Those who moved abroad with kids - how did they handle the transition?
Posted by jonescm12@reddit | expats | View on Reddit | 56 comments
My wife and I are considering a three year work assignment in Switzerland and we currently have twin two year old girls and my wife is pregnant with another.
It may not matter as much to our kids since they are still so young but I am curious how the transition was for your kids?
SuspiciousOnion2137@reddit
My husband and I were both expat kids and we have two of our own. Whether a move is great or terrible depends on a lot of different factors and not all of those are under your control. That said, switching the language of instruction can be really uncomfortable and upsetting and it gets worse as your child gets older. Expat adults often seem to underestimate how awkward changing national curriculums without changing the language of instruction can be. The language may stay the same but the sequence things are taught in and expectations can vary widely.
We used to move quite frequently with our kids when they were younger and they did quite well because we were living in places with a high number of expats that had schools that understood the pros and cons of transitions. The wheels fell off the cart when my husband’s employer moved us ‘back’ to the US a country our children did not know. We enrolled them in a highly regarded public school district. Our district botched the transition so badly our kids were diagnosed with a permanent anxiety condition. I learned from reaching out to people who specialise in globally mobile children that stories of local schools not understanding the needs of expat children are very common. Your move to Switzerland with your toddlers is likely to be simple, but a move back to the US may be more complicated than you realise. If your kids thrive there I would think very hard about moving back and who would really benefit from that move. Happiness is never guaranteed and we should never take it for granted in ourselves or our children.
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
That's interesting - what do you think the school did that created this anxiety? We are moving from the UK to the US now and initially our kids will be in french school and I suspect they are very used to international move - the kids understand some french as im french but it will definitely be a transition for my eldest (7) to be taught in french. We were considering eventually moving them into the US state system for middle school - maybe by then the transition will feel more natural but curious to hear more about your experience
SuspiciousOnion2137@reddit
Our kids’ local public school messed up because they assumed that American culture was default and they didn’t need to help our kids with the transition.
As an adult TCK from an American/British/French family your plan concerns me. French international schools are overseas French public schools, that is why French nationals do not pay tuition. For the majority of their students coming from overseas there will be a seamless transition from what they were learning the year before. My husband switched back and forth between French, British, and American schools as a kid and his parents thought it was effortless and he thought it was intensely stressful. It wasn’t just the language transitions that were tough, but the fact that different concepts are taught at different times. For some reason the big difference always seems to be long division. I have no idea why. To make it even worse, the way long division is taught in the French curriculum is completely different from everyone else. It seems to make it really tough for people who transition from the French curriculum to others after it is taught. The major danger though is if you leave a curriculum that teacher an important concept later and jump into one that taught it earlier. Then you show up already at an academic disadvantage when you are already experiencing culture shock.
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
Thanks that's really useful to know. My kids have been in the UK system but are still small (turning 4 and 7 this summer). They understand french but will definitely have a transition to make with the language. I'm not concerned about my little one as he will be preK and most in his class will be learning french from scratch from what I understand. I am a bit worried it will be a baptism of fire with the french for my eldest who will be starting 2nd grade - that said he is a very fluent reader in english and is able to sound out in french so hopefully that will help.
We are french citizen and will be looking into AEFE bursaries - that being said they are quite constrained for people who are homeowners so we may not be eligible. The main goal for me is to support the french they are hearing at home with schooling so that they both become fully bilingual by middle school. It's been difficult to reach this level with me being the only french speaker in our current environment. After this we will have to re-assess what the best school is for them. We could stay on the french school / IB track or switch to something else locally.
We also have the option to go back to the UK in their current school at any point if we feel like we/the children are out of our depth. I don't want to mess them around too much but also want to be responsive to their experience and do what's best for them. I'm pretty clued up on the UK curriculum so would feel confident supplementing in view of a return if needed. You are right that long divisions are taught differently in France but overall so far there has been a huge amount of overlap between how they have learnt additions, subtractions, multiplications so far with how i was taught in France.
I'd love to understand more about what was stressful in your husband experience (was it the switch of teaching method / curriculum?) I want to make the transition a happy one for them
SuspiciousOnion2137@reddit
Apparently it was one thing hearing French at home and responding in English, and another thing having it be the language of instruction and socialisation all day at school. He felt a lot of pressure to catch up with his peers. What to his father looked effortless took a lot of work and worry.
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
out of curiosity does he speak french now?
SuspiciousOnion2137@reddit
He spoke more French when I met him because he had recently lived in France. I suspect it’s currently in a kind of hibernation mode where his French is OK, but not as good as it otherwise would be. Oddly enough one of our kids is quite the Francophone and has been taking private lessons through the Alliance Française twice a week since COVID, and his French is more contemporary. He uses words like ‘enfin’ and refers to his teacher as ‘ma prof’.
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
That's amazing! My kid has been going to alliance francaise once a week for a week and we have seen no progress (admittedly it was from 5 to 6 so he was young) - I think its a question of motivation - right now none of his friends speak french and even though I try to speak to french to them they know i'm fluent in english so we're not doing great on the bilinguism yet
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
That's very fair. I am extremely mindful that this will be a lot of work (and pressure) for him and fully intend to acknowledge that and support him through it. I'm prepared to remind him regularly that going to school in a new language is brave and hard and to branch out of school for activites etc. I do believe his peers will all speak english given the school is in the US and so will understand him. I don't know if it will make a difference, but I'm also prepared to go back to an english speaking school if this becomes too hard for him. I just feel like its a last window for us to give it a shot before it closes. Thanks for the feedback though!
NyxVivendi@reddit
My parents moved when I was 9 (now 28) and the following years were without the shadow of a doubt the most miserable of my life. I didn't ask for this, I lost my friends, a good chunk of my family, kids at school were awful and I just wasn't able to communicate anymore without everybody making fun of my accent. The resulting isolation created deep social and character flaws that took years and years of hardwork to straighten up. I felt like a monkey in a zoo and was extremely unhappy for years. Man, that was next level-shitty.
That was nearly 20 years ago, now I'm happy in my country. I've reached some point of equilibrium between my two citizenships a couple years ago, which has thrown me in a very real and itchy existential crisis. I used to be French, but now I'm more Canadian, and it fucks up my mind. Sometimes I wonder why my parents have moved but I know my views are skewed. I'm very tempted to go and try out my birthplace for a year or two so I can find out where I belong the most, it's like I need to know. I'm sure it will be nearly as bad as the first time, but the other way around, but at least this time I'll be free to just GO HOME and feel at peace, at last! :)
Illustrious-Web9868@reddit
Do you think it would have been different if you were younger? Do you feel like it had to do with the school and were you verbalising this at the time? We are moving our kids (aged 7 and 4) from the UK to the US but they will be going to a french school there (as they are half french). I'm thinking if they're not happy I will move them into a different school but curious to know if your experience was wider than the uneasiness iwth the school environment
SignatureSea6649@reddit
I can relate to this — I was born in Europe, went back to the US, then moved three times out of the US for a year or more at a time. The final time when I was fifteen was VERY VERY tough. I have never felt at peace or at home anywhere and also quite out of place. I hope you found some peace.
NyxVivendi@reddit
I did! It took a while though. I hope you get better too, stay strong, it does indeed inflict lasting damage, I went through so much only moving once I cannot imagine moving back and forth. :(
EggLord9919@reddit
Slightly late- but here's my take on it. I don't have kids of my own but I do have personal experience to share. Born in Sydney, and when I was 2 moved to Milan, Italy. Shortly after when I was 3 I moved to Dubai, and at around 6 moved to Germany. Then moved to Brisbane when I was 10. Personally, I think overall moving is a good experience as its more likely to give your kids an open mind towards cultures and new experiences, and can develop their social skills as they might need to make new friends often (or it might do the opposite, it's a 50/50). But from experience, it might affect their ability to make emotional attachments, especially if you're planning on moving a lot because they will be forced to detach themselves in order to not get hurt. I'd say they'd likely be affected once the three (or now 1) year is over, as they're old enough to remember by now. I know you didn't specifically ask for advice but I just wanted to share some (and also the statements are based off of my experiences obviously). Overall experiences are subjective, and your kids might react differently to what I said here (or even not at all).
Apprehensive_Ad3076@reddit
We are thinking of moving from the UK to a fairly small but safe city in South America, with a 5 year old and a 1 year old. The 5 year old has a nice group of friends here, though they are all about to go separate ways from pre-school to different primary schools.
Adapting to the new environment should be easy enough, as it's my wife's city, and he will have a LOT of family there and already a basic knowledge of the language. My biggest concern will be coming back to the UK after (approximately) 2-3 years. He will be 8-9yo then. Still young enough to adapt well, but I'm worried that he'll find it hard to re-integrate, especially with the difference in culture and leaving his cousins behind.
Our main reasons to move are to be close to family as the kids are younger, save money on childcare for a few years while the youngest isn't in school yet, and also get a bit more time with the kids ourselves (hopefully less intense work schedules due to lower living costs).
Anyone have any thoughts on this or similar experiences?
nonsense39@reddit
I moved internationally (a couple of countries including in the Middle East) with my daughter who initially was 2. She loved that sort of lifestyle so much that she dedicated her career to working internationally (UN) and subsequently raised her two kids in Africa, Middle East and now living in Latin America. Your children will benefit greatly from this experience, so don't be concerned.
FlatwormMain4917@reddit
Amazing! Did you love own you own (single parent) or with a partner?
nonsense39@reddit
Wow! A question on my comment from a year ago. I went with my wife and the country was Iran. My grandchildren are now confident internationally savvy teenagers and speak several languages.
jonescm12@reddit (OP)
Oh wow, that's awesome!
AccountForDoingWORK@reddit
I moved internationally every 3 years as a kid. I was an only child. It was fine for a bit but the first time I remember the moves wrecking me was when I was 16 and leaving the UK, and it took me years to feel I was on solid ground again (ultimately ended up moving back to the UK).
I have 3 young kids now and we moved when they were 2, 4 and 5. It didn't seem to bother them at all due to their age, honestly. Kids that age seem to very much live in the moment, and they also had each other. I would never move any of my kids as teens if I didn't absolutely have to, but I don't think there's anything harmful about moving when they're younger as their peer network and acceptance isn't critical the way it is as it is with teens.
SignatureSea6649@reddit
I was in the exact same boat as a child/teen and I’m not sure I’ve ever gotten my steady footing. My dad apologized to me when he was retired and finally said he understood how hard it was for me — but it doesn’t change how I felt
AccountForDoingWORK@reddit
That’s really cool and self-aware of your dad to acknowledge that impact on you.
PreposterousTrail@reddit
We moved from the US to NZ with a 5- and 2-year-old. The older one talked about missing her old friends a bit, but she’s really well integrated now. My 2-year-old was fine! Biggest issue with transition for us was it took months for all our shipped things to arrive. Once they had all their toys and things back they were able to settle more. The main language is English here, but Māori culture is very important, and both kids have been picking up Te Reo words and Māori cultural meanings as well, which is really interesting and cool.
SignatureSea6649@reddit
This is good to read — one of my adult kids (with children) is seriously considering the same move. I grew up all over the world and love this for them — but I will miss my grandkids like crazy! How did you handle family and visits?
PreposterousTrail@reddit
That’s the toughest part, but we FaceTime with my parents weekly. They just spent all summer visiting, and we try to go back to visit family yearly. I love NZ but I wish it wasn’t so far!
FidomUK@reddit
Earlier the better. Pre teens fine. Teens - problematic. Speaking from experience.
SignatureSea6649@reddit
Speaking from experience of being that moved teen (to East Africa from USA) for 18 months, I would strongly agree.
Due_Personality3932@reddit
They will have the opportunity to learn a new languages which is something you should consider as plus. You actually might end up extending your assigment (if offered)
goahnix@reddit
Not a problem with children of this age
Lyrebird_korea@reddit
We have moved two times now with kids (and more than 10 times without kids). The first time, they were roughly as old as your kids. No big deal. I guess they don't know any better.
For us... that is a different story. Most people have family living in the neighborhood or living at a reasonable distance, so you can rely on family to help take care of young kids. We did not have that luxury, and it was painful. Daycare was too expensive. We found a great pre-school for our youngest, that helped a lot, but it was just a few hours every week.
bookofthoth_za@reddit
Easy move for my 3-year-old to move from South Africa to the Netherlands. She is also fluent in Dutch now for a 4-year-old already since she is already in a proper school. What's more important is that the parents are happy and that the parents have strong bonds with their kids.
yoshisicle@reddit
I moved to Switzerland with my kids when they were 2 and 4 years old. Been here for 2 years. It's been great! So many fantastic opportunities, they've made friends, done amazing things, picked up the language incredibly fast.
My feeling is that they just respond to your energy. If you're excited and explain how cool it will be, they will be excited. If you're worried and scared, they will be as well.
Enjoy your time in Switzerland! It's a lovely place to call home.
jonescm12@reddit (OP)
Thanks! Whereabouts in Switzerland are you?
yoshisicle@reddit
Geneva
jonescm12@reddit (OP)
Awesome! We will be in Luzern
Chanze3@reddit
probably not the target you're asking, but my parents moved my family when I was 8, and subsequently 15. maybe I can provide a perspective of the "kid" to answer your question.
the first move was difficult because I felt sad to leave everyone behind. but moving to a new culture made me learn many new things. that's the main issue from back then when I was young. I rememeber the transition being stressful for my parents too.
for me on the other hand growing up overseas, I don't ever quite feel like I fit in in my own home country anymore. I'm not sure how long u and ur family will be overseas, but my parents did their best they could to always bring me back home to visit extended family over holidays. this meant that in terms of cousins and extended family, I felt quite close to them.
but I came back to my home country for university and felt super out of place, almost like a culture shock. this might be something you may have to consider for your kids (though far in the future) that it won't quite be the same for them since they would have grown up overseas in comparison to a majority of kids back home.
I wouldn't change a thing though. I'm grateful that my parents gave me the chance that not a lot of kids out there have, and I have friends outside of my own country and have learned so much from my time abroad.
Jauggernaut_birdy@reddit
I feel the same as you do without having left my home Country as a child. I still feel out of place. I think it’s just something that some people experience even without travelling. As an adult I now live overseas and still feel out of place but because I’m a ‘foreigner’ it’s more acceptable to feel out of place if that makes any sense. I feel like I have an excuse for not quite fitting in.
jonescm12@reddit (OP)
Thanks for the perspective! I do feel that doing it while the kids are so young is the perfect time to do it. We think the experience for them would be wonderful, but they are probably too young to remember it. My wife is extremely family oriented so we don't expect to extend the contract, but you never know.
We are also lucky that our company will pay for two or three trips back to the US each year so we can still have that family connection.
GasNo5022@reddit
Do it while young. As they get school aged it can screw them up when or if they ever return to the US.
I had a cousin who was in the same situation
Chanze3@reddit
yes my parents thought the first contract would be a one-off too... but who knew xD
believe me, they will remmeber it and talk about it. I do have friends back home too who mention they've been overseas when they were verrrry young for a year or two. they're still very local since the most important years are teenage years... but are more willing to be aware of worldly matters as opposed to others who never had similar experiences :)
for the US more or less going back for college wouldn't be as much of a culture shock. most cities where expats reside generally have international / american schools, and the number of colleges and students in the US make it so that people go out of state all the time for college so it's still mixing around with people of different cultures and loads of international students.
I'm not from the states so my university culture shock was different. but I do have American friends from school when I lived abroad and they definitely had a great time in college still, though they did have a broader perspective on certain things having lived another culture first hand.
GreatBear2121@reddit
My family also did a work placement in Switzerland when we (the kids)were similar ages. At this age, they will be fine. Moving back may be a bit more stressful--I misbehaved terribly when I was about five and my family was in the process of moving; however, things were fine when we got there.
OldResponsibility982@reddit
My wife and I moved to the Netherlands from the states a few months ago with a 2.5 year old and 10 month old. So far the transition has been smoother than expected, especially for the kids. We were able to get them into daycare and they love it. Happy to chat more if you dm me.
Gloomy_Ruminant@reddit
How is your 2 year old picking up Dutch? We made the same move about 9 months ago with a (at the time) almost 2 year old and she is definitely picking up English faster than Dutch despite daycare speaking in Dutch.
OldResponsibility982@reddit
She hasn’t picked up much so far. Most of her Dutch is what we practice at home and in public. We’ve been trying to read more Dutch children’s books but are probably doing her a disservice with our pronunciations haha
Gloomy_Ruminant@reddit
Yeah I have avoided that because my older son's teacher discouraged us from trying to speak in (broken) Dutch at home. She suggested TV in Dutch, so we let the 2 year old watch Nijntje on YouTube.
I imagine it will come eventually, just was surprised there is such a strong English preference when she is exposed to Dutch at school.
OldResponsibility982@reddit
Yeah I’m sure it will come eventually. I am sure it takes a while to get over the fact that these new words are the equivalent of words they already know without someone taking the time to explain.
T1sofun@reddit
I was 14 when our parents decided to move us halfway around the world. I fought the move tooth and nail. But it was the best thing that ever could have happened to me. I met friends from all over, learned to appreciate other cultures and foods, and it taught me what a cool place “the rest of the world” really is. Give your kids this gift!
ffokcuf-hctib@reddit
Moved from the UK to NL with a 2.5yo and 9m almost 3y ago. They both handled it amazingly. The eldest has completely outpaced me in learning Dutch, and has made lots of friends in school, even with the language barrier.
MadeThisUpToComment@reddit
Moved with a 3 year old and 6 month old they barely noticed.
Moved again with an 8 year old, 5 year old and a 1 year old. They learned the language within a year and were well integrated in school and other activities. 5 years later planning to stay put until at least they are all done with school.
Your twins will be 5 when this is done, right? they will most likely adapt just fine with a move back or to a new place. I doubt they'll bately notice the move now more than moving across town.
BaconMeetsCheese@reddit
People who lived in different countries and experience different cultures tend to be a lot more open minded. That reason alone is well worth it imo.
jonescm12@reddit (OP)
I agree. We travel a lot so its something we would do with our girls regardless. We think its really important.
My wife is from a very small town and her family hardly leaves their town. They are very hesitant to try new things and are pretty closed minded. You can guess what they think of our move...
More_Example6153@reddit
We moved internationally when my baby was 4 months old. He adjusted well but I think that was partly because we moved before he started solids or got too attached to my family. The biggest change for him was the climate (we used the AC a lot in the beginning because he was sweating a lot) and the attention he's getting from people here which he loves haha. He's used to the local foods, he loves playing with his grandpa (my husband's dad) and loves how chaotic and busy everything is. The other way around he'd probably be very bored.
monbabie@reddit
I moved from US to Belgium last year when my son had just turned 5. It’s been 1.5 years now, he’s completed his first full year of school, in French, and while the first days/weeks/months/year were challenging in their own ways, we have settled into our life, he’s made friends, feels at home, etc. I think the younger the better. They won’t know anything different. He was just sort of beginning to make friends at his preschool before we left. But he was able to adapt fairly well once he picked up some French at school.
It would be much much harder over like 8 years old.
3andahalfbath@reddit
I moved to Lichtenstein as a kid, pretty similar to Switzerland, and it was very nice! The language in school was hard but that’s a nonissue with a 2 year old. We moved from Idaho to Singapore with a 2 and 6 year old and our toddler is thriving. The older kid talks a lot about Idaho and “home” but the 2 year old has fully integrated into society
Explodinggiraffe7@reddit
We moved to Taiwan for 2 years when my kids were 1&2....the transition was pretty minimal at that age because they are so little. I made sure we video chatted with grandparents etc.
Now, we recently did another international move to the Netherlands and my kids are 5.5 and 6.5. At this age it's been harder as they had friends at school etc.....but they should pick up the language pretty quickly so I am sure they will adapt fairly easily.
247GT@reddit
Your kids are two. Two. Come on. What are they so attached to that they will experience any sort of trauma? You're not sending them to boarding school. The things they need most in their lives will be right there with them. As far as they're concerned, they might as well be moving across town. Makes no difference at that age.