Teenagers first proper laptop - high school use - advice on hardware and software please
Posted by I_am_just_so_tired99@reddit | linux | View on Reddit | 47 comments
Good morning - and thank you in advance to anyone who takes the time to read this (let alone comment)
The situation: My 14yr old needs a laptop for his school work and so I’m looking to get something that is a balance of the usual; utility, robustness, future optionality (will he be a CS major? A graphics artist? Who knows), and so I’m looking for advice on a few things:
1. Hardware - which might not be the thing folks in this forum focus on, but I’m betting some of you have opinions: things like CPU, RAM, HDD vs SSD, screen resolution etc.
2. Operating system - This is why I am posting here. I used Windows laptops for most of the last 20 years - so I’m familiar with it, and this will be my default option (vs. Mac). I now have a Mac Air laptop which is fine for what I do, but I much prefer excel on a windows machine due to shortcuts. (Also my kid would bend that MacAir within 24 hours with how he just bounces around in the world.)
I want to avoid bloat-ware so the chromebooks and google OS stuff worries me (and I know windows has plenty of this also… I guess I’m just more familiar with it so am able to navigate it better) and this got me down a rabbithole for Linux. So here i am.
I’m old enough to have been through school and university without owning a computer (the rich kid at Uni had a 386..!) so I could be missing some requirements here but I see his needs to be fairly basic. 1. Documents, presentations, spreadsheets, and likely the ability to collaborate with project team-mates. 2. Technical writing features (mathematical formulae such as integration and differentiation) 3. Filing systems 4. Communication: emails, instant messenger 5. Art / drawing / picture editing (he likes to draw) 6 other..? I dont know of any needs for things like CAD or virtual machines in high school… maybe a younger person could help guide me here as to what might be on the curriculum.
I’d like my son to have a bit more knowledge in the underlying tech and architecture of “how things work” so that he’s better able to maintain (or modify) his equipment to suit his needs as they evolve. And I’d like to avoid him joining the ranks of the “less tech savvy” that seems to be growing amongst the younger folks due to apps just working out of the box (basically I’d like him to learn something his school may not teach him, and as a dad I want him to be independent and self-sufficient - do people still de-frag their drive to free up space?)
I’m honestly not 100% sure I’ve asked the right questions - I genuinely feel like a dinosaur - but I hope I’ve conveyed the sentiment. Any and all guidance is welcome. Thanks again.
lifeequalsfalse@reddit
I'm in school and I run arch, aspiring developer.
Hardware wise, I don't see the need for a super beefy laptop unless your son is going into AI/CV/other media related stuff. Pretty much any modern laptop would do
As for the OS, I think it's pretty obvious what I would shill from the subreddit name. At your son's age, I was distrohopping before landing on arch linux.
> Documents, presentations, spreadsheets, and likely the ability to collaborate with project team-mates.
I usually use google docs/microsoft office online to do things that require collaboration. I use libreoffice and write my assignments in latex for personal assignments.
> Technical writing features
As mentioned earlier, latex is really good for writing assignments.
> Filing systems
Could you elaborate? I just keep a folder with school stuff in my home directory
> Communication
WhatsApp Web/Telegram Desktop, Discord, Thunderbird & Weechat for emails and matrix
> Art/Media editing/CAD/VMs
I personally use krita for art. Media editing, I use gimp for photos and blender for videos. For CAD/3d design, I use FreeCAD for serious stuff and blender. For VMs I run standard kvm setup with virt-manager, which is helpful in the very rare case that I need to use software that wine can't run.
> do people still de-frag their drive to free up space
Not anymore haha
kettlesteam@reddit
The thing is, YOU made the decision everytime you distro hopped and eventually settled on arch, your parents didn't make that decision for you. There's no need to force anything on the kid, just get him a Windows 11 laptop and let him install linux on it if he is tech savvy enough. Linux isn't for everybody, so let the kid decide for himself.
lifeequalsfalse@reddit
I agree. OP posted this in a Linux subreddit asking for opinions, it's just my personal experience. Arch would suck for a beginner anyway
lifeequalsfalse@reddit
Laptop brand recommendations:
I'm running a MSI Modern 14 C7M with a AMD Ryzen 7 7730U, it runs really well and is generally the most well built laptop i've touched in a long time. I highly suggest shunning lenovo and acer laptops (although OLD thinkpads are fine) as they have pretty severe build quality issues and their hinges suck.
kettlesteam@reddit
Everybody's given you decent suggestions about hardware, so I won't go into that. But when it comes to OS recommendation, of course you'll get biased opinions on a sub that's literally called linux.
Even at the risk of getting mass downvoted and hated by everybody here, I'll do the right thing and suggest Windows 11. Because if the kid knows nothing about linux, doesn't even know how to use package manager, doesn't know how to troubleshoot missing drrivers, etc, and he just wants to get his homework done on time on the laptop, the kid will struggle. It'd be a different story if he had guidance from someone who knew all that stuff, but it doesn't sound like you have someone like that in the house.
Besides, if the kid is tech savvy enough to work on linux and wants to use linux, there's nothing stopping him from getting rid of Windows 11 and installing linux on the machine. So this is the most reasonable way to go about it. Don't force linux on somebody who has no idea how to use it and has no guidance.
mell1suga@reddit
ahem
FRAMEWORK 12
Why? Because it's open. You can upgrade things a bit, modular, like REALLY modular. Has a (albeit kinda shitty if in professional standpoint) pen. Kids love such things. Get em a linux Mint.
Downside is the price and availability.
Software suit:
Usually for collab, kiddos will collab on Google Suit or Office Suit online. But OpenOffice and Libre Office are aplenty.
Graphic: Krita is go-to for digital drawing and painting. Inkscape for vector stuff. Idk about CAD though. Blender for 3D stuff. Via Steam, get them Aseprite if they want to try out pixel art.
Gaming: do not be afraid, you can set up family acc and family library as well as restrict things, but keep in mind that YOU must have a good look and control it. Steam is surprisingly good with it. There are games that are also nice for kids, at the same time gaming on linux is almost on par and sometime even better thanks to Steam Proton. Hollow Knight and its sequel Silksong. Final Fantasy pixel collection (these are lengthy and wordy btw, decent plot tho), Final Fantasy Tactics. Hello Kitty game. Hades and Hades 2. Tiny Glade for building towns and such. Also Steam games are a way to teach them about the value of patience and economy: Steam has sales and bless lord Gaben, so many deep sales.
RoxyAndBlackie128@reddit
Not everybody just has an extra 1000 dollars
mell1suga@reddit
The issue is how bad it would be (ab)used by a toddler-teenager. Framework is expensive (and hecking expensive no less, the 12 is literaly a repairable 2-in-1), but able to fix things with ease vs anything HP/Dell locked down stuff is still something. If not for the ease of repair and modular IO, a secondhand laptop loaded with linux is already suffice.
Even adult can destroy machines in questionable ways, and here you have teenagers.
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CortaCircuit@reddit
Use thinkpads are not too expensive
MagicianQuiet6432@reddit
As a Linux user, I'll obviously recommend Linux.
He can't use Adobe products but there are open source alternatives like GIMP and Krita.
Linux.
Linux.
Linux.
Only HDDs I think.
Suspicious-Bill-554@reddit
Second all this
Strange-Future-6469@reddit
Used thinkpad in the $250ish range with Fedora Plasma KDE or Mint.
That's what I use for college, besides my PC.
Outstanding for classwork with lots of bells and whistles.
I_am_just_so_tired99@reddit (OP)
Thank you.
How did things work when say project team members were using MS word etc. and you had to pass documents back and forth ?
Strange-Future-6469@reddit
I can use the microsoft360 software via web browser when needed. Usually, I use libreoffice and submit documents and essays as pdf.
GZ22@reddit
I have to say I agree. A used Thinkpad, maybe a T480 or T490 or similar. And a good stable OS. Linux Mint or another Ubuntu variant is probably the best bet for a beginner , namely because these OS have a slightly better chance of your teen resolving issues due to the high amount of forum posts and stuff to search through. While your teen may never really need to use the command line, should they run into issues, learning with all the Ubuntu resources out there will certainly ease things.
Plus it's stable, and has lots of software available. I run Mint on all my family's laptops, but I'm on a Fedora fork on my gaming computer just because I wanted to try something new, I had Mint on it for quite some time.
I_am_just_so_tired99@reddit (OP)
Thank you - just to make sure I understand… Linux mint is a sub category of Ubuntu ?
GZ22@reddit
Yes, there are quite a number of distributions that take Ubuntu as a base to work off of, they put their own desktop environment on it, make a few internal tweaks to make it work the way that they prefer things to work, and call it their own. The beauty of this is that Ubuntu has a solid foundation to work off of, has lots of troubleshooting resources, great hardware support, and historically has been easier to manage for the masses than more OG platforms like vanilla Debian.
For instance I've always like Mint, The Cinnamon desktop is plain and simple and quite Windows-like out of the box, they manage application installs with a great repository from Flat hub which is simple, and the updater is simple and easy. It's just easy mode, nothing fancy and works great. However stock Ubuntu is also great, it's gets some flack for the way it manages packages (uses something called Snap) and some people don't like the desktop with the toolbar on the side, but personally I think it works great and runs super smooth. It's honestly probably the spot to start and try out first.
YMOS21@reddit
Framework or Thinkpad
RAM > 16 GB Intel i5 or better and definitely comparable AMD would work too SSD preferable > 512 GB Dedicated graphic is Optional based on your budget
I_am_just_so_tired99@reddit (OP)
Thank you
JailbreakHat@reddit
A Dell XPS or Thinkpad would work the best on Linux if we exclude less popular brands like Framework, System76, Tuxedo or Starlabs.
xmBQWugdxjaA@reddit
If you have the money: Framework or Thinkpad.
If you want a budget option (maybe better in case it gets lost or damaged): Vivobook or Ideapad.
You should compare the discounts in your actual market though, as it varies massively. Like importing the Framework to Europe is stupidly expensive vs. buying ASUS or Lenovo.
JailbreakHat@reddit
T480 enters the chat.
CakeIzGood@reddit
Second this, Frameworks are awesome because they're really easy to fix if that's something you or the kid is interested in but their biggest drawback is battery life and it would potentially need to charge at some point during a full school day. A ThinkPad is just a solid all around laptop, but if you break it you probably won't want to try to fix it yourself. Also second the Vivobook (generally solid budget laptop) and IdeaPad (ThinkPad Lite essentially) on the lower end.
Regarding operating system: seriously consider whether putting Linux on a laptop that's going to be used for immediate productive purposes is the best thing. If you or the kid are technologically inclined or familiar with Linux, it might be okay, but the risk of an issue that you can't as easily find help to fix is higher and the odds of the school eventually wanting to use some application that isn't on Linux is there. You can run both on the same device so they can switch based on need; it does require a bit more setup and the user might not actually want to switch and may find themselves using the Windows install just to keep it simple.
There is a debloated Windows called ReviOS that, while having extra steps to set up, cuts a lot of the bloat and telemetry out of it too.
B3_Kind_R3wind_@reddit
Why not? ThinkPads are mass-produced business laptops. Used models and cheap parts for repair are easily found on eBay. On top of that, they are usually easy to disassemble and reassemble.
CakeIzGood@reddit
I guess it depends on what breaks and how confident you are. With Framework, you can buy replacement parts for things that are often really dicey and difficult to fix on other laptops directly from the manufacturer. Can't do that with Lenovo; if anything is glued or otherwise fixed in place, or otherwise difficult, the average person might not want to tackle it. They could, but it's not quite the same
B3_Kind_R3wind_@reddit
In terms of repairability, the Framework should be a better option than the ThinkPad as long as the Framework company stays in business. If Framework disappeared tomorrow morning for any reason, it would probably become quite difficult to find parts.
I personally prefer Thinkpad because they are sturdier devices than Framework.
CakeIzGood@reddit
Fair point on the parts being dependent on the company existing. I would hate for that to deter people from buying from them because then they can't exist and it's a dead-end, but it's factually true.
Also pretty fair on ThinkPad build quality, having tighter component and chassis integration makes most laptops more rugged than certainly the 13 and 16 inch Frameworks. Everyone weighs these things differently
B3_Kind_R3wind_@reddit
Why not? ThinkPads are mass-produced business laptops. Used models and cheap parts for repair are easily found on eBay. On top of that, they are usually easy to disassemble and reassemble.
mina86ng@reddit
Tuxedo is an option for Europe.
The-Nice-Writer@reddit
A used Thinkpad or Dell Latitude would be my go-to. Solid machines, often quite cheap. If he goes into something like CS or design after high school, he’ll need a new machine anyway most likely.
YMOS21@reddit
Framework or Thinkpad
RAM > 16 GB Intel i5 or better and definitely comparable AMD would work too SSD preferable > 512 GB Dedicated graphic is Optional based on your budget
pramodhrachuri@reddit
If this is his 1st computer ever, I recommend using windows. Then slowly introduce them to Linux
paulodelgado@reddit
Friend, my 14 yr old uses my old 13” MacBook Pro from 2015 running Fedora. I don’t think there’s a need to spend too much now.
SteveHamlin1@reddit
Don't discount Chromebooks - especially if you are already into the Google eco-system, but even if your not. A x86-based Chromebook is a great companion to Linux-based machines.
Depends on how you like the mostly-unconfigurable desktop environment. If you do like the DE/UI, then: Cheap hardware, lightweight OS that works great for me, and a built-in VM that spins up a default x86 Debian OS that hooks into the DE, even when you install Flatpak GUI apps on the VMed OS.
I love it as a companion to my bare-metal Linux installs on other computers. It's a $200 portable Linux-based desktop that works great.
Successful-Piece7497@reddit
Nah bro..he will definitely need a pc with 5090 gpu and Ryzen 7 9800x3d..which is definitely needed for your son's holistic growth..
Welcome bud
rumblpak@reddit
I know you’re posting in r/linux but before you dig too far into anything, confirm the requirements with your child’s school as many require chromebooks and I wouldn’t spend more than a couple hundred on that trash.
Plan_9_fromouter_@reddit
Ah, but if you do, you get more than trash.
gannex@reddit
You know the highschool is MicrobeSofted right? Your kid is gonna have all sorts of issues for not having MicrobeSoft Word
RoxyAndBlackie128@reddit
Buy a Chromebook with a recent Intel core CPU like a pixelbook and flash a UEFI firmware on it. Then, just use any distro you want really they're easily replaceable
JazzWillCT@reddit
I use Linux for my classes and it works very well, but check with the school to ask if theres any requirements
sCeege@reddit
I’m not sure what country you’re from, but if you’re US based, or if you have access to a safe second hand market, I always recommend second hand business laptops as a first computer for children, even young adults. A lot of $200-400 used laptops are plenty fast for modern Linux distros, casually glancing eBay, there are some ThinkPads and Dell Latitudes in the $300 range rocking ryzen 5 or core i7s with 16GB of RAM.
Because your child is still so young, and that you don’t quite know what they want it, I would experiment with something cheap and robust (hence used business laptops) and upgrade at a later time when appropriate. If you spend too much on a beefy computer now, it may be hard to justify a pivot to some unforeseen needs later (like a dedicated GPU or something).
Honestly for like 90% of enthusiasts software runs on just about anything. I think once he starts to use a computer, what he needs will naturally surface and you can make a more substantial purchase later.
kopsis@reddit
This is the way. I recently picked up a refurbished Thinkpad X13 Gen 1 (12", Ryzen 5 Pro, 16 GB RAM, 256 GB NVME) for $200 (+$50 for a new battery). All the hardware is fully supported in the 6.12 LTS kernel. I use it for everything from web browsing to CAD, so I can't imagine a laptop in this class not being adequate for school work. The only thing to watch out for if you go this route is the battery. Even if sellers claim it "holds a charge" it will probably be 60% capacity or less.
dajiru@reddit
Economic option: Marketplace, 2nd hand laptop (change batteries, RAM and SSDs) and install Linux (i.e. Xubuntu).
Klapperatismus@reddit
You have to check whether Linux is even an option. Some schools require the laptops used in class to have specific Windows software installed. Mostly for the teacher to be able to eavesdrop on their students.
Also: HDDs aren’t a thing any more.
Mysterio-vfx@reddit
Make him insta gentoo, jokes aside linux is just so great choosing a distribution at this point doesnt really matter Just focus on choosing the De, Plasma or Gnome, Plasma offers more customisations but I would recommend Gnome because its so clean and has consistebt ui just love the way it looks and functions, but once you are comfoetable you distro hop as much as you want
frustratedmachinist@reddit
Snag a used ThinkPad. I’m running a 2013 W540 (I ended up maxing out the RAM and upgrading the HDD to an SSD) with Kubuntu and it’s good for everything engineering school is throwing at me. With a dinosaur like a W540, your kid isn’t going to be playing AAA games on it, but it’s a workhorse.
I’m sure you can find a newer ThinkPad with an i5 or i7 CPU that can solidly handle today’s needs without breaking the bank.