Chauffeuring kids old enough to drive themselves
Posted by spinestuff@reddit | GenX | View on Reddit | 160 comments
Non-urban people: Are we enabling the next generation by accepting that they don't want to drive? Our parents were relieved they didn't have to cart us everywhere. Now there are 20-somethings being driven by their parents/grandparents because the bus is inconvenient and ride share is too expensive.
OhFigetteThis@reddit
The problem was created by cellphones and the Internet. We couldn’t wait to drive when we were teens in the early 80s, otherwise we would be stuck at home with our parents on a Friday night. Maybe we’d get to talk on the phone for 15 minutes. Let’s not forget stretching the phone cord into the pantry so we could have a private conversation with a friend while little sister stood with her ear to the door giggling.
Naw, we’d fly out the door and pick up all the girl friends we could pack in a car and cruise, hoping to catch a glimpse of a cute boy from school. Very “American Graffiti” and “Dazed and Confused”.
The new generations can experience everyone and everything through their phones. If they can text 24 hours a day, why go out and meet them face to face? And the lack of face to face contact has made them highly anxious about entering the world, as opposed to previous generations that couldn’t wait to get out there.
AaronJeep@reddit
I have nephews 16 and 19. Neither one has a driver's license. Their parents have a spare 2015 Rubicon they gave the 19 year old 3 years ago. He can't be bothered to learn to drive it. They hardly leave their rooms. They come out to eat and use the bathroom. The rest of the time they are on their phones or computers.
It baffles me. A car was freedom to me. And it's not like I had a social life. I wasn't going out to meet friends. I was just going anywhere my parents weren't. I grew up on a farm and I've been driving since I was 13 as well, so it's not like getting a license was about gaining access to cars. It was access to drive far, far away from my previous 120 acre cage - a bird set free!
Curiousone_78@reddit
Parents enabling a 19 year old man to stay a child.
AaronJeep@reddit
That's the other half that baffles me. Their parents set by and offer absolutely no pushback at all. It's not eating at them that their kids have no life outside of their bedrooms. How do you not know that's hurting them?
DisasterTraining5861@reddit
What do you mean by enabling? I take it that you’re not driving yours around anymore, so why are you worried about other peoples kids? Yeah our parents were happy they didn’t have to drive us places anymore, but generally speaking they didn’t want us around anyway. So that’s hardly a virtue to uphold. I deal with this kind of attitude from people and it’s sad to see coming from people who dealt with what most of us did growing up. I have 4 kids and 2 of them will never drive because they’re both autistic. They’ll be able to support themselves and live on their own (one already does), but driving requires the kind of focus they just don’t have. Another of them is 35 and they live with me. I do that for various reasons, but mostly it’s to allow her to chase her dreams. I have faith in her, so it’s not a hardship of any kind for me. But, do I explain any of this to people who carry opinions they’re not entitled to?? Hell no! Anyone who is not living under my roof or paying my bills isn’t entitled to an explanation and I genuinely don’t give a shit what other people think. And I’m only saying anything here to make a point. Y’all don’t really know what’s going on with other people or even their real motivations for how they are with their kids. So why, for the love of Pete, invest any energy into worrying about things that don’t affect you at all? From what I’ve seen of Gen Z is that the majority are smart and capable. They’re invested in a lot of issues that we should have invested time into. Yeah, there’s a lot of superficial crap out there online, but it only wasn’t us because there was no internet when we were that age. Really I’m so happy that I got over my childhood trauma to the point that I legit don’t think this way. Not about my own kids or other people’s kids. I’m starting to fear that I’m the only real Gen X left because - I actually don’t care about things that don’t hurt anyone or are none of my business.
exscapegoat@reddit
I tended to want to just stay in my room, though with books. Even though being shy and having anxiety was challenging, I’m glad my parents pushed me to get outside my comfort zone. It helped build resilience and self reliance
sanityjanity@reddit
What are your nephews' parents doing during the day? Even if they're both working full-time jobs, there's time on the weekends. What are they doing? Is it something your nephews could participate in?
When kids are very small, they are driven to do whatever their parents are doing. But, if the parents are doing work that is largely in their heads, then the kids can't see it, and can't participate in it.
MaelduinTamhlacht@reddit
They grew up without freedom, with the mammy bringing them everywhere. It's no longer their legs and their creativity and their self-reliance have atrophied.
talented-dpzr@reddit
When I was 19 gas was less than a dollar a gallon, parking was mostly free, and there were plenty of places to go to hang out like arcades and record stores.
Now days it's at least three times that much, all the privatized parking lots overcharge, and there is absolutely nowhere for kids to go to hang out.
It's just financially illiterate for them to want to drive until it's absolutely necessary.
Starbuck522@reddit
I don't know where you live, but that's not the case in suburbia where I am.
Seems you must be in a city. Ok, walk to places in the city? Gas costs more and jobs pay more. No need to pay to park much of anywhere in my area. I could park for free and walk a bit farther.
Flux_My_Capacitor@reddit
Their parents are shitty parents. There, I said it. People need to get better at calling out shitty parenting.
qedpoe@reddit
All the upvotes.
Starbuck522@reddit
Doesn't the 19 year old have a job? If not, I would say that's the issue. Unless there's a disability preventing it, a child should be made to have a job during high school, whether they want one or not. And 19????? I just can't understand/accept it as true that a non disabled 19 year old doesn't have a job or full time college.
Live at home and online college? Have to have a part time job too.
sanityjanity@reddit
Parents today are (mostly) vastly less strict than our parents were, and don't have their kids doing chores. And the amount of entertainment a teenager can have in their bedroom, now, blows our movie theaters and arcades out of the water.
Our towns don't have anywhere for teenagers to exist. So, they don't.
AaronJeep@reddit
I'd agree with the first part. Living on a farm meant feeding cows, bailing hay, fixing fences, and so on. An excuse to be away from that makes perfect sense. But the idea that there is nowhere for teenagers to be is harder to buy. When I would leave the house, I didn't have a place to be. I just drove around. I drove down country roads to see where they went. I would take off and have absolutely no destination in mind.
My nephews live in Colorado. They have a free Jeep Rubicon they could drive. There are endless lakes, rivers, trails, parks and forests. There are cities they could walk around in.
The next argument is they don't have money to drive around. They would if they had a job. They don't have any other expenses. There's no insurance or car payments to make. No rent to pay. No one is asking them to pay even the internet bill they use.
I think it's simple. Humans are programmed to take the path of least resistance and seek instant gratification. Getting validation from people on the internet is easier than making friends and getting it from peers in real life. It's addictive to be on the computer or the phone. It's easier to watch some porn than meet someone and get laid. Every need they have is met in their bedroom, except it's a cheap, empty sugar high compared to the real thing. And those boys don't know it. It's why I think so many young people have everything they want, but this nagging feeling that they don't. That has to be a confusing thing, to look around your room and see all this stuff and connection, but feel isolated. They are like crackhead chasing a cheap high, but unable to quit (and no one is pushing them to).
If my nephew's parents died tomorrow, I honestly don't think they would know how to survive. They don't even know how to get themselves across town.
sanityjanity@reddit
But also, those "third spaces" are mostly gone.
I went to a nearby mall recently, and it was dead, dead, DEAD. It was creepy and quiet, and most of the store fronts were closed.
If you're a teenager, and you want to catch a glimpse of your crush -- too bad. They're at home. They're not at diner or the mall or the skate park. Hell, in my home town, every Friday and Saturday night, the teens and young 20s would drive up and down the main drag at 8 mph just to see each other and laugh. Even if they had cars and licenses, no one could afford the gas for that any more.
It's a death spiral for teenage socialization. There's nowhere to go, so why would they want to go anywhere?
Starbuck522@reddit
I think this person is saying these people are in ONE space... home. No school and no job!
Starbuck522@reddit
I guess, but they still need to work a job, eh? And go to school.
I can understand if a child is disabled. I can also understand if parents can't help with the expense of getting and having a car and that it would require too many working hours for the kid to accomplish buying a car and insurance.
But I can't relate to "I don't want to learn to drive" if there's no disability.
Op isn't saying their child never leaves the house. That would be a different issue.
endosurgery@reddit
On the farm you had to know how to drive young. You drive the tractors and trucks for various purposes. All were manual. My dad taught me when I was seven. I would take my mom’s car out before I had my license when I was 15. Couldn’t wait to get away. My kids grew up in a nice neighborhood outside of town. Big lots. 7 miles from town. They also couldn’t wait to get away.
Ahkhira@reddit
This still happens! (Except for the taking the car at 15.)
I live in a rather rural cow farm type area. All of the farm kids can drive by about age 13.
endosurgery@reddit
Yep.
xjeanie@reddit
It was a very important right of passage for us. Passing from childhood into the beginning of adulthood. We couldn’t wait to be able to drive. Getting that permit at 15 was huge. Being trusted on our own. Going where we wanted when we wanted. Meeting new people was a big part of that freedom. Car culture.
staplesgowhere@reddit
Related to that, driving requires them to (hopefully) not look at their phones.
Money_Engineering_59@reddit
Very accurate. I think I learned to drive sitting on a phone book. Then my dad threw me the keys to his truck and said “figure it out”. I was on the back roads so no traffic and I wasn’t of legal age. I was on the tractor pretty young.
Especially for us rural kids, we needed to get out of the house ASAP because those 2 channels we had on TV weren’t exactly going to keep us entertained!
Samantha-Blair@reddit
The only person my kid has really ever been in a car with is me and he says I make it seem really awful, so yes, I am to blame!!!
Starbuck522@reddit
Sounds like a problem to solve.
Can you get them on the road instruction from someone else? If you and they can't afford it, please try to enlist some volunteers to help...extended family members, your friends, their friends parents, etc. Hopefully you can cobble some hours together.
DangerBird-@reddit
They hear you bitching when you think they aren’t paying attention. 🤣
gum43@reddit
Nope, both my kids that are over 16 got their license right away. It wasn’t an option. When my oldest got her license I was spending 5 hours in the car a day and her getting her license made a huge difference. My middle was nervous, but we just worked with him and he’s not scared at all now and honestly a really good driver. We think it’s good to learn when you’re young.
ebeth_the_mighty@reddit
My family growing up couldn’t afford a car. I took the bus everywhere. When I moved in with my boyfriend, halfway across the country, I learned to drive. He had a car.
Spiritualy-Salty@reddit
My kids all got their license when they turned 16. They want to go places
DangerBird-@reddit
Yeah, not all the kids are stuck in their room terminally online. Mine aren’t either. Some are, but not all.
Starbuck522@reddit
An aside. My daughter would often be in her room during her free time (after working after coming home from school) but she would be interacting with people she knew locally. Id hear her talking and laughing. I would hear the voices of the other kids.
Firm-Investigator-89@reddit
I’d probably just show them their options: learn how to drive and do so, or here’s a bus schedule
KaetzenOrkester@reddit
I made it clear to my son those were his options (we have good bus service in our city). I still had to bribe him, but at least he learned to drive. He can even service his own car, now.
MikeyMad01@reddit
Or a bicycle and a lock.
agentmkultra666@reddit
Yep, bike and bus or learn to drive, I fully agree
exscapegoat@reddit
I loved having a bicycle as a kid and teen because you could go so much farther than walking
RubyRoze@reddit
We have two kids, 5.5 yrs apart in age. The eldest couldn’t get her license fast enough, but the she was always in a hurry to grow up. The youngest wasn’t interested at all. We waited until a year past permit eligibility to push a bit. I was baffled by the difference in the two kids. We lived in different states when each became eligible so I attributed it to that at the time (different timelines for the class in school, rural vs city locale), but I am seeing worse procrastination in my kids’s piers. My parents didn’t think it was necessary for me to have my license until I graduated HS. We lived in the middle of nowhere and the bus ran for school activities.
Dragonfly_Peace@reddit
How did our generation screw up so badly on the raising kids side?
figgie1579@reddit
I don’t get this. Where I work in NC—not a big city like NY, NJ, or even Charlotte—they’ve hired at least four people in their early twenties who don’t drive. There are no buses where we are, so public transit isn’t really an option. All of them ended up quitting.
When a big chunk of your paycheck goes just to rideshares, or when relying on others becomes a real hassle, it’s just not worth it.
Starbuck522@reddit
I work a low wage job. When my coworkers say they don't drive, I take that to mean they don't have a car because they can't afford to buy a car and pay for car insurance.
I don't think it necessarily means they don't have their lisence. I guess maybe it means that in some cases, but I don't assume that. They don't drive because they don't have a car!
argenman@reddit
If he’s not driving at 18 He’ll be walking or staying home…till I drive him to the Armed Forces recruiting office at 18 and 6 months…
HottKarl79@reddit
Car prices are outrageous. Insurance is worse. In some ways I understand where the kids are coming from; their inability/unwillingness to make this someone else's burden to bear is problematic, to say the least.
DangerBird-@reddit
Right? There’s no such thing as an $800 car anymore. You can’t just save up over the summer and check the newspaper for stuff in your price range anymore.
Starbuck522@reddit
I mean, kids DO still do that. I know multiple teenagers who did it. They were able to walk (far) to places they could work.
I can understand a kid choosing not to do it, but it can be done.
Easy_Ambassador7877@reddit
Exactly! Mine is dragging her feet at getting her license, but I’m also a single parent and if she were to wreck MY car I’d be screwed until it could be repaired. My car is my freedom and livelihood so I’m not keen on putting it in the hands of a new driver in a medium sized city. And finding an old beater to drive while you are figuring it out is near impossible. She has access to a good bus system that she uses to go to and from school. She is still in HS for another year so I’m not too worried about her not driving yet. She also had her first accident a few months ago when my much older brother took her out on gravel roads in his truck for a driving lesson when we went to visit family where I grew up. It shook her confidence a bit. But getting her permit and license is on the agenda for this summer break.
As a new driver I crashed no less than 3 cars/trucks and maybe a 4th. Idr what happened to that car. So if my daughter is anything like I was as a new driver I’m fine waiting a bit. I can’t go out and easily buy her a cheap old car like my Dad did for me. They just are so rare now.
DangerBird-@reddit
Yup! I crashed SO many cars when I was young. The first one was the family car, which screwed my parents out of a car, plus insurance went up like crazy. My dad was PISSED! Rightly so. Absolutely no rush for you! Not worth the risk!
Powerpoppop@reddit
This. My 18-old-year doesn't have her license yet (no high insurance). It's a hell of a lot less expensive to drive her around a little. She goes places with some friends who do drive. A car and license are right around the corner, though.
H1landr@reddit
They still teach driving in High School right? I see the high school student driver car in my neighborhood.
MaelduinTamhlacht@reddit
BlueButtons07@reddit
In the state I live, it’s required to attend professional driving school for anyone younger than the age of 18. Enrollment fees are around $500 and up. I know that’s a deciding factor for a lot of families.
Starbuck522@reddit
Understandable! There must be some grants/ways to have it paid for. But I can understand some don't qualify for help but it's still too much to pay for.
I also understand some have disabilities.
But people here are saying choosing not to.
Angeliquem_72@reddit
I have 2 who are dragging their feet too. I don't understand it - I wanted freedom immediately. My parents made it hard for me at 16 but I did it by 17..
Starbuck522@reddit
Can you share their reason?
Are they afraid they will cause an accident and hurt someone? Afraid someone else will hurt them?
DjQuamme@reddit
On the contrary. My daughter is 25. She lives and works in the burbs. Her friend group mainly consists of people who work downtown with a couple who live near her. On Fridays my wife will typically drive her down town after work. Not because she isn't willing to drive her self, but because we have beat in to her head that it's always ok to call us for a ride instead of doing something stupid like drinking and driving. I'm ashamed to say how many times I made that drive home when I was her age when I had no business behind the wheel. If I can keep my kids from doing the same, you're more then willing to make fun of us for driving her around
htimsj@reddit
About two weeks ago, I bought an old car for my 20 year old. I thought that would be an incentive to practice driving and get his license. Nope.
TwistedMemories@reddit
My sister’s kids don’t drive. They don’t want to. They all still live at home. Her youngest turned 21 last year and oldest is 28. I tell her she can’t keep driving them around like they were little kids.
Her son’s excuse, he’s 26, is he’s going to college and doesn’t have time to work or learn to drive.
I admit I was about 20 when I started driving, but I rode the Bose, walked or rode a bike everywhere. That includes going to work and college.
I keep telling her that her daughters work, and need to drive. But she says that they’re helping pay the bills. It’s ridiculous.
Starbuck522@reddit
What was 26 year old doing before? Full time college including summer for 18-26? I think he'd be done med school by now!
I am not into "machismo", but somebody needed to call this kid a wuss ten years ago! (Same if it was a girl...)
Again, this assumes no disability.
Flux_My_Capacitor@reddit
They aren’t ever going to move out unless they know how to drive. That should be recognized by this point.
Adorableviolet@reddit
I have it on both ends. My mom never got her license. And now my 20 yo doesn't drive. She treats her dad and I like ubers.
Unable-Economist-525@reddit
So, if you printed off the driving handbook, handed it to her, gave her the link to the site where she could schedule her driving test, and set a 90 day time limit after which you would no longer be available, would she rise to the occasion?
Adorableviolet@reddit
I have put my foot down while she is home for the summer. Oh and I forgot...her other grandma had to stop driving, so we have that extra car for her!
Unable-Economist-525@reddit
Nice!
Adorableviolet@reddit
Except now this grandma treats us like ubers! Sandwich generation, yo! ha
Dry_Yogurt2458@reddit
This is the most American thread ever
The rest of us just walk or get trains and buses that are plentiful.
I'm always baffled when I see this reliance on cars.
Beauphedes_Knutz@reddit
What ever European country you are from, just know that our realms of life are at a bare minimum 10 times the size of yours. The number of Europeans that whine at a 30 minute drive being too long can't begin to comprehend when it takes us 90 to drive to work and another 90 to drive home everyday.
Can you imagine the hours that would take if we used public transport?
brandnewspacemachine@reddit
I don't have this problem. My daughter wants to drive so bad. We just didn't have the money for driver's ed for a while and finally I did and she's 17 and she complains that she's the only Junior who is not driving. Her test is this afternoon. But now I have to figure out how I'm going to get her a car. I will figure it out though because as soon as she can drive life will get much easier
BengalFan2001@reddit
I had a spare car and told my daughter once you are 17 you better be driving yourself and she was by 16. I also didn't burned her with paying insurance gas etc....studu first. She got a brand new 2024 car using money from her job and we continue to pay for her insurance and gas. She is now done with school and looking for her first full time job.
T-Doggie1@reddit
My best college buddy told me his boy was scared to drive. Blew my mind. He’s finally got him going at 17 but it was hard to believe.
He lives on a lake 10 or 15 minutes from town and I think he finally told him that he was done with the chauffeuring and to start freakin’ driving.
diaphoni@reddit
you know what would fix this? If we didn't have culture built on cars. If we didn't see Car = freedom. If we built sustainable, WALKABLE cities. little micro villages in the cities where medical/shopping/food is all in walking distance. THAT is what we should be doing. Setting up buses and trains and such to be reliable and better than driving, but instead, we force car culture on everyone then punish younger generations for not wanting to partake in that cycle.
angelaelle@reddit
Sounds lovely. You should be out there advocating for funding major infrastructure improvements that support these micro towns.
typhoidmarry@reddit
What an easy and simple fix! Why didn’t OP think of that!
RaspberryVespa@reddit
Yeah…that’d be a “walk, ride a bike, take the bus, or stay home then 🤷♀️” from me.
I get that youths can mature at different rates, but this trend of young people choosing to not adult until after 30–if even 30—is fucking nuts. If they have no motivation to grow up and be independent, they tend to not grow up and be independent. Generalizing but… yeah. We should not be indulging this as a sandwich generation, as we already have far too much on our plates as it is.
It’s like, spread your wings and fly already, baby birds. 😒 You are not helpless. One foot in front of the other. You will be OK.
gatorgopher@reddit
Preach! I feel exactly the same way. Luckily all 3 of mine launched pretty much on schedule. I have a friend though...man, he's got 2 twenty somethings that do nothing. One does drive. I can't even listen about the kids anymore! It makes me so irate. This is not someone I'd expect this from.
eastbaypluviophile@reddit
I had to watch my husband do this with his son. 18 years old and didn’t want to learn to drive, refused to get his learners permit or practice. Finally my husband told him the taxi service was closed. It took 2 or 3 weekends of sulking at home missing out on activities before the son finally went to driving lessons and took his test. He’s fine driving now of course, but I am still baffled at how big of a fight he put up. My husband and I both were at the DMV the day we turned 15 1/2.
orchidelirious_me@reddit
I was lucky to grow up on a farm in North Dakota, so we had to learn how to drive as soon as we were tall enough to reach the pedals. I got my learner’s permit the day I turned 14, and since I skipped two grades when I was really young, I was able to take drivers ed at my high school when I was 14. I’ve been happily driving and pretty obsessed with cars ever since. I was also the lucky one who got to teach everyone how to drive with a manual transmission. The clutch in my car was barely clinging to life after all of that. Lol
Dark-Empath-@reddit
Same, as soon as it was my birthday I got a block of driving lessons from my parents. 4 months later I was driving to high school (my friends and girlfriend got automatic extra cool credits for riding along). Even now, my wife and I argue over who will be that day’s designated driver. Nobody wants to be sitting in the passenger seat.
I can’t fathom these kids at all.
exscapegoat@reddit
Yeah, I can see living at home because of the economy and housing costs if everyone gets along and respects each other.
But when I did that with my stepmom for a couple of years, I paid money towards bills. And did housework, took turns making dinner or treating for take out.
And respected the few reasonable rules she had. Like call if you’re going to be out past a certain time or staying over at a friend’s for the night. She just wanted to know we were safe so she wouldn’t worry. My roomies and I in college had done that so I was used to it. It’s nice to know someone cares.
And when my stepsister was graduating high school, I helped her with researching career options.
My friends who lived with parents did the same.
endosurgery@reddit
Hear hear!
Unable-Economist-525@reddit
I haven’t had this problem, but I have heard of it. From here, it looks like a janky family dynamic.
Not permitting learned incompetence or inappropriate dependence was part of my job as a parent to teens. By their 20s, it’s time to get out there and do this life thing.
Ginger8682@reddit
Where I live you don’t get your license until you’re 17. I bought both of my kids their o n used car at 16. I was fortunate I got my son’s truck like 6 months before covid and before car prices went thru the roof. It’s an older Chevy pu truck. I had a camera and Bluetooth radio installed and I think I bought it for $11,000.
I just bought my daughter a used Mazda for $9000. Both of their cars had over 100,000 miles on them.
My car insurance is over $900 a month, never mind putting gas in the cars.
The biggest relief when they get their license is not carting them to school and practices and games.
In high school when my son went out, he never took his car because him and friends were drinking beers somewhere. And I’m thankful for that.
My daughter though, she will be all over the place once she gets her license.
Once my kids had their permits, we got them cars to get used to driving their cars. We took them on major highways and the city and rural roads.
I made them drive everyday with their permits. They have to get comfortable doing it. It didn’t matter if I made them go food shopping or to get a coffee. They have to get used to it. Once they have the confidence while driving with their permit. The license is a piece of cake.
My daughter’s friends seem leery about driving. My son’s friends though fought over who was going to drive when they went out.
sometimesnowing@reddit
My kids are in their 20s and can't drive and it drives both of us fucking nuts. We provide minimal transport support but even walking in the rain and relying on friends hasn't convinced them. As parents it is very hard not to shake them until their teeth rattle.
JJQuantum@reddit
My oldest son got his license right on time and my younger is in the process of doing the same. It was never an option where I asked them if they wanted to learn to drive. I just said “let’s go learn to drive.” We made it a positive thing.
Iwentforalongwalk@reddit
Where I lived you could drive at 24 with a learner's permit and adult in the car. We had driver's ed at 15 and license at 16. Farm kids drove at 12 and could drive to and from school at 14. Everyone got their license. You'd be ostracized as a complete weirdo if you didn't.
We were driving all over at age 17. We took trips to neighboring states. We camped by ourselves. We'd ride our bikes to the next town on a whim. We were so free. I hate this phone culture for the kids. They have nothing.
sporkmanhands@reddit
I’d think it’s a particular set of circumstances where that would be ok, and a lot of them would involve some sort of reason where they can’t physically drive themselves paired with unsafe walking access to public transport or a complete lack of public transportation. Another would be if I was not working and available and they were full time students and we already owned one car that I, for some reason, needed throughout the day instead of sitting in a school parking lot.
But really, I don’t get it? Why would an adult child be permitted to continue living “as a minor” in the household? They are going to have to grow up at some point and holding that back or being an enabler is going to not help anyone in the long run.
exscapegoat@reddit
My stepbrother and sister in law had my nephew start making dinner one night a week in high school. He’d have to decide what he was making and go shopping with them for the ingredients. They all enjoy cooking.
By the time he got to college, he had a nice rotating menu beyond mac and cheese, ramen and hot dogs. Made him pretty popular in his fraternity
And it gave them a break from cooking for the night. So it was a win all around.
I think that’s a great idea.
Illustrious-Panic672@reddit
Cars fucking SUCK. Anything we can do to help kill the car-culture is a good thing, IMO. This is the one time I'm on the side of the kids.
I stopped driving when I was 25ish. I'm now 49 and blind in one eye and "legally blind" in the other. The fact that I still have a drivers' license is insanity to me, and has been for decades. I can renew online! If anyone gave me an actual eye test (or, God forbid, a driving test), I would fail.
Since the former US is entirely suffused with car culture bullshit, I have options:
* Spend an extra 4 hours to use "public transit" for a 20-min drive
* Spend $70 on uber
* Run or bike 10 miles with no sidewalk nor bike lane
* ...beg a friend for a ride
Sorry, y'all, I'm GenX as fuck, but in this case, nah. Cars suck ass.
Felon73@reddit
That’s a shitty situation and I agree that the whole country could benefit from actually being walkable and easier for cyclists, but the way I see it, this isn’t that. This is more about young adults refusing to drive and depending on parents to take them everywhere.
I’m in an area where I absolutely have to drive to get anywhere and it’s maddening sometimes. So much traffic in a growing rural population but infrastructure that hasn’t kept up with the pace that people are moving here and building homes. Generations of farmers have died out and lots of land is becoming available and at a premium. I am moving in a couple of months to a place where 90 percent of what I need or desire is less than a mile and a half away from my front door. Everything.
exscapegoat@reddit
That’s my goal for moving to somewhere where I can age in place. Hope to do within the next decade. I’m 59 and my understanding is driving skills can start to deteriorate due to age related causes after 70. I live alone and drive alone.
My plan is to find an occupational therapist when I relocate who will evaluate my driving periodically as a safety check to let me know when it’s time to stop driving in case I don’t realize on my own. I don’t want to cause an accident that kills or hurts someone
A neighbor across the street from me was in her 80s and mixed up her brake and gas. She slammed into our apartment building. Sadly she injured her neck and back and had to go into a nursing home. She’d been very independent and healthy until then. No one else was hurt.
At the time I was commuting so I didn’t get to know most of my neighbors. If I’d known her I would have offered to take her around or go to the store for her. I did that for my former next door neighbor who was around that age.
DangerBird-@reddit
Nice!
MidorriMeltdown@reddit
Car dependency is garbage. It's not a natural way to live, it only became a thing in the 1950's.
Traditionally, towns and cities were walkable. In the 1800's trams were added, and trains linked everything together. In the 1950's the tramlines were ripped out. and suburbs sprawled.
Car dependent suburban sprawl is not sustainable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfsCniN7Nsc
DangerBird-@reddit
I feel the same way. I’d LOVE to not need a car. It’s gotten so expensive. If you buy something reliable, you’ll have car payments. Get something cheap and you’re paying for repairs and upkeep.
DangerBird-@reddit
I agree. I don’t care about cars. They are just a necessity in a lot of places. And it’s gotten stupid expensive.
yourpaleblueeyes@reddit
🎶 cry, baby, cry...make your mother sigh..🎶
NorseGlas@reddit
Shit, I was hitchhiking 30 miles at age 13 to see my girlfriend a few towns over. I didn’t get rides long before I could drive.
We had taxi’s, a rural bus system that could get you from town to town…. And other than that it was a bicycle or feet u til me and my friends started driving.
This is why my firebird was sitting in the driveway when I was 13 getting worked on and ready for when I got my drivers license 3 years later.
AZJHawk@reddit
My 18 year old is a GenX kid in a Gen Z body. He learned to drive as soon as he could and can’t wait to be fully independent. He loves us but wants to live his own life.
My 16 year old just got his license, but isn’t really in a hurry to drive. He isn’t a great driver, so I’m not pushing, especially since we don’t really have a spare car for him to use.
JellyfishOther339@reddit
Driving the car solo was the greatest feeling. The car represented some independence and adventure, to cruise down the road pumping up the volume on your favorite songs on a beautiful day, hell yeah dude
exscapegoat@reddit
I would sometimes go out of my way to grocery shop at stop and shop so I could blast Joan Jett’s Road Runner on the way
fusionsofwonder@reddit
I'd be happy they don't want to drive, but "bus is too inconvenient" they would have to suck up and deal with. Especially if they're of voting age.
penguin_stomper@reddit
My own car as a teen was a luxury and privilege I would have killed for. Not all parents allow their kids that level of freedom, even when I had a few hundred dollars of my own for a car AND actually wanted to have a job after school (also a no-no) . So yeah, this attitude makes no sense whatsoever.
Ok-Rock2345@reddit
I think something also needs to be said about the cost of cars and especially insurance. Backe, when we were growing up, we could get a used car for around 1k and get insurance in the double digits so we could afford to drive.
Today, a half decent car will rin you a good 20k insurance if you are a teen, will probably run you 1k a year. This is without factoring in gas and the occasional repairs.
I'm sure my firstborn. Who does not live with me, would love to drive herself all over creation. Unfortunately, that is a lot more expensive these days, and it's not like salaries have kept up with inflation.
SignificantApricot69@reddit
I have 1 kid who doesn’t want to drive and another who started driving illegally at around 14, managing to get his hands on all manner of cars, motorcycles, etc. I’m happier with the former.
XP-666@reddit
Going to make it interesting for their kids; who's going to drive them?
XP-666@reddit
Assuming they have kids
SiroccoDream@reddit
Hey, if other people want to schlepp their grown kids around, I have no problem with that.
Me? No way. My son got a learner’s permit at age 15, but never wanted to put in the hours to get his license. We didn’t pressure him, because that was his choice.
Until the day when he was 17 and came to me at 11:30 on a Friday night to ask me if I could drive him to a town an hour and half away early Saturday morning, all so he could see this girl he was chatting with.
I said no, because his dad and I had things to do Saturday, BUT I informed him that, if he learned to drive, he’d be able to borrow the car and drive himself to visit said girl.
He learned to drive, got his license a month later. 😁
TheOtherElbieKay@reddit
My kids (ages 11 and 6) have already been told that they are expected to learn to drive. It’s just not optional in our house.
We just bought a stick shift so maybe we will make them learn stick.
Felon73@reddit
I don’t understand why a kid wouldn’t want to drive. Do they not desire freedom? Is it that hard to go through life that your mom has to drive you everywhere you go? I just don’t get it. Are they afraid? I have actually heard that excuse.
I don’t know what I would have done not being able to drive. I didn’t get the luxury of a crappy car for my birthday, I had to work, save, and buy my own.
Yes it’s enabling them. Adults in their 20’s should not be relying on parents to drive them everywhere. If they don’t want to drive, fine. Figure out how to get there without inconveniencing their parents. It’s incredibly rude whether public transportation is available or not.
DangerBird-@reddit
Have you looked at prices for cars and insurance lately? It ain’t like it was when we were that age. Not everyone has the means for all that. Parents or kids.
Also, sorry you feel like your kids are an inconvenience.
Felon73@reddit
I don’t have kids because I think they are an inconvenience. This is just one glaring example of why I never wanted children. I am sure not everyone is just fine with taking their 22 year old adult son or daughter everywhere. I would definitely not have asked my mother for a ride to the dispensary because I haven’t gotten around to getting my license. I probably would have caught hands over something like that.
Caspers_Shadow@reddit
We did not have kids, but we knew a lot of the kids growing up in our neighborhood quite well. No doubt in my mind that not pushing kids to drive, get summer jobs and develop relationships outside the house was detrimental to their development. The kids that just sat had worse outcomes across the board.
exscapegoat@reddit
I didn’t learn to drive until I was 19. But I grew up in an area where there is public transit and the roads are congested. Drivers can get very aggressive.
I also have a visual spatial processing deficit which makes it harder to judge distances. So I generally stick to slower lanes.
Plus my brother and mother used to mock me and say I’d fail the test. Guess who passed on her first try? That’s right, I did. Meanwhile my brother failed and had to take it again And they’ve both had more accidents than I have.
I had bus and subway maps and bus timetables.
And my parents would drive drunk, argue and physically fight each other while driving while I was a kid. Fortunately they split up when I was 12. My mother also tried to choke my brother in a car when we were in our 20s (I had long been no contact with her before she died)
Though she did pay for driving lessons as a Christmas present right before I turned 19. She didn’t learn to drive until she was well into her 20s and found it harder. So she thought learning younger would be a good idea. I do appreciate and respect that she did that for me
My dad was supportive and would let me drive for practice and helped me get a car in grad school. He didn’t mock any fears I had, but how to compensate and figure out solutions. He taught me things like stay in the slower lanes. And some of the basics. Like changing a tire.
_Silent_Android_@reddit
Do we really want more traffic though?
DangerBird-@reddit
Excellent take!
Tasunka_Witko@reddit
I'm stuck doing it because the young adult can't drive stick and messed up his car by hitting a pothole at 40 mph.
DangerBird-@reddit
Who among us GenX hasn’t trashed a car. I feel you. It’s a lot more expensive now.
JTBlakeinNYC@reddit
This is yet another reason why I love living in NYC—all of our kids ride the subway, so we don’t have to drive them anywhere.
DangerBird-@reddit
It doesn’t even make sense to have a car in NYC.
sanityjanity@reddit
Here's the thing. The enabling happened long, long before the kids became teens. The enabling happened when they were allowed to live their lives with very little discomfort.
I learned to drive *really* late (especially for our generation). I was 23. It was really scary for me, because I didn't have that wild confidence that your average teenager has. I was much more aware of the risks than I think younger first-time drivers are.
Today's teenagers and 20-somethings have that same experience, except that they also have whole lives where they faced a lot less discomfort, and a lot less distress. They are less prepared to face the stress of learning to drive.
And the motivators aren't there. I think a lot of them are having their sexuality rewired by the amount of porn that they consume before they're ever 18 -- more explicit, more impossible, more "perfect" bodies, and just MORE of it. They're a lot less interested in sex with each other.
CalmCupcake2@reddit
My kid has been solo bus riding since she was 13. I don't have my licence, we are city kids, and Canada has great public transit.
DangerBird-@reddit
In the city where there are option, driving is less of a necessity. Some cities, it doesn’t even make sense to have a car. Where the heck are you even going to put it?
alr12345678@reddit
ok, I am an urban genX with a 12 yo I don't have to shuttle much (thankfully for walking/bus/train). But a non-urban 20+ yo kids needing chaufeurring - hell no. I don't want to hand a car over to my kid when he's 16 but I will sure as heck make him get a license for life skills reasons. Same reason he learned to swim and ride a bike. Why is this a thing where kids dictate when they learn to drive?
sanityjanity@reddit
Ok, but how much money is the average 18 year old making? I think my local BK is paying about $10 - $12/hr. Assuming the teen is working 20 hours a week, that's not going to cover a car payment and insurance and gas on even a used car right now. They would literally be working just to support the car.
I think the transition from "no car" to "working with a car" is a lot harder financially now than it was for us.
Tumbleweeddownthere@reddit
I don't want my daughter to drive because there are many more people on the road and they've gotten worse on the road.
Not looking forward to drivers edand her friends driving her.
I loved driving all my life but now it's harrowing
DangerBird-@reddit
It’ll be okay. We can’t shelter our babies forever. It’s very American to expect independence from kids. Not everyone is the same. I think gender has a lot to do with it too. I’m definitely not looking forward to my daughter reaching driving age.
Striking-Amoeba-5563@reddit
Perhaps different in America?
But in the UK driving lessons are expensive and the test is such that you pretty much do need at least some professional lessons in order to pass. Perhaps of interest to our friends across the pond is this; an American‘s experience of taking the UK driving test: https://www.reddit.com/r/LearnerDriverUK/comments/1d2l8u0/my_experience_getting_a_uk_license_as_a_us_driver/
it’s getting harder and harder to even get a slot for a driving test (they keep getting bought up by bots and sold by touts apparently, hopefully someone might do something about this as it’s stupid), and costs for car insurance can be insanely expensive for young drivers [https://www.theguardian.com/money/2024/jan/27/young-drivers-car-insurance-price-rises].
My eldest (18) gets the bus and train to go to go out but my husband usually fetches him home in the car. No public transport after about 11:30pm around here so he’d have to get a taxi home if he’s going out-out, and they’re a dear do, and I’d rather he saved his money for uni. We’d be waiting up for him anyway so why not? He’ll have driving lessons after uni. Some of his pals with more well-off parents drive and even have cars of their own (cars aren’t necessarily expensive but insurance is) and they do offer to give him lifts sometimes too.
I used to get the bus and train everywhere as a youngster but would often ‘sofa surf’ or stay out long enough to get the first train home (at 5am) in order to avoid having to ask my parents for a lift home. But with hindsight, that wasn’t necessarily ideal and I think I’m kind of lucky nothing went wrong for me.
LeafyCandy@reddit
I wish we had trains here in Washington state. It’s not like back east where there are daily local runs, even outside of NYC and DC and the like, that run until late at night. Made life so much easier. There’s nothing here. Local buses, and that’s it.
LeafyCandy@reddit
It doesn’t faze me much. Their concerns — at least the ones my kids have — are legitimate. Especially given how covid’s melted so many people’s brains and their risk assessment skills aren’t good while their rage is up and their self-control is down, plus dirty cops messing with people for no reason. Yeah, I’m fine with them waiting it out if they want. We didn’t create a good world for them to live in.
marcopoloman@reddit
No way that happens in my world. Get your license at 16 and start running errands for me. 20s? You better be in college or out on your own working.
JoeyDawsonJenPacey@reddit
Well, Uber IS expensive, and buses ARE inconvenient, especially if you don’t know how long they’re going to take and you just have to get somewhere in a reasonable amount of time.
Just because you get a license and can drive doesn’t mean you actually have a car to drive. And fear of traffic/accidents is a real thing. I’m nervous any time I have to drive in certain areas bc traffic is horrendous and there’s always accidents. We have a teen that just got his license, and less than 3 weeks later, he was in an accident and was even more afraid to drive for a few months afterwards. I had given him my car and got a newer one, so he doesn’t have a car payment, but his insurance even before the accident was $225 a month. A part time job paycheck doesn’t go very far these days.
The best bet is to have a circle of friends where a few of them have cars and they’ll drive each other around and get food and gas as repayment. But these days kids aren’t as outgoing with a big group of friends as they used to be.
yourpaleblueeyes@reddit
Walking is free and yep, I am old....no one drove us around
DangerBird-@reddit
I biked or skated until I could afford my own car. This is Gen-X. I haven’t seen skating mentioned yet. What’s up with that?
sanityjanity@reddit
The bus is more than "inconvenient" for us. I want to travel to a nearby town, and it's a 20 - 25 minute drive. It is a NINE HOUR trip by public transportation.
The problem is that traditional bus routes work fine in dense cities with a lot of vertical space. They are crap in spread out suburbs or rural areas. What we really need are small buses that can be scheduled to go specific places.
gumercindo1959@reddit
That’s odd - I’ve never seen that. I live in a typical city suburb (about 30-40 min from a big city). As soon as my teen could drive, it was “alright - you drive if you want to go somewhere.” My teen gladly obliged.
H3lls_B3ll3@reddit
I didn't make my son get his license, and he did it when he was ready.
I have always been glad my son can count on me when he needs me, and that includes a ride.
I'm not going boomer on my kid. I love him. He's not a burden. He's my responsibility. He didn't ask to be born.
DangerBird-@reddit
My kid drives. While I appreciate not having to drive him around all the time, I do miss him. Our time in the car was bonding, time to talk and hang out. Now that’s gone.
Quintipluar@reddit
Can't say I blame them. Cars are a constant money sink and traffic accidents are the #2 most common cause of avoidable deaths. Long commutes are especially stressful and other drivers are often morons or psychopaths. If I had the option to not drive I totally would.
But as a teenager I didn't have this mindset. Getting my license was the first thing I did after turning 16.
alr12345678@reddit
I agree with all of this and we have 1 car in the family that we almost never drive it (because we prefer to bike, walk, etc), but I will still make my kid get his license to drive when he is of age. I just won't be also handing him a car. I actually can't recall the last time I drove our car. It think it was a few weeks ago when it was raining in a downpour and I was done biking in the rain and being wet for the day and needed to run my kid to karate class.
DangerBird-@reddit
That very much depends on where you live. Our suburban town requires a car to do pretty much anything. You can bike it, but the roads are crazy dangerous around here.
Quintipluar@reddit
Yeah even if you never plan to, having a license and knowing how to drive is useful and will most certainly come in handy one day.
Directorshaggy@reddit
I get it..cars are expensive as is everything else. Now, disclaimer, I never had kids but....it seems weird to me that people are still figuratively feeding the baby bird long after it's time to fly. Times have changed and it certainly is harder to make it, but at some point you have to jump in. This never ending adolescence seems, at least to this childless Xer, not conducive to their long term need to handle what life smacks you with. If modern life is to be lived in isolation, go get your own bubble. I know I might sound like a "boot strapper' but there's something to be said for making them take the water wings off and at least attempt to swim.
PayFormer387@reddit
Are we enabling the next generation by accepting that they don't want to drive?
Enabling them to live how they want? Is that a bad thing? Ditch the chauffeuring and make them get around on their own in other ways. I have a seizure condition and for years wasn't able to drive. I got around fine on a bike and on the bus. And even when I was a kid, my parents didn't cart me "everywhere." I got around on my own. I own a car today but still get around mostly by bicycle and I take the Metro to work.
The only people really hurt here will be the automobile and oil industries.
My daughter is 17. She doesn't want to drive. We live in a walkable/bikeable area so she doesn't need to and it saves us god only knows how much in car insurance.
The whole "cars are freedom" thing is total marketing bullshit. Cars are useful, sure, but mostly are a financial anchor.
W0gg0@reddit
At 18 I had a full time job, a car payment, and moved 50 miles away to another US state.
Bargle-Nawdle-Zouss@reddit
Yes. Tell them to figure it out for themselves, now that they are adults. Learn to set some boundaries for your children, FINALLY.
MyriVerse2@reddit
Family helps family. Half of my family never had cars. The other half drove them places. This is not a new thing, and these days there's more reason to drive them.
Puddin370@reddit
What are those reasons?
kfitz1119@reddit
If you remove all emotion from it, our job as parents is to teach our kids to live on their own.
AshnZan@reddit
I have discovered that if you don’t drive them they solve the problem themselves. When they are inconvenienced enough, they will either learn to drive or make a major changes in their lifestyle.
frogger2020@reddit
My cousin drives her daughter to and from college every day because the daughter is too scared to drive.
ob1dylan@reddit
Growing up with Boomer parents and step parents, I couldn't wait to get my license and be able to go somewhere without being at their mercy for a ride.
Snoozinsioux@reddit
My teenager takes a city bus 🤷🏻♀️
theupside2024@reddit
Why don’t they want to drive? It doesn’t make any sense .
Possible-Landscape72@reddit
My kids are among those with no interest in driving and it was THE biggest pain in my ass. My oldest finally got her license at 21 and it tickles me every time she drives away on her own. Recently, my husband and I took a weekend away and the oldest had to get the youngest to and from school. It was so good for both of them! Now my youngest has a sudden interest in driving. I think he saw how cool it was to not depend on Mom. I’m sure I’ll be driving my middle one for another ten years 😄It’s so weird to me. I could not wait to get my license and be free. My kids don’t see it that way. So crazy
agentmkultra666@reddit
Same here! I don’t understand when teens don’t want to transport themselves. I couldn’t wait to drive
dstarpro@reddit
This is not a "generational" thing, it's circumstantial.
Fit-Engineering-2789@reddit
The cost of buying a reliable used car has been way too high for a number of years now. Also, insurance rates have skyrocketed. I have 2 young adult drivers on my insurance, and the cost is ridiculous, especially when we haven't had insurance claims or issues with driving safely.
june-truth-sadface@reddit
Mine were learning driving at 14-15. I was fortunate to have the ability to teach them young. Taught my niece at 16 on a truck. But I had the ability to do so, not all have this.
tinyahjumma@reddit
I’m wondering if this is regional? My kids got their licenses at 16, and all their friends did, too. One my kids drives the stick as his everyday vehicle.
BitterPillPusher2@reddit
I have a 20 year old and 18 year old. I made them get their licenses when they were 16. It wasn't optional. It's a necessary life skill, especially where we live, and it's a hell of a lot easier to learn when you have parents willing to teach you and pay for it.
My oldest wanted to much more than my youngest and has always driven more. But my youngest takes herself to school, doctors, etc. She just doesn't drive around for the sake of driving around.
ZetaWMo4@reddit
I didn’t mind driving my kids around as teens. I wouldn’t do it for them past high school. I required all of mine to have licenses before they went off to college.
Wonderful_Spell_792@reddit
That sounds crazy. My oldest two are 12. They will be driving when they are of age. They are already asking to practice.