What Balkan stance(s) have you like this?
Posted by tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 66 comments
One for every country so as to not show favouritism:
Slovenia - Is not Balkan anymore than Slovakia. Firmly Central European.
Croatia
- Northern, non-coastal Croatia is Central Europe now and historically.
- “Reimagined” (artificially created) Croatian culture post war and whored themselves out to tourism in a desperate attempt to become associated with the west, making them look like a cheap skank in the process
- Deny obvious commonalities with Serbs and Eastern European culture post war
Bosnia and Herzegovina - Minority amount of Slavic Muslims have managed to be so ostentatious with their religion that they have stained the entire country as a result - Said “closeness” to their religion is mostly fake, rooted in spite, and the worst look
Serbia - Guilty of every single crime neighbouring countries have accused them of with no exaggeration. No one lied on their name.
Bulgaria - Way more Turkish influence in their culture than they believe that was partly obscured by the Bulgarian National Revival
Romania - Way more Turkish influence in their culture than they’re willing to accept. Parts of Romania are culturally closer to Palestine than Germany
North Macedonia - Modern ethnic Macedonians are entirely Slavic and have absolutely no connection to Alexander the Great and it doesn’t matter that he lived there.
Albania - Only literate and have infrastructure because of communism. Otherwise it’d just be a desert down there.
Kosovo - Scapegoat of the Balkans. Every backwards and horrifyingly regressive tradition you can associate with the Balkans exists or has existed in Kosovo.
Montengro - Sexiest people in Europe no contest
Greece - Go insane about the Macedonia thing and aren’t really that Balkan. It’s just like 3/4 Turkish culture and 1/4 Italian culture.
Turkey - Should apologize for colonial past and teach its students as such, detailing the atrocities they committed in Eastern Europe. - The only thing holding them back from becoming a theocracy is a piece of paper that says it’s a secular state.
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Name some of these backwards & regressive traditions
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Virdžine
Albanian women wouldn’t participate much in social events there, not sure about now.
The killing of an unfaithful wife as shown in the film Lepota Poroka (though to be fair this allegedly existed in Montenegro)
They would build 3m walls around their house and the women had restricted freedom of movement, as in a woman child in the house would be born and no one would know.
They opted to pay the fine instead of sending their kids to school past 4th grade, again, usually with girls.
This is just what I’ve heard from everyone else, I’ve never been there to confirm or deny.
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
None of these are traditions in kosovo nor have they ever been?? Is this supposed to be a joke
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Virdžine were definitley, definitley a thing. I think there’s still a handful of them living in Albania.
Idk about the specifics but I don’t think women were (are) very emancipated in Kosovo.
Besa is still a thing there.
Like I said idk about the specifics and I’m not Serbian nor do I have anything against Kosovo but it’s like everyone always clutches their pearls when somebody’s from there
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Sworn virgins were never a thing in kosovo but northern albania, besa is trust so again nothing to do with women (northern albania again not kosovo). I’m a woman myself and have all the freedom I couldve asked for, there isnt 1 thing that women in kosovo don’t have the freedom to do. You’re just the average thick head who thinks “islam” =backwards/ no freedom
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
No actually I’m from Bosnia and the Muslims here think the exact same thing I do. They literally whisper and lower their voices when they tell you someone is from Kosovo here lol.
As a woman, if someone killed you to avenge a man’s death you’d only half-count, as opposed to if they killed a man from your family, who would fulfill the Besa, because men count as a full-life.
That mentality certainly can’t exist in a bubble.
I also forgot to mention the showing of the bed sheets after the wedding night. It hasn’t been done in a while I know, but that didn’t happen in BiH.
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
The showing of the sheets is a roma tradition, besa has no hold in court nor did it ever, and you being bosnian makes perfect sense 😭😭 thick headed from the root
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Albanians showed sheets. It’s in the books of Ivo Andric.
I didn’t say Besa held up in court I’m saying it’s a mentality that expands beyond the actual act itself.
I wouldn’t be saying this stuff if I thought it was a blatant lie or propaganda. I’m sure some of it is propaganda, but I’m also sure that a lot of it isn’t. And at the end of the day, we have to be honest with ourselves even when it hurts.
When we experience that pain and let it wash over us, the real healing can begin
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Yes the book of Ivo Andric the serb is a very reliable source. Bosnian iq, albanians never showed shests to prove virginity. Besa mentality isnt a thing, what you’re talking about is the kanun which was created in north albania and was praticed by none but the man who wrote it and possibly his villagers
Krasniqi857@reddit
bro this guy doesnt have a single clue about our Kosovo and is full of bs, no point in arguing with him haha. What an embarrasment this guy
Miserable_Sense6950@reddit
He's mostly bullshitting, but sworn virgins, besa, kanun etc. were also done in Kosovo in the past. Just because he's a retard, don't deny what is part of our history.
Krasniqi857@reddit
I dont deny that. besa, kanun, sworn virgins, all part of our history and identity but the way he depicts it is wrong
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Truth hurts
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Ivo Andric is Croatian my dude
You can’t blame it all on Serbian propaganda. Kosovo was not a woman friendly place until very recently (if it even is one now).
Speaking of IQ don’t Albanians have the lowest one in all of Europe?
My sources for the sheets are the grandmas of old women who passed down oral history, a sacred tradition. None of them were Serb, all of them knew about this. If there was a propaganda mission that targeted rural Slavic villages with illiterate people in the late 1800s then damn, it really worked. Everyone told the same story.
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Don’t mistaken kosovo for your country if anything bosnia is known to be 100 yr backwards but like always the average bosnian is desperate for serbian attention
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
You can’t even ragebait well.
Go ahead, ask literally anyone. We all know about Kosovo. Like we were warned about that place let’s put it that way.
You’ve been a very good spokesperson but it’s time to retire the act. Kosovos reputation precedes itself and, like the rest of the Balkans, there’s a lot of work to be done there
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Nobodys ragebaiting just the truth
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Nah you’re rage baiting. Women tend to not be good at that
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Incel
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
I’m a woman
Miserable_Sense6950@reddit
You have no understanding of what you're talking about. For one thing, you could not kill a woman in a blood feud. Let alone having it "half-count".
"Cut a Bosniak, and seven Serbs jump out" continues to be the most useful saying invented.
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
You’re right. Have a good day.
Miserable_Sense6950@reddit
Sworn virgins were a thing in the past in Kosovo. Besa is still a thing, though not taken as seriously. It still means something. You're forgetting we followed the Kanun in Kosovo too.
But this guy is bullshitting for the majority of what he's saying.
big_cat112@reddit
Please shut up
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Ik it’s hard to accept but believe me, the change starts from within. We (as part of a collective culture/identity) don’t like to look at our ugly sides, they are shameful and repulsive to us.
But when we allow this pain to wash over our body and accept it, the real healing can begin. And it is a hard process, it is a very hard process.
But it’s worth it
Krasniqi857@reddit
bro you are goddamn clueless. Why is it always that you people outside talk so much bullshit about Kosovo yet the only clue about Kosovo is where you can point on it on a map
big_cat112@reddit
You are talking bullshit because I have no idea what you are saying, if you are a bosniak then it's very funny because in Kosovo bosniaks here are kinda...
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
It’s not bullshit. It doesn’t matter if you don’t know what I’m talking about, everyone else does.
Obviously no one in Kosovo is going to say to their kids “oh yeah btw men yell at women here”
I’m sorry you had to find out this way
lelebato@reddit
That’s a fact, and it was not exclusive to Albanians. Serbs from Montenegro also had that tradition of being ashamed of having female kids and forcing them to become men. Another thing which is still prevalent in Kosovo and Albania (and some parts of Montenegro) is blood feud.
Kosovo-Montenegro have had many weird traditions towards women
Express-Hearing3333@reddit
Blood feud is not a thing
lelebato@reddit
That’s why I used past tense. It’s not a tradition that fits into any modern society with laws. But I’m sure that in some remote places it still remains (esp. northern Albania and Montenegro)
OverallPhrase4623@reddit
the fact that none of these are true is funny
also i‘ve been in bosnia and people there were 10 times mire backwards than in the other 8 balkan countries that i have visited lol
BellowsTheMcPlayer@reddit
Bulgaria backstabbed greece and serbia, when Serbia and greece banded together to hold macedonia, which was promised to bulgaria (not like israel) in a treaty before the combined invasion of the ottoman balkans
TravelForsaken@reddit
Disagree with Slovenia, Serbia and Turkey.
Slovenia is in central Europe only geographically (and not even fully, a solid part of it is on the peninsula). Any other way you look at it and they are way closer to the rest of the Balkans, specifically the ex-Yu countries.
I seriously doubt that there weren't some warcrimes made up to make Serbia look worse. Simmilar thing happens just about anywhere.
Why would Turkey being a secular country on paper impact it being a democracy?
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Tell me you know nothing about Slovenia by telling me you know nothing about Slovenia.
Central Europe is a cultural concepts which Slovenia 100% belongs to as it lacks one key feature that qualifies a country to be Balkan - ottoman influence. They don’t dance polka in the Balkans, they don’t wear hats like that in Balkans and they’re not cold like that in Balkans.
I’m saying Turkey is very religious and the only thing stopping it from becoming like Iran is the fact that it literally says Turkey is secular in their constitution. Otherwise, majority of people wouldn’t care if their country was directly influenced by religion.
Not touching that one.
TravelForsaken@reddit
Bruh ask any Slovenian who they think they are closer to.
Mb on Turkey, I read accidently read "theocracy" as "democracy"
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Slavoj Zizek literally built a platform on calling Slovenia Central Europe
TravelForsaken@reddit
Okay, how does that prove that the majority also thinks that way?
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
It doesn’t really matter what most people think. What if most people think Bulgaria isn’t Balkan?
Slovenians are culturally closer to other countries in Central Europe, and that includes northern Croatia and perhaps extreme north Vojvodina.
Dafke98@reddit
Bosnia doesn’t have a future nor a direction. It’s foundation is extremely disfunctional and is designed to only provide basic services to it’s population. The only way that can be solved is either with a breakup or when people stop voting for the party of their ethnicity.
TravelForsaken@reddit
That isn't even a hot take, if the country stays the way it currently is it's doomed.
ThenCompany487@reddit
Our music is terrible now, which is sad because it used to be so good
rydolf_shabe@reddit
i love it when posters that will talk shit about every balkan country dont even have a flair
also the only country they didnt talk shit about was montenegro 🤔
anyway, tbh this post seems mostly like OP is trying to find an excuse to criticize other countries under the guise of "unpopular opinion"
my "unpopular opinion", or stance as you called it, is that everyone has generally the same culture and the same food and music and everything, and we should accept that more
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
I don’t need to be flared, I am a global citizen
Your take isn’t really that hot though. It’s kinda the reason why Balkan countries are grouped as Balkan countries, because of what you said lol
MihaiBravuCelViteaz@reddit
🏳️🌈🏳️🌈
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
Is that a bad thing? Are you making a joke?
MihaiBravuCelViteaz@reddit
🏳️🌈❄️
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
I don’t get it. What are you trying to say?
TheJuubiJinchuriki@reddit
The Macedonian unpopular opinion would be this:
"Regardless of the sociopolitical climate we have now, it is false to say that the Macedonian ethnic identity didn't evolve gradually over the last few centuries from the wider Macedonian Bulgarian one, and that the importance of Macedonian history and culture lies within the same emoires, kingdoms and people that shaped the majority od Bulgaria as well."
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
So I love Macedonia. I studied in Macedonia and learned Macedonian (which has rusted since) and I have nothing bad to say about that country just love and support all the way.
Growing up, I always thought Macedonians were just a weird type of Serbian. I listened to their language and I was oh this is so weird, like I get it but no.
It wasn’t until I was older I found out about the Macedonian-Bulgarian connection. I always viewed Bulgarians as being more east-Slavic/Russian, and not really similar.
It was the Macedonian identity that opened my eyes to the commonalities we have with Bulgarians (which were much more than I thought) and how Macedonians themselves are kind of Russian-y, which I think is so cool and a flex.
I would’ve preferred if Macedonians kept the letter й and standardized their language on a dialect that incorporates the ъ (and if they wrote their cursive like Bulgarians), but I can see why they didn’t.
I love Macedonia
TheJuubiJinchuriki@reddit
I like the way our alphabet is standardized today, it's super phonetic and has a letter for each of our sounds and I feel that's the perfect approach when wanting to write down any Slavic language properly.
And yeah, Macedonia (the region and the country of North Macedonia) have always been the melting pot of the Southern Balkans. A lot of similarities between Serbs, Bulgarians and possibly Greeks can be found there, given historically all the shit that's happened there during the last few centuries lol.
Sea_Top9815@reddit
As a Greek Macedonian having parents and grandparents that are bilingual i love the slavomakedonians. The only thing i don't like it's the stupid propaganda from the North cousins.. you know what I mean! I can understand that they made this so to made their identity different from Bulgarians or Serbs etc.. but wasn't so right this way... Anyways.. guys no hatred at all in the end but don't put yourselves deep in this fairytales..
Kitsooos@reddit
Φλώρινα ?
Sea_Top9815@reddit
Πιο πανω απο Φλώρινα, σε χωριουδάκι
TheJuubiJinchuriki@reddit
I hate everything about Ancient Macedonia and the needless wankery of something that killed the objectively better ancient empire (Persia).
God bless the Prespa agreement and that we signed off all of that unnecessary LARP with it. 🙏
Sea_Top9815@reddit
Sto pravis bro? I'm writing from prespa right now.! Greetings from your Greek cousins.
TheJuubiJinchuriki@reddit
I wasn't aware we had Greek cousins.
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
The only argument I’d make here is that the Bulgarian alphabet is equally as phonetic but looks aesthetically better. I likewise don’t like the Serbian orthographic reform and how it distances itself from OCS.
Many MK dialects have the ъ sound, but the standard was based on a dialect where it wasn’t a normal reflex so as to distance themselves from the Bulgarian standard. Now, in words like k’smet or in t’ga na jug, the apostrophe is used instead of tvrdi znak which was again, deliberately chosen.
I fully get why but I have my own selfish reasons for feeling the way I do.
But absolutely, Macedonia is a big melting pot of cultures. It’s honestly one of if not the most diverse country historically in Europe
TheJuubiJinchuriki@reddit
ORELSKI KRILJA KAK DA SI METNEH! 🗣🗣🗣
Hazard___7@reddit
Bosnians aren't muslim we just want to be different, because otherwise we have to accept that we're just Croatian and/or Serbian too. If I put a fez on, I'm unique!
Hanisuir@reddit
"Modern ethnic Macedonians are entirely Slavic and have absolutely no connection to Alexander the Great and it doesn’t matter that he lived there."
This isn't an unpopular opinion.
Ill-Information901@reddit
No country except Slovenia and Croatia are Balkan, only they are
vbd71@reddit
Tell me you're a Crnogorac without telling me you're a Crnogorac...
Tasty-Chemical-8884@reddit
Central Europe doesn’t really exist, at least not anymore. There’s no feeling of commonality between the countries that make up that region whatsoever.
In Slovenia, we are firmly exposed to various Serbo-Croatian cultural content, not to German or Czech ones.
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit (OP)
I’m referring to it as a cultural concept. They don’t dance polka in the Balkans
idis838392@reddit
Yes we should teach more about ottomans in our schools🇹🇷💪