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Impressive_Cover1720@reddit

From videos that I have seen it is an identity deal. Is it luxury , is it an suv, because it is big , it’s not a crossover. But personally when I saw it I really liked it but it is playing the grounds of luxury sedans, crossovers and yea I like it. I just think people are waiting to see. Because to me it looks really good Lexus , extra space. But without the price tax. I honestly noticed it because I liked it and thought it was a luxury sedans. And it really is I think.

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babijar@reddit

I drive Porsche Macan, but I think Toyota is a nice car!

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RISHBAI@reddit

Well in America we like our trucks that's probably why it is not selling well. Also it is a bit expensive also. I could get a Honda or Hyundai or a different Toyota for cheaper

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oldtreadhead@reddit

It looks like a really decent car to me. I'll have to check it out more closely.

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Savings_Shift_8689@reddit

Wa all broke asf

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zeycke@reddit

Reasons: so called muricans prefer suvs or pickups, and money

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Mean_Palpitation_799@reddit

I agree! On paper, it looks like a perfect car except that it doesn't have the latest hybrid drive train from Toyota. AFAIK it has the same engine as CX-50 hybrid. From the form factor, those are two best options for me who always wanted a nice hybrid wagon.

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Ctech8311@reddit

Our experience: My girlfriend got hit by a drunk driver (her 10-year-old Camry was stuck in traffic, no major injuries) so she was shopping for a replacement Toyota. The dealer was arrogant about the Crown, she couldn't get it without a sunroof, wouldn't take a deposit on the Crown she wanted (Insurance was sending her a settlement check in 24 hours), and sent her out the door with "come back when you have your check." On the way home, we stopped at the Mercedes Benz dealer to window shop. A GLC 300 caught her attention, about the same price, all the tech, nice interior, no sunroof and about the same price as a Toyota Crown. They treated her with respect, took a deposit on the GLC 300, and she closed the deal the next day. The Mercedes-Benz experience included a gift basket with a bottle of wine and a complimentary lunch at the cafe in the dealer whenever it is being serviced. This may be why Toyota is not selling Crowns in great numbers.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

First of all, I'm glad your gf is okay! Any dealer who behaves like that is an ass. I doubt ALL Toyota dealers would be like that but in her case, yes I would get a GLC over the Signia too. BUT here in Canada even a lightly optioned GLC 300 is close to $70K pre tax (13%). The Signia fully loaded is $62K pre tax. The Signia has more features standard. Is the Benz worth more...I think so...but just saying you have to option it out worth quite a bit more to get it up to spec with the Signia. That said, hey your Gf has a Benz now! :) I'm lusting for the new E Class sedan personally

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whatupthoo@reddit

Toyota is no longer the affordable brand the middle class was able to buy. It’s become so out of touch with the prices that people can’t afford them now.

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sprottythotty@reddit

Toyota has always been a slightly more expensive brand outside of the bread and butter Corolla’s. Look up what a previa sold for msrp and account for inflation and you’ll be shocked.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

how is it out of touch when 2-3 year old cars sell at like 90-95% MSRP? LOL

if anything, new Toyota/Lexus are underpriced.

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YJeezy@reddit

Current Middle Class experience

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Donedirtcheap7725@reddit

I owned a Toyota Crown Signia for six months before selling it, and my brother has a Rav4. Here’s my take.

People buy the RAV4 because it’s a reliable, no-frills people mover. It gets the job done if you don’t care much about how it rides, sounds, handles, looks, or feels. It’s the vehicle equivalent of a toaster—dependable, functional, and free of fuss or flourish.

The Crown Signia looks better, especially inside, with a more upscale feel. Unfortunately, under the surface it’s a similar coarse, uninspired drivetrain and suspension. It’s fine—competent in every way—but never once did it make me think, “Wow, that was fun.”

So you have a car that is too nice and expensive for the people who want a haul the dogs and let kids flick boogers on the ceiling. And, it's does appeal to the folks who like cars that are fun or luxurious.

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equitymans@reddit

Toyota as a brand and even Lexus to a large degree simply don’t carry prestige to compete wel in the higher end price market usually. The average age of a rolls Royce buyer has fallen by like 15 years which is insane. People who have excess money don’t spend much of it on Toyotas or Japanese cars in general. They are widely viewed as “lower end”, “cheap”, and doesn’t carry brand legacy of prestige from say Motorsport and other areas the same way Europeans and even some Americans do.

Honda is maybe the only exception to the legacy part but even they don’t get credit and seen for their amazing Motorsport legacy in the same way a Mercedes or a bmw etc does.

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iamjustappalled@reddit

Crown -> Cressida -> Avalon -> Crown again...and now in a wagon edition as well. The '85 Cressida was one of the best cars I've ever owned.

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jtbis@reddit

People don’t want to spend that much on a Toyota unless it’s a truck.

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iamjustappalled@reddit

Gotta say that in a deep, rumbling football coach/lonely cowboy voice: "Gotta have a truck!"

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SonnySwanson@reddit

Or a Lexus

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Lexuses however are VERY expensive now. The C. Signia is a really nice "Lexus" for a better price than say a NX.

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rfuree11@reddit

I was literally just cross shopping the Crown Signia and the NX hybrid for my mom (when in reality it should be the RX I’m cross shopping). The amount you get for the crown signia vs the NX is staggering and the crown is the nicer car minus the L badge.

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NitroLada@reddit

Is it? I looked online (Canada) and crown insignia with the only option (tech package) brings it to 62k MSRP, a nx350h premium which has more options (eg 14inch screen) is a tad less. The nx interior while not luxury by any means (the Rx is much nicer), looks nicer (less boring) than the crown insignia. It's more like why would anyone get the crown insignia when the nx350h is basically same money but better warranty and service with Lexus

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Imaginary_Act_3956@reddit

Ah yes......a $62K Opel Insignia.

LOL.

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TunakTun633@reddit

The Crown is way larger. That's one reason.

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NitroLada@reddit

Is that the only reason then? It's a bigger car? Thats a negative for someone who's looking at a nx in the first place then? Because they're looking at an nx, why would they want something so much bigger?

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tugtugtugtug4@reddit

The price difference is for the dealer experience. Lexus dealers are as good as anyone. Toyota dealers are not.

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Gorgenapper@reddit

Trust me, the Crown Signia is what you want. It has a better interior, with real buttons for HVAC, it has a wagon silhouette, and it's made in Japan.

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rfuree11@reddit

It’s probably what she’s getting. Her current company car is a Venza, which also ounces way above its weight. It’s a natural update.

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F1_Geek@reddit

Bingo. Both are excellent cars.

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stinger_02in@reddit

I test drove a Venza an year ago. The wind noise was terrible compared to my Camry. Maybe it was that particular car from the dealership.

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rfuree11@reddit

That’s weird, must have been that car. Hers is dead quiet. My work car is actually a 2020 Camry and hers is way quieter.

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apandya277@reddit

Im curious how it insures. I imagine its cheaper than a NX/RX, hopefully because thieves arent interested in it?

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an_actual_lawyer@reddit

Theft claims matter, but are just a piece of the puzzle.

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fire_n_ice@reddit

Considering the Signia was brought here to replace the Venza, I'd say you're spot on lol

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

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AutoModerator@reddit

No rage bait, memes, trolling, copypasta, or low-quality joke posts or comments.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

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NitroLada@reddit

Nx is made in Canada, at the award winning factory, not like the nx is made in USA

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AutoModerator@reddit

No rage bait, memes, trolling, copypasta, or low-quality joke posts or comments.

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[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Look at the comments though. You would think this car is the ugliest and most expensive car ever made while the Lexus cars are just deals waiting for you.

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elmastrbatr@reddit

Its lexi when plural

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

It should be but it isn't. Lexus had clarified a few years ago that its Lexuses.

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Real-Actuator-6520@reddit

If I were looking in the lux/near-lux segment, I'd much rather get the Crown Signia than the NX.

NXs are decent, but they strike me as a case of badge over substance. And so common in Toronto.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Completely agree.

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SophistXIII@reddit

Lexus absolutely has a pricing problem.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

You can get close to the early 90s CAD for a NX these days. It's nuts. People saying "just get an NX" haven't shopped for a car in their lives or something. They look at the "starts at" price without taxes on the website and run with it.

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CarsPlanesTrains@reddit

The 2025 NX starts at $42,140 while the 2025 Crown Signia starts at $45,585. It's more expensive and already in a price class where buyers are not usually gonna go for something with a Toyota badge. 45K is basically playing around BMW X3 and Audi Q5 territory. A Lexus could be able to win the battle for that buyer, a Toyota will almost never. Simple as that unfortunately

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

The Signia will top off MUCH quicker. The "starts at" price for any luxury car is a red herring. You will be out the door with the Signia with more equipment for the price of a lower trim NX.

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CarobAffectionate582@reddit

Probably would have bought it over the ES had they marketed it widely. Toyota is depending upon returning customers and word of mouth far too much.

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ptinnl@reddit

But isnt Toyota Crown a level about Lexus?

Thought was Toyota < Lexus < Toyota Crown

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bonestamp@reddit

... and you may as well buy a Lexus at the price of the crown. Not to mention, sedan sales are pretty slow across the industry.

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V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit

The problem is that not many people in America known Crown is a luxury brand like Japan.

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amancalledJayne@reddit

Reminds me of Seiko vs Grand Seiko.

People hear Seiko and think a watch you buy for $250 at Macy’s, not realizing Grand Seiko is a different brand that’ll run you ~$10k at a boutique where they serve you champagne.

I’ve known numerous people that crossed GS off their list just because Seiko is in the name.

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SylverShadowWolve@reddit

and why would they? the crown name is new to anyone who isnt super into JDM cars, and its not like their marketing is very luxury focussed

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JoMercurio@reddit

Yeah, the last time Toyota Crown was sold in the US it was in the early 70s (and it wasn't really a sales success)

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EngagedGroomsPodcast@reddit

This car starts at 45K which is 7K more than the Venza it effectively replaced. It’s also priced right in the thick of it with the Highlander, grand Highlander, and 4 runner in the Toyota lineup. Plus the new corporate front is ugly, imo. Toyota just has too many SUVs that are priced too similarly with similar components.

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Inariri@reddit

the Crown Signia is completely made in Japan and then shipped over to the states, so it'll never be able to sell anywhere near the same volume as the popular models that are produced in North America. If I remember right, Toyota was only targeting around 20k units available for the first model year. 1k sales per month is not that bad when considering the total available supply for the model.

I helped my parents shop for one near the end of last year. One of the appealing points was that the ride height is just right for comfortably getting in and out. SUV's are a bit too high off the ground while sedans are way too low for my aging parents. A minivan would be pretty good too, but the current Sienna is too large of a car for what they want. It is somewhat expensive for the upper trim, but the base trim is already quite nice with the leather interior included as standard. You do lose some parking sensors I believe, which may be a deal breaker for some.

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No-Equivalent-8324@reddit

Answer: Price. It’s that simple. Wanted one but the price is just too high. The 2025 RAV4 was purchased by a close friend in spring 2025 and they’ve been infuriated by the number of times it’s had to go into the shop because various plastic undercowl/underbody components having broken loose on the highway and caused them to be without transportation while awaiting fixes. Some of these have caused it to go into “limp” mode and made it undrivable. The 2025 RAV4 has too many cheaply engineered plastic components prone to failure, and though the Crown is a very attractive vehicle, it’s priced out of range for most Toyota consumers. It’s priced more in line with the Lexus brand.

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SockeyeSTI@reddit

My dad got one. Not a very tech savvy person so he doesn’t use any of its features. Loves the mileage though. It’s comfy. Feels similar to the Highlander up front.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Your Dad is a smart guy :)

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SockeyeSTI@reddit

I picked it out. He’s a wagon fan and that’s as close to one as anyone (dealerships close by) has. Otherwise it would’ve been a rav4.

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KingCuda93@reddit

Problem is that nobody wants a five-seater crossover that size when 99 percent of compact crossovers are serviceable.

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bazglami@reddit

Overpriced. Underpowered. MPGs … meh. Why /would/ anyone buy it?

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Yeah man about 700 other comments have made it clear. Pity, we will only have the RAV4 for the rest of eternity

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Solid-Tumbleweed-981@reddit

Its too expensive
It could have been better looking
The interior just like the TourX is a massive letdown especially for the price point
Toyota is not advertising it
Not everyone wants a hybrid or an underpowered 4cyl

Toyota issue is most of them are 45-55k. For that price range there's multiple vehicles Toyota and Lexus offer that are a better value. Although I'm going to complain no Toyota is worth 55k. The Camry and RAV4 are way too expensive for what they offer. Fully loaded they used to top out at like 32k... Now 50k wtf. Even Lexus when you look at a lot of their entry vehicles or even the ones that cost 70k they are 10000% not worth it.

Toyota and every automaker is giving us zero value. 50k and you're giving us a lawnmower engine? Come on. People I think want a V6 even if it's sacrifices 1 or 2mpgs. Its notime these 4cyls are all that great on gas at the end of the day either

I WANT a wagon. I would have bought the TourX if it had the 3.6. I could have gotten past some of my interior complaints like no cooled seats. 40k was just too much imo

I looked at the Audi wagons and even the A5 sportback used ones I just couldn't get past the price for such mehh depressing interior (most of them were black)

I looked at the Volvo wagons used. I cannot get past the msrp. Why anyone would buy them for the price point is why they fail. Their interiors and the stupid 4 banger are just not worth it. It doesn't even have rear seat vents until you get to the top trim level. Like come on for 60k that's just ridiculous

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2Stroke728@reddit

I would have bought the TourX if it had the 3.6. I could have gotten past some of my interior complaints like no cooled seats. 40k was just too much imo

No one paid $40k for a TourX, for many of the reasons you listed. Mine lingered on dealer lot for 14 months.

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Solid-Tumbleweed-981@reddit

I wanted a unicorn with the light leather seats and not submit white or bright red. I really really hated the black interior

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mustangfan12@reddit

Its an expensive vehicle and there's not a ton of people that want a stealth wealth vehicle

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pon_d@reddit

...and stealth wealth folks are not interested in Toyotas outside of the Land Cruiser, which Toyota doesn't really make any longer (the current gen is a Land Cruiser Prado, not a true Land Cruiser)

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DudeWhereIsMyDuduk@reddit

I can't wait to import a Series 70 20 years from now.

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Niyeaux@reddit

the current Land Cruiser is also just a markedly worse version of the current GX, which makes it and even tougher sell

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wh4cked@reddit

That was always true no? The LX was better than the LC 200

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Vesploogie@reddit

It’s just not a good stealth wealth car.

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doug_Or@reddit

What makes a good stealth wealth car?

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halcykhan@reddit

Not being a bright red blob from a econobox brand with a nutsack shaver front end is a start

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clownpirate@reddit

Isn’t being from an econobox brand the whole point of a stealth wealth car?

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Ecsta@reddit

No they want a car that blends in but is actually luxurious. The high end Volvos/Polestars would be my goto example.

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clownpirate@reddit

I wouldn’t consider Volvos and especially Polestars as cars that “blend in”.

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Salty-Dog-9398@reddit

Anything you’d see parked in Watch Hill, Rhode Island driveways. Originally this is supposed to be big heavy reliable vehicles, but there are lots of people with money who will keep a Volvo alive because they like it.

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wip30ut@reddit

There's ZERO marketing... i've seen literally a handful of online ads, no billboards or youtube features. It's the same price as a Highlander Hybrid, but the Highlander has name recognition. It's a tested product. Another confusing aspect is that it shares similar nomenclature with the 4-door lifted sedan, but in a nonsensical way. A Corolla CROSS makes sense linguistically, but what is a Signia? It doesn't sound like a suv or crossover.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

And a Mustang or Mirage sounds like a SUV or Crossover. I mean your other points have merit but this point makes no sense in an age where we are about to get an RSX EV CUV

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Marshall_Lawson@reddit

Separate question, but what the hell is a "signia"? Did some executive or committee decide that people are too stupid for the whopping 4 syllable word "Insignia"?

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Imaginary_Act_3956@reddit

Opel already took the Insignia nameplate.

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Marshall_Lawson@reddit

good point

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sasquatch_melee@reddit

Personally - it's too tall, too expensive, and I already have a wagon I like better.

It would be on my list to look at if mine died but if probably go with the car at the top of my list, the new civic hybrid.

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Imaginary_Act_3956@reddit

At least you own an actual Opel Insignia!

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sasquatch_melee@reddit

I do like it, even if it only meets 3 of the r/cars preferred features (used, wagon, brown). Couldn't fulfill manual or diesel 🤪

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juttep1@reddit

It's too expensive. It's pretty simple.

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bhauertso@reddit

As somebody who has spent that kind of money on a few cars, there is no way I am spending that much on an ICE vehicle in 2025. Nor a Toyota. Spending $50K and not getting a self-driving EV is, to me, irrational.

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

I don't get it

I mean a crown signia limited is a $50k car, its not a mainstream car in the same sense a rav4 is or a highlander is, in a sense it replaces that psuedo-stealth-wealth segment the venza and avalon held, and those were never volume sellers either.

The pragmatic folks are going to get a grand highlander, the esoteric folks are going to get a 4runner or opt for the landcruiser, the signia fills its niche and fills it well, I don't think its particularly surprising it isn't selling well

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Visual-Reception-139@reddit

Not wrong, but the RAV4 is a 40k+ vehicle. at that point it’s not in a different comparison

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Mustangfast85@reddit

I feel sad that anyone would pay over $40k for a RAV4. They’re just not good enough to justify that

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DriedUpSquid@reddit

The Mazda CX-50 Hybrid shares the exact same drivetrain as the RAV4 Hybrid, has a lot more options, and is cheaper.

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WatchingyouNyouNyou@reddit

Same hybride system but different engine. Mazda use their own skyactiv

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PNF2187@reddit

It's the same engine as what's in the RAV4 Hybrid.

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dakta@reddit

Does it actually license the Toyota system? Huh, knowing that could have been a game changer for my last purchase.

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DriedUpSquid@reddit

My understanding is that they’re both built into the same factory. The engine and electric motors are exactly the same, but the hybrid batteries are different. I’ve been looking at the CX-50. I test drove one and liked it.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2025-mazda-cx-50-hybrid-first-test-review

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PNF2187@reddit

Not quite. The CX-50 and RAV4 are built in separate plants. RAV4 is built in Ontario, Kentucky, and Japan, whereas the CX-50 is built at a joint Mazda/Toyota plant in Alabama that also builds the Corolla Cross, but the CX-50 Hybrid and Corolla Cross Hybrid don't use the same motors even though Toyota's hybrid system and engines are present in both (the CX-50 has the 2.5L w/ the 4th gen hybrid system whereas the Corolla Cross uses the 2.0L w/ the 5th gen hybrid system).

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Ran4@reddit

When taking into consideration that they're worth 2/3 as much after six years, then yes they are.

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Transmaniacon89@reddit

The Signia is 25% more expensive, $10,000 is not an insignificant difference at this price point. I’d also wager they are probably selling a lot more XLE/SE trims than Limiteds based on what I see driving around.

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Visual-Reception-139@reddit

I agree. But it is a much more polished car than the rav4. I’ve seen 10k difference in trim levels alone in most vehicles, regardless of manufacturer

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Transmaniacon89@reddit

Yeah it’s easy to option up some cars, but I just don’t see the average RAV4 buyer deciding to pony up 10k. I can see the Signia taking sales from the NX, RDX, Infiniti, and Genesis. If you are shopping Audi/Merc/BMW you likely want the badge even though the Signia is comparable to their entry level crossovers.

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Astrohumper@reddit

I just bought a CS limited for 47.3k. The Top of the line RAV4 loaded XSE was 43.5k with a 3 month wait. It was a no brainer to get the CS.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

The Crown Signia is essentially just a RX450h in a Toyota badge.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Way more polished.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Exactly my point. You get a LOT for that extra coin something you dont if you opt for a Lexus where you end up paying quite a bit more for just the badge.

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mags87@reddit

$10,000 is going to be over $200 more per month of a payment on a 5 year loan. That’s a huge deal when char shopping.

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craiggers14@reddit

The RAV4 MSRP starts under 30k. You have to go to the very top of the range to get to 40k.

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woowoo293@reddit

But the very top of the line Rav4 isn't just at or just over 40k. The top trim Rav4 phev stickers for nearly 50k and generally has an otd price over 50k.

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craiggers14@reddit

It is actually just over 40k. Are you not in the US?

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woowoo293@reddit

I said phev

https://www.toyota.com/configurator/build/step/model/year/2025/series/rav4pluginhybrid/?bap_guid=c82794c7-c0ee-49d6-a680-b02893120bee

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FSUfan35@reddit

And most rav4s you see aren't top of the line. They're le or xle trims

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DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit

The real MSRP of a base LE is $31k. Besides, I bet the LE is far less popular than the one-step-up XLE...which starts at $32.5k.

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craiggers14@reddit

Car and Driver must add in the destination fee. I pulled my number directly from the build and price on toyota.com.

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DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit

They do, just like any manufacturer's website once you've built the car and you get the final price. MSRP without D+H isn't the real price. No one can actually buy it for under $30k. That's why I said the real MSRP is $31k.

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jstude2019@reddit

You can almost buy a cpo X3 m40i for that money, that's nuts.

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Lighthouse_seek@reddit

thats an extra 10k. thats not nothing.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Great post and a sad state of affairs. Toyota buyers also tend to not even bother looking even without the same dealership at other cars. "I've had 6 Camrys since 1990, I'm here to buy the 7th one. And no, I won't look to my left or right".

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listurine@reddit

Agricultural drivetrains I'm dying I'll steal this

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

I wish I could take credit for coming up with this but people have been using it to describe NA diesel toyotas since the dawn of time back when they were actually underpowered and genuinely agricultural

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Ran4@reddit

The hilux still has 150 hp.

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SJHikingGuy@reddit

Because the Avalon was a damn perfect Lexus equivalent at a somewhat affordable price and replacing it with a tall AF hatchback psuedo-SUV made no sense at all.

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derouville@reddit

And nobody bought the Avalon either.

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Alone_Peace371@reddit

Maybe because they want a car and not a grill with wheels

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

And that's a pity because it was a wonderful car, especially the last generation model.

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clutchthepearls@reddit

Yup.

Avalon sales 2020 - 18,421

2021 - 19,460

2022 - 12,215

Crown sedan sales 2023 - 19,063

2024 - 19,648

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V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit

Chinese still can buy Avalon IIRC

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

That was replaced by the standard crown, not the crown signia, the signia replaces the venza

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Which BTW almost doesn't exist. I've seen a couple and I like them.

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hutacars@reddit

I used to see them shockingly frequently (given how unpopular sedans are in ), but thinking about it, I can’t recall the last time I saw one. It’s like 100 randomly appeared all over the place last year, then they all just disappeared sometime early this year. Odd.

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

They are oddly disproportionately popular in nyc, both the crown and the crown signia, but the old avalon, venza, and wagons in general are also disproportionately popular here so that means nothing for the american market as a whole

I chalk it up to uniquely 1. horizontal space is at a premium w/ parallel parking and whatnot so you are incentivized to get something smaller, which takes out the highlander and GH, 2. the costs associated with running cars (insurance, parking, etc.) are so relatively high that the cost of the car itself doesn't matter quite as much 3. lower ride height makes it easier to see pedestrians and jaywalkers

Both of the crown models are well suited then and feel very international/european compared to the usual fullsize or compact crossover, I also see V60's and RS6 avant's on the daily, its a very interesting scene!

[-]

TunakTun633@reddit

Re: Horizontal space in particular: The Crown "sedan" is exactly as long as a Highlander, and the Signia is only 2 inches shorter.

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Drzhivago138@reddit

Why is sedan in quotes?

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TunakTun633@reddit

When it came out, people had a hard time distinguishing whether it should be called a crossover. The wheels are larger than on the Avalon it replaces, and the total body height is greater by ~2 inches.

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Drzhivago138@reddit

And it still has comparable ground clearance and overall tire size to the old Avalon, and a fixed roof with a trunk rather than a hatch. The standard black fender flares give it the illusion of more ground clearance. If the Crown isn't a sedan, the Ford Five Hundred wasn't either.

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

As was the avalon, but it's taller, so you get a little more utility in the same space

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Sounds like New Yorkers knows good value when they shop for cars. These "straddles the middle" type of cars are the best of both worlds. UNLESS you have to have a luxury badge.

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fireinthesky7@reddit

Wagons with the seats down can carry as much as a pickup provided you don't need the vertical reach, and they're a hell of a lot easier to park.

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gmwdim@reddit

Yeah vertical-ish cars make sense in dense cities. It’s impractical to get a car that’s wider or longer, so the best way to get a “bigger” car is one that’s taller and “boxy.”

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losteye_enthusiast@reddit

Just depends on location. There’s quite a lot of Venzas in the PNW, specially around Portland, Tacoma and Seattle.

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dakta@reddit

The Venza? I looked at getting one but the size footprint is absolutely massive for an ultimately not terribly spacious interior and abjectly bad cargo volume. Ended up with an F48 X1 instead.

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Successful-Growth827@reddit

I've seen quite a few around the surrounding suburbs of Chicago. I appreciate this because I actually like the Crown and I want it to still be available when I pay off most of my other home purchase expenses, and finally can put money towards one.

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generalright@reddit

The Venza already didn’t sell well, the crown signia gives you the same as the Venza for 20k more. At least the Venza was built on the harrier RX350 chassis.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

20K more? What country are you in? The Venza and Signia are almost the exact same price in Canada.

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generalright@reddit

Ok 20k was exaggerated. When I bought my XLE Venza it was 36k and 32k with the discount. A comparable Signia is 46k after destination

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

I agree but tnga-k underpins everything from the lm and the century to the altis platform, doesn't mean much, it's just where the manufacturer chooses to drawn the line these days

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RockChalk4Life@reddit

Sounds like they've got a naming problem then. I knew the Crown existed and replaced the Avalon, Signia sounds like it's a trim level.

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player_three33@reddit

So it's selling about as good as the Venza then? Seems normal to me

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Vesploogie@reddit

Which people also weren’t buying.

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ManufacturerBest2758@reddit

Maybe that weird product line is part of the problem

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CuddleTeamCatboy@reddit

The Crown Signia is basically Toyota’s version of a Subaru Outback, it doesn’t really have anything to do with the regular Crown other than the name.

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Zappiticas@reddit

Then maybe they should have given it a different name. I don’t understand this current trend with creating a crossover and giving is the name of a sedan.

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CuddleTeamCatboy@reddit

Crown is a premium subrand of Toyota, sort of like the Buick to Toyota’s Chevy. In Japan they have a bigger lineup of Crowns that includes a RWD luxury sedan and a compact crossover.

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Bubcats@reddit

With no vibes for young people. They just get a rav4 or actual Subaru.

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tsar73@reddit

In theory yes, but between the lack of ground clearance and having the same engine as the $10,000 cheaper (and more useful) RAV4 it’s dead in the water for me. It’s neither a sporty wagon nor a useful enough lifted one to be a compelling package.

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smexypelican@reddit

The Crown Signia is actually called the Crown Estate in other places. Look at the body shape, it's a modern wagon. Definitely more wagon than whatever an Outback has become.

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Porshuh@reddit

lmao coping ahh unc ain't slick driving a crossover 🥀🥀

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smexypelican@reddit

I mean it's pretty close for 2025 man. Maybe the new K4 "hatchback" is a much better match to the wagon name.a

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BroKick19@reddit

Love the Avalon. Better than a Camry, worse than a lexus ES, just right in the middle.

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06Hexagram@reddit

Shhhh! it's just a station wagon that can go over speed bumps easier.

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clutchthepearls@reddit

The Crown sedan is selling similarly to the last couple years of thr Avalon.

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Alone_Peace371@reddit

It’s ugly. The plastic mesh grill is ugly. The hammerhead headlights are ugly once you get over the novelty of split headlights. The wagon shape is, to many people, ugly

And it doesn’t help that this vehicle went from a Venza wagon that sold poorly to a Venza hybrid SUV that sold poorly and back to a hybrid wagon with a confusing name based on a hybrid car that sells poorly.

and I would wager than many people don’t know whether it’s an HEV, PHEV, or BEV

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hawksnest_prez@reddit

Americans dont buy this type of car. It’s a crossoverish wagon. And it’s expensive.

It’s a great car but Americans either buy a cheaper Rav or a bigger Highlander.

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Egoist-a@reddit

You didn't swap your QX60 for one of these either.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

3 row. We needed a 3 row and the QX60 was purchased in 2022 July, before the C Sigma came into the market. If I had the option, I would trade the QX in for that as I don't like 3 row vehicles. But my mother insists on having a third row.

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Intstnlfortitude@reddit

Ask the dealers. People are still buying tons of Toyota models, so why can’t sales get them into a crown? My guess is financing, or lack of it. It’s also in a weird price spot, where people balk at paying 40k for a “car” yet have no issue paying that for a suv.

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pops992@reddit

I really like the Crown Signia but I'm not paying $50k for it, if I get one it would be in a few years when I can get a used one for half the price. I have a 2018 Mazda CX-5 that I bought in cash and I'm pretty content with it.

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Turbulent-Extent-898@reddit

Cause those things are 60,000 used in canada and for that kind of money people rather buy a SUV. I would buy a used one at 25k though

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Internal_Marzipan_98@reddit

It's basically a lifted wagon in an SUV-obsessed market.

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gg06civicsi@reddit

We broke

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CurbsEnthusiasm@reddit

Go on a Toyota sub and see how many are happy to drop $62k on (name that Toyota) after their mandatory $2,995 dealer add-on package, financed at 6.99%.

[-]

kulzboy@reddit

I personally know a few people who tried to buy a landcruiser LC250 but went straight over to Lexus and bought a GX after seeing over 80k OTD for a Toyota badge. Granted I do think the LC looks cooler.

[-]

B0bab0i@reddit

TTV6 engine in GX also trumps 4cyl turbo hybrid

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Mimical@reddit

This,

If you have LC money you have GX money and if you have GX money gas prices are at worst a minor 30 second inconvenience.

From the Taco, 4 Runner and LC they are punching 5-10k above where they should be.

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hutacars@reddit

The GX is more expensive than an LC, so no, if you have LC money, it does not therefore logically follow that you have GX money.

[-]

nsfdrag@reddit

It starts at a $10k price difference and goes up from there.

[-]

nucleararms@reddit

Well love my 250 h8trzz

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

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[-]

73629265@reddit

The Overtrail is so hard to actually pick up if you do show up with money. "Low availability" is being kind. Also the base Overtrail is probably closer to $130K cad. A LC250 with 10,000KM is about $70K. Things are probably a bit different in the USA.

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CurbsEnthusiasm@reddit

Buying a Toyota from a Toyota dealership is one of the automotive world’s terrible experiences.

[-]

bring-back-70s-bush@reddit

I personally had a great experience buying my Toyota from the dealership.

Their service department is a nightmare though. As soon as my free service package is over I’m never taking my vehicle back there. I’m also gonna let my salesman, who I actually really liked, know that he’s never gonna sell me another car as long as that service department continues to operate the way they are.

[-]

Kryptus@reddit

For 62k I'd rather buy a Lexus.

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Pinecone@reddit

I'm not doubting you but I would like to see some specific examples.

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StatusCount7032@reddit

For 14 years.

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PearlNights@reddit

we are broke broke

[-]

mangoagogo6@reddit

Broke broke phi broke

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MeinKampfySeat@reddit

We ain’t got it

[-]

Successful-Growth827@reddit

We are sharin' jeans. If I go outside, I got the only clothing on!

[-]

count_nuggula@reddit

How many cars do we own?!

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MNAAAAA@reddit

NONE

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NissanskylineN1@reddit

Shall we let the woman be the cat with the car?

[-]

count_nuggula@reddit

YES WE WILL!

[-]

Watchreps@reddit

WHY? BECAUSE WE CANT AFFORD GAS

[-]

MikeExMachina@reddit

“Remember when the US was half way respected and Kanye wasn’t mentally ill? Pepperidge Farm Remembers”

[-]

Girl_you_need_jesus@reddit

And that really is the root of the problem here

[-]

dakta@reddit

Doesn't explain how anyone is buying the RAV4 Prime, then.

[-]

icecon@reddit

$7500 tax credits on the leases are still valid until next month.

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Dragoeth1@reddit

Toyotas suck for leasing. Unless you're in a state with more stacking leases like colorado, a rav4 prime is still gonna be in the 600-700 monthly range.

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AndrewIsntCool@reddit

Holy shit that is a terrible lease price. I've been looking at leasing cars with the EV tax rebate, and I'm in a state with no extra lease incentives, and the monthly payment for cars $10k+ more expensive than a maxed out Rav4 Prime are going for $300 less monthly lol

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ciaranr1@reddit

Being upsold at the dealer?

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mysticode@reddit

Yep, it's also why Vegas is slowly dying

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GTI-Mk6@reddit

And if weren’t, we’re getting a Lexus

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invol713@reddit

This. We would like to buy one. We can’t afford one.

[-]

AmbassadorLeather224@reddit

I can tell you why. I test drove one and loved everything about it on paper.

The drivetrain is horribly underpowered. Slow. Way too slow for the money. It's that simple. Great idea, great looking car, sucks to actually drive.

[-]

Nonsense7891@reddit

CS feels solidly built, but the interior feels cramped like a plane cockpit. And the interior color choices are a dealbreaker. And it’s priced too high.

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Warpuppy@reddit

Taking delivery of a 2025 Crown Signia Limited this week. It replaces our beloved 2007 Camry Hybrid with 200K miles and still gets high 30's gas mileage and has had tires and oil changes and that's about all for going on 18 years. For me the Crown is a modern Camry drive train vehicle that adds a modern, premium feature set, AWD and lay flat cargo area. If it lasts like the Camry did, I don't care that its $50K.

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ShrimpSherbet@reddit

Too expensive for Toyota prices, not good enough for Lexus prices.

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negativeoxy@reddit

I just bought a new Land Cruiser, the Crown Signia wasn't on any dealership lots to even look at or I would have considered it.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

Did you ever consider a Lexus RX? If that was too small that a LC isn't too big for your needs, the CS wouldn't have worked.

That's why we went with a CPO GX vs the CS. It was too small for fitting 2 car seats + room for a driver.

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negativeoxy@reddit

There were no Lexus RX's either lol. What I actually wanted was a new GX but those are basically unicorns too.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

The 550 looks significantly better but we loved how smooth the old V8 was vs the turbo 6.

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Emppulicks@reddit

Another boring suv. Pass

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BAQ717@reddit

Because Lexus exists

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

If you go option a top of the line NX versus fully loaded this, there is still a big gap

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EnderBaggins@reddit

Yes but smart money buys a cpo lexus. Totally unbiased opinion here.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

agreed. Absolutely love the CPO GX460

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EnderBaggins@reddit

Give it time.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

I had a CPO GS for 7yrs so im with you. But man I still really like what this car is as a overall package

[-]

EnderBaggins@reddit

Its good looking, but the in-between place it occupies feels like that’s all it has going for it. Not quite enough utility and nothing going on performance wise, at a 50k price point its gotta bring more than a pretty face to the dance.

[-]

Successful_Ad_9707@reddit

While true, people will still want the Lexus nameplate. Stealth wealth is always a tricky sell.

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Gorgenapper@reddit

I know someone with one, it is basically a baby Lexus. It's even better than the NX350h, IMO, because it has physical buttons for climate controls, and it is also made in Japan.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

There you go. That's what I'm saying. Everyone going "Lexus exists" hasn't done any research at all.

[-]

Gorgenapper@reddit

It's basically the same price as a base Canadian NX350h ($61k), but likely has more standard equipment, it has more of a wagon shape to it (which looks good), it has physical buttons and the build quality is stellar.

Although if you were to put it side by side with a RAV4 hybrid at $20k CAD less, it would be a much tougher sell to the Toyota crowd. The Lexus buyer, assuming they're not tied to the badge, might consider the stealth wealth Crown Signia instead of the NX.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

the CS is a down badged RX450h

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907Ski@reddit

I'm considering replacing my wife's car with one, but it's larger than she wants. Will probably end up with a Volvo V60. (Still larger than she'd prefer, but there's not really anything smaller that checks the boxes. Oh that the Genesis G70 Shooting Brake were imported or even some of the smaller German wagons.) Were it a very similar overall to what it is but shorter in length and height, I'd have already bought one.

As for why it's not more popular, I suspect that Signia is too much of a cross-over/SUV for the "car" crowd and too much of a car for the cross-over/SUV crowd. It's also in a weird market space that's not quite luxury nor economical. More budget-minded buyers would get an Outback. Those with looser purse strings often want more luxury if not prestige. (That it's badged a Toyota rather than a Lexus is a plus as far as I'm concerned.) And as others have noted, Toyota hasn't put much effort into marketing, which is important for a new model that lacks name recognition.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

as a former Genesis owner, the only knock I have against them is how much deprecation fucks them. My G70 was much more fun and nicer than my S4 it replaced. But goddamn did I mess up by not just getting the IS500.

[-]

wh4cked@reddit

Just get an RS6 Avant bro!

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letsbefrds@reddit

As a person who leases a v60cc B5 I would not recommend it. Unless you're getting the PS edition t8.

I have 12k miles on it. My moon roof rattles. It's been in the shop twice, left me stranded once. Connectivity issues with Internet. The B5 mild hybrid gets decent mileage I don't think accurate, it's over estimated the signia gets a lot better. The B5s auto start stop is really awful like sometimes I miss the opportunity to go from a stop sign because there's a two second lag and a big clunk after (once a month I experience this)

[-]

907Ski@reddit

Thanks.

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Shamrocksf23@reddit

Test drive one last week and was very very impressed. Very Lexus like inside, luggage room decent and just a very attractive looking car va rav4

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

bc it's essentially a down badged Lexus RX450h. Check out a review video, the parts are Lexus stamped.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

That's right and def worth the extra coin. And you dont have to get an NX and pay even more.

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DudebuD16@reddit

Had one parked in front of my house recently. It was that copper-y colour and god damn that's a good looking SUV

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whittlingcanbefatal@reddit

The thing is it's not really an SUV. It gives the illusion of being one because of its high doors and shape but it's only two centimeters higher than previous crowns.

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Dr_WLIN@reddit

it's a crossover, just like 90% of the other "SUVs" on the road but at this point it's so commonly used now that it's really a moot point.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

That's the colour right there. It is SO good looking.

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Ok-Improvement-3670@reddit

Toyotas are slow and lack modern technology. They have a reputation for reliability but they’re like buying a 20 year old car.

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Astramael@reddit

What modern technology do they lack?

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Ok-Improvement-3670@reddit

Have you driven a Toyota? It feels like using a flip phone. The 2025s actually on paper have many modern “features” but they’re implemented in an extremely archaic manner and hard to use. Their seats are awful. Engines are unresponsive like cars from the 90s and before.

[-]

Astramael@reddit

Umm… yes. Your characterization really makes it seem like you have not driven a Toyota in 25 years.

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Ok-Improvement-3670@reddit

I’ve driven 2024 and 2025 Toyota for too many hours to not know about them. I was not impressed.

[-]

Astramael@reddit

Okay so in conclusion they don’t lack any modern technology, you just don’t like the interface. So your initial statement was intentionally false, got it.

[-]

Ok-Improvement-3670@reddit

A 286 has a word processor and a calculator and a spreadsheet, but I’m not going to use one for my daily work.

[-]

Goodman4525@reddit

The general rule is if a car enthusiast likes a car that car will likely sell very badly to the general public.

And then the car maker axes it while the car shoots up in value because all us car enthusiasts too broke to buy new scrambles for it in the used market

[-]

Whosez@reddit

They sold over 12k for the first half of the year and they’re not in stock anywhere. I have to disagree with their story.

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TurtleCrusher@reddit

RAV4 is already overpriced. Who the heck wants this?

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fak3g0d@reddit

I'm sure it's a great CUV but doesn't have the name recognition of a rav4, highlander, 4runner. It also seems a little boring, but Toyota should stick with it. It might become a staple eventually.

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StuckInTheNorth@reddit

I've always liked hatchbacks and wagons. The Crown Signia got me excited when I first saw it cause it almost did everything I want. Hybrid with a big trunk with the utility that I want since my current hatchback isn't really cutting it anymore for camping and long road trips.

But I hate the front end.

[-]

Astramael@reddit

Yea the front end is definitely weird. I’m not so keen on Toyota’s latest front end designs in general.

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Jucko6@reddit

No one has MONEY! Why is this question still being asked?

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RFK_Cum_Regimen@reddit

Saturated crossover low-affordability slop market.

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Valarmorghuliswy@reddit

Are you buying one? If not why not?

My wife would have considered it, but she likes her Lexus better. I wouldn’t consider it because it costs more than I want to pay for that type of vehicle. Tweener of car ideas.

[-]

MarioNinja96815@reddit

This post is the first time I’ve heard of this car so I suspect marketing or lack there of has something to do with it. After looking it up it looks like a pretty generic crossover while the RAV4 has a beefier SUV look, but I don’t know how many share that opinion. Then there’s the price difference. Economies aren’t doing great lately and even the successful are feeling it in their wallets.

These are just my educated guesses on why though.

[-]

DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit

This may sound silly, but I have a theory. Last November, I checked out the Crown Signia at the L.A. auto show. I'm not a tall guy by any means...five foot 9 and a half. I got into the driver's seat, and noticed that simply getting into the vehicle was a bit of a chore. The rake of the windshield and thus the a-pillar is so far back, that I could easily hit my head on it. I thought maybe I was overthinking it or imaging it. So I got back out and tried to sit back down onto the driver's seat. But I'm telling you, you can easily hit your head on the a-pillar. What makes it even worse is that the opening of the door relative to the roofline is quite small, and if you look at the design of the front doors/roofline, you can see there's hardly any horizontal space between the rake of the windshield/a-pillar and the b-pillar/rear edge of the front door. Meaning, there's not much space at all for your head when getting in or getting out. The roofline barely starts to flatten out before the end of the front doors.

For comparison, and yes I know these two cars are very different, but my Civic has much more horizontal space past the rake of the windshield. And I never have an issue with banging my head on the a-pillar of my car. There's far more space for your head when getting in and out.

Maybe this awkward design is driving people away from buying the car. Like I said, it sounds silly but it could be a viable reason.

[-]

poppinandlockin25@reddit

I agree. I am 6'4", so a lot of cars seem cramped or tight, but the Crown Signia was notably claustophobic feeling. I sat down and immediately knew it wasnt for me -- cramped.

[-]

DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit

Glad I’m not the only one who felt this way.

One other thing I forgot to mention was how low the ceiling was, making forward visibility less than stellar. The point where the windshield ends and the rooflines begins was pretty much in my line of sight looking forward. And if you put the sunvisor down? Forget about it. You can’t see anything in front of you. This was such a weird thing to me, I just couldn’t believe it. Such a large car has serious design and visibility issues.

Just out of curiosity, are there any cars that are the opposite of this to you? Which ones had lots of space when you got inside? I remember getting in the Bronco and thinking that it had lots of space.

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poppinandlockin25@reddit

As i said I am 6'4" and my son is 6'5". So when we shopped for a car for him, this was a MAJOR factor. What we called "an open feel". That term referred to both head room and viability, as well as not having a huge center console taking up room for your legs and knees

We saw the following as having open feel

- Bronco Sport - HUGE amount of headroom and visability

Subaru Forester - Same

VW Tiguan - less than the two above, but at decent amount. That's what he drives now.

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

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[-]

crikett23@reddit

I'd guess you are not in Japan, as sales there have been good... but, if you are not in Japan, then that also means you are in a country where the average car buyer most likely has no idea there is such a thing as a Toyota Crown Signia. Having consumers being completely unaware of your product's mere existence is a pretty major sales barrier.

All of those markets, where most consumers don't even know it exists, are also markets where sedan sales in general are in sharp decline. So, in the event someone in that market is even aware that it exists, they probably don't want a sedan.

The car is very expensive for a Toyota, and has styling elements that are may be problematic for people that are actually looking for a sedan. Meaning, if you wind up with someone that knows it exists, and wants a sedan, it may still alienate a vast majority of those customers with either the styling choices it made, or the price point.

When you get through that much, you are left with very few potential buyers, and the resulting sales you are seeing.

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ReasonableInternal75@reddit

We have an XLE. We love it. The only thing that I wish Toyota would’ve done was take out the heated back seats and replace it with parking sensors. Other than that, it’s damn near a perfect car. It doesn’t stand out in doing one thing exceptionally. But it does everything very well. For the money, I would buy it again in heartbeat.

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YJeezy@reddit

It doesn't have parking sensors?

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ReasonableInternal75@reddit

Yeah, a peculiar omission. There must be a lot of content about demolition derby’s in Japanese textbooks about life in the US. Anyway, we are willing to live without it considering all of the other built-in creature comforts.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Im glad you bought it. Its a fantastic choice

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01nebia@reddit

A guy at work has one, it's weird looking compared to other sedans, it sits high and proportions are off. Cars like that never sell well, remember the Toyota matrix? Good car, people just want somthing more mainstream I think.

[-]

sk8rlee@reddit

My guess is because it more closely resembles a station wagon than an SUV and most people these days don't like station wagons. And I imagine that the companies that do still make station wagons are selling mostly to brand-loyal buyers. Personally I like them and if I were in the market for something new I would definitely check them out.

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RallyVincentCZ75@reddit

I feel like the Signia sits at an odd crossroad. The Crown Regularia is right there, and then some people will wanna go to the Lexus NX just because it says Lexus. Crown by itself doesn't have a name that matches the prestige. Maybe they should have just left the name Toyota off if the Crowns, who knows. I did see one Crown Signia the other day, which reminded me that they are in fact for sale. So yah they're not selling great. Regular Crowns I see all the time.

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Wtheh@reddit

Starting at 60K

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ky7969@reddit

It’s the best looking car that Toyota makes IMO, but it’s too expensive. Might as well buy a Lexus.

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itsnottommy@reddit

I don’t think there’s much of a market for a $45,000 Toyota SUV with 2 rows of seats. People who want 2-row SUVs buy RAV4s, and people who want $45,000 SUVs buy 3-row Highlanders.

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06Hexagram@reddit

I bought one last year as soon as it was available and it is the nicest driving car ever, especially in traffic. It just whisks you away effortlessly and it's damn quiet and comfortable.

I drove a RAV4 hybrid the other day and in comparison it felt like driving a truck with much more engine noise and plasticy interior.

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Maggins@reddit

It’s a great vehicle. People in this thread saying the RAV4 is such a better value probably haven’t spent time with both vehicles. The RAV4 is a loud, uncomfortable, plastic box. The Crown Signia wasn’t quite out yet when I was last car shopping, but it would have been a finalist for sure. I think it’s a better vehicle than other Toyotas I test drove in that class/price like the Venza and Lexus NX.

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Tapprunner@reddit

You don't understand why more people can afford a $35k car than a $50k car?

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Did you read my full post? I didn't say I expected both to sell equally. You also get more VALUE and more CAR for that extra money. And RAV4s tend to not have any incentives on them while you will probably score some incentives on a car which isn't selling well. Pure hard numbers on a website aren't a good indicator of what a dealer will eventually work out for you.

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Tapprunner@reddit

Yeah, but the two price points are just too far apart.

Someone in the market for a RAV4 is unlikely to spend an extra $10k just because "it's a better value and we brought the price down by $5k". Those are the kinds of things that move the needle between two cars that are already about the same price.

I think you're also missing what RAV4 shoppers actually value. If they valued extra tech and luxury touches, they wouldn't be shopping for a RAV4 in the first place. The things you think make the Crown a better value, most RAV4 owners would call unnecessary and wasteful. They wouldn't look at upgraded speakers, infotainment/screens and see value - they'd ask: why do you throw your money away on frivolous options?

[-]

ZealousZeebu@reddit

This is the power of name branding. They screwed-up not calling it the Avalon.

[-]

keaferg@reddit

It’s as expensive as a damn Lexus ES without the badging.

[-]

yzyszn99@reddit

My Lexus dealership’s been attracting tons of Toyota clients because we discount cars, whereas the Toyota stores nearby stay at MSRP or charge more. We also offer special rate financing on certain models so it comes out to be the more feasible option in comparison.

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Oh yeah? Not the case here in the Toronto area with the Lexus guys I've been to at least. And the pricing is craaazy

[-]

yzyszn99@reddit

I’m based in NY We get tons of Crown, Highlander, Grand Highlander clients come in and get our vehicles just based on the overall dealer experience as well.

[-]

GOD-PORING@reddit

Crown Sport I'd consider

[-]

Hrekires@reddit

There's one parked in the train station I take to work just about every day. And every morning, I think about what a striking looking car it is as I walk past.

Then I lookup the price and continue on about my day. Not to mention Toyota's lack of decent lease deals on just about anything other than the BZ4Xs that they can't give away.

[-]

OpenImagination9@reddit

For that money there are better options. Also, no Turbo in what would be the sleeper hot-rod in the lineup.

[-]

boatsbikesandcars@reddit

I have and love my Crowns for my company cars. I went to look at a signia for the extra space when we needed another but I couldn’t get over the look. They are just ugly.

[-]

power_of_funk@reddit

They're ugly and people would rather a real SUV than a pretend one

[-]

F1_Geek@reddit

Funny you say that because I see so many of them in my area.

[-]

DrDice14@reddit

As someone who considered buying the crown signia and took it on several test drives it is exceptionally quiet and the interior is nice; however, the low roof line and huge A pillar makes you feel claustrophobic. You sit pretty low and there’s a high belt line. They also gate keep a few features for the higher trim that push the price to 50k

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Anteater_Reasonable@reddit

Because it’s a more expensive Subaru Outback without the outdoorsy street cred and its sunroof doesn’t even open. Who is it for?

[-]

AmNoSuperSand52@reddit

It’s way nicer than an Outback lol

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Imagine comparing this to an Outback lol

[-]

Anteater_Reasonable@reddit

Imagine not seeing how similar it is to an Outback. What else would you compare it to? It’s a lifted AWD station wagon. An Outback Touring is nearly the same price and its closest competitor.

[-]

Anteater_Reasonable@reddit

It’s marginally nicer than an Outback

[-]

letsbefrds@reddit

I don't understand the sunroof it's like an extra 2000 that is nothing but trouble how often do people actually enjoy them

[-]

Anteater_Reasonable@reddit

I open my sunroof every time it’s more than 65° outside. It’s pointless if it doesn’t open.

[-]

Then-Ticket8896@reddit

As I look at the price of these vehicles with interest And minimal salaries in my area I’d say they will drop prices after next April.

[-]

binding_swamp@reddit

$43k OTD price. We’re pleased, it’s a level above any other Toyota, made in Japan to a much higher quality than any dime-a-dozen RAV4. At 6k miles, every tank over 40mpg.

[-]

Carbosuchus@reddit

Price vs what you get. I was looking to buy a premium wagon or compact SUV and this was on my early list. At $50k, it has less value for money than the Outback. Vs the Euros, its powertrain, looks, and refinement are a complete joke. I ended up with a Mercedes E class wagon.

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

A Benz E Class wagon was the same price as a C Signia?

[-]

Carbosuchus@reddit

Haha, nah. But I had a flexible budget, and was open to either a shitbox steal or something higher end. The e class is very nice, the outback was a great deal on space, reliability, etc. And both have a distinct personality to them. The crown signia was a bland, unexciting, not-that-nice option in the middle.

[-]

Then-Ticket8896@reddit

Ugly vehicle

Lexus screwed up the ES design for 2026!

[-]

Streelydan@reddit

Because they make 8 goddamn suv models with only minor differences in size and features plus 6 more from Lexus. The market is overrun with the same bullshit.

[-]

doubletwist@reddit

I didn't even know it existed until I saw one the a couple months ago. And as a former owner of a 2020 Avalon Hybrid (which was REALLY nice for the price) the first thought I had upon seeing it from the behind was, "That thing is fugly."

[-]

LTBX@reddit

I think the branding is very confusing. That’s not helping.

[-]

squirrel8296@reddit

It's too expensive for a Toyota-branded vehicle and it is positioned wrong in the market.

If it had a Lexus badge it would sell a lot better in North America. Sure it's comparable to a Lexus in build and material quality (which is going to be a noticeable step up from a normal Toyota), but folks who have that kind of money to drop on a vehicle are going to buy from a luxury brand (because status). The other comparable expensive Toyota-branded vehicles (like the Sequoia, Land Cruiser, and 4Runner) are positioned as durable long lasting vehicles not luxury.

[-]

GooberPeas0911@reddit

The dealer experience is sucko. We have 5 dealerships locally and they're all bad. On the sales side every vehicle has at least $3k in 'mandatory' add-ons. And a couple have a put on an additional $2k in markup. On the service side, they're notorious for performing unneeded tasks and/or replacing parts prematurely.

I too like the Crown Signia but the dealer experience was bad enough that I went elsewhere.

[-]

04limited@reddit

The big reason the Rav sells so well is you can get them in the low $30k range and there is a lot of supply compared to the crown. You can go to just about any Toyota dealer and walk out with a RAV4 right now. You won’t with a Crown.

Last summer I was dead set on buying a Crown LE sedan(would’ve 100% gotten a Signia if I knew they were going to be released)

However Crown LEs are very tough to find. They’re mostly built as Limiteds and Platinums $45k-$50k+ There were a few LEs around me for $42-43k however every dealer I went to acted like they were sitting on gold. Wouldn’t unlock them for you to look inside. “We have someone coming to look at it” “it’s already sold” yet it’s sitting without a sold tag and continued to sit there for a few weeks. They kept putting me on the fully loaded $50k Platinums. Ended up getting a Lexus UX for less than a Crown LE.

I honestly think the Crown is gonna die out for the US market. The supply is too low for someone who wants one and the cost of these is too high for the typical Toyota buyer.

[-]

RyanGreener@reddit

Its an ideal commuter/family car but the price is either inaccessible to people or the people who buy cars that expensive want the badge. It seems no different than the Avalon.

[-]

ranchero_colectivo@reddit

Costs about as much as a Highlander, and for the same amount of money most people will take the larger car, even if the smaller car is nicer

Even if I wanted a Crown Signia Toyota wouldn't allow me to order one. I checked just now, and my local dealer has three in transit and none have the options or color combination I would like. To get the one I want, I'd have to look everywhere until I somehow find a unicorn.

Toyota will sell about as many cars as they're willing to build. If they only want to sell a few thousand of these then that's the amount they're going to build.

[-]

eh_itzvictor@reddit

We are broke, and its just another Toyota crossover amongst the extremely crowded lineup they currently have. Why WOULD anybody buy this one?

[-]

SRMort@reddit

$45 grand, CVT, 7.1s 0-60, big stupid SUV. those are my reasons.

[-]

Due_Platypus_8221@reddit

I’m convinced that people that claim it’s like a Lexus haven’t driven one. It’s not half as refined feeling as my 20 year old Lexus. I test drove one to get for my mom. Instead landed on a new ES with the V6. No one could confuse the ride quality and comfort between the crown signia and ES.

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Phosphorus444@reddit

My guess is because the Signia sits as the awkward middle child of Toyota's and Lexus' lineup. Too expensive for Rav4 buyers, you don't get the prestige and comfort of a Lexus dealership, and the Crown Signia shares its name with one of the ugliest sedans on the market today.

I like the Signia, but I'm not in the market for a premium, soft wagon. I'd rather have a GS wagon.

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Your first paragraph is the reason I would go for one. You don't have to deal with Lexus dealer costs and you get a very classy and loaded vehicle that isn't as plain jane as the RAV4 is. I've always been drawn to vehicles that sit in that zone...Avalon, Maxima, you could argue the Murano esp last gen when it still had the V6 and was loaded.

[-]

hi_im_bored13@reddit

Vast majority of toyota dealerships should service a lexus just fine, parts are going to be pricier of course and no recalls and whatnot, but for basic maintenance, oil changes, etc. its no issue

Likewise outside of warranty work you can take acuras to honda dealerships

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Ran4@reddit

No, Toyota dealerships can't service newer Lexuses - they no longer have access to the software.

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Exactly. That hasn't been the case for YEARS

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V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit

I think Toyota really needing to give Crown an independent showroom like Japan. Have been their Crown showroom, I’ve to say it was really awesome.

[-]

Oddballfew@reddit

You say you would go for one... But are you actually going to buy one? This isn't an attack but rather a potential insight into why others don't buy.

[-]

ggtsu_00@reddit

You have to look at market segments as a Venn Diagram. Niche cross-segment vehicles that try to dip one foot in each segment end up only appealing to that small intersection overlapping region between the two it's straddling.

[-]

RudyDaBlueberry@reddit

Price range: $43,590-$47,990

And it’s just another shitbox crossover, I can only imagine why no one’s buying another shitbox crossover for almost 50k out the door when a brand new Mustang GT MSRPs at the same price.

[-]

Aetius3@reddit (OP)

I know this sub is full of kids like you but people generally dont cross shop a RWD muscle car with a four door CUV.

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RudyDaBlueberry@reddit

I mean, my point stands. It’s still a 50k crossover. My point being, there are better options if you’re going to drop 50k on a vehicle.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

Its a Golf R, you fucking moron. I guess you haven't come across it yet in Forza Horizon so you have no clue what it is?

[-]

RudyDaBlueberry@reddit

What’s your fucking deal? What, you don’t like it when someone takes uncalled for personal jabs at you? Funny world we live in. Did you write the article yourself? No. Then stfu and go get your CEL checked at autozone. If it makes it there, that is.

[-]

Treso44@reddit

The proportions are so weird. It’s the only vehicle that is somehow in between a sedan and CUV, but still not really a hatchback.

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tablepennywad@reddit

It is ugly and frumpy. I do not know why they didn’t bring over the budget Purasangue, the Crown Sport SUV. Every time I see one in Japan it catches my eye.

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Bram24@reddit

Because it’s Fugly

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uglybushes@reddit

People have eyes

[-]

Dgp68824402@reddit

Most buyers just want functional. RAV4 meets that. Crown is not particularly compelling to most buyers at its price point.

[-]

Dutchdogdad@reddit

Call me when it's full electric. Looks great, but I'll never go back to an ICE vehicle. Charging in my garage and driving past gas stations is marvelous.

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masterz13@reddit

No one’s buying anything in this economy

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MiLKK_@reddit

Lexus without the Lexus badge but Lexus prices. As a Lexus owner this is welcoming, Toyota should stick to what it does best and make cars at an affordable price and reliable. If they want to do luxury, they have Lexus.

[-]

CaliDude75@reddit

I don’t get it either. I think it’s one of the best-looking current Toyotas, and plays in the same league (at least market positioning) as the Outback, which sells very well.

Probably price (and/or greedy dealer markups) and just lack of consumer awareness.

[-]

funnyfarm299@reddit

Can confirm. I looked at one when I was in the market for an SUV last year. Thousands of dollars of dealer markup in my area soured me from Toyota. I wound up with my CRV instead.

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fantaribo@reddit

Because it is more expensive and not that good looking.

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Jigagug@reddit

People who want a sensible family Toyota don't buy them new.

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kqlx@reddit

I think people in that target segment would rather just get a hybrid lexus suv or a RAV4 prime

[-]

dsonger20@reddit

Why not just hit a Lexus at that price?

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

You wouldn't get a Lexus that loaded at that price and then you have things like premium gas and premium dealer service fees to consider.

[-]

fsu_ppg@reddit

I just got a Lexus ES 350 Luxury pretty much loaded for $51k. I was really eyeing the Crown Signia as well and probably could have negotiated to about $48k but the ES had better gas mileage and I didn’t have a utility case for the cargo area

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Ran4@reddit

Buying an n/a vehicle in 2025 is kinda wild.

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jstude2019@reddit

No way the Lexus had better gas mileage. Isn't it an na v6

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fsu_ppg@reddit

Should have specified that it’s the hybrid. I’m getting between 44-47mpg

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jstude2019@reddit

Okay so you have an ES300h, not an ES350

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senorbeethoven@reddit

Is that 51k before tax and destination fee?

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acideater@reddit

What cars don't run on 87 now with "regular" driving?

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Ch4rlie_G@reddit

It’s really not worth it to run lower octane than the car was designed for. If you want 87 buy a car designed for 87. Cars have a window where they can advance and retard timing and just in case something goes wrong that doesn’t pop the check engine light, you want your engine to save itself. Running 87 reduces your safety net.

If you want to save money, increase economy, AND have better performance then spend the 300 bucks on a mild e85 tune (provided the car has forced induction).

[-]

acideater@reddit

I drive a 2004 Saab 2.0L with a turbo. 87 it gets. "Modern" cars or anything eco-boost knock sensors adjust the map within milliseconds of detecting knock. I wouldn't put the car in a high load boost situation on purpose, but most modern cars will tolerate it.

There is an "87" map for those people who they know are going to put 87 in.

I had an argument about e85 back in that economically, while maybe slightly more economical, your not saving as much as you think because e85 is like 25% less energy dense. you get less mpg.

A car with an E85 mode "flex fuel", etc just injects more fuel to make up the difference. E-85 used for performance is ridiculous the size of injectors you have to use.

It has a great octane rating and deals with knock well though

[-]

Ch4rlie_G@reddit

Oh I know the woes of e85. But we have a plant on the way to my lake where you can get it for 2 bucks a gallon.

Unfortunately my new tow vehicle doesn’t take it. GM stopped in 2014 I think.

To each their own. I have an 06 Audi A8 with an NA 4.2, but I know enough about the timing and fueling systems to just feed it the 93 and not have that variable.

My kids are like you and actually drive more than me. They both have 2.0tsi engines (turbo). Daughter puts 87 and son puts 93. We shall see who makes it further.

My money is on things breaking other than fuel .

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dsonger20@reddit

I’m not getting work done at the dealer. A Lexus is mechanically a Toyota. Any mechanic can work on them. Besides warranty work through a Lexus dealer will be much better.

Apart from that, a comperable NX in Canada is like 56k I believe. With some options, it’s like 10kish more CAD than the Crown.

[-]

Dangerous-Ad-4103@reddit

Broke

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supreet908@reddit

Honestly, they should sell a Lexus version of this thing. Do it like Volvo does their Cross Country models and sell it as a Lexus EX, the "Cross Country" version of the ES.

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Old-Sprinkles760@reddit

Seen this play out. Friends went Lexus GX shopping the second their LC250 quotes hit $80K+. Can't blame them though gotta admit, the Land Cruiser's still the cooler rig.

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shffldair@reddit

might as well just buy a tesla

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rVintageRKO@reddit

Because its not a traditional body style. Its a weird hybrid mix of a wagon and a crossover. Just like the Crown sedan, it just looks weird.

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fizzy_love@reddit

If I needed a new car and couldn’t source a gx460 or of Toyota was offering an incredible deal, I’d surely consider it. I really like the looks of it, I just don’t need it right now and there’s plenty of used 460s around.

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steepndeep82@reddit

Test drive one in the evening, and try to see anything with those headlights. Kept checking to see if they were on when there was street lights, then we went behind the dealership where there were none. Low beams are for showing other drivers you are there I guess. High beams are blind the world, but illuminate nothing. It's a city car at best. Wipers are too slow as well.

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ikilledtupac@reddit

Boring hybrid with a CVT it’s almost 50k and you have to deal with a Toyota dealer. Pass.

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chef-curry-30@reddit

I just looked it up and I was surprised how much advantages a RAV4 hybrid has over the Crown Signia. The RAV4 is lighter and has a smaller footprint while offering pretty much the same passenger space and more cargo capacity and better mpg than the Crown Signia. The Crown has better interior and build quality, but man the RAV4 is significantly cheaper and comes in more convenient packaging. Not to mention the next gen RAV4 will be kicking it up a notch.

[-]

DankBlunderwood@reddit

We're entering a recession and the Crown Signia depends on a market segment that has disappeared - middle class buyers aren't looking to stretch to a halo model of a mass market nameplate right now.

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Traditional_Tax6469@reddit

Too expensive…

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foscrew@reddit

Because it's not a traditional crossover, people are broke, and probably confusion with the other Crown.

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Bubcats@reddit

If I got one, I’d take off the crown badge stuff

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stametsprime@reddit

For as big of a car as it is, it’s not all that roomy. My head brushes the ceiling and I’m 5’10”.

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Bubcats@reddit

I looked for the YouTube video review I saw that was pretty on point about how Lexus wanted it and Toyota said nope. They call this an suv even though they have 9 SUVs. Its market is sooo niche. Think mega loyal Subaru grandparents. Its mpg for hybrid is okay. If Toyota got their head out of their ass about electric this would crush the dumb Honda GM version. But no, they did the Bz4x thing. As a Volvo cross country driver in I think it’s perfect hybrid Subaru alternative except mpg is so-so.

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Lazy_Gap_752@reddit

?

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monroe4@reddit

If you are going to spend that much then might as well buy a Lexus

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fiddlythingsATX@reddit

If I'm spending that kind of money, I want to be able to get the exact car I want and Toyota doesn't let you do that. You can use their online configurator all day long, but dealers can't order that car for you.

[-]

Cyberhwk@reddit

I'll tell you the same thing. I told the salesman that tried to sell it to me...

I like it, but not $10,000 more than the Camry.

I'd have paid maybe $3,000 to $4,000 more for the same feature set.

[-]

StopTheIncels@reddit

My brother bought one. It's nice. But it's a car who doesn't know what it wants to be - it's like a wagon/semi-luxury/AWD sedan/hybrid. It's weird.

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WatchStoredInAss@reddit

It's fugly.

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SirLoremIpsum@reddit

I don't get it.

The Camry / RAV4 / Highlander is cheaper.

The ES / RX / NX has the name, the badge.

It's in an awkward spot.

I would love to have one. It's almost a proper wagon.

But it also lacks the higher end T24A drive trains that the Lexus have, that the other Crowns have.

So firmly I think the RAV is stealing it's lunch

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V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit

Crown is basically Toyota Buick, so Crown models are mid luxury levels and prices.

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ClaudeVS@reddit

Firstly, it's a new car, meaning it's got all this awful shit like cameras and lane assist and screens and things that nobody wants. Secondly I'm guessing it doesn't come in manual, and thirdly I can't afford that shit lol, give me a 1994 3.0 turbo diesel 4runner off marketplace 😍

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BraveFencerMusashi@reddit

Maybe everyone else is waiting for the Crown Sport like me

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kulzboy@reddit

I almost bought one.

But at that price point you have a lot of options. Do you want parking sensors and more ground clearance and only wants a point A to point B? There's a whole segment of hybrid CUV under 40k.

Do you want to feel like a true luxury product with parking sensors and useable Speaker system? Go for the limited. Is your Toyota dealership being a jerk? Here's a premium Lexus NX350h for the same price.

Weirdly enough I would've bought a limited if it didn't come with the 21in wheels. I'm a sucker for wagon esque suv. It did open me up to test drive a very low mile CP manual integra with the same ish fuel economy at 20k less though. Guess I'll save a bit of money and have some more fun for now.

[-]

juicytootnotfruit@reddit

You should buy one and let us know.

[-]

testthrowawayzz@reddit

My reasons for eliminating this from consideration...

Before going to the dealership:

There are no colors I want. I prefer a light color and the only light color is white, which is a color I would never buy (the other being black). There's not even a silver color!
Too long. The last generation ES was already a bit too long at 192 inches and this is even longer

After checking it out at the dealer:

Shared brake lamps and rear turn signals. Deal breaker for me especially at this price.

My parents saw the car too and they didn't like it because it's too short (vertically) for a SUV.

[-]

clownpirate@reddit

Premium or “near luxury” cars from non-luxury cars always seem to bomb in the US.

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MattTheMechan1c@reddit

Because for a little bit more you can have a Lexus which has a tad better interior, unique dealership experience, and the more prestigious L badge. This reminds me of the Volkswagen Arteon. Sharp looking car that’s actually decent, but for a bit more you can have an Audi that also has a more prestigious badge.

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ZoomZoomDiva@reddit

It's too much of a wagon. People are buying Highlanders instead.

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mr_lab_rat@reddit

This is the first time I’m hearing about the car. That could be part of it.

I guess it just doesn’t have the right buyer. People either get the RAV4 for the value, Highlander for the bigger size and value, or go to Lexus for luxury.

It looks like a good alternative to some Lexus models.

[-]

crashck@reddit

Honestly I like them and have considered it, but I hate that they put last gen hybrid in it. Its too expensive to use old tech

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hundredjono@reddit

Nobody is buying it because they don't know it exists

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The_Phenomenal_1@reddit

Money

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Ftpini@reddit

It’d be fine if it were a Lexus. I’ll never buy another Toyota in my life thanks to how terrible their dealerships are in the US. We owned 2 Corolla’s and a Prius back in the day. Cars were good. It’s a shame really. If they could ditch their dealerships they’d be a great brand.

[-]

L_viathan@reddit

Starts at $60,000 CAD. It's more expensive than the RAV4, Highlander, grand Highlander, and 4runner. Who is this car for?

[-]

One_Weird2371@reddit

Expensive and ugly. You are gonna spend that much might as well get a luxury SUV

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rhunter99@reddit

Man in Canada it starts at around $61,500. In this economy??

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__nullptr_t@reddit

It's ugly.

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wc1048@reddit

Kinda reminds me of a station wagon, which I like. Once it’s 17-20k (used) instead of 40-50k… I’ll be shoppin

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King_Barrion@reddit

Crossover slop is why

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Dat_Belly@reddit

I have 2 different neighbors that have one and I see them all over town.... 🤷🏼‍♂️

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Hutchicles@reddit

It looks like shit and is basically a car. The towing capacity is terrible, the mileage is pretty good, but overall it's just a car that looks like an SUV.

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Shmokesshweed@reddit

Ugly as sin.

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ShadowGLI@reddit

When I read the spec as soon as a see CVT I’m out. And I’m not against automatics, but I like cars with manual override and I hate when my car is in too high or too low a gear and a CVT shifts like a 2 speed and it annoys the shit out of me

[-]

baronvondoofie@reddit

VW had the same issue with the Arteon — really nice and good-looking car, but priced like an Audi, so not just buy the Audi instead of buying an overpriced VW?

I think the Crown should have been slotted above Lexus, not shoehorned between Toyota and Lexus. Make the Crown a true luxury marque to compete with Mercedes and BMW.

[-]

No_Manches_Man@reddit

Really nice car…just too expensive. You can get a nice three-row suv for that dough.

[-]

Dud3_Abid3s@reddit

It’s another soulless SUV…

[-]

goodluvv@reddit

It's ugly.

[-]

prothero99@reddit

Most people aren't sure that they will have a job a year from now, interest rates are crazy, dealerships are too greedy for their own good...

[-]

darti_me@reddit

RAV4 exists

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tetrachromatictacos@reddit

It’s an SUV. Fuck it.

[-]

bigbura@reddit

Looks so much like an Equinox EV on the outside. Is spooky.

[-]

longgamma@reddit

Too expensive. Why not spend a little more and get a Lexus?

[-]

vampyrelestat@reddit

Beyond someone just buying a Lexus at that price point I also think a lot of people don’t even know what the Crown is or that it even exists

[-]

herbaltherapy@reddit

My wife and I bought one a month two ago. We looked at the RAV4 PHEV, RX350H. I put her on the C Signia because it was between the 2, RAV4 PHEV too hard to find. She didn’t like the look and size of RX350H

Dealer was willing to come down and negotiate on a C Signia. I did the research and negotiating. For us:

Lexus ish frame/design/parts Camry hybrid engine Crossover type SUV first family car starter

So far she loves it, much safer than the 2010s matrix we got her out of. 🤣

[-]

varezhka11@reddit

Mid-size two-row SUV in general is a slow seller, with most people going for a similarly priced three-row instead. In case of the Crown Signia, it's also a bit lower, almost station wagon in proportion. Its dimensions are almost identical to the first gen Toyota Venza and we all remember how well that sold.

They're sort of in an odd place where they're not luxury enough to immediately command high price, but not inexpensive enough to have a sense of value for most people.

[-]

KeyboardGunner@reddit

Mid-size two-row SUV in general is a slow seller, with most people going for a similarly priced three-row instead.

This is totally untrue. The best selling SUVs in the US are overwhelming 2 row SUVs.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g64457986/bestselling-cars-2025/

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varezhka11@reddit

I see a lot of two-row compact SUVs like RAV4 and Foresters and three-row midsize like Explorers and Grand Cherokees in that list. The only midsize two-rows that sell in any numbers are Subaru Outback or BOF Wrangers and 4Runners.

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Signal_Ball4634@reddit

I'm not particularly surprised a pseudo-lux niche crossover isn't selling massively. And families will lean towards the Highlander and Grand Highlander at the price point the Crown Signia hits.

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MotoMeow217@reddit

I'm not buying any new cars any time soon unless I don't have a choice. Interest rates are insane, prices are too high, and insurance rates are ridiculous.

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driftking428@reddit

My brother in law has one. My truck was 59k his crown close to 50k. Absolutely everything about my truck is nicer. The only category it wins in is MPG. And I get almost 30mpg highway.

It's not nice enough for what it costs. The infotainment is garbage. The cupholders are some stupid rattly shit. It doesn't feel premium at all.

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HocusFocuss@reddit

What truck do you own?

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jojowasher@reddit

I think its a stock thing, there are almost none listed in my area (9) and I bet if you go to the dealers they dont actually have them, they just list them on autotrader and tell you to pre order one.

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krombopulousnathan@reddit

On paper it makes a lot of sense. Enough so that I recommended it to my dad to look at. He has an older Audi A6 but has been thinking of moving to a small to medium size crossover. He still wants something nice but would like to have decent fuel economy. And bonus points for regular gas.

According to him it just isn’t good. He said it wasn’t as economy car as the Prius, but nowhere near the level of a BMW X5 (which he really liked) or even the Lexus RX (which he really did not like). He said his 12 year old Audi was nicer to him

My dad is not a car enthusiast. To non enthusiasts like him it seems the Crown Signia is expensive but not as nice as other cars around the same price point.

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WarCrimeGaming@reddit

Because we want the god dang Crown Sport!

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DoublePostedBroski@reddit

We broke.

And “crown” is a dumb name.

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tallon4@reddit

Crown is the naming basis for some of the best-selling cars of all time made by Toyota:

Corona = “crown” in Latin
Corolla = “little crown” in Latin
Camry = “crown” in Japanese (かんむり kanmuri)

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Lidzo@reddit

Oh boy... another sub 250hp CVT crossover... how are these not flying off the shelf? /s

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SushiRoe@reddit

Because I wished Toyota would bring the JDM Crown Sport instead

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six_six@reddit

Another car that's a victim of the "i'd buy used one".

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RiftHunter4@reddit

They are pretty attractive used. They go for around $45k for the limited and about $41k for the XLE. And these are examples with under 5000 miles. Pretty soon, early examples will be in the High 30s, cheaper than a Highlander or Camry.

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ainsley-@reddit

The manual Corolla Syndrome

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apoleonastool@reddit

It looks like a wagon and is expensive.

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hanjh@reddit

I’m waiting for used prices to go down, stop posting this man

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boner79@reddit

I really like he Crown as a sedan but when you jump to Signia you're competing with the Grand Highlander.

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tallon4@reddit

Signia has 2 rows, Grand Highlander has 3

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RiftHunter4@reddit

I don't understand the concern? The Crown line-up was not meant to be a large volume seller by any means and Toyota has not made many of them. My local dealer has maybe had 20 of them since it launched. Edmunds is currently showing just 500 new Crown Signia's listed nationwide in the US. That's about 60 more than the current new GR86 listings they have.

So it really isn't supposed to be some common car. Don't expect to see these too often.

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TSLAog@reddit

Because it’s just an overpriced vanilla-ass Toyota…

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Successful_Ad_9707@reddit

I definitely wouldn't call it vanilla. It's fairly handsome with a well appointed interior.

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SurprisedByItAll@reddit

Never heard of it, gonna look it up now

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arsinoe716@reddit

It looks like a station wagon.

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Jasonp359@reddit

It's the price

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Dyslexicpig@reddit

We traded in our 2020 Rav4 three months ago for a Crown Signia. We put down a deposit for a Rav4 hybrid, and were told the waiting time was six to seven months. A week later, the dealership called and said the had the Crown Signia (in white) coming in, and asked if we were interested in it.

We had never even heard of it - it was one of Toyota's little secrets. Took it for a test drive and really liked it. We went from straight ICE to a more powerful hybrid, from cloth seats to leather. And best of all, when we park at a mall, we don't see three hundred identical cars on our walk to our car!

After three months of owning it, I am still impressed with the fuel economy. Our best with the Rav4 was 6.1 l/100km, and around town, we would get 10.5. With the Crown, our worst of three months was 6.0, all around town, and our best so far has been 5.3. We are getting around 850km per fill up.

In my opinion, it looks better than the Rav4 and drives a lot better. And so far, the only other one was at a mall while on a recent road trip.

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DALESR4EVER124@reddit

It aint worth $70k, lol

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ferio252@reddit

Doesn't translate well for the US Market. The Crown market is mainly for Japan, and any sales here are just a bonus. It's like if we start selling new F-series trucks in Japan, it'll be a flop, but it's all bonus sales on top of what we're selling here.

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Massy11155@reddit

It’s overpriced. I would rather get a fully loaded Camry.

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ainsley-@reddit

People are brand snobs

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BodaciousGuy@reddit

Never heard of it.

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

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AutoModerator@reddit

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redcarblackheart@reddit

They gave it the lower hp powertrain compared to the sedan. Why?

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20footdunk@reddit

Judging from these comments, I don't think even car enthusiasts know that the Crown and the Crown Signia are two different cars.

That might be hurting its sales.

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Monkeywithalazer@reddit

1) it’s ugly 2) it’s expensive

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

You think its ugly? Come on dude

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Monkeywithalazer@reddit

For 50k? Fugly

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ancientemblem@reddit

Because I have a 2nd child on the way and will pick up a Sienna to shuttle the grandparents as well.

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PJTree@reddit

It was nice, but didn’t seem luxurious enough. It was sporty nice. I was expecting to be impressed.

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kramark814@reddit

Crown Signia has a pricing problem.

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KidRed@reddit

Good!!! Toyota should’ve brought over the Crown Sport instead!!! They make a badass xover, give it power and don’t bring it to the US. We instead get this generic Venza thing.

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PaulClarkLoadletter@reddit

The cargo area was a little on the small size.

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

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ThePurpleBall@reddit

Too expensive. And I think most people are looking for the biggest boxiest thing they can afford, because you got 5000 lb Escalades driven by teens and distracted drivers. Can’t make up for size and force etc. At this point in a car you’re getting picked out of the grill in pieces in an accident

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rather_be_redditing@reddit

Rich wasps that like to hide their wealth have them. I’m hoping they go for cheap on the used market but it’s not happening yet.

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drewforty@reddit

It's more money than a Grand Highlander or 4Runner both of which will appeal as "more for the money" to most people. It's main selling point in marketing seems to be comfort, which needs to be a thing in an era where everyone wants to be a sports car, but just being comfy alone isn't enough as a new line without a reputation. I'd argue it does not come in nice colors - other than black and white there are only 3 - too-bright red, a nice bronze, and prius powder blue. The interior looks good but it's Lexus money and not quite Lexus nice. The drivetrain is bog-standard Toyota Hybrid so it can't lean on that for sales. It's basically the LC200 problem. When it comes down to it, you're probably going to buy the Lexus instead for the same money - it's NX/RX territory.

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streetracer967@reddit

The Lexus NX exists, I recommend this car to my mom and she said “why would I get this when I can get Lexus”

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CynCity323@reddit

I didn't even know the crown signia was a thing... Maybe it's marketing?

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octoroach@reddit

Sat it in, has no headroom (6’3). Another car with a forced sunroof that I can’t buy, hate sunroofs so much lol

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tclark2006@reddit

Th3y should make a "TRD" edition where they drop it 3 inches to make it a wagon.

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derouville@reddit

I'd love one but want the more powerful engine they dont offer.

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Low-Umpire236@reddit

Can’t wait to get one depreciated.

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rekniht01@reddit

It would be top of my list, if I was in the market of its price. I’m not, so…

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

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AutoModerator@reddit

No rage bait, memes, trolling, copypasta, or low-quality joke posts or comments.

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CarobAffectionate582@reddit

What in the hell is this about? Is the automod this incompetent?

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BIGJake111@reddit

Anyone interested in that radical of styling would rather buy lease or own pre owned a more premium brand.

It’s not that budget brands can’t do luxury cars, they just can’t hack it without badge engineering.

Kill me but I’d bet an updated Avalon would sell better.

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acideater@reddit

That is considered a hatchback? I mean i agree, but surprised they labeled it that way.

These small sub-compact "suv's" are all lifted hatchbacks giving up mpg for 4wd and large tires. People like the tall sitting position so manufactures get to get a premium for them.

A "luxury" non luxury branded hatchback for mid 40's.

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silent-dano@reddit

I don’t think it looks good. Was going to look into the crown suv one. But that was just too long for a two row.

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466rudy@reddit

Crossovers are ugly as hell. I'd buy a JDM Crown.

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tokidokithrowie@reddit

If they made it as an EV with the new 2026 powertrain, I would've gotten it over my Mercedes.

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ThetaGrim@reddit

They should have brought the crown sport suv.

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

I wish but now with people not even buying this, thats not gonna happen

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BetterSite2844@reddit

For that kind of money I decided on a golf r instead.

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Incompetent_Person@reddit

According to this road and track article they were only planning on selling about 15,000 total for the 2025 MY so having only sold ~1,000 last month isn’t that far off the target. For whatever reason it’s a low volume model here in NA.

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5tudent_Loans@reddit

Because its expensive af. You also might not knownit exists because of all its siblings from the same brand alone, talk less of throwing Lexus in the mix.

It wasnt even till the other day that I realized that Toyota essentially has a street line of SUVs and a Rugged SUV line.

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NoBenders@reddit

It's a slightly shinier NPC mobile in a sea of NPC mobiles. And the Venza looked 1000x better than it

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Aetius3@reddit (OP)

I dont think so. Yes the Venza was def nice but this one looks fantastic.

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Ok_Top55@reddit

I think a lot of people just see the price and look elsewhere. It’s not cheap, and for that money there are a ton of other options, especially SUVs or crossovers with more features or better brand recognition in the US. Plus, the Crown name doesn’t really mean much here like it does in Japan. Most people probably don’t even know what it is. Toyota also already has a bunch of similar cars that kinda overlap, so it just gets lost.

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RussBot10000@reddit

Im not really ready for a hybrid yet.