New Zealand oceans warming 34% faster than global average, putting homes and industry at risk, report finds
Posted by IntrepidRatio7473@reddit | collapse | View on Reddit | 75 comments
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
NZ being the much touted great place to weather the coming changes.
Round_Medium_814@reddit
It has the advantage of not being dense in population. I hear billionaires don't like to be cannibalized, but we don't hang out much. It is also more difficult to run to, need ships or planes. Most people will not have access to those when the end is nigh.
quietly_observ_ing@reddit
And how does such a secluded population guarantee access to what will definitely need to be imported.? No matter how much money you have now it likely won’t matter when you’re isolated in New Zealand and no ships are coming to rescue your needs.
phobisgracias@reddit
What do you classify as needing to be imported? Majority of our food is locally sourced with a large knowledge base and communities where sharing goods and services based on your skillset is very normal (farmer gives neighbour home kill, six months later neighbour fixes farmers truck). In terms of modern health resources we might be a bit fucked, but again have a population of people who already ignore blatant health issues.
Fuel imports? Sure, but I don’t think we’re a population that will fail without modern luxuries, half of the people I deal with for work on a daily basis live on dirt roads and are self sufficient driving vehicles from the 90s with 400k miles on the odometer.
Not disagreeing with you, but curious as to what you are thinking of here
quietly_observ_ing@reddit
I was talking about the bunker builders - I agree with most everything you discussed above. New Zealand is a beautiful bountiful place - but when it’s global bunker time it won’t be the safe haven even a billionaire can “buy”.
DifficultAd5896@reddit
4 seasons in one day.
Titrifle@reddit
Of course, it's far away, The coming changes could never reach there.
Edmee@reddit
I live in Tasmania. We are definitely noticing the climate changing here. I don't think any country or area will be spared. Although I may be able to ride it out a bit longer.
Slamtilt_Windmills@reddit
I thought it was obvious, but is nobody else expecting that there will be some uninhabitable areas that become habitable?warm will get warmer, cold will get colder, but at the boundary there will be some moderate climate
spareparticus@reddit
Why would the cold get colder?
Anastariana@reddit
Ice melting off of Greenland will dilute then shut down the Gulf Stream; it transports massive amounts of heat to the northern hemisphere. If it shuts down, cold air will spill further south across Europe while the equatorial ocean will heat up, causing Cat 6 hurricanes of death.
Timeon@reddit
The idea that Europe will cool has been debunked.
Anastariana@reddit
No. It's very much an active area of research.
ScragnarTorgosson@reddit
The boundary will have some big ass storms
chrismetalrock@reddit
at first, but after enough feedback loops kick in it will get hot enough everywhere to make life unfavorable.
Slamtilt_Windmills@reddit
Good news, qw dont need to worry about that
SidKafizz@reddit
Temperature wise, yes - some areas will become more habitable. But it will very likely take a long, long time for those areas to become viable for the agriculture needed to support human life at a reasonable level.
So don't get your hopes up.
Classic-Today-4367@reddit
I've seen a couple of news stories about people moving to Tassie in the past few weeks. I'm actually wondering if the state government is kinda nudging along that line of thought, in the hope that more people will move and invest there.
Edmee@reddit
Well, mainland Australia seems to have a lot more fires and floods, not to mention much higher temps. The heat was one of the main reasons I moved from Western Australia to Tassie.
Classic-Today-4367@reddit
I've recently moved back to Perth after living in Asia for over two decades. This year's (comparatively cold and wet) winter has been great, but I know that summer will kick in with a vengeance in a few weeks.
I would love to move to Tasmania, but my family are against it. I can't even persuade them that we should consider buying a small plot of land down on the south coast before people start moving down there en-masse.
Cultural-Answer-321@reddit
NO place on earth is going to be spared.
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
Middle Earth being exempt from reality and all.
boogerbrain57@reddit
I don't know, Middle Earth got the shit beaten out of it in the books, drowned and broken and wrecked by industry.
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
Even the Shire got pumped in the books hey.
boogerbrain57@reddit
So bad they had to scour it
cabeep@reddit
We are being prepped to become the US's bolt hole. They are trying to start local weapons manufacturing here, they already control our state security. Plenty of wealtht holiday homes on our rural hills for them to run to
Next step is digital control like the UK really
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
It's a pretty good plan as long as they can sort out the supply chain for essentials to be fair. Food security probably fine. Fuel for aircraft and ships long-term might be an issue? Pharmaceuticals?
cabeep@reddit
Good for them and horrific for everyone else.
Another grand thing our government is doing is opening up oil and gas exploration so they have that covered too
Anastariana@reddit
Fellow kiwi here; ain't going to do anything.
Methanex already looted 90% of our gas and paid bugger all tax on it due to tax evasion. Couple of supermajors already drilled all over the place for a decade and found basically no more viable oil or gas.
"Opening up" areas for drilling won't do shit; the oil companies already know there's none to be found.
cabeep@reddit
We have a huge decommissioned refinery, but that said they aren't looking to mine gas, they are looking to allow companies to try finding more. And maybe they will? Maybe they will frack the hell out of various areas.
Anastariana@reddit
That refinery is a rust heap, had almost no investment for 15 years and was allowed to fall apart. Also it wasn't set up to process the kind of oil that NZ produces, which is extremely light.
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
You don't have any refineries at the moment, but there's some in Aus.
KlicknKlack@reddit
Did you not just read the article or even the headline?!
Food security? On an island with rapid local ocean warming!!
The effects are more than just loss of food chain in the local ocean, you will have ecological knock on effects on the islands themselves. For one, expect higher humidity than already exists... High or lower rainfall by drastic amounts, higher heat index, etc.
Whatever they are farming or herding, it is not going to do well... Secure food my ass.
This just goes to show that billionaire's really are stupid and dont understand what's happening, they just do what sounds right
Anastariana@reddit
Kiwi here, we produce HUGE amounts of food, more than 7x what our population needs. We have some of the richest and most fertile soils in the world and we run on 85% renewable energy.
There are good reasons why the billionaires are building bunkers down here.
KlicknKlack@reddit
Fertile soils only get you so far when you have crop failure due to unseasonable weather shifts.
But yeah, I will safely say I do not know what sensitivities the crops your country grows has and how monoculture it might be.
Radiant-Visit1692@reddit
I read plenty. Short term there is plenty of sheep to eat, as I pointed out other concerns like fuel are going to become problems before food does. Australia only has 22 days worth of fuel if something disrupts supply chains from the big Asian refineries, NZ would be in a similar situation.
Classic-Today-4367@reddit
At least the local council wouldn't agree to Thiel's plans to build a bunker by Lake Wanaka though.
dopeonplastique@reddit
Nz was a bit chilly and cold prior to this, we’re just getting to that sub tropical warmth that everyone loves, with room to move into the tropical zone if things carry on. Obviously it comes with increased risks of cyclones, extreme rainfall and tropical diseases but overall it’d be survivable. Just don’t buy a place on the beach, head for the hills.
EnforcerGundam@reddit
lots of billionaires use it as a escape home, they have lot of mansions and bunkers there.
apparently it'll be safe in a war or something lol...
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AwayMix7947@reddit
Well, not "great place", there's no such thing on this planet anymore.
But considering the low population density, and the fact it being on the southern hemisphere with high latitude, it's still orders of magnitude better than most of the world.
ConfusedWhiteDragon@reddit
Kiwi here. Anyone hoping to flee to New Zealand to get away from the decisions of their terrible leaders should know that we've done our best to elect the same. Neoliberal trickle down economics pollute-while-you-can, austerity-for-thee-but-not-for-me billionaires. Honestly, any place people can get to, they'll get there first and ruin it.
PracticalTank5436@reddit
Slowly...Slowly....BANG! All of a sudden. Nature of feedback loops and exponetial change...Hang on to your hats, its going to get very scary indeed!
LovesFrenchLove_More@reddit
When the last fish has been caught, when the last river has been poisoned and the last animal been extinct, then the wealthy and powerful will have moved on to another planet to exploit while leaving the rest to die. If they weren’t too stupid, that is.
Cultural-Answer-321@reddit
Welp, so much for it being a safe haven.
faster-than-expected@reddit
Same for British Colombia.
imminentjogger5@reddit
Why is it warming faster than the average?
Willybrown93@reddit
Read the article ffs
MonoNoAware71@reddit
I can't find that particular info in the article.
Willybrown93@reddit
"New Zealand is bearing the brunt of these warming seas because of its position in the ocean, which makes it more vulnerable to atmospheric circulation and changes in ocean currents.
Between 1982 and 2023, New Zealand’s sea-surface temperatures in its four ocean regions increased, on average, 0.16 to 0.26 degrees Celsius per decade, and its rate of ocean warming outstripped global averages by 34%.
Coastal waters are also warming faster than the global average, it said."
MonoNoAware71@reddit
That's not the answer to the question, obviously. Why are the seas around New Zealand warming up faster than average?
faster-than-expected@reddit
polar amplification, which is caused by melting polar ice. Thi causes feedback loop.. Ice melts, temperatures warm, more ice melts...
Anastariana@reddit
Because the polar seas are warming faster than ones closer to the equator.
imminentjogger5@reddit
what article?
Willybrown93@reddit
The top of this thread is an article, you reach it by clicking either the grey guardian.com text, or clicking on the image.
False_Raven@reddit
Give him a break, he's only 3 years.
ttystikk@reddit
Because the Earth is warming substantially faster closer to the poles than near the equator. Not only has this been proven on land, but in the oceans as well. It's happening in the North Atlantic 'weakening AMOC', North Pacific 'the blob', and it's happening all around Antarctica.
retsam2554@reddit
This is terrifying. We're just watching it happen in real time.
Anonymous_exodus@reddit
War, famine, disease. This is why population is collapsing because people either comprehend or sense somehow the future isn't bright... so to speak..
Not counting unaffordability. We're living through the good ol days and not even aware of it because the flashing red signs
dopeonplastique@reddit
Deffo all makes for a milder winter yet still they persist with trying to ski in the north island, in summer hello wet and humid.
SimpleAsEndOf@reddit
Do not, my friend, become addicted to water. It will take hold of you and you will resent its absence.
Anonymous_exodus@reddit
Hi, I'm Bill and I'm a hydrohaulic...
Hi Bill!!...
CaptainFartyAss@reddit
I'm trying hard to feel bad for all those American billionaires who built bunkers there thinking NZ would be safe from the harm they knew damn well they where responsible for.
Frutbrute77@reddit
Well looks like they’ll be heading back to Zealand.
zedroj@reddit
so much for New Zealand bunker heaven
NyriasNeo@reddit
"New Zealand oceans warming 34% faster than global average, putting homes and industry at risk"
You do not have to warm 34% faster than global average to put homes and industry at risk. Warming at the same rate put homes and industry at risk already.
There is a reason why we put the word "global" in "global warming".
s0cks_nz@reddit
I'm near Auckland and just waiting for the day that a hurricane hits (we call them cyclones). Atm we tend to just get the tail end where it's already broken apart, if they make it this far, but with warming waters I'm sure that will change.
offgridstories@reddit
Laughs nervously in Great Barrier Island resident.
Eagleburgerite@reddit
I live down here right now and feel like I'm getting to see the country the way it will be remembered before it really gets bad.
Physical_Ad5702@reddit
“Of particular concern was a lack of understanding into how climate change, oceans, severe weather events and ecosystems interact, Collins said.”
“It is a bit like pulling a thread from a fabric and the whole thing can sort of fall apart – understanding those interactions is perhaps the biggest blind spot for us.”
…..really? You have blind spots left? Would have liked to get a little more insight as to what’s so confusing. Time is of the essence here….
lowrads@reddit
This is probably right up there with the spate of articles claiming that sea level is rising fastest at whatever location happens to be the center of that publication's subscribers.
Granted, there is a logical exception for parts of Japan, and anywhere else along an active tectonic margin.
StatementBot@reddit
The following submission statement was provided by /u/IntrepidRatio7473:
New Zealand’s seas are warming about 34 % faster than the global ocean average, placing huge pressure on coastal communities, marine ecosystems, and the nation’s infrastructure , a shift that brings greater risks of flooding, ecosystem collapse, and damage to homes and industry.
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/1o0zvb8/new_zealand_oceans_warming_34_faster_than_global/nid4jhn/
Slamtilt_Windmills@reddit
IntrepidRatio7473@reddit (OP)
New Zealand’s seas are warming about 34 % faster than the global ocean average, placing huge pressure on coastal communities, marine ecosystems, and the nation’s infrastructure , a shift that brings greater risks of flooding, ecosystem collapse, and damage to homes and industry.