MSI PC with NVIDIA GB10 Superchip - 6144 CUDA Cores and 128GB LPDDR5X Confirmed

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

My only issue with Spark is that limited for a single job, and from PNY's presentation it could require paying for licences to unlock capabilities while is locked in NVIDIA's OS. (if someone doesn't know what I am talking about, either look at the post in here 8 weeks ago or ask for the link).

Cannot use Windows, cannot use off the shelf ARM based Linux, and definitely cannot do anything else with it.

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colonelmattyman@reddit

Articles are claiming that you can run this as a traditional Mini PC. Not sure why you are saying otherwise.

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

🤣

The NVIDIA promo material you mean....

A x86 based miniPC having off the shelve Windows/Linux can play proper mainstream PC games, can run ALL my software without hassle.

Cannot do the same with ARM CPUs, even when try with ARM Windows.

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International_Bid716@reddit

So you're complaining about the arm architecture generally, not this specific product?

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Have nothing with ARM but this product which is falsely advertised, and is ridiculous expensive for what it is.

They ask $4000-$5000 for a 5070 with 200GB/s RAM and ARM CPU and cannot do anything else with it.

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International_Bid716@reddit

That's a reasonable perspective. What is the false advertisement?

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florinandrei@reddit

Can you support the fearmongering with more concrete information, please?

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Seems you missed this discussion :)

Some details on Project Digits from PNY presentation : r/LocalLLaMA

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colonelmattyman@reddit

You keep posting this but it has very little information on the topic.

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Expensive-Apricot-25@reddit

not being able to run linux (at all) is a red flag...

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Technically someone will argue is running Linux, since the NVIDIA OS is Ubuntu based but is proprietary.

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Expensive-Apricot-25@reddit

I guess so, but if it’s based on Linux then u should be able to run any Linux u want.

Honestly even bigger red flag imo

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

From what we got from PNY presentation, the red flag was this line.

And we know NVIDIA worked like that on previous such devices.

Cost: circa $3k RRP. Can be more depending on software features required, some will be paid.

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NBPEL@reddit

This is too much to be paywall of paywall

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

The price is not over $4000 closing to $5000. If you read the other discussion.

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LengthinessOk5482@reddit

Can you or someone get the link please, cause if it is that limited I am no longer on the fence on whether to buy one or not.

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Here you are. Full discussion with the notes from the presentation.

Some details on Project Digits from PNY presentation : r/LocalLLaMA

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LengthinessOk5482@reddit

It doesn't say exactly about having some features locked or not. Nor about the OS being locked to nvidia OS, this presentation was given when people where still speculating on whether the bandwidth will be 250 or 500 gb/s

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Seems missed the line

Cost: circa $3k RRP. Can be more depending on software features required, some will be paid.

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LengthinessOk5482@reddit

That isn't specific enough to claim about locking features, especially when information was still so thin at that time 3 months ago. In the notes, there is a quote saying "we don't have the specific bandwith specification". We need actual recent information now, not just small notes on a presentation made 3 months ago.

What about the OS lock? No mention of windows or other linux OS not being locked

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

If you look similar products NVIDIA launched, they were all behind the NVIDIA OS.

Windows for ARM could work, but NVIDIA hasn't released a single driver for it, even for their mainstream graphic cards. (AMD has).

I want this device to be able to fully work without ANY restrictions, using standard ARM Linux. But NVIDIA has shown it's hand on the past.

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kitanokikori@reddit

Parent is right, nVidia strictly controls stuff like this and it sucks. You can easily verify it by googling for the Spark drivers / software. It's all locked behind paywalls

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SkyFeistyLlama8@reddit

I first thought the features were locked behind typical software packages. If it's locked at the OS level, no thanks. It's like buying an expensive Windows workstation that runs some gimped version of the OS and then having to pay extra for Windows Pro.

Even Microsoft doesn't do this because ISV-certified machines and workstations almost always come with Windows Pro out of the box.

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Candid_Highlight_116@reddit

But what does that mean??? Exactly in what way it's more locked down than Jetsons?

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LengthinessOk5482@reddit

I know nvidia has licenesing packages for certain features on their hardware. OP said to ask for the link or to find the post like 8 weeks ago - I decided to ask for the link about sparks/digits

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zerconic@reddit

I have a Spark reservation but now you've got me worried, I didn't realize they were actually locking it to their OS. That might be a dealbreaker. I just checked their docs again and didn't see anything explicit about it, do you have any links you could share?

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Rich_Repeat_22@reddit

Sure, whole discussion here :)

Some details on Project Digits from PNY presentation : r/LocalLLaMA

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Special-Quantity-149@reddit

Once I realised how narrow the use cases are for these things, I soon realised I'm out. Compute is hyped, 1 petaflops sounds great, but it's for sparse 4 bit which is limited in what you can apply it to.. In reality they are not as beefy as claimed compute wise. The dealbreaker though, is the memory bandwidth is poor compared to a flagship GPU, by some margin. So unless you really need the compact size and low power, given the Nvidia attitudes about proprietary software, there is no future in this platform for me.

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DiscombobulatedAdmin@reddit

I guess I'm back to hoping the ARC B60 Pro turns out to be an option. Maybe the new Ryzen 395+ chip will turn out to be something, even though it currently looks a little slow and the software stack is immature. I refuse to pay $900 for 4-year-old, worn out 3090s or $3000+ for 5090s.

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101m4n@reddit

"superchip" 🙄

Apologies for the pedantry, but can we not popularize nvidias marketing nonsense? It's just a multi-die soc.

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mycall@reddit

That sounds super to me

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NBPEL@reddit

to NVIDIA fanboy

It's rather weak of a chip

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101m4n@reddit

It's an soc with 250GB/s of memory bandwidth and only 6k cuda cores for several thousand dollars. Super is not the word I'd use for it.

They're trying to coin the term to make it seem special to those that don't know better.

It's like intel calling SMT "hyperthreading" or AMD calling resizeable BAR support "smart access memory". Pure marketing noise.

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HGHall@reddit

Fkn nvidia man. Everything that looks sweet has their cloud hanging over it. This is why we cant have monopolies. I hope amd and the new intel cards figure software out and smoke them.

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coding_workflow@reddit

So remind me this is ARM based. So very custom setup... Why not building on AMD/Intel!!!! Since I saw that, I knew that Nvidia heading in bad direction and they think they will do an Apple marketing stunt.

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tyflips@reddit

What is the token speed of a large model on these? Are they even usable?

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henfiber@reddit

My rule of thumb is (0.6 * BW) / model_size.

So, divide 164 by the model size in GBs. A 32b Q8_0 will be about 5 t/s.

In terms of input/prompt processing, they will be about 85-90% of a 3090.

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rbit4@reddit

I got 21k cores in each of my 5090s. And 14k cores in my 4090s. The 2 4090s togwther cost me 2.8k

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robertotomas@reddit

They are pricing themselves out of competition with mac minis

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iliark@reddit

The Mac Mini only has 64gb unified memory at most

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BananaPeaches3@reddit

They could easily shed $1200 by not including ConnectX-7. The engineering cost would be negligible, they can just choose not to solder it on to the existing PCB.

It has USB4 anyways 40Gbit is fine for most people.

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federico_84@reddit

I wonder if Nvidia is making it a requirement for them.

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Cane_P@reddit

They don't make their own systems. Just the case and cooling. The motherboard comes pre-asembled from NVIDIA.

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No_Afternoon_4260@reddit

Same as the MGX in server class, right? Guess Nvidia want to make the chips, the pcb, and next year they'll make the box as well haha

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Cane_P@reddit

The motherboard comes pre-assembled from NVIDIA. They don't have a say in the matter. The only thing they can do is design their own case and cooling (but there is probably some kind of specification telling them the max size allowed for the case).

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Qaxar@reddit

Doesn't the 128GB Mac Mini cost $10K?

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robogame_dev@reddit

For $10k you can get a Mac Studio with 512GB

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Spiritual-Neat889@reddit

But mac mini does have or not cuda support? I want to use it for video generations. Speed no issue for me.

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l0033z@reddit

I believe there are ways to run OpenSora on MLX. Searching for MLX in general always gives good results. The space is progressing quickly. The hardware is very capable even for other tasks like virtualization, so I’d say it’s hard for these other devices to compete with them. They barely use any power too.

Performance for LLMs is not that great in terms of throughput when compared to expensive rigs with multiple high end GPUs, but if you don’t want to deal with any of that stuff I’d say the Macs are rising pretty quickly right now - because neither these boxes seem like they will give any amazing performance for LLMs due to the memory bandwidth constraints.

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getmevodka@reddit

yeah mlx is quite performant if there is software using it

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phata-phat@reddit

HP is also launching their version - HP ZGX Nano AI Station

Wonder if the various implementations differ or if it is a simple rebadge.

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Cane_P@reddit

As far as what I have read, it is the exact same motherboard (with all parts already soldered on to it), supplied by NVIDIA. The only difference is the case design and cooling.

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MoffKalast@reddit

the system has peak power consumption up to 224 W, and according to data from the exhibition, the cooling in the mini-PC case can hardly cope with such a thermal load

Chernobyl Desktop

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drulee@reddit

Would love to know if any of the Nvidia DGX Spark / Msi EdgeExpert MS-C931 / Lenovo ThinkStation PGX / ASUS Ascent GX10 comes with a Nvidia Enterprise Ai license as the other DGX hardware does.

https://docs.nvidia.com/ai-enterprise/planning-resource/licensing-guide/latest/licensing.html#nvidia-dgx-software-bundle-nvidia-ai-enterprise

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nderstand2grow@reddit

great, another PromiseWare

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COBECT@reddit

It’s only an expensive toy

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nostriluu@reddit

I'd love to see an option with a GB10 and PCIe slot. But I'm guessing the arch is different.

Another interesting option would be a laptop GB10. A Thinkpad or tablet would be fantastic.

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tyb-markblaze82@reddit

PDF found on MSI website with specs https://download-2.msi.com/archive/mnu_exe/ipc/MS-C931_dm.pdf

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WackyConundrum@reddit

I think we can guess what will be the availability of these chips and their real prices (rather than fake MSRP)...

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b3081a@reddit

There's not a single official source from any of these vendors saying 6144. Only previously known info are on the introduction. We still don't know if NVIDIA offered something like TMEM in GB10 which Blackwell GeForce GPUs don't have access to, and significantly boosts tensor perf per SM

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phata-phat@reddit

PNY which manufactures the FE edition has this on their product page

https://www.pny.com/en-eu/professional/hardware/nvidia-dgx-spark

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emprahsFury@reddit

Boom! Got 'em!