Nissan Listens to Enthusiasts, Confirms That the Z NISMO Sports Car Will Offer a Manual Transmission.
Posted by Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 319 comments
tofulo@reddit
Cool, but think it is a little late. Current Zs are rotting on lots with steep discounts and barely used ones plummet in value more than anything I’ve ever seen. I personally am interested in getting a base for dirt cheap and building it out eventually
Azncheesy@reddit
You can get a performance model Manual Z for $40k here in California. Probably one of the best bang for you buck car you get right now. 400 horsepower for $40k is pretty crazy.
LimonFromChowder@reddit
I feel like c6/c7 wins this category
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
Pure Dollar:Performance yea, but if you want something with a warranty then the Z still has something to offer.
LimonFromChowder@reddit
Really good point! Much safer bet
tofulo@reddit
Are the base models $30k then? Imo if you are going to mod, you are prob going to replace all the upgrades the performance comes with aka wheels, brakes, and suspension. The only thing you are really missing out on is the LSD which you can add for much less than the $10k in price difference
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
Honestly it strikes me as a weird car to mod.
$10K difference between the Sport & Performance trims. The latter comes with upgraded brakes, forged wheels, aero that matters at triple digit speeds, LSD, and the better interior / bigger screen.
By the time you put new wheels, brakes, LSD in there... you're probably at or extremely close to the $10K you would've just paid the dealer.
tofulo@reddit
I’d rather put money into parts i want than stuff ill replace.
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
Depending on the regional discounts you can get them 35 to 37.
ggtsu_00@reddit
Fair point, but you are getting a Nissan for what it's worth.
mini4x@reddit
Base Mustang GT has 480 and they start around $45k - near impossible to find a low spec one tho.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
Can find them much much lower at dealerships though.
I was playing around with the idea of a Mustang because of the crazy discounts on them.
$42k-$43k seems to be the going rate for base manual ones with an MSRP around $49k.
Dr_Disaster@reddit
You weren’t lying. I took a look at listings near me and most dealers are offering them at 4-5k off MSRP. Oof
hustlehustle@reddit
Some places in Canada are showing a 5-8k discount and then offering 10k on top of that when you come in. People getting a performance for ~45k Canadian
Dr_Disaster@reddit
I can’t lie, I’m tempted because I liked the Z from day one. The price was the only thing I didn’t like.
hustlehustle@reddit
The price has been highly adjusted. I think it’s in a spot where it’s an actually reasonable price and approachable as a platform. I think it’ll be a long term fun car for a lot of people, like the 350 was. Sucks Nissan isn’t doing well. I think they finally made a fun car again.
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
Most reviewers tend to agree, but the internet hated on it because it loses by most metrics. Marginally slower than its competitors to 60/quarter mile/lap times, therefore it's utter trash.
But if you actually listen to the general substance of the reviews, it does quite well. Like in SavageGeese's comparison between the Z and the Supra he said the Z is far more engaging & rewarding to drive and that he'd choose it over the latter
hustlehustle@reddit
Yeah almost every review I’ve seen is highly positive. Sure, it’s not he fastest thing on earth, but it’s fun
mini4x@reddit
Which is what thae should have been prices at in the first place.
tjflex19@reddit
Nature is healing, because dealership were trying to offer them 10k+ over sticker. I still remember that random Z going for almost 80k lml.
stakoverflo@reddit
You should look at luxury cars lol.
$130K Window Sticker sold for $50K with only 14,200 miles
deleted_by_reddit@reddit
[removed]
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
The Z isn't a roadster, and neither is the Supra.
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Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
This makes it very very interesting IMO.
There are not many 400+ horsepower 2 seater manual sports cars on the market.
magnament@reddit
The market is going towards cars are for driving, traffic is insufferable - into - want to have fun? Buy an off road or sports vehicle. Because driving in traffic is the same in a fast car.
Ftpini@reddit
Hahahaha, no. Driving in traffic in a fast car is so much more enjoyable than driving in traffic in a slow car. Try it sometime, its just better.
ruleofnuts@reddit
I’d rather be in my automatic jeep than my s2000 in traffic
PurpEL@reddit
Lol the car with perhaps the lightest and most buttery manual, vs a squishy soft floppy box. Ok
jse000@reddit
A buttery manual in stop and go traffic isn't awesome, you're not even shifting much.
I prefer my Bolt or GTI for commuting
PurpEL@reddit
Clutch pressure is like 1/64th of a gram dude
jse000@reddit
Why use a clutch at all when I could just not?
ruleofnuts@reddit
Apparently two guys with an s2000 are wrong and the guy with zero s2000s are correct
jse000@reddit
I don't think this guy likes driving
PurpEL@reddit
Crying cause your bird legs
jse000@reddit
Why do you have three cars? Just drive the Chevelle everywhere
equitymans@reddit
If I have one and strong disagree does it count? 😂
equitymans@reddit
As someone with 2k, strong strong disagree. Ap1 also so no clutch delay valve lol
Ftpini@reddit
My last car was a model 3 performance. Heavy traffic couldn’t have been simpler to handle. You literally just wait it out and the car did everything.
I greatly prefer heavy traffic in my mustang. I’m actually doing something instead of just sitting there and the noise and vibration from the V8 is exquisite.
AfroInfo@reddit
But that's not because it's a fast car... That's just because you like doing something in traffic. Just drive any manual for that sake
equitymans@reddit
Most fast cars will be more enjoyable for same reasons mustang gt will be to more people brother lol not all maybe but most? Yes lol
Ftpini@reddit
I mean, isn’t that about the half the point of this entire sub?
Niyeaux@reddit
i went from a 40 horsepower daily to a 280 horsepower daily recently. my experience sitting in rush hour traffic is identical.
velociraptorfarmer@reddit
I had a 2WD Grand Cherokee from 1999 and an 07 G35xS at one point a few years ago.
I found myself driving the beater Jeep because it was more comfortable.
equitymans@reddit
Wrong car.
SkylineSpeed@reddit
You mean the ‘10 Accord V6?
thekhaos@reddit
Horsepower is not the only measure of speed
And even if it is, 280 hp isn’t exactly fast unless you’re driving a featherweight
SavageryRox@reddit
280hp is more than enough to be considered fast in daily driving. An Audi A4 has 261 hp, & does 0-60 in 4.8 seconds despite weighing as much as my CX5. A GTI has 240hp & does 0-60 in 5.6 seconds.
Hell, a ecoboost mustang has 315 hp & does 0-60 in 4.7 seconds, whilst the Mustang GT has 485 hp & does 0-60 in 4.3 seconds. 54% more hp & only 0.4 seconds quicker.
A car can have limited HP & still be fast. A car can have a lot of power & still be slow.
thekhaos@reddit
Read my comment. That’s what I’m saying
He’s using hp as a measure of speed when speed also depends on drivetrain, transmission, weight and bunch of other variables
The Audi is mostly doing a sub 5 second 0-60 because of Quattro. A GTI with the same engine does it in 6.5 seconds
AltruisticMobile4606@reddit
Read his comments and flair bruh, he went from a Kei truck to an Accord V6. You will absolutely feel that difference
SavageryRox@reddit
Okay, let's quote your comment.
An Audi A4 has 261 hp, & does 0-60 in 4.8 seconds despite weighing as much as my CX5. That's plenty fast for daily driving.
Moving the goalposts now? You said 280 hp isn't exactly fast unless it's a featherweight. I told you a heavy sedan with 260 hp does a sub 5 second 0-60. Your response is "BeCauSE QuaTTRo" but that doesn't change anything about the fact that it's a heavy sedan with 260 hp that's plenty fast.
UnnamedStaplesDrone@reddit
The crazy low gearing of the 10 speed transmission does wonders for the ecoboost. Really for the GT as well but the 10 speed fits the ecoboost nicely
svideo@reddit
In my experience the sports car was worse because I’m standing on the clutch for an hour.
Zelderian@reddit
Agreed. Also higher power cars will probably have stiffer clutches, which will suck more in traffic
BombTheFuckers@reddit
Also, depending on the car you get to "enjoy" a loud as fuck engine, and a harsh ride. All the things that make a car fun on a track make it suck hard in traffic.
PurpEL@reddit
Weak legs
Niyeaux@reddit
in my case both the 40hp one and the 280hp one are manuals, so that part's a wash lol
ob_knoxious@reddit
Went from ~100 to ~300 and yeah, no change. If anything it got worse because my car got larger.
BWFTW@reddit
What were you daily driving with 40 horsepower?
Niyeaux@reddit
kei truck lol
BWFTW@reddit
That's so awesome ahaha. How was it to daily drive that?
Niyeaux@reddit
really fun in the city, amazing for weekend camping and trail driving. not great on the highway and a bit stressful to run as a daily because of parts availability in north america.
would love to get one again as a 3rd vehicle for camping and 4x4ing, probably wouldn't go back to dailying one.
BWFTW@reddit
That's awesome. Which truck was it? Was it hard keeping up with traffic? Could the kei truck go 60mph?
Niyeaux@reddit
'98 Suzuki Carry. it did like 90km/h fairly comfortably but that's about it.
Eggonioni@reddit
Yoooo you should totally link or post pics of it :)
Niyeaux@reddit
there are a few on IG @vivakyusha
Eggonioni@reddit
Thanks!
equitymans@reddit
Duh lol if it’s the right spots car a 30km/h bend feels night and day to a economy sedan let alone a truck lol this comment section is always incredible 😂
10000Didgeridoos@reddit
Lol what? I daily drive a car that does 0-60 in 4.5 seconds and it makes no fucking difference in rush hour. Y'all are absolutely insane.
CrimsonFlam3s@reddit
They probably mean bumper to bumper. I would rather be in a nice comfy car if I can't use even 40% of the power available.
Ftpini@reddit
Yep. I deal with it for about 1-2 miles of my commute every single day. Stop and go heavy traffic in a convertible V8 with a properly loud exhaust is a riot.
randeus@reddit
No it’s not lol
Ftpini@reddit
That’s a fair take, but not my experience. The whole point of a convertible is cruising. Not racing, not speed, just driving around. I love every minute of it!
randeus@reddit
You aren’t cruising in stop and go traffic, brother lol
CrimsonFlam3s@reddit
Sounds horrible to me but to each their own.
shoveazy@reddit
Can you say why driving in traffic in a fast car is better than in a slow car? If you're sitting in slow moving traffic, you might as well be sitting in a moving room. How does a fast car make it better in your experience?
DarkMatterM4@reddit
Not if you have an unspring clutch with a heavy duty pressure plate.
GimmeChickenBlasters@reddit
So pretty much no one? That's racecar stuff. Unless you're making like 1k hp there's no reason to have one.
Less-Fondant-3054@reddit
No, it's really not. At least not when we're talking modern sports car vs. modern commuter car. Sure, if we're comparing a modern sports car to a 1970s econobox it's better but I'll take a modern crossover or pickup over a modern sports car in heavy traffic every time.
Ftpini@reddit
And that is why we have so many options for boring cars and so few for fun cars. Most folks would rather sit in a comfortable boring car day after day. I don’t care for that at all.
Less-Fondant-3054@reddit
That's also why so much money and effort has been put into making fun(ish) versions of boring platforms. Hot crossovers and pickups exist because people want the option for fun without being miserable in their 75% use case of traffic.
Op3rat0rr@reddit
Indeed. People who say stuff like that don’t drive fun cars while daily driving
brettriv@reddit
It could be bumper to bumper traffic, and I will always enjoy being in my Supra more vs. my Tiguan.
magnament@reddit
No shit adaptive cruise control isn’t driving
equitymans@reddit
Or because one feels baller and the other makes you just another miserable dad in traffic 😂
equitymans@reddit
Off road vehicles are same as sports cars in traffic??? Oh wait I’m on Reddit lol make sense now
RFK_Cum_Regimen@reddit
I mean, we don't all live in the Bay or Chicago or whatever. Even better of you work from home and can drive when you choose. But yeah, I hear you.
We're probably heading toward a subscription appliance market anyhow. Everything is a boring, soulless crossover or pseudo-utility thing connected to the internet. The average age of new-car buyer is 53 years-old and overweight. Can't say I have much hope for performance and fun.
WendysChiliAndPepsi@reddit
There are places that exist outside of LA and NYC.
10000Didgeridoos@reddit
If you live in any medium sized or larger metro area, you aren't bombing down roads to and from work. This subreddit acts like people live inside Forza Horizon. If you live in bumfuck and work remote, sure.
TookEverything@reddit
Even within LA, there are tons of twisty roads that are free from traffic and enjoyable to drive on.
In the summer I like to detour through the Malibu canyons instead of sitting on the 405. Similarly, taking Angeles Crest to get inland instead of sitting on the 10.
Virtual_Industry8553@reddit
Do you think everyone just sits in traffic every time they drive? Backroads exist, highways aren't always busy.
Hell if you're like me and you work odd hours you might not even run into traffic on your commute daily.
spongebob_meth@reddit
And bad traffic usually isn't even terrible if you have the right mindset and technique
Traffic is bad in my city and i still don't consider an automatic a necessity to have around. All my vehicles are manual. You can usually idle along in first gear and leave a gap, not having to use the clutch all that much.
_Winterspring_@reddit
I usually drive home from work on the backroads for this reason. It takes ~5-10 minutes longer, but it's way more fun and I actually get to stretch my car's legs.
jiggajawn@reddit
As someone that doesn't really ever sit in traffic (trains and bikes ftw), my car is explicitly for fun. This would fit the bill if I wanted a two seater sports car.
ManufacturerBest2758@reddit
No it isn’t lol
OldRed91@reddit
I bet you're fun at parties
cookingboy@reddit
I can think of the Mustang GT only. Is there anything else?
4r4r4real@reddit
The Mustang is a 2+2 not a 2 seater
UrbanAlaska@reddit
My kids fit back there but adults... not so much.
4r4r4real@reddit
I managed to get 4 of us adults the 2 miles to In N Out in my 17 Camaro once... there were shoeprints on the back of my recaros after, so it stayed just the once lol
orangutanDOTorg@reddit
We packed four big fat dudes in my friend’s catfish Camaro a bunch of times back when those were new. Good times.
Sexualrelations@reddit
Same. I think I would have a panic attack if I was in the back of one of those right now.
Ftpini@reddit
That’s why it comes in a convertible trim as well!
cookingboy@reddit
Ok, then there are no other alternatives right?
Vhozite@reddit
Supra. It’s not rated at 400HP but it’s underrated based on Dyno charts
4r4r4real@reddit
I think the Emira is the only one.
Spicywolff@reddit
Corvette. Miata if you let the soft top slide, BRZ twins since the “rear seats” are lucky to fit my sisters kid let alone an adult.
4r4r4real@reddit
Not a single one of those has 400 HP and a manual?
Spicywolff@reddit
Didn’t see the manual part. Yah seems not much. Supra is close to 400 and has a manual, as does the Z brother.
Breakout_114@reddit
Supra and Z4 are just under 400. Over 400hp manual coupes currently new: Lotus Emira, and two Porsche 718 models.
shouldahadaflat4@reddit
To be fair to the bmw twins they dyno at the rated horsepower to the wheels. So they are well over 400 crank hp.
mini4x@reddit
And with a tune you can tap off a lot.
TurboFucked@reddit
Yeah, but to tune a Supra, you need to ship the DME to Finland to have it unlocked (and you can't get any service updates because it will re-apply the lock).
So, unfortunately, "just a tune" is substantially more involved on the Supra than most other vehicles. Though, JB4s are pretty common.
Word_Underscore@reddit
How reliable is that JB4 stuff in general? I had a 2022 WRX at release and COBB didn't come out for probably a year after release but JB4 was out within weeks
Hardac_@reddit
Wonderful, I'm pushing 415hp and 458ftlb at the wheel on dyno with some simple mods. 376/376 pre-tune. 0 issues with the JB4, dailying it for about 23,000 miles now.
aviciiavbdeadpunk@reddit
DONT JB4, its tricking the ecu to push more power, tlx cars had jb4 and blew up transmissions
_ThugzZ_Bunny_@reddit
Lol please don't talk about things you don't know about
aviciiavbdeadpunk@reddit
I'm literally being told this from a Honda master tech who has a tlx type s 23
_ThugzZ_Bunny_@reddit
I'm a service manager for bmw, They all don't know about tuning like you think they do and them saying that lets me know this one doesn't. If anything it was just the shitty transmission not being able to handle the power. I'm still laughing at your comment about it "tricking the ecu" 😂
aviciiavbdeadpunk@reddit
ok.
_ThugzZ_Bunny_@reddit
Jb4 is great
orangutanDOTorg@reddit
No piggybacks? Or do those not work for cam advance and such? It’s been a while since I tuned a car that couldn’t be flashed by my bike still has a piggyback. Doesn’t have variable cam timing though.
element515@reddit
M2 as well
cookingboy@reddit
The 718 is no longer available. But I did forget about the Emira.
Breakout_114@reddit
Plenty of brand new 718’s still sitting on lots though 🤣
XCCO@reddit
As far as performance, though, it doesn't matter much that the Supra is under 400 when compared to the Z NISMO, so it's still a good option here.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
Lotus Emira is at 400 exactly like the Base Nissan Z.
Porsche isnt making any new 718 cars with >400 horsepower and a manual. You can buy a used GT4 though.
Sexyturtletime@reddit
Zupra
cookingboy@reddit
I thought that is less than 400hp, no?
onlyranchmefries@reddit
It's a BMW drivetrain. They usually put down what they are rated at to the wheels. More like 420-430 at the flywheel.
mini4x@reddit
Doesn't everyone do this since the 70's?
onlyranchmefries@reddit
Nope. The switch in the 70s was from gross to net HP. Gross was engine only HP while net is engine with its full accessory drive, intake system, and full exhaust. Add on top of that the oil crisis and that is what caused HP ratings to plummet. BMW and Porsche are really the only manufacturers that rate by wheel HP.
TurboFucked@reddit
No they don't. This is an internet myth repeated by people who don't actually know what's going on.
There is a standard procedure for measuring certified horsepower figures. This standard is called SAE J1349. It has a few requirements, but the relevant one here is that it requires the engines be run continuously at peak power until HP stops falling and stabilizes (usually 5-10 minutes).
On N/A cars, this usually doesn't make a difference in power. But BMW and Porsche use the regular cooling system to cool the intake charge for their turbo motors. They will overboost the engines until Intake Air Temperatures hit a threshold (or a time limit), then the DMEs will switch over to a low boost table. This low boost table is what the HP rating is measuring.
Dyno operators don't run customer cars for 5 minutes at redline. They just do a simple 30 second pull. They run "SAE correction" which is simply correcting for air temperature and pressure. It is not making the HP rating SAE J1349 certified.
If you dyno a BMW using the certified procedure, the output will be the certified HP figures. It will be bang on too, since modern BMW engines are programmed to request specific torque output. Run a B58 long enough at WOT at 5,500 RPMs and the DME will request 500Nm of torque instead of the 550Nm requested in the high boost table.
Ghost1k25@reddit
That’s a great explanation, thanks for that!
Sexyturtletime@reddit
Only on paper. Car and driver saw 388 at the wheels on a dump.
F1_Geek@reddit
That was the 2020MY, the 2021MY was even higher. They make like ~450 at the Frank.
Sexyturtletime@reddit
What do they make at the Jeff?
F1_Geek@reddit
449
Frank units are always Jeff + 1
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
382 horsepower.
Although it is probablt slightly over 400 at the crank due to how BMW reports horsepower.
Sexyturtletime@reddit
Car and driver saw 388 at the wheels when they put it on a dyno. It’s definitely making > 425 at the crank.
cloudofevil@reddit
M2
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
Not a 2 seater.
Ill-Train6478@reddit
400 under or over doesn’t really matter since Supra or BMW under reports their horsepower numbers and probably makes more horsepower at the wheels than the nismo z. Im pretty sure it will beat this in a straight line
DickKravens@reddit
Nerd!
equitymans@reddit
Facts 😂
roman_maverik@reddit
Neither of those cars are new, so we already have the specs. They are pretty much the same, with the Z slightly faster in the quarter mile (12.2 vs 12.8 seconds).
It all just boils down to which one you think looks better at this point
RFK_Cum_Regimen@reddit
How many fake vents does the Z have? Any fake engine noise? Fake exhaust?
to_the_victors_91@reddit
Isn’t the Z cheaper?
ImBiginKorea@reddit
Got my Nissan z performance for 44k
DynoMenace@reddit
Yeah, I get that this article is all about the Nismo, but all this discussion about the novelty of a 400hp RWD manual sports car seems a bit odd to me, given that the even base model already offered this.
romanLegion6384@reddit
Nissan is going to mark this up like crazy.
stakoverflo@reddit
They already tried that with the non-Nismos and it didn't work out well for them. Why would they try it again?
FireWrath9@reddit
nismo z is 67k, supra is 58k.
Lancer876@reddit
Right but the Supra is going away. Z4 you can argue, but that's way more pricy than the Nismo which regularly gets discounted. M2, yeah that's gonna win on HP but is also pricy. Anything else with a B58 is less athletic than the Supra and won't keep up with the Z
equitymans@reddit
Grand tourer* not really sports car
RFK_Cum_Regimen@reddit
As long as it doesn't have speaker-fed engine noise, I'd buy the shit out of it.
TunakTun633@reddit
Reviews of this thing have been really interesting to me. Transmission aside, people seem to really love the way these things drive.
I'd need a pretty screwy financing agreement and a solid discount to get away with one... but it is a Nissan.
ggtsu_00@reddit
Interesting? This is great! Just too bad it had to be a Nissan...
shd0w2@reddit
$65,000 MSRP for a Nissan oh man
EC_CO@reddit
I'd almost argue that this isn't one either, because they seem to be vaporware. I live in a major Metro and I still have yet to see a single new Z
manesag@reddit
Just got mine, saw two in one day which is the most I’ve seen in one day
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
Living in SoCal, it took me a shocking amount of time until I saw my first one. Now, I've seen about 6-8 of them since that first one. They exist, but they're very hard to find or come across.
Virtual_Industry8553@reddit
I've seen a handful of them living in a midsize Midwest city.
I can count them on one hand, mind you. But they're out there.
4r4r4real@reddit
I've finally seen a couple in the wild. But I've seen more Fisker Oceans and Vinfast VF 8s, and I've already seen half as many ID. Buzz as Zs.
9e78@reddit
How I ended up in a M2. I was waiting for the 400z nismo but kept getting delayed and then didn't have a manual option anyways.
mini4x@reddit
But for less money you can get more than 400hp and a back seat.
Overall_Outcome_392@reddit
Nissan listens to enthusiasts and puts in a manual, then as usual, more people say they will buy a manual than actually do, and Nissan looses a bunch of money and cuts the manual.
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
"As usual"? When have they done that?
Vhozite@reddit
Alright how many of yall are gonna buy it?
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
Hopefully they continue to produce these for a decade+ like they did the 370Z lol. As I said in another comment, I'd strongly consider one but I need a house first in the next year or two. Then some number of years to save up for a weekend toy.
FunkAd95@reddit
I think I will... But I'm also the target audience for this car. Been holding out for the manual trans option on the Nismo. I really don't want another car to modify so this is perfect for me.
cock________________@reddit
enticing if i didn’t have kids. but 2 seats does not work.
Vhozite@reddit
Same here I need a backseat seat even if it’s a tiny one. Though if I could get away with a 2 seater I’d go out and buy a 124 tomorrow
I was mostly talking to the people who were pretending the NISMO not having a manual was the reason the car was irrelevant and why they weren’t gonna buy it.
ThunderGod_Cid13@reddit
I figure this Z is going to have an insanely long life just like the last gen. There should be some happy owners out there with a manual Z NISMO, from what the reviews said it was really just the transmission that held it back.
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
I hope it does; I'd be stretching my budget but I really like the Z, and the Nismo looks significantly better than the base.
I need to get a house first in the next year or two before I can justify getting a second car, but I'd love for the Z to be my weekend toy.
Astramael@reddit
I dunno if this will be popular. But it definitely sounds awesome.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
The price point is probably going to be a little ridiculous.
But it pushes it into a completely different market if its a manual.
Kind of hard to consider the Z Nismo when the C8 stingray was a similar price, and had better performance in every metric.
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
I wouldn't be surprised if "this one had a stick" was a sticking point for some number of buyers though.
Like the C7 is still holding its value a lot better than 'Vettes typically do when a new gen comes out.
TangieChords@reddit
ChatGPT estimated for me that about 20% of Americans can drive manual. But less than 1% of new cars sold are manual. It’s becoming more and more niche to drive one in the US so unfortunately prices will be likely too high
SnikySquirrel@reddit
For as much shit as Nissan gets, it seems they’re at least trying to appeal to enthusiasts again.
BroxigarZ@reddit
Not for $70,000 and $95,000 with dealer markups. Nissan dealers do their damndest to ensure nothing sells.
Odd-Refrigerator-425@reddit
The Z wasn't selling with the markups they were applying in years past, why do you think they'll try it again?
The only way some dealer will ask $95 for one of these if it's done as a "we don't actually want to sell it, it's a showroom piece to get people in the door -- but for the right rich idiot, yea we'll sell it"
MembershipNo2077@reddit
I'm seeing them again because I don't see dealer markups. In fact, I see them for $5-10k under MSRP near me. That's a fair price, but I didn't give it a look initially due to its lack of manual. Now that would be an interesting proposition.
RobinsShaman@reddit
I have my permission to ignore enthusiasts before the company go to bankrupt.
mini4x@reddit
As they circle the drain.
Shoopin@reddit
Nissan is cool again leave them alone :(
smashedsaturn@reddit
Recently been looking around at 3 row SUVs, and shockingly the Armada and Pathfinder are both looking really really enticing compared to the rest. And this is coming from the owner of a 2010 Murano that we've sworn multiple times we wouldn't want another Nissan.
Fenrirsulfur@reddit
This and the Frontier Pro 4X R are definitely great offerings to those enthusiasts.
peakdecline@reddit
The Frontier Pro4X (R or not, the Rousch stuff is nothing that interesting) is a joke compared to what all the other mid-size trucks are doing for enthusiast versions....
printaport@reddit
Likely too late at this point.
EarthOk2418@reddit
Agreed. The Z hasn’t been relevant in a long time. Adding a manual transmission to the NISMO version is “too little, too late”.
peakdecline@reddit
As of July the Z had posted 3700\~ in 2025. That's higher than all of 2024 total. Car sales are seasonal but that's a pace that's set to match and maybe even slightly exceed the Supras best year (2021).
I wouldn't be surprised by all said and done it gets close or even eclipses A90 sales numbers in the US.
EC_CO@reddit
That's surprising because I live in a major Metro and I still have yet to see one
peakdecline@reddit
I've seen a couple in my area in a small city in the Midwest... soo.... I don't know what to tell you.
Ultimately though we're talking around 8000\~ units moved total so far. They barely made or sold any in 2023 and into 2024. Its really only been the last half of '24 and now '25 where they started producing them in number.
equitymans@reddit
Because you’re in the Midwest lol it’s only selling any real units in random areas. Larger the city the less chances of even seeing one at a dealer. Typical Nissan knowing their demo 😂
EarthOk2418@reddit
I live in LA and have only ever seen two - one regular Z and one NISMO.
PlatinumElement@reddit
I live in the SGV and am starting to see them as often as Supras and Type Rs here, they’re becoming pretty popular. Only color I haven’t seen is bright red, but I’ve seen a lot of black, burgundy, white, and grey ones
B0bab0i@reddit
I see more lambos and exotics than Nissan Z’s in SGV.
MembershipNo2077@reddit
A year ago, same, but I've now seen quite a few in the last few months. I guess sales are picking up now that dealers aren't marking them up $10-20k.
iSlacker@reddit
I see this all the time, but I live in fucking Tulsa and see 1 or 2 a week. I just don't believe it.
mini4x@reddit
Same here, Boston area, I see Ferraris, and Lamborghinis all over, C8's galore, more Camaros and Mustangs than you care to count, not a single Z.
tjflex19@reddit
I've seen a few street parked in Brooklyn. So they're around but still rare as hell to see.
hustlehustle@reddit
I’m seeing more and more in Vancouver and I’ll be honest - they look awesome.
handymanshandle@reddit
I see them every now and then in North Alabama. Supras are certainly more common but I do see Zs, although I haven’t seen a Nismo one yet.
Jamaican_Dynamite@reddit
Yeah, but that's still not a lot. Z sales haven't really recovered in several years. It's on borrowed time like the Supra. Both are pretty much niche sports cars at this point.
But I could be wrong.
peakdecline@reddit
Define several years? 2025 will be the strongest Z series sales since 2015. If you took Q1 + Q2 numbers and doubled it... that's the best year since 2010....
They're never, ever going to match years like 2005-2007. And I confident in saying Nissan was fully aware that would be the case. And I'd bet even 10K units was considered a very lofty goal.
They'll sell this model for probably a decade in total if they can maintain volume like this year. And I personally think the Z's best years are ahead of it.
mini4x@reddit
Meanwhile Chevy sold 13,000 Corvettes already in 2025.
SnikySquirrel@reddit
The nice thing about Corvettes selling well is that they’re one of the only sports cars that undoubtedly will always be able to be bought used cheap.
hopfield@reddit
Not really…if you want a manual GS or Z06 it’s just as expensive as the Japanese equivalents
peakdecline@reddit
Corvettes numbers are remarkably consistent, frankly. The C8 numbers are as good as ever for Corvette in the last 20 years. 2022 was the best individual year going back to 2005.
Meanwhile everyone else? Its bad. Mustang? Sales are less roughly 1/3rd off 10 and 20 years ago. Before it was killed off the Camaro had a similar story.
EarthOk2418@reddit
You’re totally right. The Z4, the Supra’s platform mate, is dead after this model year. No official announcement yet, but I’m sure the same goes for the Supra as well.
Jamaican_Dynamite@reddit
Like it's unfortunate to say it. And I'm happy they're both back. But for example, 20 years ago, they were selling 10k to 37k Zs a year. It's a dying market.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
In fact, there were many sports car gone in new car market 20 years ago, but Z was one of cars had luck to survive until today.
mini4x@reddit
Weren;t they always, it's not liek previous Z's sold all that great. Back in the early 2000s they had a couple years they sold about 30k a year, since then they haven't sold crap, one or two years in teh late 2000's when the 370 came out but they barely broke 10k that year.
vw18t@reddit
If it actually passes the A90 Supra lifetime sales numbers in the US that’s a massive accomplishment by Nissan
peakdecline@reddit
I think there's an outside chance of it happening for two reasons.... I'd bet the Z ends up being for sales longer than the A90 (7 years) and Nissan probably won't be trying to do as tight of a n-1 of supply/demand like Toyota does.
If the Z has no competition from the Supra for 2026 (and probably most of 2027 too) then strong sales (relative) are possible.
THE_GR8_MIKE@reddit
That's what no stop-sale will do.
PlatinumElement@reddit
IMO, this is the Z’s selling point. It’s the most old school car you can get on the market outside of a Morgan or Caterham. Old fashioned analog cars and Sports cars are both tiny markets nowadays, however the Venn diagram overlap for those two markets is relatively high. I want my next daily to be as simple and old school as possible, and the Z is becoming more and more intriguing
EarthOk2418@reddit
A manual transmission with computerized rev matching in a vehicle with a drive by wire gas pedal isn’t old school in the least.
PlatinumElement@reddit
So which cars can you buy today that still use a cable throttle?
SirLoremIpsum@reddit
70 series LandCruiser
EarthOk2418@reddit
That’s not my point. My point is that the Nissan Z isn’t “old school” or “analog” by any sense of the imagination. The platform on which it’s built may archaic and date back to the 370 Z days, but that’s about it. It has as much technology and electronic wizardry as every other new vehicle on the market.
420bIaze@reddit
The GR86/BRZ or Mx5 seem far more "old school".
briansmith@reddit
I would say the 370z fits that description better than the new Z.
mini4x@reddit
Old school, meaning clanky and rides like it's 30 years old... because it basically is.
EarthOk2418@reddit
Well yeah I have to agree with you there.
k0fi96@reddit
How? The 370z got made for almost a decade. The only way these sports cars work now is with long product cycles and little updates to keep people interested.
TunakTun633@reddit
Tell that to the Supra / Z4.
Natedoggsk8@reddit
Why too late?
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
People said same word in A90 Supra inb4. MkV Supra was supposed to be AT only, but Toyota offered MT option after years.
Standard-Juice-3738@reddit
I gotta disagree. My friend has a Nismo and it’s pretty badass. Just priced too high. But he got a really good deal on it
claspen@reddit
Ok then let's discontinue it all together so we can have 3 more crossovers that can actually make a profit.
Hugh-Jass24@reddit
Most likely but the rarity will make it sought after even more.
Serious_Flounder_953@reddit
Just bought the performance model on Labor Day 😭
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
I've said it before here but this car deserves revisiting. Red manual v6tt 400hp stock and can get them base for 35/36k and performance at 41k/42k. It would be a fun car to mod.
quikslvr223@reddit
I'd like to be corrected if I'm wrong, but I believe the Z is the only current mass-production sports car to have both a motorsport-related engine (Nissan runs the VR in Super GT, albeit the 3.8L) and a manual transmission.
Gone are the days of your new sports car having a consumer version of the same 3S-GTE or RB26DETT that tore up tracks around the world. The Z is all that's left of that era.
no_real_dinner@reddit
Does Miata count with the MX-5 cup?
wWratWw@reddit
There's just no way. 2003 350z base was 46k adjusted for inflation.
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
You have to follow the regional discounts. They may not be as high as they were a few weeks ago, but they're still good.
Performance even lower than I expected, I'm telling you this thing is getting slept on. See links below:
Base for 36.9 https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/719496ba-3e4e-4604-b039-1a6463beefc9/?aff=atempest2&utm_campaign=atempest2&utm_source=autotempest&utm_medium=trp&utm_campaign_id=2&utm_trusted=TRUE
Performance 39.9
https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/309f7554-11a6-4dfd-a035-de5f6da21d17/?aff=atempest2&utm_campaign=atempest2&utm_source=autotempest&utm_medium=trp&utm_campaign_id=2&utm_trusted=TRUE
Performance 40.5
https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/0afb43a6-3254-45da-b4ec-14aadc84a82f/?aff=atempest2&utm_campaign=atempest2&utm_source=autotempest&utm_medium=trp&utm_campaign_id=2&utm_trusted=TRUE
wWratWw@reddit
That's crazy. Dealer still asking over 50 for performance in my area https://www.redwoodcitynissan.com/new-Redwood+City-2025-Nissan-Z-Performance+Coupe+2D-JN1BZ4BH9SM411677
airblizzard@reddit
Yeah sports cars are high demand low supply in CA. The Integra Type S can be had for $5,000 off MSRP on the east coast but the dealers here refuse to budge.
wWratWw@reddit
I knew it was much easier to go cross country to get really in demand stuff like Porsche in the winter since the sport car market really slows down in the winter in other parts. I'm realizing now it's not a corner case anymore. Coworker can't get a GTS here for less than 25k adm, but can get a build slot on the east coast for MSRP. I just didn't think the demand difference would be that big for Z
ImBiginKorea@reddit
44k for a performance in Nebraska this summer.
86Austin@reddit
now compare it to wages!
manesag@reddit
I just got a base for just around 37k, need to put a bit more miles on it but I plan on throwing an LSD into it. Should be $2k for the LSD and install. Which to me is worth it considering I won’t track the car
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Okay, where is our new Z convertible ?
THE_GR8_MIKE@reddit
They're probably focusing on the car itself before making a heavier less rigid version.
FreshPots87@reddit
I'm sorry, where are you seeing base for 35/36k? Because "Sport" is the lowest trim starting at 43k.
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
See the links below.
FreshPots87@reddit
Ah gotcha. Technically "used" but with less than 20 miles on the odometer, hardly would count it so. Thanks.
5ekundes@reddit
I really wanted this car 3 months ago during my car shopping but dealers are asking $65k OTD (socal taxed), I told em this doesn't make sense since supra is around if I were to go that price range. I get the 400 hp though the car feels heavy and I wanted something light. It's just like driving a smaller mustang while retaining the weight.
I might consider getting this again depending on how the car market is 2-3 years from now.
Rivers33@reddit
This is going to be an absolute blast to drive. The normal Z NISMO was missing one key thing... three pedals... Forget lap times... they don't matter here. Fun is the name of the game and this will be tough to beat in terms of playfulness.
CAM22b@reddit
THANK GOD. Now I can someday drive my fav modern Nissan and not have it be a silly automatic
RacerM53@reddit
No tell dealers to stop marking these up
blondiemetal@reddit
Now let's hope Porsche takes a lesson from this and puts the manual back in the Porsche 911 S.
claspen@reddit
I mean they kind of did with the sport classic, but that was more of a GT2 touring.
blondiemetal@reddit
The S had a manual (I have a 992.1 4S with a manual). The 992.2 S is non-hybrid but is now unavailable in manual.
The only manuals available now in Porsche are the 911 T and the GT3.
Wishful thinking on a Turbo S with manual---but it was written as such. My dealer has said that rumor has swirled around Porsche forever. I'm just saying I would love it.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
I don't see them putting a manual in the Turbo. Would be awesome, but that combo has literally never been done before.
AWD + Manual + Hybrid.
But if someone was going to do it, it probably would be Porsche.
theBdub22@reddit
The 996 Turbo and Turbo S came with a stick
blondiemetal@reddit
Yes, but no longer. Tough audience here--I wish they incorporated more manuals back into their cars.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
The upcoming Turbo/Turbo s will be a hybrid.
Yes, the Turbo has had a stick in the past, but adding the Hybrid part is what makes it a combo that has never been done before.
There have been a few Hybrid + manual cars, and quite a lot of AWD + manual cars.
But never an AWD, Manual, Hybrid production car.
theBdub22@reddit
Oh, my bad I misread that
blondiemetal@reddit
That's what I mean. I'd love to see it happen and if anyone could do it, it would be Porsche.
WorldClassPianist@reddit
Overpriced. The old 370z nismo started in the low 40s. The new Z nismo starts high 60s. Makes no sense. They're practically the same car.
PeanutPicante@reddit
Yeah, you know, except for the turbos, body, digital dash, etc, etc. Basically the same car. /s
megahornet@reddit
This will be great for the 12 r/cars users when they'll buy it second hand.
On a more serious note, I appreciate Nissan doing this but this is a little too late. In the past couple of years I've seen a total of 3 new Z's across 3 different countries (2 were seen in Los Angeles, and the last in Nissan's HQ in Yokohama). It's a lovely enthusiast car, but most enthusiasts aren't the ones buying these cars in today's market, hell the average Joe can barely afford a Corolla today. The people who will buy these will mainly be older people who want a cheap sports car or are experiencing a midlife crisis and can't afford a Corvette and their credit is too low for German manufacturers. Those buyers are less likely to buy a manual car, imo making the automatic transmission a DCT similar to the Corvette's in feel would be a better business choice (while axing the manual so they only manufacture one type of transmission to save costs).
platinum_toilet@reddit
I am sure the few thousand of people will enjoy this car.
theBdub22@reddit
I remember them saying that the Nismo was too powerful for the manual transmission. I wonder what changed.
frsh2fourty@reddit
A few different articles mentioned they are reworking the transmission internals and changing gear ratios
ChillDwill@reddit
The CEO lmfao
frankztn@reddit
For a while, most LS,RB and JZ swapped cars ran Nissan CD transmissions.
BTTWchungus@reddit
The CD009 is extremely durable, that was a bogus statement from them
roman_maverik@reddit
Their warranty accounting cost regression testing.
Cakedonut1@reddit
after driving a super car on the track with auto. I am so torn on the manual now... (i was a die hard manual lover till this)
ConversationSome4824@reddit
Traffic is unbearable these days. If you actually want to enjoy driving, get a sports car or go off-road. A fast car won’t make traffic any less frustrating.
Aggressive-Web3038@reddit
Traffic is insufferable these days. If you actually want to have fun driving, just get a sports car or go off road. Sitting in traffic feels the same no matter how fast your car is.
s3cf_@reddit
this or m2? 🤔
yobo9193@reddit
“This or a car that goes for $20k more?”
TookEverything@reddit
NISMO Z is around the same price as an M2. For much less car.
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
Can easily find a nismo z 53-55k there's no stingray or m2 within 15k of that
TookEverything@reddit
Brand new? With dealer discounts maybe, and only because everyone knows it isn’t worth anywhere near its actual price. $50-55k is what it should’ve been in the first place.
Educational_Age_1333@reddit
https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/dc9bb7e0-61ae-4920-b50c-3d9bf6ed7295/?aff=atempest2&utm_campaign=atempest2&utm_source=autotempest&utm_medium=trp&utm_campaign_id=2&utm_trusted=TRUE
TookEverything@reddit
Yeah, like I said. They weren’t moving at MSRP.
TunakTun633@reddit
It depends on what you want. The M2 is unquestionably more modern - a better daily for some.
But the reviews of this Nismo model have been pretty excellent - with the sole exception of the transmission. If you're a sports car person, this one easy.
Kamukix@reddit
That's awesome! I enjoyed driving the auto version of the Nismo Z, but I very much kept thinking that it would be so much more enjoyable with a manual. Glad to hear they're actually going to do it. It's a very good (and good looking) car, but it's missing that last little piece, to me.
Kudos to Nissan 👍👍
EntertainmentCute914@reddit
that’s the dream right there 😍 a NISMO Z with a manual? I’d love to get my hands on one of those!
DanielG165@reddit
Very cool. With the Camaro gone, outside of used examples of course, the market is pining for another track-focused sports car with a manual transmission that isn’t the Mustang.
randeus@reddit
If you’re talking about the DH, that definitely has a manual.
JustaguyTTV@reddit
better than what most of the industry's doing so i'll take it
reddit-eats-shit@reddit
It’s like they’re trying to go bankrupt
meuria132@reddit
beautiful car
knwnasrob@reddit
Happy to see.
I test drove a Nismo Z last month and just couldn’t get over it being an automatic.
Maybe the manual will entice me to buy.
Fresco_cas@reddit
If they listen to enthusiasts they better expect enthusiast level of sales. If anything has been truth is that every car oriented towards that niche is bound to have small sales number.
Skensis@reddit
If this was at launch, I might have considered.
Gas0line@reddit
If they'd offer it in Europe I'd buy one today.
steve626@reddit
Oh, I just saw one of these in Tucson.
GadFlyBy@reddit
Does Nissan know how to make a decent MT anymore?
Smart-As-Duck@reddit
I am only now starting to see the new Zs around.
Would have loved to pick up a manual Nismo.
AudiB9S4@reddit
Excellent.
icanredditgood@reddit
They still won’t buy it. Way too expensive for what you get.
Due_Percentage_1929@reddit
❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Huge-Goal5528@reddit
Will the dealers add a ~~bullshit greedy markup~~ market adjustment like they did for the 400? And then complain they don't sell?
THE_GR8_MIKE@reddit
Yeah, like, what the fuck were they 'thinking*.
SecretPantyWorshiper@reddit
The proportions on this car are absolutely beautiful. Front headlights are so wonky but it looks good everywhere else. Shame that its hindered by the overpriced MSRP and marginal track performance
C0gInDaMachine@reddit
And only like 5 people will end up actually buying these. Lmao.
Manginaz@reddit
Dammit I wanted a performance cvt.
Dan_TheGreat@reddit
i think the issue with the nismo was also the fact that it was like 70 grand which is fucking bonkers. Having a stick is cool but come the fuck on.
TheAntiAirGuy@reddit
If only this thing would be available in Europe for a reasonable"non import" price
nerdpox@reddit
Nissan wasted years claiming the car would never get a manual. Read the fucking room dudes
streetkiller@reddit
Imagine how great it would be if all manufacturers did this.
MoirasPurpleOrb@reddit
And it likely won’t sell very well
Sexyturtletime@reddit
What do they make at the Jeff?
mini4x@reddit
Teh same manual that had a stop sale on the base Z ?? :)
(and had serious synchro issues in the previous 2 maybe 3 generations.)
turboash78@reddit
I think I've seen a grand total of 2 of those in the wild. And it might have been the same one twice.
DM725@reddit
Oh wow. Definitely did not see this coming.
bazbloom@reddit
Asking an honest question because I can't find a straight answer anywhere else:
Did Nissan ever detail to any degree the transmission issues that prompted the initial stop sales? What did they fix, if anything?
One of the worst product launches in recent automotive history, FWIW.
immortan_drew@reddit
I wonder if the shift linkage can handle this engine tune?
Spicywolff@reddit
Nismo Xtra package includes LSD, and added red piping on seats. 5k add on package.
Seriously I don’t see this helping sales with the current gen.
Unlucky-Work3678@reddit
Too little too late at this point. They should have said so within 6 months releasing Z