Is the U.S. in the early stages of collapse? If so, how are you preparing mentally and practically?
Posted by RowPuzzled9703@reddit | collapse | View on Reddit | 237 comments
I've been watching what's happening across politics, the economy, culture, and geopolitics—and I can't shake the feeling that we're living through the decline of the American empire in real time.
- Politically: polarization is getting worse, and trust in institutions is collapsing.
- Economically: we're drowning in debt, inequality is extreme, and the middle class feels like it's vanishing.
- Socially: people are more isolated and angry than ever. Nobody trusts anyone.
- Militarily: it feels like we're overstretched and trying to maintain global dominance that no longer matches our internal cohesion.
Historically, this looks eerily familiar. The U.S. reminds me of late Rome or the USSR right before it unraveled. I'm not asking out of paranoia—I'm just trying to understand what stage we're in, and what the hell to do with that understanding.
If you’re feeling the same unease:
- Are you changing anything in your life in response?
- Are you planning financially, psychologically, or even geographically for instability?
- Are you leaning into local community, political engagement, or trying to unplug?
This isn’t meant to be doomer bait. I’m genuinely trying to sort out what responsible adaptation looks like. Would love to hear how others are thinking about it.
DeathofDivinity@reddit
You can’t completely prepare for collapse because there is no way to know how it will actually happen what will be the consequences for you when it happens.
As far as i understand it’s common theme with civilisation collapses is they are generally followed by migration inwards or outwards but we are headed for something akin to or for a mass extinction even you can’t survive that until and unless you get off the planet.
adamwintle@reddit
I don’t think there will be a single moment when we realise we’ve collapsed; only in hindsight will we see that everything was progressively collapsing.
DeathofDivinity@reddit
That’s not true. I am expecting definite collapses of various regions due to various factors.
My country -India , Europe and east Asia will be first to go but for different reason.
apoletta@reddit
Americans will eat each other by the end of 2100. I am afraid.
AndrogynousAndi@reddit
You think it'll take that long? I've been betting on 2050 for a decade now.
apoletta@reddit
Ahh. I am not talking the first one. I am saying when it’s known and common.
AndrogynousAndi@reddit
Ohhhhh, I was speaking more metaphorically. I bet the rich have already been participating in human trafficking for body parts much akin to ancient Chinese medicine. "Powdered pituitary gland from children every morning will keep you looking young", etc.
narwi@reddit
Europe does not have particularilly low birth rates - it has bad birth rates but by far not the worst and most of the world is catching up with European birth rates fast.
DeathofDivinity@reddit
Europe problems isn’t just birth rates it is also AMOC collapse.
mixmastablongjesus@reddit
How about Africa? Mass famines, diseases, wars, conflicts over food, water, arable, habitable land that leads to mass population decline?
DeathofDivinity@reddit
Africa is 30 million square kilometers it’s hard to make an assessment. It is going to be bad but it’s clear to me how bad it will be and as continent Africa is still struggling.
bernpfenn@reddit
it's probably more organized by lattitudes. around the equator is where it starts with unlivable temperature and moisture conditions. Higher up forest fires create misery everywhere. even higher and lower, the poles are melting at never before seen levels. Oh and the Oceans... There is no safe place on a dying planet ecology.
DeathofDivinity@reddit
Monsoon will shift downwards if AMOC collapses a paper published on effects of AMOC collapse on monsoon season predicts all monsoon fed areas should see a decline of monsoon by 20% if i am not mistaken.
Impact of AMOC collapse on monsoon
vand3lay1ndustries@reddit
Ukrainians are at war and the guidance is to show up for work if there isn’t “active shelling” in the area.
throwawaylurker012@reddit
guess all these memes about your boss asking if youre still coming to the office were true
bernpfenn@reddit
there are already enough examples of close to done with collapse. Libia, Haiti, etc...
Tenth_10@reddit
Let's face it, collapse has begun already.
Economy is weak and going weaker, socially speaking tension is everywhere, temp is rising, animal deaths are up and counting (70% insects and 30% birds are already gone), positive loops engaged, +1.5°C impossible to avoid anymore.
DeathofDivinity@reddit
We have crossed 1.5C.
Tenth_10@reddit
Momentarily.
Not permanently. Which is due to 2029 (for now).
treesalt617@reddit
Preparing?
I’m smoking a lot of weed and taking my dogs on long walks through the forest.
Kstardawg@reddit
This is the way. Let go of the things we cant control and enjoy the things we can.
Valuable-Habit9241@reddit
I see this perspective a lot and agree with it in principle but I really don't think we'll be saying this when we're starving to death or meeting some other horrible physical reality.
ka_beene@reddit
There's worse ways to go than starving, especially if you've made peace with the process. I don't plan on living out some MadMax type scenario. Then again I have a chronic illness that makes life hardly worth living so it might be easier for me to think like this.
PhoenixAsh7117@reddit
Same here. No chronic conditions though except getting older and not really up for fighting tooth and nail for every day of survival, seems like a younger person’s game. Will play it by ear, if it gets that bad then the only thing I would struggle with is what to do with my dog.
AdeptVideo3177@reddit
Gotta agree. I've lived a good life. If I have to nope on outta here, no biggie. Would the dogs be better off noping with me or let loose on the streets? One is a rescued street dog, the other is a little bit of a princess.
PhoenixAsh7117@reddit
I guess it depends, my dog is a smaller rescue dog who was a stray in Texas when he was younger, but he’s been with us for 8 years now in New England area. He does like to chase / eat bugs lol so maybe he could subsist on them in the woods for a while, but since he’s smaller and older and friendly with humans he would probably either not make it through the first winter and/or end up as a starving human’s or other animal’s dinner during a collapse scenario. The kinder solution in that situation seems to be to have him share my own fate, at least I could give him a proper burial and all that, although it would be the most difficult thing I’d ever have to do in my life.
AndrogynousAndi@reddit
I would make that decision for my pet. They've never faced life like that, I'd rather their end be quick and sudden than prolonged and painful. Same decision I'd make if they had some incurable disease.
They're not built to survive on their own like that anymore. Especially one of my cats, he's got worse anxiety than I do! Shakes like a leaf if you take him outside. I wouldn't be around to see it, but I couldn't put them through that.
vandemonland@reddit
Yep, the dog is definitely the main problem. At least in the USA , the second amendment should make it relatively easy to quickly solve the problem of your own escape.
OnlyAd7207@reddit
If we all think this way, we can speed up the collapse. More is in our control than we want to think.
Kstardawg@reddit
I'm saying to let go of the things you can't control. If you can control something, still try your best
OnlyAd7207@reddit
Understood. I just see a lot of people saying things like, “what can you do?”…or “it’s not in your control.” Those are the people in directing that to.
Alone we may not be able to change much. Together, we can change EVERYTHING. I recently heard it only takes about 4% of people to start a movement. We need those 4% badly now.
Hey, I’m with ya my friend. We just gotta do our best…whatever we can do without losing our minds. 🫡
Old_Coconut_5463@reddit
This. Too much scaremongering here :/ sad.
Significant_Prize_15@reddit
Ollie approves this message 🐄
rematar@reddit
Forest bathing is good for you.
https://www.npr.org/2023/08/22/1195337204/a-guide-to-forest-bathing
mcwriter007@reddit
Yikes. RFK Jr. enters the chat.
TwinkleToesTraveler@reddit
I love this philosophy! Except I currently am living in an area that’s filled with mosquitoes and extreme heat that sometimes it’s almost impossible to relax while taking walk!
adfasdfasdf123132154@reddit
maybe consider wearing one of these for your walks? https://www.insectshield.com/products/insect-repellent-mosquito-net?variant=29958316490797&gQT=1
BakedLake@reddit
I've been learning guitar. My hope is that I might be able to at least go out with music.
Aurelar@reddit
I'm reading books and chatting online. I got nothing else..i also take walks outside
SiamLotus@reddit
Phish’s summer tour is great right now. Best they’ve played since fall ‘21
Mtn_Soul@reddit
Same
SixGunZen@reddit
The cool thing about that is your dogs have no idea about the collapse and likely wouldn't care if they did know. They're just living their best life in the woods. Maybe we should all be more like your dogs.
Kinkajou4@reddit
Same. Just take in the beauty of nature and life while it’s still there.
CastAside1812@reddit
So in other words you just have up
Limp_Meet1321@reddit
Hell yeah, same here!
Aggressive_Algae7550@reddit
I do exactly this! No kidding.
adamwintle@reddit
Same sans the forest!
cheknow@reddit
I’m in LA where we’ve been under ICE occupation so I feel fit enough to say that we are not in the beginning stages anymore. We are well into it but everyone is in so much denial.
autumndrifting@reddit
Can I be honest? Punching my ticket. I'm thinking about it every day.
TSWCAARA@reddit
5 . Set up a licensed private patrol operator, four out of six residents are qualified armed guards.
We've been prepping to shelter in place for two decades.
Slow collapse is when you neighbor loses their job. Fast collapse is when it happens to you.
Haniel.
vand3lay1ndustries@reddit
I don’t think you’re part of the middle class anymore if you have the money for a pool house and whole-house generator. I think OP is asking about what happens to people who have less than you.
You can only push people to the edge for so long before they start to fall over and it becomes the purge.
TSWCAARA@reddit
I didn't read that phrase as referring to class struggle, but let's run with it.
No, I'm not part of the middle class, I'm working class --proud of my roots --just with more resources after a life working in I.T. and owning a couple of small businesses, one that has a future under B.A.U, one that will provide support in a collapse scenario.
What happens is that people pull together.
That's what we've been doing for a decade: that those of us who can coordinate a response to the lowering levels of available energy and resources help those around them who need help.
The security guard company has given us the opportunity to offer entry-level work and get people back on their feet. Two out of six people living in our commune were homeless at some point in the last three years, four of us have experienced homelessness at some point in their lives.
Yes, a purge type scenario is possible, but it's typically not how people react to short-term challenges, and the Long Descent is a slow, grinding stairstep descent to a sustainable level of energy-use. It *could* happen, which is why four security guards live here who are not just employees of one of my companies (that's the business framework I use to support commune members and minimize the community's total tax burden), they are part of their community. Two are ex military.
So against random violence I rate our safety concerns as low. However, our connections with our neighbors is our most valuable asset, community extends far beyond the boundaries of commune.
Mud-Room-33@reddit
working class with more assets = middle class. your class status changes based on your wealth in the US, this isn't the UK with an aristocracy or India's caste system.
TSWCAARA@reddit
Lol, I was born and raised in the Welsh Valleys, my wife is from "Oup north". I stood on the picket lines during the miners strike and took part in the Poll Tax riots in London. So yes, I'm proudly using the definition of "middle class" that is more British.
The idea that an increase of wealth forces one out of their working class status --and out of solidarity with the proletariat --and into the middle (merchant) class has but one purpose: to divide and conquer. It's exactly the same argument that is used to turn the working class citizen turned against the immigrant.
So I'll continue to view myself as "working class", and I will continue refute the middle class view of seeing a productive and successful life as somehow "elevating" me above the values my parents and village inculcated within me.
When a Welshman, and Englishwoman, an Italian-American, an African-American, and two Hispanic-Americans break bread together around our table tonight, our theoretical class differences won't be a topic we discuss. We're living the NEW American dream: genuine community.
addteacher@reddit
Thanks for the explanation. In the US, working class means blue-collar job, and you don't get to be in that club once you achieve a certain amount of security/wealth. We do forget sometimes that other places do it differently.
TSWCAARA@reddit
Makes sense. In a more capitalistic society, "automatically" moving laborers into the overseer class based on effective managerial skills breaks social those ties that traditionally led to effective union organizing. I've noticed before than good supervisors fulfill the role of "shop stewards", but are legally the eyes and ears of management.
Guess I'm going to have to stop going down pub, and find myself a wine bar... Lol.
addteacher@reddit
Vanek you heard? Capitalism is over. It's techno-feudslism now.
TSWCAARA@reddit
Feudalism at least had a social contract between the Lord of the Land and the serfs. It wasn't working conditions that had the landless flocking to the cities in the industrial revolution, it was the loss of land due to the enclosures.
Comparing Feudalism to TechBro-ism is like comparing a traditional union shop Taxi company with Uber. Tech Bro's do not understand Nobless Oblige. The Tech Bro's are oligarchs. Don't honor them with a new title, that exploitative shit has stunk the same since Rome.
Doughop@reddit
I'm a little less doomer than most here. I'm just accepting that a US collapse is likely to happen in some form and figuring out how I want to hedge my bets and live out the future till then.
Collapse isn't anywhere near the biggest factor in my decision, but I have chosen to leave the US. Though I have zero faith it will save me. I have been enjoying working remotely for a Japanese company and I have chosen to accept a work visa and move to Japan. Pursuing permanent residency is high on my list and I'll leave investment assets and keep citizenship in the US in case the US does not collapse and I want to return.
Japan is collapsing too, but I feel that the US is violently eating itself and would go out in a boom, metaphorically and literally. I feel Japan will go out in with a quiet whimper and that sounds a lot more peaceful. If the US completely collapses the entire world economy is fucked anyways. If a US-China war starts then I feel either way the nukes will start flying and I would be fucked anyways. Climate change? No escaping that anywhere. The world is just too closely tied to the US but maybe I can shield myself from it's problems for a little while longer.
I have zero interest in trying to prep for total collapse. My survival instinct just doesn't seem that strong and I don't have much faith I would survive it anyways. Hopefully we are all wrong and the world never quite slides into those last stages of collapse, or maybe we are right and the end is neigh. Either way I just want to live out my remaining years peacefully and the way I want whether that be 10 years or 50.
yellowblueberry372@reddit
How is Japan also collapsing?
Doughop@reddit
A shrinking population, very high government debt, relatively stagnant economy and climate change will probably hit them hard. They are relatively resource poor so if trade lines collapse they will get hit especially hard. I would say their collapse is more of a slow decay.
On the positive side is that I think they will be some of the first countries to figure out some of these issues such as shrinking populations. They have also managed to maintain a surprising amount of stability through the entire thing.
yellowblueberry372@reddit
Thank you for explaining all this!
fungiblecogs@reddit
Early? It's been on this trajectory for decades. We're nearer the end game.
Bellybutton_fluffjar@reddit
Probably started around the beginning of the Vietnam war.
3toe@reddit
There are different points you can argue as for when the collapse started here. I think it was when the British colonized what is now the USA. Another major inflection point was ww2. We did this whole "excess, corruption and wealth inequality" thing in the 20s, then paid for it in the 30s. I don't think we properly learned our lesson because the war interrupted everything. Then, we dropped nukes and created the FBI, CIA, etc., and the military industrial complex. That really put us on the fast track. Just my opinion.
It-s_Not_Important@reddit
Inequality has always existed, but monetary and tax policy through the 70s and 80s are the driving force behind growing inequality. Prior to that, “share” was relatively stable. Wealth has been consolidated to the top few more and more disproportionately since.
Runningoutofideas_81@reddit
Other than environmental factors, I think you are right to focus on inequality. I am not saying one is more likely the culprit, but if the spirit of America/Society (for non-American countries) was alive, and intact, environmental issues likely could have been surmounted and/or curtailed.
Silly_List6638@reddit
Peter Turchin has a good view that Collapse occurs when you have both massive inequality and in-fighting between elites. Those being the two necessary ingredients that need to align at the same time.
Runningoutofideas_81@reddit
Def a recipe for disaster.
Grand-Page-1180@reddit
'Nam was bad, but the beginning of the end will always be the Reagan administration for me. He and his British counterpart Thatcher did irreparable damage to their respective countries that we're still living with the ramificiations of to this day.
3toe@reddit
Not just living with, but exacerbating. But yea the Reagan administration was an absolute nightmare from which we will never recover.
MotanulScotishFold@reddit
1971
bernpfenn@reddit
care to elaborate?
MotanulScotishFold@reddit
summary here: https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/
bernpfenn@reddit
right, abolishing the gold standard was a bad idea
finishedarticle@reddit
IIRC the end of the Bretton Woods Agreement and the switch from the gold standard to the petrol dollar.
trivetsandcolanders@reddit
This.
I think it’s notable that you can find works by American authors from as far back as the 90s, or probably even earlier, that discuss the spiritual hollowness of American life. (“Infinite Jest” is one that comes to mind.) We’ve been socially isolated from each other without much meaning, for too long, that’s what’s at the root of our increasing political divisions.
TheRealYeastBeast@reddit
Amusing Ourselves To Death - Neil Postman 1985
FakeGamer2@reddit
I don't think so dude. 2100 is end game. 2040/2050 is mid game like when fossil fuels are running out and warming is passing our early limit goals. Here in 2025 id say we are in late stages of early game.
bernpfenn@reddit
I give this BAU another five years before harvests become impossible due to climate droughts flooding fire and erosion.
If we don't have any crazy Atom war before that. Lots of jobless youth, the social contract broken nearly everywhere. You get the picture...
Glittering_Film_6833@reddit
I hope they point their ire at the parties responsible
AngilinaB@reddit
Have you read The Forcing? We like are the ones considered responsible 😁
thomas533@reddit
RemindMe! 5 years
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mangomisfit@reddit
This is the romanticised idea of collapse, but not reality. It won’t end spectacularly in societal breakdown, civil war, or nuclear bomb. It will slowly rot from the inside, with a sick, hungry, and paranoid population reaffirming their belief in the “American dream” as the freedom to suffer without government intervention.
screech_owl_kachina@reddit
It doesn’t have to be civil war for me to get sniped by someone in the woods while I’m driving on the highway
mangomisfit@reddit
True but that has been the case for as long as America has had highways
edwigenightcups@reddit
At this point, we are one generation from Parable of the Sower, which everyone should read right now if they want a chilling glimpse into what a slow, undetectable collapse looks like
Professional_Hold477@reddit
I just started reading that.
aubreypizza@reddit
Yup, super glad I didn’t have children
erbush1988@reddit
Woo! Same.
I love my nephew but think my brother and sister-in-law are crazy lol
ChrisssieGoerl@reddit
love your name here, love Aubrey plaza
aubreypizza@reddit
Thank you! She and P&R are awesome.
Time is money. Money is power. Power is pizza. Pizza is knowledge.
Wild-Muffin9190@reddit
Bingo
SixGunZen@reddit
I mean, maybe. I woulda said that same thing in 2008 though.
insuperati@reddit
This is what I said out loud, from a far distance too. It's like I've been watching a head on train crash in slow motion since I was born in '77.
pocketgravel@reddit
Don't forget demographically. Births are below replacement and have been for years. The social contract (lol) and modern society as a whole are built on the premise of constant demographic growth. Without enough young educated workers society falls apart.
The developed world is already hip deep in the demographic collapse and are blissfully unaware except for token coverage of Japan, Korea, or Taiwan as the most extreme examples while ignoring exactly how bad it'll be for us.
So far no developed nation has figured out how to get birth rates above replacement. Almost like people plan smaller families when squeezed from all sides simultaneously. Once you hit ~1.5 children per woman you enter a fertility death spiral. Young people are overworked to meet the ever increasing demands of "line must go up" and don't have the money, time, support, or housing to have kids.
upthetruth1@reddit
Immigration can solve that, even Japan is opening its borders
But you have to have a proper plan. You need to build, you also need integration programs.
pocketgravel@reddit
Immigration is demographic debt. It solves it in the short term. Eventually they retire.
The last few places with positive birth rates are rapidly declining in rate and developing rapidly. For my home country of Canada we immigrate the majority from India and they just went below replacement. Their average age is mid 30s, and half of the migrants from India are closer to retirement age than not. Eventually it stops working especially as all countries are drawing from emigrant nations that are getting older and have less kids.
upthetruth1@reddit
That’s a problem with Canada not having age requirements.
Anyway, Africa still exists.
Regardless, the problem isn’t lack of immigrants. It’s poor planning and loose requirements which many centre-left governments are looking at resolving.
pocketgravel@reddit
Yeah you're right they should have a age limit, but there's still the issue of smaller families and a lower cohort of young workers within India. At some point India and even Africa will start making treaties over them like a natural resource.
Northern Africa is well below replacement and has been for a long time so it's a smaller pool of countries than you might think. Subsaharan Africa also has a higher replacement rate (2.5-4.0 children per women depending) and is developing fast as well. There's also the issue that every developed country on earth needs to draw hundreds of thousands or even millions of migrants from a small pool of nations.
Within 5-10 years global fertility rate will be below the global replacement rate. IIRC we're at 2.33 for fertility and 2.3 for the replacement rate.
upthetruth1@reddit
Who said millions?
Net 200k is enough for all Western countries. What Canada did was ridiculous.
pocketgravel@reddit
You do need millions. You need 0.5-1% of your total population in immigration every year if your TFT is <1.5. China would need to immigrate 1/4 - 1/2 of Canada's entire population every year to meet their youth shortfall. it's even worse as people age in both the host and emigrant country, as emigrant countries get older on average from their own low birth rates.
Also remember the % of people in emigrating countries that meet your ideal age band for workers is ~30% of their total population, and is needed to maintain the emigrating countries high birth rate. Second gen immigrants also naturalize to native fertility rates. First gen immigrants tend to do the same if they immigrate under 15 years old.
For example Europe is roughly ~1.5 TFT on average and would need somewhere around 0.9% immigration per year (also remember it compounds year on year) so Europe would need 6.7 million people per year. 6.8 million the next, and so on. Just like cheap oil we're pulling all from the same places with no long term planning. It doesn't end well and the math doesn't math in our favour.
But the real point I'm getting at is it breaks our current system and will almost certainly prevent us from effectively dealing with other problems like climate change. It'll also certainly result in new wars from civil unrest within aging nations.
Everything is based on the assumption of never ending growth. Especially endless demographic growth. We're in unknown territory having this happen globally all at once. If it was just Korea or Japan the world can manage. But it's every developed country east and west, democracy or autocracy. When you add in all the other cans we've been kicking down the road (or outright ignoring) we won't have the ability to deal with anything. It's like Maslow's hierarchy of needs. You don't worry about the higher order problems when the existential problem of not having enough people to keep society running is present.
The 20th century set the stage for a disaster mid 21st century, and demographic collapse will ensure we let those disasters happen. 2030 is when things start to get bad for low TFT nations and nations begin fighting over the last few high TFT emigrant nations. 2040 is a breaking point for places like Japan, Taiwan, China, and Korea and when immigration simply isn't enough for anyone sub 1.5 today. 2050 will be chaos. It also lines up quite well with climate change and the death of cheap oil.
upthetruth1@reddit
Why would there be civil unrest?
I really think you’re overestimating all this. Africans also have high fertility rates. 100k Africans a year will probably kick the can down the road for a while since they will probably have 3 children, and then you’ve got 250k Africans in a single generation.
Maybe I’m optimistic because I live in the UK, but the UK is the only European country where second-generation immigrants outperform natives in education. They’re more likely to do well in school, go to university, work a good job. Especially for those of African, Indian and Chinese backgrounds. We’ll be reducing immigration, but I think we can handle net 200k providing we actually build some f-king houses.
Net 200k immigrants will solve the problem for a country like the UK, Canada or Australia. Just choose young people, ideally young couples with good education.
Actually, if you fix your university system (close down diploma mills), you could take in international students and train them so you get good workers in the future.
I think you’re catastrophising the demographic issue.
Also, I assume you mean EU, but 6.7 million divided by 27 is 248k.
I’m not saying it’s sustainable forever, but it could last to at least 2100 for developed countries.
One-Dot-7111@reddit
Early?!
StoopSign@reddit
I don't think we're in early collapse anymore. Probably more mid collapse.
IAMA_Drunk_Armadillo@reddit
Honestly, I'm not entirely sure how we haven't had a total economic and societal collapse. It feels like everything is being held up by duct tape and kayfabe at the moment.
MeateatersRLosers@reddit
A big part of it feels like there is no real competition. Like China, our big rival, is supposed to be the next big super power, but in reality is super corrupt low trust society full of tofu dreg construction and no correcting mechanisms - just saving face, sweep under the rug, and punish anyone rocking ghe boat and raising awareness.
IAMA_Drunk_Armadillo@reddit
That's the kayfabe part of it. Everyone knows it's all performative and doesn't mean anything but still treats it as real and normal
AndrogynousAndi@reddit
It's felt like it's all spit and bubblegum since 9/11 at least.
CharacterForming@reddit
You must be new here. J/k but in all seriousness, yes, it's not coming soon, it's happening now. I moved my family out of the city 3 years ago. We moved onto a 15 acre farm and have begun building out permaculture gardens and trying to be as self sufficient as possible. Even then, I don't see a lot of hope; the "US Empire" collapsing is not a big deal compared to the climate disaster. All this fear mongering about AI and other threats is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Even if we were to save the US tomorrow, billions of people will die in the next 20-50 years. We are fucked, so try to live a good life and it you can extend it as much as you can, but you aren't going live happily ever after if you are under 30-40 years old.
Silly_List6638@reddit
yeah i did the same, though.
i work parttime from home to pay the mortgage. My hope is that if I stay ahead of the mortgage repayments (about 12 months ahead) that when there is a collapse and my debt given to the local warlord that I will not be kicked off the land completely and have some agency to retain the land for myself and sell produce from it
PS I am more into Regen than Permaculture now. Whilst permaculture was good to get me started i think there is a lack of focus on community resilience
PPS It might be the youtube permys that tricked me...but yeah im tired all the time....animals escaping, things breaking...still i wouldnt change anything
PPPS good luck on your adventure!
CharacterForming@reddit
Oh yeah for sure, Regen has to be in your wheelhouse. We aren't straight permaculture out here either, it's important to be realistic ATM. We joke about it too "Right now you can drive into town and go to the hardware store... SO DO IT" lol! It's all part of the process of learning how to live out here, like you, we wouldn't change a thing. Collapse or not, I'm really glad we moved out here.
Old_Coconut_5463@reddit
Lmao. Great to have hope for your children and tell them they won't live a full life. You're a lunatic like everyone else on this bizarre sub. Live your life dude. Touch some grass on the farm you bought, and get off Reddit. Like seriously.
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CubLeo@reddit
Not in the US, UK here, but I have completely checked out.
I go to work. I earn a barely livable wage. I have no savings. I worry about everything out of my control.
I judge myself for not being 'successful' despite knowing that I have everything stacked against me.
I have accepted I will never own my own house despite working full time.
I have accepted I will never be in a good paying job due to a disability.
Everything is getting progressively worse and I have realised the issue is not me or something that therapy and medication can solve. The issue is the world.
I used to be hopeful, but that has gone. I'm not depressed, I just am realistic.
I don't know how much more of this I can take, im currently trying to learn to sew better to distract myself but I don't know how long this will distract me for.
I'm tired.
ventabaron@reddit
Most of the world would love to live in the USA. Solve 1. House prices 2. Healthcare Any I would estimate that a lot of issues go away.
USA economy is strong, yes debt is high (too high) and deficits are not sustainable but all of the capital that exists in the USA doesn’t change because of debt. The infrastructure, knowledge, skills, law and order, IP etc.
Lots of less educated quite rightly feel undermined by globalisation, our governments have let these people down over a 50 year period. They need jobs and a clear path to housing and healthcare.
Desperate-Ad-5109@reddit
I think it’s very useful to do comparisons. I see a lot of political comparisons with the 1930s but I would play down economic comparisons with that period.
DocFGeek@reddit
Been a 100% bike commuter since 2020. (Fuck the financial sinkhole of car ownership.)
Minimized our life to fit on a touring bike + trailer. (Bug out bike.)
Been living sober and vegetarian for the last year and a half. (The body and mind lack cravings.)
Digital and media detox for the last year. (Not drawn to any of the propaganda/distractions.)
Made use of the small pittance of health insurance we have to make sure we're shipshape. Have new contacts and eyeglasses on order. (Fit and functional.)
Been researching permaculture, food forestry, subsistence farming, victory gardens, and off-grid living. (Food independence.)
If/when SHTF: bug out bike > somewhere FAR from urban civilization > eco-farmstead
GiftToTheUniverse@reddit
This all sounds "good," but...
How's the digital detox going if you're posting here?
Also, you really can't minimize your life to fit on a touring bik and trailer if you're trying to subsist on farming.
Your post comment honestly reads a lot like someone who has considered doing the things you say you're doing, but hasn't actually done them.
I spent 11 years with a bicycle as my main form of transportation. I have quite a few 250-1500 mile minimalist biking/camping tours under my belt (was poor, had to "make do" a lot) back and forth across the PNW, a couple trips Seattle to LA, trips in Canada...
You might be able to flee on a bicycle short term, but you're not going to hit the road during a serious collapse and somehow thrive.
When biking long distances you're CONSTANTLY on the lookout for water, which is only guaranteed during regular civilization because regular civilization is happening. You're constantly buying food, constantly trying not to get ran over by cars that only make an effort not to kill you because they don't want to dent their car...
You're very vulnerable when you travel by bicycle. People in cars can stalk you. Once when I was biking from Spokane to Riztville some people I knew saw me in the morning and then they spent that afternoon driving around Ritzville on the lookout for me to see if I wanted to stay at their place that night.
This was before cell phones. That whole day I had no idea they had spotted me. If they'd had bad intentions what could I have done?
Another time I was in a friend's city and called to see if she wanted to hang out. I let her know where I was going to be camping that night, and she came and picked me up for dinner.
We had such a good time that she decided she would meet me to hang out again the next night.
A bike just doesn't get very far very fast compared to a car.
The life of a bicycle nomad is heavily reliant upon a docile society that is willing and able to make provisions available for travellers.
MinuteWonderful5001@reddit
Don’t know why u got downvoted 💀
GiftToTheUniverse@reddit
Pretty sure they used both their accounts to abuse the downvote button, lol.
Honestly I've been gardening for many years, too, and without municipal water I wouldn't be able to grow shizz, and that's in a beautiful, incredible climate. With utility provided water I have sunflowers taller than a basketball hoop. Without I have nothing but dusty weeds.
And even under ideal conditions my "crops" are under constant attack by pests. It's a very involved chore to constantly inspect for harmful bugs and deal with them.
Even my giant sunflowers have around 10% loss due to sunflower moth caterpillars chomping away where you can't see them due to the flowers that cover the seeds.
It is so much harder to grow subsistence quantities of food than most people imagine and even if you're just magically lucky it still takes months for results. And this guy mentions "permaculture" without mentioning that it takes years to build good soil using permaculture.
And they've got some kind of imaginary homestead they're going to pop off to.
Dude, if you've got someplace you can build a homestead then why would you wait until things are so bad that you're forced to bug out on a bicycle? Go get it started now while you're not forced to rely on whatever you can 'stead with the little trowel you're going to be able to carry with you on your bike!
Do they just think they're going to squat somewhere for months while they do permaculture?
No one wants to feel cornered, but we're cornered, bro.
bedbuffaloes@reddit
Yeah, there is a huge learning curve to homesteading. You need to start DOING now.
Silly_List6638@reddit
yeah been at it for 7 years. 4 on a suburban block and 3 on a small 30+ acre farm. So much work. Tired all the time but wouldnt change it
Sorry_End3401@reddit
Noice! I use on line “call on doc” to bypass any sort of visits to urgent cares. It costs $35 to text I have a sinus infection-then they text back when my prescriptions are ready at the pharmacy. AND give me a coupon for $10 off next use. Used this for my whole family. Saved a ton
I use on line ordering for all contact lenses so I can bypass the “must have new prescription from eye drs” This too saved a great deal of money
collapse-ModTeam@reddit
Rule 2: Posts and comments which appear to be marketing, self-promotion, surveys, astroturfing, or other forms of spam will be removed.
Self-promotion or surveys of value to the community may be allowed on a case-by-case basis, if the moderation team is informed first via mod mail.
BambosticBoombazzler@reddit
Nice! What website do you use for contacts?
Janices1976@reddit
nice!
NomadicScribe@reddit
Not in the early stages at all. Remember that collapse is gradual and takes a long time, and the larger the organization/entity, the more there is to collapse. It's not a sudden disaster like in the movies.
I fully expect young people to be asking this exact question in 20 or 50 years, as poor history education makes them unable to recognize or acknowledge decline. The message will always be "USA #1", until the borders dissolve and the last ounce of marble on the Lincoln Memorial is sold off to the highest bidder.
By my estimation, the US as an empire hit something of a golden age in the years after WWII. It was still expanding, still adding states. (Yes, some of us have parents older than Alaska and Hawaii.) The turn came when the US, struggling with war debt and an oil crisis, kicked off the neoliberal turn in the early 70s. (I cannot understate how much doom the oil crisis brought, to the point of inspiring new genres of science fiction.)
Since then it's been an oscillation of peaks and disasters. But thanks to the neoliberal economic design, each extremity in these oscillations serves to transfer wealth upward to the wealthiest, while crushing the working class.
Somehow with each cycle, we emerge feeling like there's been a return to normalcy, when there hasn't been. We just accepted the degradation, accepted the decline.
And it will continue this way until we hit some kind of existential wall, or the working class collectively says "enough"... and acts on it.
Silly_List6638@reddit
thats a really good perspective. I like that you refer to the cycles as ways it has stabilised but the cost has been increasing the inequality...ie turning us into peasants instead of participants in democracy with agency
Sorry_End3401@reddit
Exactly! This deterioration is slow so you do not rise up and fight. Each passing year we lost pensions for shitty 401k pyramid schemes, we pay exuberant health care costs monthly and when we use them but our politicians are paid for by us. our rights have been slowly chopped away, our salaries trickle up more & more leaving us with little to spend, corporations use algorithms to price rent regardless of area, women are losing the battle to control our own reproductive organs and now it’s common to be told to have a side hustle. A fukking side hustle? To make ends meet after my 40 hour a week job?!?!
Yeah NOPE
OnlyAd7207@reddit
What I think is funny is people will say the world is collapsing and then still continue to procreate….like wtf?
TMag73@reddit
It's been happening but MAGA threw a bunch of gasoline on it. Gothic Maga, the accelerationists, seem to be executing their plans to really push the point so that they can be part of rebuilding a country or system that they think is better. The "stable coin" law and selling off federal lands they passed is paving the way for city states owned by corporations where people can live without the nation state.
deadlandsMarshal@reddit
Well... Sort of. It's complicated.
America is kind of a micrososm of human civilization with a greatly reduced time scale. So the authoritarianism to anarchy and back cycle plays out usually once a decade rather than once every six or seven generations. Also what a lot of people (even many Americans) don't know is that the states are actually individual, though not truly independent, nations and this creates a situation where different national cultures can clash in a way that mimics the dynamics of nations interacting with each other but on a smaller regional and shorter time scale.
The whole time the federal government is kind of trying to balance being the center of all these chaotic state interactions and being in charge all at once.
What that causes is a highly unstable societal cycle which brings about the collapse of American society at least twice a century, and modern technology is making that happen a bit more frequently.
When America collapses, the population and the governments work to pretty much completely reinvent themselves in terms of what is happening with available technology and business capability. Again about twice a century if not more, this process makes America almost a completely different nation after each collapse.
And if you go back and see the news reports and articles since America became a major global player people have been almost gleefully predicting that whatever turmoil the U.S. is going through is going to be the end of it. Well... They're technically right. They just didn't count on Americans being willing to improvise and work together to rebuild in a different direction.
So we're in the end stages of yet another collapse of America. What remains to be seen is if the population is willing to submit to authoritarian rule and the degradation that comes with that, or is our population going to overturn those billionaires and loyalist politicians and allow the collapse to happen so we can go a different direction.
Either way America will never be the same. And there is no going back.
upthetruth1@reddit
Balkanisation might work out for some states
Cascadia and New England will be just fine
NecessaryVast517@reddit
The country is drifting apart and racially we are too diverse from a world history perspective.
I’m not sure it’ll be a complete collapse but the country will likely divide into several countries at some point. Maybe not even violently.
The people boy way to prepare is to be in good physical shape and own guns. Maybe have a garden.
upthetruth1@reddit
Race isn’t the problem, and this kind of thinking is why the USA is collapsing
Class is the problem
Glittering_Film_6833@reddit
Not in the US, but figuring to sell excess possessions, buy a couple of pairs of good quality boots and prepare to do a lot of walking.
Deep_losses@reddit
The first step in preparing for collapse is to delete as much social media as possible. If all your photos are saved to instagram or facebook, download them to an external hard drive. Better yet, print physical copies of the absolute best and keep a photo album. The second step is to have actual books, not audible or a kindle. Build your own library. The third step is to plant a food garden or, if in an apartment, a bunch of potted food plants. Understanding how things grow, the inputs required, processes that occur, and the outputs that are produced is very rewarding. These three things will not only make you more resilient against emergencies they will improve your mental wellbeing. Good luck everyone.
i-come@reddit
Its not even early stages tbh, i would be very very surprised if things dont move along a lot faster soon
Winter_Screen2458@reddit
To me the failed revolution of 1968 pushed us past the hope for a civilized future.
cinesias@reddit
Things went terribly wrong from 1968 and onwards.
A right-wing counterrevolution is close to winning.
All it takes is a committed 40-45% of the population who demands the worst of the worst get to control everything.
New-Acadia-6496@reddit
I don't think we can adapt. That's like asking "how do you adapt to living in 1939 Germany". Well, if you're a Jew, you don't. if you're anti-fascist, you don't. if you're a communist, trans, gay - you don't adapt.
I would say "leave this place" but honestly, where are we going to go?
Tall_Pizza562@reddit
It was very telling and somewhat surprising how professors who study fascists quickly moved to Canada. They don't think the politics in the USA will end well.
Wide_Scope@reddit
Made them look like cowards. They should be staying and fighting.
AndrogynousAndi@reddit
Staying and fighting. Fighting what? It's the age old question, at what point would shooting Hitler have no longer made a difference? Would he have ended up a martyr anyway, with someone else taking up the reigns? Now extrapolate, and be careful how you talk.
He might not have a majority supporting him anymore, but it's enough that the top man doesn't matter, in my opinion. The sycophants will take up that work in his stead. It's all rotten to the core. Has been for a long time, but it's blatantly apparent, now.
How does one fight then? Save for the time machine to go back and prevent the circumstances that caused the disenfranchisement of 1920's Germany?
enkifish@reddit
That's a bit like moving from Germany to Austria because Germany is getting too fascist.
4BigData@reddit
thank God somebody else notices this too
SixGunZen@reddit
There are representatives of every marginalized group you just named among the survivors of 1934-1945 Germany. They survived beacuse they adapted. The ones who didn't, died.
New-Acadia-6496@reddit
They didn't adapt, they survived either by escaping to another country, or just survived the camps they were held in until the Russian/American army came to release them.
SixGunZen@reddit
That's a pretty big group of people from a nuanced variety of different situations and backgrounds for you to offhandedly group them into two categories.
ferenginaut@reddit
away
bonzomaistah@reddit
Early stages.... LoL
Spittyfire-1315@reddit
💯
Known_Leek8997@reddit
Hey u/RowPuzzled9703 you flaired this as AI. Out of curiosity, why?
SettingGreen@reddit
They clearly used AI to write this post. Thats why it reads like an amalgamation of every dam collapse question ever and uses bullet points etc. slop on slop. I hate it here. We MUST BAN AI
davidm2232@reddit
Minimizing expenses, saving more, having 6 months of supplies on hand. End goal is to be totally energy independent and have a lot of food grown at home. The more self sufficient you are, the easier collapse will be.
Acceptable_Law_4227@reddit
I'm heading to the wilderness once the grocery stores go bear. Hunt, butcher, survive- alone. I won't be passing my DNA on to the next generation, but I choose life to the very end. I believe our collective choices influence the future.
Flaccidchadd@reddit
It's not the collapse phase yet, it's the transition into the conservation phase of the adaptive cycle, the zero sum phase
SpotResident6135@reddit
Creation and fostering of community support and defense with your neighbors. YMMV.
fsalese@reddit
Dual citizenship and offgrid home in Philppines... check.
ieroll@reddit
,Not sure what to do. Seniors, midwest US. Financial planner stole our life savings and partner has terminal and progressive neuro degenerative disease. No family and very few close friends left nearby to assist. For now we just hope that SS and Medicare (and Medicaid) hold on for a while. Have stashed a few long shelf-life foods but not enough for more than a couple of supply chain interruptions. Our local water sources are undrinkable (uncontrolled agricultural waste) are politics are pro-collapse. Honestly, hoping for a direct hit from an asteroid or nuke or something.
Grand-Page-1180@reddit
I think the last gasp of the USSR is not a bad comparison to where we are now. We're running on fumes. I don't know what's going to happen, or when, or how, but the U.S. I was born and raised in is dead. I don't know what we have anymore, a strange shadow of its former self.
Much of my planning is probably psychological. Most of what I (and we) were taught was a lie. We were being used the entire time. Nothing had to be as difficult, precarious or complicated as it is, but its that way because someone benefits from it. Never going to have much steady employment, probably not going to retire, no one in the government works for us. The closes thing we have to a government are the dictatorial private corporations we were for (if we do work). Its a lot to accept, to internalize.
I'll save my money, I'll keep looking for scrap work. I'll stand in the corner and take notes at all the insanity. The usual, really.
littlepup26@reddit
I mean we're at full blown fascism at this point with no attempt to hide it anymore. As a trans man I can see a clear path forming that the administration could use to round us all up and I'm terrified. I can't get a passport to get out of here because they'll put an F on it even though I have a mustache even Hulk Hogan would be envious of. I can't run and I can't hide and I'm fucking scared.
AstraScribe3797@reddit
Right now at least while the court injunction is in effect, you can at least try to apply. The department of state doesn't have a standard process for the passport gender markers so it will depend on the agent who processes your application.
syynapt1k@reddit
Is the injunction still in effect after the SCOTUS ruling on Friday? I thought the relief from said injunction now only applies to the litigants who brought the case - and that anyone else seeking relief will need to bring their own case.
Or does that only apply to new injunctions?
AstraScribe3797@reddit
Because the Department of state isn't a monolith and the # of passports is huge, it can depend on who and where it gets processed if the passport will be issued with the current gender or the assigned gender. There are a lot of people stuck as cogs doing the best they can. I won't promise you'll be able to get through but if you're desperately trying to get a passport it's a hail Mary option.
softeggnoodles@reddit
You can’t get a passport because they would put your assigned sex at birth on it instead of the one you PREFER? Oh no, you’ll never be able to leave now!
If you really wanted to leave this fascist hellhole you claim to live in, the passport wouldn’t matter, because your freedom would matter to you over the government misgendering you. If you want to leave before it gets bad (reminder you all said this in 2020), buck up, shave the mustache if you think THATS what’s going to keep you from leaving, and leave. Literally no one is stopping you at this point. Our borders aren’t closed. They won’t detain you at the airport because you’re trans.
Yet here you sit on your device, freely spouting information about your trans identity on the internet for everyone to read. You cant do that in fascist nations FYI
score_@reddit
Ma'am you need to chill.
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PrestigiousQuack474@reddit
Must be pretty miserable for you to be this enormous of a clueless asshole.
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PrestigiousQuack474@reddit
Oh but this other commenter's anti-trans screed is totally kosher?! Gotcha.
SixGunZen@reddit
Fash gonna fash 👆👎
looooooooserr@reddit
If you believe you’re in real danger, can you get a passport with an F on it just to get out?
I’m a guy and if I was in danger, I’d get a passport that stamps my gender as literally whatever they want if it would keep me alive. Stamp it as sissy little girl, or sack of potatoes. Just let me leave.
LightningSunflower@reddit
I think it has less to do with it being consistent with their gender than it not being accepted by the customs agent on the other side
Sorry_End3401@reddit
I love you for this
PenguinColada@reddit
I'm also a trans man and mustached. Hello 👋
Unfortunately I'm not able to get a passport because the gender on my birth certificate doesn't match my license. In my birth state I have to have "the surgery" in order to do so. I'm just hoping Canada will offer refugee status and I can sneak across the border, Handmaids Tale style.
I live in a town that has a good number of POC and most of my friends are POC. I'm terrified for them. I'm terrified for me, too. I'm so scared that ICE is going to round up everyone I love and come for me and my trans daughter the next week while we mourn. It's a wild time to be alive in the US. It's a much different US from when I was a kid in the 90s.
I'm glad someone else gets it. But I'm also sad someone else gets it.
SixGunZen@reddit
The reactionaries go on and on about how Murica is a fReE CoUnTrY. And they're so dumb and bias-blind, they will read about people having to sneak out of the country illegally and do the mental gymnastics to make that not count against their make believe narrative. When I lived in Germany in the late 80s I met a few people who had left East Berlin illegally. One of them had a bullet hole in his left asscheek to remember the escape by. Murica is starting to look more like a capitalist North Korea than the free country the fash think they live in. I keep trying to tell them, if it's not free for everybody, it's not free for anybody. They don't listen.
SixGunZen@reddit
Just do what you can. No one person can take the whole thing on. Just do the best you can in the way you feel you'll be most effective. Spreading class awareness is extremely impostant right now.
SixGunZen@reddit
Is Austria starting to fall to the global trend toward fascism? Not surprising when this is going on everywhere.
Desperate_Cheetah249@reddit
hugs
lesenum@reddit
yes the US is in the beginning stages of collapse. I expect that since I am old, I will eventually simply crawl into a fetal position and expire. I feel sorry for the young today and the near future...
Top_Restaurant9031@reddit
We're planning for a move to France in 2028. Already visiting Nice and scouting neighborhoods, realty, etc. We were already inclined to do this around retirement, mainly motivated by their healthcare system. But the recent political speed up of authoritarianism made us schedule some dates, and start organizing our moneys. It feels right.
DoubtForsaken4454@reddit
I can umagine such a severe counter reaction to trump and maga that this whole mess reverses and we get a strong socialist revolution, massive confiscation of wealth from the wealthy, as well as guns from the gun toters, end of religion ((tax it like trump wants to tax Harvard) etc etc. Now, such a thing cannot be perfect, and would overshoot, into communism and distribution of the pain and sufferening uniformly to all.
JHandey2021@reddit
Dunno. I do know that every day, the probability that the USA will just go back to "normal" when Trump leaves/dies grows measurably smaller, as the Democratic Party establishment so dearly hopes (and is willing to stay in power to see until they literally drop dead, as they've been doing).
America has many, many, MANY taboos, things that can't be discussed by Very Serious People. One among them that I'm paying particular attention to is the future unity of the country. God did not ordain that the United States shall stay united in its present form forever (and for any people who think that's true, they should actually crack open the Bible sometime and read the political convulsions plainly described, sometimes in sad and evocative language, throughout the whole thing). The USA has stayed together through the creation of an imagined community (not a pejorative; see Benedict Anderson's work), through institutions from the postal service to Social Security, through effective tax transfers from the wealthier areas to the less wealthy, through the lowering of internal barriers to trade and movement, through a million other things.
Trump with so many of his actions is saying "fuck all that shit", and I can't tell if the Trumpists are just really dumb or whether they know exactly what they are risking. The threats and interruptions to federal transfer funding are, to me, the most fundamental threats towards American unity out there. I don't think this will happen next year, but if you continually destroy the faith and expectation that we have some sort of common enterprise, this will corrode the structural and formerly non-controversial pillars of the United States. And while it may not be next year, it'll won't take decades, either.
Eventually, states or maybe other entities as well will start wondering "why bother?" with the whole enterprise of the United States - flags and pledges of alleigence are great, they're nice, humans aren't rational creatures, but one of the lessons of collapse studies is that even the most intense propaganda at some point will start failing, and bam, a few centuries later, you've got sheep grazing in the Roman Forum (for one example).
That may not happen - President AOC may cruise to office on the back of a gigantic popular movement. But it won't be "nothing will fundamentally change" as Biden promised. And Trump's creating things that will outlast him, mark my words. This new citizenship database is the One Ring, and no one will give that up. Americans are, already, permanently, in a new reality.
I'm going on business travel next week and I'm going to re-watch Adam Curtis' "TraumaZone" on the end of the Soviet Union and the run-up to Putin in Russia.
Appropriate-City3389@reddit
We're collapsing and a big orange clown has his foot on the accelerator. If you don't have a several month supply of food at home and a way to protect yourself, you're fooling yourself.
GalacticCrescent@reddit
I'd say the collapse started in earnest with reagan as that's when we saw a turning point
Environmentally- removing the solar panels that carter put on the white house, as well as the rise of acid rain and awareness about the ozone layer hole
Economically- breaking of the air controllers union, eliminating much of the tax on the wealthy, trickle down economics etc.
Socially- the "war on drugs" and specifically flooding black neighborhoods with crack cocaine, also a big part in the rise of the whole "god and country" mentality
Politically- Everything else mentioned as well as the rebound to this with clinton's "triangulation" which helped pushed the democratic party further right
And some of the other time frames mentioned have some argument for them, in my mind the whole thing about collapse is that it has to happen after a society's peak, and granted what defines peak can be debatable, to me the logical interpretation has to do with how far a civilization has progressed technologically and socially and the 80's were pretty tops before that bubble burst. Also the factor in the rise of things like planned obsolescence which saw the overall degradation of consumer goods in search of profit
refusemouth@reddit
Reagan is definitely a major downward inflection. As far as debt goes, just look at the charts for debt by administration. It skyrockets under Reagan as a result of his "trickle down" and, of course, massive military spending. Nothing comes close aside from WW2 (in percentage terms, not dollar terms). I guess there's a good argument to be made that forcing the USSR to waste money on the arms race was instrumental in causing its collapse, but Reagan screwed the American working class more than anyone up until now, and I'm not sure tge Russisn Federation is any better than the USSR. This is just a continuation of the same con job. Instead of "welfare queens," we now have undocumented immigrants to scapegoat, and of course, "the radical left" and transgender people. Americans are sure a bunch of suckers.
GalacticCrescent@reddit
Suckers are what you get when education gets gutted for decades
somecoffeenowplease@reddit
Not early. Midway.
addteacher@reddit
Keep asking, "What things CAN I control?
I try to remind myself that for most of human history there were despots, and most people lived in pretty horrible conditions. We are ants on a blade of grass and will be gone soon whether the US survives or not.
Be good to people around you. That's my only advice.
Codicus1212@reddit
We’re always in a perpetual state of collapse in this country. Our specialty is building a platform to land on that bridges the gap between what use to be and what we want things to be.
The only difference this time is we have people actively hacking away at the supports of said platform.
Life will go on as normal until one day it doesn’t. We’ll wake up and realize we’re about to land and have nowhere TO land, and it’s too late to figure it out.
One of these days I fully expect the country to go from burying its head in the sand pretending everything is business as normal, to full blown collapse. And I don’t expect it to take much longer than a day or two.
MidwestException@reddit
So—the US is brand spanking new compared to everywhere else. Ask yourself how the rural, poor, destitute, and suck Russian/Indian population live? There’s internet sure and there’s education sure and there’s money sure, but they want all of us living on the streets outside of the town walls. It’s not going to all fall apart—it’s going to be like the crappiest bus on the crappiest line in the crappiest city going to the crappiest job and then coming “home” to the crappiest home. How did life look during the depression? How has life looked for the majority of the industrial period in developing nations? It’s gonna look and feeL like that with pockets of luxury popping through from the parallel society that they want to price you out of.
Historicmetal@reddit
Doesn’t sound so bad
TheSpeculator22@reddit
As Hunter S. Thompson once said
"Pray to god, but row away from the rocks."
in10ebris00@reddit
As someone who hasn’t started their life yet, I know that the best thing I can do is stop pretending that I’ll have the life my parents and their parents had. I know that I have this chance to use my time wisely and make sure I’m ready.
Calm-Limit-37@reddit
Mid-collapse. Definitely no where near the end.
squirtz_rule876@reddit
By exercising the 2nd, going to the gym everyday, talking to my family about our plan once this goes nuclear(metaphorically or literally? Idk). Bought for the first time a lot of seeds for different vegetables.
Money wont really do you any good in a fractured society btw.
emma279@reddit
I'm preparing to leave the country. I think there will be a civil war and I'm not hanging around for it.
lizadye@reddit
where are you headed if i may ask?
HotAccountant2831@reddit
Gave up alcohol four years ago. Supporting my body to be as strong physically and emotionally as possible. Doing my own inner work so I can stay in my heart space and thereby be a support to myself as well as my community. Learning skills such as gardening and herbal medicine. Meditating. Refusing to stay stuck in fear loops. Feet on the bare Earth. Reclaiming sacred rage. Working every day to be as ungovernable as possible.
lizadye@reddit
😍
Sorry_End3401@reddit
Congratulations
hairway_to____steven@reddit
I’m in pretty much the exact tribe. Meditating and inner work among many other peaceful practices 🙏
But what is sacred rage? Sounds good!
Outside_Bed5673@reddit
I want to suggest giving up vaping and tobacco - the benefits when SHTF are large if you are able to keep a cool head and continue to adapt outweight health benefits 50 years out. I am trying to regain my sanity - I love my country - I just do not recognize it sometimes anymore.
JulianCribb@reddit
Yes, the US is in decline. But so too is the nation state in general. Nations are finished because they do not have to capacity to solve any of the global mega-threats they now face. In fact they make these threats worse.
JustTheBeerLight@reddit
1) not having kids.
TheRealTengri@reddit
I think we are pretty close to the end, likely within a few decades. My projections are in the early to mid thirties, things will start to get really out of hand, and by 2050 society will have collapsed. Mentally, I think about the fact that I have been preparing practically, increasing the odds of me surviving. Practically, I have been learning a lot of skills for the past six years and sometime within the next few years I am going to go off-grid and be as self sufficient as possible.
Ambitious-Can4244@reddit
Just kinda laughing at this point honestly.
mslashandrajohnson@reddit
As a relatively new retiree. I’m doing my best to stay as healthy as possible, including having lost weight over the winter and early spring (intermittent fasting) so I’m no longer obese and am working my summer jobs tending flowering plants for my town, including some carrying of water and some weeding/deadheading.
The work is only a couple of hours four days a week, if it isn’t raining. But it’s a great workout. I did the same work last summer. It straightened up my posture and built my upper body strength. It’s lots of fun, too. The people are great, my boss is easygoing, letting me pick up any trash I come across. And I come across native turtles, who are wandering to and from nesting sites. It’s great to see that the park works in harmony with our wildlife.
I’m still detrashing around town, when time and weather permit. Detrashing is more of a lower body/lower back workout. So it balances the jobs well.
I’m fortunate to have a pension. This covers most of my expenses. I have savings to tap into, if needed, and I have investments that are mostly not growing much but not in the stock market too much so I don’t worry.
Learning not to worry about things that don’t warrant worry is one of the most important lessons of retirement
I’m fairly self sufficient. I see my neighbors and friends as potentially in need of my help.
There’s something to be said for sliding into accepting your mortality, too. I see news I don’t like to hear. It’s stuff I can’t fix. I’m not young anymore so I won’t be around for 30-40 years of a horror show economy.
PenguinColada@reddit
My husband and I give ourselves an allowance with each paycheck. I've been saving mine up to buy gold, silver, and precious gems for years now, because humans have lizard brains and like shiny things. I'm hoping that these things will retain their value when the paper dollar does not.
Mentally? I'm not prepared. I'm a trans man, my daughter is also trans. Seeing the state my country is in politically and recognizing that the law no longer matters is terrifying. I know it's been a slow build up to this point but I feel like it's just exploded in the past few months. Life is a whirlwind right now. My every instinct tells me to flee, but to where? The world is feeling the ripple and I can't get a passport.
Sorry_End3401@reddit
I send you and your family hugs
itsgoodpain@reddit
the OP asked in the subreddit directly related to the collapse of the world and specially the US
PocketsFullOf_Posies@reddit
My husband and I made a huge lifestyle change and sold our house and quit our jobs. Bought 40 acres of woodlands and built a cabin in a tiny town of only 150 people. Learning how to be more self-sufficient and creating redundancies in our everyday life so that collapse hopefully doesn’t upend our lives. Basically collapsing before the rush.
Sorry_End3401@reddit
This sounds lovely. Good luck. I hope one day to move to a co op community where redundancy is eliminated. Like does every house have to have so many appliances? No. Lawns? No. Skills? Yes. That benefit the people there on the super local micro level
pm_me_ur_ephemerides@reddit
In February 2025, I started looking for jobs overseas. I now have two offers, and I’m planning 1 week vacations in both countries. I am extremely fortunate to have a resume which makes me employable in those countries.
It does feel cowardly, but I have an infant and a 3 year old, and the risk to their future is too great.
NinjaRapGoGoGoGo@reddit
Mainly just trying to survive while wishing for death
HappyCamperDancer@reddit
I'm just glad I'm old. I probably won't see the worst of climate change or the collapse of the us gov't. As far as preps, I'm prepared for "tuesday not doomsday", and I thank god every day I didn't have children. When the the time comes, if I have to, I'll just kiss my ass goodbye.
Susanoos_Wife@reddit
These are some good, thought-provoking questions. I'll definitely have to think about this, I think doing so will help me further come to terms with my feelings regarding what's happening with society right now.
4BigData@reddit
I shifting from spending on what I see as unsustainable to spending only on climate change adaptation
each adaptation I get fone improves my resiliency and quality of life a lot. so cannot complain
my limit is my own imagination
NorthRoseGold@reddit
Preparing? Getting helium before it's gone
thirdeyevalhalla@reddit
My grandfather was a WW-II vet and a Great Depression paranoiac, and while he wasn't really a prepper I think he would have been if my grandma didn't force him to live in town near Buffalo and be a nice civil guy. I say this, because growing up around him taught me a lot about cycles and loops, meaning, his perspective would likely be relevant again someday.
I made the plunge to move to as remote of a place as I could find 15 years ago - not out of paranoia but out of a kind of intrinsic need for wildness, lots of dogs, and a lack of too many people. However, I've made some changes in the last few years mentally and on my property because I believe I am watching this environmental bubble about to pop.
Learn more about food - both nutrition and farming.
Learn more about how to make things from scratch.
Got an RN degree - not out of a desire to be a nurse but to know what's up when I need to do medical on myself or my small local community. Luckily, in my remote area I had a small tribal college that accepted me to study nursing there.
Responsible_Brain269@reddit
The whole planet will collapse, not just the USA.
astilba120@reddit
When will this romanticizing of the "middle class" be put to rest? In many ways it is the most parasitic of classes, and certainly have destroyed any chances of the working class to survive. They drive consumerism, demand low pay for essential workers so that prices do not go up, will scoop up cheap real estate to flip it, making housing inaccessible for the people who clean up after their mess. Within my lifetime I have seen tourist areas, which provided working class people an income, have to import seasonal workers because the people who used to do that work cannot afford to live on the wages provided. Sure, we blame corporations, but who grew the corporations? Certainly not the maintenance laborers who serve the middle class. Maybe it is time to redefine what we are talking about. There are plenty of people who call themselves middle class now, just because they do not make a million dollars a year, but what about the people who make less than 50k a year? People like teachers aids, maintenance workers in hospitals, hotels, office buildings. I support 4 people in a home I am still paying for on 50k a year. How? By refusing to get on the wheel of the middle class dream. I moved away from cities and suburbs, bought a manufactured home, had a basement instead of a foundation, keep my 4 acres semi cultivated, the rest left alone for nature, buy cheap used subarus from a good mechanic, do not borrow money to "upgrade", spending cash for needed repairs, for decades shopped only 2nd hand clothing stores, do not spend money for salons, cosmetics, new furniture, live simply, frugally, grow a lot of my own food. The middle class of yesteryear, which grew because of Unions for workers, is over, Reagan saw to that. Bigger homes, newer cars, remodeled kitchens and baths, swimming pools, credit cards, all fed to people as must haves is what made the fat cats fatter. Consumerism is what got us here, buying things we want, instead of what we need. My house is almost paid for, we eat very well, all our vehicles were bought with cash and last at least 4 years, and I have exactly 15 dollars on my credit balance, with 17 k in savings. For emergencies only. I am an American worker, I care for the disabled, and rent rooms in my home. My gardens are lovely, life is good. I get tired of people sitting on million dollar real estate, making triple digit incomes, defining themselves as middle class, they have merged into the ruling class, investing in markets that exploit everyone else.
Pot_Master_General@reddit
I worked for a group of surgeons who looked at people like dollar signs, yet saw themselves as poor victims trying to manage their multimillion dollar practice, which was the only gig in town.
A lot of the middle class jobs are going to young people who still live at home, or those who have other means of support. People coming out of retirement, too. It's a gimpy hodgepodge of the inexperienced, the Karens, and the apathetic who have experienced all too much.
Desperate_Cheetah249@reddit
It is not early as it started, by different opinions, somewhere between 1980 and 2010.
One could argue that Jan6 and reelection of 45/47 was the Rubicon moment for the US and the judicial, political and economic systems will never recover from it. But the election of that person was a result of long-running trends, some of which take roots even before the beginning of the "republic".
* Yes
* Yes, yes, yes.
* Yes and yes.
We've changed our lifestyle and now live on a sailboat we got for cheap without the engine and outfitted with an electric motor, which gives us both mobility and resilience (a month of water storage, solar power generation, a month worth of cooking gas, potential for getting your own food, ease of defending against intruders, etc), although does come with its own additional risks, primarily because of increase in extreme weather events. But boats are designed to survive storms so, with a little bit of luck and careful planning we should be fine and I feel like that is going to be nothing compared to risk management on land in \~5 years.
Otherwise-Product-60@reddit
Personally, I am interested in working on resisting the U.S. plunging into authoritarianism. This country is so powerful, nowhere is safe from a U.S. that wants to, say, reinvent some of the expansionist endeavors that led us into WW2.
That resistance, if it becomes widespread, could lead to the country fracturing, or indeed some form of civil war.
I tend to be philosophical about all this, as I believe we are just one bad agricultural year, globally, from things spiralling downhill very quickly. Virtually the entire world depends on the food grown and produced in one year. Livestock takes more than one year to raise, but if an entire herd dies from drought or drowns in a flood, for example, that year's production is lost. And all the years of prior investment are lost as well.
If we are all suddenly starving these political concerns will either be irrelevant or accelerated. (Just as Covid accelerated the U.S. veering away from the norms of civil society.)
Responsible adaptation, as you call it, is extremely difficult in an environment that denies the existence of a problem.
Mass public transit, universal basic income, banning most forms of tourism, weaning entirely off plastics, researching a replacement for artificial fertilizer, implementing sustainability economic models ... all these seem very far away, and I do not think we have that much time.
I am spending more time gardening, growing plants for native pollinators. Spending more time with my dogs and worrying less about retirement funds that I may not ever need.
pantsopticon88@reddit
Night vision, ceramic armor, training and stockpile food and ammunition.
duplicati83@reddit
Is a frogs' arse watertight?
ionalpha_@reddit
What I'm interested in is why is this forum still full of climate discourse when AI is an IMMEDIATE threat? I can't see how a forum about collapse would downplay such a thing when the stakes for being wrong are so high. Ahh well whatever who cares it's all going to shit anyway right!
Ra_Akkaniu@reddit
The general consensus of AI on this sub is that it requires so much infrastructure to run (massive data centers with global supply chains, lots of power production, heavy external investment due to poor short term profitability), that the timelines required to reach AGI/ASI will suffer from infrastructure collapse before reaching these points.
It depends what your AI timelines are, AI safety is important and generally ignored on this sub in favour of the anti-ai positions.
Proof_Register9966@reddit
This is a good point - I do think AI is worse than anyone expected. And, it has done considerable harm for the past 4 years.
ionalpha_@reddit
Couldn't give a shit about the consensus :) end of the world remember, don't care one bit one a single person thinks anymore. That's wrong btw we already have the infrastructure to replace the vast majority of knowledge workers.. but no, I'm talking about it so let's stop there shall we.
ThrowRA-4545@reddit
This is AI scramble, at least format before posting here. Try to have original thoughts, or backed up with evidence.