I’ll take the hate, but if mw2 released today, it would be fun for 2 months, then people would start seeing the giga sweats show up and abuse every game breaking bug and weapon
Yeah, late-2000s Xbox live was just a golden time. The vast majority were just casuals having fun, often with mic on. Now it’s mainly sweats and everyone has too much social anxiety to talk to each other.
From the research I did, you are not even safe playing the single player unless you physically remove your computer from the internet. You're way safer, but not 100% safe.
I bought a bunch of cods during the summer sale just to play the campaign, but then this whole hacking thing dropped and I said "never again cod" and refunded them all.
The slur riddled death chat was a point of pride back in the day. If you did well enough to get the opponents to rage, that stream of expletives was your medal.
I remember running around an old Halo 3 lobby back in the day, kept grabbing the rocket launcher and killing a guy, and he was angry enough to write a post on reddit about it.
That's another thing too, it was super normal to stick around in the same lobbies in games, so that you'd recognize most of the players after a few matches. Made a lot of friends back in the day from playing games in the same lobbies. Now it feels like people just drop after each game, and tons of games don't have lobby permanence, they do a whole new match search after each.
My medals are all of the comments on my steam profile both from enemies and teammates. Nothing boosts the ego more than being called a cheater while on my 5th beer and 7th bong rip
The golden days when my reaction times on Halo 3 saw me getting headshot kills with the sniper on reaction... Younger me would absolutely destroy my ass in multiplayer games these days. I just ain't got that twitch reaction like I used to.
Half the time in my case, it was the dudes that we talked the absolute most shit with who ended up being my longest time MP friends.
Nothing like getting told you're going to get face fucked and drown guzzling balls only to then be back-to-back with those same assholes whooping and hollering sometime later.
I remember when it came out and it was weeks before I saw anyone get a nuke, I bet if it was released today there would be someone going for a nuke every game and just spamming whatever OP strat is good, be it one shot snipers or one man army grenade launcher spam.
Do you think if i made a game that tried to capture the feeling you just described it could be successful? If monetized correctly to adapt to the market
Within the time frame of Halo 3 and MW2 was pure magic. Party chat wasn't really a big thing yet so people were still mainly in game chat and lobbies, you are making friends with people practically every other match, talking massive shit to each other beforehand only to end up sending friend requests a little while later. Adding so many people to the friends list that I have to regularly go in and delete the oldest names that I didn't really remember...
God damn, those were great times...
I don’t mute chat because of “social anxiety,” I mute chat because there is no need to be ear-fucked by some guy eating his mic while screaming incoherently, another rapid-firing racial slurs at a tempo suggesting amphetamine abuse, punctuated by an 8-yr-old squeaking about hacks while I’m trying to enjoy free time.
At least X360 lobby shit-talk was imaginative.
Every fps that releases today has those sweats on release day. There's a whole streamer culture around chasing trends and abusing noobs in new games. The culture around these games is just different than it was ~20 years ago.
Back then hardly anyone cared enough to look up the meta strat, nowadays you have people asking on reddit about what to do in the game before they even finished downloading it
Bro did we play the same game? I remember people going out of bounds to get into some weird ass spot to headshot you at spawn.
People were climbing the crane in the rooftop map to see everybody. Spawn camping, etc.
Atleast there was no SBMM back then. If you ran into a really skilled player you thought "woah i can't believe i just ran into that guy" . Now if you run into a player like that you think to yourself "the game is punishing me because having too much fun in this game is bad for their "algorithm""
Autism and lack of being able to conceptualize fun is what has ruined the feel of a lot of modern games.
Marvel rivals is a beacon that shows that lots of things feeling overpowered is better than “balancing” the fun out of your game.
Look at World of Warcraft for example, people lose their shit over a 3% aura buff and that’s content to them. The people who bitch for nerfs in every game now are just droids in my eyes.
I don't disagree, but I think that "everything is OP" falls under balancing as well. It's just tuned up to 11.
The problem is usually when out of dozens of options, only a select few are strong enough to use if you want to be competitive. Generally happens to games that just released a new weapon, character, card, or cosmetics for specific ones.
If all guns need roughly 3 seconds to kill and the new one needs 1, then cries for balance are justified. Especially since most modern games tend to release new stuff that's purposefully OP as a way to make more players spend money on the game.
I loved being able to take down a guy with a single burst from the m16 in the classic MWs, felt realistic enough and kept for nice fast paced shoot out. Now you’d be lucky if you could kill a guy going full auto with an extended mag.
It’s kind of impressive just how good CoD2 was, and even after dozens of sequels to the franchise we are yet to get one that’s as good.
Not just MP but the SP campaign was probably the best
Its one of the reasons I could never stand games like fortnite, halo, or warzone. With time to kill being too high someone can just sprint across a road or field getting shot the whole time and just heal/armor up once they make it to cover. It felt terrible and seems to have gotten worse with modern titles like halo infinite having even longer time to kill than earlier halos.
Regular cod multiplayer still feels fine with ttk, but I only play hardcore when I do making it even lower.
The flipside to this is that near instant kill times feels horrible if you're a decrepit old man above the age of 12 and your reflexes are gone, or if you have ping higher than single digits. In something like Halo if someone starts firing at you you still have options, you can use an armor ability or something to turn the situation around. Even then there are gamemodes like SWAT, and special weapons like the sniper or rocket launcher that get you the opportunity to instakill folks.
>The flipside to this is that near instant kill times feels horrible if you're a decrepit old man above the age of 12 and your reflexes are gone, or if you have ping higher than single digits.
I regularly get spanked by drunk middle aged Kazakhstani men playing with 102 ping after their 12 hour uranium mining shift in CS2.
Sounds like a skill issue to me.
Streaming ruiend games.
Streamers are good at the game. People watch it and want to be as good as their streamer.
They aren't as good and that is frustrating, so they use whatever meta tactic they can find just to have a bit of an edge.
When their favorite meta tactic is nerfed, or something else is buffed, they complain like babies.
Worst is when a streamer complains about something. The fans amplify this complaint by 1000 and act like the game is dead because one character is slightly less effective than before.
Wow is dead to me for that reason. Its a grindy number crunch game these days with features that lead nowhere. I just wanna play a badass dude in over the top big suits of armor.
It's just a solved game. No matter what you do, there is a "correct" way to do it, and GOD FORBID the sweats catch you doing anything different. If you take it even a little bit seriously it ends up feeling more like a job than a game.
Not that I particularly tryhard in WoW, but it's pretty much always the guys doing it "their way" for fun who ends up wiping the group the same way over and over until they get kicked from the raid team. They're so stubborn about playing the game "their way" that they refuse to learn stuff that is obligatory regardless of what spec you're playing.
People playing the meta are unsurprisingly more likely to also know meta strategies so they don't end up wasting everyone elses time.
It’s definitely my personal autism making me say this but that 3% complaint is warranted. Nobody below the competitive level cares about that buff because whether it comes or doesn’t it doesn’t matter. For people that want to play higher level content that buff is a massive blow to physical only classes. God comp is already bad enough of an issue as it is for high m+ content. Classes like warriors don’t need a deficit for not having a monk making that issue even worse for them. Raid it doesn’t matter because ideally you have all buffs anyway but if you didn’t have monk buff then a class like warriors does almost 10% less damage but if a mage didn’t have chaos brand from a demon hunter they only lose 3%.
These are the kind of things that have significant influence because people understand they need the classes with the best numbers at these points.
Nah, I'd say that players never knew what "fun" was to begin with. Back before skill based matchmaking was a thing, people just played the game: You jump into a lobby, you win, you celebrate; You lose, you rage a little or you just jump onto another game. Nowadays, there's like 50 forum posts every day of people crying about how the game is not fun because their opponent who had a shinier badge than them when a game has SBMM. Most people now just want to play to win, if there's a meta character, gun or strategy, they'll use and abuse it even if it means they enjoy the game less. People who get defeated by the meta feels like crap for losing so they will in turn, either quit or use the same thing in order to win, which means more people people follow suit until the vast majority of players only use the meta.
"Given the opportunity, players themselves will optimize the fun out of a game" which is made worse by the accessibility of internet, many players can't resist pressing the mountain of video game guide videos with titles like "Best \[....\] to \[....\] in \[....\]" that will often lead players to skip exploration or experimentation, trivialize challenges, break the progression or even spoil a game that are often the actual fun parts of the game.
I mostly play singleplayer games nowadays. I have a friend who exclusively plays multiplayer games. He has over 4000 hours in Rust but got bored with RDR2 after 2 hours. I asked him about this and he said he doesn't play singeplayer because "you're playing against bots".
I suspect I'm kind of like your friend, and maybe he didn't articulate it well enough, but it's not about winning or losing. It's about improvement. Think of us like basketball players or soccer players or even gymrats. It's the same exact mindset that actual athletes have. Of course, some people care *too much* about winning/losing, but it's still under the same blanket. The dopamine comes from improvement, not the game itself.
Anyway, playing against bots only scales the difficulty so much. There's a point, and it doesn't take very long to reach, where you are just smoking the bots on repeat, which is boring. You stop improving, because there's no challenge. A multiplayer lobby though, you can sort of think of it as bots with actual sentience. It gets *hard*, because the "bots" (actual, other players) are making the same good/bad decisions you do, so multiplayer simply provides a better challenge and place to improve than bots ever could provide (outside of things like say, chess engines), at least in this day and age. Maybe in 30 years, AI will make better decisions than human players will.
A LOT of people I know who play exclusively multiplayer games are the same; we enjoy the competition. It's no different than people who play basketball or baseball or soccer.
This is why the best games have high skill ceilings. Even the combat in the Batman Arkham games is very simple, but has a high skill ceiling and lots of room to increase your ability or challenge yourself in other ways. With humans, it’s just easier by design since other humans will naturally make the difficulty for uou
I mean technically true. Maybe it's just a kind of mental stimulus that we don't understand.
I'm more into getting invested in a narrative experience and exploring worlds though, I couldn't give two shits about who I'm (not) playing with.
I like both singeplayer and multiplayer games for different reasons. I think the whole "playing to win" mindset falls under that kind of mental stimulus for me. I'm just not that competitive. I mean, sure, I like to win as much as the next guy, but it's not the be-all-end-all for me.
Have you never heard of *the most dangerous game*? The appeal is an opponent constantly adapts and improves. If you want someone to fall for the same tricks, and uses the same tactics forever ** that** is what single player is for.
Projection. You misunderstood and were eager to correct before trying to understand. Hunting animals is the analog to single player if you really need your handheld. If you honestly can’t understand it after that, you need to retake elementary English.
I'm sorry you fucked up your "metaphor" with your misunderstanding of something that's made entirely clear in the short story from which it's taken.
>Projection.
Shut the fuck up, redditor, I can absolutely and unequivocally *guarantee* my grasp on English far exceeds your own
Dude, he understood the metaphor perfectly. You're WAY too caught up in semantics. The most dangerous game is game/quarry/prey/opponent that is smart enough to potentially outplay and beat you. Which is exactly what he's talking about.
I'm sorry you fucked up your "metaphor" with your misunderstanding of something that's made entirely clear in the short story from which it's taken.
>Projection.
Shut the fuck up, redditor, I can absolutely and unequivocally *guarantee* my grasp on English far exceeds your own
Anytime a new game like chivalry or mordhau came out it was only a matter of time before people discovered the meta and switched to mostly that. Its the type of game where you have to buy it early to really experience how fun they can be with a wide variety of playstyles to try and go against.
Same, but for everything in general in post-modern history, except for the economy literally filled with loopholes for those who already own everything.
Enjoying the human experience hasn't been so hard since a while, sorry for the off-topic but i can't avoid tracing parallels
it's because MR is a game that does not require mechanical skill and has overturned support ults that make everyone in the game just stare at eachother and become bullet sponges until the ult is over. insane gameplay, truly what makes fps games fun
Streamers play a huge part in this. If a few streamers cry about certain balancing issues that 99.9% of the community don't care about the devs will hop on it like crazy.
You would be complaining just as much if everyone was using the same thing. That means you’re only happy if you get to be stronger than everyone else. Even without online play there were 20 versions of Street Fighter, because it turns out one character or move being better than the rest isn’t actually fun, and not how the developers wanted people to play.
What killed Overwatch for me was the role queue, I mean I understand adding it to ranked because it improved balance but it really makes quick play less fun, it makes the game more restrictive and made playing as damage impossible unless you wanted to wait 20 minutes for a match.
Marvel Rivals is balanced for casuals, but it is also one of the most boring and enraging games. Half the support ults just turn the fucking game off for 15 seconds. Anyone higher than bronze knows there are serious design and balance issues with the game. I mean, it still has the OW problem of no one wanting to play tank.
Super weird to bring autism into it that makes 0 sense the real problem Is just people who always want that meta to hop onto to try and feel like a pro and sweat their asses off trying to be the first one to discover the next broken meta
He’s not literally referring to Autistic people. People who vocally complain about minor balance issues in games could broadly be called autists regardless of their mental condition.
It doesn't help that he phrased it like a dumbass. Who the fuck uses autism as an insult but insists on using the term "autistic people"? He'd probably have halfed the replies talking about it if he just said autist
> the reason games are bad is because of devs catering to people who conceptualise fun in a different way to me
> these people are autistic robocucks that i dont respect because of how they enjoy the game, and they have singlehandedly destroyed a plethora of good games. They should not have a voice
> if devs listened to me however, games would be good, because I enjoy games tht are made to cater to the way i enjoy games
> this is because people like me are smart and handsome
> The people who bitch for nerfs in every game now are just droids in my eyes.
The perpetual complainers. The people who just constantly complain about every single aspect of every game. You’re right, that they’re functionally just bots at this point, and companies trying to prioritize what they think, has been a detriment.
Yesss.
I hate when in the name of balance someone makes a games where are factions are 99.9% the same. Sure it is balanced. But also boring. And when something is OP then it forces people to develop strategies. Or you can nerf everything into the ground
That’s the type of memory games used to create.
Idk if it’s because I’m older, but most of my gaming memories are from 10+ years ago. Not making many new ones, just doesn’t seem as enjoyable anymore.
Idk why people say guns in games are overpowered. It shouldn't take an entire mag from an AK (or equivalent) to kill someone. When my friends used to play COD, we would always play hardcore because it was more realistic. But the last 2 COD games I bought, no one ever played hardcore so I just stopped buying the games. If I want somewhat realistic gun power, I play siege. Even though the operators are not even close to realistic, at least the gun mechanics are.
Hardcore was the way for me in Modern Warfare 2019 because I got fed up of shooting and hitting first only to get 180’d and battered by someone with the meta gun at the time. Probably a skill issue on my part by not being able to keep all my shots on target, but to me the person who lands a shot first should be the winner in a gunfight
Yeah I'm kinda struggling to think of reasons why MW2 was picked for the image. It had a bunch of exploits and meta strategies. For the longest time if you weren't running the dual shotguns you were just kinda dumb, for an example.
Not only was MW3 superior as it fixed a bunch of MW2’s problems, this game destroyed modern gun selection in later CODs because every gun had to have some sentimental value to a has-been.
I remember randomly matching into a hacked lobby and unlocking everything via the most jank in-game menu ever. It was Terminal, people were noclipping, absolutely insane. Still my strangest video game experience
It’s so crazy how many games obsess over the idea of balance instead of fun. Helldivers 2 is the craziest part, haven’t played that game in a long time but I stopped playing cause it seemed like the devs genuinely wanted to make the game less fun.
Oh jeez this is classic nostalgia-goggles…
Was this game fun? Yes absolutely, still the most fun I’ve ever had playing CoD… was this game balanced?? Lmao
If you released this today within one month you would see every single lobby feature one of only five builds:
FAMAS stopping power
OMA Noob Tube
Quick scope Intervention
UMP45 stopping power
Akimbo 1887s
… and that’s it…
Nothing else would be viable and every content creator would be feeding these builds to the masses of pre teen sweats.
You’d all hate the game now.
- Playing MW2 with my cousin way back when
- Cousin tries to do the worst 360 no-scope ever
- Fires his M93 raffica at me from across the map
- One single bullet (killcam) grazes my fucking shoelace
- Instant kill and Headshot medal
- Top 5 favourite gaming memories
I remember in the times when COD4 was the go to, they reached out to fans during a live survey event or something for the next game and I mentioned dual wielding. I very well might be the reason akimbo was a thing, you're welcome everyone 😄
this game is so overrated. it was not well balanced and it’s not this holy grail of a shooter like people talk it up to be.
if it was, the iw4x lobbies would be much more active and people would still be playing it like there are still players on source servers.
WaW>MW2
iw4x has been around for years. Activision is surely aware of it.
It doesn’t cost anything, uses the base game files, and is in fair use. They don’t run a risk of getting ceased and desisted
Noob toob + OMA was a fucked combination and needs to go.
Aside from that, the high fire rate/low damage guns could be buffed (m4/f2k/vector/m240/uzi), probably by looking at 2 range dropoff guns that the later games had, which was an interesting space that MW2 didn't explore. Lightweight and hardline could be buffed. Ump deserved a nerf, but something small like mag size, the 3 shot kill at all ranges without stopping power with SMG level mobility was iconic and should not be touched.
Outside of the intervention, the sniper balance was kind of weird. I would import the MW3 snipers (but keep the intervention of course). If nothing else, at least import the winchester (only oneshots in the head, bolt action fire-rate, but no breathing in ACOG).
Also the jug suit from MW3 was sick as fuck, import that too.
Scrambler was actually dogshit. While it was funny such a shit perk existed it was annoying how pre level 10 if you wanted to snipe you had to take scrambler.
Not even that well balanced. To most well balanced COD ive played is black ops 2 and if you look at the guns stats you realize why. Then its followed by ghost, the most overpowered and unbalanced cod ever.
The game was fun but it was also trash. The only place I wasn't dying to infinite grenade launchers was SnD. People have these wild nostalgic takes but it's like they weren't even there.
I thought about this recently and went back and checked the arsenal in MW2. There's only a few guns I would avoid, I can remember using almost every weapon in a loadout I thought was good. I don't remember ever using the MP5 and a couple other weapons, but everything else felt strong to me.
Akimbo P90s and Marathon Pro, or what I liked to call it, the “AHHHHHHHHHHHH” build, because I would just be screaming the whole time as I ran towards people, hosing them down with bullets
Honorable mention to the perk that made you faster (lightweight?) and Commando Pro, just for the added benefit of being able to literally jump scare people with melee
Play Battlefront 2 (2017). It's the same principle: Everyone is overpowered and you die often but when you go on a spree it's fun.
Also the Clones say clanker.
Guns are pretty overpowered in real life too. Most have the power to one shot you if it hits the right spot. Devs haven't bothered with patching this btw so try it at you own risk
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