Troi is pretty young for commander

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TLOE@reddit

Troi was a Lt Cmdr originally because as the ship's counselor, she was responsible for the entire crew's mental health, like Crusher was for their physical well-being. She's essentially 2nd in line rank-wise and responsibility-wise within the Medical division on board, while Crusher was a full Cmdr because she was the dept. head.

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carrobucks@reddit

is that young for a commander? i feel like half of the commanders we see in the show are in their late 20s/early 30s

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

Riker was 29 and first officer of the flagship.

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kkkan2020@reddit (OP)

Riker was just wasted potential in universe

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

He was in a weird space character-wise.

Ambitious and skilled, but if you promote him, then you lose him as a character so they just kept having Starfleet offer him his own ship and have him keep turning it down.

That goes for a lot of the senior officers. You'd think Data and Geordi would have gotten promotions far earlier than they did, but the writers couldn't justify writing them off the show, so they didn't.

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frygod@reddit

I think they ended up making it work character wise. He starts as talented and ambitious, and has a backstory that involves giving up a long term relationship for his career. By the middle seasons, he's realized that the crew he's working with is starting to become more important to him than advancement, and he's comfortable staying with them a bit longer. By the end of the series, he's rekindled the old relationship and shows no signs of going anywhere.

Riker's story arc is of someone who slowly comes to the realization that they want to put down roots.

By the time we see him again in Picard, it turns out he did end up putting family first and retired early as a result.

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

They did make it work, which I'm glad of.

I think we all have to remember how weird the first two seasons of TNG can be, though. Going back and watching those earlier episodes, sometimes I forget how drastically different the characterization got once they figured out what they wanted to do.

Thankfully it was able to happen in a way that felt natural to the characters and the world, because everyone was so serious in those early episodes. Picard and Riker especially.

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kkkan2020@reddit (OP)

Data for sure was held back he been in starfleet for like 20 years prior to tng season 1 he should have been given his own command by season 1.

Geordi I would say got promoted pretty fast. He should have been made xo by the tng movies.

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Ahielia@reddit

Data for sure was held back he been in starfleet for like 20 years prior to tng season 1 he should have been given his own command by season 1.

While true he was very skilled in science, he was absolute garbage in interpersonal skills, and it was at the Enterprise he saw serious growth. A commanding officer needs not only technical skill and knowledge, but also about the humans/people s/he is supposed to command. It makes perfect sense why Data isn't in command of his own ship at this point even though he's been a part of Starfleet for decades.

Crushers could have easily been given her own ship or medical station by tng season 1.

iirc she was a full Commander by the time TNG started, and she seemed very content in being a chief medical officer. A doctor in charge of medical on a (flag)ship is a far cry from being in charge of medical on a base or a medical ship.

I don't know much about Geordi in this case, but I feel he was a lot more technical than anything else, and he was perfectly fine being chief engineer. He was great with engines and the ship in general, which is why he was made chief engineer to begin with.

Deanna being a lieutenant commander doesn't seem weird in universe as both that rank and lieutenant seems "easy" to come by, in comparison to commander and captain. Lots of medical staff seem to hold those ranks relative to other areas, maybe I'm misremembering.

Regarding Riker "still" being "simply" commander/first officer after so many years and even turning down many promotions, I feel it's the same logic as Crusher being "simply" CMO of the flagship instead of something else. It's the Flagship, it goes to unknown and often dangerous places to deal with many unknown things, that would be far more interesting than a "boring" life on a starbase or a ship that goes shuttle traffic between safe bases or planets. For many, a lower rank on such a posting would be better than higher rank on an uneventful place.

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Due_Example1096@reddit

Better to serve in heaven than to rule in hell lol

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VeterinarianIcy9562@reddit

And keeping in mind that there is no incentive outside job satisfaction. They weren't getting paid at all so taking the more interesting gig is kind of a promotion unto itself

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dangerousquid@reddit

A simple fix for Riker would be to say that he had a black mark on his pre-enterprise record that made the brass reluctant to promote him higher (the Pegasus incident?)

Him just turning down command opportunities was definitely out of character.

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Due_Example1096@reddit

Riker kept turning down his own ships because he was hoping Picard would retire/promote/die and he'd take over. He didn't want just any ship, he wanted the flagship. He said it over and over again: the Enterprise was where he wanted to be. He was hedging his bets that Starfleet wouldn't do the obvious and assign an experienced captain to the position once any temporary emergency was resolved.

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

Then you'd question why Picard chose him as first officer of the Enterprise.

I suppose you could get around that by Picard not caring about the incident and seeing Riker's potential, but S1 Picard was very stern and by the book, so I can't see him having let something like that slide.

I think the easiest thing would have been to have him reignite his romance with Troi, but her being unwilling to follow him to whatever post, so he prioritized her over his career.

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Cookie_Kiki@reddit

Picard said that he chose him because he refused to follow his captain's orders. He wanted someone like that in the bridge. He did the same for that Bajoran girl whose name escapes me.

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

Ro Laren.

It's just the disconnect I'm pointing out here. Later Picard, yes. Farpoint Picard? That early he never would have explicitly chosen a rule breaker, especially if he knew that Riker had been involved in a conspiracy that big.

We're not talking about disobeying bad orders, we're talking about breaking a treaty that had been in place for a century and could have devastating effects on Starfleet if it had been revealed that they were using cloaking technology.

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Cookie_Kiki@reddit

Sito is who I was thinking of. Farpoint Picard chose Will because he was willing to deny orders to protect his captain. Riker being involved in protecting his captain would not have turned Picard off to him. The book tells you to follow orders as much as it tells you to follow treaties. I don't think Picard would penalize an ensign for doing the former.

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dangerousquid@reddit

That's why I liked the Pegasus incident as an explanation.

Picard: "My first officer is amazing, I must AGAIN recommend promotion."

Starfleet HQ: "Noted."

Picard: "Why do you keep ignoring my promotion recommendation?"

Starfleet HQ: "...don't worry about it."

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Due_Example1096@reddit

It always bugged me that they didn't promote them. Crusher was a commander, and so was Troi, and they were allowed to stay in their positions. Granted, those positions weren't full time bridge crew, so I guess if they'd promoted Data they figured they'd have to transfer him. But Laforge wasn't bridge crew so he could have been promoted and kept his position.

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Scottland83@reddit

I could understand Geordi not wanting to leave the engine room of the flagship. It's believably the thing he'd most want to do at the age we see him doing it.

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Neveronlyadream@reddit

I can see him not wanting to leave too.

But Starfleet can be exceptionally weird about promotions. Look at the crew of the NX-01, they all held the same ranks for a decade and you'd also think Starfleet would at least have bumped everyone aside from Archer and T'Pol up a rank by the time the mission ended.

You'd think Data and Geordi would have been full commanders along with Troi and Crusher by the end of TNG.

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Scottland83@reddit

Oh yeah, Data saving the Federation how many times and not making it to full commander?

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primalmaximus@reddit

That could also be because Data was an android. They didn't know enough about him, about his programming, to be willing to give him higher authority and greater access to Starfleet data files.

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Scottland83@reddit

Dude. Data was able to lock out the entire crew and take command of the ship. I’m pretty sure an extra pip on his collar wasn’t going to make much of a difference. If he can make the computer think he’s the captain then we’re already answering the question of if he’s safe to keep around at all.

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kkkan2020@reddit (OP)

No just to highlight the ultra competency of troi.

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