Thanks for posting it, and I thank anon for writing it
As corny, pretentious and fake it comes off as it might be, it resonated with me, not because I have such deep thoughts but because I too struggle with the reality of my existence and the triviality of it.
I have came to the conclusion that there is no hope, and there never was. Hope seems to be a thing we create in order to satisfy our need for reason and the reality of the gap between our situation and dreams.
When a miracle happens and there is a happy end we name it indomitable human spirit, but countless times there is nothing, and we avert our gaze, naturally.
As someone who's currently going through something similar, how about you take Nietzsche's critique of schopenhaur and consider that maybe you're just projecting your inner world and assuming that just because you feel hopeless, it doesn't mean there is no hope and that people are just pretending. It could be there you're just severely depressed and assuming your truths are universal truths.
Thanks for your thoughtful reply, yes my opinions on these matter are, after all, what I see before my eyes through the glasses I wear and only what I perceive after multiple changing and subjective factors of things
Ive said and do think these but despite that, like Nietzsche's advice, I still try to somehow thrive, be may it be through my little fanfiction that will live on no matter what, no matter how cringe it may be or this reddit account that Ive written about my views on things. Pronably a kind of compensation or coping mechanism of some sort, since I dont have the means for the kind of live I want to live
That's cool. If I may recommend some unconventional advice, the literature /lit/ bored on 4chan is pretty productive, forthright and interesting to check out, especially if you're looking for specific literature or want to bounce ideas off of people. It's casual but a lot of the people on there are genuinely really well red.
In the same way there's no hope, there's no dread, they're both concepts we made up to make sense of a chaotic universe. The next step after realizing nothing matters (if you do believe it) in existentialism and nihilism is to realize that even though nothing matters, you can experience things, and there are people you care about, and you can make your life and the lives of people around you better. Do things you enjoy, spend time with people you like, nothing matters so improve the experiences you've got before you're fertilizer.
If there was no dread, then you could at least hope cope. Dread might not matter and be subjective but it's still real, even if it has no meaning. Why would you assume something having no meaning means it doesn't exist? If you got random meaningless pains in your chest, are those pains in it of themselves not real because they lack meaning?
I havent thought about it that way about dread, thats very interesting. Of course, as bitter as my line of thought is I know that doing nothing because of will only bring misery. I cant live the way I want but I still try, for whatever reason
I don't think its supposed to be complicated. I am not a fan of dumping a bunch of meaning into everything when things are just supposed to be what they are in most cases.
Go out with friends, have some beers and enjoy chatting. thats it. no need for you to overthink it.
Had an awkward interaction? it doesn't matter. it changes nothing.
Enjoy doing an activity? (playing music, drawing, dancing) Thats all there is to it. you enjoy it, so might as well do it. Life is clearly meaningless and therefore every day is there for us to fill it with whatever actions make us feel content with living it.
I might be overthinking it, youre right. I know hanging out with friends or doing anything you like is just as important (if not more) as trying to make sense of things
Its just that I myself dont want to live my life without having never questioned it, and although it has brought nothing positive (unlike what everyone says its actually a liability when talking with girls, they reward surface-level thinking in my experience) but I am content with it in my own way. My little fanfiction and reviews are also ways to make me fulfilled besides goofing around with friends.
I don't think that never questioning existence is the right way to go. I myself am guilty of overthinking things that hold no value to the quality of the life I live lol. I generally enjoy discussing topics like this, and sadly I have the same experience as you when it comes to girls lol.
However I don't think that its women that reward surface-level thinking, but the masses in general. As someone who enjoys a good discussion, setting my existing friends apart, I really have trouble finding people that I enjoy talking to. And thats a must for a romantic partner.
Imo hedonism is the way to go, and I don't mean only food, drink and drugs, but everything that makes you feel good.
Gotta keep ourselves fulfilled and content with our every day lives
Youre right, I had a similar discussion with a friend of mine. We tend not to think deeply like the underlying meaning of things and whatnot.
How many misinformation we read in a day, how does the content we consume effects us, what it means to exist and what worth are things? I think they are all important things and knowing, realizing their value is the first step to change and improve them. This isnt just about these questions its about the mindset to have when faced with other seemingly trivial questions ,
But even at the first step we are discouraged to question. Most will say something like "What are you talking about" if not outright call you crazy just because you thought about it a bit. Kinda hard to talk about it to people so I keep it to myself or shape it in a way and try to insert them in my reviews or fanfic to make it somewhat interesting
A true Existentialist would recognize that just because we aren't inherently provided meaning in our lives doesn't mean we cannot create meaning ourselves.
After all, If life is truly meaningless, then the statement "life is meaningless." Is equally as meaningless. Anon should enjoy the meaninglessness of life and embrace the absurdity, since life is meaningless Anon can be completely free.
That's absurdism, existentialism is when you decide that every choice is your own and that your life could have whatever meaning you desire. Both are equally flawed but at least with existentialism you're not being a huge douche.
When it comes to absurdism it's flawed because the only logical answer to living a meaningless life while enjoying it is hedonism. While with existentialism it emphasizes that everyone is free and responsible for both their choices and their lives which ignores people who live in poverty or slavery or anyone who doesn't have many options in life.
the idea that hedonism is the only natural conclusion in completely flawed. Camus never advocated for hedonism. Rebelling against existence through the absurd and creating meaning requires to do meaningful things, things that actually matter to them. You misunderstand absurdism.
It's not bad per se. It's just that being an inconsiderate douchebag that only focuses on what makes them happy while ignoring any responsibility to both themselves or others is empty imo. Even when they do charity it's still hedonistic cause they care about how it makes them feel instead of actually helping others in need.
I made a girl cry in my Bible Belt high school for suggesting she only did charity because of the heavenly reward she would receive afterwards. Not because of any sort of intrinsic kindness or value.
I will not disagree that a lot of hedonists are egoistical, but as any other ideology it has many versions of it. Imo if you strive for pleasure maxxing and living in a way that makes you feel good, then you should also realize that others also want those things, regardless of what they believe in. Therefore you shouldn't cause harm to them or do anything to prevent them from achieving that pleasure for themselves. Its without doubt that the ideology centers around you as a person rather than humanity as a whole, but considering that people are individuals and not a hivemind, I think that its more than fair.
I will contribute another criticism of hedonism. Even the responsible kind that you talk about. And that is that it’s very shallow. You live and make choices and execute your agency (if you believe it exist) purely to satisfy and stimulate your own brain chemistry. It’s a very basal existence and at that point you might as well so heroin or become a coomer.
I think you are severely steel manning hedonism to the point of being disingenuous. Hedonism is about maximising pleasure. What you are talking about is something else. I’m not hating on your worldview though. I just don’t think what you are describing is hedonism.
Also, your last paragraph does not make any sense and is putting words in my mouth and border on ad hominem. I argued in good faith. You should carry yourself with a little more class.
I get your point and I agree to disagree.
I see how my last paragraph could have came out that way and I didn't mean it to. Either way I did enjoy talking with you on this. Have a nice evening mate
Just because an action brings pleasure doesn't mean its shallow lol. You can pursue long term pleasures like cultivating skills, meaningful relationships and engage in substances like alcohol and drugs without actually overindulging. Saying "you might as well do heroin and become a coomer!!" is such a strawman lmao. you like women??? you might as well start committing sexual assault!!!" like what?
Its not about achieving maximum pleasure, but optimal pleasure, and tbh overdosing on a substance and dying kinda prevents you from enjoying life to the fullest.
Thinking that the goal of hedonism is to "purely satisfy and stimulate your own brain chemistry" is like saying that art, deep friendships and love don't matter because they trigger dopamine? like what do you do? meditate all day and donate to charity? kek
I think you are severely steel manning hedonism to the point of being disingenuous. Hedonism is about maximising pleasure. What you are talking about is something else. I’m not hating on your worldview though. I just don’t think what you are describing is hedonism.
Also, your last paragraph does not make any sense and is putting words in my mouth and border on ad hominem. I argued in good faith. You should carry yourself with a little more class.
it's no longer hedonism when you take other people's feelings into consideration. What brings you joy is subjective but the minute you do something that could be bothersome to you in order to help someone else it stops being hedonism. However, if we take the opposite thing like something that could bother someone else but brings you joy, like lying, that's hedonistic. Hedonism means that you prioritize your own comfort over someone else's displeasure, it's not an individual philosophy it's anti society by nature.
Existentialism is an individual philosophy while hedonism is closer to a goal than philosophy. It usually ends in failure as well because humans are social animals by nature and prioritizing your own pleasure leads to ostracization or worse. Plus humans aren't supposed to experience constant pleasure we need the hard times to make the good times feel better.
Tldr: life in a society requires committing sacrifices to personal freedom which goes against hedonism which leads to hedonists leaving society and isolating themselves which almost always leads to an unfulfilling life.
"Hedonism is the ethical theory that pleasure (in the sense of the satisfaction of desires) is the highest good and proper aim of human life." Copied that directly from the oxford dictionary as to not make any mistakes about our topic at hand lol.
You're treating hedonism like as if there are only two sides to it. either you're a pure hedonist who only prioritizes personal pleasure at all costs, or you are not one at all. But thats not how any ideology works. By that logic, the moment a religious person does anything that goes against their religion, they stop being religious, or the moment a capitalist gives something away for free, they instantly become a communist. That’s not how humans function. we are not robots who operate strictly within ideological confines
Of course I'm not gonna sit and argue that hedonism has nothing to do with egoism or the prioritization of the self, however it all comes with ifs and buts. If my brother needed help and me helping him came with literally no benefits, except his own well being, then I would surely still do it. you could come up and say, but you benefit from him being okay, since surely he will now owe you a favour and you will use it when you need help.
I think thats a rabbit hole in general, since you could apply that to almost any scenario as most things humans do benefit them in one way or another, even if not immediately.
Constant pleasure is a strawman imo lol. Life can't be constant pleasure and self destruction prevents you from living a meaningful and satisfying life.
I would say that materialism plays a big part in hedonism and although drugs, food and sex are also more than welcome, the idea isn't mindless indulgence, but seeking optimal pleasure and a long life of bliss.
Like i said, i don't consider hedonism a philosophy. To my understanding, hedonism is prioritizing pleasure. That's not a philosophy that answers any questions or offers any practical solutions to society. So if i have to rate it purely as a philosophy it fails.
For your first point yes i consider things black and white if you're a religious person but pick and choose what tenets you uphold you become a hypocrite. And if a capitalist keeps handing out free stuff every once and a while to help others he's no longer a capitalist. Ideologies are consistent and if you consistently break them it means you neither believe in them nor follow them.
I already gave my opinion on the second one the benefit is that helping him makes you feel good and that's still hedonistic. but if you helping him causes you to lose something for instance he needs some money that you wanted to spend on bills and you still help him you're no longer a hedonist.
So it's not about benefits it's about sacrifices. Are you willing to sacrifice some of your own personal pleasure to bring pleasure to someone else if you are then you're not a hedonist and you misunderstood what hedonism is.
Constant pleasure is the ultimate goal of hedonism as a philosophy which is why i brought it up. And yes it's self destructive by nature.
Maximizing your own pleasure while minimizing the damage it causes to your surroundings is not hedonism. Compromising your pleasure isn't a part of hedonism.
Reminds me of quote from Camus book "The Stranger"
"For everything to be consummated, for me to feel less alone, I had only to wish that there be a large crowd of spectators the day of my execution and that they greet me with cries, of "you're not a huge douche.""
Yeah, he kinda brought the hate on himself though. I mean what kind of a heartless person takes a four day vacation for his mother's funeral? Does he hold no regard for his employer's feelings!
As an absurd satirist writer, I’m offended that you think I’m a huge douche. You know what I’m gonna do about it? I’m gotta writer a letter—a letter to myself—and in that letter I’m gonna describe how much you’ve offended me. It’ll be a very visceral letter, impassioned and from the heart. Did you know I wear my heart on my sleeve? When I’m wearing sleeves, that is. We don’t always wear sleeves. Sometimes we wear nothing. Like my grandfather, comatose on his deathbed, bloody fluid draining from his emphysemic lungs. He was a smoker, and now we use a smoker every Christmas to roast a pig, dividing its body among the family. It just feels right, you know? Poetic, even. But I’ll write that letter. Please don’t offend me again. Or I’ll have to write another letter.
Nah not really, I'm not changing op's logic just taking it to its logical extreme. If life is meaningless than believing life is meaningless is equally as meaningless.
Its actually absurdism which I somewhat related to Existientialism, which I'm assuming is enterchangable with Optimistic Nihillsm. Only the first sentence would be considered Existientialism.
Basically just watch the movie "everything everywhere all at once" and take the phrase "nothing matters" in a positive light. We give our lives meaning. Earth without teeming life is just another rock in space. But at the same time, it IS just another rock in space. So get into the pit of life, climb ur mountain and enjoy the ride as best u can.
Anon forgot the part after realizing we're all dust in the wind who will all die someday soon: since none of it really matters, your purpose and misery or happiness are your own to decide. If nothing matters, do something with meaning to you and the other specks of dust you care about. Create something to enjoy til you take your long nap 6 feet under.
Thats more than fair. Im not too keen on bread usually, but it suffices on most days. I would rather just eat a variety of foods and not touch pastries at all though
avagrantthought@reddit
lol
Lmao even
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Perhaps even Kek?
DokutahMostima@reddit
Thanks for posting it, and I thank anon for writing it
As corny, pretentious and fake it comes off as it might be, it resonated with me, not because I have such deep thoughts but because I too struggle with the reality of my existence and the triviality of it.
I have came to the conclusion that there is no hope, and there never was. Hope seems to be a thing we create in order to satisfy our need for reason and the reality of the gap between our situation and dreams.
When a miracle happens and there is a happy end we name it indomitable human spirit, but countless times there is nothing, and we avert our gaze, naturally.
Dont mind me, just a schizo larping.
avagrantthought@reddit
Schopenhaur pilled lmao
As someone who's currently going through something similar, how about you take Nietzsche's critique of schopenhaur and consider that maybe you're just projecting your inner world and assuming that just because you feel hopeless, it doesn't mean there is no hope and that people are just pretending. It could be there you're just severely depressed and assuming your truths are universal truths.
Hope that helps.
DokutahMostima@reddit
Thanks for your thoughtful reply, yes my opinions on these matter are, after all, what I see before my eyes through the glasses I wear and only what I perceive after multiple changing and subjective factors of things
Ive said and do think these but despite that, like Nietzsche's advice, I still try to somehow thrive, be may it be through my little fanfiction that will live on no matter what, no matter how cringe it may be or this reddit account that Ive written about my views on things. Pronably a kind of compensation or coping mechanism of some sort, since I dont have the means for the kind of live I want to live
avagrantthought@reddit
That's cool. If I may recommend some unconventional advice, the literature /lit/ bored on 4chan is pretty productive, forthright and interesting to check out, especially if you're looking for specific literature or want to bounce ideas off of people. It's casual but a lot of the people on there are genuinely really well red.
DokutahMostima@reddit
I did take a look at it and there are indeed some interesting things there, much appreciated
avagrantthought@reddit
Think nothing of it.
Have a great a day week.
DokutahMostima@reddit
Thank you and you too
theyeshman@reddit
In the same way there's no hope, there's no dread, they're both concepts we made up to make sense of a chaotic universe. The next step after realizing nothing matters (if you do believe it) in existentialism and nihilism is to realize that even though nothing matters, you can experience things, and there are people you care about, and you can make your life and the lives of people around you better. Do things you enjoy, spend time with people you like, nothing matters so improve the experiences you've got before you're fertilizer.
avagrantthought@reddit
No hope, leads to dread.
If there was no dread, then you could at least hope cope. Dread might not matter and be subjective but it's still real, even if it has no meaning. Why would you assume something having no meaning means it doesn't exist? If you got random meaningless pains in your chest, are those pains in it of themselves not real because they lack meaning?
DokutahMostima@reddit
I havent thought about it that way about dread, thats very interesting. Of course, as bitter as my line of thought is I know that doing nothing because of will only bring misery. I cant live the way I want but I still try, for whatever reason
O-03-03@reddit
I think you need some Life Loaf dude
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
I don't think its supposed to be complicated. I am not a fan of dumping a bunch of meaning into everything when things are just supposed to be what they are in most cases.
Go out with friends, have some beers and enjoy chatting. thats it. no need for you to overthink it.
Had an awkward interaction? it doesn't matter. it changes nothing.
Enjoy doing an activity? (playing music, drawing, dancing) Thats all there is to it. you enjoy it, so might as well do it. Life is clearly meaningless and therefore every day is there for us to fill it with whatever actions make us feel content with living it.
DokutahMostima@reddit
I might be overthinking it, youre right. I know hanging out with friends or doing anything you like is just as important (if not more) as trying to make sense of things
Its just that I myself dont want to live my life without having never questioned it, and although it has brought nothing positive (unlike what everyone says its actually a liability when talking with girls, they reward surface-level thinking in my experience) but I am content with it in my own way. My little fanfiction and reviews are also ways to make me fulfilled besides goofing around with friends.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
I don't think that never questioning existence is the right way to go. I myself am guilty of overthinking things that hold no value to the quality of the life I live lol. I generally enjoy discussing topics like this, and sadly I have the same experience as you when it comes to girls lol.
However I don't think that its women that reward surface-level thinking, but the masses in general. As someone who enjoys a good discussion, setting my existing friends apart, I really have trouble finding people that I enjoy talking to. And thats a must for a romantic partner.
Imo hedonism is the way to go, and I don't mean only food, drink and drugs, but everything that makes you feel good.
Gotta keep ourselves fulfilled and content with our every day lives
DokutahMostima@reddit
Youre right, I had a similar discussion with a friend of mine. We tend not to think deeply like the underlying meaning of things and whatnot.
How many misinformation we read in a day, how does the content we consume effects us, what it means to exist and what worth are things? I think they are all important things and knowing, realizing their value is the first step to change and improve them. This isnt just about these questions its about the mindset to have when faced with other seemingly trivial questions ,
But even at the first step we are discouraged to question. Most will say something like "What are you talking about" if not outright call you crazy just because you thought about it a bit. Kinda hard to talk about it to people so I keep it to myself or shape it in a way and try to insert them in my reviews or fanfic to make it somewhat interesting
SmolBirdEnthusiast@reddit
I don't fuck with all this alists and isms; I see bread I eat bread, yummy bread and I smile
I like to do things that make me smile, life is too short and sad to live without smiles; so I get my bread, and peanut butter, and jelly, and smile.
rienceislier34@reddit
For some reason I am imagining a little kid eating bread and PB&J, smiling.
You are adorable u/SmolBirdEnthusiast
shjahaha@reddit
A true Existentialist would recognize that just because we aren't inherently provided meaning in our lives doesn't mean we cannot create meaning ourselves.
After all, If life is truly meaningless, then the statement "life is meaningless." Is equally as meaningless. Anon should enjoy the meaninglessness of life and embrace the absurdity, since life is meaningless Anon can be completely free.
avagrantthought@reddit
No true Scottsman fallacy much?
zaien@reddit
That's absurdism, existentialism is when you decide that every choice is your own and that your life could have whatever meaning you desire. Both are equally flawed but at least with existentialism you're not being a huge douche.
shjahaha@reddit
Yeah I kinda mixed and mashed Absurdism, and Existentialism especially towards the end.
How exactly are they flawed though?
zaien@reddit
When it comes to absurdism it's flawed because the only logical answer to living a meaningless life while enjoying it is hedonism. While with existentialism it emphasizes that everyone is free and responsible for both their choices and their lives which ignores people who live in poverty or slavery or anyone who doesn't have many options in life.
RearAdmiralP@reddit
Who says I'm supposed to enjoy life? You're not my supervisor.
zaien@reddit
That's the spirit, welcome to nihilism all of the existential dread without any of the answers.
Ace_of_Razgriz_77@reddit
https://i.redd.it/4j6srax74rse1.gif
zaplinaki@reddit
I sure love it here
thesonoftheleviathan@reddit
the idea that hedonism is the only natural conclusion in completely flawed. Camus never advocated for hedonism. Rebelling against existence through the absurd and creating meaning requires to do meaningful things, things that actually matter to them. You misunderstand absurdism.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
How is hedonism bad though? The only arguments that hedonism is "bad" stem from religious values which are clearly biased.
zaien@reddit
It's not bad per se. It's just that being an inconsiderate douchebag that only focuses on what makes them happy while ignoring any responsibility to both themselves or others is empty imo. Even when they do charity it's still hedonistic cause they care about how it makes them feel instead of actually helping others in need.
Pubics_Cube@reddit
I made a girl cry in my Bible Belt high school for suggesting she only did charity because of the heavenly reward she would receive afterwards. Not because of any sort of intrinsic kindness or value.
encrustingXacro@reddit
You fr
Pubics_Cube@reddit
I wish I was that skinny
Tenko-of-Mori@reddit
unfathomably based.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
I will not disagree that a lot of hedonists are egoistical, but as any other ideology it has many versions of it. Imo if you strive for pleasure maxxing and living in a way that makes you feel good, then you should also realize that others also want those things, regardless of what they believe in. Therefore you shouldn't cause harm to them or do anything to prevent them from achieving that pleasure for themselves. Its without doubt that the ideology centers around you as a person rather than humanity as a whole, but considering that people are individuals and not a hivemind, I think that its more than fair.
stickypocketlint@reddit
I will contribute another criticism of hedonism. Even the responsible kind that you talk about. And that is that it’s very shallow. You live and make choices and execute your agency (if you believe it exist) purely to satisfy and stimulate your own brain chemistry. It’s a very basal existence and at that point you might as well so heroin or become a coomer.
stickypocketlint@reddit
I think you are severely steel manning hedonism to the point of being disingenuous. Hedonism is about maximising pleasure. What you are talking about is something else. I’m not hating on your worldview though. I just don’t think what you are describing is hedonism.
Also, your last paragraph does not make any sense and is putting words in my mouth and border on ad hominem. I argued in good faith. You should carry yourself with a little more class.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
I get your point and I agree to disagree. I see how my last paragraph could have came out that way and I didn't mean it to. Either way I did enjoy talking with you on this. Have a nice evening mate
encrustingXacro@reddit
Holy shit an actually civil reddit debate
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Just because an action brings pleasure doesn't mean its shallow lol. You can pursue long term pleasures like cultivating skills, meaningful relationships and engage in substances like alcohol and drugs without actually overindulging. Saying "you might as well do heroin and become a coomer!!" is such a strawman lmao. you like women??? you might as well start committing sexual assault!!!" like what?
Its not about achieving maximum pleasure, but optimal pleasure, and tbh overdosing on a substance and dying kinda prevents you from enjoying life to the fullest.
Thinking that the goal of hedonism is to "purely satisfy and stimulate your own brain chemistry" is like saying that art, deep friendships and love don't matter because they trigger dopamine? like what do you do? meditate all day and donate to charity? kek
stickypocketlint@reddit
I think you are severely steel manning hedonism to the point of being disingenuous. Hedonism is about maximising pleasure. What you are talking about is something else. I’m not hating on your worldview though. I just don’t think what you are describing is hedonism.
Also, your last paragraph does not make any sense and is putting words in my mouth and border on ad hominem. I argued in good faith. You should carry yourself with a little more class.
zaien@reddit
it's no longer hedonism when you take other people's feelings into consideration. What brings you joy is subjective but the minute you do something that could be bothersome to you in order to help someone else it stops being hedonism. However, if we take the opposite thing like something that could bother someone else but brings you joy, like lying, that's hedonistic. Hedonism means that you prioritize your own comfort over someone else's displeasure, it's not an individual philosophy it's anti society by nature.
Existentialism is an individual philosophy while hedonism is closer to a goal than philosophy. It usually ends in failure as well because humans are social animals by nature and prioritizing your own pleasure leads to ostracization or worse. Plus humans aren't supposed to experience constant pleasure we need the hard times to make the good times feel better.
Tldr: life in a society requires committing sacrifices to personal freedom which goes against hedonism which leads to hedonists leaving society and isolating themselves which almost always leads to an unfulfilling life.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
"Hedonism is the ethical theory that pleasure (in the sense of the satisfaction of desires) is the highest good and proper aim of human life." Copied that directly from the oxford dictionary as to not make any mistakes about our topic at hand lol.
You're treating hedonism like as if there are only two sides to it. either you're a pure hedonist who only prioritizes personal pleasure at all costs, or you are not one at all. But thats not how any ideology works. By that logic, the moment a religious person does anything that goes against their religion, they stop being religious, or the moment a capitalist gives something away for free, they instantly become a communist. That’s not how humans function. we are not robots who operate strictly within ideological confines
Of course I'm not gonna sit and argue that hedonism has nothing to do with egoism or the prioritization of the self, however it all comes with ifs and buts. If my brother needed help and me helping him came with literally no benefits, except his own well being, then I would surely still do it. you could come up and say, but you benefit from him being okay, since surely he will now owe you a favour and you will use it when you need help.
I think thats a rabbit hole in general, since you could apply that to almost any scenario as most things humans do benefit them in one way or another, even if not immediately.
Constant pleasure is a strawman imo lol. Life can't be constant pleasure and self destruction prevents you from living a meaningful and satisfying life.
I would say that materialism plays a big part in hedonism and although drugs, food and sex are also more than welcome, the idea isn't mindless indulgence, but seeking optimal pleasure and a long life of bliss.
Would love to hear your thoughts!
zaien@reddit
Like i said, i don't consider hedonism a philosophy. To my understanding, hedonism is prioritizing pleasure. That's not a philosophy that answers any questions or offers any practical solutions to society. So if i have to rate it purely as a philosophy it fails.
For your first point yes i consider things black and white if you're a religious person but pick and choose what tenets you uphold you become a hypocrite. And if a capitalist keeps handing out free stuff every once and a while to help others he's no longer a capitalist. Ideologies are consistent and if you consistently break them it means you neither believe in them nor follow them.
I already gave my opinion on the second one the benefit is that helping him makes you feel good and that's still hedonistic. but if you helping him causes you to lose something for instance he needs some money that you wanted to spend on bills and you still help him you're no longer a hedonist.
So it's not about benefits it's about sacrifices. Are you willing to sacrifice some of your own personal pleasure to bring pleasure to someone else if you are then you're not a hedonist and you misunderstood what hedonism is.
Constant pleasure is the ultimate goal of hedonism as a philosophy which is why i brought it up. And yes it's self destructive by nature.
Maximizing your own pleasure while minimizing the damage it causes to your surroundings is not hedonism. Compromising your pleasure isn't a part of hedonism.
blippie@reddit
Reminds me of quote from Camus book "The Stranger"
"For everything to be consummated, for me to feel less alone, I had only to wish that there be a large crowd of spectators the day of my execution and that they greet me with cries, of "you're not a huge douche.""
zaien@reddit
Yeah, he kinda brought the hate on himself though. I mean what kind of a heartless person takes a four day vacation for his mother's funeral? Does he hold no regard for his employer's feelings!
TenserMeAgain@reddit
he was autistic Camus said also even if he tries to rationalize his actions he still kill a person in cold blood without intention.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Its probably my favorite book ngl.
RicSide@reddit
As an absurd satirist writer, I’m offended that you think I’m a huge douche. You know what I’m gonna do about it? I’m gotta writer a letter—a letter to myself—and in that letter I’m gonna describe how much you’ve offended me. It’ll be a very visceral letter, impassioned and from the heart. Did you know I wear my heart on my sleeve? When I’m wearing sleeves, that is. We don’t always wear sleeves. Sometimes we wear nothing. Like my grandfather, comatose on his deathbed, bloody fluid draining from his emphysemic lungs. He was a smoker, and now we use a smoker every Christmas to roast a pig, dividing its body among the family. It just feels right, you know? Poetic, even. But I’ll write that letter. Please don’t offend me again. Or I’ll have to write another letter.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
This comment motivated me to start writing an essay. It will be a long essay. Longer than most essays.
utkohoc@reddit
This the same type of shit like "just be happy" you cannot so easily change the way you think/who you are.
shjahaha@reddit
Nah not really, I'm not changing op's logic just taking it to its logical extreme. If life is meaningless than believing life is meaningless is equally as meaningless.
utkohoc@reddit
That would require some degree of self awareness
shjahaha@reddit
If anon can ponder his own existence he should have some base level self awareness.
this-is-robin@reddit
No that's 'Optimistic Nihilism' what you are talking about. Kurzgesagt did a video on that.
Letters_to_Dionysus@reddit
optimistic nihilism isnt a real historical thing in philosophy
theyeshman@reddit
The damage edu-tainment YouTubers have done to people's critical thinking skills is incredible
shjahaha@reddit
Its actually absurdism which I somewhat related to Existientialism, which I'm assuming is enterchangable with Optimistic Nihillsm. Only the first sentence would be considered Existientialism.
herefortime@reddit
Well said. It’s either:
Life is meaningless…
Or
Life is meaningless!
TeknoWookie@reddit
What a loser
sxtigon@reddit
Dudes gotta dopamine problem. So introspective but so cowardly.
blalokjpg@reddit
I was hoping it would go all the way to them at the altar but mentally anon is still in that bread aisle.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Perhaps he never left
MoneybagsMalone@reddit
"Le Pain" By Albert Camus
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
loled hard. great comment
XLRIV48@reddit
Peak
Roanapura@reddit
**C I N E M A**
ZogIII3@reddit
LiterallyAPidgeon@reddit
loaf is just one big solidified droplet of seed oil
slepere@reddit
sovLegend@reddit
Can someone send a better resolution image? I can't read this.
justaBB6@reddit
>She is probably lying too
>She is talking about her job, her new apartment, her dog
hey anon maybe you’re just wrong sometimes and also being kind of a dick
Again_718@reddit
wow. life is not like this at all for me
Neat-Cap-5888@reddit
Anon was cucked by life bread
TheDarkSoul616@reddit
Honestly, could be me some days.
DecentHippo9196@reddit
tldr
TheFischKing@reddit
Anon should write a 20th century French philosophy novel
ch3ck0uT@reddit
That is so real. I’m happy that I can get good bread
ToxicPyro@reddit
This reads like American psycho narration
Half_smart_m0nk3y@reddit
buys wheat bread
_tastes like nothing _
Many such cases
Towbee@reddit
real and straight
GandalfInDrugs@reddit
Fake and gay
JOnion6@reddit
explain
The_King_7067@reddit
I'll do it
Fake: anon talked with a girl
Gay: anon loafs getting bread by another dude
CourteousRevolt@reddit
Great post! Do you have the link to the original?
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Yup Here: https://boards.4chan.org/r9k/thread/80848874
depersonalised@reddit
there are so many pixels
maximidze228@reddit
Dude needs a beer or something
Puettster@reddit
Camus was a Neet
zaien@reddit
Honestly, this is the most accurate and hard takedowns of camus' philosophy. Guy was a creep but so were most philosophers.
ThatsWhatSheVersed@reddit
This might be one of the best things I’ve read on 4ch.
C_Pashe@reddit
“That I have spent the last 5 years in near-total social hibernation.” Same dude.
amdyn@reddit
Tenko-of-Mori@reddit
this gives me some kind of ineffable soulpain
Willundrskor@reddit
Basically just watch the movie "everything everywhere all at once" and take the phrase "nothing matters" in a positive light. We give our lives meaning. Earth without teeming life is just another rock in space. But at the same time, it IS just another rock in space. So get into the pit of life, climb ur mountain and enjoy the ride as best u can.
YeastusCrust@reddit
Anon experiences existential bread
ExistentialJew@reddit
Anon is stuck between existential dread and nihilistic collapse
epicganerepic@reddit
mf just buy the fucking bread lmao
RegalToaster@reddit
Anon fumbled the bag
Thin-Rush-9453@reddit
but he got that bread... for what its worth
Gameboysixty9@reddit
Anon is just a broken person trying to find some deep profoundness in his suffering where there isnt any.
theyeshman@reddit
Anon forgot the part after realizing we're all dust in the wind who will all die someday soon: since none of it really matters, your purpose and misery or happiness are your own to decide. If nothing matters, do something with meaning to you and the other specks of dust you care about. Create something to enjoy til you take your long nap 6 feet under.
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
One must imagine that the bread tastes great
Gameboysixty9@reddit
If there is any meaning to be found in life, then one must imagine breadanon happy
theyeshman@reddit
I'm not much of a bread guy, I'll make some bomb ass chili instead
LordIVoldemor@reddit (OP)
Thats more than fair. Im not too keen on bread usually, but it suffices on most days. I would rather just eat a variety of foods and not touch pastries at all though
IOVofCWA@reddit
Cruel, wheat-based deception 😂
psydelicdaydreamer@reddit
Absolute cinema
NotRandomseer@reddit
This reminded me that bread is delicious and I should try a new variety
I_love_Coooooookies@reddit
Absolute Cinema
MzCWzL@reddit
Way too real.. 🍞
Fickle_Sherbert1453@reddit
You're just sad, anon. It's not that deep, you're just being pretentious.
thr33beggars@reddit
One of those situations where one thinks, “thank fuck I’m gonna die someday.”
AReliableRandom@reddit
based and breadpilled
wookiebadass@reddit
Real and original
Grizzly2525@reddit
Just like me fr
AntisocialHipster@reddit
Anon participates in the shared human experience
NoobMemeLordd@reddit
Another day another existenfaggot.
J̶̖̜͕͚̑̊u̵̼͔̪̠̍̿̈͊s̴̡̯̜̥̏t̴͈̲͚̾̈́ ̷͓̥́͌̋̈́́c̸̳̯̿̽͠ô̶͖̭̣̙n̵̟̞̖͐̽͌̈́͝s̵̯͍̬̍u̸̎̚͜m̷̠͉̤̖͎͐̀̈̌̒e̶͇̥̫̊͜ ̶͉͂͆̌̓b̷̪̹̏̃͜͝͠ȩ̸̼̄͑̾ ̴͚̉̆̆͝ḩ̵̛̮̘̹̰͆͗̚͝a̶̲̠̖̾̈́͋ͅp̶͖̀͐̂̚p̶͖̀͐̂̚y
AdeptusShitpostus@reddit
aslume