A good reminder to watch your altitude if you’re VFR near bravo airspace
Posted by wolfstore@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 68 comments
I fly around CLT almost every day for work. Today, I heard on frequency not once but TWICE a VFR aircraft busted the bravo at CLT because they weren’t paying attention to their altitude. Just a good reminder to plan accordingly and to watch your altitude if you plan on flying around bravo airspace. Remember, that a bravo clearance is required to enter bravo airspace. So simply making contact with ATC is not sufficient to enter. You need to hear that you’re cleared into the bravo airspace. Fly safe friends!
Former_Farm_3618@reddit
I’ve heard staying 500’ above the top and at least 500 below the bottom shelf is a great idea too. What has everyone else been taught?
Reason is, the airliners are often right at the shelf altitudes. Wake turbulence is a real thing if you’re below them.. and being right at their altitude, well, that’s not a great idea either. Again, what’s everyone else’s best practice.? Are you a 5,999’ under the 6000 shelf type of guy?
Kseries2497@reddit
If the bravo floor is 5000, you had better believe I am running jets at 5000. If you and your 1968 Shithawk want to be a 4,900 when a 787 goes by, that's between you and St. Peter.
To me it's just incredibly poor SA. You know the bravo is there, so surely you understand that there's a busy airport nearby. Therefore, there's high volume jet traffic around, flying at low altitude and high speeds. But apparently some people don't grasp the concept. Give the bravo a 500' buffer, if not 1000'.
Former_Farm_3618@reddit
Yup. This is what pilots don’t typically think of. There’s a good reason those shelf’s are there.
DankVectorz@reddit
The people who think 100’ below/above are the bane of my existence and it’s really hard not to vector 777 right over them.
throfak@reddit
😂😂😂
Former_Farm_3618@reddit
Totally. I generally don’t cause I’m worried the carrier would get a TCAS. It’s usually busy enough I don’t wanna deal with that and getting them out of position or cause a secondary TCAS. Plus if anything happened to the other plane I’d feel kinda shitty knowing I did that on purpose. But man is it tempting to scare the dumbasses.
michael_1215@reddit
The bravo area is 900 ft AGL from my airport. So we were trained 200 ft below the shelf.
SirEDCaLot@reddit
As I see it, the '5999 in 6000' is pretty dumb. One little variation in pressure altitude or altimeter setting and you've got a situation where it's reading 5999 for me and 6001 for the controller.
Plus, if I'm 5999 and the airliner is 6450, they might get a TCAS warning for my bug smasher. Not to mention if they fly right over me, I'll be getting the full force of their wake turbulence.
IMHO, hanging out over/under a shelf isn't a great idea. I'll overfly a field no problem, and I'll land under a shelf, but under a shelf is a good place to get out of as quickly as possible. Take a Bravo airport, and make a cone like ice cream cone shape that's hollow in the middle, that starts at the field and goes up along the angle of most climbouts/approaches... that's not a good place to hang out.
So IMHO a good plan is stay at least 500' above or below controlled airspace. An equally good plan is request VFR flight following whenever around a bravo. That way you're at least on the radio with them, and if you're about to cause a problem they can let you know and get you out of the way.
Former_Farm_3618@reddit
I’m glad other pilots have some smarts about staying away from B airspace. Maybe it’s just my B but so many dudes love tickling the edge of it. (Gigity)
SirEDCaLot@reddit
Seems dumb to me. Risking a certificate action (or a safety issue) is not worth saving a few minutes of flight time. I like flying. No reason not to fly a little more and give it some extra space. If I'm that broke that I can't afford an extra 5-10 minutes to go around controlled airspace with spacing, or that shy that I can't say hello on some freq, I probably shouldn't be flying.
Also nothing wrong with calling tower and saying 'Bigport Approach, bugsmasher 1234N is 20 east of Bigport inbound to Nowheresville Regional, might clip the lower edge of the bravo on the way in so request a transition'. They might say 'runway 36 is in use at Bigport, transition through the bravo approved'. And then with one simple conversation I'm totally legal.
Or they might say 'runway 9 is in use, stay clear of the bravo and recommend approaching Nowheresville from the northeast' in which case now I've gotten something even more useful- knowledge that there's going to be a bunch of big heavy traffic right where I was planning to go, so I can have a much safer flight by making a dogleg and staying a bit lower on approach to stay below the jets.
Absolutely worst case scenario they tell me to fuck off, which is fine because that leaves me right where I was to begin with.
And if the concern is they'll instead put me on flight following and give me a clearance (which I might then violate), if that's really a concern then one should take some remedial dual time, or get some practice with the autopilot.
__joel_t@reddit
I'm the kind of person who likes to be on flight following. That way ATC can move me out of the way regardless of airspace classification.
Big-Carpenter7921@reddit
This is the way
Vincent-the-great@reddit
Not if you pull the transponder breaker and gaslight them into thinking you are a kite
JBalloonist@reddit
Or fly under a bridge…but that was outside the Bravo (barely).
Pileopilot@reddit
OMG THE DRONES ARE BACK!!!!
zemelb@reddit
what ever happened with those drones?? i just kinda stopped hearing about them...
JimTheJerseyGuy@reddit
I’m in NJ and the number of people who joined in the mass hysteria was mind boggling. People who, apparently, had never once before looked up at the night sky, had never understood that they live close to three major airports. The comparisons to the War of the Worlds
pyromaniac7@reddit
where’d you get your complex & hpe if you don’t mind me asking?
JimTheJerseyGuy@reddit
I’ll PM you.
pyromaniac7@reddit
where’d you get your complex & hpe if you don’t mind me asking?
TheDrMonocle@reddit
Nutsos on tiktok are still posting about them. Most have transitioned to calling them orbs because they dont know how focus works on their phone and are just desperate for ailens to exist.
As before, 90% of sightings are just planes, 8% are stars and 1% are mylar balloons. The remaining 1% are out of focus bugs, dirt, or lens flairs. Anything these idiots can see floating in their video are drones/orbs now.
From what I remember the actual drones were some commercial company doing tests or whatever.
Malcolm2theRescue@reddit
I think aliens WERE here once, searching for intelligent life. Mission was aborted.
DrRob@reddit
Collective shame and good sense prevailed
zemelb@reddit
You must be thinking of a different country’s populace
DrRob@reddit
Ya, fair. Most likely boredom and chasing the next shiny object
Historical_Meal_3935@reddit
This is probably the funniest shit I’ve seen on this sub in a while.
awh@reddit
I haven’t got time to copy a number; I’m trying to fly the plane!
aeroxan@reddit
A kite.... Flying at 100 kts
themedicd@reddit
It's really windy tonight
Drone314@reddit
Configure for slow flight and with the right conditions hover over the bravo with a zero ground speed
OTN@reddit
No just one kite not 100
SimilarTranslator264@reddit
It’s 2025 I’m allowed to identify as whatever I want and denying me that makes you a bigot!
wolfstore@reddit (OP)
I’m sure the all the American pilots landing at CLT with their TCAS having a spasm won’t notice……… right…..?
Vincent-the-great@reddit
Pretty sure my tcas does nothing if the other aircraft doesn’t have a transponder
wolfstore@reddit (OP)
Welp I wouldn’t know. My Baron isn’t fancy like yalls fast bois lol
Weasel474@reddit
Can't react to another transponder if there isn't another transponder. Taking an RJ into some podunk fields can be a bit sketch at times because the old dude in a Cub with no flight review since the Reagan administration is out there somewhere, but good luck finding him in time to see and evade.
wolfstore@reddit (OP)
Didn’t realize the TCAS requires the other aircraft to have a transponder. But that totally makes sense.
Jwylde2@reddit
TCAS is basically having a secondary surveillance radar (SSR) onboard.
ResponsibilityOld164@reddit
Instructions unclear. just did this in a A350 and now I appear to have lost my widebody job.
TaurusAuriga@reddit
Just fly IFR even in good weather when near or in a bravo. You have less to keep track off - just follow the instructions!
AffectionateBoat158@reddit
Did my night cross country outta KEQY to KHKY and flying over KCLT at night was insane. Crazy to see all the aircraft operating below you
wt1j@reddit
When you fly VFR in and out of an area with bravo, and then fly IFR inside the bravo on departure or arrival, you begin to understand why the bubble of bravo is so sacred. It really is very small for the amount of traffic and size of planes moving around inside it. And so having someone randomly moving within that space, not under ATC control, can become a major crisis quite quickly.
DrewSmithee@reddit
You should post to r/Charlotte for a break from the politics and Altima posts.
OpenListen3830@reddit
the bravo buster is probably an Altima driver looking for exit 3A
DrewSmithee@reddit
Lmao, probably.
AutoRot@reddit
Uhh, yeah. You should probably be watching your altitude at all times, or at least have a good idea of it. If you are anywhere near a bravo you need to be extra alert.
BUNNIES_ARE_FOOD@reddit
Class G stands for Leeroy Genkins
1202burner@reddit
Nah fuck it, think I'll just go up and down randomly, and then fly my happy ass right into the bravo because I felt like it.
Good luck everybody.
mfsp2025@reddit
Reminds me of N731NR in the LAS Bravo
wolfstore@reddit (OP)
It’s unfortunate that this has to be reminded to some people sometimes
minfremi@reddit
Meanwhile, N731NR needs to watch his attitude as well.
Vithar@reddit
WIFE APPROVED LLC has to be one of the better airplane owning LLCs out there...
satans_little_axeman@reddit
I wonder if his WIFE APPROVED of his Bravo bust...
AK_born00@reddit
But he’s been talking to them the whole time!
Continental-IO520@reddit
I do like circling the CLT
poser765@reddit
I’ll take circling CLT any day instead of actually landing there.
Ashamed-Charge5309@reddit
What's everything to the far left and centered? More terminals for planes or warehouses?
sunfishtommy@reddit
Depends where you are talking about in the picture, but the two options are Warehouses, or parking lots/ parking garages.
wolfstore@reddit (OP)
Honestly couldn’t tell ya. This is an older pic before they started a bunch of the construction they’ve done recently
185EDRIVER@reddit
Always watch ur altitude?
LowTimePilot@reddit
I did the Hudson corridor not long ago and the entire time LaGuardia was YELLING at some Piper in the Bravo. Easily a solid 4 minutes of aggressive lecturing and frustration with someone who either had radio problems or couldn't maintain altitude or direction to save their cert.
Didn't hear them give out a number to call. Guess LaGuardia is used to the weekend warrior crowd in their airspace.
ThePandaisInsane@reddit
No pun intended in the weekend Warrior I presume. nice. bravo
SoyMurcielago@reddit
When able please copy a number because that was busted
Possible posting deviation
Skynet_lives@reddit
This happens frequently in Phoenix also. Either Pilots not adhering to the assigned altitude when using the Bravo transition, or thinking they don’t need to call them for clearance if using the charted transition.
Legitimate_Let93@reddit
*cough cough* AeroGuard *cough cough*
Musicman425@reddit
CLT are sticks in the mud. They always vector me to Pluto just to go around their airspace. They ain’t even that busy….
mrrichardhn@reddit
I did a 141 school near the Bravo and it was quite heart pumping for sure haha, especially with the comms and everything.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
I fly around CLT almost every day for work. Today, I heard on frequency not once but TWICE a VFR aircraft busted the bravo at CLT because they weren’t paying attention to their altitude. Just a good reminder to plan accordingly and to watch your altitude if you plan on flying around bravo airspace. Remember, that a bravo clearance is required to enter bravo airspace. So simply making contact with ATC is not sufficient to enter. You need to hear that you’re cleared into the bravo airspace. Fly safe friends!
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