[PARTS]SureFire Optimized AR-15 Bolt Carrier Group - 5.56 NATO - $399.99

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skygao@reddit

Awesome to see this after 5-6 years of OOS.

Finally some competition though with the Griffin Enhanced Gas Pocket BCG which includes the two originally innovative OBC enhancements: * Elongated cam path for delayed unlock * Shortened gas key and buffer for longer stroke and more reliability for feeding

But the Griffin also includes the anti-tilt ring on the carrier body, the side venting gas pocket carrier, dual ejector bolt, supposedly stronger steel, and an “enhanced” buffer with dual piece design for better dead blow effect.

Excited for some nerds to do some high round count tests on durability and some cyclic rate analysis of the systems 🤓

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

I bought a griffin on release and I really don’t feel satisfied with it. On full auto fire it causes fire to come out of the trigger pocket. My lugs are chipping and peening pretty bad after like 3k rounds.

The gas builds up into the receiver more and makes everything disgusting. My eyes have never watered when running a flow through and somehow this does

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skygao@reddit

Is the fire out of the trigger pocket linked to the side vent? Guessing at full auto rates that’s a LOT more high pressure guess being dumped into the receiver.

I’ve had one for a few months and like it so far shooting semi run and gun type stuff, but wouldn’t pay full MSRP for one again.

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

I talked to them at shotshow about the play doh bolt. They kinda were baffled.

I actually notice it making my rifle dirtier and causing crud to ooze out everywhere. That part isn’t a big deal just a minor annoyance. I think sound wise it reduces port pop as much as an LMT Ebcg

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LifeguardNext9910@reddit

What do you mean play doh bolt?

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

Play doh. The kids modeling clay. The lugs were breaking off

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LifeguardNext9910@reddit

Ok I’m still lost. What is a play doh bolt? And what about lugs breaking off. Like did they fix a bcg by using playdoh or what?

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

The metal was extremely soft and the bolt lugs were breaking off

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skygao@reddit

Baffled, but did they offer any sort of replacement or inspection? I know manufacturers can have duds on their end or with the materials they use, so next step is always how they take care of customers. Especially important for premium products like these.

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

They didn’t really offer or say anything about inspection or replacement. I was honestly gonna see when it breaks and then get it replaced and offload the new one

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accounts_baleeted@reddit

Those are solutions to problems that don't exist in functioning rifles.

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skygao@reddit

This is also a tautology, “a functioning rifle functions”.

Most PSA and Anderson rifles work just fine.

The point of these enhancements is to theoretically increase the total window of functionality, adapting to a wider range of ammo types (pressure), environmental conditions (also affect pressure and cycling), and gun condition (e.g how long has it been since lube, how much grit/grime has gotten in there?).

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Drexx_Redblade@reddit

You do "enhancements" to fix identified problems. What's happening here is just marketing. Then the people that fell for the marketing create imaginary problems it their head to justify their purchase.

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afuckingwheel@reddit

"Innovation bad because thing works"

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Thats just not true. There's tons of people constantly chasing little things like muh perfect ejection angle despite their rifle never having malfunctioned. Not to mention muh fcd enhanced bolt carch thats a little more to the left so I can hit it better. The geissele reliability enhancement kit costs more than this and comes with the same 3 items with arguably less enhancements. Considering this actually does what every other person thinks the a5 buffer system will do and give them some extra stroke length amongst other things it would be a better purchase that would do more for how the rifle functions.

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skygao@reddit

Increasing window of operability across ammo types, environmental, and gun conditions are very much real problems people have identified.

One solution is gas the gun for the worst condition (weak ammo, cold day, dirty and unlubed), this is the common solution and what people associate with overgassed guns.

Things like elongated carrier travel give a larger window for the same level of gas to cycle reliably and allow you to tune a gun to a less over gassed default state.

Elongated cam paths allow you to reduce pressure and/or gas volume required to cycle the bolt by mechanically delaying unlock (part of other variables like spring power and reciprocating mass weight).

Side (and down) venting solutions have already been tested to reduce sound signature, and have objectively measurable benefits to shooters seeking that benefit.

Anyone who interested in tuning and optimizing AR-15s will see these benefits. If you just want the gun to go bang reliably, a slightly over gassed system and microbest BCG will be just fine and you don’t need to buy this and may not get much value out of it 🤷

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accounts_baleeted@reddit

Longer cam path actually decreases the operability range.

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skygao@reddit

This one is dependent on how the system is gassed. Really all these reliability questions are system dependent. If your system is over gassed to the point of reliability issues (e.g double feeds, increased wear and tear on system due to carrier velocity) then elongated gas path increased reliability and longevity. If your system is under gassed or heavily tuned already to the edge of reliability, an elongated gas path (with no other changes) will require you to increase gas slightly.

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SwissChzMcGeez@reddit

I can't exactly rent a BCG and return it if I don't like it. There no way for me to judge for myself if it's a problem or not before I buy.

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Dang its a shame that selling an unobtanium high dollar item from a big named company with a low round count is so hard. It shouldn't be too hard to tell if your gun is overgassed or not. if you care is another thing.

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StrictlyFirearms@reddit

A model T will get you from point to point still

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Maybe not considering the advent of frt triggers and super safeties nowadays.

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CallsignFlorida@reddit

Anyone buying a $400 DI BCG for an AR might genuinely be regarded.

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Usually a good take but I suggest you at least read the product description on this one before talking smack.

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CallsignFlorida@reddit

I will still stand by it’s not worth anywhere near $400 when an adjustable gas block, downvent, bootleg, or any other tuning solution already exists for significantly cheaper.

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Harrypslalms@reddit

What if we don’t want to use any of those shit solutions? Reddit loves adjustable gas blocks tho lmfao

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External-Succotash72@reddit

Especially Superlative Arm adjustable gas blocks. Hahahaha

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ChillBlintone@reddit

I will stand by it still sounds like you haven't yet read at least the product description smh

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CallsignFlorida@reddit

It’s a delayed unlocking cam and it over travels… big whoop

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Lmfao, yeah no big deal right big whoop, it seems you still dont know what all you get when you buy this. You are not a serious person and not worth anymore time.

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Foxxy__Cleopatra@reddit

Maybe not everyone but for me at least it'd be worth \~double what your typical bougee DLC bolt goes for if everything they're claiming is true.

But an extra \~$200 is a lot to gamble on the possibility of "meh, can't really tell a difference".

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Would you trust something designed by Jim Sullivan?

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accounts_baleeted@reddit

The description repeats itself like bad ai.

It's also a bunch of solutions to problems that don't exist in functioning guns.

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TotalNegotiation1182@reddit

LMT enhanced are over that. KAC is around this price. Geissele is around this price at MSRP, but no one pays that.

I bought this because I have the money and it’s cool. I always wanted to try one given that I run everything suppressed.

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lennyxiii@reddit

I was just about to respond to someone saying the same thing. If you need a bcg and would rather have 3 microbest then this isn’t for you. When you already have a ton of budget and mid ars and just want to buy Gucci shit then why not?

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ShowMeYourFeet87@reddit

I paid like $550 or so for my LMT Enhanced full auto BCG.

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abrokemexican@reddit

I prefer the term restarted

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Wildwildleft@reddit

Let’s get it started

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Traditional-Hat-952@reddit

Fun fact the original version of that song used the real word.

https://youtu.be/LrkEc2V3mO4?si=8HK1_MSAWPGdmL1Z

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pauliep13@reddit

And they used that version in a movie:

https://youtu.be/VVgC2__fLNs?si=GyLJni6dZ3Qb8g0E

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IllSkyHelix111@reddit

there's nothing fun about the black eyed peas

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TumbleweedBusy5701@reddit

In here!

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d8ed@reddit

They'd probably sell even more at $499

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Gratzsner@reddit

show me an optimized BCG for cheaper, they have monopoly

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accounts_baleeted@reddit

You honestly think it will 'double the reliability'

Lol

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avowed@reddit

Mac went 10k no cleaning no malfunctions that shows how bad these products are with cleaning you should never have reliability issues if you get a quality bcg.

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Junction91NW@reddit

In 2008 I had a shittastic Bushmaster AR as a rental go 26k with only CLP shot through the ejection port door. And that was the low estimate.

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CallsignFlorida@reddit

Optimized for what? Function? Suppression?

Damn near any $150 bolt will function flawlessly and you can get a Bootleg adjustable for $200, or a KAK downvent for less.

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prmoore11@reddit

It sounds like you don’t understand what this does. How does the downvent KAK replicate this?

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redacted_robot@reddit

But those don't say surefire and cost $400. They're optimized to perform a market function of separating you from your money...

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Grand_Cookie@reddit

People will brag about waiting years to pay that for a KAC bolt. There has to be another level.

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kayl_breinhar@reddit

Please, the term of choice is in the product description.

Optimized.

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Bitachon_BH@reddit

Might make sense for someone with special needs

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Ejection-Port-Licks@reddit

Spend $400 for one extended life BCG or pay less for three excellent Microbest BCGs? Math is hard.

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skygao@reddit

I’ve bought $400 bcgs but I’m not well regarded at all.

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pauliep13@reddit

Hi! That's me!

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nope_noway_@reddit

Optimized how..?

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throwawayifyoureugly@reddit

Optimized for profit

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TextMysterious7822@reddit

400$ in todays economy would just have people buy a psa for 98% of users. This is probably going to be a similar situation to its first launch in 2019 here for 6-8 months then gone for another 6-8 years.

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Tadders_1488@reddit

The surefire OBC requires a proprietary buffer and spring? Like the G$ braided one or whatever?

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

It does a lot for suppressed usage and Full auto fire

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TextMysterious7822@reddit

The only thing I can see this being useful in is to test a rare breed, in my colt IAR 11.5 or 16 in with a G stressproof bolt. If you don't have a dedicated high volume gun system with drums and other high quality kit this is a literal waste of your money and will prohibit the systems that could make full use of this surefire obc. Spend your money on the lmt ebcg or G$ rebcg as it will out perform in semi auto tasks.

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TotalNegotiation1182@reddit

I don’t think the spring is proprietary.

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TextMysterious7822@reddit

That is completely incorrect, small arms solutions goes into explicit detail regarding this change. Please review the video link at 9:05 at this time, to prevent misinformation, using a normal carbine spring with the OBO WILL damage the lower receiver if you choose to use improper buffer springs with the surefire obo. Main reason I passed on the system in 2020 January in favor of the rebcg was during the covid lock downs, I saw the surefire obos replacement parts as an inherit flaw in logistics and shortages may continue for years on parts long term. Ultimately made me dubious to it's long term viability which 6 years without much as a peep from owners should indicate my sentiment was well founded.

https://youtu.be/18A-9Q__nNY?feature=shared&t=38

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CharlesAFerg@reddit

Just to avoid confusion for anyone reading this - You CAN use a standard spring and standard buffer in conjunction with the carrier of the OBC. You cannot use a standard buffer with the shortened spring. Basically you have to use both the spring and buffer that comes with it, or a mil spec spring and buffer, not mix and match. If you run it with a standard spring and buffer with the OBC, you simply lose the added travel length, but it will not damage the receiver like it would if you mix and matched the buffer and spring components alone. I've tested this with a Geissele Super 42 spring and buffer paired with the OBC carrier and for a semi auto suppressed rifle the gas reduction is actually really amazing.

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MidWestEDC@reddit (OP)

What makes the G$ or LMT "outperform" in SA? They're all about the same price, so there isn't really a benefit one way or another there. If anything, the SF is cheaper. Also, I think you're hard pressed to say it would be anything other than an extremely durable, hard use part. Buy extra parts, if you're concerned, but wearing out recoil springs or buffers is a lofty goal for most. Also, saying this system is only for full-auto or forced-reset/binary applications is highly reductive. The benefits of the system substantially improve function with short barrels and suppressed systems as well.

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TextMysterious7822@reddit

I bought one to compare regardless, most folks on here will look at this price and think "I'll just buy another psa or ammo" if anything, that's the market currently. Surefire is never cheap and "buy extra parts" is quite pompous and disrespectful.

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Sh00tYourEyeOut@reddit

Hey FRT folks - these slow your cyclic rate.

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Tricky-Two-6600@reddit

Would this be preferred to a heavier buffer system to slow cyclic rate or maybe used in conjunction? Rare breed just restocked and was able to get one

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redit_readit_reddit@reddit

Can't believe I just spent $440 on a BCG. Better slow my MK18 down.

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SPICYMK18@reddit

This or a LMT EBCG 🤔

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rb26dett95@reddit

I love my LMT EBCG, I tried the KAK downvent and its not even close.

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throwawayifyoureugly@reddit

What functionality difference did you experience?

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rb26dett95@reddit

The KAK succeeds in making my magazines/rounds even dirtier while still having more gas to the face shooting suppressed (RC2). The KAK chamber "lock up" is noticeably notchy when chambering a round, sometimes to the point of needing the forward assist during light charges.

The LMT does a better job of keeping gas out of my face than any other bolt I've tried so far, without the issues KAK has above.
Having said that it functions fine in comparison to the LMT, but the KAK is out into a spare parts bin vs the LMT that gets used.

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Count_Warheit@reddit

Good to know as I was looking to try a kak.

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

Honestly this I have 4 EBCG’s but the way this handles Full auto and suppression is on a next level comparatively. This actually slows ROF and does more for gas than the EBCG

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PageVanDamme@reddit

I use Enhanced Carrier and they have been fantastic

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CADnCoding@reddit

They spin up production on these again or is this some “old stock”?

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Curious as well since it had been reported to be discontinued.

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okboomer1911@reddit

New production. Just for PA. One time run.

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AnonAccessoriesFS@reddit

Where’d you get this info?

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okboomer1911@reddit

I have my sources.

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B52doc@reddit

Source here

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jellenberg@reddit

Damn you got me 🤣

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IknowthatDude1970@reddit

They were made for PA as a special run.

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heretowastelife@reddit

These were really designed for full auto use. That being said the proliferation of forced reset systems does make them more interesting. If you are running some sort of ARPK/m27 this could be cool. I do worry a bit about bolt catch damage, though.

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medyaya26@reddit

Also designed for sbr carbines. It was a fix for the mk18 over gassing

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Blk_Lion_reloaded@reddit

I would stop take the LMT ebcg over this tbh

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

The OBC does a lot more than the EBCG. Thats coming from someone that has 4 EBCG’s

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Blk_Lion_reloaded@reddit

quick comparison of the two

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luckygunnerx30@reddit

I was talking from first hand experience I’ve been running EBCG’s and OBC’s for years on MG’s

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Blk_Lion_reloaded@reddit

🫡

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medyaya26@reddit

In terms of product support, yes.

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TheCrimsonChin-ger@reddit

Can you ELI5 about what this would do for the bolt catch?

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heretowastelife@reddit

The carrier is shorter to lengthen the stroke and slow the cyclic rate. Due to this, the bcg is going to have more time to accelerate before it is caught by the bolt catch. I would think this would put more stress on the catch, but I could be wrong.

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NewBalance998@reddit

Will these make my SureFire mags run reliably?;(

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Lol it actually might. "One of its standout features is the long-stroke design, which provides 60% more travel beyond the magazine. This increased travel time improves magazine feed, reducing the likelihood of bolt-over-base malfunctions. "

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Logizyme@reddit

RIP LRBHO lever

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skygao@reddit

Makes sense that this might be a concern, but haven’t found any reports of broken catches from the OBC.

A few S7 steel bolt catches out there for anyone who wants additional piece of mind.

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Logizyme@reddit

RIP lower receiver

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ChillBlintone@reddit

Oof ar9 style lol. I dont think this should be an issue, the bcg is semi proprietary and comes with its own buffer and spring due to the longer stroke. Shouldn't be as oversprung as an ar9 with a 308 spring. I know that feel though

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acb1499@reddit

This or 4 $99 microbest BCGs

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Electronic-Tea-3912@reddit

10 bear Creek BCGs so you just throw them away instead of cleaning.

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chuckisduck@reddit

My left eject BCA side charging handle gets loose and indicates to me it's time to clean it. keltec would patent this feature.

but honestly this BCA upper is the most accurate of my x39 semiautomatics.. and sore are $2k+....

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Electronic-Tea-3912@reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/longrange/s/VFZsTJLes5

I like the side chargers.

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chuckisduck@reddit

BCA bcgs! I bought the BCA to give me left eject when x39 was 12cpr and I had my first 308 can.. surprised how well it ran minus the reciprocating CH coming loose every 400 rounds.

BCA barrels (at least from 2-5 years ago) are surprisingly accurate. someone is doing that part right.

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