US isn't quite ready for a CME
Posted by OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit | preppers | View on Reddit | 52 comments
https://www.space.com/astronomy/earth/the-us-isnt-prepared-for-a-big-solar-storm-exercise-finds
If you want to skip the fluff and just read the report,
https://www.jhuapl.edu/sites/default/files/2025-04/Space-Weather-TTX-Report-Summary-v3-FINAL.pdf
Bottom line, a huge CME isn't considered a US crasher at this point, but the report still talks about power being out for days, and a lot of communication failures, electronic and bureaucratic, screwing up the response. And the proposed fix is to launch more satellites, and who knows if that will ever happen.
So CME still gets to stay on your bingo card.
2020blowsdik@reddit
No one is...
kycolonel@reddit
Laughs in Amish!
Lethalmouse1@reddit
If the Apocalypse happens the best prep is to secure the Amish, since they are generally pacifist but accept to some degree external security. And their lifestyle is generally immune to Apocalypses short of nuclear winter or such.
9volts@reddit
Secure? Ask them for help or?
Lethalmouse1@reddit
Since the trend of preppers tends to be defensive capacity. Even in the frame of farming, if the defensive reality is needed and the Amish have none, a favorable security trade could logically workout.
Of course, if you're a nefarious person you might consider it another way, but then that's probably a shitty prep anyway, because it is generally more valuable to establish sustainable trade than be a nefarious raider.
If you burn through the resources, fail. If you unjustly oppress, someone will likely come along to offer positive security and oust you for sustainable trade.
So sustainable trade is the better option all around.
Since they have generally internal community capacity, they will be reduced but not really too harmed by the apocalypse in a logistical sense. And they will have easy quick pivot to filling any gaps in their community.
Ideally, if it's raw apocalypse, and you got control of a railway, you could trade that way. Amish use rail travel when they cross community. And being a secure trade bridge would be likely profitable. Scrap and a steam engine is not that hard.
Seekertwentyfifty@reddit
Actually, there’s no ‘getting ready’ for some of the solar events which our planet has experienced overtime. Ones that would make a ‘Carrington Event’ seem like a non event.
elitodd@reddit
Humans have been around for 300,000 years. At least some people have been surviving every solar even we’ve had.
funnysasquatch@reddit
If there is a large enough CME to destroy the grid it will be an end of life event.
The least of your problems is the lights went out in your home.
Because it isn’t just losing power. This (or any other EMP) is going to fry the computer controllers that manage complex systems as well. So: Every airplane falls from the sky. Trains derail Dams fail Chemical plants and refineries chemical reactions uncontrolled Nuclear power plants fail and go critical Nobody can communicate
So now you have fires , floods, toxic fumes, nuclear meltdowns and mass panic as people don’t know what is happening.
It will be much worse than anyone can imagine.
elitodd@reddit
People far to often forget that if the grid goes down long term across the US, it’s only a matter of time before every single nuclear reactor melts down along with all of its spent fuel which is currently in active cooling. It’s the end of all life in the country no matter what. Nuclear power simply has not been engineered in such a way to be safe in the scenario of grid collapse.
cryptodog11@reddit
Why are people downvoting this comment? funnysasquatch is 100% correct. Once the grid gets fried it’s game over. Cars won’t work and roadways will be clogged. Nobody will get their essential medication, massive amounts of food will spoil because there’s no way to get it to people. The government will exist in name only. You’ll struggle to hunt because everybody will be hunting and will wipe out entire populations of animals. Not something you’d want to experience.
dittybopper_05H@reddit
That’s literally bullshit. Airplanes won’t fall from the sky, Poulet Petit. CME induced GICs don’t have a small enough wavelength to significantly disrupt electronics. They are a potential danger to the electrical grid, though.
People have been extrapolating about what a Carrington level event would do based upon how it affected the only significant electrical system at the time, the long distance telegraph system.
But that was a system with no protections that ran off of 150 volts DC current to an earth ground.
Totally different than today’s electrical grid.
ISOs and power companies have taken measure to mitigate the damage. We watch the Sun like a hawk, and we will have at a bare minimum 12 hours to President Madagascar everything, and probably more like a full day.
deja_vu_1548@reddit
A CME that power is when you kiss your ass goodbye.
But there's a whole spectrum of CMEs between "non-event" and "civilization ending".
Such as CMEs that will fry long distance lines and transformers, but not even tiny-ass circuit.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
In theory (maybe only in theory) grid operators will disconnect and ground out their gear when a big CME is coming - and they have at least 24 hours warning, usually closer to 3 days. This isn't to say that there won't be damage - some power providers will ignore the warnings or mitigate incorrectly. Some areas might not have mitigation at all. But it's not SUPPOSED to be a life ending event. They turn off and ground the grid until the event passes, repair what damage did occur, and life goes on.
Don't ask me the odds of it going that smoothly. But in theory it COULD and in principle it SHOULD.
This is radically different from an HEMP attack. First, they'd happen with virtually no warning, so no one is going to have time to get the grid into some sort of safe state, if that's even possible. Second, because of the wide frequency range, they can affect not just the grid, but even things not plugged into the grid. How much damage would ensue no one actually knows, but it doesn't matter. Once the US loses the power grid and can't repair it (repairs require the grid to be functioning) the US crashes. Also note that if people are lobbing HEMPs around, WW3 is underway. Even if grid repairs were possible, there will be other things to worry about in a lot of places.
CME might be a bad month for a lot of people. HEMP attack... it's a bad few months and a worse ending.
TexFarmer@reddit
CME would be preferable to an EMP. CME will NOT destroy small electronics & most vehicles. Both will result in the grid being down for years.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
CME would be preferable, yes. It won't affect much of any electronics not hooked to the grid, and it shouldn't take the entire grid down because, as noted, the grid operators have a day or two to disconnect key points in the grid. Hunks of the grid will still burn - but if anything is left, we use that power to continue to pump fuel, and if we can pump fuel we can keep transportation going. Which means we can ship parts, get factories open again, and start the painful process of repairing the damaged parts of the grid. I don't think that takes years, as it would be the most important project any government ever had. But it definitely wouldn't be quick, and there would be a lot of misery.
Compare EMP, where there is no time to get the grid isolated. When the Russians did some testing along these lines, years ago, they literally melted some power lines, and burned out a power plant. And that was with a relatively small weapon. It's possible a few of these could take out the entire US grid, which means no practical way to pump fuel, move spare parts, run factories to replace wire... nothing. Repairs become impossible. The grid isn't coming back from that; by the time anyone can organize the resources to do hand repairs, the US will have collapsed because food distribution will have halted nationwide, and then you only have weeks.
How much damage EMP does to electronics, cars, etc is an open question. The only testing I know of exposed a lot of cars to EMPs in a series of increasing power steps. On the one hand, they only managed to fry one car. On the other, they stopped the test at that point and it was still under the size of a pulse an actual HEMP would create. So no one is sure what would actually happen. And it's unclear what happens to very small devices with less potential antenna. I tell people who worry about this to assume the worst and make actual Faraday shields (not cages) for their stuff. But it's deliberately fool's advice, because no one is going to care if your laptop or cell phone survived at that point. People nationwide will be fighting over food in a matter of weeks. The US is heavily armed and the fights will become slaughters. It's not survivable.
Manatee_In_A_Tree@reddit
Like everyone is supposed to know what a CME is
totpot@reddit
Watch the movie Knowing if you want to see an extreme fantasy version of a CME.
Squattymctightpant@reddit
Think of it as the sun giving Earth a pearl necklace
IndomitablePotato@reddit
CME- Contribution of Minimal Effort (basically googling the thing)
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
There are weeks in this sub when it's just about all anyone talks about. Also, What is a CME in Google works fine.
Gat_Cat@reddit
Coronal mass ejections. Very low risk in comparison to weather events.
dittybopper_05H@reddit
You’re in the prepper subreddit. If you don’t know, you can always just read TFA or look it up.
WhereDidAllTheSnowGo@reddit
Remember all this is a matter of scale, like wind, a whisper to a tornado
What you can do:
ninjadude1992@reddit
Any recommendations for a while house surge protector?
BallsOutKrunked@reddit
a lot of that will be what kind of panel you have. I rock a Schneider QO because I have that kind of panel
https://a.co/d/dOMUuOp
ninjadude1992@reddit
Less than 100 isn't bad. I assume I would need an electrician to install this?
BallsOutKrunked@reddit
If you have the space in the breaker panel you literally just push it on. Turn off the main supply, verify there's no voltage on the panel, and pop it on. You'll need to take the faceplate off the load panel first, it's a few screws. But again before you go within 10' of that thing with a screw driver kill main power and then verify no voltage.
If it's the right product for your panel and you have the space on the panel it would take 2 minutes.
juxtoppose@reddit
Just to add, don’t be a twat like me and forget about your solar panels and storage battery, it’s not a mistake you will make twice for more than one reason.
WorldClassAwesome@reddit
I’ve got Siemens panels so I went with the Boltshield which occupies a couple of breaker spots. Otherwise I’d have probably gone with the Siemens firstsurge FS140. I also put a separate Ditek DTK120 on the air conditioner at the disconnect box.
NewLawGuy24@reddit
When was the last one?
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
They happen all the time. The vast majority miss Earth entirely. The rest are generally too small to notice. The last big one ("Gannon") to smack earth was just a year ago; 3 CMEs arriving over a couple of days; just about no one outside the solar observer community noticed. No part of the US grid went down.
dittybopper_05H@reddit
I’m a ham radio operator. I noticed. Big time.
CMEs also cause disruptions to HF communications, but can also enhance the long distant capabilities of VHF. When HF goes down I fire up the 6 meter rig and try to work som auroral propagation.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
If anyone on this sub noticed it was going to be you. :)
NewLawGuy24@reddit
Interesting thanks for that info
vaikedon@reddit
A CME takes days to reach earth and with GOES we see them as they're happening. It's not going to be like a nuclear blast of EMFs from the sun that we won't have time to react to.
Most of the world isn't prepared to go back to the stone age. It's not like there's other countries that are more on top of it than we are. They'll be broadcasting for days in advance that a CME has occurred and is heading right for us with a pretty accurate time period for when it is due to strike and how long it will last. Everyone will know to shut off their electronics and stuff at a certain time and wait it out.
I think that what's more likely to take us out for the duration is a coordinated attack on our communications infrastructure in combination with an attack on our power grid, fuel distribution or refinement, data server centers, stuff that we rely on daily. In Sacramento California someone burned a utility pole and then cut a fiber optic line and the whole city had zero internet for an entire day, some areas for two days. Imagine if a bunch of people entered the country during the previous administration with a plan to execute such attacks all over the country all at once while executing a much more dire and immediately threatening attack while our communications were down? 9/11 could be made to look like child's play, and instead of thousands of people dying we could see hundreds of thousands of people dying, if not millions.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
No idea why you mentioned "previous administration." The current one is slashing programs like FEMA and defense programs involving cybersecurity. In terms of preparedness, we're worse off now than we were then. We also have fewer friends in the world. Risks have gone up, not down.
That said, the idea that the US might get hit in that fashion doesn't keep me up at night. China's in a defensive posture and Russia can't even take Ukraine. Neither is eager to start anything bigger with the US. Regardless of administration, the US military and soft power is still something to be considered.
vaikedon@reddit
I explained why.
So you're saying that if an attack like the one I illustrated takes place you're going to blame the current administration. That's rich.
9/11 didn't exactly require a war machine to effect upon us.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
This sub has a rule against politics, so other than to point out that there's quite a lot I blame the current administration for, including a horrifying loss of rights, disregard for the Constitution, deporting American citizens to foreign gulags, falsifying evidence, trashing alliances, dismantling the CDC, FDA and ongoing health research during a measles bloom, and openly spreading disinfo about vaccines... I'm just going to cut this off here. Your opinions are your problems. Bye.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
A political comment such as this one is never acceptable on r/preppers, nor is it focused on emergency preparedness.
Popular_Try_5075@reddit
This is why I keep certain tech items, for example my router, wrapped in tin foil.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
I find that when I wrap my router in foil, the wifi seems to degrade significantly. *straight face*
I'm also going to point out that if a CME happens, foil's not really a help. CME is not EMP. If a CME does happen and your idiot power provider hasn't taken the right steps, what fries your devices is the power surge coming through the power line. All foil will do is delay the time when you smell the smoke. :)
Popular_Try_5075@reddit
Hmmm, I wonder if it would be more effective to keep it housed in something better insulated like a microwave?
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
Um... are you talking about a router that you're actively using? Because then it obviously has to be plugged in, and it's being plugged in that exposes it to the wild burst of line voltage that CMEs cause. Sticking it in a box does nothing to help.
If it's a spare router that you're keeping in storage for after then as long as it's not hooked up to anything, it's entirely safe from coronal mass ejections. No need to wrap it.
This is wildly different than an EMP (electromagnetic pulse) caused (generally) by specific nuclear weapons. That's when you start talking about wrapping things in foil. Why you'd bother, I don't know; if (for example) the US gets EMP'd then the whole grid is coming down and maybe not being rebuilt in your lifetime, so you won't have to worry about internet bills anymore.
Popular_Try_5075@reddit
So maybe if I put a powerstrip with a surge protector in the microwave that would help? I'm gonna need a bigger microwave.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
It's taken me this long to realize your jerking chains here. Sigh. I mean I don't blame you, this sub is prone to ideas and beliefs worse than what you evinced, and who doesn't love satire. I'm just irked that I didn't catch you sooner.
Besides, you know perfectly well that if you microwave a running router, the emitted frequencies will form a heterodyne frequency that strips the inner metal of the microwave and emits it as a blast of flaming ionized vapor. Which voids the warranty.
Popular_Try_5075@reddit
I was most worried about putting tin foil in the microwave.
lincey@reddit
I would consider something a bit more practical for everyday life, such as a UPS (uninterruptible power supply) - I have several from APC, hook up all my important equipment to them in-case of power issues (my computers, NAS, router, playstation, TV, etc).
CommiRhick@reddit
I have faraday bags I use for spare / prepped electronics...
Expensive, but worthwhile. Can test by putting your phone inside and trying to call it, it won't get a signal.
Yeah_right_sezu@reddit
Solar Flares, just say Solar Flares.
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit (OP)
Not the same as a CME. They're very different events. Which is why I didn't say solar flare.
smsff2@reddit
Upvoting for educational value.
I don't think a CME is the biggest concern. I have personal experience with — and some PTSD from exposure to — far more disruptive technologies. That said, the post might encourage people to think about emergency preparedness, which is beneficial for them in any scenario. It also links to highly illustrative scientific sources, which could be educational, specifically for younger Redditors.
ryleg@reddit
Ok, I'll bite. What are the more disruptive technologies? Cyber attack?