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--Apk--@reddit

What is the point in flatpaks and snaps? They run worse, pull in gigabytes of repeat dependencies, and are buggy as fuck.

Security? Sandboxing? Useless buzzwords. People should run trusted and audited foss software. There's the only real security. We shouldn't rely on the guardrails of sandboxes that have some crack half the time to enable people to ignorantly install dodgy software. This isn't android.

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Adpocalyptic@reddit

I saw the image before I saw the title of the post... Was legit excited

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Slaykomimi2@reddit

stuff like this doesnt make me wonder that people like trump can sell restrictions as freedom. Like wtf Linux is the only OS allowing us to have options and people having nothing better to do then argue about it and wanting to limit it so we don´t have options anymore. Humans really want enslavement and surpression, they literally beg for it

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nelmaloc@reddit

http://www.islinuxaboutchoice.com/

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AkiNoHotoke@reddit

While I understand the gist about the underlying system blocks, GNU/Linux is about the choice IMHO. This is because there is still a lot of options out of which the user can build their own experience.

You can build your own minimal environment with window managers and CLI applications. In fact, it can even be a hobby, since there is are so many options, and ideas of what a window manager should be.
You can opt for different DE, such as GNOME, KDE, or Xfce. Each one having their own ideas of what a DE should be.
You can create any kind of hybrid mixing DE and various window managers.
You can decide to operate only with text and only use a shell in a virtual console. Of course, this is extreme. But it is still a choice.
You could get as close as possible to a Lisp Machine by running EXWM.

Therefore, there are plenty of choices for the user. It is just that some of the building blocks are not up to the user to choose. But you can still pick some of the system components, such as the boot manager, init system, system shell, sound system, etc.

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nelmaloc@reddit

All of that is true, but when someone says «Linux is about choice», it's always in the context of «and the developers must support it».

Just look at this thread's root comment, comparing reducing the available packaging formats (a good thing) with slavery.

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AkiNoHotoke@reddit

I think that, inevitably, some of the projects will receive more funding and effort, while others will receive less. But we GNU/Linux users still get to enjoy a wider plethora of options to chose from, compared to the proprietary OS. I agree on your point on packaging formats. We have LSB, which suggests RPM, but I guess that is only relevant in the enterprise setting. With the desktop distros, it is indeed Far West.

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anotheruser323@reddit

Fedora's are all about extremism. Their extremism.

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nostril_spiders@reddit

Have you tried enslavement? Maybe give it a go before you slag it off

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Slaykomimi2@reddit

had it till I was 20, can´t recommend it. But seing people scream more and more about getting limited, that they dont want options but dictated what to do and how things go more and more anticonsumer and them just screaming for more, I doubt they would oppose enslavement if it´s just pitched as "you want that to show how free you are!", even embrace it and be "proud" about being used and abused

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StrictCheesecake1139@reddit

systemd-ai contains Slackware-AI 0401

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KnowZeroX@reddit

Finally, no more packaging issues and we can all use a universal packing centered around gentoo where we all compile everything from source as the great penguins intended.

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chemape876@reddit

Stares profusely while holding a nix themed waifu pillow

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deanrihpee@reddit

there's some nix themed Waifu pillow?

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JockstrapCummies@reddit

Yes, and the great thing about it is that you can easily have the same configuration everywhere and revert to the pristine state after every use with the power of Nix.

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spaceguy47@reddit

So you’re saying the waifu is reproducible… interesting…

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headedbranch225@reddit

Why have you made me imagine this?

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gigantipad@reddit

Finally what us current Thinkpad 770 users have been advocating for decades now.

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worked-on-my-machine@reddit

Everybody agrees on a common package manager: 😃

It's zypper: 😢

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trxxruraxvr@reddit

What's so bad about zypper? I've been using it only for a couple of months since I switched to tumbleweed, but so far it hasn't been bad for me.

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passerbycmc@reddit

It's a little slow, but yeah otherwise no issues with it

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Guthibcom@reddit

Not anymore. Parallel downloads came a few weeks ago

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Kryohi@reddit

It's slower than pacman, but definitely faster than apt

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linuxjohn1982@reddit

The joke is that this is the exact mentality that EVERY developer has when creating a new standard or software option.

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cmrd_msr@reddit

In fact, I honestly don't understand why no one has developed a universal package installer yet. Why doesn't the average distribution even try to install foreign packages on click?

After all, console tools for this have existed for a long time.

I believe that the development of such a tool could greatly increase the popularity of the system on the Torvalds kernel.

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QuickSilver010@reddit

xkcd 927

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NeatYogurt9973@reddit

It quickly falls apart.

Oh, wait, this app already includes this tiny library but is split in the repos so now they are in conflict

Oh, wait, this program was built against a different Glibc version so it doesn't find symbol xyz here

Oh, wait, SIGILL. We don't know why honestly.

Oh, wait, we are on MUSL

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cmrd_msr@reddit

Yes, there may be quite a lot of problems, however, it is still better than the lack of (user-understandable) ability to try to run the program.

As for the dependency problems, I see the solution in the ability to automatically create a container for a foreign package, using dependencies from the repository of the system for which this program was originally made.

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NeatYogurt9973@reddit

Oh.

Well, wait til you hear that's exactly what fucking AppImage does. And Flatpak. You are going nowhere with this.

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cmrd_msr@reddit

Unfortunately, in most distributions (of those I've tried), out-of-the-box support for appimage leaves much to be desired.

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NeatYogurt9973@reddit

Fym? You add execution permissions to the file, and then you execute it. Usually by double clicking. Also, AppImages are static now so no dependencies. Where problem?

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cmrd_msr@reddit

Appimage can be launched by clicking, but I have not seen it installed by clicking (so that the program from the container is displayed in the general list of programs and is available at the system level). Third-party software is used for this. I am not even talking about the system itself trying to create an appimage from a foreign package, it sounds like science fiction.

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NeatYogurt9973@reddit

not installed

It's not supposed to be installed. Like a Windows portable exe.

system itself trying to create an AppImage

??? That's the packager's job?

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cmrd_msr@reddit

It is definitely more convenient for the user when a program can not only be launched, but also installed into the system. The average user does not care how this is technically implemented.

It would be much more convenient if the system tried to launch foreign software, and if it could not be launched due to dependencies, it would build the container itself. I don't see anything impossible in automating these actions and I sincerely believe that such an approach would make Linux a more popular solution for launching useful utilities.

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NeatYogurt9973@reddit

For the first point, just use Flatpak? It installs a .desktop file?

For the second, it's all dependent on the application.

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LowOwl4312@reddit

Spoiler: they managed to get the Microsoft Store running in Wine, native apps are now deprecated except for Gentoo

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QuickSilver010@reddit

I remember hearing a joke that the best solution to resolve dependency issues is to just run the windows version with wine.

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acewing905@reddit

they managed to get the Microsoft Store running in Wine

This is still my Linux white whale

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lewkiamurfarther@reddit

they managed to get the Microsoft Store running in Wine

This is still my Linux white whale

The Linux@Microsoft Store? The Microsoft@Linux Store?

This should be classified as hateful rhetoric.

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odsquad64@reddit

Can we setup Gentoo to compile everything from source using gcc.exe in wine?

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Masztufa@reddit

stallman turning in his bed as you're typing this

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JockstrapCummies@reddit

Nice to see Gentoo reigning supreme once again.

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Twig6843@reddit

Who tf uses snap???

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

People who don’t realize apt-get is pulling snaps.

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The-Malix@reddit

I know for a fact there are dozens of people wishing to say Nixpkgs

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derpJava@reddit

Literally saw this after commenting bout Nix packages kekw.

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therealduckie@reddit

No, the purists will insist it is GnuNixPkgs

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nixgang@reddit

🙊

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chemape876@reddit

Get out of my brain https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1jp6m7f/comment/mkx8wnx/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

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derpJava@reddit

Wait it was an April's fools post? 😭 I thought that the packaging thingy actually existed, just that it was still under development. But I really doubted it was real because Nix packages exist and that stuff can be run on not just any Linux, but Windows and MacOS as well.

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halfbakednbanktown@reddit

What is this "universal package format" be?

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dotAgent0range@reddit

I fell for one like 10 years back that claimed all of the big Linux distributors (minus redhat) were going to collaborate on a new Linux distribution.

I was super stoked until I looked at the date.

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Living_Horni@reddit

Reminds me of this one lol https://xkcd.com/927

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Acceptable-Comb-706@reddit

Isn't it infuriating? We can't just all sit down and come up with one standard. But, noo.

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BetIntelligent9885@reddit

yeah i have no idea why they all need to be different

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headedbranch225@reddit

I have seen 927 before, but can't fully remember, is it standards?

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Living_Horni@reddit

Yep, the "There are 14 different competing standards"

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WSuperOS@reddit

There is always a relevant xkcd

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carbonblackmind@reddit

I was about to say the same thing - there's always a relevant XKCD.

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Mezutelni@reddit

I was about to say the same thing - I was about to say the same thing - there's always a relevant XKCD.

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Willexterminator@reddit

I was about to say the same thing - I was about to say the same thing - I was about to say the same thing - there's always a relevant XKCD.

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carbonblackmind@reddit

https://xkcd.com/1739

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je386@reddit

Now we have SnapPack...

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irasponsibly@reddit

AppPack, SnapImage, and flat

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Veer-Verma@reddit

🤣🤣

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usernamedottxt@reddit

1 favorite xkcd. I reference it regularly.

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sususl1k@reddit

And that’s desktop Linux discourse in a nutshell for ya

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rdesktop7@reddit

The whole situation really is like that.

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EmbeddedSoftEng@reddit

Managing a team of programmers is a skill likened to herding cats. The idea of multiple teams of programmers all agreeing to abandon their own solutions and everyone rallying behind a single standard would be akin to every single one of those cat herds breaking in to synchronized dance at the same time.

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gnimsh@reddit

Real question... What is the new Ubuntu software center thing?? I installed Ubuntu on my mom's computer several years ago and it's still going strong, but when she opens up a gdebi file it shows the name and how much storage it will use, but you can't actually install it.

Why is this so useless and why isn't gdebi installed by default?

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Beautiful_Crab6670@reddit

I'm a simple man. I

./configure && make -j$(nproc) && sudo make install

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Barafu@reddit

.tar.gz!

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nightblackdragon@reddit

Fun fact - Linux Standard Base defines RPM as standard package format.

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_ahrs@reddit

Which is why Debian had tools like alien https://wiki.debian.org/Alien to technically be standards compliant:

alien is a program that converts between Red Hat rpm, Debian deb, Stampede slp, Slackware tgz, and Solaris pkg file formats. If you want to use a package from another linux distribution than the one you have installed on your system, you can use alien to convert it to your preferred package format and install it. It also supports LSB packages.

LSB failed though. It's almost impossible to get everyone to agree on exact versions of software to ship. They tried though.

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amarao_san@reddit

Nothing beats make install. Works identically on all systems.

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shinmarwan@reddit

Can anyone explain difference between snap and flatpack ?? I am new to Linux

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FacepalmFullONapalm@reddit

Pkgsrc?

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tu_tu_tu@reddit

AppImage!

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Inoffensive_Account@reddit

git clone; ./configure; make; sudo make install

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BaseballNRockAndRoll@reddit

Don't forget the fun next steps: check the configure log to install all the dependencies, install 5 of 6 missing libraries, discover that the 6th one is not available in your distribution at the necessary version, download the source to that library and try to install it to another location and point the configure step to it, then watch the compile log only to discover that one or two of the other listed dependencies are at a slightly newer version that introduce a compile error, then try to figure out if you can patch them yourself but you realize one of them is written in a languages like lua or haskell that you have no idea how to code in so you start learning how to do that, make some progress but then discover that the version you have in your distribution repositories is too old to compile the code so you need to download and install a newer toolchain, which itself has all sorts of missing dependencies.... and lastly throw your computer in a dumpster and become a mennonite.

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deanrihpee@reddit

i mean app image is actually not bad, feels exactly like portable windows exe

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KrazyKirby99999@reddit

AppImage is quite bad. It is marketed as "static binary + assets", but still requires system dependencies.

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deanrihpee@reddit

i feel like it depends on the app and the developer that packaged the app, most AppImage I have seems to not require any additional dependency, at least not something that I have to install manually again since I just have to double click and run, while Flatpak and pacman packages require additional package either to be present or to be used as a build process before installing (it is useful to know it has dependency and to make sure it will work), but yes there's some AppImage that won't run because missing dependency, but i only encountered probably two for such case, and if i understand correctly, the developer could include those dependency to fix it

and I don't think it's that bad, at least compared to the Flatpak and distro package manager, it has its use case, and a great alternative, I used all 3 of them, and all of them serve their purpose well enough

also AppImage ranked second in my daily use that reliable, as in it won't suddenly broken and stop functioning every major distro update because of mismatched version, at least i haven't experienced it yet, the first is Flatpak, and third is distro package manager, which even within distro repository and within the same update cycle, sometimes there's some app that stop functioning and i have to install previous version of some dependency because upstream now uses the latest/newer lts version, and it is kinda funny when those previous version is available on AUR

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