manager today, saw my RAM being slurped up to 75% (of 32gb) which is not an issue but barely anything was even open. Noticed discord and spoti taking up 600mb each - whatever, fine, took a screenshot of discord as a meme, posted to friends - discord ram usage jumped by 40mb just by sending a message with tiny attachment. So yeah, selling things with anything less than 16 should be flat out illegal.
webtroter@reddit
Don't forget the three Endpoint management/security softwares.
donjulioanejo@reddit
Can't run a virus when your antivirus is consuming 100% CPU!
NerdyMSPguy@reddit
Even 16GB is not enough anymore for workstations if you have that much running in the background.
ImraelBlutz@reddit
That’s the current argument I have with our SD lead. He is convinced 8GB is enough for most of our users.
And most use… Teams, Edge/Chrome, a SaaS EMR that uses the browser (eClinicalWorks) and Zoom soft phones or meetings. We recently got ControlUp and we’ve received constant alerts that tons of devices lack RAM…I wonder why.
Ok_Sprinkles702@reddit
I've seen six open tabs in Chrome chew up 10GB of RAM all on its own.
thebigt42@reddit
Make sure thier computer only have 8 gig of ram. One stick....and see how they like it
dcgkwm@reddit
If ControlUp provides an email alert function, please ensure the director receives those alerts. The world doesn't operate based on what people merely think.
ImraelBlutz@reddit
I did! It also generates tickets that are all assigned to him… and he’s still fighting it lol.
OverlordWaffles@reddit
Does this SD lead also only have 8GB or is he rocking something like 128GB lmao
MBILC@reddit
Does said SD lead have any mointoring on said systems to see people's actual CPU/Mem usage..
I do like that about intune, nice reports on how many users are peaking on memory usage...They love it when I reach out to them pro-actively to either tell them I can send them some ram and walk through the upgrade process, or if they are a much older system, they should be expecting a new laptop in a week or 2 (we are 100% remote company across Canada 7 Us)
DangerousVP@reddit
Yeah resource requirements in a business environment are just different now. 8GB may be enough for a PC that someone uses to check email and do some light browsing at home, but like you pointed out, there are just too many applications in most workflows for it to be enough at work.
L_Cranston_Shadow@reddit
Or a few tabs open in Firefox. Love that browser, but God is it a RAM hog.
creamersrealm@reddit
Better yet why does corporate insiste on VDIs with 1cpu and 2-4GB of ram. My start menu doesn't even load.
cb393303@reddit
My new work chrome book has 32GB ram. 8 is a joke.
Turdulator@reddit
Outlook, teams, a couple browser tabs, bang that’s your whole 8 right there
Kodiak01@reddit
3 Chrome tabs in 1 window, 11 Edge tabs in 4 windows, Outlook, 2 instances of CDK Drive (which is STILL only a 32bit app), Webex and Endpoint, this is where I'm at as I type this.
uptimefordays@reddit
Is that DDR4?
Kodiak01@reddit
Pulled the memory part number with the Crucial scanner, it is DDR4.
uptimefordays@reddit
While I would argue "memory allotment should be determined based on analysis of end user swap across the fleet" people running last gen RAM are probably having a bad time.
Kodiak01@reddit
Just bought a new mini-PC for home use, while it is an older processor (Ryden 7 5825U), I did make sure it had 32GB (but only DDR4, not 5). I don't have any real power-user apps I use at home and I pass the time with Guild Wars 2, so it should still be more than enough for me.
uptimefordays@reddit
Oh probably, and again not to say "everyone can get by on 8GiB of RAM" but 8GiB of DDR4 and 8GiB of DDR5 are very different setups.
thelastwilson@reddit
Wife: we could get $SON this chromebook, it's really cheap and he wants one.
Me: dear god no
codewario@reddit
I actually bought my wife a Chromebook a few years ago and it works very well for her work needs.
But we will probably replace it eventually with something else, since we've mostly moved on from Google services in our home.
thelastwilson@reddit
Nothing wrong with a Chromebook, just get one with a decent spec
codewario@reddit
I’ve used it a bit, don’t remember the specs offhand but it wasn’t awful. It’s got 8 GB RAM but she literally just uses it for Google Docs, printing, and listening to music.
thelastwilson@reddit
8GB isnt too bad. My wife was looking at one with an n100 processor and 4gb.
PsyOmega@reddit
That's reasonable for running a few tabs and general use. I know the N100 chromebooks have swap file on nvme so running out of ram to swap a few tabs out isn't as laggy as it used to be on HDD systems.
Could be way worse, there are still new chromebooks with dual-core intel atom or dual core little-core ARM
djgizmo@reddit
to be fair, most smartphones only have 8gb or less.
Funny-Comment-7296@reddit
Smartphones are well optimized for this. They literally only do one thing at a time — the thing you’re looking at. Everything else is swapped out. They also don’t do anything nearly as complicated as is possible in a desktop environment. All of the equivalent programs are much smaller, and have less code to cache in the first place.
djgizmo@reddit
somewhat. Incan listen to pandora, surf the web, and chat in discord without any issues on a modern middle level phone.
Do I agree that today’s WORK machines should be 16gb just due to how sloppy browsers and website have gotten, yes.
But to say no modern computer can function with little slowdown not always true.
I think Windows teams needs to look on how they can optimize the robust user experience and only engage services on demand. He always running.
DangerousVP@reddit
True, but I wouldnt try to get any real work done on a smart phone either.
Moontoya@reddit
Been out in the countryside and got emergency calls
It's doable , irritating and awkward but doable
DangerousVP@reddit
Oh yeah. Im not saying its impossible, but Id be reaaaaaaal mad about it.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
It's amazing how bad my reception is in those situations... you'd think in 2025 cell reception would be so much better but when I don't want it to be it just sucks. It's weird how that works.
Because most emergencies are the technical equivalent of a papercut.
DangerousVP@reddit
Not gonna lie, I get stoked if someone calls me on vacation because I answer the phone with, "Man I hope this is worth 8 hours."
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
I'm salaried. :( No after hours pay for me
but they pay good, the benefits are good and the work is interesting so I guess it's OK.
DangerousVP@reddit
Im also salaried, but if I work at all during a day, its considered a working day, which means I dont have to spend my PTO on it.
Now, am I going to give them shit about it if someone has an emergency on a Saturday? Probably not.
If they call me on vacation though, you bet Im gonna get those hours back. I banked them so I didnt have to think about work, and if I answer a work call with my wife rolling her eyes at me, I going to get something for it.
eternalterra@reddit
lol this must be a joke
CharcoalGreyWolf@reddit
To be fair, smartphones are far more memory optimized, it’s an apples to oranges comparison that doesn’t analyze the operating system or the applications being used.
Odd_Cauliflower_8004@reddit
They run Linux and apps in general are still meant to be used on 2gb devices for max ad coverage
Ordinary-Fish-9791@reddit
Please tell me you forgot the /s
EstoyTristeSiempre@reddit
Is this shittysysadmin or what lol
majurz@reddit
That's straight up something I would expect an absolut newbie to say.
JustSomeGuyFromIT@reddit
Even then they partially use the memory chip for RAM.
Thotaz@reddit
Just because the RAM is allocated does not mean it's strictly required to maintain good performance. As long as the things the are actively on screen can fit in memory you should be all good because the rest can simply get paged in and out as needed from the page file.
uptimefordays@reddit
Desktop support doesn’t know how memory works or believe in cache. They just see “high memory utilization! Need more memory!” They have no idea that their 32GiB suggested laptops will sit at 23-25GiB used during normal workflows because it’s mostly cache.
bigmanbananas@reddit
But desktop support tends to have a far superior grasp of how users tend to use thier equipment and work flow, unlike most sysadmin I've met, who seem to think that people only use one program at a time, in not the star 5 or 6 packages running.
uptimefordays@reddit
If we're being honest desktop support sees and hears from end users with technical problems. Support tends to have familiarity with specific problem users or departments, but I don't necessarily know that many desktop support teams are building monitoring or alerting tools for their endpoints and actually tracking things like swap--which indicates "not enough memory" as opposed to "operating system allocating as much available memory as possible."
webguynd@reddit
I wish Windows would implement a "memory pressure" graph into task manager like macOS has, it's a more clear indicator. macOS has it because it aggresively caches, even more so than Windows, and will aim to use every bit of RAM in the machine.
A lot of misconceptions about RAM usage could be sovled with a similar graph on Windows.
InternationalMany6@reddit
I mean technically that’s true I suppose. But how many people ONLY work in one application at a time?
Thotaz@reddit
I never said anything about "one application" at a time. You could have a Chrome window snapped to one half of the screen and an Excel window on the other half. Both would be on screen and in use and should obviously not get paged out, and neither should the music player that is playing music in the background.
However, the 50 background browser tabs/windows that the user hasn't interacted with for several minutes could easily get paged out with no ill effect. If the user then finally switches to one of these inactive tabs it's simply a matter of reading that data from disk back into memory and maybe page something else out.
How long do you think it'll take to read 100-300MB from disk on a modern system with an NVMe SSD? That's basically how long the user would have to wait to reactivate one of these tabs.
DangerousVP@reddit
Be that as it may, my caveman brain sees the big number and doesnt like it.
abbeyainscal@reddit
It’s embarrassing we are a dell shop and how do they even post an 8gb machine??
Ikinoki@reddit
I don't give af, I'll get 1gb systems if they sold them and they were light as a feather.
All I need is a good RDP client. That means encrypted Linux on drive, cheap to throw out and light to carry and use.
w0wt1p@reddit
640 kB ought to be enough for anyone
Stonewalled9999@reddit
I mean, you can run it, with no Outlook, no Chrome, no Edge no Teams. My users run 11 GB just sitting on desktop with apps in the background.
polarbear320@reddit
You do realize that programs will use more memory and keep more in memory when it's there? Windows does a crap job at that if you ask me. If you've worked in the Linux world at all you'll be familiar. That doesn't mean it needs that memory either. Obviously avoiding paging / swaping is great but have done some tests and find that the same computer with 8gb and also more will "use" more ram when it is put in, but when it has less isn't paging/swaping either. So I'm not sure it's as legit useage as it seems.
BigFrog104@reddit
If you have to use Linux usage to make yourself feel superior to someone posting about Windows, are you really a sysadmin? Anyone int this thread is well aware of how Windows handles memory. The $25 price difference to bump 8 to 16 GB is what we in IT call a "no brainer"
No one (other than you) will argue that an 8G RAM Windows system is superior to a 16G RAM Windows system.
DangerousVP@reddit
Yeah. It is very nice to just be able to open what you need as you need it. I cant imagine trying to get stuff done while also having to worry about managing resources like that.
We have a designer in marketing that was running on 8gb on a macbook. I got her an upgraded machine and she actually cried she was so thankful.
Stonewalled9999@reddit
send that 8Gb Macbook here I can use it for headless ubuntu :)
DangerousVP@reddit
Thats definitely not what Im going to do with it now....
Valestis@reddit
Neither Dell, Lenovo, nor HP sell 8 GB variants of their standard mainline current-gen business notebooks/desktops (Dell Pro 16 Plus, HP ProBook 4 G1i 16", whatever Lenovo calls it). It's only 16/32 GB.
You'd have to specifically configure it that way or buy some older generation crap.
Zeraphicus@reddit
On my work laptop chrome was using 70% of my 32 gb of ram the other day...
coscib@reddit
thats why i use firefox, only needs about 24gb of my 64gb ram :D
Pure-Recover70@reddit
70% of 32 is 22.4, so your firefox is actually using more... ;-)
coscib@reddit
i think my record was around 40gb with over 12k tabs
uptimefordays@reddit
I mean yeah, that’s how modern memory allocation works. If other applications actually need memory, your OS will claw memory back from Chrome and reallocate memory.
DavWanna@reddit
I upgraded from 32 to 64 for this exact reason, and I, uh, may have just been sweeping things under the rug with it...
DangerousVP@reddit
Be honest, how many tabs did you have open?
Zeraphicus@reddit
Not sure, I rip the bandaid off after a couple days and close them all lol
sybrwookie@reddit
You're not supposed to be able to see the names or symbols of the tabs anymore, right?
DangerousVP@reddit
If you dont have to manually tab through them to tell what they are, are you really even using your browser?
Kodiak01@reddit
The Mini-PCs that were installed in our office only have 8GB.
...installed back in March of 2021, that is.
I believe our next refresh will be next year when we will finally move to Win11. This year (for our office, literally this past Tuesday) they did the first major server upgrade I can remember in the 13 years I've been back.
For what they need to do, these minis have actually held up relatively well. i5-8400T, Win10 Pro 22H2. With two instances of CDK Drive (which STILL doesn't have a 64bit version of the app), 16 Edge tabs over 5 windows, 2 Chrome tabs and Outlook, it still runs at a usable level. Yes, Acrobat can be a bit slow at times when piled on, but aside from that it's not too bad.
I'd imagine if we were running 11 it would be whole other ballgame, though.
systemfrown@reddit
The early ARM based Windows alternatives were all initially sold with insufficient RAM at the very moment the platform most needed to convince consumers they were powerful enough to be viable alternatives. So everyone thought they were hot garbage despite the fact they they were simply under provisioned RAM wise.
One of the dumbest things I witnessed working in that industry.
DangerousVP@reddit
Wild that they didnt think to resolve that. Did they think that it was sufficient? Or were they trying to keep costs down? Gotta wonder what the landscape would look like today if they hadnt made that mistake.
systemfrown@reddit
I wondered that as well...my guess is a serious disconnect between Engineering, Marketing, the bean counters, and the VAR's...none of which would have given a shit even if someone had pointed out how short-sighted they were being. Well, maybe engineering would have.
DangerousVP@reddit
Trying to get anyone to think long term is bafflingly difficult. I dont know why I always try to think that way, but Id guess it would have something to do with trying to solve things the first time. I hate when a problem crops up because sustainability even in the short-mid term wasnt considered.
I get the annoyed looks and eye rolls all the time, but then when we DO do the thing the correct way, no problems manifest, so it looks like nothing was going to crop up.
They really hate when the opposite happens though, because I'll bring out the "I told you so" reeeeeal fast.
systemfrown@reddit
Well and they all have different agendas and priorities at every stage. It would have taken the Windows/CPU designer partnership specifying within the license agreement, in no uncertain terms, the minimum amount of RAM required to be bundled with the socket.
DangerousVP@reddit
I could definitely see it from that side - but I could also see the other side of that coin as well. Imagine if they had specified it, and then everyone was talking about the performance versus the alternative. Could have easily been a huge upset, but also could have been a disaster.
Im personally of the opinion that you cant make large gains in business without taking risks and being bold, but I can see where being adverse to that risk could also be helpful.
PaulRicoeurJr@reddit
Chrome AND Acrobat? 16GB isn't close to cut it
DangerousVP@reddit
I recently migrated everyone off of Acrobat and its wild how much better things are running now.
AmusingVegetable@reddit
JFC! Just go to a general store that sells computers, half the sales “exhibits”(*) are 8GB, and 16GB is only starting to appear because Windows 11 is here now.
DangerousVP@reddit
Yeah. I actually think a big part of the reason a lot of people still say they "arent computer people" has a lot to do with the fact that off the shelf consumer grade builds are generally just trash.
CasualEveryday@reddit
8gb is "enough" for your average cubicle worker. Could they benefit from more? Most likely.
If you're buying 5,000 computers, $30/ea in savings sounds like a ton. It doesn't really matter that the workers will easily generate more productivity than that many times over the life of the computer because budgets don't work that way in big companies. Everyone is saving money in their department's budget so the company looks good on a balance sheet.
coscib@reddit
don't forget outlook, my boss runs an 40gb mailbox on his i7 8550u, 12gb ram, 190gb ssd (barely 15gb free space) and it is an pain in the ass for me, because he calls every week that his device is slow and outlook is not responding but is to cheap to upgrade to a mini pc with 32gb ram and a bigger ssd.
Liquidretro@reddit
Thats just Outlook Classic with large mailboxes, You could go buy a top of the line system and likely have similar results after a while. SSD's dont slow as they fill as long as they have enough space for garbage collection.
badasimo@reddit
My phone has 8GB an it is not a fancy phone.
Responsible_Test_946@reddit
Force them to use a laptop with only that much and have them drive Zoom and Teams at the same time. If they scream tell them there is nothing to do but use web teams or get more RAM.
ngjrjeff@reddit
Min 32gb today
ToastieCPU@reddit
I found a useful tactic: mention Apple. If Apple laptops can no longer handle daily tasks with 8GB of RAM, how can we expect our employees to work effectively with 8GB.
But also there is truth in it…
UltraSPARC@reddit
We’re an MSP and I had to explain to a doctors office who wanted to use “web for everything with chrome” that the base surface laptops with an i3 + 4GB RAM was going to be a disaster. Multiple times. They didn’t heed our advice and got them anyways. Sure enough a month later they’re calling us to fix the problem and “upgrade the laptops” to which I had to remind them that they were not upgradable and they must buy all new laptops. They ghosted us again for a month and then I got the call to come fix the entire organization, whatever the costs were. Health care has to be the cheapest of all our customers to the point where we refuse to do business with them anymore.
583947281@reddit
I have to agree, I used to sell Genie and Best Practice. The doctors would have the lastest imported sports car, yet had a panic attack over our quote. So cheap, some were cool. I found those doctor's where also nice to thet staff and had a happy office.
I could also never understand why they had porn open when you remoted in to fix something lolol
MrChicken_69@reddit
If you can't load a web page ("app") in 4GB! then the problem lies with the stupid app programmers, NOT the machine.
Synikul@reddit
When your total RAM is half of the recommended amount for the OS alone, it’s 100% the machine.
MrChicken_69@reddit
Then stop running such a bloated f'ing OS. Esp. when all you need is a web browser. (people have complained about the exponential bloat of Windows for over 20 years, yet they're doing nothing about it.)
Synikul@reddit
“hey if we swap the entire enterprise to Linux, move to a new EEP program that works on Linux, and then train all of our users on it, we can save a few dollars on RAM!”
I think my pitch could use some work.
pdp10@reddit
Your ERP isn't already web-based?
MrChicken_69@reddit
Any accountant that can actually add can see an enterprise linux solution is cheaper than windows. (and IT can provide hundreds of other benefits.) This is even more true when everything is a stupid web based something, so all ANYONE needs is a web browser.
(Hint: people are already doing this with phones and tablets. 'tho modern android is getting just as bloated as windows. For the record, I'm sitting here on a a chromeOS laptop - because modern windows is unusable on the ancient thing; it's atom based so there are f-all apps available.)
Rawme9@reddit
4gb is the bare minimum for Windows 11. It'll load the web apps, but it will be an awful experience regardless of the web devs quality
MrChicken_69@reddit
When your OS is the malware... sure, blame the browser.
Rawme9@reddit
Windows is just by far the most used OS in businesses across the world. Hate it if you want but it doesn't change that or the requirements
lordmycal@reddit
Sorry -- when your Windows PC has less RAM than my phone, that's a problem. 16GB should be the minimum for windows devices where you expect good performance.
TabascohFiascoh@reddit
This happened to me back in 2017. Dental office needed a refresh, our sales guy sold them i3's with 4gb of memory.
These were actual desktops too. Lenovo m800's or something.
DenominatorOfReddit@reddit
Dental Office
You just sent shivers down my spine.
TabascohFiascoh@reddit
Honestly Dentrix(henry schein) was the WORST vendor i'd ever worked with for a LONG time. They have since been replaced as worst vendor in existence by Jack Henry.
metalblessing@reddit
Oh, then you havent seen Nicola Banking. When I worked at a banking MSP Nicola (NBS) was the absolute worst. I havent used it since they were acquired by Shazam, but I remember back then I supported it, they didnt even have a ticket system so tracking tickets was almost impossible. They helpdesk for NBS was the owners son as the "senior" tech and like one other person. Oh and when connecting to their core server for application updates you could drop into root on their core server with no auth.
It was crazy scary.
mybloodismaplesyrup@reddit
Idk if it's any better but practices that use open dental gives me shivers. That software has some kind of issue with twain scanners and it constantly breaks the connection and you have to reinstall the scanners.
FrivolousMe@reddit
Fuck dentrix !!!!! All my homies hate the Henry schein corporation
jfoust2@reddit
Hmph! I have several dental clinics as clients, all on Schein, as well as a bank with Jack Henry. No negative experiences to speak of.
On the other hand, I thought I was going to learn something from Jack Henry, when it came time for them to rebuild some virtual servers. I thought they'd have some cool rapid deployment system from templates. Nope, just built them by hand, every step of the way, all sorts of manual config.
utvak415@reddit
Not long ago I was preparing to move across states and therefore was leaving my employer. The problem with that was I was the last person there who supported a particular system, they had opted to never cross train for this possibility. Instead they decided to just end support for it entirely due to its age and waning numbers of customers who used it still.
In my final days I had returned to a dental office that had a failing system that had completely died multiple times due to its age but I had kept restoring it to full functionality. In my final visit I warned them that should they choose to not replace it, it will likely quit again and there will be no ability to bring it back. They seemed totally ok with that scenario once they were informed replacement would cost money.
In my opinion a dental office is just a cheaper medical office as I experienced a lot of the same struggles across both. They were just enhanced more with dentists for some reason.
timbotheny26@reddit
There's an MSP in my area that, at least based on their website, seems to exclusively service dental offices.
metalblessing@reddit
You got that right. Been the local IT at an orthopedic clinic for over 6 years now, and this has been my daily life.
Blues-Mariner@reddit
Not surprising then that we read healthcare is in deep doodoo on getting off Win 10.
Code4Care@reddit
Sadly it is true. Depending on country they are at the mercy of each government payouts and rules/regulations. Sometimes there is barely enough money to even hire an IT guy for hundreds of people. They just outsource it to a random company for 70$ per month.
ReptilianLaserbeam@reddit
Healthcare and lawyers. Cheap bastards
Mean_Fondant_6452@reddit
Try construction!
jdptechnc@reddit
This is where I started out in IT about 25 years ago. Dentists and lawyers were the worst small customers in general.
UltraSPARC@reddit
What’s crazy is our law firms are our best customers. Tons of cash.
ReptilianLaserbeam@reddit
Tell me about it, they even charge for quick calls by the minute!
UltraSPARC@reddit
We do a lot of ediscovery for them so I think it helps that they can bill their clients for our work LOL
Pork-S0da@reddit
School districts top them all.
FrivolousMe@reddit
Dentists too, worse in my experience. So many of them are small business tyrants more interested in nickel and dining everything than having a functional workplace for their employees.
djaybe@reddit
I fire clients that pull this shit. Been doing this too long to deal with incompetence. Isn't that why they hired a professional???
ZippyTheRoach@reddit
Y'all ever do business with hotels? I've never worked with medical, but this sounds almost as bad as hospitality with the only possible exception being that hospitality would just grin and bear it. They'd run physically damaged hardware if it still gave output
h20wakebum@reddit
We shifted to 64gb baseline across the entire organization.
The cost is immaterial knowing we’ll never have a user issue with Ram
pretendadult4now@reddit
We just had the chat that the new laptops for 2026 are getting 32GB of RAM lol
JohnnyFnG@reddit
I work for healthcare too I hear you!! We were very stingy for a while because of our senior leadership who swore on moving to VDI for everything. When our infrastructure didn’t scale as quickly as they’d like, because oh yeah that costs money too, we started “beefing up” our workstations from 4GB to 8GB in 2020 lol. We now use 16GB as standard.
What you need to do is remind them of the cost of the original device, the cost to retroactively fix a poor decision, and time and money was wasted fixing said making poor decisions. When you show them the cost savings of choosing the right device the first time, it should be painfully obvious to all that maybe they should listen to the folks that get paid to do it.😎
SBarva@reddit
Most of my non-tech colleagues barely understands what RAM stands for. I feel you but the issues is your management belongs to that part of people.
I would say that bridging the gap between OT/IT and non-tech Management is the hardest part of our job.
Ron-Swanson-Mustache@reddit
I use the library analogy.
Your hard drive is like all the book shelves, holding lots of books that need to be removed to be used.
Your RAM is a desk that you can take the books out and open it up on. The more desk space you have, the more books you can open before you run out of space.
If you run out of space on your desk, then you have to start storing books back in the bookshelves, which means it takes longer to go get them and open again.
timbotheny26@reddit
That is a fantastic analogy, I'm absolutely adopting this.
fiddley78@reddit
I have a similar way of explaining it but the desktop in my analogy is CPU cache, the bookshelves are your RAM, the hard drive is the storage unit in the next town that you need to order from for next day delivery. I think that better fits the relative speed at which you can retrieve data for processing.
fmjintervention@reddit
I prefer the builder analogy. Your CPU is a builder on a job site building a house. Your CPU cache is the tool they currently have in their hand, it's available lightning fast but they can only really hold one or two tools at a time. Your RAM is the toolbox at the builder's feet, tools in there are available almost as fast and it's got way more storage space, it can hold maybe 20-30 tools which is almost everything needed to get the job done. The problem is when you have too little RAM (the toolbox isn't big enough) and the builder has to keep walking back to their van (swap file) which yes there's loads of space there, but it massively delays progress and those delays will be noticed in the builders ability to get the job done if they're spending more time walking back and forth from their truck than they are actually building the house. This is why your computer is so slow.
Ron-Swanson-Mustache@reddit
But I downloaded every toolbar!
johnjay@reddit
I went looking for this analogy when I opened the comments. This is how I get the most people to understand memory vs. storage.
SBarva@reddit
Great analogy, but if I would treat my manager like that, pretending I'm smarter I bet everyone knows what would be next
Ron-Swanson-Mustache@reddit
How do you explain things to them? Not everyone knows everything.
ITAdministratorHB@reddit
A user who works behind me kept wondering why I couldn't just download the RAM and I surely didn't need her computer to upgrade it right
syberghost@reddit
Non-tech? A lot of my senior developers don't understand the difference between RAM and disk.
PsyOmega@reddit
Why would a dev care? The OS handles that. RAM/swap might as well be the same virtual address space.
syberghost@reddit
The conversation typically goes like this:
Why can't I build this VM? It says I'm out of quota in this location, but I have 64GB of quota left, and this VM is only 4GB!
Because you asked for 200GB of storage, and you only have 175GB of storage quota left in this location. Go fill out a quota request.
But it's only 4GB!
Contren@reddit
Many developers basically don't know tech at all. They know programming as if speaking a language, but somehow never learned a damn thing about the tech they're utilizing their code on.
Had to help so many fix basic stuff like file permissions, UNC pathing, etc that should just be basic to anyone writing code but somehow isn't.
soulseaker@reddit
I think one of the problems is working and IT career field that involves multiple branches of technology; necessarily requires you to be semi-versed in a LOT of different things. This is usually someone that tinkers with a lot of different things, not just tech related. It's a totally different mindset.
Im not saying other professions are lazy, but most people dont do this. Im also not sticking up for them. Just some ramblings of observations I've had over the years.
Fine-Subject-5832@reddit
This shocked me joining the tech world that their are developers who somehow are as tech illiterate as bob or Susan in accounting.
MBILC@reddit
And these same devs are being allowed to set up entire cloud tenants in Azure or AWS, and then the world wonders why there are so many data breaches and performance issues and sky high costs..
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
It's bugged me my entire career... how is the receptionists kid's buddy's cousin a better source of tech knowledge than the highly paid developer who can program a 400 connection API in his sleep but get confused by the fucking microwave?
uptimefordays@reddit
Developers are like PC gamers or similar enthusiasts, they know enough to be dangerous but never as much as they think. It doesn’t help that there’s a general mindset of “who cares about the underlying systems?” among many developers.
InternationalMany6@reddit
Yeah it’s insane.
I once worked with someone who thought that creating symlinks was a backup. Like they actually wrote a backup script that did this and told the project team it was finished. First red flag was when I asked how long it took to restore 100 GB of test files from the backup and they said a few seconds.
syberghost@reddit
I got called by a job that fired me because they made this mistake and deleted all the documentation because I had a symlink to it in my home directory and they thought it was a backup. Including the documentation on how to restore a backup.
flummox1234@reddit
what tech stack?
If this is true calling those people developers is being very generous.
thatsnotamachinegun@reddit
If they do know the difference between RAM and disk, just start throwing out RAMdisk interchangeably to let them know you're smarter.
Kodiak01@reddit
DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\RAMDRIVE.SYS 2048 /A
BroaxXx@reddit
How can a software engineer not understand how memory works? Like... At all?
a60v@reddit
Are they AS/400 developers?
SBarva@reddit
yeah, what do we want from people who doesn't even belong to this world, when people whose productivity and speed depends on their device have 700 000 hours session without shutting down a device...
bythepowerofboobs@reddit
Our IT and OT departments work really well together. We are basically all in one management group under the CTO which I think makes a big difference. Getting IT people to actually participate in OT operations where it makes sense (OPC servers, SCADA installation /changes, production line printers, barcode cameras, etc.) helps everyone see the challenges the other side faces.
ajscott@reddit
I always use the analogy that RAM is your desk and your hard drive is a filing cabinet.
You're only allowed to work on files that you can see.
More RAM means you have a larger workspace to have files to work on.
If you run out of desk space then you have to pick up the low priority files and walk them over to the filing cabinet to swap them for the ones you need now.
johnnybon1@reddit
I basically say "having more means you can have more things open at once. Do you multitask and need lots of tabs etc, or do you just have one document open occasionally?" Everyone wants to feel important, so everyone always says they need lots of screens and active tasks = RAM always gets signed off.
InternationalMany6@reddit
It’s what IT rams into the computer so it works better.
Example: “My computer is running slow and it needs more ramming”
neoKushan@reddit
I bet those same managers that don't understand that 8GB isn't a lot in 2025 also think the piss-poor wages their reports are on is loads of money because it's more than they earned back in 1995.
whiteycnbr@reddit
16 is the new minimum.
danp20@reddit
You guys are struggling with 8GB RAM? Almost all of my users have only 8GB, and are running SAP and multiple web apps, office, CRM etc. they're having no issues at the moment... What have I done wrong? 🤣
Surge-Monkey@reddit
Turn off the windows page file for all disks on their PCs. Don’t need the OS giving them more RAM than they’re supposed to have. 😂 This definitely won’t cause crashes and will save loads of storage space! Trust me 👍 /s
Kirk1233@reddit
8? We’re at the point 16 isn’t enough…
ubermonkey@reddit
I'm a software vendor.
I have customers who are still dragging their feet about the 32 to 64 bit conversion.
Our product is very, very data intensive. 4GB is not enough RAM. 8 isn't, either. And yet these chuckleheads are grousing about "oh, the conversion is too hard" in the Year Of Our Lord 2025.
The worse thing (maybe?) is that many of our customer parties there have never worked anywhere else, and so don't realize how fucking insane their IT environment is.
crazzygamer2025@reddit
It's the same with IPv6 there's management who doesn't view it as a priority even though they have run out of 1918 space
Dependent-Smile-8367@reddit
8GB is plenty if they still use 32bit apps. They can’t address above 4GB anyway. But if they are a 64bit shop, then 16GB min and 32GB optimum.
Ihaveasmallwang@reddit
If they are still using a 32 bit OS, it’s unsupported and should be replaced with a modern replacement.
Dependent-Smile-8367@reddit
Not 32bit OS, just the apps. For some reason companies won’t move past 32bit apps in the enterprise. It’s been that way in the last 3 large companies I worked for. O365, and Adobe are the main culprits. They did mention Excel macro compatibility in my last company. I am an IT pro by trade.
crazzygamer2025@reddit
I've known people who created Excel spreadsheets that are literally 6 GB in size it is not a good experience on 32 bit office with that size of a file.
crazzygamer2025@reddit
In my IT business I do not give the customers quote for any option that is below 16 GB.
RykerFuchs@reddit
16/512 is our min these days. Covers most users, with outliers getting 32/1T
Brwdr@reddit
The OS needs 4gb, the security agents need another 4gb, give a thought for the spreadsheet.
Assumeweknow@reddit
it's all about the conversation you have with them. Start with the average value of a single person in the organization. These days it's typically 100k or better. If you can make them 5% more efficient at their job by spending 5k on them. And, the company gets 5% boost in productivity, that turns into 25,000 over 5 years in increased value. Therefore, when I budget systems etc. for companies my target is always 3-5% productivity boost over 5 years. Most of the time I achieve over 10%. My first customer, oddly enough, I took them from 100 hours of overtime to 0 within a month of my roll out. That paid my monthly RMM and my Equipment lease fee and allowed them to double in business over the next year. Want to guess what my conversations with them are like now. You need this, this, this. It'll cost this much. Approved.
Soup_Roll@reddit
What grinds my gears are these dumb, sheeple opinions without any genuine thought. Is 8gb enough? You can ask what the internet thinks or you can do your job as a sysadmin. WHAT IS THE USE CASE? 8GB is beyond ample if your users are just running a web browser or RDP session. For just a thin terminal running RDP, 4gb is probably fine. Is it enough for Teams + browser + outlook + office apps? It used to be, but now you probably do need 16gb here. Stop with these meaningless blanket options like you need ## amount of memory, maybe if you went to your boss with actual facts and figures he might take you seriously. How about you take a standard laptop, fire up all the apps which your standard user will be using, then open up resource monitor and see if your system is doing a lot of paging or not. If it is, you need more memory. If it's not, you probably have enough.
canadian_sysadmin@reddit
Give them one.
We're onto 32. Any user who uses a lot of apps even 16 isn't quite enough anymore.
BadSausageFactory@reddit
8gb doesn't leave room for malware or viruses, we save a lot on security that way
vppencilsharpening@reddit
Please don't give the security team ideas. They lurk even if they don't understand.
forceofslugyuk@reddit
or a modern web browser.
gmitch64@reddit
They already mentioned malware...
forceofslugyuk@reddit
At least Firefox lets you still disable/turn off their bullshit they add. For now...
bbbbbthatsfivebees@reddit
At least once Mozilla enshitifies Firefox, you can switch to one of the many alternatives based on the same source code without compromising on features. There's already several alternatives --Waterfox specifically comes to mind, but I heard somewhere that they have ties to a data collection/ads company (I don't know if it's 100% true, it's just something I heard once). There's also MANY Chromium forks without Google's nonsense if you need to go that way.
Logical_Sort_3742@reddit
Much the same thing if you are using Edge, though.
EnlargedChonk@reddit
I think they call that "reducing the attack surface"
soulseaker@reddit
If you dont have a surface, what can be attacked? PointsToHead.gif
soulseaker@reddit
Genius!!! I love it.
kukari@reddit
Management should not be involved decisions like that at all. We don’t tell management ant specs, we just say we need this many moneys and then go ahead purchase i7-laptops with 32GB at minimum. I think everybody is very happy with this arrangement.
Mp3ManAZ@reddit
Substitute their computer for one running the latest version of Windows on 8GB of memory.
Their opinion will change hella quick.
UltraEngine60@reddit
Look at Mr. Fancy over here with 8GB.
stedabro@reddit
Not answering your question, but our min. Is 32GB in new systems.
Inertia-UK@reddit
640kb is as much as anyone will ever need!
GeneMoody-Action1@reddit
8gb is relevant, for some it is plenty, for others it is not remotely enough. A normal business system without a user that insist on having 60 chrome/edge tabs open all day, and not doing any intensive media work, 8 is perfectly fine for sane web browsing, office work, etc.Especially since most systems nowadays have high speed SSD making paging blazing fast as well.
Rather than trying to explain "8 is not enough" I would instead profile some of the systems on site and demonstrate why, as well as a reasonable estimate based on that. Consider the alternative, "You need at least 16", that will certainly NOT be true of most office users, when specing systems blanket statements like that always sound salesy vs practical. Try evidence based, not opinion, that is subject to no rebuttal other than stubbornness.
sparkyblaster@reddit
It pisses me off that 8gb isn't enough. We have become so lazy when it comes to development etc. We just throw ram at it, which means more cpu, which means more battery. It's just dumb.
Look at how shit windows 11 runs. The only reason it's not seen as slower than vista is because we threw an obscene amount of hardware at it. Vista is actually better at this point.
Hot take, 2gb should be fine for basic browsing, 4gb should be plenty for basic office work. 8-16 should be fine for gaming.
tmofee@reddit
Even Macs are now min 16 gb…
Bonar_Ballsington@reddit
Everyone was complaining about their computers running out of memory, so the company replaced their 5 year old 8gb ram laptops with brand new 8gb laptops. There are still folk running single 21” monitors and printing sent/received emails to prove they’ve replied or whatever. I’ve given up tbh
Silver-Bread4668@reddit
I'm equally as concerned with some of the martyr syndrome in this thread.
People saying shit like they take the "dog food" (shit devices) and give out the decent shit to other people.
People saying they added more RAM they had at home.
Shit like that.
Fuck that noise. This is your job and most of us are doing jobs that give us some level of "keys to the kingdom". Dealing with shit devices or using your own stuff at home to upgrade your device is shit. If your employer can't be bothered to give you a device that is capable of effectively doing the job you need to do, fuck them.
The system needs to fail for things to get better. Not be propped up behind the scenes by your sacrifice that no one gives two shits about and will never thank you for.
Character_Bag_5371@reddit
You make all the pointers you can on why they should have more, and make sure you have it on email that management thinks 8gb is enough so you can defend yourself when it will hit production. Because they will be looking for a scapegoat. When it starts burning
ZedGama3@reddit
I pull up the memory stats on task manager and explain it - it's not a difficult concept.
RAM is fast, that's this number. When your computer uses more memory than it has RAM (points to committed memory), then it overflows to the hard drive which is really slow.
I'll then mention the history of virtual memory and how computers literally crash if memory can't be allocated in some way.
Giving them a way to quantify it makes it real and observable for them and takes the magic and guessing out of it.
Cheezzz@reddit
Might not be enough for Windows but it is enough for Linux.
Accomplished_Sir_660@reddit
Remotely fire up processes on mgmt computer. When he call for help because it's running slow le r him know he ran out of ram and ask if you have permission to upgrade the ram. Problem solved.
ListMore5157@reddit
Laugh
DizzyOrganization639@reddit
Honestly, teh only thing that definately worked for us was framing it as lost productivity—we calculated average boot times and app launch delays on old vs new hardware and translated that into wasted salary dollars per year.
gingerinc@reddit
How much RAM does management have, out of interest?
Hot_Dragonfruit4039@reddit
Give them same systems as primary
povlhp@reddit
You give them an old PC with rotating harddisk and 8GB
MajStealth@reddit
back in my days, that would have been the cashcow for the company, 8 billable hours only to install updates on 1 machine. I would have taken that and let them do updates while i did other things, but well...
C21H30O218@reddit
Only listen to the first 3/4 of what they are saying, then walk off and come back 2 mins later and just start where they finished
mehx9@reddit
Just install linux and carry on ✌️
a60v@reddit
8GB still isn't enough for most users.
mehx9@reddit
As someone typing on a work laptop with 32GB RAM I agree.
Given this us a rant post I am just saying a committed person can make do with 8 if they were allowed to use linux without corporate spyware and antivirus.
YUNeedUniqUserName@reddit
Be generous and give them $25 in an envelope, explain that you've been saving this for over a year, so you can perform better as their employee 😂
Scooterhd@reddit
Our default deployments are NUCs with 16GB. Buying barebone I think it's an extra 20-25 bucks over 8GB.
adoodle83@reddit
Show them the memory usage output from Task Manager of having Outlook and Teams running for more than an hour
Annoying_Simpleton@reddit
8gbRAM is plenty to surf the web even with an M2 MacBook. Don’t know why you’d say that. Yes, 16 would be preferable but charging $200 for 8 extra gb of RAM is highway robbery which is why I just do it on my own. Also, let management manage. That’s their job. Want to do your job? Follow their bidding or become management.
jsellens@reddit
The post that I believe you are satirizing explicitly said "In our environment, 8gb ram on laptops is good enough." and "the issue is software-related", and the discussion was filled with responses that "you can't run teams and O365 and a browser in 8GB" instead of taking the poster at their word. Perhaps they run a single application - maybe it's a call centre or something with simple needs. I don't think I saw anyone asking about specifics of that OP's environment or even really addressing the question. I saw one response that was just "8GB of ram with win11 and office 365 is weak for sure". The OP did not mention the OS *or* the hardware - it could have been MacBooks or Linux for all we know. And now you seem to be piling on, assuming that the other OP is incompetent and unqualified, without, as far as I can see, knowing anything about the OP's organization's needs or environment. This is not consistent with the spirit of this almost always helpful subreddit.
bipoca@reddit
After the windows 11 update my work PC was very slow. IT recommend buying a $800 replacement. I just ordered a stick of order ddr4 on our company Amazon account instead. Boom,, runs great.
shrekerecker97@reddit
Put 8gb ram in their computer
EngineerBoy00@reddit
At a place I worked I got a laptop with minimal RAM and an actual magnetic hard drive (this was a while back). I literally couldn't do my job - I was a Senior Director but I was always a player/coach so one of the things I would do is parse huuuuge telemetry datasets.
Some bean counter had decreed that Senior Managers and above got "word processing" levels of laptops as an overreaction to execs taking all the developer-level laptops by fiat when they only wanted them for ego.
The concept of a Senior Director crunching large datasets or compiling complex code was seen as a scam by said bean counter so I was denied an exception.
So, out of my own pocket I sprung for the max ram it would hold and a super fast SSD. Being a techie I just cloned my disk image to the SSD and kept on trucking.
Fast forward 2 years and a high-level exec sees the responsiveness of my laptop during a presentation and "fixes the glitch" but having me assigned a different "word processing" level laptop.
So I dutifully imaged my SSD back to the magnetic disk (which I had kept), removed the extra RAM, turned in my laptop, got the new one (same model), put the upgrades in the new one and went on my merry, zoomy way.
A week or so later the high-level exec asks me to stop by his office on what I later realized was a pretext. Turns out he had orchestrated my retrofit so he could snag my sleeper laptop but now there was no vroom-vroom.
After some dumb-playing I eventually fessed up. He gave me a squinty look and said "What would the drive-out price be on doing that for this laptop?"
I said $X00, he said help me order the parts, I did, installed them, and made an ally for the rest of my time there.
Unfortunately he "discreetly" told other execs that he "had a guy" and I became Mr. Turbocharger for the exec suite.
As always happens with secrets, somebody blabbed and it got back to the Bean Counter who went ape-shit, BUT the majority of senior execs by now had upgrades so they pulled strings, pushed buttons, tossed weight, and got an exception process put in place.
Good times.
NeedsMoreNumbers@reddit
I just rebooted my work machine after reading these posts just to see what idle ram usage looked like (never bothered to check, at least not in the last few years). I'm shocked to find that it idles at around 10GB. This is Windows 11 with Teams, OneDrive and A/V running from startup. Insanity!!
bls61793@reddit
Jesus the world has gone to shit. 10GB for an operating system. Ridiculous.
maikelat@reddit
Same as me. Except I only have 16GB and it's because I myself, with my own money, had to buy another stick of RAM. It's simply absurd! I cannot work with 8GB, absolutely not. I mean... I can barely make it with 16GB, tbh.
And you know what's funny? We currently have one machine that's not being used atm until new personnel come in, and the head of IT requested to have the RAM removed and put in his.... Like.. Brother!... You are experiencing the f*** problem yourself! You know by experience it's NOT ENOUGH!, just freaking buy DDR5 RAM modules + make sure all new machines come with 16GB as the minimum.
It's frustrating, really.
F0X-BaNKai@reddit
I support a remote law firm that is 100% cloud based. They have 25 - 30 chrome tabs open at once sometimes more and were running 16GB DDR5 but still getting white screens and not responding. Went to 32GB and it vanished .. 8GB is a joke and they will definitely have issues with even moderate use.
pinkycatcher@reddit
AI tools take up a lot of memory too, I've had to start upgrading from 16GB as well. Unfortunately so many laptops have 8GB of soldered ram so you can only go up to 24GB without being super expensive. But it's still good enough.
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
It is but does it also annoy you that it's not a power of 2? I hate it when shit doesn't go 8, 16, 32, 64 128... If you give me a laptop with 96Gig I'm gonna be annoyed that you cheaped out and didn't do it right.
It's dumb as shit yes, but goddamnit the math doesn't math if you don't math it right!
iwillbewaiting24601@reddit
My MacBook Air is 24 and it gave me a bit of the eye twitch, not going to lie
FALSE_PROTAGONIST@reddit
There is 2x48gb kits just FYI
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
*eye twitches*
FALSE_PROTAGONIST@reddit
I actually have them in my precision 5570… it only supports 64GB of memory officially but took these. I couldn’t even find any larger modules actually
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
Oh I know I'm being ridiculous. But it really does bug me for some goddamn reason. Like it goes against the natural order... the natural order of completely man made things I guess?
It's a stupid as hell hill and I'm mostly just goofing with it, but honestly, it DOES irritate me. if you gave me 96Gb for my laptop I'd use it. Because right now I have 32Gb and I'm not dumb enough to not realize that 96 is a lot more than 32...
But I'd feel weird about it.
FALSE_PROTAGONIST@reddit
Usually what I do is buy the largest modules I can because if I ever want to upgrade in the future I will have these smaller ones that I have no use for. I have tried to sell used memory before but it takes ages to sell if at all and often for hardly anything so might as well get the most you can and take the hit and move on…
Vengeful111@reddit
I think 24GB is actually nice if its cheaper than 32.
Because the 24GB are for integrated graphics too, so you can basically say you have 16 GB of RAM and 8 GB Vram
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
DANN YOU AND YOUR LOGIC!!!
Vengeful111@reddit
Tbh I feel like a company setting that takes security serious needs more RAM than a home user since many modern security programs are hogging resources.
paleologus@reddit
I got 200 people running a Citrix session and checking web mail twice a week. 8gb is fine.
LForbesIam@reddit
8GB of Ram is enough. Just optimize your services and run at startup keys.
The problem is every piece of software wants to run unnecessarily.
Modern Apps are the worst for running in the background.
I disable it all. If they need to run an app they run it and close it when done.
The fraction of a second longer to launch an app from scratch is way less impactful than running everything all the time.
Also we reboot computers every 24 hours. That helps considerably.
CartographerGold3168@reddit
i dun think you are new. you know the only solution is to change a job. yes the market sucks i know. we all suffer
Denis63@reddit
i work in canadian education.
i deployed 20 desktops with i3's and 8gbs of ram earlier today. my own computer is supposed to be the same specs. i dont get paid any more for working faster so meh
Acheronian_Rose@reddit
Give them a machine with a single 8gb RAM stick, they will change their mind lmao
BoomSchtik@reddit
This is the first thing that came to my mind. Let them stew in their own decisions. Don't give them better specs just because they are management.
MairusuPawa@reddit
Grab a random one from Aliexpress too, avoid known brands.
Yubbi45@reddit
Just watched a Linus video about $145 10" Notebooks
agoia@reddit
Go Dynabook. More expensive than a big 3 laptop and it will fall apart within months.
cyclotech@reddit
I prefer the 300 dollar best buy special. The CEO will be happy at the cost savings I promise
Aquitaine-9@reddit
You mentioned it's management so also, tell them AI determined that's all they need. Watch their heads explode.
Nemisis_the_2nd@reddit
Out of curiosity, I put the idea into chatGPT to see what an AI would actually say. My prompt was:
It's top suggestion was a "i3‑12100 / 8 GB / 500 GB SSD – Punch Tech", which costs £426
I think it understood the true assignment.
Aquitaine-9@reddit
No SSD. Spinner.
RabidTaquito@reddit
This man managers.
anaemic@reddit
an i3 preferably
MBILC@reddit
pffft, get an older intel G series processor, or atom equivalent these days :D
Demented-Alpaca@reddit
What, it's basically the same thing. There's no real difference between a 3 and a 7... /s
useredditto@reddit
We have 8GB on 80% of our PCs. No problems. It depends on what for they are used. Other PCs are high specs for a separate team who has cetrain requirements
No_Resolution_9252@reddit
Try informing they they are a dumb ass boomer, gentlest way I can think of
LegoNinja11@reddit
3/4 of the office is on 8gb and 256gb drives and if it weren't for windows 11 we'd probably be fine on that. (Cloud software so 2 screens, 2 browsers open and 3/4 tabs)
If I didn't have half the office incapable of change, we'd be dumping Windows and going Linux because who cares what OS the browser runs on.
Bubbly_Morning8933@reddit
If 8GB is what they want, 8GB is what they get. When they ask for a new device, take the RAM out and replace with 2 4GB chips. That way if one dies, they can go through even more misery!
AntonyMcLovin@reddit
Management should not be in management.
FortheredditLOLz@reddit
Easy, malicious compliance time!!!
You buy a brand new unit with 8gb and happily give it to all of management. Swap said management over and solicit feedback every few days. If they STILL green lit it. Have it in writing. Do a ‘pilot’ run with your heaviest users and provide tickets stating it’s dogshit. Forward those management or build a list of total complaints.
sagewah@reddit
Been a while since anyone's said it, so: tidy up that resume and get yourself out there. Time to move on.
lilrebel17@reddit
Give them numbers.
Do the math on ram usage.
On average our builds OS at idle take up x amount of ram. If I open chrome and go to x or y tool we use. It goes up to x ram. If we need to add on x tool, its x ram.
TuxRuffian@reddit
Good lord, my work LT has 16GB and memory compression is constantly running. 32GB should be the standard for any new aqusitions IMHO. At least if your talking about DTs you can always add it, but with LTs going cheap on RAM is penny-wise and pound-foolish!
DragonfruitFit2449@reddit
If I'm allowed BYOD I will be bringing my beast to work
robotbeatrally@reddit
LOL I read that other post earlier and started reading this and cracked up before I got to the this is a satirical post part. xD
ITAdministratorHB@reddit
I been struggling even with my 16 lately and bugging my manager for another stick lol
Lil_mosey_is_white_@reddit
Yeah same issue here lol
L_Cranston_Shadow@reddit
Ask them why all they're doing is running Kali so the staff can practice for their cyber security class, since that is pretty much the only reason for 8gb of RAM being enough.
FlaccidRazor@reddit
Slowly? I bet it's slowly. /s
IndyONIONMAN@reddit
On hardware level its not enough. But for AVDs we use 8gig is fine, get all the software runs as intended without any issue.
Mission_Carrot4741@reddit
Time to leave said company
Humble_Rush_9358@reddit
I did an analysis once where I had an engineer build a drawing using an i6 w/16gb of ram and one where he built that same drawing with an i9 w/32gb of ram. I timed it.
It was so much faster for him to build it with the i9 that they determined they could get the equivalent of over an hour more work out of an engineer per day if we used the i9's.
This meant that when buying a new computer the i9's were more cost effective after 1 month. I could reuse the slower computers for regular office workers. So there was no loss by making the switch. By the end of the year, it was a net gain of half a million dollars in productivity, if you go by salary. If you go by actual revenue, I think it was roughly a 4 million dollar increase that year.
Capitalism causes companies to prioritize short term over long term. If I hadn't gotten this standard in place before we were bought by a publicly traded company, it would have never been approved. Even though it was such a boon.
aries1500@reddit
This is the way, show them how much production is lost with slow systems.
Recent_Carpenter8644@reddit
But what made the difference - the 32GB or the i9?
SAugsburger@reddit
A lot of organizations have CFOs that reject buying new tools for staff because they miss the big picture of whether those tools improve productivity enough to justify the cost. That's even before you ignore that organizations with clearly underpowered workstations likely have higher turnover all things being equal. If you feel you're regularly waiting on an application to respond you're more likely to feel frustrated at work and more likely to question whether you want to continue to work there. Maybe that by itself doesn't trigger people to want to move on, but it definitely adds to people's triggers.
razzemmatazz@reddit
The last job I did software dev for kind of did this, but in the most painful way possible to me. My entire team was on Intel Macs still and I was given an M2 Mac, despite my requests in advance to match the team's hardware because I had 0 Mac experience.
It took me 2 excruciating months to get the dependencies on our repos updated enough that they'd even run on the M2, and since I'd never seen the software run before I had no idea if my updates were necessary or causing errors in other parts of the stack. It was a big enough update that there really wasn't a way to tell what was necessary or not, as most repos were 2-3 years out of date...
I guess on the plus side the test suite update made the tests go from 7 minutes to 2 minutes to run, even on the Intel macs.
primalsmoke@reddit
This is what IT does. We provide tools to make workers more efficient, we do what is right for the company.
We replaced books and spreadsheets with Lotus 1-2-3, typewriters with Wordperfect and haven't stopped since.
Sometimes people in IT forget what we really do.
aries1500@reddit
16gb isn’t even enough anymore for people who are using multiple web applications.
ohv_@reddit
All my vdi are 6gb for 'normal' users and my laptop has 8gb... power users might get 12gb
BDF-3299@reddit
Where’d they buy them, the trash and treasure market?
That’s a signal to be looking for an employer that doesn’t have their head up their arse.
Beneficial_Reddit101@reddit
Management are 9/10 morons and shouldn’t have there jobs as they don’t understand the job they are managing if companies really wanted to do better they would put a manager in place that has done the job before and understand the process
zhantoo@reddit
8 GB of memory cost an additional 30 USD. The average worker costs 1 USD per minute The average machine lasts 4 years.
Even if the user very conservatively saves 1 minute per month, it's 48 USD saved in the lifespan of the machine, leading to a net saving of 18 USD per users.
Realisticly the time saved would in reality be several minutes per day.
ChillKyle@reddit
Print hardware utilization chart showing 100% usage. But it's gotta have visual graphs. Management loves graphs and charts.
1h8fulkat@reddit
Here we are buying 32 gig for lawyers thinking it's not enough.
Big_Examination2106@reddit
Here's how to do have this discussion with data.
Choose a user that's representative of the group you're advocating for. You may have to break down a department into several user groups depending on the apps they use to work.
Chose your example user. Write down how much RAM the machine has. Now you're gonna make a list of every significant application open and running - and this is key - when the chosen user has everything open they need to work.
This means you're going to note each app that's running after boot completion, starting with the OS. Then list all the apps your IT team puts on there; everything that's "common" on a business PC at your org, and that starts up and runs when the PC does. This should be apps like your RMM agent, any security agents, corporate VPN client, OneDrive agent, Google Drive agent, Teams or Slack, screen-cap agents, fax agents, the list goes on...
If you're not familiar with what I'm referring to, look in the system tray for examples- this type of app usually has an icon in there. You'll see graphics card update agents, Dell/Lenovo/HP update agents, and other bullshit that runs at startup. List all this crap in rows in a spreadsheet.
Next, have the user startup everything they use to do their job. Have them just start their day - open everything they use.
Users are gonna user, so do this with at least two examples from your user group. Maybe 3; just make sure you have a good idea of what everyone uses to do their job. A supervisor should know all these apps. The list will include apps like: Outlook, Word, Excel, line of business (LOB) apps like an ERP, or Salesforce, Jira, ShittyMedicalSoftware, ShittyBankSoftware, AnythingmadebyQuickenisshitty, PDFwankerfree, PDFAnnotatorfree, bullshitdesignsoftware, and other business-specific apps.
Don't forget the browser - note how many browser tabs and windows they open for a "typical day." Later on you're gonna want to note the memory used by the browser AFTER they have all their crap open and logged into.
Now that you have this bigass list of apps that are running and open when the user is set to work - you get to the fun part!
Start a column in your sheet and start googling the recommended RAM amount for each. application. listed. Tt's gonna suck, but that's why this is called "work."
You're gonna go to Microsoft and you're gonna look up what MS says your OS is "reccomended" to have. And what the shitty printer app says, and the security agent, and the VPN agent, and the shitty off-brand PDF writer, everything on the list - look up the "minimum" and "recommended" amounts of RAM by each vendor.
After you have found every apps recommended amount of needed RAM, you're gonna do column totals for "minimum" and "recommended."
You will now have two numbers, SPECIFIC TO YOUR ACTUAL REAL WORLD USERS, that indicate how much they actually need to meet all the "minimum" and "recommended" amounts of RAM.
Likely, this will be a bigger number than you actually have RAM installed. If so, you just proved you need more RAM than you have.
Don't forget to actually check the RAM used by the browser when it's newly opened and every tab the user needs freshly logged in. And grab the number BEFORE the browser puts tabs to "sleep" and saves RAM.
Now sure, someone's going to say "oh but each app isn't actually using the amount of RAM recommended." And that's true - but your statement is more true - you did the math, and proved the software vendors say you need 30 pieces of pie, you only have 20!
Math don't lie, you need more RAM to meet the vendor minimums or recommendation. And that's all that matters to support an argument for increasing the installed RAM.
At the end of the day, the vendor WILL NOT provide (infinite and/or ongoing) support if you aren't meeting their recommendations. Or, at least, if you keep fucking with the vendor crying about poor performance, and they PROVE the hardware isn't strong enough, they WILL point to your failure to meet standards and they will be on solid rational ground to not troubleshoot anything until you do. Everyone has limits, it's why written documentation exists.
Good luck!
Big_Examination2106@reddit
Because I'm a 20 year IT consultant whose been out of work for too fucking long, and I have spare time, I threw this into GPT for you. Have fun:
Absolutely — here’s your text rewritten as a formal IT support business process while preserving its intent and detail. This version reads like something that would appear in an internal IT operations playbook or SOP (Standard Operating Procedure).
Procedure: Determining RAM Requirements for User Workloads
Document Owner: IT Operations Purpose: To establish a repeatable process for collecting and presenting data on system memory (RAM) usage requirements based on real-world user workloads. This process supports hardware upgrade recommendations with evidence-based justification.
Scope: This procedure applies to all IT support staff responsible for desktop hardware evaluations, performance troubleshooting, or capacity planning.
1. Objective
To quantify actual memory requirements for a representative user group by identifying all applications and background processes typically active during a standard work session, comparing total recommended memory needs to existing hardware specifications.
2. Prerequisites
3. Process Overview
Step 1: Identify Representative Users
Step 2: Record System Specifications
Document the selected user’s machine specifications, including:
Installed RAM
Step 3: Inventory Background and Startup Applications
Include:
Operating system
Step 4: Observe and Document Active Work Applications
Record each active application, including:
Productivity tools (Outlook, Word, Excel, etc.)
Web browsers, including:
Step 5: Collect Vendor Memory Recommendations
For each listed application:
Search the vendor’s documentation for minimum and recommended system memory requirements.
Step 6: Calculate Aggregate Requirements
Step 7: Measure Actual Browser Memory Usage
Step 8: Analyze and Document Findings
Present the following values:
Total minimum required RAM
Step 9: Formulate Recommendation
If calculated requirements exceed installed memory:
4. Deliverables
Summary report or ticket note outlining:
Representative users tested
5. Notes and Considerations
Would you like me to format this as a ready-to-use IT SOP document (Word or PDF) with placeholders for signatures, dates, and approval sections?
dgillz@reddit
Quit and look for another job.
GeekShallInherit@reddit
Make the financial justification. What's the cost to upgrade or purchase the extra 8gb RAM? $20? Maybe $100 in extreme cases?
Let's say you use computers for four years. That's, at most, $25 per year. Let's say that fully loaded (including benefits, etc) your employees cost $100,000 per employee. If it saves 30 minutes in time over four years, or two seconds per day, the cost is justified.
owenevans00@reddit
Got 16gb and 20% cpu just idling here. How anyone survives on 8 these days is beyond me
Generico300@reddit
Such management should be thrown out on the street. People like that are nothing but bean counters who view the entire business as little more than a spreadsheet. They don't understand the consequences of inadequate tooling and they grossly underestimate the impact that it has, mostly because they have nothing to compare their outcomes to. So until the outcome is failure, they won't acknowledge that they are actually under performing because they're losing efficiency on every single employee.
raffey_goode@reddit
bro our systems come standard 32gb of ram now. i decided on the hardware we purchase. i didn't even hold onto 16gb as long as i thought i would
Sea_Promotion_9136@reddit
Funny, Is OP the guy that had a post made about him the other day? 😅 Complaints made about a tech replacing machines and saying 8gb ram was enough for their environment.
wrootlt@reddit
You reminded me what i tried to push back in my memory. Probably 18-20 years ago working at my first job i had to deal with reality that IT staff was using left overs from other teams. It was a messed system of budget in gov agency, so only people in other teams could receive refreshes. A few smaller teams along with IT would just reuse old replaced systems. I had to take parts from other systems (like PSU, CDROM, etc.) and build me somewhat working system that had not enough memory and CPU power for my tasks. Later it has improved and we finally started to receive newer machines every 3 years or so. At my few latest places i would always get a 16 GB machine, with 2-3 old generation of CPU and i never run into performance issues (mostly because i don't tend to have 50+ tabs opened in 3 browsers). My teammates though complain often and even think about buying memory themselves :)
ClungeWhisperer@reddit
Ive been harvesting ram from laptops that get replaced out of warranty (dropped/smashed etc) and have a little stockpile which i can franken-upgrade for users who actually cant operate on 8gb. This is gonna fucking suck as users migrate to win 11 tho 😭
DarraignTheSane@reddit
If you have IT management who believes that workstations without enough hardware resources are sufficient, when users complain of slowness you can check memory utilization in resource manager, see that's it's pegged at near 100%, then close the ticket with "Resources being fully utilized to their maximum capacity. User must adjust expectations."
Once user complaints become too much, it will become your manager's problem.
mattersauce@reddit
That's easy, you advise management in an email that 8GB isn't enough to accomplish basic tasks, then you show them what basic tasks would max that out.
Then they ignore you.
When a relevant issue arises you bring it up again and reference your previous email.
They ignore you.
Following you'll explain that upgrades are expected and necessary to maintain minimum effective processing simply by the fact that basic software updates demand more processing and memory.
Then do all the above again.
Then you'll get fired.
Fuck.
hurkwurk@reddit
solve the problem.
soulseaker@reddit
Not providing an answer, but my phone has 12GB...
xelanil@reddit
To unjerk, a lot of times management will get super dank machines for themselves but give everyone else trash. The solution is to push for standardization and give everyone the same computer and make management use 8 GB computers.
WhiskyEchoTango@reddit
8GB of RAM wasn't enough in 2015.
networkn@reddit
You explain the most expensive resource each month is labour. They make money from that labour and anything they can do to improve the efficiency of that resource, improves their bottom line.
JohnQPublic1917@reddit
Seems like every Windows version requires a ram doubling. XP was good on 2, Win7 was okay with 4 (until SP2), Win8 needed more like 8, Win10 needs 16, and Win11 will need 32 when all the service packs are finally out.
Every computer I build, I double the RAM from the previous. My newest system I'm running 64GB. I expect to get a 7-8 year life cycle with minor replacements like power supplies and new storage so the half-life.
Note: I'm not a sysadmin anymore, but this has held true for the past 20 years.
flummox1234@reddit
Give them a machine with only 8GB of RAM?
As long as I've been in this industry my bosses have always had the latest and greatest max spec'd machine yet foisted shit like this on us. make them eat their own dogfood.
Stryker1-1@reddit
This is easy you saddle management with the 8gb laptop and watch them struggle.
LighttBrite@reddit
Though I agree that it's probably in any businesses best interest to move towards 16gb min....these statements are probably why you aren't listened to. That is blatantly false. I have a machine that has 8gb and a VERY dated cpu and it not only can browse the web just fine...I can have 100+ tabs open whilst multi-tasking on it.
If you can't browse with 8gb...I think you may have another issue.
splittingxheadache@reddit
Idk about you but I never find this to be the case
LighttBrite@reddit
Never find what to be the case? Are you saying you can't browse the web with 8gb?
splittingxheadache@reddit
Not with as many tabs open as I’d like
New_Plate_1096@reddit
Our NOC is about to riot because we recently refreshed all the laptop and some dingbat bought all 16gb models. So we went from 32gb with decent cpu and shit screens to good screens with half the memory and low power cpus.
Our ticketing system in a firefox tab and our phone system alone use 5gb. Let alone the other dozen applications we need at any given moment.
1z1z2x2x3c3c4v4v@reddit
You only work to get skills and experience. Are you still getting new and in-demand skills?
If so, suck it up. Get all the new skills you can and then get out. Each company is only a stepping stone to the next bigger and better company.
zatset@reddit
For basic tasks, like browsing without opening billion tabs, word processing and so on...8GB of RAM is adequate, complemented with SSD. But it depends on the use case. Higher is better. With that I can agree.
P.S Posting this from Elitebook with 8GB of RAM. About 80tabs open in Edge, as well as other programs. But I wouldn't do graphic design on this Elitebook.
cluberti@reddit
As I always ask people when they present escalations or posts that talk about performance issues - is the person (or group) responsible for supporting/maintaining the systems 100% certain that the systems are sluggish due to the RAM limitations? I understand more RAM might make the system responsive again, but do they have the hard performance trace data showing the reasons why the systems are sluggish and know all of the options that could be presented in order to alleviate the situation? Once they have that, they can present the data upwards and let management do what management does. Whatever happens, they've provided the evidence of what steps need to be taken to improve the situation, and management decides whether or not to spend the money and time on doing so (or not). Even if the problem persists, the issue is resolved, one way or another.
Plastic_Helicopter79@reddit
The home computer has 64 gig, but after about two weeks it creeps up to 98% memory used and never seems to go down. I should probably upgrade to 128 gig.
splittingxheadache@reddit
Do you…ever restart?
volster@reddit
"upgrade" the c-suite to their approved spec.
x54675788@reddit
They think 2-4gb is enough where I work
thatsnotamachinegun@reddit
Maybe I am just a dinosaur or have an extremely light workload, but my 11 year old MBP and 8 year old Mac Air work just fine for normal office workloads. They are actually the computers I use the most often. I do have a mac mini I recently upgraded to 32 GB because I do run VMs on it.
Work did provide me with a new MBP with an M4 and 48 GB of RAM, but if I even came remotely close to scratching the surface of using 1/4 of that, I would be a very surprised man.
rschulze@reddit
Here ya go, just tell your users to download more ram https://downloadmoreram.com/
alwaysdnsforver@reddit
slow clap
Mc-lurk-no-more@reddit
I can't believe technicians can't make use of the built in tools to analyze performance. Like if memory pressure is up and available is low. Rather than making broad brush approach of simply buying a higher spec system for everyone at the org.
angrydeuce@reddit
Thats easy, you have them daily driver one and see what they think lol
You'd be amazed how quickly peoples tunes change when their opinions affect them directly. You will never see an issue moved on so fast as when a senior executive is suffering the fallout of their own directives lmao
MBILC@reddit
Ram is so cheap in the overall big picture of IT costs. When i first came into my current role, I did an inventory of computers and sure enough, plenty had 8GB of ram, so our first in person management meeting, I came with a bunch of new 16GB sticks and picked out the people with 8GB laptops and upgraded them on the spot during breaks in the meetings...(CPu and disk were still fine)
The joy of them booting up their system, everything loading fast again, opening teams, word, outlook, browsers and still things cruising...
The right tool for the job... if the company wants to bicker over $100 or less to improve workers efficiency, I am out...
Especially when we have project staff who bill out at $150+ an hour...
Our new baseline now is 32GB, period, and I have given power users 64GB if needed, not even a second thought.
polarbear320@reddit
Is 16-32GB better -- yes. For an average office user 8GB really is just fine. Saying that "you can barley surf the web with 8GB" is just a lie.
I don't like old tech when replacement is justified but if you're replacing computers just because they have 8GB you're out of touch. Consider adding RAM -- much more cost effective.
AlarmingAffect0@reddit
8 GB can be enough on a Linux distro if you don't open fifty tabs probably. But I'm betting they won't let you use Linux.
ChewedSata@reddit
Give them a computer with 8gb of ram.
CreativeDimension@reddit
make them experience it and show them how much better and productive is with more ram
bangsmackpow@reddit
Sometimes you have to give them exactly what they asked for...
r/MaliciousCompliance maybe?
Site-Staff@reddit
Digital Friction analysis.
fuckasoviet@reddit
I reject your last sentence.
Software eating up RAM isn’t due to advancing tech. It’s due to sloppy code that gets by due to…processing power, memory, and storage constantly getting cheaper and better.
https://techtrenches.substack.com/p/the-great-software-quality-collapse
Phuqued@reddit
I reject the OP's quoted statement. an OS + Web Browser should NOT require 8GB of ram. As you point out, it's lazy software development that doesn't care about resource efficiency.
SAD-MAX-CZ@reddit
If i get slow computer, i slow down with it. If i get a crashtastic computer, i just do whatever over and over. I record it and if someone complains, i show them the proof. "You want more? Upgrade your shit!"
Nik_Tesla@reddit
Everyone in /r/sysadmin has to learn to speak in terms of money, management only understands money.
It's not too hard to get ChatGPT to do some estimating and calculations to show them that for the low cost of increasing RAM, employees will lose less time to a slow computer and therefore be more productive. Show them that the RAM upgrades will pay for themselves within X weeks/months.
secret_configuration@reddit
Yikes, 16GB minimum these days. 32GB for "Power Users".
asshole_magnate@reddit
I think I’m under 1.5 min cracking open a dell latitude, throwing in a stick and getting it closed back up.
Would have been nice if they already had 16 to begin with.
Does anyone really ever want to stop what they’re doing to play psychiatrist when a user gets annoyed enough to call about a slow laptop?
There’s cheap and then there’s bad outcomes-cheap.
Roland_Bodel_the_2nd@reddit
It really depends on the use case. We have a bunch of "instrument" computers that need to run one windows app to control something connected via USB. Win11 with 8GB is just good enough. Even running a web browser is a slog though, but again for those machines the user will have their own laptop with them or another faster computer on the same bench.
Fairchild110@reddit
I'm at the point where 32GB isn't enough between Microsoft's AI services and at least one good power BI report open in the editor.
rainer_d@reddit
It‘s OK. For a Linux or BSD server without a GUI and not much to do like a website with little traffic or a DNS cache.
Can your users do their jobs with lynx/w3m and vim?
landob@reddit
Easy. I just swap their computer to a 8GB model.
Eventually they will understand.
Dru2021@reddit
Did the original post get removed? I asked if the post was made by senior management 😂
SenikaiSlay@reddit
I fought this fight at my current org. Malicious Compliance. Everyone gets 8gb, then you wait..lessons will be learned and suddenly 8gb isn't enough when the ceo says so.
voiping@reddit
r/ShittySysadmin would be the place for your satire.
Skylis@reddit
The best part is the guy used the exact same request. It didn't even need to be reworded 🤣
Ayy4K@reddit (OP)
You’re probably right. Shouldn’t have posted it here. Was hoping lingering management would see
Stosstrupphase@reddit
Manager here: have you considered upgrading the RAM on those machine?
Lower_Fan@reddit
It was already posted there btw
kadechodimtadebijem@reddit
8GB could be enough. for examle my thinkpad x280 without any dlp or security tools. used just as thin client, VPN client and RDP to my workstation. it was dirty cheap, 119euros as refurb in 2021.
fusiturns@reddit
If your replacing systems just because of 8GB then I see a point if money is tight. Slapping an extra 8GB stick for $30 that's a face palm.
BitingChaos@reddit
Same shit, different day.
A bit before Vista launched, higher-ups decided to order all new laptops.
The ordered all the laptops with the base memory configuration of just 256 MB.
Their reasoning: Windows XP's minimum requirement was only 64 MB RAM, so why pay for extra RAM?
Well, sure, a clean boot of a clean install of XP can fit into 64 MB... but what about when you want to run Office, anti-virus, IE/Firefox, Acrobat, etc.??
This was a time where basically you probably wanted 1GB+ to comfortably use a computer. So, naturally, they all ran like shit.
It was a "click the Outlook icon and then go outside to take a cigarette break while waiting for it to load" situation for a LOT of people with their "new" computers.
And now today:
Windows 11 only has a requirement of 4 GB, so why pay for more RAM?
DisastrousAd2335@reddit
Male sure the people who made that rule get the firstnones to confim usability. They will change their minds quickly. Also make sure they only get i3 CPUs..
bloodguard@reddit
I could kind of understand it back in ye olden times when RAM was crazy expensive but these days it's insane not start at at least 16GB. I think they start at 32 for desktops and laptops where I work.
screwdriverfan@reddit
Devils advocate here: 8gb ram is still enough for average, non-corpo use for basic things (web browser, movies, office,...). While I do agree 16gb should be the minimum on new builds (even 32, depending on the use case), 8gb is still fine.
I built a system for my parents in 2021 (I think, maybe 2020) with ryzen 3 4350g pro (mini pc) and 8gb of ram (part of the reason I went for only 8gb at the time was prices). Machine has been working perfectly since the day I assembled it. Chrome is open 24/7 with like 8 tabs (web browsing is what the machine is used for 99.9% of the time).
SillyAmericanKniggit@reddit
Eight gigs is ridiculous. Hell, I successfully argued for a minimum of 32 for the users I support when the rest of the company was still standardizing on 16.
Flying-T@reddit
I'am going against everyone here, but I do have to wonder what people are doing to their windows machines that require 32GB RAM as a baseline.
We still have a large fleet of 4GB devices in use lol
Yes, thats not enough, but honestly, not the end of the world. We are just upgrading them to 8GB after reinstalling with Windows 11 and they run fine. Fully updated, debloated and ready for use they sit at \~3,5G used in idle at the desktop. Just checked on a user with some Firefox tabs, our softphone+chat tool, Outlook, and their day-to-day software open at the same time and they sit an 7GB used.
New machines get specced with 16GB regardless, but I dont unterstand whats the fuzz about here.
NerdyMSPguy@reddit
You have people that have workflows that have them running with multiple tabs in Chrome, Teams, Outlook, a couple Word documents. Most people probably don't require 32GB but you are going to start seeing a lot of read/writing to disk if you only have 8GB. It is not unusual for me to have at least one browser tab that is using at least 1GB of memory. Even a relatively basic webpage will be using hundreds of megabytes of memory. Many orgs have a bunch of security software that eats up multiple gigabytes of memory as well.
In organizations where everyone's time is worth a lot it is easier to just give everybody 32GB and focus your time on problems that don't have such easy solutions.
AbsolutelyClam@reddit
We were stuck running 2 vcore / 4GB of RAM VDI systems until more recently than I’d like to recount, way too many issues with systems being (clearly) more sluggish than they should be. We jumped to 8 and it’s a lot closer to tolerable but there’s a lot of compromises to even drop the footprint that far
Physical machines are all 16GB minimum, can’t imagine life any other way
T0psp1n@reddit
I redirect any complaints about performance to management and remind them that it's what I was talking about when I suggested proper hardware.
...until I'm fired.
PaulRicoeurJr@reddit
Have you even tried to download more RAM?
meeu@reddit
Our MSP recreated a vdi desktop pool on a new whiz-bang ucs cluster and he changed it from 16GB to 8GB. He mentioned it when handing over saying, "geez those desktops were set to 16GB!! I changed them to 8." When he handed over. I changed them back to 16 and told him 8 was basically unusable. A couple months later we ended up bumping to 24GB.
taker223@reddit
Convince them to migrate to Oracle 26ai free! They will have terrific 6gb to spare!
YtnucMuch@reddit
This makes me laugh because I just helped my mother-in-law get a new laptop... she didn't want to get a new one. Her current laptop had 4GB of RAM and she barely used it because "its slow but it does what I need it to" and I explained to her that it literally is struggling to even operate, let along any additional programs she needs to run.
Thin_Comfortable_824@reddit
I’ve been running 8GB on my device for the last 4 years and it’s been mostly fine. Obviously if it’s possible, get 16GB while you’re upgrading.
uptimefordays@reddit
If you want to justify better hardware, you need data. What percentage of your systems are swapping? For how long? Can you estimate the additional storage wear or reduction in lifetime that swapping could cause? Have you ballparked productivity loss due to swapping systems?
If all you’ve done is look at task manager and gone “uh oh using 70% or RAM!” You have no way of knowing if 8Gib is insufficient.
Cashflowz9@reddit
Educate them with your recommendation in writing and if they go against it then just get 8 GB of RAM and if shit runs slow oh well
EddieTech2000@reddit
When issue come up just show them the invoice of the purchase of 8gb of ram and tell them that’s the issue lol
jooooooohn@reddit
8GB is enough for a raspberry pi and not much else. A headless web server for <100 connections a day maybe? Linux with no gui?
stabb23@reddit
Nowdays with O365 and Teams, 16GB is barely enough.....we've moved to 32GB for most devices now. Public University environment.
nealfive@reddit
Make sure all management and C suite has 8gb machines lol see how long it lasts before they complain lol
jsand2@reddit
I would laugh in their face.
16gb minimum with 32gb for power users.
I am not a magician, I am not doing magic tricks. And I am not God, I wont be creating miracles.
If they dont value my opinion, I would find a company who did. I dont need to be miserable working for ignorant employers like that.
Kaminaaaaa@reddit
Assuming the RAM isn't soldered to the motherboard, it's also pretty easy to upgrade the RAM, and like 1/10th the cost of replacing the full machine. Feels like a pretty easy middle-of-the-road solution that doesn't include throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Kleptos18@reddit
the soldering ram shit is so annoying.
clbw@reddit
Crack me up workstation that had 256 MB of RAM because it should’ve had 512 MB
The_Wkwied@reddit
I explain it to them in terms that aren't computer.
RAM is your desk space. 60 years ago in school, you had maybe one book and one notebook and it all sat well on your school desk. When you first got a job, you had a few books and binders and a slightly bigger desk. Now, Mr. Micro Soft insists on you having thirty binders and several dozen books, and you need a bigger desk. You could do this on a smaller desk, but you'll need to spend too much time walking to the filing cabinet because all of Mr Soft's books say 'continue on page xxx volume yyy'
More ram is a bigger desk. Sure, you may not need a bigger desk right now, but chances of you needing a bigger desk 6 months to a year from now are rather high.
Loudergood@reddit
Yup, hard drive is their filing cabinet and CPU cache is what you can hold in your hands.
Really easy to explain swapping this way.
expiro@reddit
Apparently they don‘t use Chrome… otherwise they wouldn‘t tell such bullshit :))
Choice_Reindeer7759@reddit
I feel your pain so much as a K-12 Tech
Appropriate-Border-8@reddit
There are some things you can do to improve performance on 8 GB machines running Windows 10.
-Remove the OneDrive app and use Office 365 web to get to OneDrive.
-Remove Teams and use Office 365 web to get to Teams.
-Disable indexing on Drive C: and later enable it only on your documents and downloads folders.
-etc, etc...
Naznarreb@reddit
Give them 8gb of RAM and see how they rate the performance.
ORA2J@reddit
Sometimes i wonder how we ended up in a place where 8 gigs of rams isn't enough for the most basic computer tasks.
Like, i still remember when i had a 4gig machine that was running smoothly, and on Windows 10.
abramN@reddit
sometimes you wait until some software comes out that requires more ram, so people have to be upgraded. There's also Gartner and other consultants that provide best practices and recommendations. There's also benchmarking, which shows the tools that people run on a regular basis and their memory footprint. We have devs using Mulesoft and Visual Studio and then one-off containers - they have 32 gigs and they still need to shut down apps to prevent them from getting too sluggish. Look at the software recommendations too - more and more they're coming out with 16gb+
Diligent_Sundae7209@reddit
It's easy. Recommend. Rejected? Go with the flow and don't beat yourself over it. Just say management has decided against it and move on.
forceofslugyuk@reddit
I also make sure to let the client know, exactly why/who made the call so they know not to blame me. And if they wish to speak to my manager about it, or the director... or C-suite... they are more than welcome. I don't control the purse strings.
bitslammer@reddit
Exactly. Every ticket about slowness or poor performance should include the note: "This is expected behavior due to limitations of the approved hardware standard."
forceofslugyuk@reddit
Copy and pasted every single time. Oh your machine is slow? Wish I could help... but you know... policy
sauriasancti@reddit
Yep. Dont care more than management unless they pay you to. Document for CYA and let them sleep in the bed they made.
EstoyTristeSiempre@reddit
Pretty much, document everything to CYA and move on.
TimePlankton3171@reddit
You install Puppy Linux in their devices, and tell them this is the consequence. They'll quickly give in.
EldorTheHero@reddit
Easy. With Translation to Money:
System with 8GB takes X amount of seconds longer than a System with 16 GB with typical Tasks.
Multiply that with the Number of People. Then Multiply that by X hours, then days and you know how much more expensive this System will be for the company.
Now show how long the more expensive System needs to break even. Boom! Now you have an easy to understand Situation for your management without techno talk.
aprimeproblem@reddit
That’s funny, my machine has 6 and it’s more than enough to do everything I need to do. Are you guys still running Windows? /s
Jenghrick@reddit
16 isn't even enough. 32 should be standard.
tshizdude@reddit
32GB minimum for ALL PC's now. Fight me.
sharpied79@reddit
Are you the tech mentioned in this post? 😉
https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/s/aanaO0HgUr
jtuckbo@reddit
Golden
ReptilianLaserbeam@reddit
For a raspberry pi maybe. Jokes aside, our standard now is 32 GB for EVERYONE. It’s crazy they are even considering that. Give management laptops with 8GB for a month and ask them again if they think that’s enough
Ayy4K@reddit (OP)
Guys this is a satirical post after- I do not face this issue as the buying decision for laptops in my environment is with myself.
I was responding to this post
Mr_Mumbercycle@reddit
I was wondering if no one had seen that post. Lol
At least the OP was getting roasted in that thread. I wonder if they were shocked into reality, or just rage quit and continue to think the new employee is the problem.
h8mac4life@reddit
Once Apple put 16gb in the base model you know it’s time…
serverhorror@reddit
You make them lead by example
Feeling-Aardvark8007@reddit
Perhaps it's because I worked in finance before moving over to IT, but I always find I win with a financial argument.
Case in point, when I started in my current employer (engineering - CAD heavy) as their only IT person, they were still rocking old workstations with 8GB RAM. Big new project had just started and the engineers were grumbling about computers being slow, so I told management they needed to buy new hardware.
All was well up to the order was about to be placed, at which point I was called aside by one of the owners and asked "Do we really need to be spending this much on computers?"
My answer?
"Depends on how much you want to pay your engineers to watch a wee wheel spin"
Order was placed, and I've never been challenged on a hardware spec since...
largos7289@reddit
LOL Saw it...
bindermichi@reddit
Simply upgrade management to a computer with 8GB of memory and see what happens
pw1111@reddit
You could always get a little bit life out of a system with 8GB memory by tweaking the virtual memory. Set the page min and max size to 16384MB. At least that way the page file won't be expanding and contracting saving some I/O.
halxp01@reddit
Since I put 32gb in my all systems at work the random calls have stopped tremendously.
notHooptieJ@reddit
You give them the shittiest machines serrupticiously.
then when they complain, you pull up the stats and show them.
they want only 8gb, this is the price.
coscib@reddit
just a suggestion, but limit the ram in your windows settings to 4-6gb in the management pcs and wait a couple of weeks to make them understand that "8gb" are not enough
Dereksversion@reddit
I would recommend planning your next career move.
A management that dictates IT needs to the IT department rather than using their department as the advisor and then tempering spending from there is a problem.
I know the IT space is a wasteland for jobs right now. So take my advice with a grain of salt,
but if you arent the leader A-personality type who dresses above your station and takes ownership of the things around you then upper management will not budge their opinion.
If you like where you are and still want to be able to make an impact, You need to rise above being an employee and acting as if you're just an employee for stubborn management to take notice and regard your opinions.
In my early career I struggled a lot to make justifications I knew in my heart were the right move. I was a young tech. Dressed a bit messy and wasnt thinking of being a manager or director down the line, so I acted like just an employee. I acted just like other people do. Them against us, keep your head down and hide from the execs if possible. Etc.
Once I learned that to get a response at all you need clear figures, $spent for $saved, time saved. Efficiency gained. Alternatives to offset the cost. We can buy a laptop with 8gb and the ips screen but if we drop to an LCD panel model with 16gb ram we gain the performance but retain the same pricing. ETC.
AND coupled that with owning my space. Im a tech but im watching and absorbing the next person above me and what they have and have on the go, and the same with the person below me.
Im actively managing situations without asking for assistance. And when I do ask for assistance its with information I was attempting to peice together myself and am able to springboard off of instead of just passing off the task.
Then management began to see me differently. "He isn't just rambling through small talk and personal preferences, he's really done the analysis"
If you are tech level staff and not part of the IT steering committees or ops meetings or change management team then you need to work on some allies in those areas to help you get those analysis into a proper forum where it can't be steamrolled like an email can.
But mostly. If management sees you as an authority in your space, regardless of your job title they will respect your opinions.
It doesn't take real decision making authority in your job role. Its just about their perception of you and your ownership of your space.
tsaico@reddit
“I JUST need the internet…”. As if the last 5 years hasn’t shown you the internet is A LOT.
jpStormcrow@reddit
Give them 8GB of RAM
LastTechStanding@reddit
This is the only logical choice. Then tell them that you don’t want to hear them say“things are slow”
SpecialRespect7235@reddit
Cut their desks in half at night and suggest that they have plenty of room with just half a desk. Besides, it saves the company desk money because now you have twice as many desks for the same amount of money.
fuzzydice_82@reddit
MS Defender scans on their machines - all day, every day.
BigLadTing@reddit
This is true. Full scans on Windows eat through so much.
CompWizrd@reddit
Ram is so cheap we put 32GB in most systems, 2 x16GB so I don't have to deal with getting 4xwhatever working 5 years from now. Adds about $40 to go from 16GB to 32GB.
winaje@reddit
Make sure that the person who is the roadblock only has 8GB RAM. Let them suffer for a while. Then put 8GB more in and see if they enjoy the benefits. “That’s why we need 16”. Oh, you’re still not sure? Ok I’ll just remove the extra 8 I put in….
nixerx@reddit
Make sure they all have 8gb of ram on their systems and see how the function
inteller@reddit
I cant even get by with 16GB systems in my environment with all the security knobs turned up to 11. I thought I'd be able to stretch 16GB systems another 2 years but thats not the case
VariousProfit3230@reddit
We just decided to move new devices to 32GB of ram. Ram is relatively cheap.
devonnull@reddit
Teams on 8GB sucks.
andocromn@reddit
Tell them it's not, and sit there leaving the room as quickly as an 8gb machine runs.
tapwater86@reddit
If my phone has more RAM than my work computer, that’s a problem.
IID10TError@reddit
Ask them to pack two weeks worth of clothes into a small carry-on bag. Then they'll understand what it's like.
InevitableOk5017@reddit
It depends on the situation really.
not-at-all-unique@reddit
I guess it depends. As was pointed out a lot in that thread that you are attempting to lampoon, what system?
Mac OS, no problem. Linux, most flavours, no problem. Windows 11, provide minimum specs to management and tell them, “well, that’s how it is.)
Even with windows 11, that might be just enough, depending on the workload. - work computers are not for games, or providing back ground noise with Spotify, or hundreds of YouTube tabs open in the browser of your choice.
In any case, the member of staff may care as much as they like, but whilst they don’t have budget, they should not be promising new machines.
Also, I read that thread as though the techs answer to everything was to re-image/replace from stock, not that they were completing an ad-hoc hardware refresh project.
ExceptionEX@reddit
Honestly, what is the debate, finding reliable hardware that is being sold with 8 gigs of ram at this point is difficult, you are wasting more effort finding bottle of the barrel hardware with that little ram.
If it has 8gigs you can bet the rest of it is going to be bare minimum.
Aside note, I'm always blown away how microsoft can suggest that 4gigs of ram is considered minimum (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications)
drfusterenstein@reddit
Depends on the use cases and programs being used.
8GB is a minimum for anything on the desktop side for general use. It's fine for web browsing but likewise if users are running other things then quite correctly more is needed.
The main thing is having an SSD as that makes start up and opening programs much quicker.
xixi2@reddit
Management doesn't matter... I can open my laptop and add more ram right?
volcanforce1@reddit
You tell them if they can decide how much ram is needed you can decide on their marketing budget. Each help move the business along in an efficient manner
sheikhyerbouti@reddit
Whenever any of my clients complain about the system specs (that were approved by management with little-to-no experience using computers), I tell them that their VP needs to be the one complaining to the CFO, because that's the only way it will get changed.
wrt-wtf-@reddit
It’s a management issue on all levels.
Why would anyone care about a user getting an upgrade in order to become more productive?
You can do a lot to a computer to get it stable and reasonably operational at 8GB, but it’s not going to be able to do a lot. This 100% depends on the use case - but 8GB does make things extremely unlikely for even the current msoffice suite.
The complaint, the tech, and the complainer need to have this come to a head. If the tech is good, they’ll hold their own and be able to prove (through multiple examples) to the exec level that this is a need for the business.
After that, the complainer has no power and the business gets what it needs to be more productive, maybe in a planned manner to work in with budgets, as opposed to adhoc - which I would hazard is the complainers biggest issue. Inadequate budgetary strategies and IT cost recovery mechanisms.
Ultimately, many of us have been there, have had to navigate this path, and helped businesses change approach to managing the IT focus and budget strategies.
It’s a management issue.
BigLadTing@reddit
I'm sure i heard someone say 32GB is now the new norm for general staff. Starting to believe it honestly after our surface laptops have been hitting high 70% with just chrome and excel open.
jazxxl@reddit
We have moved to 24GB / 32GB configs. 8GB. Is pretty much a PC at idle with all of our tools installed.
Substantial-Fruit447@reddit
We have servers still running with 8GB RAM lmao
crimesonclaw@reddit
… we went with 32GB systems.
c_pardue@reddit
try working in a healthcare. they treat workstations like patients: "keep them living well beyond their normal expiration dates"
DaemosDaen@reddit
Quite easily actually. I have about 50 system around with 8GB RAM. They are not for developers, Finance or anything like that. Just people who need to check email, get on ADP check our internal news page and then get on with their day. They MIGHT have a need to get into JMS, Fleet Maintenance or some other department specific application. Office or Acrobat reader has never really been an issue. We are talking Police Officers, Road Workers, Firefighters and the like.
Now, keep in mind I do clean up systems when Microsoft comes out with more bullshit like CoPilot, xBox 'stuff' and other addons that our environments do not need, and I enforce Edge as the initial browser. People are informed that we will not troubleshoot slow Chrome issues when they request it. We strictly enforce weekly reboots and the first thing we do for speed issues is reboot the system.
Will these systems go away? Sure natural attrition will handle it eventually. But, it's all about managing expectations.
tamdor_clegane@reddit
Make sure their devices have 8gb RAM then track all tickets that resolve as memory/performance and produce a report with whatever emails you exchanged recommending more memory.
ersentenza@reddit
I was absolutely waiting for this post.
Main_Ambassador_4985@reddit
Make certain management teams only have 8 GB or RAM if they know what is needed.
forgotmapasswrd86@reddit
Is 8gb really not enough for basic office stuff or is this one of those "Trust me im a professional" circlejerks?
extraspectre@reddit
You should start paying attention to your resource usage. This is not something you need someone else to explain to you.
forgotmapasswrd86@reddit
Oh I have more than 8gb because I and rest of IT team need it. As for the general staff we support....we rarely have performance issues unless its a really old machine. We'll bump it up for csuite/finance/hr but thats about it.
Subnetwork@reddit
I mean OP didn’t even explain it himself.
Impressive-Bag-384@reddit
omg, in the past when I worked places which tried to save little bits of money like that I just bought used ram on ebay and snapped it in myself - good use of $30...
Pretend-Newspaper-86@reddit
tell them to buy macbooks then 8gb on macs are 16gb on windows apple said so themselves
Entegy@reddit
Even Apple finally moved to 16GB base.
Also that quote will never not be funny as trying to do a Jobsian RDF. I lived through the Lion era Apple, your memory management is so shit you had to come up with entire frameworks to automatically terminate apps.
Padgriffin@reddit
Apple Silicon is impressive though, I have a base M2 Air as a personal machine and I've never noticed the RAM issues.
Our management wanted us to order a sales rep 32GB RAM on a Mac, we ended up begrudgingly ordering a 24GB MBA lmfao
Entegy@reddit
24 is fine. 8 is not. People using Apple Silicon Macs with only 8GB of RAM were complaining about performance issues.
Apple isn't fucking magic, like I said their memory management is so shit they had to make frameworks to automatically terminate apps. They've constantly underspecced memory so RAM was an easy yet expensive upsell. At least for a Mac a RAM upgrade was possible. People have been complaining since the dawn of the iPhone how memory starved it was by noting how easy Safari lost an active tab. The one good thing about Apple Intelligence is that it forced a significant RAM upgrade for the iPhone.
I do prefer iPhone over Android but I'm not going to be an Apple fanboy over their failings.
Catchy_Username1@reddit
I know it's sarcasm but God forbid the end user has more than one Chrome tab open. I was in someone's computer the other day where Chrome gave up and started numbering the tabs on the side. I introduced that person to bookmarks
wh0-0man@reddit
if i was handed 8gb device i'd straight up ask for another while considering leaving because IT is clearly incompetent. i'm buying for my users 32 since last year and saving myself time and work in upcoming years..
ExtremeCarpenter2280@reddit
We have a lot of 8gig machines on windows 11 with huge uses of O365 suite. No complain from them. 32 gig is mental.
H0verb0vver@reddit
What "huge uses"? Probably web only. And the fact that they don't complain doesn't mean it's good.
anaemic@reddit
Yeah, I don't complain to IT because they don't do anything other than close your ticket.
Doesn't mean the PC's aren’t dreadful.
Bane8080@reddit
The owner of our company insists on 64Gigs minimum. For every device.
cccanterbury@reddit
can I come work there?
Massive-Rate-2011@reddit
My corp laptop has nvme and 32gigs, as well as thunderbolt 4 and a serial DB9.
Love the fucker
cccanterbury@reddit
thunderbolt 4 is such a luxury where I'm at. not allowed to upgrade that the mb. jelly
wh0-0man@reddit
what AV/endpoint software do you run? 16 is barely enough for larger powerpoint presentations these days.. if they don't complain they're probably afraid or think it's normal to wait minutes..
ExtremeCarpenter2280@reddit
Cybereason New Teams, Outlook, Excel. Waiting minutes are you serious?
Kyla_3049@reddit
That's weird. They're probably always complaining about the "Wi-Fi" when their PCs are the issue.
Gadgetman_1@reddit
Yeah. We also have a lot of 8GB machines. It really helps that we're not using the bloated images they came with, though.
Ordinary-Fish-9791@reddit
Lol must be great to have such gullible users. We give people 16gb where i'm at and theres still some complaints about performance. We even upgraded a few users to 32-64gb of ram.
TheThiefMaster@reddit
My WFH laptop that exists solely to run a browser and connect to Teams and RDP is using 10 GB/16GB right now.
8 GB is not enough. Those systems will be slow and the users will complain to each other about it but not bring it to IT because it's not an "issue".
You really need some monitoring on amount of RAM/pagefile usage.
itskdog@reddit
How many additional applications are used on those 8GB systems? Some of our older laptops that we haven't upgraded yet have had more performance issue reports since our update to Windows 11, but we also have student monitoring software and electronic flipcharts in addition to Office, Edge, OneDrive, and CDM.
Informal-Advisor-948@reddit
I've been doing the same. It's the only way I can ensure we don't get performance issue related complaints.
Centimane@reddit
You'll still get them.
Fewer for sure but there will always be apps not optimized for shit
Informal-Advisor-948@reddit
True, but we only have a handful of users that actively utilize different apps. The rest are basic bettys that just want 30 chrome tabs open simultaneously, lol.
Padgriffin@reddit
We had the opposite problem. Management wanted 32GB. On a MacBook Air. For a sales rep.
We compromised on 24GB.
DungeonAnarchist@reddit
You go somewhere with better management.
davy_crockett_slayer@reddit
We give out 32GB ram laptops. 8GB is insane.
IAmSnort@reddit
/r/shittysysadmin exists for this purpose
Old-Bag2085@reddit
Give the execs laptops with 8gb of RAM and they'll buy the 16 soon enough
Sharpymarkr@reddit
Sounds like we need a sysadmim circlejerk sub. r/askashittysysadmin
sysadmin_dot_py@reddit
Already have one /r/ShittySysadmin
Sharpymarkr@reddit
Fantastic! Thank you :)
rheureddit@reddit
shittysysadmin is already a circle jerk, is it not?
Pup5432@reddit
I’m issued 2 laptops for work. A 16gb 8th ultrabook and a 32gb 12th gen brick (weighs 8 pounds without the power brick). The ultra book is almost painful to use but if I’m going to be working in racks I’m not hauling around an 8 pound laptop but the 16gb is really starting to show its age with just securecrt and a few chrome tabs running. I’m firmly in the camp IT shouldn’t be issued even 16gb anymore, 32gb isn’t much more and is so much better.
hlloyge@reddit
What are you doing to eat all that RAM, then? I have no problems with few terminal and remote desktop windows and a browser on 8 GB system. With Windows 11.
Pup5432@reddit
The security package deployed across the enterprise chews up the ram lol.
Bernie4Life420@reddit
Tell them you are their expert.
Windows95GOAT@reddit
In a real world scenario i would simply explain that slower computers mean lost time=proffit. Usually was enough.
Our aim is atleast 16GB and we only buy systems (when we can) with expansion capability.
3576742@reddit
Working in IT I expect my device to be fully loaded with RAM and my last 3 employers have obliged my demands and had it ready to go on start day, more RAM = less waiting for tabs to load etc, if I can be signed into everything and open all at once, I unlock my PC at the start of the day and start work like I never went home.
Clients & users should have an i5 / Ryzen5 and 16GB 512GB SSD min if their work involves more than 2 cloud apps & M$ suite with Sharepoint & onedrive syncing to it and also expect to get productive use out of the hardware for the warranty period of 3 years. If they're any kind of 'power user' 32GB min / workstation grade laptop, for Photoshop / Fusion / Autocad 64GB min & discrete graphics card in a tower preferred.
If a custom rejects the recommended specs and opts to cheap out the forfeit the rights to complain about performance, I will flat out tell them, this option you have selected is not optimal and you will be complaining about it being slow well ahead of the warranty expiration, remedies at that time will be the possible upgrades costing more than the difference now, less disruption to business operation to just equip your staff with the correct tools to get their work done.
If a unit is out of warranty and support time is approaching the current value of the machine we quote replace it and most clients don't even hesitate to approve. The user is happy to know a replacement is on the way and they stop bitching about whatever caused the ticket, management is happy support costs are low and their workforce is working on decent equipment instead equipment past it's corporate lifetime and ready for e-waste / recycling with non-profits.
To answer the OP, businesses understand money and returns, if you can make a case that it will allow people to be MEASUREABLY more productive in a 'trial' to prove that point, even if it's just on a user complaint basis it can help shut up users genuinely held back from completing any amount of work it's likely worth it. There would only be a few political / budgetary / 'you're not paid to think/dismissive management/wrong person suggesting it' situations as reasons not to adopt it. If none of that convinces them, nothing will.
HappyDadOfFourJesus@reddit
This is not a technical issue. Management has not been educated on the quantifiable dollar amount of lost employee productivity because of waiting on slow technology.
CopiousCool@reddit
Cost the consequences for them, produce a quote with and without the extra ram as well as the lost ours and money spend on new modules after purchase. Unfortunately it's the only language they understand but it will also leave you with documentation to prove you preempted this and any complaints from or to higher ups can be directed his way
Moontoya@reddit
Give it a fiscal return
Put it in profit number rather than cost
8-16gb - saves 5 manpower hours per week per user upgraded , at an average wage of $25 (pnooma)that's a return of $125 per week per user over a cost of $100 as the user isn't sat idle waiting. 32gb saves 8-10 manpower hours so 200-250 per week Vs $150 costing. Upgrading finance alone recovers 140 manpower hours per week etc etc
CaseClosedEmail@reddit
Can confirm this happened. I am the technician in question
RorymonEUC@reddit
Screenshot of a Task Manager with Teams, OneDrive, Outlook and Edge (with multiple tabs open) running then explain those are just the apps most people leave open, how much is left for the other business critical applications to run optimally?
I wouldn't tell them this part but a slight caveat, you can get 16GB or memory and still have a crappy experience. Unfortunately, there are vendors who produce crap that will simply take as much Memory as offered. Can see that with some services that reserve a certain amount or percentage of Memory regardless of how much Memory there is. It sucks.
mini4x@reddit
I have an old surface with 4 gb RAM and it works fine.
It really depends on your use case, and well with things liek prefetch and such modern OS's will run at 80% full no matter how much RAM you toss in.
thewarring@reddit
Swap their system out for something with 8 gigs and wait. Then get approval for 16 gig systems.
theservman@reddit
In my day we measured RAM in k!
ArtisticLayer1972@reddit
Get them what they want
ACIDcuz@reddit
Just tell your users to download more ram
BetamaxTheory@reddit
Does everyone have 8GB or are the VIPs running with more? If so, that may be masking the extent of the performance issues.
Opening_Moment4145@reddit
Just tell them. And then when you start getting complaints, tell them again.
tsarmaximus@reddit
Time = money, more RAM = less time stuck with sluggish devices = more money
gaysaucemage@reddit
8GB still barely works but struggles with basic Office software like Outlook, Excel, and a browser open at the same time on Windows 11.
We have a lot of old computers with 8, but all the replacements we’re buying are 16 for standard users, and more for those with a heavier workload.
Evan_Stuckey@reddit
Windows 10 was ‘ok’ for light users with 8gb, but windows 11 was not workable even for light usage, 16gb works fine, and I think really will work fine for all regular users for the lifetime of systems and win11. Sure if you get a good price for 32gb or your workload demands it then do it.
Thing is 16gb has been the kind of standard for 5+ years, the only place we saw 8gb was VDI’s so the upgrade to 16gb was simple.
TuxAndrew@reddit
Just need larger paging files mate, it'll run.....
--Sarcasm
TheGreatAutismo__@reddit
I fart quietly and repeatedly to psychologically gas light them into believing 8GB is associated with pain until they naturally steer towards my sentiment.
spyingwind@reddit
Back in the day the easiest and cheapest upgrade to speed up a computer was to add/upgrade the RAM. The next cheapest upgrade was moving from HDD to SSD.
fastpacedsnarf@reddit
We give out 8gb MB air m3 chip now (cheapest mac, full jamf management) the m1 and m2s from years past are looking like they will last 4-5 years, 10 total “performance” related tickets on 25 devices since 2022.
fastpacedsnarf@reddit
Also worth considering that people like us are part of the problem, if an executives kid tells them 8gb isn’t enough, confirmation bias sets in, so we started printing RAM as r_V111 (kind of roman numerals) as the first 6 of the inventory control SN.
Not printing ram on the inventory control tag limited complaints/issues..
gspitzner@reddit
With facts based on requirements or thresholds that are met.
LickingLieutenant@reddit
Don't make it your problem. They order, you put in place. Document what's being requested and file it away.
I have learned soon enough not to fight upstairs, shit rolls down anyway, and even while having the power to stop the business, you don't have any influence whaatsoever
frogmicky@reddit
That's them just being cheap unfortunately companies are like that and it's not your fault for trying to recommend what you think is best.
JustSomeGuyFromIT@reddit
But be nice to dictate what's good when not concerned. Swap their great PC with an average worker PC and let them see what only 8GB of RAM does.
theoriginalzads@reddit
Give them 8GB systems and tell them to get back to you.
noosik@reddit
show them how much ram chrome is consuming, they are probably the kind of management who have a wall of open tabs and cry if you close one.
iamtechspence@reddit
Tell them to open chrome then show them the performance tab of task manager
BigChubs1@reddit
Let me know how you can convince them. Mine says cost. I said dumb ass, it comes out of there budget not ours.
ryalln@reddit
Find one of your pieces of software that has a minimum requirement of 16/32gb RAM. Also if you get board work out the cost to buy/install ram vs time saved.