Where is the most Balkan area according to your respective country, and from what borders are the Balkans *supposed to begin* according to stereotypes in your country?
Posted by Hashanadom@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 76 comments
Please refrain from mentioning the actual map borders, as they are much less funny or interesting.
People in Europe from France to Russia can also answer.
pdonchev@reddit
There are two answers.
The most Balkan area in Bulgaria and on the peninsula is, well, the Balkan mountains.
The second answer is about stereotypes - naturally it's the parts that are far from other influences - the parts that are landlocked in the middle - Western Bulgaria, Eastern Serbia, most of Macedonia. A kind of greater Shopluk.
Espace4Eve@reddit
The Balkan begins at the Rennweg in Vienna (the most eastern part at that time) said Metternich.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Balkan is those who are Balkanized to a point that are disturbing political and sociological problematic countries.
Those include: Bosnia, Serbia, North Macedonia, Kosovo and Albania.
I wouldn't include Greece, Bulgaria or Croatia here by no means.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
You are either from Bulgaria or Croatia, admit it.
Spervox@reddit
Croat wouldn't exclude Bulgaria from Balkan
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Yeah, you're right. Bulgarian confirmed.
el-rusch@reddit
Sorry for being so Balkanic
vbd71@reddit
You may leave Balkan, but Balkan never leaves you.
NietzscheIsGulty@reddit
You are so funny.
Balkan means blaming others always and never accepting accountability.
Bulgaria has blocked 4 times N. Macedonia and what did you do? Greece has blocked for many years N. Macedonia.
But sure, calling the other Balkan and acting as a Balkan, showed that you are part of the Balkan.
Poglavnik_Majmuna01@reddit
Anything south and east of Zagreb
GrandviewHive@reddit
I hate the bastard but Slavoj Zizek has a good video on it. Greeks will say it's north of them Croats that its east of them Slovenes that it's east of them Austrians that it's east of them Maybe Brits say its everything across the channel
toomanyhoomans@reddit
The most Balkan area in my country are the mountainsides of the Balkan mountain (duh)
Peak Midžor for anyone interested
Outrageous_Trade_303@reddit
There's a football related joke in Greece that says "Greece is up to Lamia, northern than that it's Bulgaria" /s
justaprettyturtle@reddit
Where does the term Balkans come from?
dwartbg9@reddit
From the Balkan mountain range in Bulgaria. Just like most peninsulas in Europe are named after their respective mountains.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
You just triggered the Turks...
LibertyChecked28@reddit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwDrHqNZ9lo
Stunning_Tradition31@reddit
I would say in Romania the most Balkan parts are Oltenia and Muntenia (basically Wallachia)
Transylvania and Moldova have too much influence from Hungary/Germany and Russia
lunapuj@reddit
Leaving out Dobruja from Balkans is a crime, also Banat is very Balkan and Moldova its definitely balkan influenced but maybe the least from all of those mentioned.
Stunning_Tradition31@reddit
OP said to refrain from the usual map and Dobrogea is part of the Balkans in the most well known maps of the Balkans so that’s why i didn’t include it
lunapuj@reddit
You are right but the way you build the sentence you said: the most balkan parts of Romania are...
You could have said the most balkan part beside the usual map or beside Dobruja.
I mean Muntenia and Oltenia are in every usual balkan maps just not in the geographically correct map, so by refering to these 2 regions you already pointed 2 usual balkan zones.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
I think Moldova is more eastern like Ukraine and Russia because of history so definitely not Balkan.
Wasn't also Banat part of Hungary? That being said it's no way Balkan
lunapuj@reddit
Moldova was 500 years more or less under Ottomans suzeranity. Moldova has many ties and dinastic ties with Tara Romaneasca/Wallachia.
In the Fanariot/Phanariot period Moldova had the same as Wallachia fanariot rulers.
In Republic of Moldova you still have Turks and Bulgarians and it feels like it's an extension of Dobruja.
Moldova was influenced by Russia in the last 200 years and not on the scale of Ottoman influence.
Same as in Wallachia, Ottomans had rayahs in Moldova which means it was under direct administrative rule from the Ottomans, some for more then 300 years.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
I think you are wrong. If you mean Romanian Moldova we'll no it wasn't under 5 centuries of ottoman enslavement.
Those areas were further south in the area of present day North Macedonia, Kosovo, Albania and Northern Greece.
lunapuj@reddit
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Moldova#:~:text=The%20medieval%20Principality%20of%20Moldavia,1538%2C%20until%20the%2019th%20century.
"The medieval Principality of Moldavia emerged in the 1350s, and was the medieval precursor of modern Moldova and Romania. It reached prominence under rulers like Stephen the Great before becoming a vassal state of the Ottoman Empire from 1538, until the 19th century."
So 300-350 years of vassality towards Ottomans.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phanariots#:~:text=Phanariots%2C%20Phanariotes%2C%20or%20Fanariots%20(,occupied%20four%20important%20positions%20in
"A Greek presence had established itself in both Danubian Principalities of Moldavia and Wallachia, resulting in the appointment of Greek princes before the 18th century. After the Phanariot era, some Phanariot families in Wallachia and Moldavia identified themselves as Romanian in Romanian society (including the Rosetti family; C. A. Rosetti represented the radical, nationalist cause during and after the 1848 Wallachian revolution.)."
I didn't even start about the religious part which used the language of old slavonic coming from Bulgaria not Russia. Russia wasn't even Christian when we was because of Bulgaria/Byzantium. Old slavonic and after that turkish was the language of the nobles in these regions.
So was influenced by the Bulgaria then Byzantium then Ottoman empire in the history from 600-1800 but somehow 100 years of influence from Russia you think is more prominent.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Yes great info.
As I told you 500 years Ottoman enslavement was present in the countries I mentioned but not in parts of Romania.
The last Ottomans leaved Balkans in 1913 after many revolutionary uprisings. However some Balkan countries got independent like 50 years before that year.
lunapuj@reddit
By your logic Russia never controled or had suzeranity over Moldova that is part of Romania. So what are we talking about ?
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Well Republic of Moldova was part of the soviet union for 50 years while Romania was a Soviet satellite country for the same period.
When I see photos from the independent country of Moldova I think it's like a Russian sphere.
lunapuj@reddit
You were talking about the present day Romanian part of Moldova when I pointed out there were still Bulgarians and Turks in present day Republic of Moldova/Bassarabia. I pointed the rayahs in Moldova which most of them are in present day Republic of Moldova.
So 50 years of anexation from URSS of the region of Bassarabia/Republic of Moldova plus 50 before from Russia makes more than over 300 years of vasalisation and direct administrative control over the rayahs that are current in Republic of Moldova?
How is that making Romanian part of Moldova more influenced by Russians then Balkans?
Bro you are the reason functional illiteracy is so high in Romania is like you are reading this but don't understand shit.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
I am not Romanian. I said only Republic of Moldova looks Russian to me. Actually it was created by Russia as a country also.
lunapuj@reddit
My bad , I thought I saw the Romanian flair on you.
Well it is more Russian because modern Republic of Moldova is build by soviets that doesn't wipe out the heritage of Moldova before the Russians.
They created Republic of Moldova and identity of Moldavians vs Romanians to create divide and make sure they will never unite with Romania.
The discussion here was about Romania and parts of actual Romania. So the main discussion is Moldova the region from Romania not Republic of Moldova, and even Republic of Moldova as I pointed despite being heavily influenced by Russians in the last 100 years has a strong balkan influence.
And Romania being a satellite of USSR for 50 years that is not true as from 60s we distanced ourselfs from the Soviet Union and that is the reason Ceausescu was given a voice in America, England and other western countries as we could have been a thorn in the ribs of USSR. USSR tanks stayed in Romania until 50s and Ceausescu came in the 60s to power. So we were a sattelite for 20 years let's say not 50 definitely.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
I have respect for Romania it looks to me as a smart nation which changed much.
lunapuj@reddit
Thank you for your kind words.
As a Romanian that left the country second time and doesn't have a plan to move back, I don't see the future of Romania so great as the education of population is in critical decline from 90s.
Romania is doing 10x better financially and the criminality is much lower than the 90s but the way people speak and behave nowadays is 10x worse than the 90s not referring to criminal behaviour but social behaviour, so I don't think that will be good for the future. Also the braindrain of the country doesn't seem to stop.
The main reason we evolved is the EU and Romanians that moved back to Romania after a few years of living in an EU country and bringing their money made there home investing.
Stunning_Tradition31@reddit
tomato tomato
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Balkan is more sociological and political divisions, hostilities and disputes. Also changing of borders and your country is definitely out of Balkan.
Stunning_Tradition31@reddit
since when are you to decide what’s balkan and what’s not?
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
I just point what Balkanization mean as the question to this is a more accurate term than geographical Balkan.
Stunning_Tradition31@reddit
it seems like u didn’t even read the question lol, read the body text, not just the title
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Real Balkan is Bosnia, Serbia, Kosovo, MK....
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Real Balkan is Bulgaria.
ObsessedChutoy3@reddit
Balkanisation was named after the Balkans though, 100 years after the region got its name. If not geographical (because you say it's not accurate) then Balkan should be based on culture, history, traditions, food similarity etc not a negative political term invented by foreigners. The word balkanisation is derogatory, and is not what we base Balkanness on. Are you from the west?
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
When I observe it from Croatia I see what Balkan means where disputes, hostilities and problems persist. I wouldn't for example mingle Greece with them.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Balkanization is a term that was coined based on the Balkan Wars and WW1. So yes, Bulgaria, Greece and Croatia are very much Balkan.
outlanderfhf@reddit
Great, now we can finally into Mittleuropa!
VirnaDrakou@reddit
Epirus, Macedonia (not the sea side) and Thrace.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Well Northern Greece was Ottoman enslaved for almost five centuries very similar to countries such as MK, Albania and Kosovo.
VirnaDrakou@reddit
Idk about Kosovo because they are a very unique occasion but def albania, North MK and Bulgaria.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Bulgaria is EU isn't it
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Čačak/Užice areas. I always thought of them as Balkanest cities in Serbia.
HumanMan00@reddit
Looks at you in Niš 🤨
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Yeah, I know, I have a family in Leskovac but it's something unexplainable about Čačak and Užice... I guess, it's only me 😂
HumanMan00@reddit
I just went to Užice for the first time over the weekend - i get you 😂
johndelopoulos@reddit
stereotypes say "north of Olympus", which is somewhat close to reality. The more North, and more mainland you go, the more Balkans you get, mainly for historical, and to a lesser extend geographical reasons
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Very true specially those that have no sea access are real Balkaniards. Like Bosnia, Serbia, MK and Kosovo.
I wouldn't dare to put Croatia, Bulgaria or Greece here anyway.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Bulgaria is more Balkan than Serbia, lmao
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
We are not judging by looks on the streets or the cafes but if you don't have sea in the Balkans you are and have been way more isolated and crashed than those who had it.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
First time I hear a copium 'no sea = Balkan'. Funny, gotta admit.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
Are you aware that Albania and Montenegro are more rapidly developing than Serbia ?
Your position has declined and will decline even more.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
Link source where Albania is developing more rapidly than Serbia and I'll quit laughing.
BalkanHelikopter@reddit
Not really, maybe just Vojvodina, rest is pretty much the same.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
And that makes it less than Bulgaria.
Aggressive_Limit2448@reddit
For what I see Bulgaria has around 50% more gdp per capita than Serbia and bigger industry.
Unable-Stay-6478@reddit
That doesn't make any more or less Balkan.
Kalypso_95@reddit
Phew, I'm south of Olympus (Larisa) so I escaped the Balkans! 🥳
But in a more serious note, I would include Thessaly in the Balkans too
johndelopoulos@reddit
really?? Me also (part) Larisaios! Hahaha
I think that all of Greece is, at least part, Balkan
Kalypso_95@reddit
So that's why you said that Balkans start north of Olympus hahaha
Nah, not the islands or even Peloponnese. They don't feel Balkan at all. For the rest of th country I agree
johndelopoulos@reddit
hahaha no, I said it as a streotype, not because I believe it. Especially in Athens they often say "Greece starts south of Olympus" for fun, especially when it comes to football
As for the latest, I will agree
BalkanHelikopter@reddit
The longer the territory was under the Turks = the more balkanic in culture and mentality.
Senior-Profession711@reddit
In Serbia, the Balkans is still mostly synonymous with the former Yugoslav republics
for example Serbian media:
Serbian army is the most powerful in the region
Serbia finished the 2024 Olympic Games as the conference with the most medals in the region
Zdravko Colic, the biggest regional pop star
Our media generally ignore other countries. The entire country is considered Balkan here, perhaps mostly the area around Vranje.
cosmicdicer@reddit
For Greece the real balkan part is northern greece, for whomever knows the history will understand. In my mind the real Balkan of what we accept as Balkans are former Yugoslavia countries and Bulgaria
KmetPalca@reddit
South of us.
riquelm@reddit
It's always over that hill that is eastern from us
vbd71@reddit
Why did you leave out Spain and Portugal, the honorably Balkan states?
Hashanadom@reddit (OP)
LOL, I feel like they should be in the their own pandilla with Latin America😅
Realistic_Actuary_50@reddit
I think that the most "balkan" area of Greece is in the mountains of Epirus or from the start of the Thracian municipalities until the border with Turkey. Or the Thracian coast up to the Rodopi mountains.
RustCohle_23@reddit
Near the Balkan (Стара Планина), of course.