"Aitch" or "Haitch"? | TheaterFire

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elvpak@reddit

Aitch as that is the correct way. Haitch is only acceptable if you're Irish.

I'm hearing more people say 'zee' now instead of 'zed' ffs.

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Downtown_Physics8853@reddit (OP)

Zee/zed is how we identify Canadians here in the U.S. Also, when they say 'sorry', it sounds like 'sowrry'......

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UmlautsAndRedPandas@reddit

Aitch is "proper" because of how it was affected by the Norman French speakers in the High Middle Ages.

It's very common to say haitch in Cockney and Estuary accents, because people think "Well, an h creates a huh sound and it's spelt like that, so it's sensible for it to be haitch", but they don't realise that h words have quite the history.

Words of Germanic origin tend to be pronounced with a huh, words of French origin are still in the process of evolving. History is pronounced with a huh, but the BBC newsreaders' autocues still tell them to stay "an historic moment", showing that the h was indeed silent until extremely recently. Honestly is still silent. Herbs is a huh in British English, but silent in American English.

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elvpak@reddit

The rule for using 'a' or 'an' before a word starting with H is based on which syllable is stressed...use 'an' if it's the second syllable (e.g. hotel, historic).

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UmlautsAndRedPandas@reddit

I hadn't actually noticed that before, but yes it is a good point.

But, there is also a phonological basis for it: if a word starts with a vowel phoneme, then the indefinite article must be "an". The addition of the /n/ breaks up the regular indefinite article "a" (/ə/) and the word where the very first phoneme is a vowel. This aids pronunciation and keeps the flow of the sentence moving.

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Gary-erotic@reddit

Aitch and Haitch are both right.

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Sharks_and_Bones@reddit

Aitch. Mainly because my mother wouldn't let me say it any other way when I was a child because only uncouth or uneducated people said Haitch. Yes, she had some "interesting" opinions.

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bambiiambi@reddit

Haitch - but English is not my first language so dunno

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Sad_Lack_4603@reddit

When you get a call from someone working in "Haitch Ar" you're getting a little hint of the level of evil you'll be dealing with. Its even worse when one of these people informs you that they are an "Haitch Ar Champion".

That's their official job title.

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WordsUnthought@reddit

Don't care much about aitch or haitch but there's a special circle of hell for whoever decided that "champion" is a normal thing to include in job titles.

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R2-Scotia@reddit

British was "itch" when I was young, Aitch / Haitch is American

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bonshui@reddit

I still say "itch" (East coast of Scotland)

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mellotronworker@reddit

'Aitch'. Any other pronunciation is a sheer sign of chronic inbreeding and educational subnormality.

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Ranger_1302@reddit

Do you drink milk from a saucer?

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mellotronworker@reddit

What sort of an animal are you?

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Ranger_1302@reddit

As me or a worm?

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mrafinch@reddit

Checks out, I was born in Norfolk and I refuse to acknowledge “aitch”

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DiscoSkrtel@reddit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3y0CD2CoCs

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Hot-Box1054@reddit

I always add the H purely because it’s the letter H 🤷‍♂️

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Bellimars@reddit

Do you pronounced the letter L as Lell then? Or F as Feff? Asking for a friend.

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anjou_aviatrix@reddit

I dont think think that's the same though? It's not about the written word, it's the sound.

For the letter L, we say "ell" which is the sound that that letter makes. The L sound is just concentrated at the end. There is no H sound in Aitch, so I think it's not crazy to assume there is a H somewhere, in this case at the start.

L - ell F - eff B - bee R - arr V - vee

The sound appears at some point in the name. It's not illogical to assume that the same would happen for H. The only other letter that I can think of that bucks this trend is W.

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Bellimars@reddit

It's literally listed in the bloody dictionary as being spelt Aitch. It's not even a matter of debate.

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anjou_aviatrix@reddit

I'm not debating it as fact. I'm just pointing out that it isn't wild or stupid for people to think it's haitch. It is completely logical and valid to think it, but folks in this thread would have you believe only absolute morons would think it.

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Bellimars@reddit

No, many have pointed out that it's a regional variation. But nearly everyone knows it's wrong just as pronouncing bottle as bockle in Lancashire is not how it should be pronounced, even the people that do it know it. I didn't say people were stupid to say Aitch but they are fucking wrong. Fuck me, do you not realise people can get things wrong?

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anjou_aviatrix@reddit

Literally agreed with you that it's wrong. Think you need to take a deep breath and get some fresh air or something.

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zombiejojo@reddit

Lell memm nenn oh pee 😆

I'm betting they don't

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NotoriousREV@reddit

H doesn’t begin with H.

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Ruby-Shark@reddit

Only half of the 26 letters in standard English start with the letter they are.

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BigBunneh@reddit

Ay?!

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daveb_33@reddit

Bee

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one_pump_chimp@reddit

Cee

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anjou_aviatrix@reddit

I literally had no idea it's meant to be pronounced Aitch. I actually assumed that Aitch was wrong because generally when people drop the H sound, it's laziness (av instead of have, ello instead of hello).

It's baffling that the pronunciation of the letter H would not have a H sound in it when most other letters do.

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Smug010@reddit

I've always said Haitch. Didn't even know it was "wrong" until my 20s. I've got irish catholic grandparents so it might come from them. I've live in Cheshire and no one has ever corrected me.

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NortonBurns@reddit

I've always considered it's centred around Lancashire, so you're not too far away.

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Raining_Lobsters@reddit

Aitch is the correct pronunciation.

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Mammoth-Difference48@reddit

Haitch is an inaccurate affectation - people think they are being correct by adding it but they are wrong.

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Real_Run_4758@reddit

in catholic hibernian english it’s haitch; i think it can be used as a sectarian shibboleth

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Raining_Lobsters@reddit

Yes, it is. The Catholics (of which I am a rather lapsed one) have it wrong.

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perplexedtv@reddit

Telling people how they speak is wrong is also a shibboleth.

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TinTin1929@reddit

That....doesn't make any sense at all.

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perplexedtv@reddit

Yeah, it allows you with one word to tell if someone is a cunt or not.

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Acrobatic-Shirt8540@reddit

I don't think you understand what a shibboleth is.

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elementarydrw@reddit

Inconceivable!

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Raining_Lobsters@reddit

OK m8 x

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SleipnirSolid@reddit

You're wrong. It's spelt "mate".

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Pitiful-Hearing5279@reddit

It’s Germanic.

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Hot_Cicada_9318@reddit

Yep. My dad was hot on this one and used to pull me up if he heard me pronounce it otherwise.

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sunbeamshadow@reddit

Aitch is the only right answer

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My_Finger_Smells_Why@reddit

So true, though it does make me unpopular when I correct people.

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Obvious-Water569@reddit

Aitch.

I judge anyone who says "haitch" the same as people who say "anythink". Dullards.

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MarkinW8@reddit

In case you hadn’t noticed, OP, the class system and regional bias is alive and well in the UK.

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PhotoResponsible7779@reddit

Brits are funny people, aren't they. The best thing is that after switching to non-rhoticity give or take in the late 18th century, they felt they were short of "R", so they invented linking R to put some of the Rs back and intrusive R, to make up for the loss of R by adding R on places where they make the least sense. Still, they've sticked to their guns and they don't pronounce R even when they spell the R sound. It's ludicrous.

H is even crazier, since there's just not reason to drop it, because H is pronounced very clearly in British English. Perhaps the reason for it may be that that's the way the Frenchies do it just this way.

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thor-nogson@reddit

You had me right up to “sticked”

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PhotoResponsible7779@reddit

You wouldn't expect me to be a Briton, just based on fact that I'm replying in AskABrit, would you? But since your language is so ~~ludicrous~~ ingenious, it never fails to detect an intruder. But back to the OP question, in English as foreign language classes, the pronunciation "aitch" is taught.

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PhotoResponsible7779@reddit

Ouch! You're right. I am monstrously sorry.

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uctpa08@reddit

Skeleton or skellington?

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thor-nogson@reddit

Secretary or secetry?

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QOTAPOTA@reddit

Aitch. There no H in aitch.

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Downtown_Physics8853@reddit (OP)

But....I assume there used to be? Otherwise, why use a name that didn't showcase the letter? I mean, I can understand "double-u", but not "aitch" unless it used to be "haitch" everywhere...

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Princes_Slayer@reddit

How would you spell F then? (F)eff by this logic

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_cosmicomics_@reddit

And ywhy

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zombiejojo@reddit

Ay bee cee Dee ee feff gee haitch iye jay kay lell memm nenn oh pee queue rarr sess tee uou vee wubblewoo xexx yiye zed

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loudly03@reddit

Totally saying "wubblewoo" from now on.

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mrshakeshaft@reddit

There’s a really good podcast called “the history of English” it gives you a really good intro into why the English language is really quite fucked up and where it came from

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QOTAPOTA@reddit

Not sure. My old boss was known as aitch. It’s certainly not just a Scouse or Scots thing.

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Real_Run_4758@reddit

i guarantee there are smug people in the comments saying that anyone who says ‘haitch’ is an idiot, yet often say things like ‘the amount of people’

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thor-nogson@reddit

OMG amount vs number is right up there with Haitch!

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Bellimars@reddit

As long as they use capitals correctly for the word I, when trying to be pedantic, or use full stops appropriately, for that matter.

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I_waz_Perce@reddit

So what you're all saying is that it's a silent "h"! 🤔🤫

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thor-nogson@reddit

Like the silent P in swimming bath

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zombiejojo@reddit

Yeah, like the silent f in feff, the silent l in lell the silent m in memm and the silent s in sess?

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GeraltOfDissidia@reddit

I am clearly in the minority here but it's a Haitch from me. Saying Aitch to me is akin to saying jif instead of gif.

I'm from South Yorkshire and have no idea if it's a local thing or not.

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thor-nogson@reddit

It’s frustratingly common in SY but it’s still wrong

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Powerful_Ad_9452@reddit

I’m from West Yorkshire and I always thought I heard haitch locally

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Purple_Bureau@reddit

I'm from West Yorkshire and, counterintuitively, I always assumed it was meant to be Haitch because I heard everyone say Aitch, but nobody pronounces the h sound at the start of any words there (have becomes av, heard becomes urd, her becomes er)!

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Remarkable-Data77@reddit

Neither, I'm from Yorkshire, we usually drop it😜

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ColinBurton@reddit

aitch

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Knight_Castellan@reddit

Anyone else reminded of that Mitchell and Webb sketch?

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Wonderful_Discount59@reddit

I (and almost everyone I know) pronounces it "aitch".

But I won't say anything bad about people who say it the other way (in part, because when I was at school, a girl I slightly fancied pronounced it that way).

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Jamesapm@reddit

And what does it matter? haitch sounds better. More correct. So who's getting fun y about it?

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Appropriate-Divide64@reddit

Despite what purists would say, haitch is an acceptable,.often regional, variation. Can't we all be friends?

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julia-peculiar@reddit

Aitch aitch aitch aitch aitch all day fkn long AITCH you hear me Gen Z and Gen Alpha?!

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AccuratelyHistorical@reddit

Do young people in England pronounce it haitch? That's strange! It must have spread from Ireland (I'm Irish and haitch is universally used by all generations here)

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Slutty_Foxx@reddit

I use both, usually aitch but if preceded by a vowel sound use haitch

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SocieteRoyale@reddit

I always say "haitch" I think it's weird people would say it without

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Bellimars@reddit

Wait until you see how the letter is spelt in the English dictionary, it'll blow your mind. Aitch.

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andyrocks@reddit

H. That's how you spell H in the dictionary. It's a letter.

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TheHames72@reddit

Exactly. People keep calling ‘aitch’ a letter. It’s a word.

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Bellimars@reddit

You might as well bother reading before you spend your whole life looking stupid.

Here's the Cambridge dictionary for you: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/aitch

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SocieteRoyale@reddit

maybe it is a Liverpool thing?

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Bellimars@reddit

It seems to be an Irish thing which might account for a regional adoption in Liverpool, but as I don't live in Liverpool I'm not prepared to comment on it despite living only 40 months drive away. I expect there would be differences even within Liverpool between classes though.

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SocieteRoyale@reddit

forty months drive away is pretty far!

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Bellimars@reddit

I've edited it but left the original in so your comment still makes sense. Have keen eyed upvote for your excellent proof reading.

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lumberingox@reddit

Aitch if your a prod, haitch if your a Catholic - haha - one of those "identifying" things from growing up in Belfast

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Mel-but@reddit

Either or, depends on how I’m feeling, who I’m speaking to etc. at work I’m speaking with Americans over the phone so to make myself as clear and understandable as possible I would say Haitch, pronouncing the H. Outside of work my very northern accent will come out and it aitch, often with an elongated vowel at the beginning so it maybe even sounds more like aytch

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Pitiful_Carrot5349@reddit

I saw a stand up comedian in Belfast who said that he could work out which side someone was on by betting them £5 that they couldn't spell Hippopotamus. Haitch being the catholic pronunciation.

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Hippymam@reddit

I know officially it is aitch, but growing up it was always haitch. I grew up in Manchester with Scottish and Irish grandparents.

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Ms_tempy@reddit

Depends if I think about it too much. If I don’t it’s Aitch. If I do It has the H.

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transgender_goddess@reddit

haitch (I don't care if it's "wrong")

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Ataralas@reddit

Aitch, hearing ‘haitch’ gives me the same visceral feeling as nails on a chalk board!

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Sea_Appointment8408@reddit

I get the same feeling when I hear someone say "pacifically"

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publicOwl@reddit

I’m the same with “I could care less”.

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Flat-Delivery6987@reddit

Can I aks you a question is the pinnacle of rage for me

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Magacks@reddit

I fucking hate that, it’s a really big American thing, the don’t seem to understand that it makes no sense.

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TheGeordieGal@reddit

Aitch from me in Newcastle. My Nana and friend who are from Sunderland - just down the road - are both haitch people.

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EscapedSmoggy@reddit

Like, I know it's Aitch, but that doesn't stop me from saying haitch. Aitch has always felt like I'm dropping a "h" sound.

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apeliott@reddit

Surprised nobody has posted this yet

https://youtu.be/qmVnr7rsWrE

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Economy_Judge_5087@reddit

I know what this is even before I click it. And yes, someone should have posted it by now.

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Economy_Judge_5087@reddit

Aitch. Next question.

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MetalRocksMe_@reddit

I know it’s aitch that’s correct, I know people who refuse to accept that and they keep saying haitch. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♀️

I just realised after I wrote my post that there’s no red line under aitch but a red line under haitch, I guess that tells me everything on which one is correct.

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Rinsetheplates_first@reddit

Aitch

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prustage@reddit

Apparently in Ireland (so an Irish friend told me) its a way of telling the catholics from the protestants. Catholic schools teach "haitch"

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Dic_Penderyn@reddit

In the Irish language, just like in the Welsh language, the H in the alphabet, (if you start reciting the alphabet A,B,C,D etc) is pronounced as 'Huh'. This could be the reason that when speaking English, Celtic first language speakers tend to pronounce it 'haitch' rather than 'aitch' more. This tendency may have also rubbed off on Irish and Welsh people who did not learn a Celtic language as their first language.

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drbrtsn@reddit

Can confirm, Irish Catholic ex-wife (from Northern Ireland). I am Scottish but, unfortunately, our daughters have been corrupted and use "haitch."

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Dont_trust_royalmail@reddit

people here seem unaware that it is a sectarian issue - at least i hope the "i hate anyone that says haitch" lot are just ignorant

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pigadaki@reddit

Hinteresting.

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1182990@reddit

This made me snort-laugh.

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Icy-Belt-8519@reddit

H doesn't start with H, it's aitch

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Downtown_Physics8853@reddit (OP)

..except in Manchester?

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Own_Secretary_6037@reddit

Are you from Manchester. If they say haitch there, it’s probably the Irish influence. I’m Irish and will always say “haitch”, because that’s how it’s pronounced everywhere in Ireland. I’m pretty sure even on the news it’s haitch — and newsreader-speak in Ireland has a bunch of cringy and unnecessary pronunciations which survive from the early days of broadcasting, but I’m pretty sure haitch was never changed to aitch.

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marshallandy83@reddit

I’m pretty sure even on the news it’s haitch

This should be pretty easy to confirm since "NHS" must be used at least every week.

Do they say "en haitch ess"?

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Own_Secretary_6037@reddit

I’m was mentioning to OP about Irish news, meaning the RTÉ broadcaster. I don’t really need to check, but yes they say HSE (the health services executive) every other week.

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Appropriate-Bad-9379@reddit

I’m from Salford and it’s a aitch…

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Bellimars@reddit

I Iive in Manchester and it's aitch. And I won't have a Philadelphia resident tell me otherwise, however controversial that sounds.

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Own_Secretary_6037@reddit

Look, I think at this point even Harrison Armstrong should change his stage name. I mean, a Philly Redditor wouldn’t bring all this up if they didn’t know their stuff.

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Downtown_Physics8853@reddit (OP)

No, I'm from Philadelphia. Liverpool and Manchester were heavily populated by Irish immigrants in the mid 19th century, as was the U.S.

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Own_Secretary_6037@reddit

Yes, I know lol

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MFingAmpharos@reddit

Only if the Manc in question is thick

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Mickleborough@reddit

Aitch. It’s a class thing.

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jonathananeurysm@reddit

It's "Aitch" but my dad is from Dundee and says "Itch" and insists he's correct so who can say?

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Figgzyvan@reddit

Does he say ‘ji’ for J?

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SnoopyLupus@reddit

Hatch is colloquial.

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riscos3@reddit

Aitch, thick people say haitch

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Poo_Poo_La_Foo@reddit

I was always taught to say it without the "H" but I am from around the south of England.

I had a teacher from Wolverhampton who had a very strong accent and he would prounounce it and I started to do so - from copying/impersonating him so much - but I got out of the habit quite quickly!

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