Alternative prep ideas vs whole home generator cost.
Posted by don51181@reddit | preppers | View on Reddit | 136 comments
I live in middle Tennessee and we are getting a lot more bad storms each season. We got a quote for a a Generac 22k for $21000. While it is possible for us to buy it I wonder if it is the best use of that money. It would be a big commitment for us financially. We have a single level 1650sf home.
Should I focus on some other things instead? We have not lost power in the last 5 years for more than 30 minutes. There have been areas in our county that have lost power for hours with storms.
Maybe a Jackery power station to run a fridge and freezer? My main concern is sometimes we have a bad winter storms with ice. Our power company says it struggles to keep up with demand.
Overall I just look at the up front cost and long term cost. Then I wondering if that money could be put toward other prep supplies. Thanks
genesurf@reddit
xaidin@reddit
Goodness that's a $6500 generator. I installed most of mine myself, and had an electrician fix up the box itself. Was about $1200.
Maybe shop around, $22K is crazy talk.
don51181@reddit (OP)
Good point. I think because they are a popular company they want to charge more. Ill shop around.
wanderingpeddlar@reddit
I would suggest getting a used military generator. If you can put in the cement pad for it. If your electrician friend can help you it is possible to get it done for 4k or less.
I would however recommend getting one that can run off propane or natural gas.
The advantage is you don't have to store fuel that will go bad.
Say $500 for the generator
$600 for the pad.
Find out how much for a manual transfer switch from your friend.
And price installing the lot.
don51181@reddit (OP)
Never thought about that. Thanks.
Far_Falcon_6158@reddit
Look up generlink, buy the one for 800-900$ buy a big genny for like 1k run your whole house
don51181@reddit (OP)
Thanks
sttmvp@reddit
Portable generator with a manual transfer switch.. I wouldn't spend the money on a whole house generator
xashen@reddit
This is the answer. I have a portable generator and installed a Generlink transfer switch on my meter, didn't need to touch anything in the panel. I can pick and choose what circuits to run, but only one major appliance at a time (water heater, A/C, oven). I've got an Ecoflow battery to keep a few things going for short outages, then pull out the generator if it's going to last awhile.
Far_Falcon_6158@reddit
I just posted this also. I love mine
don51181@reddit (OP)
That is what I am kind of thinking. How much does wiring for something like that cost? What size portable one would you recommend?
I know a good electrician I might ask as well. Thanks.
JanetCarol@reddit
VA - I got a giant Anker battery and to have it wired to my breaker box (it won't run everything but I can pick and choose which to turn on) was $1600. The main cost was the 50amp wiring through the house to the garage where I keep the battery.
It only ran a super small heater for 3 days. Normally I wouldn't have run one at all but we had little chicks we had to keep warm during that storm.
I did use it to turn the fridge on for a bit to keep it in safe temp range and some.lights here and there and the internet (we are rural and cell signal is iffy at best)
don51181@reddit (OP)
That is a good idea as well. What size battery did you get? Did they say how long the batteries last before they have to be replaced. Thanks.
JanetCarol@reddit
Essentially I have this. It's $$$ and I'm not entirely sure how worth it it is vs having a non-electric heat source and a smaller battery for charging things. But I have livestock and I need to be able to run my well pump for water and I don't have back-up heat at this time unfortunately.
We are good at making do when we need to (humans) as previous avid campers, we have skills and equipment. But I needed something easy to work to keep lives that depend on me alive. So this is where we settled.
Anker is generally a brand I trust from previous smaller purchases and when buying a massive battery, I wanted to go with a company I knew. I'm sure you might be able to do something similar for less- but this 100% gives me.peace of mind for keeping things alive in the short term
Future plans include a secondary heat source for humans and a manual well pump but everything bleeds money and I gotta move in stages. Good luck.
Scuba-Steve_636@reddit
Look at recharge cycle count. I have an EcoFlow delay pro 3.6kWh unit. Says it can go 6500 discharge and recharge cycles before the battery will be at 50% original capacity.
BlueSwordM@reddit
*80% capacity, not 50%.
Almost all cycle life ratings are done at 80% SOH (State of Health), not 50%.
Scuba-Steve_636@reddit
I thought I remembered ~3000 cycles till 80% when I bought it so went to their website to verify and this is what it reads:
“DELTA Pro sports a brand-new LFP battery with 6500 cycles, which means you can use DELTA Pro for years and years before your unit reaches 50% of the original capacity.”
Unless I’m missing something there.
BlueSwordM@reddit
Yes, we, not you, have been mislead.
Their marketing is complete ass and seems to be written in a way to mislead people.
In the industry, nobody ever rates their cells down to 50%, since below 70% most of the time, other cell properties start to drift considerably more.
6,500 cycles to 50% capacity, 3,500 cycles to 80% capacityflortny@reddit
I just got a delta 2, the manual and all information in packages says 80%. What's weird is their long term storage instructions. Some say completely drain it, which is terrible for LI, the others say drain to 60%. I'm sticking with 60% because LI cycles are ruled by complete discharges.
Scuba-Steve_636@reddit
Appreciate the additional info
RhodesianOG@reddit
(Texas) I paid $350 for an electrician to wire in a 50 amp plug to my breaker box, including main power switch safety device to prevent back feeding power lines. Price doesn’t include parts.
I paid an additional $300 for a 75’ 50 amp cable and then the Westinghouse 11500 (9500w running) dual fuel genny. So less than $2000 for whole house power. During Beryl, I kept the entire house energized for the 4 days w/o power. I had 6 Jerry cans and to conserve fuel, would keep power on 3 hours, off 3 hours.
bareback_cowboy@reddit
Cost, i don't know (where are you, whats the market, what exactly do you want), but I'd say it's relatively inexpensive. I've got an electrical engineer and an electrical contractor in the family, so they just put them in when we're redoing wiring at parents/siblings houses.
What I would highly recommend is that you get one that can maintain stable and clean power. Last summer, my parents lost power and used the old generator that's been around for nearly 30 years. It works fine except that as the load increases, the engine can struggle to keep up and the voltage drops. Now 30 years ago, no big deal, but now? Now it matters. They fried the circuits in their new dishwasher, part of their range, a countertop ice maker, and a handful of the new "smart" light switches. They cannot handle dirty power - it has got to be a constant voltage within their range and any deviation can be costly.
The other thing you want to be aware of is load balancing. (IDK what you know about electricity so if you know it, ignore me.) You have two hot lines coming into the house with 120 volts each. You have two bus bars that the breakers attach to those lines. When you're using a generator, it's going to be sending power into your home, but if you're running every breaker on Bus A and nothing on Bus B, you're going to overheat, you're going to trip breakers, and you're not getting the optimum power usage. ASSUMING your house was wired well, it shouldn't be a huge issue, but if you want to only power a subset of items in your house with the generator and they're all on one bus, keep that in mind. It would be prudent to discuss that with your electrician that installs it for you.
MrBrawn@reddit
Yep, 1300 bucks gets me 13000 watts. More than enough to run everything i need including charging my house battery and running ac. Please note, if you want to run sensitive electronics. Put a sinewave inverter between them and the generator. It can be rough on thrm.
Lost_Document_1801@reddit
Genuine question. Why gas? Natural or otherwise? Why not solar. What if fuel runs out? I'm just starting my generator consideration journey and I keep running into folks having gas. I'm so curious.
CCWaterBug@reddit
Solar Includes massive setup costs.
Dual fuel tanks are a fraction of the cost.
OutlyingPlasma@reddit
Solar is great for long term generation, over a year it will produce a phenomenal amount of free power. The downside is it's not good for powering things now. It takes a roof full of solar to run a fridge, and that's only if the sun is out.
This means you need energy storage, aka batteries. This is expensive to buy and expensive to replace, and limited in capacity. You can run a gas/petrol generator for days, even weeks. Not so for a battery bank.
Also, everything just got 34% more expensive today thanks to the tax increase, so... might want to buy yesterday if you can.
Lost_Document_1801@reddit
Yeah. And I'm Extremely rural. 2+ hrs from the nearest town. It was already dumb expensive. yay... Thanks for all the info folks. It's genuinely helped.
MrBrawn@reddit
I have both. Solar is less reliable and when you start adding batteries, it gets very expensive. The little Solar generators are good in a pinch but if you are going to be down for a while or the weather doesn't cooperate, go gas.
Lost_Document_1801@reddit
Ok. Thanks. I just don't have space to stockpile tanks. Maybe a dual set-up is something i need to consider. Fuel for regular consumption and solar as a back up.
MrBrawn@reddit
Remember, your vehicle tank can be siphoned in an emergency. You don't really need that many, I just like that many so I don't have to run to the station every day.
father-figure1@reddit
True, I got my whole setup put in for $1400 including install, generator, multiple tanks
MountainGal72@reddit
This was route we chose, as well.
Fantastic compromise for our needs and FAR more affordable.
MegWhitCDN@reddit
We did this too. in Canada it’s called a generator link and goes on your power meter base. You then plug in your generator and can choose what things on your main panel you want to use based on what your generator can power. I think the one we chose was around 3000.00 CAD and we bought a 1000.00 generator. We can run fridges and freezers as well as a well pump, heat pump or the hot water tank.
MountainGal72@reddit
Yes! Being able to power our well pump is the most satisfying thing to me. Such increased confidence in our level of preparedness!
mybluerat@reddit
Any specific recommendations?
sttmvp@reddit
1.Honda.. if you got the money. Quite and extremely dependable
OutlyingPlasma@reddit
The problem with champion is the after sales support. Honda will have parts available for decades, Champion can't even settle on a single engine supplier for longer than a week.
MrBrawn@reddit
I love my duromax.
TransportationNo5560@reddit
Any brands that you could recommend?
sttmvp@reddit
Honda or Champion..
TransportationNo5560@reddit
Thank you! We're looking at a Honda
sttmvp@reddit
They’re pricey but extremely quiet and reliable, champion is a close second
TransportationNo5560@reddit
I think we'll take a look at both, but noise is definitely a consideration.
partyinplatypus@reddit
Whole home isn't worth unless you're in hurricane country or pretty much homesteading.
616c@reddit
Single-person liftable? Or two-person?
2kVA (1800 W) can fit in the trunk of a small car. 9000W is a different beast.
sttmvp@reddit
I can lift my 3000w by myself it’s 140lbs, the bigger 12000 watt has wheels and it rolls lifting it is a 2 person job
sttmvp@reddit
Also get a dual or tei fuel unit
Plane_Geologist8073@reddit
I’m an electrician and this is what I have at my house. A 15kw generac and a 200amp manual transfer switch between the meter and the main panel. The only downside is if I’m not home, I obviously can’t start the generator and switch over, which might make a mess of the fridge and freezer if I can’t get back or get someone to switch me over for more than a couple days or so.
davidm2232@reddit
If you want to go with a true generator, get a used ATS off FB marketplace. They are in the $400-600 range. Grab a military surplus generator like an MEP-803a, I got my 802a for $1200 but they are closer to $5k now.
Many-Health-1673@reddit
You can buy a 22k Generac with auto transfer for $6,200. The price they quoted if they are just setting the unit and plumbing into existing natural gas lines is highway robbery.
xaidin@reddit
This, you can buy the whole kit on Amazon for goodness sakes.
delatour56@reddit
You can get a portable generator and install an inverter system on the house as well. it will cost you less than the 21k
mydarkerside@reddit
I think you can do a lot with just $2-4k.
Predator 5000 watt duel fuel generator - $1100
Anker Solix F2000 2400watt power station - $1300
Solar panels - $400+
A couple of smaller power stations - $200+
Power inverter to connect to car battery - $200+
If you have a bunch of power tool batteries (Dewalt, Ryobi, etc), you can get inverter adapters for them
MrHmuriy@reddit
It might be worth getting a calculator and calculate how many days a year you can be without power, how much gasoline or diesel it will take, whether it would be cheaper to buy a $21,000 Generac or not
don51181@reddit (OP)
Most likely a gas generator would be cheaper. I rarely lose power. Maybe an hour or less a year. Often it might just flicker.
Maybe we might have a rare winter storm so I am planning in case we are without it for hours then
MrHmuriy@reddit
It seems to me that for a house that rarely loses power, $21000 for a generator is quite a lot. I live in Ukraine, and until the war is over there are frequent power outages here, but a 2500$ diesel generator is quite enough for me.
SunLillyFairy@reddit
Think about what you really need/want power for and what it would take. For around $1,000 we got a transfer switch installed so we could turn off power coming in from the grid and plug our generator into the house electrical. We had a pro do it so it's safe and legal. We can't run our AC or electric stove or dryer with our generators (one solar, one gas), ... but we can run our gas furnace, (needs electric just to start), some emergency lights, fridge and freezer, laptops and home security system/wifi. Honestly, I'd rather have a whole house generator... but what we have cost us less than $5k and we purchased it over years so it wasn't a big $ hit. It's what we could do.
'City Prepping' on YouTube has a lot of videos on setting up DIY solar for limited house use.
don51181@reddit (OP)
Thanks for the idea. I'll look into getting the transfer switch. Especially to run my gas furnace during winter.
sfbiker999@reddit
I lose power more than you and just keep a $1000 portable generator around. I have a generator inlet for the furnace for winter power outages and a window-unit air conditioner can can keep one room cool in the summer. I do have a power station to use for lights, refrigerator, cell phone charging, so I have power without running the generator all the time.
Rarcar1@reddit
How big of a generator do you have and what brand do you recommend?
sfbiker999@reddit
I've got this one:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Champion-Power-Equipment-5500-4000-Watt-Electric-Start-Gasoline-and-Propane-Powered-Dual-Fuel-Inverter-Generator-W-CO-Shield-and-Quiet-Technology-201469/333422283
(or one very similar to it).
I have no complaints with it, I've got about 200 hours on it so far (I use it for the RV too, not just home power backup). It'll run for around 18-20 hours at low load on a 20 lb propane tank (specs say 21 hours at 1/4 load)
Rarcar1@reddit
Thank you!
don51181@reddit (OP)
What size propane tanks do you have? We have a natural gas hookup outside. Do they have portable generators I could up to them when I need to?
TacTurtle@reddit
Rule of thumb for propane vs gasoline : by gallon, you will burn about 20-30% more propane than gasoline, so a 20lb propane tank will last about the same time as 3.5 gal of gas.
oros3030@reddit
Those 20lb tanks can freeze on the outside in cold temperatures and you can lose even more as well. I had one freeze on my and there was still quite a bit of propane inside even though the generator wasn't getting fuel.
sfbiker999@reddit
The size that I said in my post - I just use a regular 20 lb BBQ propane tank - I have a BBQ grill and a couple patio heaters, so I keep around 5 spare tanks, so have plenty of gas for the BBQ and generator if the power goes down.
For natural gas, just look for a tri-fuel generator, they will run from Gasoline, Propane, or Natural Gas.
uhyeahsouh@reddit
I personally have been looking at replacing my ceiling lights with 12v lighting, and buying a lifepo4 battery, and a solar charging setup. Honestly, we lost power for a few hours at a time monthly, and lighting is the biggest inconvenience.
2x 100ah lifepo4 batteries 2-4x 100w panels I think we have 24 recessed puck lights.
It’s not overly expensive, and would be usable all the time. Plus, from the right charge controller, you can keep other things charged up.
newagedefiance@reddit
I'm a Journeyman Electrician and Renewable Energy Technician.
Best bet is to dave yourself thousands of dollars and get a generator and transfer switch. This setup is around $2000 depending on the size of generator and transfer switch.
With a transfer switch you can choose which breakers to keep on during a SHTF scenario. My suggestion would be refrigerator, deep freeze (these both only need a hour or so a day to keep your food cold as long as you don't keep openong them. I would also have the breakers for your well (if you have one), sump pump and furnace on. Also a certain or 2 for some lights and power outlets. You can charge your devices and listen to the TV or radio for news.
I wouldn't run your generator at night as it will keep the neighborhood up and make you a target for looters.
If you have the funds invest in a dual ot tri fuel generator. This allows you to use natural gas and propane to run the generator. NOTE! Propane and natural gas do not allow the generator to produce as much power as gasoline. But should be more than enough to run the basics for a while since you shouldn't be running it constantly. Also you can use BBQ propane tanks while gives you another commonly found fuel source.
obsequious_fink@reddit
I run a 6500W generac portable generator on a manual transfer switch. The transfer switch cost about $900 installed, generator was around the same.
I power my oil furnace, my water pump (I am on well water), my fridge, and then the lights/outlets on the main floor of my house. Keeps my food from spoiling, gives me heat and hot water, and a decent level of comfort. For cooking I have a toaster oven I can use inside (one of the combo things that can bake, air fry, etc), or I can plug my pellet grill into one of the 120v outlets on the generator. Runs for about 11 hours on 5 gallons of gas. Bought a little generator tent for it that keeps rain/snow off of for safer operation on bad weather.
JAFO-@reddit
We used to have a week almost every winter with no power. I have a champion 4000. It would run around 40 minutes every 4 hours to keep the fridge and our freezer good along with filling our water tank.
I have a solar array with batteries that run lights in the kitchen and run the Internet. Not that hard to make do with it.
Now the power hardly goes out for more than a day.
Inexpensive and keeps the essential stuff food and water going
LowBarometer@reddit
For $21k you could do a DIY solar system that would pay for itself over time. Check out Will Prowse on YouTube.
Sisyphus-Smashed@reddit
Commenting to check back later. Thanks
don51181@reddit (OP)
Thanks for the tip
TheSensiblePrepper@reddit
Ok, so here's the thing.
First, more people are installing those "whole home Generators". That's more people tapping into the Natural Gas Network that was never designed to handle that kind of demand.
A fun fact is that the Natural Gas Network runs off of a system of valves/pump stations that regulate the flow. Those stations run off of the electric grid and when that is down, Diesel Fuel Generators. If the Electric Grid is down for longer than a week, those generators need to be refilled. They are priority but residential areas are considered "non-essential" and are the first to get cut for demand.
So relying on another "grid" when the first one has failed is not the best way of going about this.
Second, you need to prioritize what you're running and cut the stuff that isn't "critical". Some examples would be that you don't need every light in the house to be able to come on. Flashlights and LED lanterns for people to use are just fine. Keeping the refrigerator and chest freezers going with dedicated Solar Generators are the bare essentials you need to worry about. If you have a Sump Pump, having a backup and a backup to the backup isn't a bad idea at all.
I would recommend you check my post about preparing for a Power Outage. It will give you a lot of tips for getting started.
Bearikade-@reddit
I have total power failure very rarely, so I decided to go the portable generator route. You can get a cheap interlock kit that forces you to turn off main power before turning on the 50amp breaker that goes to the 50amp external plug to the generator. That will keep you from energizing the power lines and creating a danger to linemen.
The above mentioned is all stuff you can do yourself for dirt cheap if you’re handy (and local laws allow). Or not super expensive to have an electrician do for you. All cheap common parts. You don’t need an expensive transfer switch.
Then you can get a portable generator for $1-1.2k. Turn off your 30-50amp breakers (stuff like water heater, range, ac, heat) so you don’t overload it. Keep fresh gas for your generator and hook that puppy up.
Total project was less than $1500 for me. I don’t have to deal with extension cables strewn across the house anymore (all wall outlets and lights energized), and I can keep my fridge, freezer, tv, microwave, and a portable ac or heater running no problem. This is too small to run your central ac, heat, or water heater, but it also didn’t cost $22k. Power outages happen seldom enough that I can deal with cold water and most of the house (except bedroom) not being climate controlled.
SeriousGoofball@reddit
Generator with manual transfer switch or breaker interlock. I went with the transfer switch. I power the kitchen outlets, master bedroom and bath, fridge, and a few other things.
I have a couple of gas generators, but if I had to do it again, I'd get dual fuel because propane is easier to store than gasoline.
Be realistic on your generator size. Mine are 3500 and 5500 running watts. I have electric hot water which takes 4500 watts.
In a power down situation, I can run the fridge, lights, and a portable AC unit in the master bedroom. When we want a shower, I can switch over to the larger generator and make a tank of hot water, then switch back to the smaller one for better fuel economy.
Remember, the bigger the generator, the more fuel you use.
I also have an Ecoflow battery system with 8000 watt hours of power. It can run up to 4000 watts at a time, can "boost" to 6000 watts if needed, and can do 240v or 120v.
The Ecoflow can run everything I need overnight so I don't have to keep a generator running while I sleep. I can fire up the small generator, run everything, and recharge the Ecoflow at the same time. In a few hours, turn off the generator and switch back to the Ecoflow.
A whole home generator might run your central heat and air, but I don't need all that. And if it breaks, you have no good backup. I can plug any portable generator into my transfer switch.
I'm happy to answer questions. I'm not an expert. This is just what I've worked out for me.
OutdoorsNSmores@reddit
I went with an EG4 12kpv and one battery. Second battery is on the way. 7k of solar should be up on a ground mount in a month or two. I have a propane generator to charge the batteries when the solar won't do.
All of that is less (not much less) than the price you are taking about (I am 100% of the labor, so that helps).
During good months, solar will do it all. During the worst days of winter, it won't do anything.
Everyone in this area said not to worry about outages, they are all short... Until it was 3 days. Could freezers, hot running water, what else do I need? Not having the well pumpkin l pump was rough.
geetarman84@reddit
Look at a GenerLink. Only problem would be your power supplier. I have one at my house in the city and they were great. Had never heard of it before and sent an employee out and installed it for free. Said if I ever moved to call them and they’d come take it off for free. Wanted one at my lake house and the po-dunk co-op were complete douchebags and wouldn’t even consider it. I told them I’d even pay for one of their guys to come out and install it and still wouldn’t give me the time of day.
Unusual_Dealer9388@reddit
You've lived there for 5 years how often have you lost power for those 30 mins? 21,000 dollars is a lot of money. Even if your power went out every week for 30 minutes in the last 5 years that would be 250 events. That's 84 dollars for 30 minutes of power it doesn't make sense.
Now, if you see a regular increase in the number of events, or if you have a loved one on dialysis or something, then it makes sense.
But likely a far more impactful and useful prep would be to buy a small reasonable generator for a couple grand and then put 15,000 on your mortgage and use the extra money each month from the saved interest in buying better gear slowly over time.
MadRhetorik@reddit
I would just get a portable generator and use your money some place else like new gutters, energy efficient windows or something else. That’s a large chunk of money into one thing.
EnergyLantern@reddit
I'll try to summarize the reasons you need to have some backup power.
Wood on telephone poles rot out and come down. and their conditions are aggravated by storm systems.
People have medical emergencies and hit telephone poles with their cars.
Ice storms, strong winds and ice can bring down trees and wires by adding weight to telephone poles. When power goes down, it can destroy the transformers up on the telephone poles and workers have to follow a circuit and drive around looking at the telephone poles to see where they went down. If the workers haven't caught anything and put the power back on too soon without the circuit being fixed, more transformers can go down and cities usually don't have that many transformers sitting around and instead have to have transformers trucked in from somewhere.
I've even seen tractor trailers in residential areas take down electrical wires because tractor trailers can actually be 13.5 feet or 13.6 feel tall and people's electric wires can sag.
In hurricanes, power can be knocked out and you won't have power to run a sump pump.
How would you charge your power banks in an outage? Take your power banks to work? Charge your flashlights or power banks with your car? How many hours would charging take? Would a 15-watt solar panel be enough and would it charge more than two devices in a day's worth of sunlight?
One of my solutions is to have more solar lights in the yard so if power goes out, I can bring them inside.
I'm thinking about getting a 100 watt solar panel or more than one and I don't believe that is enough power to run large devices in a house.
Adorable_Dust3799@reddit
My brother had an electrician friend put his heat pump and well on a separate panel and that has a generator hooked up to it. His outages are all storm related, and the backup fridge and freezer are in an unheated garage, so he doesn't worry about those. He figured heat and water are the life important items.
don51181@reddit (OP)
Good idea. I know a good honest electrician I will talk to about that. Especially the heat for the winter. Thanks.
Revolutionary-Half-3@reddit
The biggest advantage of a whole house generator is that you don't need to think much.
Power goes out, generator fires up, and you don't need to stop using AC or anything else. Electric tankless water heaters might be a bit much.
Battery or smaller generators feeding a sub-panel can power critical loads, like refrigerator, furnace, and a few lighting and convenience outlets.
If you have a well pump or sump pump you may need a bigger generator.
don51181@reddit (OP)
It's still a small option but trying to consider all my options. $20k for something I use about 30 minutes a year is a tough pill to swallow.
As you said a battery might be an option. Then put the money I save into other things to spread out my prep supplies.
five_bulb_lamp@reddit
If you are going to plug anything with a green board in it get an inverter generator. My neighbor fried his brand new refrigerator when he put it on a regular.
I got https://www.harborfreight.com/8750-watt-open-frame-inverter-generator-with-co-secure-technology-epa-71340.html
Inverter keeps tv safe
30amps
240 volt so you can run a well
don51181@reddit (OP)
Good idea. Thanks.
Adorable_Dust3799@reddit
Some of our neighbors were spending 30+ a day on gas for a whole house generator. 15 days of outages this jan. I got a small one for just the fridge and it uses 1.5-2 gallons a day. I have a jackery 300 for led light strips and little things. the 100 w panel takes a few hours to charge. While a fridge only uses about 400 w while running it uses more like 1000-1500 to run the compressor periodically, and you'll need something that provides that much power to keep it cold. I will get a 2nd small generator to run a portable a/c for outages in high summer, and i have an indoor rated propane heater for cold weather outages. My stove and water heater are propane. Figure running costs in for your prep.
Humanandnotalien@reddit
That is really high priced. A generac 22kW at an NC Lowes is 6700. Installation maybe 5000, although I always thought that was also high
wpbth@reddit
21k is a crazy price. I’ll guess it’s from a big box store? My next door neighbor paid $5k for 14k. Find a dealer.
TacTurtle@reddit
About right for a standby gen with autostart and automatic transfer switch.
don51181@reddit (OP)
That's for the generator and installation. From an HVAC company.
wpbth@reddit
Yeah find a generator dealer.
whatiftheyrewrong@reddit
Ours was $10k installed. Can you look around more?
whatiftheyrewrong@reddit
Agree. We don’t have a tiny home and it was $10k.
AdditionalAd9794@reddit
21 might include installation
TacTurtle@reddit
For whole-house power, a double throw 100-200A 120/240v double throw switch allowing the house to manual toggle over to gen power should run $600-1000, a generator inlet box another $100-150. Misc wire and conduit another $200.
Labor to wire them up should be under $1000.
Call it $2400 total to wire the house for generator power.
A Harbor Freight Predator 13,000W Tri-Fuel (gasoline, propane, natural gas) generator would run ~$1200-1400.
ExtraplanetJanet@reddit
My house is a similar size to yours and we also got a really wild quote for a General, which also included a fuel tank that would have to be installed in our front yard. I decided to go with the Jackery 5000 instead, partly because it was also eligible for the solar tax credit. I went with one extra battery pack and two 400w solar panels. Without a solar charge, I should get about 25 hours of use for my well pump, fridges and freezers, and CPAP outlets. I like not needing to worry about fuel and noise from a generator, and the way it flips quickly and automatically back and forth when the power goes off and on. It’s nice to still have power even during short outages when it wouldn’t be worth it to mess with a big generator. The one problem, one I haven’t solved yet, is that on three occasions the Jackery smart transfer switch has shut down its five circuits for no apparent reason when there’s no grid trouble. Flipping its main breaker brings everything back online, but obviously having an inexplicable failure point in my most important electrical circuits is not ideal I’m working with Jackery to figure out what’s going on.
SheistyPenguin@reddit
The less power you need in a crisis, the less time and money you need to spend on a solution. So figuring that out first helps.
The biggest power hogs in a home, are usually:
Propane is a great backup energy source. The fuel keeps almost indefinitely, and you can use it for cooking and heating.
What we have for our household, is:
If you really want low-fuss, get a portable propane generator... then you don't need to rotate the fuel.
HappyCamperDancer@reddit
Regarding a fridge/freezer: we saw new freezer for like $300. We thought about loading our old freezer up with jugs of water/ice, so when the power goes off we can place blocks of ice in the fridge and food freezer (as we remove food to eat) to keep them in the safe temperature zone longer.
Then the jackery could work at other things like keeping our pellet stove running (it does't take much power, its just running the fan and pellet feeder/auger), a couple of LED lights and a few electronics.
We have lots of camping equipment for cooking food and we store plenty of water.
nickMakesDIY@reddit
I was in the same boat. I opted in for a dual fuel 11k portable generator that I can plug into the house and run it as needed. Note that you may need to set up some additional wiring
I have enough gas and propane to run it for a few days and have had to use it a few times, but not more than a few days.
don51181@reddit (OP)
Thanks. What size propane tanks do you use for it?
nickMakesDIY@reddit
Just regular grill tanks
PrisonerV@reddit
I bought a 4400-watt dual-fuel generator ($400) and just run a ($100) power cord into the house. I then branch off of that to run 1 fridge, 1 mini-fridge, a freezer, tv, internet, etc. I only use propane in the generator so I never have to worry about bad gas or a crusty carburetor. Propane keeps forever and I have 6 20lb tanks.
Yeah, it's more of a hassle than a transfer switch but if you only do it once or twice a year, no biggie. If I lived somewhere like Florida, I'm sure I'd get a bigger generator and install the switch.
But also it only cost me a few hundred.
For cooking, I got a dual-fuel camp stove (propane).
For coffee, I got a french press.
For lighting, I have a bunch of harbor freight lanterns and head lamps.
For AC, I got a window unit that only uses 380 watts power (working on making it 100% solar powered).
For heat, I have a 20k BTU vent-free natural gas heater in the basement that takes no electricity to operate. And I have definitely tested it out. Worth the $200 I paid for it.
Speck72@reddit
After we took an energy audit of our place we determined we could keep every critical item powered off a 2kw genset. We used a Kill A Watt meter and measured everything in the house and logged it.
Highly Suggest you watch Homestead Engineering's power backup series:
Your energy needs will be determined by... well, your needs. Do you have an electric stove? Are you wanting to run an electric drier? AC? HVAC / Electric furnace? All of these are high draw items. We have an AC in our house but will simply not run it off our small generator. If we're in a prolonged power outage in the heat we'll switch to fans or a single room based AC. If we have a prolonged power outage during cold weather we have a propane fireplace that keeps the living room warm and instead of burning a ton of electricity trying to run space heaters we know exactly how little electricity out heating pads / heated blankets use which is a fraction of a space heater.
We use two small UPS systems to prolong the generator. We keep the fridge / stove (electric ignite, propane fueled) on one and the living room essentials (TV, phone, laptop, heated blanket) on the other.
We can plug a heated blanket in and throw a quilt over that and stay TOASTY warm while watching TV for hours off our small UPS. The Fridge will run about 36 hours off the ups as long as we don't open it. This setup allows us to easily go about our life in a short term or extended power outage and only have to run our generator 2-4 hrs a day to top off the batteries.
Sizing your generator will let you calculate your needs. We tested the genny and found the numbers in the manual to be dead on, 0.95 gal tank will last 3.2 hrs at full throttle and 8.1 at quarter load. We can top off our batteries and run a few extra things while the generator is on in about 2-4 hours of "fuel use" per power out day thus extending how long we can go without line power significantly opposed to running the generator 12+ hrs a day. 5 gallons of gas will get us about 15 days of this cycle! Stocking a few cans of tru fuel and a 20lb propane tank (Genny has a dual fuel conversion) means I have no worries of having over a week of grid down time. Any time a storm is on the horizon we fill up the car and the 5 gal fuel tank meaning there's an additional 20ish gallons of gas if needed. Once the storm passes simply use the 5 gal in the car.
It's also nice to only have to run the generator in spurts. During our last week+ power outage I fired up the HAM and heard a guy two neighborhoods over bragging about running his 20k genset all day and night, doing laundry, not a care in the world. Man, I guarantee folks were licking their teeth looking at that guy and his family as a target. Something to be mindful of as preppers - discretion can mean laying low at home watching movies under a warm blanket while the storm passes opposed to being the ONLY house in the neighborhood with all your lights on and a loud, roaring generator signaling to the cold / hungry masses.
Sorry for the long ramble. Power management and preparedness is a fun topic.
Flaggstaff@reddit
I got a new Firman tri fuel 9.4kw generator on marketplace for $800. Bought a 10kw manual transfer switch for $100 on marketplace. Wired it myself (albeit I'm handy with electrical and know codes).
I leave the gen on a trickle charger and it powers my fridge, freezer, lights, furnace, tv, router, fireplace blower and well pump no problem.
Takes 3 minutes to restore power and cost meabout $1000 total.
Eventually I will have a plumber attach it to natural gas so I can withstand a long outage with no gas refills.
Bmat70@reddit
I am happy with my generac. The electric here goes out for a few minutes several times each year and for several days to a week about once a year. (All electric house). It is so convenient even if it is only for a few minutes -since I don’t know how long- to have the generator come on and not have to worry about dragging out the portable generator and having gas for it and for extended outages letting the portable cool down so more gas can be added. Plus starting up the portable generator periodically to keep it in good running condition. I can’t speak one way or the other for solar but between generac and portable generators.
HazMatsMan@reddit
Mine was half that... I think you need to get some more quotes.
don51181@reddit (OP)
I'll ask around. How long ago did you get yours? That price was with install as well. Thanks.
HazMatsMan@reddit
Probably 7 years ago or so. I realize prices have gone up, but mine required the addition of a 2 psi gas line because I didn't want it outside the master bedroom where the gas meter was. That required additional regulators for all of our appliances, auto-transfer, etc, etc, etc. That made it considerably more expensive than a "basic" install.
mjunkin68@reddit
I bought a 10000 watt dual fuel generator and put in a manual transfer switch.
DarkFriend1987@reddit
I’m an electrician. I have a 40amp portable generator. We lost power for a few days last winter. I had almost my whole house, and some of my elderly neighbors house running off of it, he had a oxygen machine that if I didn’t get him power he would have had to call and ambulance or drive through a blizzard to go stay at the hospital. If you have electric heat, a portable generator is not enough, but for our gas furnaces I could run the whole block. My kids were watching tv, we were taking hot showers and the fridge was running. The nice thing about a whole house generator is they are automatic. The if you loose power they come on, and turn off when power is restored. If you haven’t really lost power for 5 years a whole house generator would be pretty low on my list. I would always suggest a 240v generator so you can run larger loads. Mine can run on gasoline, propane, or natural gas.
AlphaDisconnect@reddit
Could get a few of those fancy new big ol portable power packs and store it somewhere safe from water. Just leave them plugged in (and find one that is safe for that). Not infinite power. Can't refuel, just recharge.
Martin_Z_Martian@reddit
That seems about 3X the price it should be.
22K is overkill for that size house. I was looking at a 22K to I think 26K (?) when I had a 6000 sq ft house with 2 200 amp panels and yes, prices were roughly $20-22K.
I have a Generac natural gas with an auto-transfer switch for the same size house as you. $5500 all in 5 years ago. I can't remember the size. I think it is 14K.
Get 3 more bids.
dalek_999@reddit
You need to get some more quotes - we installed a Generac 22k a few months ago for less than $12k.
TraditionalBasis4518@reddit
Generac sells the biggest gen they can because it maximizes profits. The advantage is that it’s a turnkey solution, requiring very little mechanical skill from the owner. The disadvantage is that the machine is not terribly well designed, and that most users don’t need to run every appliance in the house all day long in an emergency. My solution, in the absence of natural gas service, is a smaller dual fuel generator that will run the freezer and refrigeration intermittent, and run some fans and a portable ac as needed, with plans to replace the generator every five years or so, and retain the old generator for redundancy and sharing with neighbors.
IGetNakedAtParties@reddit
The Nokia 3310 can batton oak.
kl2342@reddit
Texas tips
matchstick64@reddit
We decided to plumb for a tri-fuel generator and use natural gas. All in, including the generator we might have $5k. My husband did the electrical and plumbing and poured a cement pad for is. I just couldn't spend $10k + for a whole home.
Significant_Bass7618@reddit
I went with a Bluetti 1800 watt unit, ran me about 800, runs freezer, fridge, and charges phone, or other items for 12 hours or more.
TheHorseLady2023@reddit
I’m in the whole home generator business and $21k for a 22KW seems high (I’m in Florida & don’t know the market in TN but still). 1. Does this include propane tanks/hookup or piping from natural gas?
Does this include the ATS and all wiring components (LSM’s , surge protectors)? Plus installation?
Is permitting included (the entire permit package including riser diagrams, load calculations, etc)?
Like I said, I’m not familiar with the TN market (or codes for that matter) but here in Fl it’d run around $14k.
If you’ve got your heart set on a particular brand (Generac, Briggs & Stratton) you can call and find a certified dealer & get a quote.
For what’s it’s worth, I don’t have nor would I want a whole home setup. The ongoing maintenance expenses can be pretty high, as are repairs.
don51181@reddit (OP)
That was the cost with everything you mentioned installed. Like you said I think companies are raising the prices. Plus long term maintenance and they mentioned that the motors last about 10 years.
So I probably will get a portable one and wiring installed.
Cute-Consequence-184@reddit
You can't go 30 minutes without electricity?
A properly packed freeze can go a day easily in the summer.
Central Kentucky has much the same weather. Never have needed a backup in 50+ years. In the winter, we switch out frozen water bottles. And like you, in summer we haven't had a 30+ minute power outage. Except for when the truck wreck we wiped out a pole. Then it was about 5 hours.
But once in 50+ years doesn't seem like it warrants that extreme of a cost.
So maybe a simple generator and a few extra gas cans? If you are on a farm, get a diesel one so it can utilize farm diesel.
I don't know anyone who has backup power for freezers or fridges.
ommnian@reddit
Idk how much sun/roof space you have, but at that price id think long and hard about going with solar. Get a couple of quotes at least.
AdditionalAd9794@reddit
Solar is kind of overrated. When we had wildfires smoke blocked out the sun, so they were only operating at 25-30% power generation, it was also November, so there was only 10hrs of daylight a day, which further reduced power generation.
Solar doesn't really work great in shtf, atleast not in the winter, not if there's weather or cloud coverage and not in wildfires if smoke blocks out the sun
ommnian@reddit
Oh there's definitely times it doesn't work. But, gas is a finite resource, and is only going to go up in price. Once solar is installed, it costs nothing to use.
Mynplus1throwaway@reddit
I have 1kw and it wasn't hard to do it myself. You can get inverters now that won't backfeed when power is on and you can hire someone to do a transfer switch.
PM-me-in-100-years@reddit
Solar with batteries is the most resilient option.
What are you using for home heating? How much space do you have? Middle TN is a good location for wood stoves and pellet stoves as primary and/or backup heat.
Investing in insulation pays off pretty quick too. For heating and cooling, and it can make emergency heating very easy. I have a super-insulated bedroom addition and a space heater on low (500w) will maintain the temp 40°F higher than outdoors indefinitely. If it came to it, I could heat up rocks in a fire outdoors, carry them inside, and be warm all night.
PVPicker@reddit
I'm getting a battery system to shave peak loads and work as battery backup. I could connect to solar for extended outages, but it's mostly going to shave time of use/demand electric loads and save me $50ish a month while offering me 6+ hours of power in an outage.
EG4 6000XP - $1300ish (now $1600ish due to tariffs).
20kwh of server rack batteries can be purchased for $3000ish.
Critical load panel + electrical work/etc: $800-1000ish.
Big benefit with the battery system is I can save substantial money every day by having it shave peak loads. I switched from a basic residential plan to a 'demand' based program and this will save me 50%+ on electric bills. I can also buy a "chargeverter" and connect a cheap smaller $600 generator for recharging during extended outages. Battery system is literally saving me money every day and will pay for itself, the system is virtually maintenance free and the batteries will last 11 years and still be 80% capacity. The generac will cost you money in maintaining, money when it's ran, money for required monthly testing.
615wonky@reddit
Fellow mid-TN'er. I couldn't rationalized a whole-house generator, so here's what I went with.
If you're going for a NORAD-level prep, you'd better have a NORAD-level budget.
For the stuff we see in mid-TN, I think those will suffice.
KlausVonMaunder@reddit
Insanely high, even for these insane times. I'd recommend a Honda EM6500S and a manual transfer switch, then keep the $17,000 in savings. I have multiple thousands of hours on similar sized unit w/ a 9hp Honda GX270, pull start. It's been flawless for over 15 years+
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit
I once lost power for 10 days in an ice storm. It happens.
On the other hand, I had a large home and I was able to run everything necessary with a 9000W gas/propane portable generator + transfer switch, which costs a lot less than a whole house model. It's also more fuss, but I thought the savings was worth it.
I was able to run the refrigerator, chest freezer, oil burner, well, sump pumps. computers and fans with it. The only thing it struggled with was the electric stovetop, and in blackouts I tended to cook with propane anyway.
If I'd planned on staying in that house indefinitely I might have considered a permanent installation for a lot more money... or not. The 10 day outage was a one time thing. Once I had the generator hooked up I never say an outage longer than a few hours. :)
jusumonkey@reddit
We bought batteries and an inverter as part of a Solar plan. We don't have the panels up yet but the batteries and inverter are installed and run the house during the day based on our local time of use program. Perhaps you can contact your power provider to see if they have a time of use plan?
The cost of buying inverters and batteries to meet your use during peak hours would vary from home to home and family to family.
I see 4 main improvements to inverters + batteries + generator over genny alone:
It's very convenient and could end up saving you some money up-front and in the long run.
Only-Location2379@reddit
The generac ain't worth it. I got one and solar panels professionally in but no battery so I am just the power companies bitch and the generator eats up way too much propane per day.
Honestly you'll want something like the harbor freight 11k predator for like 1200 bucks would probably cover your energy I imagine. It goes on sale a lot and it's a great generator.
You can look at solar panels and batteries but buy it and do it yourself because you're getting ripped off to have a company do it for you.
BeavisTheMeavis@reddit
If heating the whole home vis a vis electricity is not a concern, and you're only worried about your fridge and freezer and shit, there's no need for a whole house generator. You can buy several (not that you need several) portable generators and more gas than you'll ever need for 21k.
Being from Louisiana, we get by with a portable generator post storm to keep the fridge and freezer going...maybe power a window unit or TV.
Not__Beaulo@reddit
That seems crazy. I have a 2800 square foot house and I had an interlock installed so I can plug a portable generator into the house to run almost everything.
I have 9000 wat generac that cost $1k and the interlock was $700 installed.
I probably can’t run a/c, microwave, coffee maker and 3 fridges at the same time but I am fine with that.
In an emergency I will ration and probably run 2 hours on 3 hours off to keep fridges cold and reduce fuel burn.