Is a Piper still fine after my CFI jumped on the wing to celebrate?
Posted by Limp-Breath1942@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 42 comments
Weird post I know but I can't stop thinking about this and wanted to get some thoughts on if this something anyone would even give second thought to.
I’m a low-time student in California and noticed something on my last flight that has me thinking. My instructor hopped out of the Piper after a student’s first solo when were taxing and, in the excitement, he literally jumped up and down on the wing like it was a dance floor. I appreciate his enthusiasm for his students but as I was watching this I couldn’t believe someone would jump on an airplane wing.
I know the wings see way more stress in flight and during landings, and he was on the reinforced step area, but I can’t help wondering if that kind of treatment is rough on the structure. Would anything like that even show up in a normal inspection, or am I just overthinking it? Could it damage the wing spar?
I’m probably overthinking this. I’ve just always assumed everyone would treat planes gently, and now I have this irrational fear about what happens to the rentals when I’m not around. Is it common for people to jump on wings?
Has anyone else seen instructors or students do something like that? I’ve always assumed everyone would treat life-saving machines with care, but I guess not.
New_Line4049@reddit
If someone jumping on the wing is likely to cause any issues for the structure then keep jumping till that fucker snaps and do everyone a favour, it wasn't safe before you started jumping so ensuring it never flies again is the best way.
For most aircraft though theres no issue there. From a quick Google the structural G limit of the Cherokee is +4.4g. That means that wing spar can happily survive being loaded up with over 4x the Max takeoff weight of the aircraft. (Note, this is in utility category, but even in normal category is a 3.8g limit) Theres no way youre instructor is heavy enough to be an issue for structure designed to support over 4x the aircrafts weight. This is all before we consider the safety factor that'll be built in, so in reality, it's designed to take even more.
Also, in turbulence the aircraft is, in effect, jumping up and down on its own wing. Its all going through the main spar just the same as your instructors weight.
Yeah, no, if theres any danger here that's not a plane you should be flying in to begin with.
The only things Id be concerned about is the instructor denting or scratching the skin (exposing metal and allowing corrosion to occur). That said, this isnt really an issue on the step area, and could be spotted from a regular visual inspection during preflight anyway.
When I was trained to do flight servicing/line work I was always told to be brutal, far better it breaks in my hand on the ground than in the hands of airflow and turbulence in the cruise.
Alternative-Cat5533@reddit
It’s completely fine. Think about the weight of your CFI. Then think about the amount of Gs you’re pulling when you do a steep turn in that thing.
MDT230@reddit
The reinforced step area, as noted, is built for stepping and putting weight. So it should be find
teleterminal@reddit
It's built for stepping on and most pipers have cracked wing walk doublers already. He's jumping on it which creates much higher forces.
MDT230@reddit
Ohhh I didn’t read the “Jumping” part. Then yea , no bueno on that Chief
TuwtlesF1@reddit
Consider the fact that the wing is supporting all of the weight, and more, while flying. If a plane can sustain 4Gs, at a max weight of 1320, lets say, the wings can actually support almost 6,000 pounds before they will experience structural damage.
shrunkenhead041@reddit
All good. Look what you can do to a Mooney.
Mooney MSE with 30 Employees on Wing https://share.google/zTFuj4Le4W9VIyQw2
No_Mathematician2527@reddit
Alright we need balance. So Rhonda, Jessica, you get on the RH wingtip. Karen your on the Left...
What's wrong Karen?
skyvector@reddit
Irrelevant comment. The OP is asking about a Piper.
Classic_Ad_9985@reddit
That’s pretty sick actually
Electrical_Ad8367@reddit
Woah way cool
Guap-Zero@reddit
Was he aura farming on the taxi?
classysax4@reddit
Do you know the negative G rating of the plane? Multiply the gross weight by the negative G rating. If your CFI weighs less than this, the plane is okay.
goldlord44@reddit
That is not how pressure forced work. You are assuming the CFI is distributed across both wings for that..
witheringtie975@reddit
Ive done several landings in it that even navy pilots would say is too hard and they are un phased by it
Previous-Distance81@reddit
You should quit. Everything will be worse than this.
JarlWeaslesnoot@reddit
If he jumped on the wingtip I'd be worried. If he jumped on the wing walk at the root, whatever. As an A&P I'd rather it didn't happen but it's not gonna hurt the plane badly.
VirAntiguaMike@reddit
Remember, those wings are holding up the plane on the ground and in the air. An extra 180 lbs on the wing on the ground isn’t gonna hurt it
teleterminal@reddit
He jumped on it, that's more like 2-3x the weight in point load. I guarantee he either started or worsened a cracked wing walk doubler
anomalkingdom@reddit
An extra 180 lbs on the wing on the ground isn’t gonna hurt it
That's my line from now on when my wife catches me in the fridge at night
teleterminal@reddit
You should inspect the wing walk with a borescope. Most of them are cracked, it's not a huge problem until the cracks connect between the ribs of the doubler.
btgeekboy@reddit
You can tell the CFI has never had to pay for that repair before. It ain’t cheap, I tell you what
teleterminal@reddit
Yea, you have to pull the fuel tank and entire wing to get to it. It's a huge amount of work
link_dead@reddit
Piper's requires an eddy current inspection.
teleterminal@reddit
Incorrect. Piper requires an Eddy current inspection of the spar bolt holes. Not the wing walk.
jersledz@reddit
Not on the wing walk-that’s the spar bolt holes.
TobyADev@reddit
I assume since it was the step area which is reinforced, you’ll be fine
oldbutambulatorty@reddit
Careless, reckless,juvenile, and ignorant. I doubt any aircraft owner would do this to their own plane.
JerryWagz@reddit
You must be fun at parties
oldbutambulatorty@reddit
I party with adults. Avoid self absorbed man children.
Rich-Cucumber-5821@reddit
If it was the far end of the wing it would be damaged but it’s supported more at the base.
GengisGone@reddit
Nah, students (including myself when I trained in a Piper) slam that shit all the time into the pavement at a vertical speed of -5 million. It’ll be fine.
IvanYakinovski@reddit
My very first student dumped the flaps on a go around and I was too slow to react. Man that was embarrassing…
Jolly_Line@reddit
That fucking hyperbolic number has me rolling 🤣
Kotukunui@reddit
You might be able to oilcan a skin panel by jumping on it in the unsupported middle of the square of rivets, but the wingspars are tough.
If the CFI wasn’t wearing stiletto heels and leaving little puncture marks with each jump, I think the aircraft will be fine.
RBR927@reddit
“I know it’s way less stress than it normally goes through in a flight, but….”
There’s your answer.
if_a_sloth-it_sleeps@reddit
My cousin tripped getting out of our tripacer (I have no idea how this is just what he said) and if the spar was damaged you would ABSOLUTELY see it. Also, yes you should check the wing spars on preflight.
Oh wait, I just realized “jumping on the wing”. Ok so the cousin who tripped and destroyed the wing spar… his dad did a little hop jump to get into our bonanza…. Except the hop-jump ended up with him face planting into the side of the airplane because the step broke.
I’m always super gentle getting on and off… but they’re surprisingly tough. I worry more about the jumping up and down if they’re farther back because there have been too many times where a tail almost hit the ground when there’s too much weight or excitement farther back
Brotein40@reddit
ARE YOU CALLING ME FAT ANDREW
flyingron@reddit
There's a promotional movie from the days they were new showing a woman running out to the end of a Navion wing and jumping into a pool as if the thing were an aluminum diving board.
x4457@reddit
Completely fine.
helno@reddit
The step area is reinforced. If this was that easily damaged it would be very hard to get into the aircraft.
The spar has to handle the force of very hard landings. It will be just fine.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Weird post I know but I can't stop thinking about this and wanted to get some thoughts on if this something anyone would even give second thought to.
I’m a low-time student in California and noticed something on my last flight that has me thinking. My instructor hopped out of the Piper after a student’s first solo when were taxing and, in the excitement, he literally jumped up and down on the wing like it was a dance floor. I appreciate his enthusiasm for his students but as I was watching this I couldn’t believe someone would jump on an airplane wing.
I know the wings see way more stress in flight and during landings, and he was on the reinforced step area, but I can’t help wondering if that kind of treatment is rough on the structure. Would anything like that even show up in a normal inspection, or am I just overthinking it? Could it damage the wing spar?
I’m probably overthinking this. I’ve just always assumed everyone would treat planes gently, and now I have this irrational fear about what happens to the rentals when I’m not around. Is it common for people to jump on wings?
Has anyone else seen instructors or students do something like that? I’ve always assumed everyone would treat life-saving machines with care, but I guess not.
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