FBO employees, does anyone else feel the “gap”…?
Posted by fgflyer@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 256 comments
So I work front desk at a Netjets FBO. Oftentimes I just sit there and think, “here I am, barely making $19 an hour before taxes, and every single person who walks through that door are multimillionaires who generally spend more cash on a single flight than a lot of people make in an entire year. And some of them aren’t that much older than me.”
I know it’s a “trust the process” thing and I’ll get to my flying career eventually, I’m 23 and have a lot going for me, but do any other FBO employees or ramp rats sometimes feel like they’re just a peon and feel very stuck, and out-of-place?
TheJudge79@reddit
You might not realise it now, but if you’re doing a good job and being enthusiastic then people are noticing and appreciating you. That goes a long way in the corporate world if that’s where you want to go. I know of an owner back in Europe who paid for a guys licenses because he went above and beyond and then gave him his first flying job. Sounds unreal right?? Well, I know it’s a one in a million chance but you never know .
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
You might be surprised how many of those people teeter on the brink of collapse of their wealth, too.
But no, it’s not just you.
Remember this and be sensitive to it when you’re an airline pilot, too. Almost everyone in the operation makes less than the Captain, especially if that Captain is there on any sort of premium trip—and THEY know it, too.
SpeedbirdTK1@reddit
Once flew with a captain who got called for a premium trip on the turn of my pairing (I was straight pay) and asked the FAs during the sit if they wanted coffee and what their orders were. When he got back with their drinks, he asked all of them to pay him back... come on bro. It was pretty awkward with him and the FAs after that.
slamgeareatrear@reddit
I’ve had the inverse happen. FA asks me if I can get her a coffee on a short turn because they have to start boarding soon. I was going to get myself some anyways so I went, I bring her coffee back, she immediately asks me what’s my Venmo to pay her back. I start laughing and say don’t worry about it. She was insistent on Venmoing me. I didn’t let her.
This captain in this story is clueless.
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
Yeah. That captain is spare parts.
throway9912@reddit
If someone offers to get you coffee, you should expect to pay them back in some way. Are you all pretending an FA won't get themselves a latte on their own dime? It's not like they can't afford a coffee or latte.
Just because the Capt makes more money, the person receiving the favor shouldn't have to pay them back?
I've also seen FAs get offered by the Capt to get them a coffee, and then they proceed to order a customized latte.... Do you think that's acceptable for them not to offer to pay when the Capt brings back their custom lattes? Should a Capt do that for all 4 FAs? What about on the widebody?
The entitlement is ridiculous these days. I'm 38 years old and there's a massive difference between the young pilots now and when I was there.
TwoZigZags45@reddit
That latte costs her like an hour of work and costs the capt one fucking micro nano second of work. So yeah, he should be a GD gentleman and buy her coffee
Bot_Marvin@reddit
Yes.
throway9912@reddit
Haha. As I said, the entitlement of posters here is remarkable.
pressingfp2p@reddit
My brother in Christ that’s not entitlement, that’s manners. Don’t offer to get something for someone in a worse financial situation than you and ask them to pay it back, that’s impolite as fuck.
Also, if you’re asking for payment back it’s not really much of a favor you’ve done there. If cap is offering to go to Starbucks for them or something, cap should be paying. If you aren’t paying, don’t offer to get it.
throway9912@reddit
I know numerous FAs that are in much better financial situations compared to me. Most others, I have no idea what their financial situation is. And you don't know either - you clearly assume their financial situation based on external factors.
Manners is offering to pay for the coffee that the Capt offered to get for you. At least in my operation, the reason I'll ask is because it's either myself or the FO that is able to leave the aircraft and make that coffee run - the FAs cannot leave the aircraft with passengers onboard. I will likely not accept your money if you offer to pay me back but I certainly appreciate the gesture and will remember that.
Sad_Fruit_2348@reddit
LOL if you think any FA is better financially set then an airline pilot
throway9912@reddit
No, you misunderstood. I KNOW flight attendants that are in better financial positions than I am.
But sure, tell me I'm wrong while knowing nothing about me or the other people I'm talking about.
Your current job title does not dictate your financial health. I'll be kind and assume you're very young.
Sad_Fruit_2348@reddit
There’s not a single FA making what a Pilot is making.
To argue they’re in a better financial situation is ignorant and stupid.
You’re either an idiot or a literal child.
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
One can argue the the captain is entitled by thinking he was entitled to get paid back.
I would not accept the offer because coffee is foul. But I'd also decline because I'm perfectly capable of getting my own and I don't want the awkwardness that could ensue with strings on that social contract I was unaware of.
satapotatoharddrive4@reddit
Buying the crew coffee at least once during the trip is a good gesture.
throway9912@reddit
On a 4 day trip, I may fly with 6 or more sets of FAs. Sometimes maybe it's 3 sets of FAs in the 4 days.
I think I can handle figuring out if and when I'm going to offer to buy coffee for strangers. Good day to you and everyone else in this silly conversation!
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
If someone offers to get me something is them offering to pay for it.
old_flying_fart@reddit
You’re also clueless. She wanted your digits.
slamgeareatrear@reddit
I’m married homie
EezyBake@reddit
I keep hearing about that. The more said pilot makes, the tighter they hold onto their money. Personally don’t understand it.
cincocerodos@reddit
You know, I get it, to an extent. My brain has this "this has got to be too good to be true, we better save our money" switch. That said, it's within reason. It more applies to "maybe I don't need to spend THAT much on that" rather than being the guy who's taking the hotel toilet paper home in his bag.
boobooaboo@reddit
I asked once, and an FA took me up on it and ordered an $8 coffee. I’m a ULCC FO, it’s fine, but it was more than I was expecting. So,I don’t offer anymore. When I say “coffee,” I mean coffee. So now I say, “if anyone puts in an order at the B17 Starbucks, I can pick it up for you.
FYI, Iused to be a regional FA, made $16 an hour and always offered to pay the pilots back for my coffee.
cincocerodos@reddit
Offered once when I was a regional FO and she did that. Never offered again. I thought there was a general tact of "if someone is offering, don't ask for some expensive thing off the menu", but apparently not everyone is that self aware.
Brambleshire@reddit
Wow I bet that Starbucks really destroyed you. How did you financially recover?
boobooaboo@reddit
I’m glad that I don’t work twatwaffles like you.
I’m just saying I wasn’t expecting to buy an $8 “coffee.” When I was a broke flight attendant, I only ver asked for normal drip coffee and always offered to pay when the pilots brought it back, so that’s what I was expecting in this case.
al_andaluz@reddit
Had this happen to me. She ordered some 4 shot expresso caramel latte with sprinkles. Spent like 9$ on it. Never again.
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
It was the fucking sprinkles that put it over the top
Noktomezo175@reddit
I understand it to just be coffee. But then I fly with enough captains enough times that when they say do you want anything during the turn, they mean that pretty literally. And even though I know they mean it sincerely, I still feel guilty. But I'm also the rare unicorn that will buy coffee for the pilots, too. I'm also happy with the ones that will get me into the club with their fancy credit card. 😂😂😂
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
One modifier only.
Yesthisisme50@reddit
Lol wow. Seems like a lot of CA’s are some of the cheapest dudes
Paying for the FA’s coffee usually makes their day and that helps out a lot
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
With the gutting of contracts I actually somewhat understand it too.
Still, the Captain’s take home is almost always the biggest.
Ok_Bar4002@reddit
Gutting of the contracts? Every US captain makes more than premium captains did 5 years ago.
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
The bankruptcy era is still living memory where I work. YMMV.
ZOB_oo_land@reddit
As opposed to the FAs who are making at absolute most half of a Y2 legacy FO lmao. You don't get to talk about "the bankruptcy era" if you lack that level of perspective.
greenflash1775@reddit
It takes 6 weeks to make a new FA. That’s why their pay is where it is. A Y2 legacy FO has probably been flying for nearly a decade or more.
Brambleshire@reddit
So? The point is FAs tough it out with a fraction of our pay.
Going the "well we deserve it and they don't" route doesn't work because SOMEBODY has to do the FAs job. If everyone in the world was a massive over achiever and born into pedigree someone's still gotta work the cabin. Be nice to people that make less than you.
greenflash1775@reddit
No, the point is that bitching about how much someone makes (or your pay relative to that person) who has many years of experience and certifications is silly. It’s comparing apples to fish. Humoring people with unrealistic expectations is a huge problem in our society today.
It doesn’t mean you aren’t nice, don’t buy coffee, don’t drop a tip (if you’re only doing a dollar a bag you’re a cheap fuck BTW), or don’t pick up a check. You can find comparisons ridiculous and not be cheap, they’re not mutually exclusive concepts.
ZOB_oo_land@reddit
I'm aware. Was just making fun of the above "muh gutting contracts" excuse to avoid buying the occasional latte for a FA.
Yesthisisme50@reddit
FO’s can make $300k on year 2 pay now. I think a CA can afford to buy FA’s coffee.
VulkanLives_08@reddit
Gross. Man makes enough money to be in Porsche daily driver territory and goes Dutch on the coffee.
bottomfeeder52@reddit
typical autism of a pilot thinking the favor is just applied to asking and getting the coffee not paying
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
The autism jokes are getting old.
I know autism comes in different flavors. But being socially oblivious or just a bit of a dick doesn't not mean asd.
qmriis@reddit
As a likely autist fuck you being on the jokes
bottomfeeder52@reddit
then why is it so common in the profession?
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
Being a dick? Probably dealing with people that think they're autistic for being a dick. At certain point you just lean into that shit and people leave you alone. Life is grand.
I know true autistics. It's very different.
FujitsuPolycom@reddit
Yeah, this. The autism shit really needs to go.
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
Bro, were facing an up hill battle.
semiprobookie@reddit
It doesn't preclude it either though.
kyle_Larsons_mole@reddit
I hired a kid with Asperger's. Aware they don't use the term. You absolutely knew this kid wasn't all there. And it is very different from pilot autism.
If you're actually around it you know the joke is tiresome and downright offensive
T-yler--@reddit
So autism is fine but not ADHD... come on FAA
qmriis@reddit
Anything is fine as long as it's untreated and undiagnosed derp
exbex@reddit
Call ops on the radio and ask them to send mx over because someone left a tool on the plane.
serrated_edge321@reddit
Oof.
Probably one of those twice-divorced ego dudes...
busting_bravo@reddit
My FAs often try to return the favor of all the coffee/dinner whatever I bought - I usually say no thanks, had enough coffee, then when they see me drinking more, I just politely say I changed my mind and bought some.
HappyBappyAviation@reddit
Damn... I try to buy at least one meal for my crew a trip. That's awful that he expected them to pay it back. Like c'mon. Pay it forward a little.
cincocerodos@reddit
This. And try not to complain (about much really, but especially money) in front of van drivers, ramp guys, etc. Your 401k alone probably gets more free money dumped into it from the company than most people will ever see in a year. Be nice.
Warking2015@reddit
bro i feel you but 12.50 an hour for me as I park their 300k car in front of the weekly private jet they take in/out of town that he flies to his second house in california
Nora_Walkuerie@reddit
Lol fuckin tell me about it. I work at an MRO, interacting with the obnoxious assholes rich enough to OWN these fuckin things makes my skin crawl lol
fhfm@reddit
Sounds like a hell of a networking opportunity. Meet everyone you can and make yourself memorable. It’s a shockingly small community
ResponsibilityOld164@reddit
for real
MondayNightRawr@reddit
That flair…
ResponsibilityOld164@reddit
I fly airplen ✈️✈️🛫🛫🛬🛬🛬
DisregardLogan@reddit
This guy flies airplens
ResponsibilityOld164@reddit
Thank you for your validation 🙏
HV_Conditions@reddit
You fly airplen?
ResponsibilityOld164@reddit
there are rumors alluding to it yes
HV_Conditions@reddit
O my goodness
humboldtreign@reddit
The quickest way to unhappiness is comparison to others.
Katana_DV20@reddit
This comment should be pinned permanently on every Reddit sub.
cincocerodos@reddit
On every social media site, really.
Katana_DV20@reddit
True!
Im so grateful not to be afflicted with envy and jealousy but some of my friends are.
I don't know how they stay sane. Hours spent every day swiping through insta posts of celebs or other "high net worth" people stepping out of G650s or Global 7000s and rolling in G-Wagons.
Comments like "Not fair, how is this fair?" are below the pics...
cincocerodos@reddit
I mean with the people on IG I just assume they either rented a jet to take pictures in on the ground, will be broke in a couple years max when they realize "selling courses" isn't a long term wealth generator, or they'll be in jail for some kind of fraud. People forget how much of what they see on those platforms isn't real.
Katana_DV20@reddit
Exactly so. There was that one dude in Dubai, forgot his name. Built up a huge following on IG , endless posing with bizzjets and Rolls Royces and then it all came crashing down.
andrewclarkson@reddit
My wife and I occasionally fly into bigger(to us) airports when we go on vacation. I never cease to be amused at taxiing my Cherokee in past all the bizjets and watching the line crew bring out a little red carpet for us to step out on.
poisonandtheremedy@reddit
This was me at Henderson Executive Las Vegas yesterday 😂 I feel like Jed Clampett.
peripro@reddit
Yeee Doggie, landing at Henderson in my Exp. Glastar.......7 jets lined up to takeoff.
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
The places that treat the little gasoline bangers mostly the same as the big-ticket Jet A burners deserve public praise.
andrewclarkson@reddit
Most of them do a pretty good job in my experience. The worst we ever really have run into is certain places cough signature cough that just make no effort whatsoever and that’s not even every location.
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
Signature Flight Lack Of Support.
Hell I had them turn their nose up at a King Air once and promptly took my Jet A order across the airport…
KaHOnas@reddit
They clearly didn't need your business.
I will go out of my way to avoid giving Signature any business. They continually let me down.
dopexile@reddit
Signature doesn't want General Aviation, that's why their AVGAS prices are always like $3 a gallon more than normal
KaHOnas@reddit
Unless you're flying a Phenom or a Gulfstream, they couldn't care less about you. Helicopters and turboprops are just a nuisance to them.
vismaypikachu@reddit
On the other hand I have never had a bad experience with Signature. Had a complete electrical failure (C172) out of KAMA on Wednesday at 8pm flying to KRBD about 1 hour in.
They tried helping when the ARTCC called them to get our information when we lost service with center by texting us with some numbers.
Hawker96@reddit
They treat bizjets that way too. Shitty service doesn’t discriminate. Signature is kind of a meme but my experience is its all about location rather than FBO chain. There’s great and terrible and everything in between with any brand.
Gand@reddit
Agree! Flying my 182 into KLAS and parking between the private BBJs and citations, walking through the same FBO doors, and being treated extremely well was quite an experience.
itszero@reddit
lol for real, looking at the clapped out 182 I just parked with a broken door lock cylinder that just fell out of the door and all the big boys behind it was a vibe
FujitsuPolycom@reddit
Fake it till you make it!
AWACS_Bandog@reddit
I remember going into Signature (Obligatory: fuck them) years ago, and when I called to make my reservation the only way they found the aircraft type was under 'Gulfstream', which is technically accurate but im a dinky AA5A.
The moment she thought I was a G4 its amazing how the tone of that call changed, and then went to confusion when I didn't want any G4 things like Lav, GPU, or JET-A Service.
Had to argue with the lineman the day I got there when they still rolled up with a Jet-Truck after explicitly saying im 100LL...
Legitimate-Watch-670@reddit
"if you ain't got an engine upgrade for this thing sitting in the cab, I'm gonna need you to go back and get the other truck please"
Legitimate-Watch-670@reddit
Only had it happen once, but yeah it was a really weird mix of amusing, but also a little ...idk the word, not sarcastic, but kind of joking around? 🤣
But then again, even if I was a rich person coming off a jet, I wonder if I'd feel like I'd take it much worse, like I was being mocked or something lol. I'd probably have my pilots call ahead to specifically request they don't do that..
KITTYONFYRE@reddit
yup. this might be my favorite aviation picture:
https://i.imgur.com/CxhGP2h.jpeg
my brother took it as we were heading to an air show the morning after I'd flown in. pretty hilarious to see all these 8 figure planes sitting next to the club's absolute shitbox lol
Spottedowl8274@reddit
Ramp rat checking in, started to make ends meet while I (barely) fly with the few students/new renters I see come in at my other job. Marshalled in a Vision Jet a few months ago. Pilot was super cool, noticed me gazing inside at the flight deck and offered to let me climb in, showed me the whole setup. When I made an offhanded comment about never being able to afford one this man looks me dead in the eye without a shred of irony "just buy one used"
TravelerMSY@reddit
I always think about the jail at Rikers Island. They’re within a few hundred feet of the runway at LaGuardia.
scrubhiker@reddit
I hear the plane a comin, it’s comin into land …
RageAga1nstMachines@reddit
But I ain’t seen a NetJet since, I don’t know when
CMDR_W0LF3@reddit
Hey, at least you're making $19/h, I'm scraping by making $17/h
Bowzy228@reddit
If this makes you feel any better, I’m a 33 y/o unemployed CFI working the ramp at the local class bravo and I run in regional FOs in their mid 20s and some of them don’t even respond when you say hi. They feel like gods with their aviators on looking at me like “get away from me you dirty rampy “. Fck my life 😩
dopexile@reddit
That blows my mind, I am always super thankful when ramp employees marshal and go the extra mile to you out
NoDistribution9217@reddit
Someone needs to remind those regional guys that they are flying at a REGIONAL. Nothing against all regional pilots, but everything against regional pilots who think they are better than others. Hell, any pilot regardless of what they fly who has that attitude can stuff it.
Dependent-Place-4795@reddit
Regional influencers lol
grateful_bean@reddit
Welcome to working class America. It's not just aviation.
Gratzsner@reddit
Yep, and most people live their entire lives thinking that one day, they'll "make it". But, in reality you'll probably just live and die as a poor person, just have to accept it.
dopexile@reddit
If you sit around with that attitude, complain, and wait for someone to solve your then sure you'll be broke your whole life.
If you work hard, learn skills, be frugal, and invest your savings then you can quickly make things happen. It took me 15 years to go from broke college student to millionaire.
instant_ace@reddit
Hey now, that "one day you will make it" is what gives all those tax breaks to the billionaires...one day you too could be one who gets a huge taxbreak by being a billionaire /s
Dave_A480@reddit
Who else are we going to give tax breaks to, what-with the rich paying 50% of the total federal tax revenue collected, and the bottom 50% paying essentially zero.
The more dumb stuff (like 'no tax on tips') that we do, the less and less people actually get stuck paying for the government after all the breaks come out...
And that overall is a significant problem...
KITTYONFYRE@reddit
I don't mind the 1%. Many of those here are in the 1%. I don't think the 1% needs to bear more of a burden
I think the .1% or the .01% need to get fucked.
Nah. There's no reason that wealth inequality should be as high as it is in the "greatest country on earth", we certainly don't need more regressive taxes.
SwoopnBuffalo@reddit
The problem is that the tax code has so many loop holes carved out for these people over the years that I don't think anyone has any clear idea of how they could be effectively taxed. The fact that people are taxed when we "make" money means that the people who have so much wealth that they can borrow against it or are never effectively taxed. You'd almost need to tear the whole tax code down and rewrite it to be able to get those fuckers to pay their fair share.
Spark_Ignition_6@reddit
The U.S. has the most progressive tax system in the OECD. https://www.oecd.org/en/publications/growing-unequal_9789264044197-en.html
instant_ace@reddit
Dollar for dollar the rich might pay more (I don't have the numbers in front of me, but from all the loopholes I've seen, they might not) but as a percentage of income (can they afford it) they absolutely do not pay their fair share. Don't even get me started on corporations....
Dave_A480@reddit
That is absolutely not true.
The rich (top 10%) earn 25% of the TOTAL income earned.
They pay 50% of the TOTAL taxes paid.
This isn't dollar-for-dollar. It's percentages.
And corporate tax? All that has done, besides reinforce the idea that companies should not retain earnings, is drive up prices for consumers....
The 'best' tax is a no-deductions personal income tax, graduated based on the percentage of total income any given 10% cohort earns (eg, people making over 250k/yr earn 25% of the total income earned? That cohort should pay 25% of the total federal revenue collected).
instant_ace@reddit
What do you think the top 10% in the USA make per year? I'm referring to the 0.01% or even the top 1% who don't pay their fair share because they shelter it or they use loopholes to not pay as much.
As far as corporate taxes, those being stuck at whatever ridiculously low rate they are now only makes money for the shareholders...screw the average worker. Ford vs Dodge was a wonderful case study in how even when Ford wanted to improve the lives of his workers by offering them more, the money has to go to the shareholders.....
Dave_A480@reddit
You hit top 10% at 192k/yr.
bigpowerass@reddit
You’re getting downvoted but it’s true. We have one of the more progressive taxation regimes in the world. Income taxes on a middle income earner in France is about double what it is in the USA.
instant_ace@reddit
Many would say that you get a lot more for your money in France for those taxes though....like universal healthcare and much cheaper if not free secondary education...
ATACB@reddit
The average person can definitely be a millionaire by making good choices and investing. The average person will never be a billionaire. You don’t get there by hard work.
instant_ace@reddit
Not sure if I believe the average person can get to be a millionaire...there are a lot of barriers for people of color, etc.
Millionaires...sure but thats not what the tax breaks are for. They are for the 0.001%, amounts of money we can only dream of. Republicans have convinced the MAGA group that they too can get to be this wealthy and when they do the tax breaks will help them..but those MAGA people will never get to that level to enjoy those benefits...
Rich get richer..poor get poorer..
KITTYONFYRE@reddit
you should pretty easily be a millionaire even if you're making 40k/yr man. let's say you do pretty much the absolute bare minimum and save 2.5k/yr (6.25% of pretax income per year - pretty doable) in a roth IRA. we'll say your gains average 10%/yr, minus 3%/yr for inflation. you start with $0 at age 25, at age 65 you now have $1.2 million in your retirement account
basically every young person now "should" be a millionaire when they retire. if we instead say "average" person, yeah, they ABSOLUTELY should be retiring as millionaires. it's just that being a millionaire in retirement isn't actually that glamorous (live off ~4%/yr means you're still making 40k ish a year)
SwoopnBuffalo@reddit
Yea, you're technically right, but that's not the type of millionaire people think of when they use the term. Saving for 40 years to barely break into 7 figures is a lot different than someone worth high-7/low-8 figures by the time they're in their mid to late 40s (which is what most people think of). You could take all of my assets now and I'm probably in the 7 digit figure net worth club but I am by no means a "millionaire" in the traditional sense of the term.
That's not even accounting for the loss of spending power that happens after 40 years. If you use 3% as a basis for inflation and start the clock in 2010, in 2050 when I retire I'd need $3.07 to equate to the buying power of $1 in 2010. So that $1.2mil I've saved is the equivalent of $400k in 2010.
Dave_A480@reddit
For those of us who started out at 30k/yr & made it well into the 6 figures, that sort of attitude falls into 'if you think like that, yeah, you have to accept it'...
OutOfBase@reddit
"I don't want to go to college. I don't want to start a business. I don't want to take any initiative. I just want to smoke pot and play video games. Why can't I find a job that pays more than $19/hr?!
Brambleshire@reddit
If everyone went to college and started a business what do you think would happen?
fgflyer@reddit (OP)
I love how you’re making so many negative assumptions about me, lmao. I’m busting my ass off working 50-70 hours a week here, on average, on top of flight training and timebuilding, so that I can continue to get the ratings I need to advance my career.
Sometimes though, I feel stuck and burnt out and I suppose it just resulted in this post.
OutOfBase@reddit
I'm not even referring to you. But your comment just goes along with the spirit of your post - you think the world is about you and you're entitled.
You are in an ENTRY LEVEL JOB. You have no skills or abilities. You are starting at the bottom - just like everyone else who isn't generational wealth and flying around in their daddy's private jet. Which is everyone here. We all worked for what we have.
My first jet job paid $19/hour, and I got 50-70 hours a month.
xprtcombatninja@reddit
What do you think of the new contract?
fgflyer@reddit (OP)
I’m sorry, I fail to see how I think “the world is about me” and I’m “entitled”. You seem to be very, very good at hurling out negative assumptions about people in general, and I don’t know why that is. I know not everything is about me. A feeling of envy about a situation does not equal entitlement - I think that’s something you’d probably be able to understand.
I’m working for what I want too, and working a lot. I know what it means to work hard, as I said in my previous comment, but that does not stop me from feeling stuck at times.
FujitsuPolycom@reddit
Miserable old asshole, ignore him. You're doing fine, keep at it. Your thoughts are normal.
FujitsuPolycom@reddit
Could have just said "I wasn't talking about you specifically", but no...
Kuchington@reddit
Yeah dude, you probably walked both ways up a hill in the snow to get to your first pilot job too.
For fuck’s sake - people are allowed to complain about their job every once in a while without being accused of being entitled.
Ils20l@reddit
When people say shit like this guy, it's all about them and their issues. Fuck'em. Life is too short to deal with losers. People like him take a bite of your ass because it is the only taste of success that they will ever have. You got this.
Dave_A480@reddit
I don't know that he was SPECIFICALLY talking about you, OP...
More responding to Gratzsner's general dig at capitalisim.
LaserRanger_McStebb@reddit
I'm a multimillionaire? This is a nice surprise.
TrowelProperly@reddit
you were born middle class. Tough shit. They were born rich. It sucks, but thats how lifes always been
Major-Owl-2821@reddit
I make $15 an hour working at my FBO and I've got an EAB cub I keep on a trailer for when I clock out. Those high dollar folks in their all metal planes are spending way more to fly than I am. I'm pretty happy with the situation. I work at an airport and I have my own plane. That was kind of the goal for me.
BlacklightsNBass@reddit
I’m not wealthy at all but also not a “peon”. But just remember…. Humility is the highest value currency one can have. My mindset is to never look down on anyone and also never be envious of those with higher wealth or status. We all leave this earth eventually anyway…. Just want to have good vibes with everyone I can
GMTMaster_II@reddit
So - I fly privately through these FBOs, not Netjets but just regular Atlantic and Mill etc where you meet the pilot in the lobby.
I often do feel like a douche walking in with a dog and a pile of bags that someone else insists on taking.
It's even weirder calling rental car companies and having to beg for special reservations teams because reps don't understand the difference between an airline and a tail #. I even get embarrassed when I tell the cab to go to the other side of the airport..
DataGOGO@reddit
I used to work at an FBO at a small regional airport (lineman) and felt the same as you.
I learned just not to look at it that way. At the end of the day how much money other people have has nothing to do with how much money I have. Whatever circumstances they are in has nothing to do with my own. So I just focused on myself and my own goals.
Eversonout@reddit
It’s a good attitude to have, it in actuality it’s not necessarily true. What with trickle down economics (or lack thereof) the upper classes have a direct effect on the wealth of those below them
DataGOGO@reddit
No, it is absolutely true.
No they don’t. Money is not a static resource, there is an unlimited supply. One person does not have less because one has more.
Eversonout@reddit
There is not an unlimited supply of money lol. That’s just false
DataGOGO@reddit
Yes there is.
We print huge amounts of it each year, non-paper money just poofs into existence; quite literally.
Point remains, how much money others have had no impact on how much you have either way.
Eversonout@reddit
If you definition of money is paper bills, than sure. However, the value of money is not infinite. For all the money that “poofs” into existence, the purchasing power of all the other money decreases. There is an effective cap on money because of this.
DataGOGO@reddit
It is controlled, but unlimited
Spark_Ignition_6@reddit
This is only true if the total value of goods and services etc remained the same, but it does not - it grows. More wealth is generated every year.
Spark_Ignition_6@reddit
There literally is. Google fractional reserve banking. Wealth is not a zero sum game.
Smokey_Bird@reddit
I was flying those guys and making $30,000 a year. How do you think that feels lol.
Piperpilot645@reddit
I have for sure. Especially since my entire adult life has consisted of obs at or slightly above minimum wage.
I'm 43, soon to be 44. Back in 2018, I took a job at a small independently owned FBO that dealt with a lot of business, charter and privately owned aircraft.
I was a line guy making $13.75 an hour at the age of 37. I once had a passenger fly-in on a citation. When him and his wife got off the plane, they were immediately looking for a ferry to get to Block Island. Since the weather was bad, the nearest ferry was closed. The closest one was around 45 minutes away.
He asked me if I could drive him there, I said unfortunately we don't drive passengers that far. He immediately said " how would you like to make $200" I responded with " let me go grab the keys to the crew car"
I got them there 15 minutes before the ferry departed. He put another $100 in a cup holder. That's $300 to drive somebody 45 minutes away.
When you meet people that are around your age that are living like this, it's very discouraging and depressing at times. It really makes you rethink your life and the mistakes you made.
I'm currently working towards my commercial pilot's license and have a much better outlook on my life, but it is absolutely wild how big the wage gap is out there in the world.
T0gaLOCK@reddit
That is how it goes in the world and in life... I started making $7.25/hr working 3 part time jobs before I went to flight school. That was 10 years ago. I finished flight school and worked my low time jobs building my 1500hrs and never made more than 25k/year, covid hit, my airline CJO was cancelled and I was making 18k working a shady 135 job. Covid passed, I got to a regional, then a major, now I am a CA making over 280k/yr.
Appropriate-Front809@reddit
The days of that kind of progression are over for the foreseeable future. No more getting to a legacy with 2000 hours. I have 4000 hours (and counting), a masters degree from a public ivy university, a 100% first-time pass rate on every checkride I’ve taken. It’s been crickets for a year and half from every legacy where I have apps including multiple letters of recommendation at those places.
ltcterry@reddit
A friend was flying Citations for an upper-medium sized Part 135 business and commented once that he was well paid to sit in the front seats of an airplane he couldn't afford to sit in the back of.
I can't afford a supersonic ex-Soviet jet, but I'm glad I live in a country where it's allowed. Most places in the world don't have general aviation at all, let alone affordable hobby flying.
ValeoRex@reddit
I always chuckle when someone treats me like crap because they think their wealth equates to status. I have a best friend in banking that told me almost everyone living that “high roller” lifestyle that comes into the bank is leveraged up to their eyeballs and living pay check to pay check like everyone else.
I know every line guy by name at the FBO’s we frequently fly into. As a corporate pilot I’m not making airline pay, but I still offer to pick up lunch for the staff every time I get a crew car. There’s times I’ve even door-dashed family packs of BBQ and left it all in the staff room for the line guys to share.
I type all this to say, you never know people’s status in life. Some (maybe most) of those guys getting in the back of the jets are probably more broke than the line guy making $19 an hour. Some of the workers are likely more wealthy than the clientele they serve. Be nice, treat everyone with respect, and keep a positive attitude.
Oregon-Pilot@reddit
I remember we had some lady fly her very large cabin private jet up from her home in California to her home in Oregon so her assistant to grab some vegetables from her garden for dinner. I was in high school at the time, working at an FBO, and I thought, I wonder if this lady would let me just grab her veggies in the morning and drive them down to her and she could put me through a year of college?
OutOfBase@reddit
A large majority of those multimillionaires are successful people who bring skills and abilities to the world and are compensated as such. The rest are generational wealth.
Sounds like you weren't born wealthy so now you're stuck being compensated based on your skills and abilities.
_toodamnparanoid_@reddit
I'm a multimillionaire who was simply lucky, right place right time. There's a ton of luck involved for most of the multimillionaires I know, too.
fvpgkt@reddit
Bullshit, unless you hang out with crypto bros and lottery players. A huge majority of multimillionaires worked hard, saved, and invested. They sacrificed nice cars for 401K contributions. They paid off their house instead of going on vacations. Also this is r/flying. The average demo in here is flight crew making 6 figures, most likely. It requires gross mismanagement to end a career without becoming a multimillionaire. There is next to 0 luck involved for 95% of us.
OutOfBase@reddit
Exactly. I'm a multimillionaire, but I'm not able to afford private jet travel. Reddit just just extremely biased towards young, liberal kids who think the world owes them something without having to work for it.
Agreeable_Speaker_45@reddit
Is it a liberal view though? It’s a well known fact the vast majority of these people come from generational wealth. Hell, with the cost of living skyrocketing, things like a college education are becoming pay to play systems.
Spark_Ignition_6@reddit
Not true at all. 79% of millionaires did not receive any inheritance at all from their parents or other family members.
OutOfBase@reddit
Is what, specifically, a liberal view? I was merely remarking that reddit skews towards a younger, liberal audience who often don't have any skills, abilities, or useful education.
Agreeable_Speaker_45@reddit
On the contrary Statistically speaking the younger liberal audience, are the most educated demographic. Yea a couple people worked their way up, but not everyone that didn’t make it was lazy. Some people worked their whole lives and are still stuck
OutOfBase@reddit
I'm not talking about statistics in higher education. I was specifically referring to the average reddit user. The same type of person who compares themselves to others and complains about how much better other people are doing. You know, kinda like OP?
LegalRecord3431@reddit
No matter how cool you think you are, I have never in my life seen this amount of cringe level LARPing on reddit. I am just as right wing and conservative as you are but my god you come off as someone who hasn’t been laid since high school.
_toodamnparanoid_@reddit
We might have different definitions of multimillionaire. Perhaps I should say UHNW individuals. Because no one I know at thos level has skipped on cool cars to put money into a 401k. Or even ises a 401k. There's so many better ways to get tax advantage but keeping liquid.
fvpgkt@reddit
Multi-millionaire= someone with a net worth or more than $2 million.
OutOfBase@reddit
Cool, then why don't you give the poor desk boy some money?
_toodamnparanoid_@reddit
New phone who dis
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
Anyone who has any hand in flight operations or works around aircraft in general deserves more than $19/hr IMO, but that’s just how it is🤷🏼♂️
CliffBooth1234@reddit
Working at a desk? I don’t think so. Same ability as a barista at Starbucks. Arguably Starbucks barista has more ability.
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
Everyone needs to start somewhere. Not everyone has the money to just GO to flight school. A-lot of people need to get their foot in the door with entry level positions to crack into the aviation industry. It’s really lame to sit here and disagree with the fact that anyone involved in aviation deserves more than 19/hr. I wouldn’t mow a lawn for less than 20 bucks, so why should I be compensated less for having a hand in flight operations? Even if it just means greeting people like you with no respect as you walk in.
OutOfBase@reddit
Why does someone with literally no skills or abilities deserve more than $19/hr?
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
I shouldn’t have to spell it out for you. You’re entitled to your opinion. I was just speaking my mind.✌️
OutOfBase@reddit
One day you'll grow up and see how the world works.
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
The way you talk about other people is genuinely disappointing. It makes me wonder if you’ve ever actually faced real struggles, because if you had, I doubt you’d speak about others with such disregard. You're entitled to your opinion — you can argue that $19/hour is a fair wage for the work being done. But the way you choose to refer to others says a lot more about your character than your argument ever could.
OutOfBase@reddit
Oh no! Anyway...
CliffBooth1234@reddit
Obviously everyone needs to start somewhere. That’s clearly the stage the OP is in. That doesn’t mean they should be compensated higher than their worth.
fvpgkt@reddit
Nobody “deserves” anything, my dude.
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
I’m not talking about getting handouts, I’m talking about getting compensated for your time at your place of work. What are you on about, my dude?😂
fvpgkt@reddit
Well I mean you are talking about handing out $19 each hour to someone just because they work adjacent to planes. I’m not saying I don’t want everyone earning a bunch of money, I do, but shitty rampers and line guys and CSRs don’t “deserve” anything.
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
I never said they should earn a bunch of money, I simply said I think they deserve more than $19/hr. You need to learn what handing out money means. I’m not talking about giving a random person on the street 20 bucks, I’m talking about someone who is giving up their free time to be somewhere and do what they’re told. I’m not gonna go back and forth on this anymore, I didn’t realize me wanting someone to have a livable wage was so controversial.
flyingforfun3@reddit
Man, I will agree with this when service actually gets back to pre covid.
You know how many times I get parked, drop a pax, pay a bill ($500-1000 ramp fee - Signasty, I’m looking at you.) then no one comes to pull chocks or Marshall me out.
We carry plenty for tips and we tip when there is actual service, but it’s been awhile since I’ve had any worthwhile service.
I started on the ramp in 2010, I was paid $9 hour, in 2011 I made $14. If I ever let a pilot pull the chocks, not help with bags, or not Marshall I would have been fired.
Customer service is rare on ramps now. I basically expect to pay a ramp fee to just get chocks put on the nose.
OutOfBase@reddit
I'm not sure working a front desk really qualifies as a skilled trade.
Shark-Force@reddit
God I would hate to fly with you.
LegalRecord3431@reddit
You are the second person that has told her this today.
OutOfBase@reddit
Oh no! Anyway...
PullDoNotRotate@reddit
My eyes just rolled into the back of my head so hard the “click” was audible.
LegalRecord3431@reddit
Bro you really are an insufferable fricken douchebag 😂😂
ThatDougPerson@reddit
NetJets employee here also. Order and set up shipping for aircraft parts. (AOG maintenance) Definitely feel like a peon everyday shipping parts to ritzy locations i can't afford to visit. Hopefully the Aviation Science degree I'm working on gets me out of parts, but definitely a small peg at CMH. 😑
DatBeigeBoy@reddit
I remember when I became a flight instructor my dad told me that I was about to see a world where money was limitless. That I did not have a true understanding of how much wealth is out there until now. He was right. I watched a dude roll into our FBO in his PC24, go mountain bike for a couple of hours, ride back and just takeoff into the sunset wherever he came from.
Most of us will never know wealth like that.
MunitionGuyMike@reddit
Some people are just better off from the get go than others.
Don’t think about it too much and do your best
fallskjermjeger@reddit
Most of the people who are better off were born with that advantage, not all, but most.
exbex@reddit
Most millionaires did not inherit it, they saved and invested.
fallskjermjeger@reddit
Being born into upper middle class, and the socioeconomic advantages that comes with, is probably going to be a shared trait of the majority of the 20M+ millionaires in the US. I don’t doubt investments are a huge part of their wealth, but that’s the fun thing about having money, it has a tendency to accumulate more money.
FujitsuPolycom@reddit
Going to make a lot of privileged people upset with that comment.. oops I did it too.
BraboBaggins@reddit
Your be surprised at how many of those people arent eeally loaded… some a surprisingly large number def are not.
skywagonman@reddit
Gotta appear rich to your friends!! Slams door on clapped out Falcon 20.
ZOB_oo_land@reddit
Haven't seen too many Falcon 20s still in a passenger configuration. But I'm sure they're out there kicking around SoFlo and such
skywagonman@reddit
There’s a ton out there still. Wish there were more passenger birds. The freighters are all trashed to shit now.
BraboBaggins@reddit
Ha Im just over here getting excited about pulling up in a brand new 69 year old Bonanza 😅🥴
Notable-Oatmeal@reddit
Hell yeah!
Amazing-Number-3228@reddit
Hey dude, first off wanna say thanks for the help yall provide (based on post history I’m assuming this is at our newest location in AZ). As an AZ based PIC at NJ you guys always provide great service and make our days easier, so I for one certainly appreciate it.
As someone who worked line service and CSR at another FBO in the Phoenix area I can resonate. Took alot of patience to trust the process and keep grinding, especially when feeling like I wasn’t where I wanted to be in life while watching the people younger than me being much more successful. Hang in there and know we all started somewhere, but this experience you’re getting will be beneficial in the long run.
Not sure what your goals are in the career, but if NJ is on your radar feel free to shoot me a message anytime. Always happy to help out, and thanks again for taking care of me and my crew whenever we come in!
EpicDude007@reddit
On a private jet with 3-8 people on board. One of them is making the money. The rest is middle class or supported by the one.
TheGeoninja@reddit
Private jets are the ultimate people watching experience
boobooaboo@reddit
Unpopular, likely to be downvoted opinion.
If someone can learn how to do your job in one shift, it’s not a specialized or skilled job. Therefore, it does not demand a high compensation. That’s the way the market works.
CantDoThatOnTelevzn@reddit
There’s actually a lot that goes into successfully and safely working a GA ramp, and there’s 100% no way to learn it a day.
It’s certainly not rocket science, and I’m not saying it deserves 6figures, but your comment perfectly underscores just what’s wrong with so much in the world.
Your attitude is dismissive and fucked up, and promotes a race to the bottom society where instead of paying wages, the companies up charging you for ramp fees are paying suborbital insurance premiums instead.
boobooaboo@reddit
Oh my. Spoken like someone who’s making a lot of assumptions about where I come from. I used to be a regional FA making 14-18 per hour. And that took 4 weeks of full-time training. Then I worked as an FA while I was getting my ratings, again, years of experience and work. Go ahead, tell me I’m dismissive and don’t care.
I had a friend working signature KBFI on the fuel truck, also working on her ratings. They trained her up in a day. Is it a race to the bottom? No. When she quit, they found someone to train and fill her position in a day or two. That’s the difference.
I worked hard and got a marketable skill, and now I’m getting paid for it.
CantDoThatOnTelevzn@reddit
I haven’t made a single assumption about you, and am simply responding to your comment at face value.
Your friend at KBFI working the fuel truck was doing just one aspect of a job that actually involves a lot more.
But sure, you worked hard and got a marketable skill, just like I did, so it makes sense that everyone else doing whatever else deserves fuck all because their job is so easy.
TheActualRealSkeeter@reddit
I mean . . . Duh. But people like me walk in from the other side of the door with more debt than cash all the time lmao.
MrEatinBeaver@reddit
When I was a ramp rat I always likened the job to a zookeeper. I get to meet and interact with all the cool animals but at the end of the day all I do is deal with their shit. Also their ice coffee papers.
kevinpet@reddit
Best to temper your expectations a bit. You can have a successful career but for a private jet you’re either founding a company or inheriting one. Unless you’re really good at throwing a ball.
jellenberg@reddit
Yeah that's why I started doing Uber to get me through flight school. Made like double the money and could set my schedule. Working at an FBO was doing nothing to get me in the pilot seat.
temupilot@reddit
You weren’t doing it right then
jellenberg@reddit
How so?
temupilot@reddit
The comment of working the line not getting you closer to a pilot job… all of my buddies who were working the line we all fly corporate now, strictly because of our personality and networking
jellenberg@reddit
Eh I guess if you wanted to fly corporate that could help. But working 40+ hours a week for a measley paycheck sure wasn't getting me any closer to a commercial certificate or a job.
temupilot@reddit
Valid, pay can be shit. Just depends on your certain goals or plan in life
jellenberg@reddit
Yeah I was going for a helicopter career and we very rarely dealt with those. But when we did, I made sure to go there and talk to the pilot when I could lol
Plastic_Most_9285@reddit
Wow $19 an hour? I made $8 when I worked at FBOs. I never begrudge someone’s wealth, I work harder to accomplish my own success. They did.
Jortlord44@reddit
I rent from my local fbo and hope the employees know I’m in the same situation as the homeless guy with cardboard sign at the stop light down the road… but with my ppl and cleaner clothes
Cold_Stroll@reddit
Making $13 an hour working the Ramp for envoy getting talked down to by junior FO’s 2 years older than me while I was a CPL had me feeling the same way man. Trust the proceds
NuttPunch@reddit
You should eat them for the proletariat cause.
ZOB_oo_land@reddit
Don't tempt me
wayofaway@reddit
I hear most of them are well marbled.
Dependent-Gur6113@reddit
Worked for NJA for about a year before making it to a legacy. It was sometimes a contest to see which rich guy was the cheapest asshole, they're all like that. Just get your ratings and get out of there.
Future-Project-6074@reddit
If it makes you feel better I’m a line guy and while I enjoy my job, I understand what your getting at but I get to talk to pilots everyday and they always say “ pay your dues”. “Take your time”. “Enjoy the journey” etc. so realize it takes time and it’s hard so let it be. It will worth jt
TellmSteveDave@reddit
Net jets FBO? Sounds fancy. I worked at a small 3-rental FBO making min wage when I was getting my PPL.
Someone out there has it better than you. Someone has it worse. Put in the work regardless and see where it gets you.
CliffBooth1234@reddit
You’re very lucky to be working around highly successful people. You can use it as an opportunity to network or at the very least just observe, OR you can sit there crying on reddit about how you think you deserve what they have. Welcome to the game of life, everything is a learning experience if nothing else. If you’re feeling a little self conscious and counting other peoples money, go work at Burger King. They make $19 an hour too.
But moreover and to your point, you’re unskilled labor. A monkey could do it. $19 an hour to sit at a desk is about what it’s worth. Sorry
fgflyer@reddit (OP)
I never said I think I deserve what they have based on my current position. Please don’t take words out of my mouth. I’m trying hard, working my ass off (including overtime), in order to spend an exorbitant sum of money on flight training and getting my ratings so that I can achieve the career I want to have.
I made this post because sometimes I do feel stuck and unable to make any substantial connections or networking opportunities despite working at an FBO.
CliffBooth1234@reddit
That was a dick comment and you’re right. My apologies.
Dubhavens2@reddit
Use it for networking! Everyone one that walks through that door could be a lead for your next job, or they know someone else who could give you that job.
Sometimes the person flying in a clapped out 172 has a hangar full of the coolest stuff, best stories and know a TON of people.
Sometimes the guy coming off of a Lear is in debt up to his eyelids.
Weak_Fudge_8028@reddit
I work at a busy FBO and i sometimes like to do the math on how much the fbo made in a day in revenue. Yesterday we did about $249,271.83. They are actively talking about cutting our hours. No joke.
sound-of-impact@reddit
"The world needs ditch diggers"
I worked ramp, it gives you a big picture perspective of the operation and appreciation of the workers. Now with that said I have a different hat and I expect what I expect but I feel it's more of a "do your job" mentality but I've been there and I did the work. It just makes me appreciate it more similarly how you see the guys who built their fortune from the ground up. Those were always the best jets to work. You'd never know they're worth millions by what they're wearing or carrying their own bags. The ones with a silver spoon were obvious.
hoosier06@reddit
They represent a fraction of a percent of the population. Those who are rich and your age are probably there because of whose sperm made them. I know some of these people and it took 3 generations of good choices to get there(not always) and it can take one divorce to destroy it all. Just fucking grind and try to get that paper.
Significant-Bat-2639@reddit
Hey brother or sister, I worked as a lineman when I first started… it got me my current SIC job! I still feel this way too since beginning my corporate flying job. Makes you feel small lmao. But keep up the hustling, you’ll probably never be in the back of the airplane because you most likely have morals lol, but as a pilot my quality of life has drastically increased in the short 1.5yrs since I started flying professionally! It’s worth the pain!
JadedJared@reddit
I think you have a very cool job. You have the opportunity to be around cool jets and meet interesting people. Think what you want of them, but people that are wealthy enough to have that kind of lifestyle are pretty rare and you get to see a little bit of what they’re like, whether they’re eccentric, friendly or just assholes. It’s probably night and day compared to the ultra low cost passengers I fly around.
10and250@reddit
Having flown both, I’ll take my ultra-low cost passengers 10/10 times. Okay, maybe 9/10, but still.
PlaneShenaniganz@reddit
Life isn’t fair. It’s harsh and not pleasant to think about, but it’s true. Some people are born rich, some die in childbirth, some work at the family’s investment firm and others work the ramp. Hard work and a good attitude can go a long ways for changing your living situation.
AWACS_Bandog@reddit
Yeah but there was definitely a bell curve on how we were treated I found
I think my favorite on this bell-curve was the wanna-be influencer types. If we're being honest people who very clearly were one missed paycheck away from their entire "brand" house of cards exploding around them. Expected to be treated like royalty, and didn't appreciate it when they got the same service that everyone else got, including actual celebrities who were more often then not far nicer to us than they were. They were the biggest cheap-skates too. the FBO I worked at had a policy for years that, if you were staying overnight, then night crew would do your fuel order and we just settled up before departure the next day with the ramp fee and such. It was thanks to a string of Post-Superbowl Instagrammers running off without paying their tabs we had to stop that policy. Eventually we got paid on most of the bills in the end but that became my Manager's near full-time job trying to get these people to pay us.
unusualreply@reddit
I know it's difficult and against human nature, but you have to minimize comparing yourself to others. There will always be people out there richer than you including many who didn't "earn" it. That's just life. It's been that way for the entirety of human existence.
Society should work on solving the very real problems of wealth inequality but you need to focus on the advantages you do have. You make $19/hr, about 4x more than half of the entire global working population, and have the opportunity to become an airline pilot - a career that could easily put you in the Top 1% of earners.
mrivc211@reddit
A lot of those “multimillionaires” sat exactly where you are and became wealthy thru their experiences in aviation. In other words, stay put and keep learning
redditburner_5000@reddit
The thing about America is that social mobility is easier here than just about anywhere else. It's super easy to stay in or move to the lower echelons. But if you put in the effort and hone useful skills and make the investment (time and money) into your credentials then you can move way up.
We don't have a caste system or even the social hierarchy that exists in Britan. It really doesn't matter your background. Extraordinary effort and output are rewarded. It just is, despite whatever the social narrative at the moment.
Yes, concentrated general wealth is a problem. And I mean real wealth that can influence policy (like hundreds of millions or billions), not just $10 or $20M family net worth money that can fund a Citation 500 or a NetJets subscription.
fluffy_101994@reddit
r/shitamericanssay
Tell me how the social mobility in America is that different from the rest of the Anglosphere or Western Europe?
A migrant to Australia, for instance, has the exact same opportunities as the rest of the Australian population. I’m sure it’s the same in Germany, France, etc.
It definitely just isn’t America that has social mobility.
redditburner_5000@reddit
Lol. amerikkasuxthirdworldguccibelt. Sure. Okay.
A recent askanamerican thread: If you have lived abroad and returned, what made you come back?
It's common knowledge. There's a reason our net migration between the EU and US is 3x higher EU->US than it is US->EU. You can do and be so much more here. It's not even close.
What I said is that no other place has social mobility like the US. This is a science fact.
EddieVedderIsMyDad@reddit
Yea, but Australians and Brits have a cultural attitude of keeping people in their place. Even if there aren’t structural barriers, there is a cultural barrier. Americans are unabashed fucking strivers, for better or worse. There is nothing in the collective American psyche about settling for their lot in life or cutting the heads off tall poppies.
fluffy_101994@reddit
I’m an Australian. We celebrate when people are want to improve their lives.
What we get the shits with is when people move up the ladder and then laud it over others, as if they forget where they came from.
bottomfeeder52@reddit
I think what he’s saying is that the social mobility is better here than anywhere else in that someone immigrating to the countries you listed may have the same social mobility as their respective citizens, but in America they’d still have more. at-least that’s what I took his comment to mean. however I do think that this “American Dream” is slowly dying
YamComprehensive7186@reddit
I used to mop the hangar deck floor then I grew tired of watching jets taking and off and wondering they're going to, so then I went to flight school.
Anthem00@reddit
You do know that even if you were the pilot, that you are still a peon compared to the people sitting in the back (if privately owned / chartered and not a company plane). So even those pilots are generally not chartering flights at whatever charter rate it’s going for….
MondayNightRawr@reddit
Retail Transportation Sales Grocery store Everywhere Entertainment venues
This is not only in aviation. It’s literally every industry. Don’t focus on what others have. Comparison is the thief of joy. Stay focused and keep moving forward.
Commercial_Water_977@reddit
Just understand that all those "wealthy" folks are probably writing off the cost of their flight as a business expense. That means that the full cost is deducted from their "business's" income and substantially reduces its taxes. So, in effect, you (as a taxpayer) are subsidizing their "free" rides. A fair tax system would only allow businesses to deduct the cost of an economy class commercial flight not a ride in a $80 million Gulfstream or similar. Hope that makes you feel better about things!
Theytookmyarcher@reddit
Yeah you're noticing that we're the #1 highly developed country in terms of a wealth gap between the extremely rich and extremely poor. It means you conscious, that's a good thing.
tiern11@reddit
Never felt the gap really. Realised I was in the infancy of my career and it was a great opportunity to network and learn. Loved my time on the line and met some really great people.
Own-Ice5231@reddit
Always remember that it’s the person, not the job or what they fly that makes their character.
OkEfficiency3747@reddit
Don't concern yourself with other people. Focus on you and get yourself where you want to be
ChigginParmaSean@reddit
Focus on what you have going for you, and try not to get too caught up in where others are in life. You’re in a career field where top performers are compensated extremely well, so it’s natural to be around people who are earning much more. Stay positive and keep an eye out for the opportunities around you. Talk to coworkers who are willing to share their insight, and be proud of where you are. There are plenty of people who would love to have the foot in the door that you do.
mad_catters@reddit
I made 9 dollars an hour when I worked the ramp in 2016
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
So I work front desk at a Netjets FBO. Oftentimes I just sit there and think, “here I am, barely making $19 an hour before taxes, and every single person who walks through that door are multimillionaires who generally spend more cash on a single flight than a lot of people make in an entire year. And some of them aren’t that much older than me.”
I know it’s a “trust the process” thing and I’ll get to my flying career eventually, I’m 23 and have a lot going for me, but do any other FBO employees or ramp rats sometimes feel like they’re just a peon and feel very stuck, and out-of-place?
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