Leno's Law has Passed the CA Senate [In some form]

[-]

juwyro@reddit

If the cars still have to pass emissions for their year does that actually change anything done currently?

[-]

TempleSquare@reddit

From the way I'm reading it, it needs to pass the emissions standards from the year that the car came out.

I can't help but think that, say, a 1979 car had a much easier time passing smog to 1979 then it did in 1999 or 2019.

So the car would be judged by the 1979 smog rules, since it's a 1979 car.

Am I reading that right?

[-]

stoned-autistic-dude@reddit

So I still need to source a 35 year old catalytic converter? Just like I have to source a 20 year old car today? So… it’s the same thing.

[-]

Honest question, why would you source a new old-stock cat when having a modern cat fabbed in at an exhaust shop is an option? That's what I did with my old Miata when I put an exhaust setup on it. I can't imagine you're required to use the specific OEM part as long as what you install meets or exceeds the original specifications.

[-]

stoned-autistic-dude@reddit

New was $2,200 plus tax, used was $650. Used is in great condition. To make a cat, they’d need to cut the old flanges off my original cat to make it and I use my original (now hollow) cat as a test pipe bc the shape acts like a resonator to reduce exhaust volume. The OEM S2000 cat breathes really well with a very efficient design whereas a fabricated cat will be more restrictive.

[-]

frozentime4@reddit

I may be wrong but we need the CARB sticker and EO number or something like that.

[-]

RedlyrsRevenge@reddit

Correct. It has to be approved for that specific year, make and model to be legal to install. A 49-state legal cat will do the same job but, someone at CARB didn't get their palms greased to give it an EO number.

[-]

Slideways@reddit

The vehicle is judged by its engine, which could not be older than what was originally installed, and you couldn't put a truck engine in a car. So, for example, a 1979 Mustang with a Coyote swap would have to pass smog as if it were a Mustang GT that had originally been equipped with that Coyote V8.

[-]

kinkycarbon@reddit

But will they allow a truck engine in a car? Same could be said for putting motorcycle engines in small cars. I’m pretty sure they’ll refer to the section where said engine must be the engine used in the vehicle it came with.

The rule itself leaves a giant hole to allow swapping to a 2JZ or modern K20 for 900 horsepower in a smog exemption vehicle under classic designation.

[-]

kinkycarbon@reddit

Based on that interpretation. It effectively means the vehicle needs to pass smog to get the exception even if non operating and brought back into compliance.

[-]

juwyro@reddit

I thought that was already the case though. It's a fair rule for the standard it needs to pass, but as the cars get older the parts are nearly impossible to find or very expensive.

I thought the spirit of the law was supposed to let classics be exempt from the emissions testing after a certain age. After 30+ years there's so few of them and most likely driven so little that they barely contribute to overall emissions.

[-]

Familiar_Air3528@reddit

So it’s weird. The listed change falls under the part about exemptions to the biennial smog testing. So it would certainly imply that vehicles under this category are exempt from periodic smog testing.

My guess is that the purpose is twofold:

Give CARB and the DMV broader authority on these vehicles, by letting them set some kind of separate standard for them, rather than a blanket exemption
The purpose may be to have the vehicles pass ONE inspection and then be provided the exception, rather than the original law as written, which originally implied you can be exempt without ever having the car inspected. This may be to deter false registrations, or to deter people from driving just completely emissions gutted vehicles.

So now, if passed, it ultimately comes down to California agencies enacting their policies. If CARB and the DMV want to nuke this law, they technically have the ability to continue enforcing current standards, even if the law passes. Hopefully that is not the case, but I could easily see the legislature passing this law for a “win” with constituents and then CARB/DMV setting harsh standards anyway, out of spite.

[-]

Particular_Flower111@reddit

How does this apply to cars that never came with emissions equipment (JDM/Euro imports). Those cars are already extremely difficult to register in California

[-]

seamus_mc@reddit

That was always the case. Otherwise every new stricter generation would eliminate everything prior.

[-]

_Banned_User@reddit

I read that to mean no more visual exam. If what comes out the tailpipe is clean enough for the year of manufacture, you are good to go. Let the LS swapped world begin. Also goodbye smog-era carbs and hello full EFI.

[-]

jimbofranks@reddit

Yes. The standards were much more relaxed in the past.

[-]

BiglyBirdWuzHere@reddit

Meh, it's easier to just register in Montana

[-]

TempleSquare@reddit

I don't think that's a smart game plan for California. The state is really good at finding cheats.

Heck, even Utah is cracking down hard on people doing the Montana registration thing, because of air quality issues.

[-]

XMAN2YMAN@reddit

The cars that take ad of this loophole are not what’s causing the air quality issues. These are old collector cars or very high end cars that get driven very rarely.

[-]

OoIIoO@reddit

By rich people.

[-]

XMAN2YMAN@reddit

Not everyone that drives an old car is rich but I’m sure a large percentage that do take advantage of this are richer than average.

[-]

BiglyBirdWuzHere@reddit

They never bother me . They're only going after expensive supercars for the tax revenue.

[-]

Particular_Flower111@reddit

Yeah the state might not be happy that you’re “cheating” smog, but they care way more about losing out on tac revenue and registration fees

[-]

J-MAMA@reddit

Or Florida, Washington...

Hell, there are even counties in CA that only require a one time smog test upon registration to an address in the county.

[-]

OoIIoO@reddit

Jfc that reminded of the time I had a hard time registering my car I bought from a few counties over, because SMOG.

[-]

2Drogdar2Furious@reddit

I thought they have been targeting people for that?

[-]

deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

[-]

AutoModerator@reddit

Policy discussion is welcome. However, if your post involves politics AND CARS, please consider submitting to /r/CarsOffTopic.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[-]

Vanzmelo@reddit

The way enthusiasts and publications are hyper focused on this bill is dumb. It’s hyper niche and just for collector cars and doesn’t actually change anything

[-]

Deeceness@reddit

Great news for Montana.

[-]

rational_overthinker@reddit

I live in Los Angeles and I dont know if this is bullshit or not but I had a really hard time finding a smog shop that would test my 1977 G10 Chevy Van. I went to no less than 3 shops and every time they said " we dont have the software on our machines to test something this old, you'll have to find another shop"

This entire bill may be pointless if the state makes it harder for shops to even test these older vehicles

Just a thought...

[-]

kinkycarbon@reddit

CARB is aware people are having issues with smog for using the rolling road system. There’s only one company providing the parts for the system. It’s that bad some businesses are refusing to smog those vehicles. They may phase it out entirely over the next few decades because these vehicles become a lower percentage contributing smog to the environment.

[-]

sixtninecoug@reddit

Ditto. My 1994 Mustang is getting harder to smog because nobody wants to do OBDI anymore. Full CARB EO numbers on all the parts. AFR Heads, Motorsport headers, basically a clone of the SVO package that was available through dealers at the time. Even the cool SVO intake.

Mustang passes completely legit. I only drive the fucking thing like 1000 miles a year. It sucks that I gotta jump through these hoops every two years when I probably fart more emissions over that time period than the car is responsible for.

[-]

PPVSteve@reddit

Even before lenos law this issue was being worked on.

State may take over some of the older car testing and authorize a few contractors to do the rest. So not every station will need to do them and be required to keep up the equipment. Will probly lead to a few super centers in each area, appointments to do your car and a farther travel distance to get a test. And I imagine even more expensive per test.

Still about 600,000 cars in CA that still need the tests.

[-]

INFAMOUSMACIAS00@reddit

That provision sounds like it would be a one time inspection when you first want to convert the car to smog exempt but who knows, I doubt the dmv itself would want to constantly be doing visual inspections so if it were to become a biannual visual inspection it would probably rest in the hands of smog shops which would then be voided by illegal inspection passes so the state would have nothing to gain

[-]

orangutanDOTorg@reddit

I went special construct a few years ago with sb100 exemption and will likely never go back

[-]

jingforbling@reddit

Am I the only one reading this and thinking, now they have a an excuse to make smog testing more expensive because the they need to track different standards?

[-]

sixtninecoug@reddit

So if we still have to smog them for their year, what the fuck did the law change?

They already had to do that right? I have a 94 Mustang that I smog, it passes, but there’s zero chance it’s required to meet 2025 standards.

This bill was a ray of hope for lots of us and now what the fuck did it even do? This is some bullshit.

[-]

Deeceness@reddit

Hey, thanks for the update! Even if it’s not as strong as we hoped, it’s still a big deal that it made it through the Senate. I’m cautiously optimistic, but yeah, the DMV clause seems like a pretty big loophole. Fingers crossed the Assembly doesn’t water it down more.

[-]

Bonerchill@reddit

Adding onto my comment in the last thread, this also fails to address California’s ludicrous importation standards that require lab testing prior to assigning a California title- even for pre-1976 vehicles.

To me, that law is protectionism for existing collectors and disallows normal Californians from importing less expensive collector cars from Europe. There is an ever-diminishing pool of good, unmolested cars from which buyers can choose, and the state of California added $10k+ to any purchase.

Meanwhile, any Fresno resident can import a straight-piped, 572-powered Chevelle from any of the other 49 states.

It’s unfair.

[-]

Immediate-Report-883@reddit

I think that provisions for compliance is that the vehicle has all the required/non -modified emissions equipment in place, but doesn't necessarily require it be optimally functioning. IE you have to have a visually correct cat converter, but they aren't going to check to see if it's not hollow. Basically you intend for it to be able to pass, without actually sniffing it. So throwing non-carb approved parts, removing emissions components all together still isn't going to work. But you aren't going to have to lean it out to the point of being undrivable either anymore.

[-]

Cryosanth@reddit

Great news for Montana.

[-]

kingkodus66@reddit

I guess i continue ignoring car laws then.

[-]

AutoModerator@reddit

It looks like you're posting about a currently popular topic. Your submission has been automatically removed and forwarded to moderators for review. If your post is about Tesla or Olympian, please see this thread for details. See r/TeslaMotors and r/RealTesla for indepth discussion. Want to prognosticate about car prices? Head on over here. YES, WE WILL REVIEW YOUR POST AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. NO, YOU ARE NOT ON A BLACKLIST. You do not need to send us modmail immediately. Your call is very important to us and will be answered in the order it was received. No, seriously, we're all volunteers. We'll get to it as soon as possible. In the meantime, please check r/cars/new to see if there is a discussion already underway.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.