Thanks Europoors | TheaterFire

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usersub1@reddit

Unlike the US, Europe can fine corporations and receive the money for not complying. So I won’t be surprised if we will have games that can only be played in Europe-only

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MrBingly@reddit

Can someone give me context? Please and thank you

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Basically there has been an eu petition in the works for the past year or so spearheaded by the youtuber AccursedFarms in an attempt to force companies to have end of life plans for online only games. this greentext is just making fun of people who opposed the movement and their copes.

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One-Masterpiece9838@reddit

Why would anyone oppose that?

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Pineapple_Spenstar@reddit

The only real argument I've heard is concern over how it will force developers to make their games. Basically, from the very start, they will have to design games with EOL in mind. It sounds good, but it could also be a huge limiter if they have to design a game to ultimately be hosted on someone's basement server vs a huge industrial data center or very specific server hardware

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H00ston@reddit

This cannot come to pass, how will Blizzard have time for optimization and stealing breast milk from the company fridge?

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coolsam254@reddit

They should automate it and develop a robot to steal the breast milk.

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H00ston@reddit

you fail to see the human made artistry in stealing your co worker's breast milk

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declanaussie@reddit

Is there anything within the petition to suggest this though or is it just fear mongering? If a company is willing to release the source code for their distributed server architecture at EOL that’d satisfy me at least. A sufficiently motivated community can set that up on AWS or equivalent, you don’t need to own a datacenter.

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Pineapple_Spenstar@reddit

There's nothing in the petition, but it's educated speculation based on how ambiguous the language in EU mandates like this have been in the past and how litigious the EU tends to be. Calling it fear mongering is unreasonably dismissive

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declanaussie@reddit

Fear mongering is probably the wrong term. This doesn’t really seem like something that needs to be actively avoided though, unless people start to suggest that all game servers need to run on consumer grade hardware. Then again though, the EU has implemented some dumb policies in the past so who knows.

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wolflordval@reddit

The whole thing is a mess and both sides have too much bad blood towards each other to salvage anything good from this.

The point was to try and have that discussion now, before EU legislation starts sticking their nose in and making legislation without knowing the whole picture, which they have a history of doing.

Ross and his followers don't really seem to understand that there won't be time for that discussion once the EU legislation gets involved.

Thor and his followers fucked up trying to explain this by being dickheads and failing to understand popular support for this initiative.

The reality is that the most likely outcome is that some form of EU legislation will pass, it won't be thought out well, will cause problems and several live service games will block EU users from playing them. Ross will claim victory before realizing the problem. The industry will suffer as a result. All this could have been avoided if an actual discussion was had, which never occurred because both sides had their heads too far up their own ass to admit maybe their argument was flawed.

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IIlIIlIIIIlllIlIlII@reddit

Because they know how backend architecture works unlike everyone who signed

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Sumdoazen@reddit

Yeah? And how does it work exactly, my fellow programmer? My fellow online programmer? That understands how "backend architecture" works? Because he's an online programmer or, at the very least, someone that knows how "backend architecture" works. Please, tell everybody else. Just a short version, because, as we all know, if you understand something works, you can explain it in short. You can use everyday examples even!

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IIlIIlIIIIlllIlIlII@reddit

Sure, I can keep it short for you! A game backend can be very complex and split across many services, like databases, payment processing, matchmaking, etc, with any number of those being proprietary or licensed making it not trivial to just release it to the public when a game shuts down. A game company may have components that they use across multiple games that would potentially cause security/integrity concerns if released after shutting down one of the games but not the other. Basically, most people imagine a game server as basically a single computer with a single exe file running as the server, but it’s usually many different computers doing different things and sending information around.

Is that too long for you? If you’re interested in further reading you can start by googling some keywords such as “microservice”, “cloud computing”, “AWS/EC2”, etc

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FreakinEvan@reddit

Okay sure but when is there ever an excuse for them to exclusively host single player content on one of these propeietary servers? That seems like you are just making excuses for planned obsolescense which is a shitty buissiness practice. Like your point makes sense for mmo games but not so much games like Space Marine 2 that require a central server just to play single player. Or allowing peer to peer multiplayer for allowing local hosting, I mean im sure things have changed since that stuff was the standard but it was a bad change that as far as I can tell is solely driven by profitt and the idea that if gamers can keep playing old games they wont buy the new ones which is obviously asinine.

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IIlIIlIIIIlllIlIlII@reddit

I think in general, single player games do not need it, and they do that mostly for profit. I don’t think SKG has any exceptions for multiplayer does it? The main reason (a small amount of) people are opposed to SKG is because of how broad it is. If it only targeted single player I wouldn’t even be making these comments.

However, in regards to peer to peer, that’s completely impossible for many games; it again shows the lack of understanding of how massive and in depth these multiplayer backends are.

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TheCatOfWar@reddit

Nobody expects the multiplayer to be fully functioning or get new content or anything post end of life, it's more just about any singleplayer content not being locked out when the servers shutdown and if possible/applicable, an end of life plan that could for example release limited server files to the community so that they could eventually run it without having to reverse engineer and recreate the entire backend from scratch.

Fyi your attitude is super condescending

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IIlIIlIIIIlllIlIlII@reddit

As explained, in many cases there are no “server files” in a backend architecture but rather a hundred different repos running micro services and other crap. Of course my attitude is going to be condescending towards ignorant people who’ve downvoted me hundreds of times and still haven’t proven me wrong, in fact, they’ve proven me right by continuously not understanding how backends work.

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Sumdoazen@reddit

Peer to peer is exactly the thing that is the easiest to do...

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TheCatOfWar@reddit

I'm completely for SKG but peer to peer isn't just something you can easily add to an existing codebase. If the entire structure of the multiplayer is based around communicating with a centralised (authoritative) game server, you can't just tell the clients to talk to eachother and expect it to work like, at all. In that kind of instance you'd want the game company to release some server files (probably with any payment related functionality removed) so that the community can run servers instead.

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DrStrucx@reddit

never seen something so obviously copied from an AI answer holy crap, where's your dignity?

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IIlIIlIIIIlllIlIlII@reddit

It wasn’t copied from AI, it was written sarcastically like that on purpose. Go ahead and be confidently incorrect though

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alex2003super@reddit

As ContraPoints famously once said, "I wish I could let go of the part of me that still cares about the truth". But I can't so you're right.

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precision_cumshot@reddit

actually the people who signed have all been to your backend architecture

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Foxion7@reddit

There are improvements to be made to the initiative. This enraged all the kids who cannot see beyond the next day.

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Neomataza@reddit

People whose model is live service games. Basically anything freemium or battlepass/seasonpass based.

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Sbotkin@reddit

Because mah corporations

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FreakinEvan@reddit

People are always defending rich people and corporations for some reason.

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BathtubToasterBread@reddit

There are unfortunately some keyboard warriors who love being repeatedly fucked over by billion dollar corporations that don't care about them at all

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Belfengraeme@reddit

Pirate software and the denizens of cuck chairs worldwide

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Kotoy77@reddit

note on this, said end of life plans largely consist of: at least let us still play it on individually hosted servers or whatever, of our own making, and stop going out of your way to literally kill the game.

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Alokir@reddit

Thank you Pirate Software for making people vote just to spite you

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Dog_in_human_costume@reddit

Fuck him, every single thing I hear about him is horrible

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Foxion7@reddit

Most of it is fake

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Lukebekz@reddit

Correct, most of his claims are fake.

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GermanHandCannons@reddit

He just got a big ego man its not that serious

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Neomataza@reddit

That he can't admit fault is a huge issue for me. That's lack of class in my eyes.

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scrumptipus@reddit

I played his "game" and holy fucking shit is yandere simulator in it's current status better than that steaming pile of dogshit

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davidvia7@reddit

That is a big overstatement. His game isn't revolutionary but isn't so horribly made like YanDev's. It's an Undertale clone but worse at storytelling with shameless attempts at tugging on the heart strings.

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QFB-procrastinator@reddit

The EU is kinda weird, one week you have these gigantic W for consumers and the next some members propose chat control. I still think it’s a net good, but how tf can this be the same organisation.

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VapeHonda@reddit

The short answer is lobbying. The long answer is - my friend had an opportunity to visit board of EU officials from proverbial backstage as a journalist couple years back. He was shocked to learn that their day looks like this: everyday they receive a huge dossier of documents regarding a specific legal act consisting of at least 600-700 pages. They flat out said to him that there’s no way they can read all of that, so they don’t even bother. They spend all day doing pretty much nothing (of course while earning huge salaries) and at the end they just sign and approve whatever they were given. And it’s not just some insignificant laws, these can be some major things introducing huge changes (like stuff regarding green energy and whatnot). They don’t even read it and outside of general description they don’t know what it is. Really makes you think.

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Ok_Analysis6731@reddit

Which do you think is more likely? Someone lied to your friend, or even just left out details regarding aids summarizing stuff etc, or the eu just rolls a dice everytime a bill goes in front of them?

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Viapunk@reddit

EU is composed of many countries with broad spectrum of politicians residing in European Parliament.

Aside from that, SKG was a citizen’s initiative, meaning the was a proposal and people’s direct support, while chat control is a regulation proposed by an EU politician.

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ModmanX@reddit

Nothing-ever-happens bros in shambles

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Kaikeno@reddit

They've had quite the week

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Sbotkin@reddit

They've had quite the 3 years.

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PillowPhone007@reddit

How about 5

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The_Junton@reddit

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RarityNouveau@reddit

I really hope that one twitch streamer keeps getting flogged for trying to destroy this movement.

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hagamablabla@reddit

He almost did it too. God bless Ross for biting the bullet and doing that final video.

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Loopy-Loophole@reddit

Genuinely, I think him trying to avoid the drama and giving pirate almost total control of the narrative was a major mistake. We lucked the fuck out people caught on when he finally made a response.

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hagamablabla@reddit

I do think it worked out in the end, because back when Thor first made his case against SKG he was far more popular. Ross waiting until the end meant the video came out after the WoW incident, which made people much more willing to disagree with Thor.

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TheCatOfWar@reddit

you can just call him jason

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bddragon1@reddit

yeah but people like me are dumb and even with context, might miss who is being talked about

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FreeCapone@reddit

Honestly, I think he's done the movement a lot more good than harm, all that drama publicized the entire movement. Sure, he's reputation wound up in the thrash, but who cares

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HansChrst1@reddit

I got so much schadenfreude witnessing his downfall. I think he is still popular, but at least more people know he is a jerk now.

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StandardN02b@reddit

Untill this is law and companies start properly aplying it, they are just words.

Still hope it happens, tho.

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RunInRunOn@reddit

But the thing that is happening is objectively good, so we win anyways

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Lord-Black22@reddit

Piratesoftware frothing at the mouth

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anovatikzzzz@reddit

The solution is the indie games.

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SpaceBug176@reddit

Yes, but no. Indie devs have the passion required to keep an online game's servers alive, but they lack the money.

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anovatikzzzz@reddit

How about the community? For example NFS carbon's servers shut down years ago but community relaunched the servers. Can't this be also done for indie games?

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A_Stoned_Smurf@reddit

That's how 90% of them function anyways, you have to run a different host executable and then your friends join directly to you (occasionally with port forwarding, but I feel like I haven't seen that be necessary for some time).

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PiscesSoedroen@reddit

It's also less accessible, many people can't configure their port-forwarding because ISP are a dick and blocks them from doing so

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SpaceBug176@reddit

I guess? This isn't really relevant to me, I was simply saying indie games aren't the solution.

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Zigge2000@reddit

Indie games shut down as well. Gigantic was shut down for years until the game was bought out and re-released.

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halpfulhinderance@reddit

Team Cherry is basically bulletproof at this point. I’m so happy for them

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AbortionBulld0zer@reddit

My favourite online game: Hollow Knight

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halpfulhinderance@reddit

Oh this is about online games? Whoops

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RookWatcher@reddit

No, it's about all of them because no game is inherently safe from the bullshitting of the always-online, server checks and login requirements.

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FrazzleFlib@reddit

these dont apply to hk or silksong to be clear, but yeah always online drm is a huge factor

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RookWatcher@reddit

They should be good now, but better safe than sorry, this regulation should target every game. I prefer to avoid leaving any room for legal loopholes that could be exploited against consumers.

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Sbotkin@reddit

Indie devs are one of the worst offenders of abandoning games tbf.

Usually because they don't have money / passion to keep working on their games.

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FrazzleFlib@reddit

this is a differentl issue rly

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PeachesGuy@reddit

Always have been to fight the lack of innovation in AAA games, still there are big budget games that are as entertaining.

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Wayss37@reddit

Go and try to find some obscure indie game from 20 years ago without using torrent trackers

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Mr_john_poo@reddit

I doubt the EU will make it into law

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SmoothPimp85@reddit

Anyway, all additional costs will be paid by consumers.

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Kulson16@reddit

Additional costs of what?

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Foxion7@reddit

Of the work that is needed of every company that makes games. Wait, you aren't young and stupid enough to think it's just an on off switch? I swear the kids who rage for this halfbaked tantrum initiative

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Alokir@reddit

This is like the argument against livable wages for waiters in the US.

"but the cost will drive prices up"

Yeah, so do mandatory tips. But who benefits from having lower prices on the menu when you order, even though you'll have to add 30% to it when you pay?

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The_Meemeli@reddit

Better than "I want to pay to have this experience but they won't take my money"

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Quaschimodo@reddit

you mean like literally anything else? you do realize that games have been constantly going up in price anyway as has everything else? so take your cope and shove it.

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RunInRunOn@reddit

I'm fine with paying more for a product that lasts longer.

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The_Knife_Pie@reddit

Yes, additional cost of letting people host their own servers when the devs shut down theirs will in fact be paid by the people running the servers. That’s the point.

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Laziness2945@reddit

The part about companies just not giving a fuck might be true tho. If the fines are less than keeping the game alive, it is cost of doing business. Same as google, meta and company violating every privacy and antitrust law possible, making billions and getting fined like 2% of what they gained.

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DelightfulHugs@reddit

It all depends on what the EU decide will be the penalty for not complying, assuming a new law does end up being made.

If a company is forced to refund the payment for a game in the event that the game is no longer playable for all EU citizens that bought the game, then there is no way companies can ignore it.

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XiJinpingChinaParody@reddit (OP)

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-F0v3r-@reddit

god bless xi and the cpc

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Julicsi@reddit

There's always that contrarian loser