ATF Visit
Posted by shooter116@reddit | Firearms | View on Reddit | 100 comments
Reading the earlier post about the 180K rounds of ammo got me thinking — how many guns would someone have to buy, and over what period of time, before the ATF might show up at their door? Has anyone ever had a visit? Of course, assuming you're legally allowed to purchase and possess firearms. Asking for a friend.
shaft196908@reddit
How would the ATF know multiple guns were purchased at once? Unless the laws changed, 1 NICS check is good for 24 hours- so multiple guns can be bought on one check and when your info is run, there is nothing in the electronic part of the process in which the number of guns is shared. Nor is the make model and serial number, That info remains on the ATF form with the dealer for 20 years. Unless the dealer or someone is contacting ATF. The background check does not go thru ATF anyway.
True_Fill9440@reddit
What happens after 20 years? Thanks.
shaft196908@reddit
The FFL is cleared to destroy those records after 20 years.
shooter116@reddit (OP)
Buying two or more handguns within 5 business days from the same FFL dealer requires the dealer to file an ATF Form 3310.4 (Multiple Sales Report). This is automatically sent to state police and the ATF.
True_Fill9440@reddit
Excuse my newness…..
Why does ATF visit? Cake and coffee?
Are you required to answer questions?
shooter116@reddit (OP)
🔍 What Might Trigger an ATF Visit? These scenarios can raise red flags and potentially prompt a follow-up, usually via:
⚠️ 1. Multiple Handgun Purchases
Buying two or more handguns within 5 business days from the same FFL dealer requires the dealer to file an ATF Form 3310.4 (Multiple Sales Report). This is automatically sent to state police and the ATF. While this doesn’t guarantee a visit, it puts your activity on the radar.
⚠️ 2. Frequent High-Volume Gun Purchases
Buying multiple firearms across multiple dealers in a short time (especially rifles + handguns) may trigger interest. Patterns that resemble "straw purchasing" (buying for someone else) or potential trafficking will raise suspicion.
⚠️ 3. High-Volume Rifle Purchases (Border States)
In border states (like Texas, Arizona, California, New Mexico), buying 2+ semi-auto rifles under .50 cal with a detachable mag within 5 days also triggers a multiple sales report.
⚠️ 4. NICS Check Issues or Delays
If you frequently trigger delays or denials during the background check, that may warrant follow-up.
⚠️ 5. Tips, Complaints, or Suspicious Behavior
Sometimes it's not about quantity, but a neighbor, gun store employee, or someone else reports you as "suspicious."
No_Passenger_977@reddit
If you buy a couple at a time they may show up and ask a few questions
doecliff@reddit
I worked with a guy. He was pretty dumb. He was buying multiple Taurus 9mms. He got a visit. But to be fair, he was sending them to Gahanna. Im not sure the atf even knew but when the questioned him about it he said he was hiding them in packages of home goods and leaving them off the manifest to avoid theft in Customs. He was just plain dumb and was doing for a friend in Gahanna. He only got 18 months because he was so cooperative. .
Lampwick@reddit
My father bought a half dozen new in box Glock 19GEN5's from a "kitchen table" FFL that was getting out of the business. He called and told me he had no idea why he did it, because he hates Glocks, but it was probably because the dude was selling them for so cheap.
A couple months later he gets a knock on the door. It's two fat fuckwit ATF guys who say they want to talk to him about buying all those Glocks. He asked "do you have a warrant?" They said "no, we just want to talk." So he shut the door in their faces and went back to watching TV. He never heard from the ATF on the matter after that.
Steel_Prism@reddit
Based, honestly
NotAGunGrabber@reddit
I've seen a video of someone who got visited because they bought two guns at a time.
I also know of a case where someone bought 20 and didn't get visited.
LiberalLamps@reddit
Two handguns in five days generates a report to the ATF (not lowers or rifles). But unless you are buying 5+ of the same model at once you’ll probably never hear from them.
oaktreebarbell@reddit
5 business days, so if the FFL is open once a week, that would make it 2 handguns every 5 weeks
Ornery_Secretary_850@reddit
It's not FFL business days, it's standard Mon-Fri business days.
oaktreebarbell@reddit
Wrong
“A business day for purposes of reporting multiple sales of pistols or revolvers is a day that a licensee conducts business pursuant to the license, regardless of whether state offices are open. The application of the term “business day” is, therefore, distinguishable from the term “business day” as used in the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) context.
Example: A licensee conducts business only on Saturdays and Sundays, days on which state offices are not open. The licensee sells a pistol to an unlicensed person on a Saturday. If that same unlicensed person acquires another handgun the next day (Sunday), the following Saturday or Sunday, or the Saturday after that, the reporting requirement would be triggered, the subsequent acquisition of a pistol or revolver would have to be reported on a Form 3310.4 by the close of the day upon which the second or subsequent pistol or revolver was sold.”
Warrmak@reddit
Generates a report to CLEO, The ATF has no idea how many guns you buy at any given time.
JamesRawles@reddit
Certain rifles in 4 border states will generate a flag if bought 2 at time or within 5 days.
Exact-Event-5772@reddit
I believe it’s actually 3 pistols in one trip. And it just triggers a form for the FFL to fill out.
It’s different in border states though.
Inevitable-Sleep-907@reddit
It's highly likely I'm wrong but I thought it wasn't a week but 7 business days so if you purchase on a weekend or a Monday you'd need to wait for Wednesday of the following week before it's not flagged
ChevTecGroup@reddit
My dad has bought 4 of the same gun from me at the same time. He wanted to stash them all over. Never got a visit or anything
Admirable_Cry_3795@reddit
I may, allegedly, know someone who purchased two pistols at the same time and never heard a peep
Edrobbins155@reddit
I did 4 of the same pistol. Never got a visit.
retromullet@reddit
I bought two Glock 47s at the same time and no one came knocking. They probably just googled me and saw I was a square.
Glocked86@reddit
Certain rifles also have the same multiple purchase form requirements in border states.
jasont80@reddit
That really suggests they are considering some other information they probably shouldn't have.
CreatedUsername1@reddit
What about that one time when that TX couple mistakenly received 2 boxes full of US govt. M16s?
NotAGunGrabber@reddit
Oh yes, the government reacted so appropriately to their own mistake by raiding the couple's home.
ReeeeeeAndClear@reddit
That pissed me off so much. LIKE SHUT UP ABOUT THE CRATES DONT PUT IT ON SOCIAL MEDIA. The govt. would just end up wroitingnit off anyways
winston_smith1977@reddit
A classic example of a perfect time to STFU.
deadinmi@reddit
We have a customer at my store who is buying 2-3 handguns a week. He never buys the same thing, has probably bought 20-30 guns this year. He has not gotten a visit.
fpssledge@reddit
Knew someone that worked in the FBI who explained they mostly are monitoring for groups like possible cults or militias that could pose a threat. More that than keeping joe schmo from buying a his and her hunting shotgun.
TaskForceD00mer@reddit
Which is ironic given Militia's and Cult's would be looking at multiple long guns, rather than handguns typically.
MikeyG916@reddit
Except they get to decide who is a member of one of these groups.
Right wing Christian? You might be an extremist.
Member of a mosque that has a radical Iman leading it? You're fine.
TaskForceD00mer@reddit
"It Depends" on a lot.
Where do you live
Does your last name sound Hispanic, especially in the border region
The exact type of guns being purchased
The alignment of the moon and stars
TheCarm@reddit
Why would the ATF visit for any reason? What are they worried about?
Warrmak@reddit
They don't, unless they have a reason. They have no idea what you are buying, since the 4473 goes in a filing cabinet, and never sees the light of day unless there is a trace request.
Warrmak@reddit
The real answer is, the ATF has no idea how many guns you are buying. the 4473's are getting filed and kept by the FFL, but those don't get sent to the ATF unless the FLL licenses is surrendered or expired.
If they are coming to talk to you, they have a reason that has nothing to do with your impulse buying proclivities.
tmas4343@reddit
21 guns and over 5000 rounds but tell them to jump off a cliff and and if they have questions, contact your attorney and do not talk to them. You go on a list but I haven’t had any delays
505manufacturing@reddit
505 in the house!
realspartan76@reddit
David Koresh knows the answer to this question.
fubalubalon@reddit
Last time rti has carcanos for 99$ I bought 25. Then again they were carcanos.
HolyShitidkwtf@reddit
Back when the Gen 1 S&W Shield 9mm had a huge rebate from the manufacturer, I bout 10 of them. Never heard a word from the ATF. Best deal ever. Lol
doecliff@reddit
If you buy multiplies of the exact same gun, that will raise suspicion.
Edrobbins155@reddit
You would think. But it does not always get a visit.
Im_Back_From_Hell@reddit
Fact. I bought a dozen SKS' back when they were dirt cheap. No visit.
gravity_loss@reddit
They know you're not arming a rebellion. They have a file-box labeled "rednecks who just won $200 off a scratcher" for all the 'crate of SKSs and Mosins' purchases.
Edrobbins155@reddit
What about the guy who bought 3 glocks at once?
Come to think of it, I buy multiple guns a few times a year. Never a visit.
Ranges from HP22a's to P226's
PreparedForZombies@reddit
I've bought three of one without issue in NH, but fair. Anecdotal.
Ornery_Secretary_850@reddit
I picked up four handguns on Saturday from my FFL. That's the second time this year I've done so, a GB addition is a terrible thing, and so far no visits.
Squirrel_Works@reddit
Having a dog increases your chances of a visit.
Smart_Slice_140@reddit
This
b1ueToe@reddit
it’s the atf, just farting will get them to take it to court to get in banned.
Smart_Slice_140@reddit
Hahahaha 😂😂😂
FabiusBill@reddit
And your dog shot by proxy.
BigoleDog8706@reddit
Depends on the state and county from what I've been told. Bought several pistols in one day, no issues. Go to get some stuff of lay a way, told I have to wait 24 hours between pistol purchases otherwise it gets reported to the ATF. No idea if bullshit, but them don't really care. They are more then welcome to come.
jdata20@reddit
Why does it matter how many firearms you purchase?
Kinet1ca@reddit
It shouldn't but we're talking about ATF here. It apparently increases chances of a straw purchase or other criminal/illegal activity and thus why a form is filed. ATF prob then has an algorithm or some other mechanism to filter through reports looking for other flags that peak its interest, ignoring most of them but for a select few seeing other data points that prompt contact.
Im_Back_From_Hell@reddit
Back when SKS' were dirt cheap, I bought a case of them, (12 guns) for like 59 bucks a piece and gave them as Christmas presents. No ATF.
Beneficial_Bus5037@reddit
Is this the story about the white van in Colorado with .308 & 7.62 ammo in the back?
They were pulled over because of a traffic violation.
That gave police probable cause to search their vehicle.
Then, the ATF was called in when it was discovered they weren't supposed to be in possession of any ammo at all. The amount was just a headline for news media.
left_write@reddit
A traffic violation does not give probable cause for a vehicle search. The article I read said they consented to the search.
Beneficial_Bus5037@reddit
You, sir, you are right!
I'm certain they were unaware of their rights due to them being from another country?
SloCalLocal@reddit
Who knows what they were thinking, but if one of them had possessed a valid hunting license the ammo would have been legal (until they hit Mexico, that is). There's no possession limit if you have an exemption, and a hunting license for any state suffices.
Im_Back_From_Hell@reddit
Not if you are a prohibited person like these two were.
SteveHamlin1@reddit
"They were pulled over because of a traffic violation. That gave police probable cause to search their vehicle."
False.
Beneficial_Bus5037@reddit
They were riding around with high beams on. That led the police to follow & stop them.
I'm sure LEOs on site just peeped the ammo crates in the back & proceeded to get the drivers permission to search.
Clothes-Excellent@reddit
Depends In which state you live in
Inevitable-Sleep-907@reddit
The simplest answer is they don't appear to have operational standards and don't even need a reason to come knocking. Remember you don't need a reason to tell them to fuck off if they don't have a signed warrant. If they do have a signed warrant keep your mouth shut and wait for your attorney to tell them to fuck off for you
FountainLettus@reddit
Gun store visitor had the ATF come to his house after buying 50bmg ammo. I was a skeptical so I asked how much he bought, he said 10,000 rounds. Made a little bit more sense why he got a visit. He said it was for a machine gun shoot in the desert the following month
AlphaTangoFoxtrt@reddit
It's less about how much you buy, more about what. If you're buying a pistol a week, but they're all different models, ok you're an eccentric collector with poor impulse control.
If you're buying a new stock Glock 19 every single week... Well that raises some flags.
Hunter88889@reddit
Had 10 transferred to me in one day and never got a visit
MidniteOG@reddit
You buy a couple high point yeet cannons, they’ll show up.
SuperNa7uraL-@reddit
Years ago during the AWB I bought an SKS from a local shop. A few months after the purchase I got a visit from the ATF and police, at like 10pm.
The shop I bought the SKS from was busted for selling other SKS’s that were illegally configured at the time, so the ATF was visiting everyone that bought an SKS from them. Mine was fine, totally stock. I just showed them and they were on their way.
PreparedForZombies@reddit
Your dog ok?
Jenkki15@reddit
10pm is bullshit. I’d be so pissed if they did that and ask why it couldn’t have waited for a normal time of day.
Stewart_Duck@reddit
Best friend bought 13 of the exact same revolver as wedding party gifts. Nothing happened. If anyone had looked into it through, getting the exact same gun, all engraved with mostly the same information, and all having the same blue pearl grips, kind of a dead giveaway what they're for.
R_Shackleford@reddit
I had my door kicked in by the ATF for having gummy bears in the same box as a pistol when it arrived to my dealer for transfer. It’s a wild world out there and anything is possible.
Pafolo@reddit
If you buy 2 at once your already on a list for the atf
Givemedumbname@reddit
I'm pretty sure that's only the border states in the southwest. California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas.
Icy-Medicine-495@reddit
I ordered 65k rounds of ammo 1 day (not 22lr) and not a word from the ATF.
f30tr0ll@reddit
Thanks for the clarification. Would have hated for us to think you spent under $5K.
Beebjank@reddit
Damn… $20 well spent
DigitalLorenz@reddit
It is multiple handguns in a short amount of time that increases the chances of a visit. Especially if you buy one from an FFL that is under suspicion of allowing straw purchases.
generic93@reddit
Unless of course the government tells them to sell no matter how sketchy or illegal it might seem or lose your license anyway
Fresh-Wealth-8397@reddit
Don't act like one of those guys didn't call the ATF after he sold one lady like 400 AR-15s and 400 glocks in a single year lol
J_Rod802@reddit
My buddy bought two matching handguns at once (his and hers) and the ATF visited him. Seems like they pick who and when they feel like visiting relatively randomly.
ChampagnePlumper@reddit
Iv bought 5 at once and didnt get one
Libido_Max@reddit
If they ever visit what will they ask?
Av8tr1@reddit
I got 4 in one day, same FFL. Two rifles and two handguns. One was a PS90, the other was a AR-15 and two glocks. This was just out side of Seattle before they went full (word I can't use on Reddit because its run by a bunch of pussies who tremble in fear of words). Belview Gun Club. Never heard a peep. But its been a few years.
Clarkearthur601@reddit
I think with the amount of firearms legislation that is going through some of the states you will get a lot of panic buyers thinking this will be the last time they will ever be able to buy things before they are grandfathered in. That’s what happened to me. Bought 6 handguns 1 weekend. Then next weekend bought 12 lowers. Then bought a shit ton of mags and parts kits. Now I don’t know what to do with all that shit and have to sell it all at a loss. I bet the ATF sees this pretty often and doesn’t care because they know their just panic buyers.
Av8tr1@reddit
Gotta get into 3D printing. I can print a couple of lowers in a weekend.
Clarkearthur601@reddit
Are 3D lowers even reliable? Last I heard they break easy. For now, I will stick with Aero lowers. Good quality at a good price.
Av8tr1@reddit
I haven't had any issues so far with 1000s of rounds.
Holden_Cullen@reddit
Unless you paid crazy pandemic prices you should be able to break even. Also assuming you didn’t pay $75 per Anderson lower normally $35.
Think of it as you have 12 lowers to build into something.
Clarkearthur601@reddit
Yeah but now I got to buy 12 uppers, 12 optics, 12 suppressors, and the ammo. I can barely afford 1 right now.
Edrobbins155@reddit
I bought 4 at a time. All the same pistol. I never got a visit.
mylifeisfubar@reddit
I've purchased 10 stripped ar lowers twice (about 2 years apart) and haven't received a visit.
malitove@reddit
I've bought more than a dozen guns in a month from multiple stores and never got a call.
benmarvin@reddit
More than two in five days requires an ATF form to be filed by the FFL. Certain firearms in Southern border states as well. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/reporting-multiple-firearms-sales-or-other-dispositions
Not necessarily a visit, but it will at least get you on a list.
TheRumrunner55@reddit
Ask Bryan Malinowski
SchuLace13@reddit
I have gotten 5 in one day from 3 different FFLs. No issues