Can someone please explain your school system to me? I just don’t get it.
Posted by Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit | AskABrit | View on Reddit | 477 comments
Hi!
In the U.S., a public school is the school that’s free to attend if you live in the area and it’s funded fully by the government. Private school means you pay to go there, and it’s selective.
In the UK it seems a private school is our equivalent to a public school? Or something like that? I don’t get it.
Also what are GSCE’s and A levels and O levels?
Do you have 1st through 12th grade too? Elementary, middle and high school? Or how are your school ages/levels separated?
Thank you!
jonathanemptage@reddit
I'll break it down for you a private or public school are paid for the one that's free is called a state school because it funded by the state. So our private schools are also public schools.
We start school at age 4 in class R and then go up to year 1, Year 2 etc etc all the way up to year 6 when we turn 11. we will do a SAT at the end of the school year when we turn 11 and then we will leave the primary school and move to secondary school that September ( the school year runs from september to the middle of July).
Secondary schools tart in year 7 in the academic year when you turn 12 and for the next couple of years not a lot changes you get a bit more homework you study a range of subjects English Math and Science are what they call core subjects. Other subjects often include Art, Languages, CDT including cooking, Music and Drama IT,History and Geography. Then you get to year 9 here you take your GCSE options you will have a range of subjects you can choose you must take English Maths and Science but any subject you didn't like you can drop and choose ones you do like there likley will be options you didn't do in year 7 or 8 that you can choose I wont list them all here because there are loads but you choose 4. From year 10-11 you start your GCSE courses then in May of the academic year you turn 16 you take your GCSE exams.
The GCSE's take place between May and June you are tested on the 3 core subject and your 4 options hopefully getting good enough marks for your post 16 options. I should mention the O levels at this point they are old qualifications and were replaced by the GCSE.
So now it gets a bit confusing you have a few options once you have done your GCSE you can do A levels.
A-levels you do these over 2 years you take 4 subjects and often drop one after one year the first year of these are called year 12 and the exams after year 1 are Called AS levels the ones you do a the end of the second year or year 13 are called A2 and AS and A2 will form 1 A level.
T level Gemmni says A T Level is a two-year technical qualification available in England for 16-19 year olds, designed to give them a head start in their chosen career. They are broadly equivalent to three A Levels, but with a strong focus on practical skills and industry experience
The International Baccalaureate (IB) is a non-profit educational foundation that offers a continuum of four challenging, high-quality educational programmes for students aged 3 to 19. It was established in Geneva, Switzerland, in 1968, with the aim of providing an internationally recognized standard of education that fosters intercultural understanding and respect, and develops inquiring, knowledgeable, and caring young people. (again from Gemmni)
BTEC there are a number of these but I'm going to explaint he most common. The extended diploma this similar to the t level is a vocational qualification while you do have exams most assessment is done nia course work or in class tests your work experience will be shorter than ina t level and a BTEC in genrally broader in scope.
All these courses will give you ucas points which is what you need for university you'll use predicted grades to fill out a UCAS form and you can apply to 5 universities you'll get either conditional or unconditional offer or rejection from those universities depending on your predicted grades and a strong PS does really help.
Most courses at uni are honours degrees grades 1st, 2:1 2:2 (most common) and 3rd you usually spend 3 years studying these courses I''l give you a link to help illustrate this to you in the drop down you'll see the option of a foundation year which requires less points for entry. I could go really in depth about uni but that's the general gist
anabsentfriend@reddit
Public schools are fee paying private schools.
What is a public school
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
I read you link AND my only question is:
“ Though most public schools were originally founded under true charitable purposes for poor pupils, by the modern age conversely they have become elite institutions and are associated with the ruling class.”
Why is this so? What happened. I think that’s what confusing people who live in the US.
We have two types of schools. Public which no one pays to attend and private where tuition is charged.
erinoco@reddit
Basically: most schools in Britain before the nineteenth century, apart from those offering an elementary education in parishes, were founded by wealthy benefactors and provided with an endowment. The benefactors could be royalty or nobles, but were frequently wealthy people with a connection to the locality, or guilds.
Normally, these schools were set up so that children (almost always boys) within the locality who met the requirements could be educated for free or at reduced fees. But several schools also allowed boys to attend from further afield if their families could pay the requisite fees. Some schools took in boarders, gradually concentrated their resources on the fee payers rather than the local scholars, and built up national reputations as places of learning - and this is how the leading public schools emerged. (In some cases, the school's authorities eventually ended up creating another less prestigious sibling school to carry out the original intention of the founders - for instance, Harrow eventually created the John Lyon School and Rugby the Lawrence Sheriff School.)
In other cases, the schools remained closer to their original intent. These schools stayed day schools and concentrated on local boys. These schools often developed into the well-regarded local grammar schools. There were many factors which determined whether an endowed school developed into a public school or remained a grammar school; but the specific legal requirements of the endowment were often important. That's why "public schools" are known as such - their endowment allowed for wider pupil recruitment.
While the line between the two has always been fuzzy, you had a clear social and cultural difference between the two kinds of endowed school.
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
Okay so you are saying they are “public” only in name and theory but not in practice.
erinoco@reddit
They are "public" in the sense that any family could pay for a child to attend them, rather than being told that they couldn't qualify because they weren't local, or weren't a family in the trade (or whatever qualification was in the original endowment). The term arose before the various Acts of Parliament from 1870 onwards which gradually created the modern state education system, with free and compulsory education.
The traditional public schools were largely unaffected by the creation of compulsory education, so they retained the term, and various terms such as "state school" emerged to describe the schools offering free education. Some of the other endowed schools which had remained local grammar schools were eventually absorbed into the state system. Others offered places where the local authority effectively paid the fees for the children - the "direct grant" schools. This system was abolished in the 1970s, and most of the schools became fee-paying day schools, although a few did join the state sector.
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
First off, thank you so much for breaking this down I understand it better now.
Now this opens an entirely new line of questioning for me.
I’m somewhat aware of how currently the older families in the UK often synonymous with “elite” have been struggling to generate enough income relative to the inherited land/ estates. From my observations the UK takes class way more seriously than the US.
So my new line of questioning has more to do with “unusual circumstances”.
Has there ever been a case or reported instance where someone from an older elite family attended a prestigious public school for free. By that I just mean their family was not directly responsible for paying for their education. The reason I’m asking is because I’m trying to understand the class system there same as OP and I’m trying to see if I have a good handle on how the class system functions in practice.
I am asking this question based on the assumption that even if a family did not bring in a high enough income their social status and aristocratic status supersedes their actual income. The idea being that all aristocrats much be educated in line with tradition.
erinoco@reddit
It's a question definitely worth asking: my answer would be that elite families did (and do) try and gain access to schools as scholars, which would normally mean a reduction. However, in several schools, the actual reduced or waived fees paid by scholars would depend on your family circumstances, as determined by the school authorities, so rich families wouldn't be able to get away with paying nothing in terms of tuition.
From a landed family's perspective, primogeniture made a difference to education. Whereas the eldest son would inherit estates, and probably wouldn't have to work for a living, younger sons would need to enter a suitable profession, barring a fortunate marriage, and so they would need good education. (And, in the present day, even eldest sons are expected to be able to enter the working world, even if they are going to inherit wealth in the future.)
From the school's perspective - Eton is an example. It is, to the present day, divided between 'King's Scholars' - the successors to the poor scholars the school was set up to educate - and 'Oppidans' (derived from the Latin for town dwellers), the boys who pay the bigger fees. (Oppidans are so called because, unlike the Scholars who boarded in the College, they live in boarding houses around Eton town.) Although you still had the occasional King's Scholar who came from a modest backgrounds, most King's Scholars for the past two or three centuries have been broadly of the same social class as their wealthier peers. Sir Robert Walpole, often seen as the first PM, came from a well-off Norfolk landed family, but was a King's Scholar (even though his father lied about his age to qualify him for the distinction). The most recent Etonian PM, Boris Johnson, was also a KS.
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
Hi, I’ve been gone for 7 days and not voluntarily 😅.
Thank you so much for explaining this, I just saw it. This gives me all the info I need to dig deeper into the class system there. I did not know about King’s Scholars nor that Boris Johnson was one. This puts in perspective for me even more!
Fantastic_Deer_3772@reddit
I think one thing to understand is that when an aristocrat complains about not having enough money, they're overstating things massively. It generally just means they're annoyed that their house is expensive.
The schools do have scholarships, but this probably wouldn't be a use for them - the family (or someone they know) would pay.
LionLucy@reddit
Because in the past (say 150 years ago or more), children (mostly boys) were either educated privately which meant their parents paid a tutor to come to their house and teach them, or they paid to send them to a public school that was open to anyone. So, by the time the government and the church stepped in to offer schooling to anyone, funded by tax payers, the term “public school” already had a meaning so they had to call them something else (state schools)
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
Why is this so difficult 😂. I’ve had it explained so many times. Thanks for trying. I just give up at this point.
Let me see if I can understand.
So you’re saying that at some point public schools were “open to anyone” but some people couldn’t afford them ? So by default only wealthy people went there.
Marcellus_Crowe@reddit
Right, there are lots of public things that are open to anyone that many people can't afford. Disney Land is open to the public, it isn't a private park, but not everyone can afford to go.
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
Yes, got it this makes sense! I can see what happened is that the US took a word that meant something in Uk and sort of converted its meaning.
Marcellus_Crowe@reddit
Pretty much!
By the looks of things the situation was very similar in the US initially. Public schools were funded by donations and tuition fees when they first started out, however it quickly became a unanimous decision across the States to fund them via taxes.
So, even today, in reality, public schools are paid for by the public in the USA, its just via tax instead of a direct tuition fee.
StefanJanoski@reddit
Yes you have to cast your mind back to a time when schools as we know them now didn’t yet exist. If you were rich and wanted an education for your children, you paid a private tutor to come to you. Otherwise, your kid just learned a trade and went off to work or whatever.
At some point somebody decided to open public schools, public in the sense that anyone could apply to go there. But you still had to be accepted either under a scholarship or via a donation.
A long time later, schools came along which anyone could attend without paying a fee. The term “public school” had become established for those original, prestigious institutions, a bit like Russell Group or Ivy League universities. So schools which were funded by the state without a fee are called state schools.
Today, state schools are where 94% of pupils go. “Public schools” are those very old, prestigious, expensive, posh fee-paying schools such as Eton. There are plenty of other fee-paying schools which are usually referred to as private schools or independent schools (they’re independent from following the national curriculum, so they have more say in what/how to teach)
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
I finally get it! thank you so much for explaining this. You guys literally carried me across the finish line. 😂 I think what was always missing from my understanding was the historical context and once I had that piece it finally made sense.
LionLucy@reddit
Yes exactly! It’s public the way any business is public - a restaurant or a hotel. It’s not a private member’s club, it’s open to anyone who can pay.
Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit (OP)
Thank you! That’s what confuses me too!
Front-Pomelo-4367@reddit
Public schools started out as schooling for the public that wasn't hiring tutors to come to your house (which was how the wealthy were educated). Anyone could go to a public school so long as fees were paid, and the original aim was usually for some/most of the students to be local and in poverty. Nowadays, because those schools are so old, they're inherently more prestigious than normal private schools (still fee-paying, but cheaper and set up more recently) and definitely more prestigious than state schools (free, taxpayer-funded)
Christ's Hospital School is a great example - founded like 500 years ago as a charitable school, and now it's £30k per year full price and has a weird uniform. Ditto for Eton - founded about 600 years ago to educate the poor boys of Windsor, now about £60k per year full price and with slightly less weird uniforms
(I had a friend who went to private school - founded in the 1980s, £9k per year. That's the kind of difference we're talking between public and private schools)
AttentionOtherwise80@reddit
There is actually quite a difference between Eton College (school) which the Royal Princes, William and Harry attended https://www.etoncollege.com/
And Christs Hospital (school) https://www.christs-hospital.org.uk/
rosemaryscrazy@reddit
Okay so I caved and used Chat GPT.
The term "public school" in the UK can indeed be confusing, as it refers to what many would consider private schools. The historical reason behind this term is that these schools were originally established to serve the public in a broader sense than just the local community, unlike local parish schools of the time.
Historical Origins: Public schools emerged in the late Middle Ages as places of education for boys who were primarily from wealthy families. At that time, the term "public" signified that they were open to any member of the public who could afford to pay for their education, as opposed to being limited to the clergy or local guild schools.
Over time, the term "public school" became entrenched in the British education system. Despite their private nature in terms of funding and exclusivity, they retained the name due to tradition and the historical context in which they were established.
PolarBear091@reddit
I’ve taught in the US and UK, so feel well placed to compare:
• US “Public School” = UK State / Comprehensive School
• US Private School = UK Private School (in that you pay fees)
• Historic Private School in the U.K. = UK Public School (can also be known as “Colleges” as well, to add to the confusion, though the U.K. is far from alone in this)
• UK Grammar School = non-fee paying school that is selective by entrance exam. Can also be private these days.
• UK does 14 years of school (Reception (age 4) Y1-Y11 (age 5-16), plus Y12 and Y13 which are also called Lower and Upper Sixth or “The Sixth Form” together (age 17 and 18)
• Generally for US schools you’ll have Elementary School (Grades Kindergarten to 4th), then Middle School (5-8th Grade) and High School (9-12th). Whereas for the U.K. you’ll have Primary School (R-Y6) and Secondary School (Y7-13). Sometimes the final two years of Secondary School can be completed at a 6th Form College for just years 12 and 13 (they begin at age 16, and leave when they have turned 18).
• GCSEs are public exams that you do in 8+ school class subjects aged 15-16 or during Years 10 and 11. They are the minimum qualification and are all “Honors” level classes, equivalent to a High School Graduation in the USA. Once you have finished GCSEs, you are allowed to leave full time education in the U.K. provided you are now doing some training, apprenticeships, or employment.
• O Levels are the old name for GCSEs, but are still used in Commonwealth nations.
• A levels are 2 year courses you complete during Years 12 and 13, but you do not have to do them. They are equivalent to AP Classes in America, but you sit public exams for them at the end of the year. Sometimes they are split into AS Levels (end of Y12) and sometimes just all at the end of the 2 year courses (A2). They are very hard but are required for entrance into UK Universities.
University admission in the U.K. is very weird for Americans- you specialise in what you study very early on, e.g. if you are studying a Bachelor’s in Engineering, you don’t have to do any university classes in, say, Creative Writing like you would as part of a Gen Ed requirement in the US. You start your “major” on day one and your first year just needs to be passed, it doesn’t count until year 2.
Additionally, you are offered a conditional place at a U.K. University if you are to receive a set of grades at A Level, e.g. you have a place at the University of Exeter to study English if you receive 3 A grades in your A Levels (likely including English Language or Literature as one of them). But you won’t find out the results of your grades until August, when you are likely going to university that September/October - which is intense if you think about it! If you don’t make the grades, you have a second choice university, known as your “Insurance” Choice, and if you fail to make the grades there, you go into “Clearing” or whatever is left!
As a teacher who has taught both the U.K. and US systems, the US system is easier to understand and teach to, but most exam questions are multiple choice, and the fact that you have to graduate high school with a well rounded education means I think the US system is more well rounded, but less in depth. In the U.K., you don’t have to do math(s) after age 16, for example, but you specialise much earlier, and the amount of public exams you do is insane. But, because Americans have admission to their university locked in by, say October, they definitely mentally “check out” much earlier than Year 13s do in the U.K. (they do so around June once A Levels are done).
Hope that is helpful!
ArcadiaNoakes@reddit
"Generally for US schools you’ll have Elementary School (Grades Kindergarten to 4th), then Middle School (5-8th Grade) and High School (9-12th)."
Correction: Elementary in the US is K-5, middle is 6-8.
Material-Theory3031@reddit
applies to England and Wales, Scotland is slightly different
GoldFreezer@reddit
To add to point 8, there is a much greater range of subjects available at GCSE, although those are among the most common. The only compulsory subjects are English, Maths and Science, and the school has to teach Religious Studies up to age 16 and usually has the students take that as a GCSE but they don't legally have to. Every school makes its own decisions about what other subjects to require students to take, and students in Wales have to take a GCSE in Welsh as well.
Crowfooted@reddit
Yeah, I'm 32 now so I don't know how it's changed since I was at school, but I didn't do history or geography at GCSE level, instead it was art and IT. But everything else checks out.
Dutch_Slim@reddit
I’m 43. At my school a humanities subject (history or geography) was compulsory. As was RE - either the full GCSE if you took it as an option or the short course/half GCSE if you just did the mandatory lessons. Also had to take at least one language.
Crowfooted@reddit
I remember having to take at least one language but I didn't have to take a humanities, unless IT or art is considered humanities somehow, not sure how that works.
GoldFreezer@reddit
I'm 38 and I didn't take them either, I wanted to do Drama and two languages which used up all my option blocks.
IAmLaureline@reddit
Schools don't have you teach RE as a lesson until 16. One of my kids dropped it after year 9, the wee heathen.
I assume they have to provide the vague content through the assemblies and PHSE?
Material-Theory3031@reddit
they get round it in some schools with citizenship and other such subjects - my son's school dropped official RE lessons too - but my daughter's didnt (and funnily enough even though sh'd have never chosen it, it was her highest graded GCSE).
GoldFreezer@reddit
Maybe that's true! I know the guidance says they have to provide it and every inspection at every school I've ever been at, they've bollocked us for not providing it enough lol.
IAmLaureline@reddit
I never saw it picked up in at my kids' school and it got two 'Good with outstanding bits' in our time.
Odd!
GoldFreezer@reddit
Perhaps Wales is more into religion than England? 🤔 Something I never considered.
IAmLaureline@reddit
Could be!
Material-Theory3031@reddit
sorry that wasn't meant to be a comprehensive list - just examples of the subjects that are most likely.
Many schools are restrictive about what subjects can be chosen, for a variety of reasons, timetabling, teacher availability, E-Bac subjects ranking schools higher in league tables etc.
Maths & English are compulsory and most schools insist on at least double science, a language and Religious Studies (because they have to teach it anyway).
Most academy schools in my area are very results and league table driven and will preselect Maths, English language, English Lit, Religion, double/triple science - then the student can chose between French and Spanish because they have to do a modern forgeign language, then one between history and geography and one from a wider list - media studies, art, music, sociology, drama, film studies, computer science, PE, another language or the other from history/geography. It is really restrictive and means that arty students cant do music and art at GCSE level.
I appreciate that there will always be schools that offer a wider choice to their students and won't always make children do a language etc - but this list was a generalisation of English/Welsh system.
I work in education and this is fairly normal - give or take the odd subject/option
wxterlilies@reddit
My friend repeated year 11 :) it was his decision though. I'm not sure of the specifics but it does happen. I'm assuming it just can't be forced upon you?
reverse_mango@reddit
Adding to clarify to people that the only mandatory GCSEs nationwide are English Language, Maths and Science (either Triple or Combined). Some schools make certain subjects mandatory (like English Literature) but the rest are generally up to the pupil.
crucible@reddit
Welsh is also a compulsory GCSE here in Wales.
Helen_forsdale@reddit
I have a really dumb question. When you study Welsh as a subject in Wales but it's your first language are you doing the kind of tasks we'd do in English as a subject in Australia e.g. reading and analysing books and plays. You're not literally learning the language like you would in French or something? And how does that work across the state? I know there's people with Welsh as their first language all over but understand it's far less common in Cardiff compared to Blaneau Ffestiniog for example.
Izzy_Red@reddit
Hello! First language Welsh speaker here, from North Wales (where most Welsh speaking people are). Wales isn't a state - it's a country, and all over the country, Welsh is taught in every single school, and it is mandatory, like English would be. There are two different kinds of Welsh taught in schools.
In English-medium schools, all subjects are taught in English, and you study Welsh in the same way you might study French. You learn the fundamentals, the things you might need to get about ('Where are the toilets?', 'My name is', 'I live in', 'How are you?' We typically begin these lessons from our very first year of school as small children. What's known as 'incidental Welsh' is also used throughout the day, and staff are encouraged to use it regularly even if they don't speak Welsh ('da iawn' instead of 'very good', for example).
In a Welsh-medium school (secondary school/high school, specifically), Welsh is your default language. You are not allowed here to speak English, because it's a Welsh language environment. All students here will be fluent Welsh speakers, except in cases of rare and extenuating circumstances. The only class in which you will be permitted to speak English is in English lessons, which is similar to what you would expect from an English-medium school. Grammar, literature, et cetera. In Welsh lessons, you do much the same thing, but in Welsh. Remember, students here are fluent Welsh speakers, so they don't necessarily need to learn what non-fluent speakers would. Instead, we hone grammar, mutations, syntaxes, communication, writing (creatively and critically) and generally the mechanisms for using the language - just like in English Language classes.
I hope that helps!
Helen_forsdale@reddit
Yes it does! So basically "Welsh" as a subject is mandatory for all but the way it's taught is entirely different based on wether you're in a Welsh or English school? Is there a hard and fast line or border as to which schools are Welsh and which are english? Are all schools in the north Welsh speaking? Or do some towns have an English school and a Welsh school?
Dros-ben-llestri@reddit
Correct
A school will be classified as one or the other (or bilingual - with some pupils going through Eng and some through Welsh). Depending on the town there may be one or two schools - but if you want Welsh education the local authority should provide access - eg they will provide a bus to your nearest Welsh school if it isn't walkable distance, even if the English school is closer.
I believe one county - Gwynedd - doesn't have any English language primary schools (3-11yo), and is phasing out its secondary English schools.
reverse_mango@reddit
That’s fairly cool :)
GrinningD@reddit
I (in England) could choose 3+1 language GCSEs
My son's (in Wales) could choose 2 (or 1+1 language) GCSEs
So it really depends on if you want to stay in Wales or not.
Laelegs@reddit
Just to add in Worcestershire we have a three tier school system so primary R-4 , middle 5 - 8 and high school 9-13. Blew my husband's mind when he moved here from down south.
GrinningD@reddit
2 - "not as posh" - half the kids in my private school were the children of builders and electricians. My dad worked on oil rigs. Posh don't mean what it used to mean.
DifficultSport5110@reddit
So sixth form/college - the name 6th form refers to year 12+13 16-18 year olds and is usually attached or part of a secondary school. A college or sixth form college is its own school just for 16-18 year olds. You could study an apprenticeship or btec (usually skills based) or an A level. Whether you say sixth form or college can be a class/regional difference. Eg. In my county there weren't many sixth forms attached to state schools, only private schools so we called it college generally whereas everyone I went to uni with called it sixth form
will-je-suis@reddit
German is also offered quite a lot
Some areas of the UK have a slightly different system with middle schools
There's a nice diagram here in the terminology section https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-tier_education
Crustacean-2025@reddit
The three tier system, to my mind, is ideal as it broadly aligns with most kids’ developmental stage. I went to secondary actually aged 10, but there were 18 year olds ‘in the playground’ with us as the school had a sixth form.
It makes far more sense to start secondary at 12-13, and to separate out the juniors (8-12) from infants (4-7) but I do understand that requires 3 school sites, 3 lots of admin etc, not 2.
I’m not sure but I believe only parts of Dorset do 3 tier in England, now?
will-je-suis@reddit
I think bits of Bedfordshire and Isle of Wight do too
themuleskinner@reddit
Regarding point (12), why don't students repeat or get held back? It seems that if a child is struggling or not doing well in certain classes or may have some sort of learning disability, then they are continually falling further and further behind as they move through the grades
Material-Theory3031@reddit
they're given additional support with their peers
RegularWhiteShark@reddit
Maybe it’s changed since but I was in school with someone who was held back a year (I’m 32 now).
Crustacean-2025@reddit
There was a time when it was practically impossible to hold a kid back in England, early 2000s for definite. If you decided to send them to school in the term after they turned 5 (the law), they’d do straight into Y1, bypassing Reception altogether, which is not ideal.
Of my two, one effectively ‘repeated’ Y12 as his immaturity (late May born) meant he underperformed at GCSE, picked random, too hard A levels so we changed tack, he abandoned A levels, did a BTEC, went to uni aged 19 (software engineering), got a First. He should have repeated R which is what we and his teachers all would have wished, along with all of the other summer born boys in his class!
Second (early May) did okay but luckily did an Art Foundation year (Y14, effectively) so went to uni at 19, too.
I understand that one can now defer a year, but I don’t know about repeating.
RegularWhiteShark@reddit
No, it was 2000/2001 when the boy I knew was held back a year. He was the year above us but was put in our year. This was Wales, not England.
Not related but he sadly died in 2003 of meningitis.
Material-Theory3031@reddit
I think it can happen to the occasional child who has additional needs - but it is not like USA where they can be held back for failing
IAmLaureline@reddit
Addendum to your point 5.
Some church schools select on church attendance/baptism but not all. I suspect all Catholic ones do. In my area most Church of England ones do not select on church attendance or baptism.
Material-Theory3031@reddit
I think that they have to for a percentage if they want to retain their church status but it is often the case that there arent as many faith based applicants as there are places available and so the non-faith applicants are ranked based on siblings and distance etc like other schools
IAmLaureline@reddit
That's not the case for Church of England primary schools. Some do not give any weight to faith in admissions policies at all.
In my area most CoE schools do not consider faith at all in admissions policies. They remain CoE schools.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
In many areas, especially rurally, the ONLY primary school option is a C of E school! In an ideal world, the state would finance and control all such schools but it’d cost a fortune to ‘buy’ out such schools from the Church.
But most of such schools only pay a nod to religion. It’s a hymn and a prayer twice a week and grace before lunch, and that’s it.
Shevyshev@reddit
This is about the most comprehensive summary I’ve seen. Thanks for spelling it all out!
Just a follow-ups: is there a historical or some other reason for 6th form? For instance, was there once a first form and fifth form?
Also, can you stop at GCSEs and decline to pursue A-levels?
Crustacean-2025@reddit
Year numberings are, or were - weird in England, so ‘Sixth Form’ is an anachronism. I started secondary in ‘73 aged 11 into First Form, then second, third to fifth form (15-16) THEN into the Lower Sixth, then Upper Sixth 🤷🏽♀️ , but I recall in some of my ancient textbooks (school supplied) previous pupils and year group/class would state ‘Mary Smith, UIVE (upper fourth, class E) so no idea how that worked!
I think all state schools use R, Y1-11 (4-16) now, but Y12/13 isn’t used so much, even ‘Lower Sixth/Upper Sixth’ not so much especially at Sixth Form college as those denote which of the two years of A level you’re in, but Sixth Form Colleges often offer BTECs, T levels, other vocational courses, GCSE retakes etc as well, that don’t fit into that LVI/UVI thing, so you’d say ‘I’m in my second year at Sixth Form’
IAmLaureline@reddit
You can do something other than A levels after GCSEs.
BTECs are common - can be three subjects or one larger extended qualification that counts as three.
BTECs and other alternative qualifications can count for university entrance. The uni admissions body UCAS has a table of points conversion so you know what is equivalent to what.
Caveman1214@reddit
Northern Ireland is also different..
InevitablyCyclic@reddit
Just to add O level stood for Ordinary level. A level is Advanced level. There are some other more obscure ones that most people don't/didn't take like AO (Additional Ordinary) S (Supplementary) and probably more.
GCSE stands for General Certificate of Secondary Education.
Two other big differences from US high school:
1) The exams are set by an external board and marked by outside examiners. Pleading with teachers or being good at sports will have zero impact on your grades, the teachers don't decide them. Some subjects included course work that is graded by the teacher but being generous on this for select pupils is not done. A random subset (not picked by the school) is moderated externally. If it's deemed to be too generous the marks for the whole class are reduced accordingly.
2) There is a lot more specialisation, for A level you take 3 or 4 subjects. That's not major in them with less time on the rest, it's drop everything else. This continues on through university/college. I have A levels and a masters degree. My last English lesson was at age 16 when I took GCSE English.
Maleficent-Leek2943@reddit
Your post reminded me of my long-forgotten AS Level in… General Studies? I forgot we had the option to sign up for that alongside our A-Levels.
InevitablyCyclic@reddit
My school had that as a full A level. But it was a bit of a joke, for any university offers made on points they counted it as AS level, only half the value of an A-level.
Maleficent-Leek2943@reddit
Same, really - probably why I forgot I even did it. It was just presented as a kind of “oh, you can do this AS Level as well if you want. Come on - it’ll be FUN!”
It was not especially fun, as I recall.
whippetrealgood123@reddit
In Scotland, you have P1-7, you start school from age 4/5 and finish primary at 11/12. You'll often ask a child what primary they are in and if they say Primary 3, we'll roughly know they are around 7 years old.
Secondary school is from 11/12, and you can finish between 16-18 years of age. In 4th year, you sit your Nats (formerly standard grades) and can finish school once sitting these, and in 5th and 6th year you sit your intermediate 1/2 (not sure what they're called now, changed since I left school) and higher exams, highers get you into university. You need at least 4 highers to get into uni. If you don't meet uni requirements, you can attend college (tends to be your local one) and continue your studies there. Also, you can leave school at any point in 5th and 6th year, preferably you have a job or further education set up.
DoItForTheTea@reddit
there hasn't been any intermediates for years, like over a decade. it's just nationals and then highers, amd then if you're lucky to have the option, advanced highers
whippetrealgood123@reddit
So what do people do who aren't capable of highers?
DoItForTheTea@reddit
usually nat 5s, higher over two years, or leave for apprenticeships. if you got nat 5s in s4 you're probably good to do a higher in s5 though. people who can't do highers will have done nat4s in s4
whippetrealgood123@reddit
Thank you. I think when it all began I just saw loads of Nats mentioned and it confused me, never looked again as I didn't need to. Nat 4s in S4, some doing 5s then onto highers.
OkanaganBC@reddit
Grammar schools only exist in a few parts of the country. They were generally abolished back in the 1970s, with most becoming state funded "comprehensive" (all ability) schools which replaced the old secondary system split into grammar (those who passed an entry exam called.the 11+) and "secondary modern" (everyone else). Some converted into fee paying private schools for new intakes at that point (the school attended by our current prime minister being an example).
raspberryamphetamine@reddit
There’s still Lancaster Girls Grammar which is exam admission based!
julia-peculiar@reddit
I grew up in, and still live in, one of the counties where the selective system persists in state education. I despise it with all my being. It's insidious and divisive. Encourages obsessive tutoring, for years before the test, by parents who have the money for such (some of whom move to the county for this specific reason). Consequently, grammar schools end up admitting a goodly proportion of students who are not suited to such a setting (significantly more academically rigorous), when not being supported and coached to the nth degree, because they were expertly and expensively tutored to pass the test (the Secondary School Transfer test, colloquiallly known as the 11+).
Grammar schools tend to have better facilities / higher spend per head of pupil, than 'non-pass' schools. Which is disgraceful. A number of them can trace their origins back hundreds of years, and so have the prestige of a 'poor man's public school'.
philpope1977@reddit
I got a good education at a grammar school. The standard of behaviour and the academic expectations in the state sector are just terrible.
julia-peculiar@reddit
I too got 'a good education' at a grammar school.
I also have a child who did not 'pass' the 11+, and so did not go to a grammar school.
Do you have experience working in the state education sector*? - is your observation coming from a place of informed experience?
*I do
philpope1977@reddit
my partner is a secondary school teacher as well as several friends. I would have loved to be a teacher but after my work experience placement I decided against it.
julia-peculiar@reddit
I don't blame you! I'm not a teacher, and I wouldn't want to be one (but, as I said, I do work in a school). The state education sector is in crisis: 2 key aspects of this are behaviour and SEND. From your partner and friends, you'll know that what/who absolutely can't be blamed are the staff at the 'chalk face'. A huge / the main factor is underfunding/defunding: years of political leadership with apparently minimal insight into the realities of working in schools. An increasing factor is parents: not so much unengaged, as actively unsupportive, to the point of antagonistic.
Present_Program6554@reddit
I haven't been inside a secondary school since integration of SEN student became normal. I'm a specialist in Learning Disabilities and I simply can't imagine that being good for SEN students. I have noticed worse outcomes for the young adults with learning disabilities that come into adult services. They are often seriously lacking in skills that would have been taught in special education settings and have unrealistic expectations based on their classmates abilities.
infieldcookie@reddit
Just to add, in Northern Ireland we don’t have reception and don’t really have the college system (some colleges exist but it’s mostly for adult students or vocational studies).
We have Primary/P1-7 (ages 4-11) and then secondary (years 8-14/ages 11-18).
(I also had people in my school repeat a year, but that was because they had health issues that caused them to miss a lot of school one year.)
marbhgancaife@reddit
Interesting! This is the same as the rest of Ireland as opposed to England.
Would someone say they were in secondary school then, instead of high school? Or would they say grammar school?
AceOfGargoyes17@reddit
We'd say 'secondary school'. 'High school' isn't used; 'grammar school' is a subset of secondary schools but you wouldn't really say "I go to grammar school" as a way of saying that you're no longer at primary school, you'd just say "I go to secondary school".
Present_Program6554@reddit
In my time in N. Ireland, I noticed some grammar school pupils made a point of saying I go to Whatever Name rather than secondary school. Just their way of making it clear they were at the gramma, I suppose.
IAmLaureline@reddit
Many secondaries are called High School and in some areas people use the HS term as their norm. It means 11-16/18 rather than the same as US HS though.
No-Introduction3808@reddit
So the NI equivalent of reception is P1, so kids are in schooling for the same age range and time.
infieldcookie@reddit
That’s right yeah, there’s a few other minor differences like longer summer holidays as well.
caiaphas8@reddit
I always thought colleges were more common in NI, Belfast tech, SRC, etc
infieldcookie@reddit
This is anecdotal obviously but in my experience the only people who went to college/tech were people not interested in doing A levels but vocational stuff instead. Or those who went back later to do GCSES/A levels.
In my year group there were maybe 5 people (out of ~100) who didn’t continue from GCSE - A level at the same school. Nearly everyone I’ve met in England seems to have gone to a different secondary school and sixth form.
caiaphas8@reddit
Haha everyone in my secondary school stayed on for sixth form in England. But at university in NI everyone seemed to have studied at college before uni.
infieldcookie@reddit
I wonder if it’s another one of those things that’s regional (or based on career path?). It would’ve been difficult/expensive for me to go to a college due to not living near one.
GiftOdd3120@reddit
Not all schools have a 6th form so people are forced to go to a college. I had to get 2 buses it was a right pain
theelectricrainbow@reddit
Just wanted to add to point 12, whilst it’s unlikely/a lot rarer to happen in the UK, children can be held back a year if they are developmentally behind or are not meeting ‘Age Related Expectations’ (ARE’s). I work in healthcare and have worked with a number of clients who have experienced it and there’s mixed feelings on it. That being said, the more likely scenario is that children who are struggling will get extra classroom support from a teaching assistant in class or ‘top up’ sessions where they’re taken out of regular lessons to work on specific skills such as phonics. All depends on the area and the schools funding.
lordrothermere@reddit
Stages are key stages, and there are some small educational 'ecosystems' that still run with first, middle and high schools.. they're quite far and few between, and it's particularly hard to get teachers for middle schools, as they split KS2 and KS3 from traditional primary and secondary career paths.
Minute-Aide9556@reddit
Though the naming of years is also often different at private and public schools. Primary schools are generally called prep schools and many run to age 12. Secondary schools often run from age 13, and naming conventions are traditionally third form, fourth form, fifth form and sixth form, though individual schools may have their own naming conventions. At Radley, and public school, third form is called shell, fifth form is called remove, for instance.
IAmLaureline@reddit
Our local private schools have: Nursery (before school) Pre-prep (roughly infants) Prep (sometimes junior, sometimes including Y8) Senior
philpope1977@reddit
surely second, third, fourth, fifth, lower sixth, upper sixth.
IAmLaureline@reddit
Point 8. Your choice of subjects for GCSE is a bit specific.
Most schools insist on a base five subjects of Maths, English Lit, English Language, double science. These are the basis of the comparisons between schools of 5 GCSEs.
A foreign language is not required at this stage, nor are history, sociology and a third science. Many schools insist on a MFL, one arts subject etc, but these are choices made by the school.
Many schools only do 7, 8 or 9 subjects. 10 is not universal.
Lunchy_Bunsworth@reddit
sympathetic_earlobe@reddit
Northern Ireland is different from England, Wales and Scotland too.
Internet-Dick-Joke@reddit
A minor correction on this - doing an extra year at 6th Form/college (between the age of 16-19) is common and not looked down on at all, but it's also something that is completely voluntary, not forced on students, and is more likely to be done by students with average grades looking to improve them than by students who are genuinely failing, or sometimes by students who need to spend a year redoing a particular GCSE to get a higher grade in order to get onto the A-level course that they want. This wouldn't be referred to as being held back, though, because it is completely voluntary.
fraksen@reddit
So school is not compulsory after 16? Do most people continue through the A levels or only those that want to go to university?
M96A1@reddit
It's slight complicated- education is compulsory until 18, but where you go depends on your school, what you want to study and other local education facilities.
Many secondary (11-16) schools have a 'Sixth Form' (16-18, years 12 and 13) where you can continue full time education. Mine offered A levels and a small selection of B-tech courses, which tend to be more vocational rather than the traditional subjects of A level.
Some schools don't have this, and children have to go to a separate college, often with kids from other schools. Eve if your school does have a sixth form, you can go to college if you want- if you don't like your school, fancy a change, or if there's education options more beneficial to you. As they're more focused on 16-18 year olds, colleges tend to offer a broader range of subjects to study.
Another option is T levels or apprenticeships, where the school leavers at 16 can go and train hands on, with some classroom based learning as well. These are specific to a job typically.
Anyone can go to university, as long as you meet the entrance requirements and this can be done with either B-tech or A level routes in the required subjects.
At 18 you leave full time education and you can go do what you want- be that university, work or a gap year.
Orwell1984_2295@reddit
It's even more complicated than that as whilst the government made education compulsory to age 18 there's no consequences if you don't other than not being able to claim child benefit for that child and they can't claim benefits in their own right either. Also, due to lack of that legislation, if pre 16 you were eligible for free school transport, between 16 and 18 you're not even though education is supposedly compulsory to aged 18. Full legislation didn't go through so it's all really a bit of a mess!
GavUK@reddit
It didn't used to be compulsory, but the law compulsory education (this could be something vocational like an apprenticeship in a trade, not just A levels in Sixth Form or a college [FYI 'college' does not mean 'university' here]) came into force for 16 to 17 year-olds (i.e. the year after their GCSEs) in 2013, and raised from 17 to 18 in 2015.
Those going on to 'further education' to study A levels or equivalents (vocational qualifications that have had various names over the years, some relating to the issuer of the certificates: BTECs, City & Guilds, GNVQs, etc.) didn't necessarily do so with the intent to go on to university but, except in exceptional circumstances (some extremely gifted student that applies to or comes to the attention of a, usually prestigious, university), any 18 year-olds applying for a higher education course (BSc/BA or vocational equivalents) will have to meet certain academic requirements (usually they want at least C or above in English GCSE and also the same for the Maths GCSE, at least for technical subjects, and certain grades in one or two A levels, or equivalent vocational qualifications) to be accepted for that course.
crucible@reddit
This varies by country:
https://www.gov.uk/know-when-you-can-leave-school
Basically you can leave school at 16 if you’re in Scotland, Wales, or Northern Ireland.
If you’re in England you have to carry on in some form of education, employment, training or volunteering until you’re 18.
Having said that, a lot of people throughout the UK do choose to go to University, so they will continue past 16.
It’s just that the school leaving age, and laws around it were changed in England recently.
Zealousideal-Set-592@reddit
Just a slight amendment to the stages as that has changed recently. Early Years is nursery and reception (ages 3-5). It operates quite differently to the main primary school and uses a different curriculum and is supposed to be predominantly play based. Teachers are also trained differently Primary school includes key stage 1 (5-7) and key stage 2 (7-11).
simonk1905@reddit
Just to satisfy the pedant in me.
Not all Grammar schools are free. Some are fee paying like Kingston Grammar School. Although a lot of fee paying schools will offer scholarships for the brightest children.
The problem is that with a country as old as the UK and a fractured education system between the constituent parts of the UK many regional and historical dialect differences linger and so a lot of our language is very confusing to non natives.
It would help if we just said something like fee paying and state funded which would help people who are confused between public schools which are in fact a very select few schools amongst the fee paying schools.
Bonus fun fact. Grammar schools are called Grammar schools because they originally were intended to teach pupils Latin grammar as in the past university education was conducted in Latin.
texan-yankee@reddit
Excellent answer! Thanks! I've been confused about this too.
Skruffbagg@reddit
Public school = private, fee paying State school = open to all, free
Paladin2019@reddit
Side note, the difference in education systems in different countries is why everyone hates it when Americans say their kids are in 7th grade instead of just saying how old they are. Nobody in the rest of the world knows what 7th grade means.
ArcadiaNoakes@reddit
Well, I started 9th grade (high school/secondary school) at age 13 and turned 14 druing the academic year. I was one of 4 members of my class like that, and I was the oldest of the 4, as my birthday is before Christmas break. Most kids were already 14 and turned 15, and there were more than a few (maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of the class) who turned 15 years old over the summer before the school year started. So telling you my age at that time wouldn't really tell you what the grade level was. You would have a rough estimate, but not the actual answer to the question. It seems odd to complain that giving you precise information about what level a student is academically when asked is percieved as less precise than the age.
If you ask how old a child is, then you'll get the answer to that question. They aren't so strictly releated that they are interchangeable answers.
How is age related to academic year where you are? Is it strictly by age with no exceptions?
Paladin2019@reddit
I think you missed the point a little. I was talking about the American habit of answering the question "How old is your child?" by saying what grade they're in - which does not answer the question being asked.
Case in point, the TV quiz show "Are you smarter than a 5th grader" was renamed "Are you smarter than a 10 year old" when the format was copied over here.
originalcinner@reddit
The only way I can deal with it, is to assume that kids are aged 5 in first grade, and then I just add 5 on to whatever grade. 7th grade would be age 12.
This doesn't work when Americans say their kid is a junior, senior, or sophomore though. Without actual numbers, I'm lost.
Relevant-Battle-9424@reddit
Close. They’re 5-6 in kindergarten. 1st grade is 6-7 years old.
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
Wow! Kindergarten (nursery school) in the UK is 3 to 5 years old and is optional.
Compulsory education starts at infant school at age 5.
Dear_Tangerine444@reddit
Realistically it can start at an earlier age for individual children too. You can start school in the year you turn 5. My daughter started her primary school whilst she was still 4, and in fact had only been 4 for a handful of months.
ArcadiaNoakes@reddit
I was 4 years and 8 months when I started kindergarten. I vaguely remember sitting with my mother and the teacher and being given something to read, and some basic math. And how nice she was, and her positive reaction when I finished what she gave me.
lakas76@reddit
It depends on when the child is born. My youngest best daughter was born at the end of October, so she started school the next year at 5, then turned 6 soon after school started.
Albert_Newton@reddit
I turned 4 in late August and started school in September
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
I started school aged 4 years and 8 months in 1963.
sympathetic_earlobe@reddit
I was 4 and 2 months when I started in 1993. Which is far too young in my opinion. There were children there who turned 5 the day after I turned 4.
Sharp-Sky64@reddit
4
Ohd34ryme@reddit
What does eyfs strand for? Educate your fucking self?
Sharp-Sky64@reddit
Early Years Foundation Stage. Only education at that point is learning how to scribble on paper
Ohd34ryme@reddit
Reminds me of 6th form.
nikfilaye@reddit
There are actually multiple “kindergartens” or at least in my area of the US and I think it’s fairly common. When generally speaking of Kindergarten it is speaking about the aged 5-6 kids but there are kindergartens for 3 and 4 year olds but much fewer kids attend those and are referred to as “pre-school” or “pre-kindergarten”. They are typically private with few public so the only kids going to them are kids whose parents can afford it. Though in certain states there is a push for public pre-schools. It’s more about nomenclature than there being a real difference
Familiar_Radish_6273@reddit
It's the year they turn 5, so in fact most kids start school at 4.
kawaiiyokaisenpai@reddit
You can wait for your child to turn 6 before starting at infant school in England. This is recommended if you have a child born in July, especially if they're very small.
This is because a child who doesn't turn 5 until June/July will spend most of their 1st year as a 4 yr old. The developmental difference between 4 and 5 is huge. A similar jump happens at age 6.
My mother always regretted sending my bro to infant when he was 4. He has a July 24th Birthday, AND he was ridiculously petite. My mother didn't realise she was permitted to delay his 1st year or school. It meant my poor bro spent his first few years of school playing catch-up with the older, bigger kids.
HatOfFlavour@reddit
I've heard the opposite of parents fudging the dates and saying a kid was born a week earlier so they get into school a year earlier. A lie compared to the cost of another year not being able to work can justify it to some people.
winobeaver@reddit
yeah at the other end of the spectrum the kid might appreciate getting to enjoy the freedoms of adulthood relatively early in their 18th year rather than when they're almost 19
Present_Program6554@reddit
My nephew was young for his year and finished high school before his 17th birthday. He didn't skip any classes at all, but after a gap year, he was still under 18 when he started university.
lordrothermere@reddit
My two went when they were 4 as they have summer birthdays.. They're either youngest or near-youngest in their respective years. Because they went to nurseries at their first schools, they would have moved up the year after their friends if we delayed it, and they weren't keen on that. Thankfully they found the experience okay.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
You can wait in the U.S. as long as your child starts before they turn 6
First-Lengthiness-16@reddit
No you can’t. They must start school the term after they turn 5
Kayos-theory@reddit
Ugh! Tell me about it. So many times the educational psychologist is called in to do a cognitive assessment on a child in Year 1 or 2 because they are behind the rest of the class and “They are summer born you numpty, of course a child born in July of 2020 is going to be behind a child born in September 2019. That’s almost a full year.”
Snoo_said_no@reddit
Not quite, you can wait till the first term after the child turns 5 (so if they are 5 in October, compulsory school age is Jan. ) but not till after they turn 6.
https://www.gov.uk/schools-admissions/school-starting-age
You can of course homeschool. But you are legally obligated to provide a suitable education from the term after they turn 5. Of course at 5 this might not look much like 'school' and could/should be very play based. But compulsory school age in England is 5, not 6.
samdd1990@reddit
Oh come on, loads of kids are born in July and August (myself included) and still stay in their normal year. Deferring the year is/super uncommon.
It's only really a big deal in the first and last years of school. (I got ID'd at every single 18th birthday lol).
thekittysays@reddit
What about kids born in August?
The cut off for the year is the start of September in England and Wales.
Also it is not recommended, or at least not by officials. It's actually pretty hard to get LEAs to agree to deferring places, if they agree at all they often just say they should skip the first year of reception and go straight into year 1. Which kind of defeats the point.
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
That makes sense. My two sons were two years and six weeks apart in age. But, because of the months in which they were born, they were three years apart in school.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
Kindergarten is effectively year one or what used to be called reception or whatever in the U.K. it’s not nursery school
lakas76@reddit
Different names but same concept in the US. Preschool can start as early as 3 in the US also, kindergarten is mandatory at 5.
sympathetic_earlobe@reddit
I was 4 in primary 1
Crankyyounglady@reddit
Kindergarten is more similar to reception in the UK. After kindergarten is first grade, similar to our year 1.
Madruck_s@reddit
My daughter goes from nursery to reception next year when she has turned 4 and then year 1 at 5.
mrsrobotic@reddit
It's the same in the US. We call it preschool (ages 2-5) which is optional. Kindgarten begins at 5 and is the first compulsory year.
Insomniac_80@reddit
Also depends on what state they are in, cut off dates tend vary by location, with earlier ones in the South, where school may start in early August, versus the Northeast when they start in early September. In New York, often kids start Kindergarten at 4 1/2.
nonsequitur__@reddit
And I thought freshman meant first year of uni!
five_two@reddit
Freshman, sophomore, junior, and senior are used both for high school and college/university.
nonsequitur__@reddit
Ah great, that’s not confusing at all 🙈
Impossible_Moose3551@reddit
Usually people qualify that they are a freshman in high school or a junior in University if they are not talking so someone who already knows what level they are in.
nonsequitur__@reddit
Wow they start later than I realised!
Zingobingobongo@reddit
I’m British & my kids in high school in California. I have no idea what year here is beyond he’s in 10th grade 😂
Insomniac_80@reddit
If he were in the UK he would be taking the GCSE!
Sin_nombre__@reddit
Not in Scotland.
GetOffMyLawnYaPunk@reddit
Adding 5 still works for upperclass students Freshman is 9th grade +5 = 14 y.o Sophomore is 10th grade + 5 = 15 y.o Junior is 11th grade +5 = 16 y.o. Senior is is 12th grade + 5 = 17 y.o
epoustoufler@reddit
I don't think they were saying the technique of adding the numbers doesn't work, they were saying that when Americans say sophomore etc in isolation, they assume everyone already knows that means 10th grade. But if you don't know that because your country doesn't use these words, it's confusing.
lakas76@reddit
In general, someone in college/university would just say they are in college as opposed to saying they are a sophomore in college. Not sure how it is in the UK, but each year in college can have vastly different courses depending on the student, so, the name of the year doesn’t add much other than the number of years in college, in high school, just about all students take the same classes each year with only one or maybe two electives being different.
epoustoufler@reddit
I'm sorry, I don't think I understand how your point relates to my comment - though yes that's broadly true of the UK too, except we reduce the number of classes we take earlier here I think
RummazKnowsBest@reddit
I work it out from the Simpsons. Bart is 10 and in the fourth grade and I go from there.
ffs_not_this_again@reddit
I always think "Bart Simpson was in 4th grade and he was 10" and work it out from there.
wookieesgonnawook@reddit
But everyone has names for their grades. Just because it's a different name in different places doesn't mean there's anything wrong with using the name.
dowker1@reddit
If I said to you my child was in lower sixth, what would that mean to you?
Present_Program6554@reddit
It would tell me you're not Scottish
Rare-Bumblebee-1803@reddit
Your child is in their first year of A Level studying.
Top_Barnacle9669@reddit
I'd take it you mean year 12 so 16 and will be turning 17
dowker1@reddit
That was directed at non-Brits
Top_Barnacle9669@reddit
Given lower sixth and upper sixth aren't commonly used terms anymore,I suspect a lot of Brits wouldn't necessarily know if from certain generations. I only know it from reading books like Mallory Towers as a kid.
dowker1@reddit
Fair, guess I'm showing my age.
Do people still takk about "sixth form colleges"?
Top_Barnacle9669@reddit
It tends to be sixth form OR college now with the clear distinction of sixth form is a-levels and college btec
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
It depends on what the question is.
If you are asked 'what year/grade are you in at school?' then answering 'sophomore' or 'second year juniors' is okay.
But if the question is 'how old are you?' answering with anything but a number is weird and, if the person asking is not from your country, actually rude. And useless.
Oh2e@reddit
People in England do it all the time and it’s so confusing to me. I don’t know how old the Year 4s are please give me an age!
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
That must be a fairly recent thing. I left the UK 15 years ago, nobody that I knew did that when I was there. My kids and grandkids are still there. I don't think they do. I guess you and just know different people.
wookieesgonnawook@reddit
I guess I've never heard someone answer the question "how old are you" with their grade. That would be weird to me even as an American, as I've always been bad at remembering what ages you are at various grades. The only time I've used that is when doctors ask when I had my heart surgery. I know i was in 2nd grade, but I don't know how old that is supposed to be or what year it was, so I tell them the grade.
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
Countless post here on Reddit will mention children and, instead of saying their ages in years (where the context is saying their age), will say 'sophomore' or 'xyz grade'.
Do you seriously not know how old you were when you had heart surgery?
lakas76@reddit
I am not sure it’s countless. I’ve never talked to an American who said their kid was in 3rd grade instead of saying he’s 8.
wookieesgonnawook@reddit
No, I don't. That was like 32 years ago. Or 33. I could be more exact but I don't remember how old i was.
MolassesInevitable53@reddit
So what age us second grade?
nonsequitur__@reddit
It doesn’t, but if someone says the grade they are usually including it to indicate age.
Over-Dragonfruit-961@reddit
Agreed. This annoys the hell out of me too. Dazed & Confused is probs one of the best films I've ever seen, but try working out what age/year a fecking freshman is in before the invention of the internet. If somebody says "How old are you John?", they are asking HOW OLD you are. They expect you to answer "I'm 16" NOT "Sophomore Sir".
Mid-40's & I still can't work out wtf a senior is!!!
Insomniac_80@reddit
Senior is the last year in high school in the US, 16 1/2-18, it can also be a college student who is 20 1/2 to 22.
Over-Dragonfruit-961@reddit
Thanks. We call it sixth year in Scottish schools. I was 24 when I started college ("tec" in my neck of the woods, short for it's former title of technical college) and I was classed as a "mature" student. Mature my arse!!
Present_Program6554@reddit
I was a mature student in a school of nursing when I was 22. I was told to make sure the kids kept the common room clean.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
Well they can also be quite different ages in 7th grade. In most of the US you only have to make sure your child starts school before they turn 6 it’s not uncommon for a child (well the parents) to have a choice to be able to start school or wait a year.
yourlittlebirdie@reddit
Ok but don’t British schools have “year nine” “year ten” etc?
ukslim@reddit
They do, but they changed the system some time in the 90s or 2000s.
When I left school in 1993, you counted years in primary school, then when you went to secondary school age 10/11 you'd start in the 1st form. Do GCSEs in the 5th form. Optionally stay on for the 6th form (lower 6th, then upper 6th) before leaving school.
Then they renamed "first form" to "year 7", to follow on from year 6 of primary school .People over 50 who aren't teachers, and haven't had kids in school, have no instinct for the "new" system.
MerlinOfRed@reddit
Yeah but try saying that within Britain, let alone to foreigners.
People in Scotland don't even generally know what English Year nine is without counting the maths on their fingers.
BlakeC16@reddit
Plus the current system only started in the early 90s (I remember going from the old 'Class 7' in primary school to the newly-renamed 'Year 7' in secondary school), with 'Sixth form' being the last remnant of the old system. So I think anyone of a certain age would have to work it out too.
Paladin2019@reddit
We do, but we don't use it as a substitute for "They're 13"
yourlittlebirdie@reddit
Ok that makes sense.
QuietVisit2042@reddit
We used to call that the fourth form.
RiskyBiscuits150@reddit
Yes, but when asked the question "how old is your son/daughter?" I think we're much less likely to say "year nine" in response. We'd say 14.
slade364@reddit
Isn't it just one year behind our year system?
So 5th grade is year 6?
Christovsky84@reddit
It's pretty straightforward, kids start school at 5. So just add five years.
GetOffMyLawnYaPunk@reddit
We know, and that's all that really matters.
nonsequitur__@reddit
Yeah exactly, it means absolutely nothing to most of us other than they are a school aged child.
F_DOG_93@reddit
The UK is very old. Way back when, schooling was very rare. Barely anyone was able to go. "Public" schools were schools that you could go to if you could pay the fee for it. Many of the richer people were rich enough to homeschool. And by rich, I mean they had manor houses with a separate wing/library enough to school the owners kids and their siblings.
Economy-Worldliness1@reddit
Yes, the naming is counter-intuitive. Very few people go to public/private schools. They are for the rich 1%. I'm 44 and from the UK and I thought they were interchangeable terms until I learned something from others replying to this thread.
The 99% of us got free education from 4 years old at a primary/junior school and then from 11 to 16 at secondary/high school. For those staying in full time education beyond high school it is still free until 18.
Some high schools have what is known as a 'sixth form' for students 16 to 18, so they stay at the same school, but most go to a separate college for further education.
18 and beyond would typically be at a university, which isn't free.
After-Dentist-2480@reddit
In U.K., the term public schools refers to the older, fee paying independent schools. They’re also known as independent schools or private schools
We refer to schools funded from taxes, which people don’t pay to send kids to as state schools.
About 94% of children in U.K. attend state schools.
Belle_TainSummer@reddit
Specifically a Public School is any School named in the Public Schools Act of 1868. Any other fee paying school is just a private school.
drplokta@reddit
That Act was repealed in 1998, so any definitions it contained are no longer valid.
JamJarre@reddit
Legally, sure, but when people say public school they're talking about the old, famous ones like Eton or Harrow. When someone is trying to understand what "public school" means, quibbling over legal definitions isn't very helpful
thymeisfleeting@reddit
This is the top post but it’s not quite right. I went to an old independent school, but it was not a public school.
There’s only a handful of schools in the country that would be described as public schools, including Eton, Harrow, Winchester, Rugby. They’re nearly all boarding schools.
MagicBez@reddit
The layperson and media use public school to mean all independent/private schools though.
This may be the correct definition but it's probably not as helpful to someone just trying to work out why the UK seems to be using "public" and "private" to mean the same type of school
thymeisfleeting@reddit
Not really, I’ve never heard anyone describe a standard private school as a public school.
afcote1@reddit
A public school is a member of the HMC. An independent school not a part of it is a private school.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
I went to a school that is part of the HMC but never ever ever was it ever referred to as a public school.
I think that may be the technical definition, but in practice “public school” does tend to conjure eton, Harrow et al. Of course, plenty disagree with me so I guess I’m wrong.
afcote1@reddit
Mine was. There’s a whole “minor public school” thing.
Fusilero@reddit
I went to a "standard" private school and it was always called a public school. Mind you, it was from the 16th century but we also called our upstart rivals from the 19th century a public school too.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
That’s interesting! I went to a 16th century school too but it was never ever called a public school.
Fusilero@reddit
The most common definition I can find is those who take part in the Headmaster/Headmistress Conference; which to my shock and horror the upstart 19th century school also takes part in.
I think people get hung up on the public school act of 1864 which referred to the nine you're talking about; but the act itself specifically mentions it was only investigating "certain public schools" which implies there are more.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
Perhaps! I do know there’s more than just those 9 public schools, but I think those are the main ones people think of when they think of a public school.
Fusilero@reddit
To be fair, I've looked into this a bit more because of this thread and the independent schools council has over 1300 members whereas the HMC has only 351.
All the fee paying schools in my hometown were founded before the 1860s, in the HMC, and have coats of arms so it might be that I'm used to calling them all public schools but it wouldn't apply more broadly.
It would feel strange to call a 70s ex-grammar a public school.
afcote1@reddit
HMC is public. That’s the definition.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
Hmm perhaps! Although I just looked out of curiosity and my old school is in the HMC, although it was a grammar school until the 1980’s, so definitely wouldn’t be considered a public school by anyone around.
Perhaps though it’s because we’re near a very famous, very elite public school so anything feels common and less elite in comparison?
MagicBez@reddit
You're literally replying to someone to correct them on that precise point.
Also even the most cursory of Googling will find numerous cases of people referring to British private schools as public schools.
So not really "a handful"
thymeisfleeting@reddit
Ah yes, people’s use of “public school” is based on a 1965 report, and not in fact, the 150 odd years of established use. Sure sure.
MagicBez@reddit
And yet you claim to have never heard of anyone using the term that way while replying to people using the term that way?
Usage of the terms this way dates back to at least the 19th century. How have you never encountered this? Are you still attending the public school you referenced up top?
thymeisfleeting@reddit
I mean in real life, obviously, in conversation. So no, in conversation I have never heard anyone refer to a “public school” in the British sense without meaning specifically Eton, Winchester, Harrow et al. I’ve not produced an exhaustive list by any means but there’s definitely a difference in how these public schools are perceived v other independent/private schools.
Yes, usage of the term dates back to the 19th century (and beyond actually) to refer to a much smaller group of schools than you have listed in your 1965 report. That’s why I said 150+ years.
I actually think neither of us have touched on the biggest qualifier in most people’s minds - and that’s the fact that when people talk about public schools, they invariably mean boarding schools, even though I believe there are some public schools that aren’t?
rcgl2@reddit
Can't you just both be right?
It is correct to say that a hoover is technically a vacuum cleaner made by Hoover, and that not all vacuum cleaners are Hoovers.
It's also correct to say that to the vast majority of people in the UK and in common UK parlance, the term "hoover" is exactly synonymous with vacuum cleaner.
MagicBez@reddit
This surprises me, I don't think your experience is a common one and may be the product of being told this while attending one of the handful of "elite" private schools in question who do indeed consider themselves distinct.
Fewer because there were fewer private schools at the time, not because the term only applied to the specific schools you're thinking of. Even places like Winchester College when writing books on the subject over 100 years ago use the broader definition. You're absolutely right that those schools consider themselves apart from others and famously like to use the term "minor public school" in reference to other schools - which of course does still imply that those other private schools are still public schools, albeit in a "lesser" form. That term shows up in dictionaries going back to at least the '30s, I've heard it used several times (including by Ian Hislop as an aside). As noted elsewhere in this thread the origjnal distinction of meaning was between public school and private tutoring but I think we can agree that few people use the terms to mean that today? The definition you give seems to be the less common one.
The fact that Government defined the term in the 1960s to encompass all private schools, and continue to use that definition gives a pretty strong indication of how the term will be used more broadly by people now. I appreciate that you have never encountered that but I assure you it isn't rare or obscure (plenty of newspaper editorials use it as well for what that's worth)
I think this may be vanishing over time. The % of students boarding is dropping, especially among British children (as opposed to international students) and even within that the rate of "full" boarding is dropping too with far more going home for weekends etc. many schools that were once primarily boarders no longer are and I wouldn't be surprised to learn of some schools dropping it entirely. The concept seems increasingly out of fashion (though allegedly the popularity of the Harry Potter books may have sparked some renewed interest)
Fridadog1@reddit
I don’t think that there is any confusion about public/private schools with the people who use them. In the whole country there are fewer than 15 public schools, which are generally boarding schools and generally old and very expensive. But there are lots of old private schools, too. My son’s is around 900 years old. But it is about half the price of a public school and is not boarding.
State schools are free, and generally not boarding, but there are state boarding schools, where the education is free, but parents pay for the boarding element.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
I didn’t attend “one of a handful of elite schools which consider themselves distinct”. Dunno why you’re assuming that.
Look, sure whatever, I genuinely don’t care this much. Was just looking to help out the original poster, because there is a difference between going to a public school and the level of privilege that entails v going to a less grandiose independent school - which in itself is of course privileged.
Incidentally, boarding schools are still fairly popular, the difference is you don’t tend to send your kids away for whole terms these days, you might do a couple of nights a week or monday - Friday. It’s not as popular a choice as it used to be, but within that upper echelon of public schools, it is very much still a thing. A third of ISC schools have boarders in some form or another.
Anyway, I really don’t care that much about this. If you want to refer to your local grammar turned independent as a “public school”, knock yourself out.
MagicBez@reddit
Apologies, I misread/remembered your first post! Totally my fault, ignore that part!
I said that attendance from British kids was decreasing not that it had stopped or was no longer a thing. Or are you saying it hasn't decreased? I also made the same point about the move away from "full" boarding so I'll take that as you just agreeing with me.
I agree there's a status difference, but I can't find any strong evidence supporting the claim that it would be incorrect to refer to both as "public" schools. As mentioned even the big established public schools call the smaller independent schools public schools in their own history books and even when disparaging them. As such I think your clarification on terminology muddied rather than clarified things for OP.
WryAnthology@reddit
I haven't either. I thought most Brits knew the difference.
philpope1977@reddit
there are about 2,500 private schools in the country, and probably more than that in the past. So public schools are a small minority of those even by the wide definition of the Public Schools Commission. My siblings and several friends attended private schools - they were not all thought of as public schools.
DucksBac@reddit
Yeah I was sent away to the worst possible private school and people have called me public school educated. I try.
WryAnthology@reddit
Not sure why you were down voted. I agree. I thought everyone knew that a public school was along the lines of Eton. I've never heard anyone refer to a private school that way.
vj_c@reddit
IMO this is either pedantry these days or perhaps differs by location? By actual usage of the term "public school" the vast majority of the public mean all or most independent fee paying schools, not just the handful of classic elite ones - you see the term in newspaper articles & suchlike. I went to a regular boring local private school & it wasn't uncommon for it to be referred to as a "public school" & this was decades ago now (I'm old!). Though, like I said, it might be a local/geographic thing like so much of our language.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
Show me an example in a decent newspaper where they’re not referring to a “proper” public school?
drplokta@reddit
The usual definition of a public school is one that's a member of the Heads' Conference (formerly the Headmasters' Conference). There are around 300 of them, not just a handful. Most of them are described as "minor public schools", to make a distinction with the ones you name.
EP_Nerd@reddit
In the US a “state school” is typically referencing a school for the disabled, or a university paid for primarily with state taxes and with discounted (but still astronomical) fees for local attendees.
cool_chrissie@reddit
Is there a reason it’s called public school when it’s actually not public funded?
kawaiiyokaisenpai@reddit
In the UK, I never hear anyone calling private school "public." It's surely an outdated term that only great grandparents and a few of the oldest boomers might use. Any school that charges a fee is referred to as private. We have two very prestigious private schools in my area, both having 'private' in their title.
Schools that are free to enrol are state-funded schools. They can be run and managed via a variety of approved models, businesses or groups, but the funds come via the government.
GCSEs (general certificate of secondary education) are the exams taken at age 15-16. They used to be graded A to F (& U for ungraded), but now are graded with numbers. The bigger the number, the better the grade: 9 = A+ 1= F
O-Levels are old fashioned and outdated, being replaced by the GCSEs.
A-level (Advanced level) is what most students aged 16-18 work towards at college. They are essential certificates required to enrol at University.
Katharinemaddison@reddit
There is a group of schools that are Public schools. It’s a bit like Russell Group universities really, it’s essentially branding.
Historically they grew out of grammar school and were public because they weren’t privately run for profit or only for children from a particular location or of parents of a particular trade.
They gradually poshified so that by the Victorian period they were for children of aristocracy or gentry or rich people who wanted their sons to be ‘gentlemen’.
They are now administered by the Headmasters and Headmistress conference.
ambergresian@reddit
Kinda interesting that the public schools evolved that way. Meant to be open to more people, now associated with higher class.
thymeisfleeting@reddit
There’s a difference between most private schools and public schools though. I went to a private school; I did not go to a public school. Perhaps the schools near you are not public schools?
I live near a famous public school, and you definitely hear the phrase a lot, mostly talking about the public school boys who go there.
Maleficent-Leek2943@reddit
Same. I went to a private school. Nobody I knew referred to it as public school. Public school was Eton and Harrow, etc.
A post above says that public schools are any of the 300-ish schools administered by the Headmasters and Headmistresses Conference. I checked that website, and my private school is on there. Seems like the definition of what is and isn’t a public school has changed WILDLY since I last paid attention.
LaSalsiccione@reddit
Exactly. Public school generally refers to the big old historic public schools like Eton, Harrow, Malborough etc
Grumblefloor@reddit
Not for the whole UK. Wales still uses A* to F.
andonebelow@reddit
“In the UK, I never hear anyone calling private school "public." It's surely an outdated term that only great grandparents and a few of the oldest boomers might use.”
This is sadly not the case. While all schools that charge fees are private, very few of those schools are also public schools. Public schools are the oldest and most elite schools (eg Eton and Harrow). People who went to public school do not view private schools in the same league. It’s extremely elitist, and that’s the point.
Sadly these institutions are still massively influential in this county- it’s what the phrase “old boys network” refers to.
Minute-Aide9556@reddit
The public schools are just seven specific (private, fee-paying) schools which existed when the law about such schools was created. You only refer to those schools as public.
erinoco@reddit
Not so. These were the classic public schools: but those schools which set up the Headmasters' Conference shortly after the Act you describe was passed were also seen as public schools.
AtebYngNghymraeg@reddit
Minor correction: GCSEs were graded A (later A*) to G, and U for u ungraded. The new numeric system doesn't directly map 1:1 with the old.
Swamivik@reddit
We always say state schools rather than public schools because we know public schools mean something else. When you say 'they are public school boys', it means they are from Eton and Harrow and not your local comprehensive.
BobbieMcFee@reddit
McD is open to the public...
cool_chrissie@reddit
Not quite the same as that is a business. Public services are generally things funded through the government. Things like schools, fire departments, police, etc.
InevitablyCyclic@reddit
They were open to any member of the public who could afford them. This was in contrast to the other schools at the time that would only accept certain people such as the sons of members of the clergy or military or of a certain social standing.
Laescha@reddit
Before we had free, universal education, a handful of very wealthy people set up public schools. The school's benefactor would pay for the education, but the school only accepted pupils who showed academic talent - so they were public schools in the sense that anyone could apply to study there, but only the most talented applicants could get a place.
These schools were very good schools, so often wealthy people would ask if they could send their kids there too in return for a hefty donation. Most schools said yes because the donations would be enough to fund the education of 2 or 3 non-paying scholars. Over hundreds of years, though, the balance shifted until you get to a point where the overwhelming majority of pupils are fee payers - but these schools generally do still have a scholarship programme for talented pupils who can't pay the fees. Eton is the most famous example.
cookingismything@reddit
Thank you for your detailed response.
ReySpacefighter@reddit
Public schools were schools that any member of the public could apply to (so long as they had the fee), vs private direct tuition.
maceion@reddit
They were 'public schools' as anyone who could pay the fees could send their children to them. This was in a time when the wealthy educated their children at home with private tutors.
DrJDog@reddit
Eton was founded as a school for the poor local but it was so good people pretended they were poor to send their kids there.
erinoco@reddit
There was always a difference with Eton. Henry VI never intended it to be a local school (although it did create a school designed to offer free primary education to locals, which has the unfortunate name of Eton Porny School). The children of peasants who weren't freemen were excluded from the start. But the intended targets were always poorer than the current intake.
DocShoveller@reddit
It's also partly to do with most schools at the time being church-owned. Public schools weren't.
Belle_TainSummer@reddit
Or guild owned. Your dad had to be a guild member in good standing for you to get an education.
DocShoveller@reddit
A lot of those schools are now lumped with the Public schools (e.g. Merchant Taylor schools). I suspect they were good schools and the rich moved in. They couldn't do that with a lot of church schools, who had the power to exclude Catholics and Nonconformists.
drplokta@reddit
They turned into public schools when there weren't enough wealthy guild members to keep them going.
SnooPoems7525@reddit
Also called comprehensives I believe. And grammer schools which were more of a thing in the past are free but require certain grades to get in.
After-Dentist-2480@reddit
Comprehensive schools are schools which accept the full ability range of children, without any financial or academic entry requirements. By definition, all will be state schools.
Grammar schools have an academic requirement, generally an exam to enter, whether state or independent. Where there are grammar schools in an area, ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_grammar_schools_in_England ) the non-grammar schools can't be said to be comprehensive, whatever their name says, because they don't have the full ability range.
queryasker123@reddit
In England:
PRIMARY SCHOOL: Reception: your first year at school. Start the September after you turn 4. Year 1: September after you turn 5… Year 2 Year 3 Year 4 Year 5 Year 6
SECONDARY SCHOOL: Year 7: start the September after you turn 11. Year 8 Year 9 Year 10 Year 11: You take your GCSEs. Increasingly it is becoming essential to get a 4 (used to be called a C) in English Language and Maths GCSEs to apply for university and be eligible for various jobs and apprenticeship schemes.
SIXTH FORM/COLLEGE: Year 12: Start the September after you turn 16. Year 13: finish the summer after/when you turn 18. - The level of qualification most people take here is called a Level 3 qualification. - The most common Level 3 qualification is called an A-level, which is an academic qualification. Typically people take 3 A-levels. - Each A-level is in a different subject, so for instance a person would take one each in Maths, Biology, and Physics. - A-levels are the most universally-accepted qualifications by universities and thus the most common taken by those who aim to go to university. - There are other academic qualifications, like IB Diplomas, and more vocational qualifications, like various forms of Level 3 BTECs, that people take at this stage - and more still that sit in between. - NB, “Colleges” are typically associated with vocational qualifications, whereas sixth forms are associated with more academic qualifications. - Sixth forms are generally attached to the end of a secondary school. While many people stay at the same school from Year 7-13, some secondary schools don’t have sixth forms, and regardless, people often go to a different sixth form/college anyway depending on what they want to do.
After this, people typically go onto university, work, apprenticeships, etc., using their qualifications so far to apply.
UNIVERSITY: - Universities offer degrees, e.g. Mechanical Engineering BEng. - A university sets the entry requirements for its degrees: e.g., for A-levels, UCL’s Mechanical Engineering BEng asks for AAA with an A in either Maths or Physics, and the As in the other one from a specific list of preferred subjects. - Students who want to go apply for university by January during Year 13, using their predicted grades they were issued by their school at the end of Year 12. - To be successful, their grades, qualifications and subject choices should match the entry requirements of their chosen degree. They also have to submit a good personal statement and possibly a portfolio, and may be interviewed by the university too. - Students can apply for up to 5 degrees a year in one specific window.
PRIVATE VS. STATE EDUCATION: Your public schools are like our state schools. It is much less common for a middle class child to attend private school here than it is in the US. Most people go to a state school.
Public schools are private schools, but this term is usually used to refer to expensive and established private schools - think where old and big money families send their kids.
mrbadger2000@reddit
Perfect answer
Own-Holiday-4071@reddit
Simple answer:
The UK equivalent of American public schools is STATE SCHOOL - because it is funded by the state
In the UK, public school refers to a select number of elite, private, fee paying schools, often boarding schools. These are the famous places you’ve heard of like Harrow, Eton, Rugby, Westminster etc
timsomething@reddit
I’m probably just repeating what other people are saying but I’m not reading through all that to check.
In the U.K. a public school is one that’s owned/run by a member/members of the public, what you’d call a private school. A state school is one that’s run by the government, what you’d call a public school. While the term private school isn’t really used over here officially, it has seeped into use via American TV.
What you call kindergarten, we call pre-school.
Rather than elementary, middle, and high school, we have primary and secondary school. Primary is ages 5-11, secondary is 11-16. We don’t call them “grades”, we call them “year groups” (Year 1, Year 2… Year 11)
We specialise in subjects earlier. You’re expected to pick a small amount of subjects (maybe 3-5, it depends on the school I think but it’s a distant memory for me so I can’t say for certain) at 14 before you start studying for your GCSE’s and it gets narrowed down from there.
GCSE’s are the exams that we take at 16; these used to be called O Levels.
Then we have two years of studying A Levels (even more specialised) you take “AS Level” exams at 17 and “A2 Level” exams at 18 and these combined get you your A Level grades. Most secondary schools also offer A Levels so you can stay in the same place but there are also colleges that teach them exclusively. These aren’t the same as your colleges.
Then we have university which IS like your college. That’s where you get a degree. Most universities in the UK don’t typically offer majors and minors like they do in the US; you pick one subject and study that for 3-4 years. Also no fraternities and sororities.
I apologise in advance if any of that has changed in the last 15 years or if I’ve misremembered anything
clutchnorris123@reddit
In Scotland a public school is just a normal government run school and a private school is a privately run school that you have to pay for. So all these comments saying public schools in the UK are posh fee paying schools that only applies to England and Wales not Scotland or Northern Ireland.
banxy85@reddit
Public school is an outdated term here now. It's often used interchangeably with private school.
becka-uk@reddit
Public schools and private schools are pretty much the same thing- you pay to go there and some have entrance exams.
Your public school would be our comprehensive school.
GCSE's are the exams you do at the end of year 11(age 16) and A levels are the exams you do at year 13 (6th form - this is years 12 and 13). These ones are the ones most likely to determine if you get into university. O levels were superceded by GCSE, so no longer exist.
My schools were infant, junior and senior. Infant and junior were on the same site and were years1&2 and 3-6 respectively. Senior school was years 7-11 and whilst my school had a 6th form, I chose to go to a local college instead.
There are other qualifications people can do instead of A levels. A levels tend to be more academic, NVQs or GNVCs (these may have changed since I was at school) are more practical or trade.
SirMellencamp@reddit
So these tests are more geared towards a career path? Is there an equivalent to the SAT/ACT for college (university) entrance?
defectivetoaster1@reddit
university admissions usually work by applying with predicted a level grades and achieved gcse grades, and if the university gives you an offer it will generally be conditional on you achieving certain grades when you actually sit your a levels. Some universities (and any medicine courses) will also have admissions tests or interviews as well as just the personal statements, eg things like history, maths, law, engineering at oxbridge and other top universities like imperial college or Warwick will often have admissions tests and/or interviews but the vast majority go entirely off of predicted grades and the written personal statement
SirMellencamp@reddit
I see the advantage in that but I work in IT and was a Poli Sci major in college. I was definitely more geared towards IT but didnt know it till I got out of college.
defectivetoaster1@reddit
yeah the uk system isn’t great if you don’t know what you want to do early on but for those of us that do know we don’t have to do any gen ed classes :P
SirMellencamp@reddit
My daughter was a freshman at Auburn University last year and she didnt know what she wanted to do so she was an "Exploratory Major". She took her core classes and classes that exposed her to different majors. She is now an Accounting major
Crustacean-2025@reddit
A friend of mine did an exchange with a US high school aged 15/16. She was amazed at the degree to which the American kids were being urged not to make future decisions, to leave everything wide open, not to commit to anything. And also that there were 19 year olds still in school! In England, your future direction is being moulded at 13 when you make your GCSE choices. You need to know what (3) A levels you’re going to do at 16, and you’ll be applying for a specific degree course at 17. Your uni course will be proscribed, no amassing ‘points’ via this course and that course. It’s 3 years and you hit the ground running.
I’m sure there are benefits in both systems tho still being in education at 23/24 seems quite old!
SirMellencamp@reddit
That is a hell of a lot of pressure for a 13 year old. My son is 14 and he thinks he is either going to be a youtube star or play in the NBA.
_mounta1nlov3r_@reddit
The thing that hasn’t been mentioned much is that both GCSE and A level exams are set and marked nationally, totally independently of the school. So, on one day, pretty much all of the 15/16 year olds in England will be sitting the same 2hr maths exam, at the same time, in their own school hall or gym. They sit about 25 exams over the months of May and June, then get their results back in August after all the papers have been marked anonymously by specialist teachers. The same goes for A Levels; my daughter sat an A Level psychology exam last week. Her cousin, who lives in a different area of England, took the same exam at the same time. She is taking three A levels, and has three exams for each subject, including a spoken exam for French. So, nine exams over about a month and a half. My daughter is hoping to study psychology Bsc at university, starting in September. She has confirmed her first and second choices of course, but will now have to wait for results day in August to know for sure that she has got in. I think it’s quite a fair system, but very stressful!
SirMellencamp@reddit
Damn that is brutal. Does you gpa get taken into account at all for university?
_mounta1nlov3r_@reddit
It’s not a thing. Some subjects, such as art, textiles etc get judged on a portfolio of work over the two years plus a final piece. English lit, Geography etc have a small percentage of non examined element eg a project or essay that counts for about 20% that you do in advance of exam season. But my daughter’s subjects (psychology, sociology, French) are all exams. Which makes the fact that our whole family just came down with Covid in the middle of exam season a nightmare! Luckily she seems to have got off fairly lightly and hasn’t had to miss any exams. (There is a mechanism if you are seriously ill where they average out your grades from the other exams in that subject, but if you miss too many, you just have to retake them next year.)
SirMellencamp@reddit
That sucks if you dont test well and you are trying to get into a STEM field.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
To an extent, but I had a colleague, degree qualified radiographer who didn’t ‘test’ well. She had special education needs provision at school (additional time for exams, sitting apart from other kids), at uni she was permitted to retake and retake elements she struggled in, additional 1:1 assistance etc etc. After several attempts, she passed her degree as it was very much in the uni’s interest to get her through.
But in the face of being the only radiographer confronting a multi-trauma patient at 3 in the morning, absolute disaster. No ability to think clearly, decisively and quickly on her feet, no organisational ability, unable to prioritise and act.
I agree you may not be faced with that extreme in all STEM, but dealing with rigours of formal examination does equip you better.
_mounta1nlov3r_@reddit
Universities have their standard ‘offer’ for each course on their websites - eg AAB, or AAA (A* is like A+). Some universities/courses will give ‘contextual’ offers. This is often based on your postcode (zip code); so if you live in an area /street with historically low rates of university education, you may get an offer one grade lower. My girl has an offer of AAB rather than AAA because of where we live (although her parents are both graduates in this case).
_mounta1nlov3r_@reddit
Thinking about it, GPA is about average grades I think? So, when you apply through UCAS, your school will input predicted grades, which are based on formal and informal assessment- mock exams, usually done in December or January as well as class assessments. So it’s on the strength of these that the university will offer a place, but it’s still down to the student to actually achieve those grades or it counts for nothing.
SirMellencamp@reddit
Yes. Grade Point Average. It begins your Freshman year (9th) and goes through your Senior year (12th). Then a university will take into account if the classes you took were honors classes which are harder. So basically in the US your college admissions for most colleges are based primarily on two things. Your GPA and your ACT/SAT score. If you are trying to get into an Ivy League school or a school like Duke, Stanford, Vanderbilt, Northwestern they are going to look at extracurricular activities, a college essay, interviews with admissions officers. Other schools will take those things into account for scholarships but not admissions. I mean there is basically a path for any kid to get into college just some paths are going to be more difficult and you might not end up at a well respected university.
_mounta1nlov3r_@reddit
If you want to go to Oxford or Cambridge they have their own admissions exams and interviews. (And you will need all A* for most courses, plus highest grades in GCSEs) Similarly, here, there are also universities which require lower grades for entry. A lot of these will be the ‘newer’ universities, which used to be technical/vocational colleges, then became universities around 30/40 years ago when the laws around this changed. So my friend’s daughter got an offer to study psych with criminology I think at a newer university and her offer was maybe CCD, so much more achievable. Another family friend is studying music at a well respected conservatoire; because it was all about the auditions and the musical prowess she just needed to get two grade E A levels as a minimum entry requirement.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
It is a bit brutal, but so is life! About 15 years ago, though, in order not to ‘stress’ kids, GCSEs had moved so far towards ‘course work’ only, own-teacher assessed, where a kid could redo a ‘module’ as often as they liked, no overall ‘end of 2 year course’ exams, that it was noted that kids had no retention and narrow knowledge bases. Get the desired grade in each short module, then forget it, move on! And of course, parents were also doing quite a lot of the homework.
Meanwhile, private schools were doing ‘international GCSEs’, designed for international English based schools, all formal examinations, and unis and employers noted the divergence of knowledge between state and private students, so we did a screeching U turn back to far more heavily formal exam based GCSEs.
LittleMissAbigail@reddit
Most people don’t take a specialist university entrance exam. Those who do are either applying for Oxford or Cambridge (not all subjects), to study medicine, or to go to university abroad. Usually your A Level (or equivalent) grades plus your personal statement (a fairly short bit of writing detailing why you want to study your subject) is all you need to apply to university. Our application system is centralised so you can only apply for up to 5 universities, but with one application for all of them.
SirMellencamp@reddit
One application for all colleges. Crazy. You can send your ACT/SAT scores to like three universities but you have to apply to each if you actually want to be admitted
LittleMissAbigail@reddit
It’s a very efficient system in a lot of ways - you pay one relatively small fee (£28.50) to apply for up to 5 universities and it’s all run through a central portal system (UCAS). We tend to apply with predicted rather than actual grades and universities that want you say “you can have a place so long as you actually get these grades”, and then they confirm your place once your A Level grades are released.
(Generally you’d pick a “firm” choice which would be your first choice assuming you meet the grades and an “insurance” choice with a lower offer in case you don’t meet your firm grades)
SirMellencamp@reddit
It’s a very efficient and more common sense system. I mean having to apply to a school isn’t that expensive, it varies but figure like $40-$70 per school, regardless one system makes more sense
vj_c@reddit
What happens there if you don't get your predicted results there? Here, there's a system called "clearing", because the universities have obviously planned on the basis of people getting the predicted results, but obviously not everyone does, so courses have unfilled places. And obviously there's lots of students who didn't get their predicted results so they go through "clearing" and you can maybe still get the place, even with lower grades, or often get offered places on slightly different courses or maybe a "foundation year" - which some universities offer as a course to give people the skills they need for a degree. It might even be at a different university - it's also possible to get a place at a better university if you got higher than expected results through this system!
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
There are no predicted results. You get accepted based on criteria that is already established. Once you’ve got in you can effectively mess around for the rest of the year.
vj_c@reddit
Ah, that's an interesting difference - as mentioned offers here are usually conditional on achieving a particular set of grades & you usually don't find them out until the end of the course (most commonly A-level results).
There's other ways to apply such as based on experience for mature learners, for example - but those go directly to individual university admissions & not via the centralised UCAS system for students progressing up from college to uni.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
Yes it’s quite different. In the U.S. your four year cumulative GPA which is essentially all your grades across the entirety of the four years of high school then most want an SAT score but you can sit that multiple times and submit your best and you don’t that before the end of the year. They also make much more of deal of extra curricular activities and you typically have to submit an essay. It’s much more convoluted than the English process of apply get the conditional offer and get the grades and job done however it probably offers more opportunity to those that aren’t all or nothing test takers.
SirMellencamp@reddit
If you dont get the ACT/SAT score you want then you know what school you can probably get into. Like I had an average score and my GPA was average. I knew what schools I could get into. I definitely wasnt getting into an Ivy League School or a Vanderbilt, Duke or Stanford so didnt even bother applying to schools like that. I just went to the University of Alabama which is a mid tier school.
We do have something like a "foundation year" for kids that cannot even get into a lower tier university. They can go to a Junior College for a year or two and make the grades and then get admitted to four year school. You can also make good grades at a lower tier school and transfer to a mid tier school.
julia-peculiar@reddit
And don't get me started on the ludicrous wrongness, in this day and age, of how very many state schools, up and down the land - particularly primary schools - are church affiliated / supported / part-funded. Mostly Church of England, but some RC also.
This again is a legacy thing - going back to the days when the church was the original only provider of free education to poor / ordinary children.
Thankfully, the C of E flavour of religion is mostly benign whimsy - certainly when compared with the right-wing-weaponised brand(s) of Christianity so prevalent in the US. So - even with its mandatory daily act of worship in school - more cringe than harmful.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
It is because most C of E primaries, in particular, are so ‘religion lite’ that we’re not bothered by them. Many of them have assembly, a hymn, a prayer and a reflection no more than twice a week. It’s no big deal, but does address that we are still a country based on C of E principles.
julia-peculiar@reddit
I can't speak for 'most' C of E primaries... but the one I work in is positively bubbling over with endless churchy nonsense. Including a daily 'act of worship' (concept and phrase makes me want to heave... We don't say 'assembly', any more: we have to call it 'worship'), pupil 'worship leaders', and bible quotes on the wall. The school (presumably all others too) has regular inspections by the C of E version of Ofsted, and ongoing (weekly, if not daily) involvement with and oversight from the local church.
I cannot bear when what are essentially decent human values and ethics are co-opted/framed as C of E / Christian principles. In my experience, this conceptual hijacking happens more in the guise of the loathesome 'British values' garbage, which is also pushed (with jolly union-flag-themed displays...) relentlessly in schools, now.
SL13377@reddit
Oh man I can confuse you further!!
My child goes to a public school with a private set of classes within in it. She had to apply and be accepted.
After that we could put in for an interdistrict transfer and hopefully be accepted into the public school.
She goes to school from 8 am to 5pm daily and there's a donation that's asked for 2000.00 per person per year for the one hour of extra class she gets. The school is called COSA (Coronado School of the Arts) and has been going on for 60 years. It's an amazing program with very competitive and amazing teachers. The shows are like college level Everyone is very very professional.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
That’s an odd set up! Paid for classes within a state school! And 8-5?! Our day is about 9-3:30 in state schools, 39 weeks a year; private is 8:30-4, 35 weeks a year.
Tricia-1959@reddit
Brits say “go to university”. Is there only 1 university? We say go to “(name of) university” such as Tennessee State University or Vanderbilt University. You usually want to identify what university you attend.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
Nah, we say ‘Going to uni’ 😊
nonsequitur__@reddit
So an American wouldn’t say “go to college”?
Tricia-1959@reddit
Where I live, most would say the name of the college.
nonsequitur__@reddit
I see. We would say it if it were relevant, but it’s rarely relevant unless directly asked which university you go to.
epoustoufler@reddit
I also think it would come off as a bit self important in British culture. If someone in the UK said something like "after I graduated from Edinburgh University" or "I start my final year at Edinburgh in September" it would feel fairly jarring. Obviously there are exceptions, like if you've specifically been asked about your career history, but the cultural norm is definitely not to elaborate unless asked.
nonsequitur__@reddit
Yeah it would sound very odd, like trying to make a point.
GaryJM@reddit
I find it hard to believe that you don't have similar constructions in American English. Surely Americans can say "on Sundays I go to church" without implying that there is only one church in existence? Or say "after I graduate, I plan to go to college" without listing the specific colleges they are considering going to?
Tricia-1959@reddit
Certainly I say “I am going to church” without saying my church name. (www.longhollow.com 😉). But you always hear “I’m going to X college” not, I’m going to college. Also most of the time, without even saying the word college.
But also, usually one of the first the first things you ask someone new in a conversation is what they do for a living which I’m told is not common in Great Britain.
pineapplewin@reddit
Americans will be more likely to hear it on "have you arrived for any colleges? Are you at college now?" Type questions.
Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit (OP)
I definitely did NOT expect this many comments! Wow! Honestly, I’m a bit overwhelmed but I’m trying to read through it all (and attempt to understand 😂).
Crustacean-2025@reddit
It’s quite interesting, isn’t it?
EscapedSmoggy@reddit
Teacher here. I can explain England, as I know there are differences in other areas.
For most, the system is Primary school (reception - Year 6, age 4-11) and then secondary school / high school (Year 7-Year 11, age 11-16). Some areas say high school for this stage, some say secondary school. For Year 10 and Year 11, you study for GCSEs in several subjects. Most GCSEs just gave a few exams at the end of Year 11 now. Some creative subjects have practical coursework alongside a theory exam. Some schools offer vocational qualifications (e.g. BTECs) in some subjects instead of GCSEs, which are GCSE equivalent.
At 16, young people have a few options. They can go to a sixth form college (this may be attached to the school or be an entirely separate institution) to study A Levels (which is usually in 3 subjects), which is the standard route to university. These are studied for 2 years usually with exams at the end of 2nd year/Year 13 (different sixth forms will call them different things). They can go to a Further education college, where they will study a vocational subject (my dad currently teaches level 2 and level 3 electrical at an FE college). Historically, these have been mostly coursework, but there has been a move to more exams. This isn't the standard route to university, but you can e.g. my friend did L3 childcare at college and went to study primary education at university. There is also the introduction of T Levels, which is meant to be a mix of BTECs and A Levels, which theoretically sets an 18 year old up to go into a workplace, go do an apprenticeship, or go to university. 1 T Level = 3 A Levels. I'm not convinced by them (as someone who worked on the development of a couple). They could also go do an apprenticeship at 16, but there's not a lot of these about, and they do need to go into college for a couple of days a week to do the theory stuff. A 16 year old could go get a full time job and leave education entirely, but their parents would lose the child benefits for that child if they're not in education at all.
Now this is where it gets complicated...some areas have a middle school system. These are usually Year 5, 6, 7 and 8, then they go to high school in Year 9. There's not a lot of them about, but they do exist. Then there's grammar schools. You have to pass an exam at 11 (or 14) to get into them. They're free and funded by the government like every other school, but they're selective. These are a hangover from the tripartite system where the 11+ exam basically decided your life because it determined what kind of education you received. "Fail" the 11+ and you will mostly study vocational subjects and won't go to university. Now, if you are in an area with state grammar schools, if you don't get the grade in the 11+, you just go to an ordinary secondary school and will do pretty much the same subjects as a grammar. I didn't go to a grammar because they literally don't exist as an option where I live. We also have state- funded faith schools. Around 1/3 of state schools are faith schools.
O Levels don't exist anymore. They were replaced with GCSEs. There was also something called CSEs, where the highest grade you could get was equivalent to an O Level C. My mum did O Levels, my dad spent too much time watching other kids' PE lessons from the classroom window and did CSEs.
Our education system is a complete mess.
Crustacean-2025@reddit
I disagree. It has certainly ‘evolved’ over the decades, but it isn’t ’a mess’. Our education system is actually pretty good for those who engage with it. We are a nation of moaners, but it has been said that a US high school diploma is equivalent to UK AS levels, and, although not the point, every English kid I know who spent a year or more in an Australian school had to return to catch up and remedial lessons in England.
And although I’d readily agree that some of our ‘newer’ universities’ degrees are not fit for purpose (and many will be bankrupt shortly), many American degrees appear to be a cobble together of full and half credit courses selected from a broad grab bag of options. Breadth but not so much depth.
hoveringintowind@reddit
GCSEs replaced O levels. Anyone who talks about O levels are probably 50+
Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit (OP)
What do they each stand for?
Crustacean-2025@reddit
Before 1986 your age 16 exams were O (ordinary) level, graded A-E; or CSE (Cert of Secondary Education) graded 1- um - 5? A C grade O level was a pass, a Grade 1 CSE was its equivalent. O levels were more academic. They combined into GCSEs due to the ‘stigma’ of CSEs but all it’s really meant is that less academic kids are getting grade 4/3 in their GCSEs (9 is top) instead of a grade 1-2 CSE, and certain subjects like maths have quietly introduced ‘higher tier’ and ‘lower tier’ GCSE papers, where I believe the top mark in ‘lower tier’ is no higher than 5 (a solid pass).
runsalmon@reddit
General Certificate in Secondary Education.
Students typically take 8-10 GCSEs, but can take more or less for a number of reasons. GCSEs are taken by almost all 16 year olds. It is extremely unusual not to do GCSEs. GCSEs are offered in most subjects, some compulsory (like English, maths, science), and some optional (there is a wide choice, which can be more restricted by what a school can offer).
They are graded from 9-1 with 9 being the best grade. Grade distribution data is best googled.
crucible@reddit
The 9 - 1 grading is only used in England.
Wales and NI still use the older A* - G system.
runsalmon@reddit
Love how those reforms to GCSEs made them easier to understand to the public and employers and made comparisons in attainment more possible too.
crucible@reddit
Yes, haha. I mentioned it in the school I work at and the teacher said “yeah you’ll be telling employers what your grades are in ‘old money’ for a few years” to the students!
hoveringintowind@reddit
I see it been answered but I thought I’d add this.
I believe in the US you get a school diploma. Which if I’m correct is a pass or a fail and is made up from scoring enough points collected through exams. I’m guessing you could suck at one subject but excel in another and it’ll average out. I could be wrong but that’s your system isn’t it?
In the UK you take exams on individual subjects and get a grade in those subjects. A-C is generally a pass, D-F is generally seen as failing the subject. For example I failed English language at school but retook it at GCSE level while I was at college doing my A levels and passed it.
crucible@reddit
D - G are still passing grades though.
A* - C are regarded as “higher level passes”, and are generally required to progress to A Level courses.
Thatnorthernwenchnew@reddit
Ordinary and advanced
Barbz182@reddit
It all depends what happens when you are 11. Some kids go to normal schools, kids in the south of England with pushy parents go to grammar schools and then ofc wizards will get their Hogwarts letters around this time.
horsethorn@reddit
Having talked this through with my American wife...
Public schools in the UK are private schools, paid for.
The equivalent of US public schools are comprehensive schools or academies.
Secondary school starts at 11-ish, and you do 3 years of fixed subjects. Then you pick 8-10 subjects to study (plus some compulsory ones), and at the end of year 11 (15/16 years old) you take GCSE exams in those subjects.
Then you can stay on and move into sixth form (if available) or go to college. You study 3 or 4 subjects (chosen from ones where you did well in the GCSEs) and then take AS level exams at the end of year 13.
When you apply to university, they often offer you a place based on what your A level results will be. You usually choose a subject covered by your A levels.
UK universities are different to American ones.
Here, you study just your chosen subject, and maybe a couple of electives during the course of your degree.
You don't do any of the English, maths, history, etc (unless that's your degree subject) that you have to take at US universities, because you've already done all that at school.
SuperShelter3112@reddit
Popping in to say that I think courses at universities in the US vary greatly depending on what you major in and type of school you go to. I was an English Literature major at a very small liberal arts college, and I did spend a lot of time there on liberal arts general education courses (a math, a science, a philosophy, a fine art, etc) in addition to lots of literature courses. My husband, on the other hand, went to a state university with its own college of engineering. His major was mechanical engineering. That is pretty much ALL he took. I think he had one first-year college writing course? So, I’m always the one saying things like, “Ah, that reminds me of something my Russian lit professor did,” or, “Oh, I watched that in an Italian Cinema class,” and he’s like, but…weren’t you an English major? Yes, yes, yes, but my liberal arts education has made me so well rounded! Anyway, like so many of my fellow English majors, I’m at a lowly public service job and he makes lots more money than me. 😂
shelleypiper@reddit
I think the point is we don't have majors and minors. We just have the course subject we chose to do, which we choose when we are 16/17 applying to uni.
IAmLaureline@reddit
And sadly I don't think we have any of those rounded 'liberal arts' degree courses left in England. They always sounded a great idea!
Crustacean-2025@reddit
I’m not sure. The people I know with degrees from ‘small liberal arts colleges’ tend to be jacks of all trades, masters of none. Similarly, the push at 16-18 for the broad International Baccalaureate instead of 3 A levels hasn’t really got off the ground.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
Right because there isn’t the concept of the liberal arts degree/college. They aren’t doing this at every uni in the U.S. and they aren’t doing it because they didn’t do it in high school.
alexoftheglen@reddit
In some subjects at some universities you can do the equivalent of ‘minors’ and ‘double majors’ we just don’t use that language and you select them before you start. BA Economics with French would be a BA with a major in Economics and a minor in French (I think this is known as “joint honours”). BSc Physics and Chemistry would be a double major in Physics and Chemistry (I think we call it “double honours”).
shelleypiper@reddit
It's very different though. A major is such because you cover other subjects too, so it's the major one from the broader pool. The language of major and minor isn't used because it doesn't quite apply, though it is a little similar as you describe.
You can absolutely do a joint subject half and half of something, or do mainly one thing with a little the other, but it's all chosen upfront before you apply to the university, and you don't do general education in other subjects outside of these selections.
Glad-Feature-2117@reddit
Others have explained public/private /state, but I'll try to explain the grades/years.
Children usually start school the September after they turn 4 - this year is Reception (I think like your Kindergarten), in a primary school. Legally they don't have to attend until their 5th birthday, though.
After that, they go into year 1 and usually stay in primary school until age 11/year 6. Then secondary school, from 12-16 (years 7-11). As others have said, they take GCSE exams in various subjects in year 11.
Young people are supposed to stay in full time education of some sort until they are 18. Many stay on at school to do A-levels (usually 3/4 subjects) - years 12 & 13; some do these at college instead. Some do more vocational courses/qualifications (e.g. BTEC).
In some areas, schools are divided into First (years R-4), Middle (5-8) and High Schools (9-11 or 9-13). In other areas, some secondary schools may be grammar schools (selective, based on an 11+ test, usually years 7-13).
PiccoloInfinite8613@reddit
Would just like to add that when you mentioned college in your answer, this is not the same thing as the American college. Our equivalent of American college is called university which you can pay to go to after you turn 18
Appropriate_Bet_2029@reddit
Except that some schools and universities are called colleges and some other universities are made up of colleges!
Crustacean-2025@reddit
But those students, when asked, wouldn’t say ‘I go to college’, they’d say ‘I go to uni’.
Appropriate_Bet_2029@reddit
Totally. Ultimately it's a little incoherent. It is totally comprehensible if you live it, but from the outside you shouldn't expect it to make perfect sense. Probably no country's system will!
Glad-Feature-2117@reddit
Good point!
rycbar99@reddit
Reception is actually the equivalent of pre-k in America and year 1 is the equivalent of kindergarten. I always presumed the same until I had a child move into my class! High/secondary school is also from 11 - I didn’t turn 12 until the end of year 7 😌
Glad-Feature-2117@reddit
Really? I know the ages are different, but from what I've read about Kindergarten in the States, what the children do there sounds very much like Reception in the UK. Either way, I believe attending pre-K is by no means as universal as Reception is in England.
Point taken about the ages, though I was (mostly, I may not have been consistent!) taking the years as the age someone is when they finish, to account for leaving full time education at age 18. Also, I was old in my year, so I tend to see it from that point of view.
MoonUnitMunster@reddit
A private school is a school that isn’t open to everyone - it’s paid schooling for a particular community, typically quite restrictive.
A public school is a school that is open to everyone. Some of the poshest schools are public schools as they recognise that education should be open to all - there’s a lot of history there, but they are paid schools.
A state school is a state funded school, funded from taxes in recognition that education is a right of all citizens. It isn’t open to everyone, it’s for people that are in that area, but everyone has the right to go to a state school in their area paid for by their taxes.
MoonUnitMunster@reddit
Just to add that open to everyone doesn’t mean you have a right to go there, so they set entry requirements - you must pay so much, must take this test, etc. They can make this test whatever they want, but everyone gets the chance to take it if they want.
A private school could just say no because you’re not from round here, not this religion, etc. A public school would always give you the test but if you don’t qualify say no. At least one state school would always have to take you based on your location.
Prestigious-Fan3122@reddit
I have a friend who lives in England. He has a seven year old grandson. My grandkids are eight and nine, so all of our grandkids are about in the same stage. When my older grandchild started kindergarten, we discussed that. When his grandson started kindergarten, their kindergarten is called "reception," not kindergarten. I think after kindergarten he was in "first year/2nd year" or wherever he is now. I've lost track. I can barely keep up with my own grandkids!
ProfessionalGrade423@reddit
I’m still confused and my kids have been in the British system for 7 years now. My oldest is in the middle of his GCSEs right and it’s a wild ride. The most different bit for me has been that the kids pick their areas of study so early. I didn’t know what I wanted to do until my second year of university but these kids are picking their entire educational trajectory at 17, or at least that’s what it feels like.
Sin_nombre__@reddit
Worth noting the things you are asking about are different in at least some of the nations that make up the UK.
illarionds@reddit
State schools - where the vast majority go - are the equivalent of what you call public schools.
Private schools are independent, fee paying schools, same as you.
Public schools are a small subset of private schools, which you may have heard the names of. They generally have long histories, and the "public" refers not to government vs private, but to the fact that they were historically open to anyone (who could pay) rather than being restricted to a particular guild, organisation, church etc. Some of the most famous are Eton, Harrow, Charterhouse, Cheltenham, Rugby, Clifton, Westminster, Marlborough, Haileybury, and Winchester. These are the schools where you will find members of the royal family, the aristocracy, children of foreign rulers and so on.
O ("Ordinary") levels no longer exist, they were phased out in the 90s and replaced by GCSEs.
GCSEs are exams/qualifications taken at age \~16, the end of compulsory schooling.
A ("Advanced") levels are the final examinations/qualifications of the UK school system before going to university, taken at age \~18.
We don't have "grades", we would say "year 1", "year 2" etc instead. The exact division varies regionally and even between individual schools, but for my kids, it's like this:
- "Primary school" (Foundation, Year 1-Year 6).
- "Secondary school" (Year 7-Year 11 = GCSEs)
- Year 12-Year 13 (A-Levels or equivalent qualifications. Can be as part of secondary school, or at a separate "college")
- University (typically 3 years, sometimes more).
Substantial_Quit3637@reddit
K-12 (Kindergarden, Middle school, High school) =
Primary 1-Primary 7 (Level 1 - Early middle school Equivelent)
Year 8-Year12 (level 2 - Middle school)
Year 13/14 (level 3 - High School)
Roughly, Tho exceptions like Scotland Ireland Junior/leaving cert and other things happen but the above is the broad outline
There USED to be exams for Post 11 (Primary 7 -> Year 8) period to determine schools you had access to
Then they Added exams at Key Stage 3 (Year10 -> 11) - (NOT THE SAME AS LEVEL 3)
Then GCSE (Year 12) was the last of your mandatory school education
but over the years many Vocational skills are seen as an Job orientated alternative + Essential Skills (IT,Math,Literacy) grew to cover those who left the school system
(Level 3 Qualifications = High school diploma equivalency) But with much more specialisation In subject areas
Level 3 Qualifications Determine eligibility for Other 'Further education' (Level 4,5,6 - Bachelors/Masters/Doctorate)
Feel free to ask other questions i kept it as broad as possible from my understanding of it and welcome corrections.
auntie_eggma@reddit
As you can see, not even the Brits can quite agree on this because they're nitpicking minor details about it.
The important bit is this:
What you call 'public school' in the US is called 'state school' here in the UK. It just means it's publicly/state-funded.
What Brits call 'public school' is a tier of very old schools that cost money to attend but which are technically open to anyone who can pay, (rather than being only for future clergy, or other specific requirement). So they're private in the sense that they're privately funded, but 'public' in that 'the public' can be admitted (as long as they can pay the tuition and do the work, ish). People seem to be disagreeing about how many schools count as 'public schools' instead of the more general 'private school' (other fee-based schools that are not among the 'public schools'). But that bit really isn't important for your understanding (just like we don't need to know exactly which schools are and are not Ivy League to know what Ivy League means). Just consider it a subset of private fee-based schools. UK public school is a specific type of private school.
Elses_pels@reddit
AFAIK a few centuries back education was only accessible to selected few with a title. Things changed when people started having money without the title. They could pay for schools and they were “public” - provided you could pay. I believe the term public school stuck. One of those curious UK things.
Maybe someone with a proper public education can confirm, I am a peasant and not even British LOL!
SirMellencamp@reddit
I keep seeing “if you choose to stay after 16”. If you leave at 16 do you graduate?
infieldcookie@reddit
We don’t do school graduations in the same way Americans do. My first graduation with a hat/gown/ceremony was when I finished university.
SirMellencamp@reddit
That’s sad. High school graduation was much more fun than university
erinoco@reddit
Normally there is nothing special about leaving British schools: once you have had your exams, the formal business is done, unless you choose to turn up at school in August to see your results. Having said that, because of the influence of American culture, many schools in the past couple of decades have decided to have a "prom" or "Leavers' Ball".
SirMellencamp@reddit
I get that but the high school graduation is a celebration that the rigid formal business is done. You are now on your own
erinoco@reddit
One big difference is that, in the US, your diploma is conferred by your own school; whereas, in British schools, the major exams are administered by independent examination boards, and you don't get the results until after the end of the school year.
SirMellencamp@reddit
So you could actually not graduate and not find out till that Summer? That would suck. Most kids here know by the last month of their Senior year if they are going to graduate. There are some that have to do well on their final exams to graduate but you def know before the graduation ceremony.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
There is no concept of graduation in the U.K. from high school. You either get your exam results to get into the uni or you don’t.
erinoco@reddit
The results day usually gets reported on the national news: for some unknown reason, the TV crews always go to schools where they can get good footage of 18 year-old girls celebrating.
SirMellencamp@reddit
are they all celebrating?
erinoco@reddit
The sad children get much less coverage...
SirMellencamp@reddit
Thats what I figured.
erinoco@reddit
What is worse is "clearing". When you apply to university, your conditional offers depend on your A-Level grades. If you don't meet those, then you have to scrabble around finding a suitable university willing to take you with whatever grades you did get. I spent my own A-Level summer dreading that; luckily, I got the grades for my first choice.
SirMellencamp@reddit
I most certainly would have been scrambling. I was a terrible student in high school
shelleypiper@reddit
I would also add that it's always seemed weirdly cringe / fake / self-congratulatory when seeing school leavers 'graduate' in American films and TV. It's just a completely alien concept here and comes across as people trying to make their school education seem like a university degree.
More recently, some nurseries (leavers age 4) have done graduation parties. It's seen as a bit tongue in cheek jokey / cheesey / silly but cute.
SirMellencamp@reddit
Yeah but its not understanding what it is then. No one thinks graduating from high school is equivalent to getting a Bachelors degree. High School graduation is more a celebration of freedom from uniforms and rules and schedules determined by others. Its about going into adult hood. You are finally deciding what you want to do with your life.
shelleypiper@reddit
Yeah, and I guess you wouldn't do that because you already have the choice of freedom through leaving school at 16 if you want to here. If you choose to stay until you're 18, that's your choice.
There might be like a leavers assembly or something but there's no hats or speeches or parents attending. It's not a big deal. I think most people wouldn't bother going because once you've finished your exams, you've already finished so why go back for an assembly. That's what teens have recently said to me.
SirMellencamp@reddit
I guess there is a caveat since once you turn 18 you are a legal adult and COULD just leave school if you want but I know one high school dropout and she left to go work for her Dad (its a long story). My daughter just finished her Freshman year at college. She went to a Catholic high school so her experience is different than most kids and everyone in her class graduated on time. I went to a public (government run) high school and my class started with 800 kids and I think my Senior class was like 600. A lot of those 200 moved or transferred but there were def some dropouts but I just wouldnt have hung out with those kids.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
In the U.K. a catholic high school could be a government run high school and many are. How mad is that? There are private catholic schools but pretty sure there are many more government run and funded.
shelleypiper@reddit
Are kids who leave at 16 or 17 leaving with no qualifications in the US? You would have GCSEs over here.
Alert-Painting1164@reddit
Correct. You either graduate high school or you don’t.
SirMellencamp@reddit
Yes. They are high school dropouts. They CAN go get a GED which is basically an exam that counts as a high school diploma equivalency which can get you into trade schools or a Junior College but there is def a societal stigma to being a high school dropout
infieldcookie@reddit
To be honest I didn’t give a crap about my secondary school so I don’t feel like I was missing out at all. I didn’t even go to our formal (equivalent of prom) and neither did about half of my year group of ~100 students.
SirMellencamp@reddit
Im sure it depends on the school. I just remember how much fun that Senior year was both for me and my daughter.
TheOrthinologist@reddit
There's no such thing as graduation in the UK (except from at the end of university). You just finish school, whether or not you earned any qualifications.
It's worth pointing out that our 'success' at school is judged by exams and/or tasks, set by external examining bodies. Teachers/schools do not assign tasks to determine a grade like in the US.
Adam_Da_Egret@reddit
Also, you could just take those exams again as an adult if you feel like it(although I don't know anyone who has bothered).
SirMellencamp@reddit
Interesting
GoldFreezer@reddit
Until recently education was compulsory only up to age 16. It's now compulsory to remain in education or training up to 18, but it doesn't have to be school. We don't "graduate", the closest thing would be passing your GCSE exams at age 16: schools aim for all students to leave with 5 GCSEs graded 9-4 [used to be A-C], including English and Maths but it's still not a case of graduating or not graduating, you just take your exams and leave with the grades you get.
Some schools only teach up to GCSE, so after that you will have to go somewhere else. Many students will go on to take A levels, typically 3 or 4 subjects which can be anything you choose. A levels are necessary to apply for university. If your school ends at GCSE, you will have to go somewhere else but many schools offer A level teaching as well.
Many students will go on to college after their GCSEs - college does not mean university here. At a college you can take A levels, but also a huge range of other more practical or work related qualifications (hair and beauty, plumbing, childcare, catering etc). You could also go straight into an apprenticeship/workplace training at 16.
SirMellencamp@reddit
Yeah school is compulsory in the US till 16, but if you drop out of high school at 16 there is a stigma to it and your job prospects are terrible. I mean they’re not good now even if you just have a high school diploma
GoldFreezer@reddit
The big difference here is that leaving at 16 with several GCSEs isn't dropping out, and if you want to do something like go into a trade, you will be just fine.
SirMellencamp@reddit
That’s not happening here, I mean YOU COULD end up in a trade but you really need to go to a community or junior college for plumbing or carpentry and you need a high school diploma for that. You can get in with a GED (high school equivalency exam) but there is def a stigma to dropping out of high school
GoldFreezer@reddit
I think GCSEs are equivalent to the high school diploma and our 16+ college is equivalent to the community college in this scenario. Leaving school at 16 isn't "dropping out" here.
Thatnorthernwenchnew@reddit
No we do t have high school graduations here. The school leaving age now is 18. At 16 you can stay to do more exams or go into employment or training
SirMellencamp@reddit
Damn. Such fond memories of high school graduation for myself and my daughter. It was so much fun on both ends
crucible@reddit
This varies by country:
https://www.gov.uk/know-when-you-can-leave-school
Basically you can leave school at 16 if you’re in Scotland, Wales, or Northern Ireland.
If you’re in England you have to carry on in some form of education, employment, training or volunteering until you’re 18.
qualityvote2@reddit
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Nevernonethewiser@reddit
In England we do use the term "public school", which I think is what's causing the confusion.
Schools funded by the government, free to attend: State school (paid for by the state)
Schools that charge a fee to attend: Public school (paid for by the public)
We started to call them private schools probably because it was so confusing!
MJsThriller@reddit
Different systems for Scotland and England & Wales AFAIK btw
Pristine-Return8307@reddit
Public school = State school Private school is the same as the US Grammar schools are those you have to pass a text to become a student.
We have preschool (what was called reception in my school) and then 1st through 13th grade
We have primary school (pre-school through to year 6) and secondary school (7th grade through to 13th).
You do GCSE’s generally in 10th and 11th grade and are these generally mandatory for everyone. A levels are done in 12th and 13th grade (what we would call sixth form) and this is voluntary, and usually only done if you want to go to university.
O levels are what GCSE’s were called in the past.
Kimbob1234@reddit
I'm in the UK and I've never understood the private/public schools thing!
Melj84@reddit
This is for England & Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are slightly different.
The cut off for birthdays is 31st August, so you would generally start Reception Class (first year of school) during the first or second week of September after your 4th birthday. Your parents can choose to defer until the January term is your birthday is July or August.
So you turn 5 during your first year of school (Reception Class) Year 1 - you turn 6 Year 2 - you turn 7 Year 3 - you turn 8 Year 4 - you turn 9 Year 5 - you turn 10 Year 6 - you turn 11 Year 7 - you turn 12 Year 8 - you turn 13 Year 9 - you turn 14 Year 10 - you turn 15 Year 11 - you turn 16 Year 13/First year college - you turn 17 Year 14/second year of college - you turn 18
After that is university. Which generally lasts 3 year for an undergraduate degree, unless you do a Foundation year, in which case you do 4 years.
Primary school is Reception class to year 6. This is sometimes split into Infants (Reception/Year 1 & Year 2) & Juniors (years 3/4/5/6) so ages 4-11. Primaries can also include a Pre-School Nursary for 3 year olds. Most only attend these for a half day & are then either at home, or with a childminder for the rest of the day. Not all children attend Pre-School nursaries, some attend Private nursaries, which cn take children from around 6 months old until they attend school. There are also Playgroups which are similar to nursaries but only take 2/3 year olds.
Secondary school (sometimes also called High Schools now) is years 7/8/9/10/11. At the end of this you (mostly) sit GCSE (General Certificate of Secondary Education) exams covering Maths, English Literature, English Language, and the 3 main sciences (Physics, Biology & Chemistry). These are the essential subjects & must be sat, unless you get a special dispensation from your LEA (Local Education Authority, which is in charge of all educational facilities in a specific area, such as a town or a burough of a city). You can then choose to take 4 other subjects, such as music, art, drama, history, geography, Computer Science, woodworking, textiles (aka fabrics or clothing design), a foreign language, and about a dozen others.
At college (years 12 & 13) you choose up to 5 subjects to study more in-depth, aiming to pick things that will assist in university or your chosen profession. These range from A-Level (meaning Advanced Level, as GCSE's used to be called O-Levels, meaning Ordinary Levels) to GNVQ/NVQ (General National Vocational Qualifications/ National Vocational Qualifications) to BTechs (British Technological Qualifications) depending on what you want to study, and whether it is a practical course (NVQ/GNVQ/BTechs these range from bricklayer, electrician, mechanic to computer technician, child care, physical education and animal care) or a classroom based course (A-Levels) such as history, music, mathematics, English Literature, accounting, photography, drama and art.
After that it is University. Which is mostly Undergraduate degrees, then Masters Degrees and PHD's. 💜 💜 💜
stringyswife@reddit
In the US, parents generally pay for pre-k or preschool unless the child qualifies for certain preschool programs at a public school, K-4 or K-5 is elementary, 5-7 or 6-7 is middle school, 7-8 or 8 or 8-9 is junior high, 9-12 or 10-12 is high school. Public schools are free and are based on your address then that’s where you go. In some states, you can do what’s called school of choice where you can go to any public school in your county with the correct paperwork filled out by a certain date. Private schools are mostly religion based and not free.
Reddit____user___@reddit
Private school - paid for education
Public school - very expensive paid for education at the likes of Eton, Harrow, Oxford, Cambridge
State school - obligatory free education for the rest of the country (the non 1 percenters)
Old-Refrigerator9644@reddit
In answer to your questions - it's complicated
Some terms
State school - school that you don't have to pay to attend.
Private school - school that you do have to pay to attend.
Comprehensive - a version of state school, historically if you failed exams at 11 (11 plus) you would go to a comprehensive which would have a less academic curriculum.
Grammar - If you passed the 11 plus you would go to Grammar School - Some of these are now private schools, some are state schools.
Just to add to the confusion while most of England no longer has the 11 plus I think Kent still does.
Public school - one of the posher private schools, they are called public because when they were founded the options were to have your children eductated with members of the public or at home by a tutor.
At 16 you will do exams these were, historically O (ordinary) Levels and are now GCSE (General Certificate of Secondary Education). Unlike US schools there is no graduation where you "pass school" each subject is independent. In my day it was typical to do about 10.
You can then leave school, if you stay there are options but A (advanced) Levels are the ones you asked about. you do fewer of these (3 or 4).
As for grades, that's not a term I'd have used but I would say you would use year 1 - 6 in primary school and occassionally year 7 - 11 in high school (up to GCSE). To add to the confusion I would have said that years 12 and 13 would normally be called sixth form (lower 6th and upper 6th).
On top of this I've only covered England - and there are probably regional differences that I'm unaware of there. I don't have a clue what Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland are like.
Why is it like this - quite simply it's various different systems that have been bundled on top of each other and bits have stuck around long enough to be confusing.
SirGuestWho@reddit
Lincolnshire also has the 11 plus if you want to go to one of the few remaining grammar schools
Old-Refrigerator9644@reddit
I'm 42 now so even if I passed it I don't think they'd take me
NotABrummie@reddit
There are four types of school to know about. State, public, private and grammar. A state school is the equivalent to a US public school. A public school is a fee-paying school that anyone can apply to. A private school is a fee-paying school with extra requirements, such as religious schools. A grammar school is a state school that has academic entry requirements (you have to pass a test called the 11+). We have primary and secondary schools, but no middle school. Primary starts with the Reception year at age 4/5, then years one through six. In year seven, we start secondary school. In year eleven (age fifteen/sixteen), we take GCSEs (these used to be called O-Levels, meaning "ordinary levels"). Years twelve and thirteen are referred to as sixth form if continuing at school, but some people switch to a technical college (like a trade school) at that stage, which is referred to as Further Education (FE). At the end of that (age 17/18), we take either A-levels (more academic) or BTecs (more vocational).
Emily_Postal@reddit
I have some British friends who stopped schooling completely at age 16 which surprised me because generally students in the US continue until they’re 18.
NotABrummie@reddit
Yeah, that's perfectly legal. Unusual, and likely not great for your future unless you've got a very specific opportunity, but it does happen.
R2-Scotia@reddit
You asked about England, Scotland has its own system.
To England, GCSE formerly known as O Level (ordinary) is a written exam in a subject. People who leave school and go in to trades stop here.
A Levels are in style much like an American AP, but are not for college exemption, these are what determines what uni you get into.
In Scotland, we used to have Lowers and Highers, the former 10th grade, the latter 11th grade and used for college. We do a 4 year undergrad degree, compared to 3 in England. The Highrr is about half way between GCSE and A Level.
Scotland also has Advanced Higher, which is a very high standard, above A Level and AP. Designed for kids going to university outside Scotland, notably England but also consider Japan where schools go to 13th grade. AH Maths and Sciences are at the USA's 2nd year college level, 1st year uni in England.
nickgardia@reddit
Short answer is public schools are so named because back in the day they were elitist establishments which prepared the kids that went there for public service (law, politics, medicine etc.). Which hasn’t changed that much.
Shannoonuns@reddit
A "public" school is a private school but we also use the terms private or boarding school. Public in this senario just meant that any member of the public could pay to send thier children there, historically "private" schooling was hiring a private tutor.
Our state funded schools are called state schools or mainstream but people would understand what you meant if you called it public then clarified you didn't mean private school.
Gcse's are the exams you do at 15-16, its possible to leave school with just gcse's but its not recommended anymore, an o level is an old name for a gcse. The name changed in the 80s.
An a level is the exams you do at 17-18 and its what you need to get into higher education.
We don't call grades "grades, we call them "school years" or just "years"
Nursery is for 3-4year olds, they normally go for half a day and its mostly to get them socialised and used to being away from thier parents. They don't learn much.
reception is for 4-5 year olds, we call it reception because you're basically introducing them to school. They have a full day and start having proper lessons and they start primary school officially.
Then year 1 is for 5-6 year olds, this is thier first proper school year.
Year 2 is for 6-7 year olds
Year 3 is for 7-8 year olds
Year 4 is for 8-9 year olds
Year 5 is for 9-10 year olds
Year 6 is for 10-11 year olds, this is when primary school ends for most kids. You also do some sat exams.
Year 7 is for 11-12 year olds, this is when secondary/senior school starts for most kids.
Year 8 is for 12-13 year olds
Year 9 is for is for 13-14 year olds, you do another round of sats and choose the subjects you want to study for gcse's.
Year 10 is for 14-15 year olds, you start studying your gcse's.
Year 11 is for 15-16 year olds, you finish your gcse's. You can either leave school now and study your a levels at a community college or at another school or you can stay at your current school.
Year 12 is for 16-17 year olds. You start your a levels, year 12 and 13 is also called 6th form and you normally have a common area and class rooms away from the rest of the school.
Year 13 is for 17-18 year olds, you finish your a levels and school completely.
Some areas have lower, middle and upper schools but its not always like the American school system. Like a lot of primary schools (elementary school equivalent) are split into infant, so nursery or reception to year 2 and then junior, year 3 to year 6.
Some secondary schools are split into 2 or 3 campuses and will call that lower and upper/lower middle and upper and I'm pretty sure some places do the American style lower middle and upper.
It really depends on population and geography, like in some places it makes sense to divide the kids up.
CaptainQueen1701@reddit
The UK doesn’t have one school system. England and Scotland are different countries with different school systems.
llamageddon01@reddit
I have a comparison chart you might find interesting on the Reddit page Acronyms 3: Abbreviations
GiftOdd3120@reddit
I'm not a parent so ages may be slightly wrong but from memory I had Nursery from age 3-4, lower Primary from age 4-6, Primary from age 6-10 - this is where we sit the first exams called SATs, Secondary from 10 - 16 - this is where we sat GCSEs (used to be called O-Levels in my parents generation), then we have College (where we would do A-Levels) or instead do a trade apprenticeship 16-18 (this level used to be optional but now it's mandatory I believe.) Once all that is done if you want to you can go to University to study further (this is what the US call College), this can start with a Foundation Degree which is basically one year of study to increase skills/knowledge before starting the real course, not all courses require this. Then the main course runs anywhere from 3-5 years depending on the subject and you'll get an Undergraduate Degree for this. If you want to continue you can do a Masters Degree, then PHD then Doctorate, and these all take various lengths of time. The last 3 are all done whilst working in the specific employment field.
CauseCertain1672@reddit
public school is a school you pay to attend because it originally meant in contrast to private tutors
a state or comprehensive school is one paid for out of taxes
jodorthedwarf@reddit
O-levels and CSE's were old examination systems that they used to use before combining them to create GCSEs which are exams you take, at 16. Then once your GCSEs, you can choose to either move onto Sixth Form or go into an apprenticeship or some kind of work-based training. Both of these options will run from 16-18 years of age.
OutdoorApplause@reddit
Think Harry Potter.
O Levels are the old name for GCSEs. They're the same as O.W.Ls, ie exams you take at 15/16 in 8-10 subjects approximately.
A Levels are the next set of exams in 3-4 subjects which you sit at 18 before you go to university. They're N.E.W.Ts. in Harry Potter.
AceHarleyQ@reddit
It's the same in reverse, we don't understand the US system on the whole (imagine some do).
Public school here is the equivalent of private/independent schools.
O Levels are an old qualification which are no longer in effect.
GCSEs are achieved in year 11 of school for us - at 16 years old. They cover most subjects - Maths, English, Science, IT etc (if you pass them all you come out with 11 GCSEs in total, so 11 different subjects).
GSCEs are a qualification which allow you to progress onto either an A-Level program or equivalent apprenticeship (hands on job experience, which pays a sub-par salary (most of the time) in exchange for teaching you how to do the job - can be anything from administrative office work to electrician to pharmacy assistant).
A-Levels are achieved across 2 years between 16-18 years old, and are the qualification we use to access university (college in the US).
An A-Level course is typically 3-4 specific chosen subjects and can be continued in the school you attended to year 11 typically, or can be done in a specific '6th form' (no idea why it's called that) college, or a general 'college' which runs various training courses for all ages. Typically, an A-level course is designed to be the stepping stone between school and university, so you get pushed by a teacher to do the work less than you were at school, but more than you would at university.
waamoandy@reddit
Sixth form is called that because in ye olden days you started back in year one when you went to secondary school. That means you did years 1-5 as compulsory education then you could elect to stay on for 6th form.
AceHarleyQ@reddit
That's interesting to know, thank you
movienerd7042@reddit
In the U.K., state schools are what you would call public schools. They’re schools funded by the state.
Then there’s fee paying private schools, ahd then there’s public schools which are even posher private schools.
Our kids start primary school at age 5, the first year is called either foundation or reception depending on the school. Then primary school goes from year one to year 6, year six being age 10 to 11.
Then secondary school starts at age 11, year 7. Some areas have middle schools, it depends where you are in the country.
GCSE stands for General Certificate of Secondary Education, they’re the exams you take at 16, which translate into real world qualifications. After you’ve taken these in year 11, you have to stay in some kind of education or training until you’re 18, but other than that you get to choose what you do next. Some kids do apprenticeships, some take vocational courses and some do A Levels (which stands for Advanced levels) which are more like university entry exams and they’re also real world qualifications.
Many schools have a section called a Sixth Form college, where you can take A Levels. Some people go to the sixth form of their secondary school, some people go to a different school for Sixth Form. Then there’s what we call college (different to your college, we always call that university), an alternative to a Sixth Form college where you can also take more vocational courses.
Sea-Claim3992@reddit
I'll make it simple, it's just a school all of them unless it's a private school. Our schools are government and council funded.
simonk1905@reddit
The UK being made up of several different constituent parts and having several similar but different cultures means that there is a lot of dialect and regional difference in how people refer to all sorts of things. Just look at the bread roll memes.
Essentially what it comes down to is there are two main types of school in the UK.
Fee paying - this includes what we call public and private schools. These are schools which are majority funded by fees paid for attendance. They generally have a higher standard of attainment and much smaller class sizes. Teachers who are well paid and not over worked.
State funded - pretty much any school which is not fee paying. Funded from general taxation. Generally called primary and secondary education and where the vast majority of children in the country go. Attainment levels run the whole gamut. You will have people who will end up at Oxbridge and also people who end up leaving with no school qualifications at all.
as others have said already.
O Levels are obsolete.
GCSE General Certificate of Secondary Education - usually taken at 16. The idea is that you should at least get a pass in core subjects. Maths, English and Science. This doesn't always happen.
A Levels are Advanced Levels and are usually taken at 18. They are optional but children are encouraged to remain in education until they are 18. If they are not doing A levels then some sort of vocational qualification is an alternative.
As for grades this has changed in the last 30 years. Gen Xers like me will remember 1st year - 5th year primary 5 - 11. 1st year - 5th year secondary 11 - 16. 6th form lower and upper 6th 16 - 18. This all changed and now they run year 1 - 13 I think and I still struggle to remember what is what despite dragging 3 children through the system.
Boldboy72@reddit
A Levels are Advanced Levels and are a minimum requirement to attend / get into University (before age 23 where you are a mature student and life skills / experience are as important).
GCSE / GCE (replaced O (ordinary) Levels) are the old minimum requirement before you could legally leave school at age 15 or 16 and start a full time job.
If a Brit tells you they went to college, they are actually talking about the last 2 years of secondary school (A Levels). The rest of the world means university when they say "college". Brits call that uni.
Kinggrunio@reddit
In the U.K., “private schools” and “public schools” are synonymous, meaning a paid for school, compared to a state school, which is free to attend. Confusing, I know.
GCSEs are exams held at age 15/16 over a wide range of subjects, and A levels are exams held at age 17/18 over a smaller number of specialist subjects.
How the schools are separated varies around the country, and our school “years” are numbered one differently from your “grades”, but I can’t remember which way the difference is.
Indigo-Waterfall@reddit
All public schools are private but not all private schools are public school.
Berkulese@reddit
My understanding is that private schools have an entrance exam (and fees), public schools you just have to pay the fees
NoiseLikeADolphin@reddit
State school is free, private school is paid. Our schools goes from year 1 (kindergarten) to year 13 (12th grade).
You take two major sets of exams while at school, GCSEs everyone has to take age 14-16 and you normally take like 10 different subjects. A levels are 16-18, some people do apprenticeships or other qualifications instead, and you pick normally just three subjects.
O Levels is the old name for GCSEs, idk when it changed, 1980s maybe.
Impressive-Safe-7922@reddit
Our schools really go from Reception to Year 13, kids generally start a year earlier than in the US.
crucible@reddit
GCSEs were introduced in 1986 with the first exams being sat in 1988, per Wikipedia.
texan-yankee@reddit
This is the clearest answer. Thank you!
ChangingMonkfish@reddit
Public school = Private, fee charging school
Private School also = Pricaye, fee charging school
State school = Publicly funded school
Academy = Privately run, normally by a non-profit, but state funded (i.e. it gets its money from the local council like a state school, but isn’t run/overseen by the council).
Flapparachi@reddit
Some great answers here, but the school system is also different in NI and Scotland, just to complicate things further!
shelleypiper@reddit
We would generally refer to the free school as a state school.
Then everything else is a private school, of which a public school is the poshest kind.
GCSEs= exams when you're 16, you can leave school after these.
A-Levels = exams when you're 18, if you've chosen to do those by staying at school or joining a college.
We don't call universities college or school. We generally say uni.
School years can vary in a minority of places but generally it's primary school (4-11) and secondary school (11-16 or 18). The first year of primary is called Reception and then it's Year 1, Year 2, etc. The final 2 optional years after GCSEs are called Year 12 and Year 13 but also known as 6th form. A few places have a middle school and high school structure instead.
This is for England. Scotland has different exams and school years and leaving ages. And uni is free for them. These are different countries with different education systems.
Super_Ground9690@reddit
The most common setup for State schools (free, government-funded schools that the majority of people go to) is Primary for ages 4-11 with the first year being Reception, then Year 1 to Year 6. After that, you go to Secondary/High school for years 7-11 (age 11-16). In year 11 you sit your GCSEs, usually in around 9 subjects including mandatory maths, English, science. For age 16-18 (year 12 & 13) you usually go to Sixth Form College and at the end of it you sit your A-levels in around 3 subjects of your choice. Sometimes a 6th Form will be attached to a secondary school, sometimes they’re stand-alone. After 6th form, also often just called college, you go to university. We do not call university college, which is where confusion with Americans can come in. To us, college is under 18 mandatory education.
Sometimes the schools are structured differently and there will be a middle school. I don’t actually know which years these are.
As well as regular state schools, some areas have grammar schools which are mostly an out-dated idea but essentially selective state schools where you pass an exam, called the 11 plus, to get in. If you fail the exam you go instead to a ‘Comprehensive’ which is not selective.
Most fee-paying schools are called private school. They can also have different divisions of ages, for example a lot will have “prep school” up to year 8/age 13 then the high school starts from year 9.
Then there are some fee-paying schools, generally the old prestigious ones, which are known as public schools. Others have given better explanations as to why they are called public, but I think of them as the extra expensive, extra posh ones.
O-levels no longer exist and were replaced by GCSEs back in the 80s. You used to have GCE O-levels (General Certificate of Education Ordinary Level) and CSEs (Certificate of Secondary Education). Children would sit one or the other, with O-levels being viewed as the harder of the two. They were combined into GCSEs (General Certificate of Secondary Education) so that everyone sat the same exam.
wardyms@reddit
Public and private school is an interchangeable term meaning fee paying. That’s the long and short of it. Yeah, it’s beyond confusing for everyone.
Albert_Herring@reddit
All public schools are private schools, but not all private schools are public schools - for a start, it's not used for primary age/prep schools, former grant-maintained schools that moved into the private sector in the 1960s, or historically for schools limited to children of the military, the clergy or a specific trade.
Bigchungus182@reddit
I might be wrong but I think it's, state school (free), public school (paid for) and private school I assume would be the really fancy expensive ones unless private and public are interchangeable.
If I didn't go to a state school I might know.
orange-busy-bee@reddit
Public school is just regular school and private school is paid for, but as a Brit I've never heard of a state school? But yeah private schools are seen as pretty posh haha
crucible@reddit
“State school” is just a term for your ‘average’ secondary school. State as in they’re run by the state, where the Government sets education policy.
Having said that, a previous Government changed things so the system of schools in England also being run at a local level by county council Local Education Authorities was abolished.
This brought in the Academy school system where an Academy is basically a secondary school that receives its funding directly from Central Government.
They are free to set other things like staff contracts, working hours, term and holiday dates, and the Curriculum they follow entirely independently. These sort of things would have been set centrally by a county council in the past.
Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit (OP)
I am so lost!!!
orange-busy-bee@reddit
Ignore my reply please, I was wrong, check the replies under mine :)
Bigchungus182@reddit
Yeah I had to Google to find out that public schools are the boarding school like ones.
orange-busy-bee@reddit
Really??? Huh. My life is a lie 😂
Bigchungus182@reddit
Mad isn't it 😂
orange-busy-bee@reddit
Absolutely bonkers
lidder444@reddit
Public school is private in the uk , state schools are reguosr ‘free’ schools.
I got a scholarship to one of the elite public boarding schools in the uk. In the 1980’s. ( don’t ask me how I did that, it seems like it was just in the right place at the right time)
I was only one of 2 girls that went daily. Everyone else boarded.
It was like Harry Potter without the magic
orange-busy-bee@reddit
Woahhhh nice one, that's awesome! I apparently haven't know the correct terms my entire life, it's good to learn them, though :)
Adventurous-Carpet88@reddit
Nah, private school is all paid for education, but it’s the really posh ones the are public school. Don’t ask why 🤷🏻♀️ I always view the posh boarding school places as public, where as private is more the middle class lawyer types where kids go home each day, usually local town scenario.
EconomicsPotential84@reddit
The "public school" thing is because these schools were set up as an alternative to education at home via a privately hired tutor. I.e they were open to the public so long as you could pay. It was cheaper than hiring a tutor, paying room, board, and wadges.
It's how the merchant class and lower aristocracy educated their children, these morphed into what is today the elite fee paying schools.
For general education, you start at reception, the first September after your 4th birthday. Years are then numbered, 1 through 11. This takes you up to 16. This period is general education and gives you, at the end, your GCSEs. Core subjects, maths, english, science, plus options depending on interests.
16 to 18 are called college. These could be apprenticeships, vocational training (NVQ, BTec), or further academic study in preparation for university (A levels)
Most regions use a 2 tier system for splitting years. Lower is years reception to 6 (ages 4 to 11), and high school is 7 to 11 (ages 11 to 16). Some use different systems.
Some high schools have college taped on, others it's separate.
New_Ad5390@reddit
20 years ago I (a 1st year US teacher) married and Englishman and moved to the UK to live and teach. The struggle trying to wrap my head around (this was pre-easy internet) the education system and its American equivalent was something I'm glad I'll never have to do again!
PMW84@reddit
Private schools are fee paying schools who will take anyone with the money to pay for them.
Public schools are elite private schools who will only take students whose parents have connections.
Zingobingobongo@reddit
The term “public school” is from before their was universal education for all. Schools were open to the public, for a fee. Only wealthier or middle class families had the luxury of sending their children to school.
LittleMissAbigail@reddit
In terms of whether you pay to go there:
State schools are funded by the government, are free to attend, and where most people will go to school. Private schools involve paying fees to attend.
To add more nuance, public schools are a specific subset of private schools which have no clear definition but tend to be the most elite/prestigious/rich (think Eton), and grammar schools are (usually) a selective form of state secondary school.
On the letters:
GCSEs (General Certificate of Secondary Education) are the exams taken by almost all students at 16 and they’re the most basic qualification you’re expected to get. Different schools will have different expectations on what subjects you have to take and how many (for example, my school made us take at least one foreign language) but most people will have between 5-11.
O Levels are the old name for GCSEs.
A Levels are what most people take at 18 (though there are other qualification options post-16). You typically take 3-5 subjects at this stage, and the grades you get will usually be the thing that determines which university you go to if you choose to do so (some universities such as Oxford/Cambridge or courses such as medicine will require more in the process, but most don’t).
In terms of stages:
This is weird because different parts of the country have different systems and different terms they use.
For me, I went to junior school from 5-11 senior school from 11-16, and sixth form from 16-18.
Primary school is most common for 5-11, and secondary school for 11-16. You might also go to a college (or sixth form college) from 16-18.
I know some parts of the country do use high school as a term, but I’m less sure how that aligns with ages.
Some places might also be prep schools (often private) which go from 5-13.
Grades are usually referred to as years, starting from year 1 (6) and ending in year 13 (18). Again, some schools might use their own system here too, but most people will recognise these.
nonsequitur__@reddit
My secondary school was named high school, but it was the exact same years etc as secondary school.
SparkeyRed@reddit
Just to say: most Brits find this whole "public means private" thing confusing too, when we stop to think about it. We just don't think about it very often.
giantthanks@reddit
In Scotland, children go to primary school for 7 years. P1 thru' P7. Then they go to secondary school for up to 6 years, S1 thru' S6. Many leave at S5. There are exams on secondary school, ordinary grades and higher grades. There're also advanced higher grades. Simple. In England, Wales and Northern Ireland, they have a different system. Children go to primary school for 6 years. Year 1 thru' Year 6, during which they have two SATs. Then secondary school is 5 years from Year 7 thru' Year 11. Then the General Certificate Of Secondary Education or GCSE Exams.
Then they have "college" or "sixth form" ie Year 12 (lower sixth form) turn Year 13 (upper sixth). Exams are A-levels (Advanced).
Education in the UK has a points based examination system so that equivalence and comparison can be made between Scottish and the rest of the UK and entry levels to universities.
GCSE and o grades are level 2 so don't qualify for UCAS tariffs.
Scottish higher results do qualify, an A gets 33 points. A B gets 27, a C gets 21 and a D gets 15.
Scottish Advanced highers... An A gets 56, a B gets 48 , a C gets 40 and a D gets 32.
A level exams, an A star gets 56 points, an A gets 48, a B gets 40, a C gets 32, a D gets 24 and an E gets 16.
Further education courses offer CAT points (Credit Accumulation and Credit), a BSc is worth 360 points, reach full academic year of work 120 points.
BTECs, Access to HE diplomas, and T Levels etc ask have points that count towards degrees.
nonsequitur__@reddit
School Types: - state school is free to attend, government-funded, and based on where you live (catchment area), like public school in the US. - private school is paid for by parents and operates independently, the same as in the US. - public school refers to prestigious fee-paying schools like Eton or Harrow. They’re a subset of private schools, historically called “public” because they were open to anyone who could pay, not just to the aristocracy/clergy.
Grades/years:
In the UK, children start school around age 4 in what’s called Reception. Then they go through Year 1 up to Year 13. We use years, not grades. - Primary school runs from Reception to Year 6 (ages 4 to 11). Years 1&2 are referred to as Infants and years 3-6 are referred to as Juniors. Some have separate sites for infants and juniors and some are on the same site. - Secondary school starts at Year 7 and goes to Year 11 (ages 11 to 16). - After that, students can leave or choose to do two more years (aka sixth form) which covers Year 12 and Year 13 (ages 16 to 18). This is where students take A levels if they’re aiming for university. There are also separate sixth form colleges.
Exams:
There are other exams and qualifications too.
Hope this makes sense!
Relevant-Battle-9424@reddit
Age 5 is also the first mandatory year of school in the US (Kindergarten). Before that, we have preschool from 3-5 which is optional.
cazzawazza1@reddit
Ok so to start, let's do ages. Primary school is 4-11ywars, secondary school is usually 11-16 and includes GCSEs which you do from 14-16, and college is a-levels which is 17-18+ but this is sometimes part of a secondary school. There are slight regional and local variations like some areas have middle school, some start GCSEs earlier,etc but that's the standard.
crucible@reddit
Well, since about 1999 / 2000 and the rise of devolved politics, the UK has 4 separate school systems depending on if you’re in Scotland, England, Wales or Northern Ireland.
Scotland has always been quite different to the rest of the UK - they don’t have GCSEs or A Levels and the school year system is different, too.
England, Wales and NI all have GCSEs but a previous Government changed the way GCSEs are graded in England about a decade ago.
DoIKnowYouHuman@reddit
Is this the time where we explain that ‘high school’ is a thing in the UK or confuse OP further by talking about ‘Key Stage’ levels?
thomasgamer99@reddit
Technically secondary school is middle school and high school combined but I choose confuse op
cazzawazza1@reddit
Oh dear. This is getting way more complicated than I thought!
Top-Raspberry-7837@reddit (OP)
😂😂😂
odkfn@reddit
That’s English!
Scotland primary is primary 1-7 then secondary school / high school is 1-6 but you can choose to leave after 4th year of secondary school.
College is similar to the last two years of high school in terms of generic subjects like maths but you can also specialise in other things like a trade.
University is the level above college / high school.
cazzawazza1@reddit
Then public schools here have tuition fees and are for posh/rich people (mostly). Normal schools, which I guess you'd call local authority schools, are the same as us public schools though most have turned into academies now which I think is similar to what you call charter schools
cazzawazza1@reddit
A-levels are probably closest to SATs but they are in any subject. GCSEs are like mini A-levels. They're both nationally standardised exams which most employers or universities will require some form of.
TarcFalastur@reddit
It might help to understand the history behind the education system.
Originally - about 1,000 years ago - the only education that existed was through the church. If you wanted to learn to read then you had to either study to become a priest or be rich enough to pay one to teach you. Consequently, the church was also where all of the study into things like philosophy, medicine, etc, was done. Universities literally were originally designed as higher learning for clerics. That's why University robes are a bit like monk robes, and such.
Over time, as Church-trained scholars became more important as clerks and government officials and scribes, local magnates started seeing the value in giving some people education without having to become priests at the end. They started leaving legacies after death to pay for some local kids to be given an education in reading/writing, classical languages, arithmetic, science, history etc so they could enrich the area they came from. These were termed public schools, because they weren't just schools for priests, they were schools for the public too.
Over time, many of these became very well-regarded, and so rich folk wanted their kids to be educated there. Thus, many of them became elite learning establishments charging huge sums for attendance. Some of the less-elite ones still catered for the average people and tried to give a well-rounded education. These turned into what are known as Comprehensive Schools (or just "Comprehensives").
Several centuries on, we got to a point where universal education was possible. The government opened thousand of schools, and so these were called State Schools.
runsalmon@reddit
There is some strange and false information in here.
Over-Dragonfruit-961@reddit
It's a bit messy but hope this helps. Note: split into the Scottish education system. Cba working it out on the US system of elementry etc.
https://www.wordpip.com/articles/school-years-what-are-the-classes-called-and-what-age-groups-are-in-them
Age USA England Scotland
Primary school 4-5 PreSchool Reception Nursery 5-6 Kindergarten Year 1 P1 6-7 1st Grade Year 2 P2 7-8 2nd Grade Year 3 P3 8-9 3rd Grade Year 4 P4 9-10 4th Grade Year 5 P5 10-11 5th Grade Year 6 P6 11-12 6th Grade Year 7 P7
Secondary (a.k.a high) school 12-13 7th Grade Year 8 S1 13-14 8th Grade Year 9 S2 14-15 Freshman Year 10 S3 15-16 Sophomore Year 11 S4 16-17 Junior Lower Sixth S5 17-18 Senior Upper Sixth S6
Free-Question-1614@reddit
I'm not gonna comment on public vs private school because, frankly, I don't want to. But I can explain the "grades" and exams we do
School for us starts at year 1 (5-6 yrs old) anything before this is either reception or nursery (depending on how old the kids are) in areas I've lived in there's been primary school (years 1 to 4) middle school (5 to 8) and high school (9 to 11) or there's been primary school (years 1 to 7) and high school (8 to 11) In year 9, we choose 4 subjects to take along with our "core subjects" which are English, maths and science, out of the option subjects, 2 of them need to be ebacc (an acronym I assume) which are computer science, geography. History and a language (for me it was German, but I assume it can be different)
As for exams, we do our GCSES at the end of high school, they're graded 1-9 with 9 being the highest and usually around 4 is a pass. A-levels are the degree you do when you go into college, they can be replaced by an apprentiship, or a couple other options.
Hope this clears some confusion for you
AllRedLine@reddit
Public School = fee paying, private sector school.
State School = 'free' state provided education, paid for via taxation.
Schools are set up in 'years'. Typically a child will attend 3 different schools during their pre-undergraduate education. Those are;
Qualifications are as follows;
O-Levels no longer exist - they were replaced by the GCSE like 30 years ago.
Cantseemtothrowaway@reddit
Public schools in the UK are a subset of private (aka independent) schools, usually the longer established, more prestigious ones like Eton and Harrow. The equivalent of US public schools we would call state schools.
GCSEs (General Certificate of Education) are exams usually taken at around age 15/16, they replaced O (ordinary) levels and CSEs (certificate of secondary education), which are no longer offered in the UK, in 1988.
A (Advanced) levels are a higher level exam usually taken at age 17/18. You would normally need A levels to go on to University
Children usually start school at age 4 and would attend Primary School (Reception followed by Years 1 to 6) until age 11 when they would start Secondary school which is Years 7 to 13 (Years 12 and 13 are often known as 6th form - Upper and Lower 6th). There are some variations across the country with some areas having Lower Middle and Upper School and some places calling Secondary ’High School’.
Children must attend some form of education from the term starting after their fifth birthday (though they can be homeschooled) and can leave at age 16, but must then stay in education, training (recognised apprenticeship or similar) or part time training/education plus volunteering or work until they are 18.
RiskyBiscuits150@reddit
Others have covered the difference between public/private vs state schools.
GCSEs and A Levels are English and Welsh qualifications. Between the ages of 14 and 16 typically, students will study between 8 and 12 subjects, with exams in each of them at the end of the two year period. Subjects like English, maths and science are core subjects that everyone studies and then there are a variety of other subjects that can be chosen. The exams, along with coursework completed over the two years, are graded. Jobs and schools/colleges will often require certain grades.
For those that want to and that achieve high enough grades, they can go on to study A Levels either at college (not the same as US college) or sometimes at their school. Student usually study between 3 and 5 A Levels, and these will be selected from the subjects they took at GCSE. A Levels are required for entry into university, which is comparable to US college. Different university subjects will require specific A Level subjects to have been undertaken, and when an offer is made to study at university this is usually conditional on the applicant achieving a specific minimum grade. The most competitive universities and subjects will require straight As.
We have no equivalent of a high school diploma. Without sitting GCSE and A Level exams, students leave school without any qualifications. It is possible to go back and study these at a later date, usually at a college.
Scotland has a slightly different system, the qualifications are called different things, but essentially follows the same pattern and general rules.
boomerangchampion@reddit
A public school here is what you would call a private school. You have to pay. Yes it's confusing lol. To make matters worse, not all private schools are public schools, 'public' school is a historic name and only applies to some of them.
Most people go to free 'state' schools which are what you would call a public school.
GCSEs are exams you take at 16 years old. You do about 10. A-Levels are taken two years later and you only do 2 or 3. O-Levels are an old version of GCSEs and don't exist any more.
The years are just called that...Year 1, Year 2 etc but we start at Reception year so they're 1 ahead of the American grades (I think). Most of the Uk has primary (reception to year 6) and secondary schools, some parts have primary, middle, and high which are split R-Y4, then 5-8, then 9-11. Years 12 and 13 are sometimes carried on at the high school (and called 6th form) or sometimes at a separate college, which isn't the same as your college.
Now that I've typed it out it is all extremely confusing.
butcanyoudancetoit@reddit
Most kids go to a free state school (what you call public school) but there are also fee-paying schools which we call either private and public schools for complicated reasons but generally the more famous super posh ones like Eton, Harrow, Rugby etc we call "public school".
Even free schools are complicated because of a mix of systems....
Almost everyone attends from Reception (age 4) and then through Years 1- 11 (age 16). Year 11 culminates in the General Certificate of Education (GCSE) which is a bit like your high school diploma. People then choose to stay on for more school-style education and study Advance Levels (A levels) and then maybe university (what you call college), OR they study something vocational as an apprenticeship. There are other options at 16 too but those are the main ones. Until recently people could also just quit education at 16 and start work as adults.
For most people, Reception to Yr 6 are at a Primary School (your elementary school) and then Yr7-11 are High school, and then Yr12-13 are college or sixth form which is a continuation at a high school. Yr1-3 might also be at an infant school and Yr4-6 at a junior school, or there might be a middle school.
High school could be a modern state comprehensive (everyone of all abilities studying together like you guys do), or it might be an older system called the Grammar system. In the grammar system, kids in Yr 6 do a test and the top percentile are creamed off the top to go to a high performing school called a Grammar school to study typically more academic subjects. These days the rest probably have a selection of comprehensives to choose from but in the past would have gone to a less well resourced school to study more vocational subjects. The grammar system is controversial to this day and a great way to start an argument.
In recent years there are also "academies" and of course there are many religions schools, but this is already a complicated enough answer!
CosmicDancer2002@reddit
Private School (Public) = Parents pay tuition/scholarships, more freedom about how they teach etc. Grammar School = funded by government, but have more control over finances etc., most have an entry exam State School = government funded, no entry exam
Primary School = ages 4-11, Years Reception (4-5yrs old) to Year 6 (10-11yrs old) Secondary School = ages 11-16, Years 7 (11-12 yrs old) to Year 11 (15-16yrs old) Sixth Form = ages 16 -18, Years 12 -13 - a lot of secondary schools are combined with sixth forms College = some you can attend at any age but most start at 16, leave at 18
GCSEs are exams that are done in Year 11 - most students will take approx 8-10 subjects - these grades effect what sixth form/college/apprenticeship you do attend after secondary school A-levels are exams taken in Year 13 - most students take approx 3-4 - these grades effect the fact your higher education e.g university O-levels used to be GCSEs I think but they haven’t been a thing for a few decades
However the systems differ depending on which country in the UK you’re in
PipBin@reddit
O levels are an old exam that we don’t do any more. The O was for ordinary and the A was for advanced.
O levels were replaced in the late 80s by GCSE. You take these at 15/16. At 13/14 you pick the ones you want to take. You have to take English, Maths and a Science. After that it’s up to you depending on the career you want to do. So if you decide to take French or Home Economics or Art then you’ll continue to study it. Otherwise you drop it. You do about 9 GCSEs, I think.
After GCSEs you take A Levels. This is more specialised and you do less of them. You usually stay at your school to do them but you are then in 6th form and the day is often less formal. Back when I was at school you could leave at 16 and not take A-Levels. Now I believe you have to take them or do some alternative training.
I_am_notagoose@reddit
So you’re correct about ‘public school’ - in the UK it refers to what you would call a private school. The reason is that they pre-date the establishment of what we call state schools (what you would call public schools) and were public in the sense that they weren’t run by the church or other such institutions and were open to anyone.
The rest varies depending on where you live in the UK. I can only really answer for England & Wales as I don’t really know the other systems.
We have ‘years’ rather than grades and start a year earlier than in the US, so Year 1 = Kindergarten, Year 2 = 1st Grade, etc.
GCSEs (General Certificate of Secondary Education) are qualification in England & Wales which pupils work towards in Years 10-11 (so equivalent grades 9-10) Until about 10 years ago you could leave school at age 16, so for many these were their final qualifications. O-levels (O for Ordinary) are in simple terms an old name for GCSEs and were replaced by them several decades ago. A-levels (A for Advanced) still exist and are the next level, undertaken in years 12-13 - though note that these days there are a range of other more vocational qualifications students can choose to take at that age instead these days.
The school layout varies on a very local level, but where I live (and I believe the most common arrangement) is Primary school up to Year 6 (Grade 5), then Secondary school from Year 7. Some secondary schools go all the way up to Year 13, whilst in other places (or as an alternative option) students may go to study at a further education college (different from a university here) for those last two years for A-levels or vocational qualifications.
This is a bit of a simplification from someone who left school many years ago, and there are more things that could be added, e.g. some areas have separate secondary schools called Grammar Schools for more gifted students, but I think that’s the basic answer to your question.
MiniMages@reddit
The private schools you are thinking about are known as Independant schools where people pay for each year.
These exist at all levels and offer the same qualification up to universities.
Agitated_Ad_361@reddit
In England, School starts aged 4 in ‘Reception Year’, aged 5 is Year 1 and it goes up to Year 13. Regional differences have this split up differently. Where I went to school in South East England, infant school does Years R-2, Junior/Primary School does Years 3-6 and Senior/Secondary School does Years 7-13.
SupersloothPI@reddit
In the U.S., a public school is the school that’s free to attend if you live in the area and it’s funded fully by the government. Private school means you pay to go there, and it’s selective.
In the UK it seems a private school is our equivalent to a public school? Or something like that? I don’t get it.
public school and private schools are both fee-paying. yes, confusing.
government schools are usually called (often, academies, changed since i was going), comprehensive schools, and grammar schools (these require entrance exam passes to get in). used to be known collectively as secondary schools.
Also what are GSCE’s
exams you sit as you leave secondary school, from 11-16. sat at 16.
primary school is 4-10.
and A levels
exams you sit at 18 if you choose to stay on after 16. you go to sixth form college (if you reach certain grades, usually 5 gcse good passes). you can also go to 'college' - not a 6th form, where entry is more lenient.
there are other qualifications available in this age bracket, but a levels are the 'academic' ones.
and O levels?
gcse replaced them.
Do you have 1st through 12th grade too?
year 11 is for the 16 year olds, final year of secondary.
Elementary, middle and high school? Or how are your school ages/levels separated?
primary, secondary, then college. after that, university (usa calls college).
OrganizationFun2140@reddit
State schools in UK are equivalent to public schools in US. Private schools are fee paying, and may or may not be selective. Public schools are a sub-set of private schools; ones which have been around a very long time, are highly selective, and the school equivalent of Ivy League.
Yarn-Bunny@reddit
Private and public schools are both paid-for education. Public schools are more expensive and exclusive, think Eton. State education is our free education.