$500 for 2hr ppl lesson?

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Rough_Blood_2175@reddit

Great price!... I did all my licenses in El Salvador and was around $115 p/h flat rate

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RedDirtDVD@reddit

That’s upper end. Cheaper elsewhere in the country for sure. Fuel surcharge is a bit suspect at this point. Oil way down…

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flightist@reddit

100LL doesn’t really track oil very closely, but $40/hr on top of a $200/hr rental is a hell of a choice.

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RedDirtDVD@reddit

I get it’s not perfect. But 100LL has come down a lot lately. So that was more my point.

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AGEdude@reddit

Base price at my FBO hasn't changed at all since I started working there a year ago. However the $0.1959 /L carbon tax is no longer added.

I haven't seen any flight schools reducing their rates in response. Perhaps that would be a bit naive to expect.

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Yeah that’s a good point. Carbon pricing is off so it should be down. I know at my airport we’re still going through the tank that was purchased pre April 1. So the cost is still in that fuel. But it should drop decently soon…

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AGEdude@reddit

Carbon tax was paid at point of sale, I don't think it was paid on delivery to the FBO

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gavingreer@reddit

I pay 660 for 2.0 leaving soon though

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DisregardLogan@reddit

Holy shit

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DisregardLogan@reddit

Yeah. It’s unfortunate but that’s aviation.

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ThinkDeepSpeakSoft@reddit

Seems about right. I would have paid $300 usd to my instructor. But, it’s in an old 172N. He charges $140 usd per hour wet for the plane and his time is $60/ hour so:

1.2 hrs dual X $200 = $240 + 1 hr ground school ($60) = $300 usd total

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dcode9@reddit

Why not study for ground school yourself and take the exam? It's one of the ways of saving money.

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ThinkDeepSpeakSoft@reddit

Yeah I do. I’m taking the online. I should have clarified that he charges for time when we do some preflight stuff etc.

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No-Use-8410@reddit

My school is 226/hr wet and 45 for instructor 60 for instrument. Or 141 $396 a lesson regardless of time.

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dabanana27@reddit

365 USD for two hours is a great price if it was in the states. However I can’t compare to Canada.

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Deathstriker908@reddit

Canadian money isn’t real it can’t hurt us

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Canikfan434@reddit

Reminds me of paying a toll on the NY State thruway years ago, and some of the change I got back included Canadian coins. A little later I go to pay another toll (same thruway), and handed to lady in the booth a handful of change-including the above mentioned Canadian coins. Immediately she snaps “sir, these are Canadian coins- Canadian currency is discounted 10%!!” I replied “Well, I got those coins earlier today as change back at exit xyz! So who owes who money here??!” She threw the coins in her drawer and snapped “just go!” Gee, I don’t miss NY one bit!😂

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gromm93@reddit

Canadian coins work in American vending machines. They're a perfect match for size and weight.

Why? Fuck, I dunno. Decisions were made I guess.

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busting_bravo@reddit

EZ-Pass ftw

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Canikfan434@reddit

When I lived up there it was long before EZ Pass!😂

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DiamineViolets4Roses@reddit

I miss back east for a thousand reasons, but definitely not that one. Been through that same thing.

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AlexJamesFitz@reddit

It's just looney up there

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haveanairforceday@reddit

Don't forget it's occasionally also tooney

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gromm93@reddit

Yeah, our dollar is totally looney tunes.

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acekng1@reddit

Note this is just 1.2 hours flight time. $365 USD for 1.2 hours seems pretty high to me.

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The_Raccy@reddit

You’re missing the ground cost also is charged in that 2.2. Plane rental including fuel is ~$175/h USD (~$241cad/h) Totally reasonable. Instructor costs might be a little high but it’s really area dependent. $500cad (~$360usd) for a 1.2 flight + 1 ground is right about average imo.

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acekng1@reddit

Wow I am out of touch with current rates. That $175 wet rate + $80 instructor seemed really high to me. But I just looked at local schools and that is right in line with what they are charging.

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L0LTHED0G@reddit

In 2014, 2015 I paid $155/hour (wet, hobbs) for a 172S + $50/hour for the instructor.

$175 wet after 10+ years seems... low? $8 more for the instructor seems... cheap?

Then again, for my flight review this Dec/Jan I paid a CFI $50/hour again.

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acekng1@reddit

In 2018 I was paying $105 wet hobbs + $45 for instructor. That same school now is $175 wet hobbs + $70 for instructor. This is a local Part 61.

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L0LTHED0G@reddit

What was the plane though? Newer 172 with G1000 or a '65 172 with steam?

To be fair, I was also training through a (smaller) college and this was Part 141.

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Eversonout@reddit

It’s a little high, I pay $116 wet for a 172, and $55 for instructor. Than again, I’m with a tiny ass part 61 with a few old guys doing it for the love of the craft

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flightist@reddit

If somebody were to find a flight school in Canada offering a 172 wet for $160 an hour today, I’d suggest they fly as much as possible before the imminent bankruptcy of the school.

I rent a 172 every few years to maintain my instructor quals and I’m gonna say that’s a ~2010 rate here.

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Eversonout@reddit

Yeah not sure what gives besides they’re not trying to make much money off of it, I’m in a mid COL location too

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flightist@reddit

Don’t look that gift horse too closely in the mouth, and run with it.

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flightist@reddit

Yeah, that instructor rate is about a decade behind the times, maybe more.

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Former-Later@reddit

My kids are working on their ppl in US, I pay $110 wet and $50 to a freelance instructor. I use eaa young eagles sporties ground as its free under 18 Heck eaa even pays for their passed ppl written. And I have zero worry with them beating up my plane.

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TGasparolo@reddit

Where are you?

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Fearless-Crab-Pilot@reddit

I'd take that price all day long. Sign me up.

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General174512@reddit

Sounds pretty good to me, at least here in Australia.

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No_Money_7418@reddit

I’ve been to 2 schools here in LA and we don’t pay for the fuel (though it’s probably added into the plane price)

A 2 hour flight lesson with my instructor is about 530.

These numbers SUCK but it is what it is.

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Mrsysreset@reddit

Not sure where you are flying out of but here at CYYJ (west west coast Canada) that's about right. 213/Hr wet plus instruction and ground brief. Do not believe what a school or club tells you it will cost because that is if you are gods gift to flying and get it in the bare minimum time legally possible not the average. Seems most major cities is pretty comparable too (looked at Edmonton, Calgary, Winterpeg, and such).

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CorrectPhotograph488@reddit

Yea that’s super good

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Leidaguffey@reddit

I'm closer to 500 USD for 2 hours with instruction in California. Completed my PPL in 51 hours plus ground lessons. Complete with expenses (Bose A30 headphones, ipad with foreflight, etc) was $18700.

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DeltaBravo22410@reddit

Run away that’s insane

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Grubbs20000@reddit

I'm at $429 for just rental at 2.2 in california :/

$22 fuel $165 instructor $22.50 instructor pre/posts

$638.50 for 2.2 hrs 🥲

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AnarchyCan1@reddit

That isn't a 2 hour lesson. It is 1.2.

Most flight schools in Canada you should be able to find for $210 or so CAD per hour of Flight time (hobbs) then about $70 per hour for instructor.
Local schools to me normally just add about 0.2 to the hobbs time for the instructor time. So in your eample it would be (1.2x210) + (1.4x70)= $350, plus gst or whatever taxes you face.

$500 for a 1.2 is VERY high.

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flightist@reddit

That isn’t a 2 hour lesson.

It’s a 2.2 hour lesson.

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AnarchyCan1@reddit

It's a 1.2 hour lesson as far as meeting the required hours in your logbook.

You don't need an hour ground brief for every hour or so of flight. 10-15 mins max for most of the flights with maybe a couple of proper ground sessions for the bigger topics like XC planning. That's why adding 0.2 is the standard.
A competent student will have maybe 5-10 hours max of ground training beyond the mandatory 40 hour ground school class.

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flightist@reddit

You certainly don’t need an hour for every flight, but OP had an hour for this flight. Which is entirely appropriate if there’s a few new exercises being introduced that day, such as at the beginning of a PPL.

10-15 minutes is adequate if the student is preternaturally gifted, has a bunch of informal instruction, or has received / viewed preparatory ground instruction on the various exercises in advance. Most students don’t meet that description, but get 10-15 minutes of PGI & briefing for a flight where they’ll go up and do 2-3 new exercises anyway, and then arrive in the circuit at 10-15 hours having seen much but absorbed little, and then bash around in circles for another 10-15 hours. Instructors gotta get that time in their logbook, after all.

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TobyADev@reddit

We don’t have to pay fuel at mine nor ground school but $243 which is equivalent to £131.54 for over an hour, is very good before considering instructor costs

Adding on fuel which is equivalent to £25 or so brings it to just under what I pay at my club for a 152. So I’d say that’s good

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TheEchoChamber69@reddit

Its like that for about 15-20 hours, then you have to think ground school should be mostly over, minus review, you’ll have around 20 hours solo wet rate tossed in and about 20 more hours of dual.

So you’ll pay about $8000-$9000 for your first 20 hours, then $4800 for your next 20 then about $6700 for the next 20. Give or take a few thousand it’ll likely cost you $18,000-$19,000 then whatever the check ride is, whatever you spent on an iPad mini/headset, whatever you spent on your written test prep, and your checkride. Realistically closer to $20-$21k cad all in. Which in the US, you’re lucky to get out under $16,000USD-$18,000 now days and only minimum 40 hours can hit the $10,000-$11,000 USD mark. Some places like Cali, you can pay the equivalent to $27k CAD just for ppl.

Ppl is the most expensive ticket, then instrument. CPL isn’t terrible because you only need 20 hours of dual with a Cfi.. that means if it takes you 100 hours for PPL/IFR, 130 can be solo, usually 120ish..

In the US today expect to spend $55k-$70k from ppl to cpl, then CFI is $7500-$8000 per 1, then MEI can be around $6500ish. So $76,500 USD bottom to $92,500 top. Usually the MEI would come later once someone’s deep in the trenches, cfii may come a little later too depending on school requirements. In your case? About $105k cad bottom, to $128,000 cad top of threshold if all was equal. The rates you’ve given are about on par with MCOL flight training for a 172

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ChainsawVasectomyy@reddit

Looks about right to me. I fly in British Columbia and everywhere local to me is around this cost.

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Mick288@reddit

I currently pay $70 for class 4 to 2 instructor and $200ph for a C172 with fuel, per hour pre GST. (Alberta, one of the CYBW schools)

At these rates and based on 2.2 instruction and 1.2 aircraft, with tax you would pay $413.70.

10 hours of ground brief for PPL sounds considerably off the mark. I had approximately 25 hours of PGI's for PPL and I was studying a lot, both before the lesson and afterwards.

I got my PPL last year, it cost $22k and I had just over 70 hours.

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No-Program-5539@reddit

If anything that’s cheap.

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Pitiful_Fox5681@reddit

PPL takes 40 hours of flight time. At $250/hour, that's $10k. It's actually a pretty killer deal.

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Ruepic@reddit

Looks right, I pay around 450 CAD for my lessons

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MondayNightRawr@reddit

$365 US for two hours is a good price

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No_Willingness_169@reddit

Normal

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pingdown@reddit

My school is 170-190$ hr/wet for most planes and 75$ an hour for dual instruction. Comes about to about 530$ per 2 hour lesson. Still better than taking out a loan and going to ATP or something of that sort. You’ll still pay less than 20k even if it takes you ~70 hours to get your PPL. Which is also normal from what I’ve heard!

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Dbeaves@reddit

If you're already complaining you might wanna look elsewhere for a hobby

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Fantastic-Cheek-480@reddit

Dudes not even complaining, he’s asking for opinions on pricing

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allieni@reddit

That seems about right. Although, will probably end up being a fair bit more than 18k to finish.

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Mr-Plop@reddit

I'm so glad I don't have to rest planes often. Gosh current prices suck.

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shalaxam@reddit

Holy moly I feel old. I just had to check my old flight school I instructed at. We used to charge $170 dual an hour up to around 2012. Now it’s $340.

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blame_lagg@reddit

Yes, this is normal pricing.

It could get slightly cheaper if the ground session was shortened, maybe by doing the preflight inspections by yourself before the lesson begins.

The weak CAD makes it tough right now, since airplane prices / engine reserves / spare parts are mostly denominated in USD.

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Rustybob48@reddit

I got my PPL at the university of Illinois in the 1970’s. They had an “institute of aviation” with package plans, so to speak. In other words, they quoted a fixed price for a specific class which included X amount of flying and X amount of instruction. With the funds I had available. I was forced to choose their basic sailplane course which included receiving your PPL. This turned out to be a good idea because it introduced me to sail plane flying. After college, I added a power rating to my license and bought an airplane, a model that I think Cessna should keep making. It was a 172 RG with an 0-360, retractable gear and a constant speed prop. I owned it for the better part of my first 800 flying hours and used it a good bit in my business. Can you believe that same 1980 airplane is still in service today in a flying school over in Mississippi. I think the airframe has around 4000 hours on it now, maybe more. So what I had done was pick a package program that I could afford and followed it through to its conclusion moving on forward after that. I’m 75 now and just last year I sold my two-year-old RV 14. I keep wondering how this could be one of the most popular training aircraft in the US. I absolutely hated the casting nose gear. It’s the first aircraft I’ve ever owned without a stable nose wheel. Sure it was fine after about 55–60 kn when the Rudder took on steering authority but I felt uncomfortable opening the throttle and wondering if I would stay on the runway. I really only enjoyed flying the RV 14 on days when the wind was directly down the runway I was using for takeoff.

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heildirimsiegerkranz@reddit

Currently in a Canadian flight school for CPL and fly the DA20, rates are about the same. We get charged a little more decimal hours for instructor time on duals but we’re not paying fuel surcharges.

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Apprehensive_Fly1525@reddit

I pay 235 an hour for plane and instructor. That's on the “cheaper” end in my area. Take that as you will.

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Solid_Cut_7356@reddit

What school is this and what part of Canada? Seems a little high if you ask me, but I haven’t attended a flight school in a few years.

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BandicootNo4431@reddit

Yeah, that's pretty average, borderline cheap tbh if you're in a higher cost area like Vancouver or Toronto.

The 1 hour ground might be a little excessive later on but makes sense for early flights.

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Asleep-Frosting-5061@reddit

I’m 340 dual wet cad per hour. 172 in a major city. 255 is the rental and then 85 for the instructor. So $245 USD per hour.

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Burrit0sAreTheBest@reddit

Seems a little high, my instructor doesn’t charge for any ground briefing and the plane comes wet. Overall isn’t super high but maybe talk to your instructor about briefing prices

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makgross@reddit

No, don’t ask your instructor to starve.

Free ground briefings are, to be blunt, insulting. They are just as much work as flying lessons and I’ll never understand why students think they should be free.

Get a professional service, and you should expect to pay for it.

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Vast-Noise-3448@reddit

For real, I paid my CFII and bought us both lunch while we did ground.

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CanuckNot51st@reddit

Getting a good briefing is part of being a good pilot. I'd be worried if my CFI wasn't being paid for them. I could see how a non-paid briefing would not be as thorough if someone wasn't paid.

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