Killer gangs are inches from ruling all of Haiti
Posted by debasing_the_coinage@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 32 comments
Posted by debasing_the_coinage@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 32 comments
TheSandarian@reddit
Any suggested way to get around the paywall..?
Though considering Haiti's government & police forces are essentially their own gang factions, with just a little more restraint than the "actual" gangs, it's arguable that Haiti has already completely fallen at this point...
The support forces from Kenya (and smaller contributions from other countries) have basically had little to no impact... Even in "secure" areas, civilians are barely holding on to any semblance of a normal life.
Haiti, Sudan, Myanmar, Gaza, Xinjiang, Ukraine..... It's hard not to get depressed at the seeming lack of care & certain lack of action taken by the governments of the world; everything has to be so politicalized & approached with a "well what do we get out of it?" mentality.
It's sickening. I feel helpless in the face of these atrocities.
KJongsDongUnYourFace@reddit
Bruh, Xinjiang is one of the safest places in the world. Mosques everywhere, local language is the primary language. Everyone has a home. Everyone has food. Everyone has healthcare.
Not even remotely comparable. I'd highly recommend visiting. Western propaganda really is next level when it comes to anything China
TheSandarian@reddit
Keeping the theme in line with the rest of my comment, I was referring to China's genocide of the Uyghurs & Turkic Muslims, the vast majority of which are in Xinjiang province.
https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/08/1125932
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/31/china-unrelenting-crimes-against-humanity-targeting-uyghurs
KJongsDongUnYourFace@reddit
Neither of these mention genocide and this issue has been to vote multiple times at the UN, every single Muslim nation has voted against it and said the Western narrative is wrong. Independent investigations by the International Islamic council came to the same conclusion.
I'm genuinely surprised this is still being pushed bybthe West tbh.
TheSandarian@reddit
... Are you serious? Did you read the UN report?
Some bullet poits on what the Uyghurs have faced:
While the report concludes these "only" (and I'm using that word sarcastically) amount to "crimes against humanity," it's pretty obviously genocide, especially in regards to birth suppression and cultural destruction of a targeted minority. :L
Regarding UN votes, many of those countries (e.g. Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt) have deep economic and political ties to China... Like I was mentioning in my original post, countries approach these sorts of things with a "what's in it for me" attitude -- they have a lot to lose by not backing China, and unfortunately, essentially nothing to gain from poor Muslims in the middle of China.
This isn’t about "hating Chinese" or loving Muslims when convenient and it's infuriating to have to even explain that to people when it should be obvious that it' about acknowledging credible evidence and speaking out against such horrific acts. Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and the UN Human Rights Office, have all independently confirmed allegations of forced sterilizations, cultural erasure, mass internment.....
It's genocide.
Ali_Cat222@reddit
removed paywall here. for future reference, remove paywall site here. at the top there is always 5 options given, click 3 if first option doesn't work
redsonsuce@reddit
Give chatgpt the article URL. Thank me later
Alaishana@reddit
https://archive.ph/aqQ1H
TheSandarian@reddit
Thank you u/Alaishana & u/Zuli_Muli! o7
Rindan@reddit
"What do we get out of it?" is certainly something that people ask, but pushing that aside, the better question is "what do we do about it?" The US has tried moral crusading before, and even done it in Haiti. No one seemed to like it. It isn't clear what the "solution" to Haiti is. The only thing I can imagine working is a tight occupation and an imposed government. No one is going to pay for that morally or monetarily, and even then it probably wouldn't work.
So what's the solution even in the most idealistic world where nations come together to try and really help?
Ed_Durr@reddit
The only way to really solve Haiti’s issues would be for the US (or another capable power) to militarily invade and occupy indefinitely, imposing Bukele-like measures and probably a sizable number of executions. Spend years building a civil society from scratch, while under constant attack from gangs and international protesters.
I wonder why nobody is jumping to do this.
GoldenRamoth@reddit
I think the biggest problem to the "solution" is that most folks try to align a dystopian area to what their own "normal" is like, and try to force it to be do.
At the end of the day, the western ideal of a nation state has failed Haiti. And that region is now currently embroiled in a crazy struggle for the privilege of waking up to tomorrow.
Without being there in person, it seems the idea for everyone there is simply: how do I get to tomorrow?
They're so uniquely fucked, I don't think there is an easy, or simple, solution. To step in to fix things, at this point, would be to bring to bear overwhelming force to declare "normal", with an extended period of struggle in which the folks there aligned, or died trying to fit that ideal.
Without that overwhelming force...? Now what? Well it seems like it's a fight for survival, and after which a "new" order might pop up that people can align to for survival
But... No matter what happens, the depressing thing is people are going suffer. On a small island there's too many people for subsistence living. And to keep the population stable they need a societal structure which is now completely gone.
Yikes.
bizzaro321@reddit
The US government isn’t bad at “distributing democracy”, they just say they’re doing that while bombing civilians and making business moves. If there was a hypothetical morally superior country that genuinely wanted to help they would be helping right now, but such a place does not exist.
Ignorantmallard@reddit
Check out Burkina Faso and Captain Ibrahim Traore if you need some good news. Guy just just kicked the French mining companies out and started exporting gold for Burkina Faso. Building factories of all kinds. Restarting the agricultural industries with solar powered tractors and just unveiled an electric car with a 330km range. France keeps trying to assassinate him so thousands of people are protesting in France and Burkina Faso.
SignificantAd1421@reddit
Kicking France off but replacing them with Russia isn't a win.
Btw nice propaganda you are spreading there nothing of that is happening rn and Burkina is just a Russian puppet state with no money.
The_Better_Avenger@reddit
This is gold... Found the Burkina Faso shill. And russian lover shill.
There are no extremists in the country and everything is the fault of Europeans. There is also no war in burkino Faso and he has control of the whole nation. There is nothing wrong there.
Jaded-Ad-960@reddit
His country is being overrun by Al Quadi afiliated terrorist groups and despite his promises, he hasn't made any progress whatsoever getting rid of them.
Crazyjackson13@reddit
Yeah.. that’s great and all, ignoring the fact that he’s a military dictator in charge of a country where around 40% of the country is controlled jihadists.
That, and he’s traded France for Russia, not much is gonna change.
UndocumentedMartian@reddit
Yeah I too would probably trade people trying to assassinate me now for people that will try to assassinate me later.
Ignorantmallard@reddit
Yea the Russia thing is weird. Putin's puppets have a great history of being assasinated. To say not much is gonna change seems a little off though. Considering he's building factories, refining exports, providing water and electric to senior citizens it makes a lot of sense why Birkinabes demonstrate their support so much.
https://youtu.be/LjoFrpgqtjU?si=YrS7lQMyWRbR8IDh
A_Lightfeather@reddit
I don’t know if I’d call it that great since Captain Traore is another military dictator supporting other coup governments, actively courted the fascist Wagner group, and has had his troops/ had troops under his command conduct massacres.
spyguy318@reddit
In a lot of those cases they’re largely internal or regional conflicts where “doing something about it” would either involve significant economic sanctions or a military intervention. Economic sanctions are of limited use when the perpetrator is deeply tied into the global economy (Good luck trying to sanction China lmao), the country doesn’t give a fuck, or have much of an economy to begin with. And nobody wants to get bogged down in yet another unpopular and complicated civil war on the other side of the globe where everyone hates them, gets them accused of imperialism and neo-colonialism, and ultimately accomplishes nothing except getting lots of people killed and fostering animosity towards western influence. You can’t not politicize this because this is geopolitics.
The only one that really isn’t like this is Ukraine, and in fact there is a huge amount of aid coming from the US and European countries who have correctly identified this as an opportunity to stop Russian expansionism. If it’s any consolation, the world is actually relatively more peaceful than it ever has been in history; there have always been these kinds of conflicts going on everywhere constantly, but now with the internet, social media, and globalization it’s all much more visible.
w4lr6s@reddit
Well, if my hunches are right, soon there will be a moment of opportune where everyone gets the chance to set things right, but the cost would be insanely high and the opportunity does not promise success
It's either very democratic, post-religion future, or a theocratic technotyrannical future; there will come a war to seek a new global social contract.
Because the past global social contract, settled through the dropping of atomic bombs and the agreement that killing Jews is bad, has been unravelled. Now we got too many people who don't care if nukes fall, and we got too many people who think killing Jews is a prophesied duty.
I for one think that not all of this is up to us - humans cannot control their future, morality and history in totality. There are some parts of it where you have to admit, you cannot eliminate all injustice, all violence, all lies etc. There is always going to be enemies, sectarianism, geopolitical clash of interest, failures. Sometimes lies prevail over truth, barbarians prevail over civilizations, nations all have an expiry date.
If you try to take it all under control, you're playing God. And playing God would be a disappointing thing at its best.
Zuli_Muli@reddit
https://www.removepaywall.com/
stonkbuffet@reddit
Such a shame. Haiti is in shambles and they have to rely on Kenya for help. Americans, Canadians and Mexicans have the power to help yet they do nothing. Young people are obsessed with a crisis 10,000 miles away but do fuck all when it’s happening in their own backyard. Help Haiti. Help Cuba. All you young people that say they want to make a difference: this is where you make that difference.
nickkkmn@reddit
What is the USA supposed to do ? Do you have any suggestions ?
ronburgandyfor2016@reddit
Jesus when the United States gets involved it’s exerting its imperialist ambitions. When it doesn’t they are neglectful and just don’t care
Vdov_1@reddit
Reme people: when America intervenes - America bad. When America doesn't intervene - America also bad.
Coolenough-to@reddit
How did that guy get such cool hair? Zoom in. Thats his hair, right? It is amazing hair.
You know, I think thise tires are actually worth good money these days. All these troubled countries are always seen burning piles of tires. Maybe this is the problem, they miss so many economic opportunities.
Zuli_Muli@reddit
The collapse of Haiti’s government in April last year was a challenge but also an opportunity. An interim government called the Transitional Presidential Council was installed. A UN-brokered Kenyan-led security mission arrived soon after. But a year later things are worse than ever. “We are approaching a point of no return,” María Isabel Salvador, the UN’s top official in Haiti, told its Security Council at a meeting on April 21st. Tasked with preparing for elections that in theory will be held in November, the council is now mired in allegations of corruption. The security force of around 1,000 people (less than half the number originally planned) has not been able to stem the chaos. Its funding runs out in September. The council is a “transitional authority that controls nothing,” says Claude Joseph, a former prime minister. “It’s an unsustainable catastrophe. We could lose Port-au-Prince at any time.” Port-au-Prince, the capital, now sees daily gun battles in which police and civilian vigilantes face off against a gang coalition called Viv Ansanm (“Living Together”). It has seized control of much of the city. The international airport has been all but shut down; the only way in or out is by helicopter, or by a barge that skirts the coast to bypass gang territory to the south. On May 2nd the United States designated Viv Ansanm and a sister organisation as terrorist groups, opening the door to tougher criminal penalties for those who provide them with money and weapons. The collapse of public life is accelerating. Most schools are shut. Cholera is spreading. The Marriott, one of the last functioning hotels, has closed its doors. Gangs have surrounded the offices of Digicel, Haiti’s main cellular network through which most people connect to the internet. “If Digicel goes down, the country goes dark,” warns a security expert. The gangs don’t need it. Increasingly sophisticated, they use Elon Musk’s Starlink satellite system to communicate, organising themselves to the extent that they have been able to keep control over access to Haiti’s ports. They also extort lorry drivers and bus operators moving along many of the country’s main roads. The UN reports that in February and March more than 1,000 people were killed and 60,000 displaced, adding to the 1m, nearly 10% of the population, who have fled their homes in the last two years. Circulating videos show gang members playing football with severed heads, bragging: “We got the dogs”. Central Haiti, once relatively peaceful, is fragmenting into fiefs. Mirebalais, a city which lies between Port-au-Prince and the border with the Dominican Republic, is now controlled by gangs. “The country has become a criminal enterprise. It’s the wild, wild west,” says a foreign official. Patience is running thin at the UN Security Council. The United States has already committed $600m to the security mission, but is unlikely to offer more. “America cannot continue shouldering such a significant financial burden,” said Dorothy Shea, the US ambassador to the UN. Few other countries want to donate. The council is so desperate that it is exploring deals with private military contractors. It has been talking to Osprey Global Solutions, a firm based in North Carolina. The founder of Blackwater, Erik Prince, visited Haiti in April to negotiate contracts to provide attack drones and training for an anti-gang task force. The council declined to comment. The Haitian police are overwhelmed; an estimated 12,000 officers polices a population that approaches 12m, barely half the international standard. Weak leadership, poor co-ordination with the Kenyan-led force, and calls for the ousting of the police chief point to deep institutional rot. In Canapé-Vert, one of Port-au-Prince’s last gang-free pockets, a former policeman known as “Commander Samuel” leads a vigilante group called Du Sang 9 (“New Blood” in Creole). Gangs have thinned its numbers. It is all that stands between them and the prime minister’s office.
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We've found 19 sources (so far) that are covering this story including:
Daily Kos (Left): "A true Portrayal of Haitians"
Foreign Policy (Center): "Trump Targets Haitian Gangs"
tippinsights (Right): "Rubio Designates Haitian Gangs As Foreign Terrorist Organizations"
Of all the sources reporting on this story, 40% are right-leaning, 20% are left-leaning, and 40% are in the center. Read the full coverage analysis and compare how 19+ sources from across the political spectrum are covering this story.
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