Whats the difference between 1850 vs 21700 battery cells?
Posted by Jellybellybruh@reddit | ebikes | View on Reddit | 14 comments
I see some batteries for e-bikes offering to use 21700 and was wondering what are you getting more over the 18650. Do you get more range or is it just a better quality cell, and if so in what way?
RoseCityRolling@reddit
21700 are slightly bigger diameter, but because the batteries are rolled spiral-like from the inside out, bigger diameters have a disproportionately large effect on capacity. Large capacity 18650 cells tend to be around 3.5AH, and large capacity 21700 cells tend to be around 5Ah.
What does that mean in real life? Let's build a hypothetical battery.
These batteries all have the same voltage curve, so in both cases we'll put 12 in series for \~44v nominal. voltage. (\~ 50V fully charged, 36V discharged if you're nice to it)
18650 : We'll use, say, Samsung 35E batteries. If you're making it the simplest shape, you have 12 batteries one way, and let's say 7 in parallel the other way.
21700 : Samsung 50E, again 12 in series, but we'll put 6 in parallel to make the battery about the same width as the other one.
So the battery made with 18650s is 84 cells, 216mm x 126mm with cell weight of about 4.2 kilograms. Total capacity of 24.5Ah.
The battery made with 21700s is 72 cells, 252mm x 126mm with a cell weight of 5 kilograms. Total capacity 30Ah.
So not so much difference as you'd notice. HOWEVER, bigger cells are cheaper for a given capacity. At current small-wholesale rates that 21700 battery with the higher capacity it almost fifty dollars cheaper to buy the cells for than the smaller capacity one made of 18650s. It's also cheaper to assemble, because there are fewer parts, and fewer spot welds. There are also a lot fewer crappy generic 21700s on the market than crappy generic 18650s, so your odds of getting good cells are probably better. Since individual cells' capacity diverging over time is the ultimate cause of most batteries deaths, fewer cells in a battery is, on balance, a good thing from the longevity perspective.
So in an ebike application the 21700 pack may well come cheaper, is somewhat likely to be made of better cells, and may well last longer. But none of those a LOT, so I wouldn't let it determine your buying decision.
DjayZa@reddit
Thank you, I'm making a raspberry pi UPS and it uses 21700 it got me confused with 18650.
JOHiDeath@reddit
Brother or sister, great response! Dig the thoroughness, thank you so much for making this a lot easier!
d3myz@reddit
I came here to learn about flashlight batteries and got way more than I bargained for. Thanks for the Masterful breakdown.
JeffThrowSmash@reddit
That's what I'm here for, too. This is a pretty solid answer, huh?
Agitated-Mulberry-92@reddit
Look at us just a learnin'
That_Touch5280@reddit
Everyday is a school day!
Awkward-Schedule-187@reddit
21700 cells are better suited for high draw/discharge applications and they are also more energy dense. 18650 cells work just fine though for an ebike. They typical draw from an ebike isn’t necessarily that massive that you need cells better equipped for that scenario.
GloomyHyena4047@reddit
MASSIVE? you know what is THAT MASSIVE? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW TAPER FADE
LexLex07@reddit
Considering building a big ebike pack - it's cheaper AND better to pick 21700 over 18650.
Better lifespan
More charge\discharge cycles
Good perfomance
Less e-waste in a future (you could rebuild pack in you have Smart Bluetooth BMS)
Your_Free_Choice@reddit
Better than those little cells, use Redflow batteries www.redflow.com
Talie5in@reddit
Lol, they went into administration and no buyer, they don't exist (since October 2024)
Navaros313@reddit
It's so funny that was only 6 months ago they posted. Even funnier you replied a mere 2 months later.. bahaha that sucks but hey they're probably one of those early adopters and now what they own is rare (just in availability, not value lol)
Talie5in@reddit
I mean they posted post the company already going under!